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#2846940 04/26/19 12:54 PM
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M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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2 Major breakups.
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And being honest. There is still a part of me that wants to do her this favor in the hopes that it will make her think better of me and then I have to remind myself that that is emotional thinking not logical thinking. It's astonishing to me at this point did I still have to remind myself of the reality of the situation after the fact. It's still so easy to have my mind to go to pleasant memories as opposed to all of the bad ones despite the fact that the latter now far outweighs the former. This is the true lingering power of love-bombing and emotional manipulation although my relationship with Mary was not a healthy decision in hindsight it did at least keep the thoughts and feelings of inadequacy and loneliness at Bay while it lasted. Having resolved to spend time by myself on myself, has proven to put some of my old hurdles back in my path. However now I am equipped with the power of a clear mind and a hell of a lot of hindsight. the difference between emotional and logical thinking truly amazes me and it's astonishing how the mind can self-sabotage itself just to get what it wants as opposed to what it needs. I appreciate all of your input, and I thank you all for helping me keep my head on my shoulders and out of the clouds


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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Looking back at the last year and a half of my life is still astonishing. It doesn't feel real, it honestly feels like all of this happened to somebody else or I watched it on TV or something. I have not had a face-to-face conversation that lasted more than 30 seconds with the woman I reproduce with and got married to in 15 months. The woman I see before me now is not someone I recognized. It honestly feels like the last five years of my life since she became a part of it are awesome hazy dream. The woman I knew, the man I was , the life I had and Was preparing for, all now feel like some half-remembered chapters of a book sleepily read and the details easily forgotten. The only thing that makes it all real in my head is my wonderful boy who I love more than the world. I often still feel like I don't know who I am my interest in Things That I Used to Love largely diminished. I do feel healthier more mentally and emotionally grounded everyday. Last March when I first found this forum, and read the quote that I've seen repeat it so many times but it's a marathon not a Sprint could not be more true. marathon runners speak of hitting the wall and having to push through it, I believe that wall , metaphorical as it may be, is something I broke through a long time ago. But just because you break through the wall doesn't mean the marathon is over. I still cannot see the finish line of this Marathon but running it got a lot easier a long time ago. I will continue to quaff Gatorade and keep wearing down my metaphorical running shoes. although I cannot see the finish line I know that on the other side of it awaits a sense of satisfaction, Personal Achievement and peace of mind. I look forward to the day when like Forrest Gump I've had enough running and turn my shootas towards home. for further insight into my current state of mind jump on YouTube and look up the song The soulforged by Blind Guardian


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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OK - Hindsight is always 20/20 right? Don't beat yourself up about how things went down with Mary. Take it as a learning point. We had told you that it was a bad idea, but now you know from experience that it was not the healthy route to take. Chalk it up as a life lesson and do better next time.

There is just no way out of this except going inside yourself and doing the internal work - confronting your fears, anger, past decisions, weaknesses, how you talk to yourself etc. There is just no way around it. Nothing external can bring you that peace and detachment and fortify your mind and spirit. It is all an inside job.

Your material circumstances have improved, which is awesome. Now take the time to go inside and learn to accept yourself and find out who you are in that solitude. Also find out where you want to be and what success in life is going to look like for you.

You got this!


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Orange, I really liked the responses you got from JoeJoe, Ginger and TBSakaJ9 but just to reinforce what they said, quit fretting over whether you're punishing your W, or rewarding bad behavior and just concentrate on Orange and S4. If you have plans and can't change them then tell her that. If you would rather spend the time with S then tell her you can take care of him. That's it, end of story. What she does with that time should garner this reaction from you ----> WHO CARES.

My ex and I have moved days, swapped weekends and even entire weeks numerous times since D. I really don't give a crap whether she's going to a nun convention or a gang bang with the Dallas Cowboys, that's water off a duck's back. If I can accommodate her request I do it because at some point I'll need the favor back again.


Me: 60 w/ S18, D24, D27

M: 21 years; BD: 06-14-12; S: 09-10-12; D final: 03-17-14; XW:57
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Orange...wow. Just got caught up on your thread.

I just want to say I'm sorry that you're here (haha day 1 stuff)! But your progress is great and I hope you keep the good changes going.


H 34
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BD 3/12/18
Divorce Busted Spring 19

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Hey, Orange. It's been awhile since I've been on here and decided to pop in and check things out. I'll have to read up on your sitch when I have more time. Hope all is well. And from what I've seen about watching your son in the next few weeks, it looks like you got some good advice. If you have plans, keep them. If you'd rather spend time with your son, keep him that weekend. Keep it simple. Who cares what she does or how she perceives it. It's Orange Time. You and your son are all that matter. She shouldn't even be a thought. Take care, man...


Me: 38
W:31
Kids: S16(mine from previous R), D10, S9, S4
M: 10 years
T:12 years
BD:Jan 3, 2018
W moved out: Apr 13,2018
Filed for D: Jun 2018
D final: Sep 2019

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Orange, did the Restraining ORder for your ex-FIL ever go through? If not, view this weekend as one more weekend that HE won't have access to your son. Always put your son first. Over doing her a favor or NOT doing her a favor. I know you still struggle with anger and bitterness (which is why I constantly harp on IC for you). Life is 10% what happens to you (and yes that includes all of the things you listed about how she wronged you), and 90% how your react to it. One of my big awakenings during my self discovery and improvement during and after my sitch is to ALWAYS do the right thing. No matter what. Do to others as you would have them do to you. Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you. Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you and abuse you.

I was a very vengeful person in the past. And you know what? I was miserable. Once I learned to let things go, to forgive, to return good for evil, it was like I was set free. I have been happier the last 15 months of my life than I have been at any other time in my adult life.

Do what you want. Completely in your right and power to say "sorry I have plans that weekend". But do it for the right reason. Not to punish her. And not to manipulate her.

Last edited by Steve85; 04/26/19 06:44 PM.

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Oh yes. I got the OP against FIL back in Oct. that is why we're still in court. After I filed a protective order he and ex-wife both got lawyers and they are contesting my protective order basing it on the grounds that I already knew about his crimes in the past, which I did not, and that it was baseless and unfounded. they are also trying to get me to pay a $5,000 fee to the court for filing a frivolous protective order and for me to reimburse all of their legal fees. We had a hearing on April 2nd that got continued as we ran out of time in the courtroom


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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I appreciate everyone's advice on the upcoming weekend situation I explained. My plan is simply to wait. If it's a priority for her or she needs an option she will ask. I'm not going to reach out to her to check up on a favor she asked me about three weeks ago. as most of you have said it shouldn't matter to me what she does or does not do. I would like to clarify that it was never my intent to punish, manipulate, or teach her a lesson in any way shape or form through our co-parenting. if I were to reach out I feel like it would potentially look like I were using it as an excuse to initiate a conversation and as I said if it's a priority for her she can ask me as it approaches. it may not even come up at all again who knows. right now I'm more concerned with what I'm going to do with my weekend, as she has S4 for the weekend and I don't have any plans as of yet. If it were not raining buckets I would probably be heading to the mountains


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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I am so confused! I must be missing something here!

Did she ask you or did she not ask you? Isn’t she waiting to see if you can or not because you didn’t give her a definitive answer?

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Yes she asked. Like 3 weeks ago.
I said "remind me when its closer i dont know what my plans are"


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Remind me when it gets closer?

That’s pretty open ended and makes her have to check in to see if you made a decision.

Clear concise communication in this world

“ I am unsure. I will know by so and so date and let you know my decision”

Reduces chasing and wondering. It almost seems like a little game playing.

In all sincereity: the right thing to do that makes logical sense is not wait until she hunts you down for it when she doesn’t even know if you made a decision. That makes it look more like you want her to chase you. Just tell her your decision when you’ve made one. It’s the adult thing to do. And one that is made of clear and concise communication without games . Make that choice for you, not her.

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We agreed ill take him on Sat and she will pick him up Sunday evening.


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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Good! See? Done. No wondering. You made a decision, you worked it out and nothing to even think about anymore. It’s over and done. Keep it simple, just like that!

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very interesting new development. Apparently there is an OM number two unbeknownst to om number one. Also the quote on quote wedding that I'm babysitting for in 2 weeks does not exist. That's just what I was told to get me to babysit. S4 told me today about how he spent his weekend with a different om and that he has met him a few times. The alleged wedding is in the same area where o m number two lips. I also looked in the area and there is no weddings listed. I'm curious what she told om number one about whatever she's doing that weekend LOL. S4 told me he was told to keep it a secret that he spent his weekend with om number two. The temptation to inform om number one about all of this is quite tempting but technically is not my business and wouldn't do me any good. funny I almost feel bad for o m number one because I know what's coming for him


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The only thing you should be concerned about is the effect these om are having on your son.

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That is exactly my concern.
Things will blow up again and he will yet again suffer loss and confusion.


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Not my issue, s4 likes om. And he is good to my son as far as i can tell.


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We knew this was coming. And in 1-2 years OM2 will get slammed up side the head by the next guy.....


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Ill admit the desire to do something with that information is huge. Im taking it as a test of my resolve and self control not to do so.


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Yep, plus she'll just deny it. Come up with an excuse, and he will believe her because he wants to.


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I couldn't agree more, if you would come to Me 2 years ago and told me that she was cheating on me I would have absolutely unequivocally not believed it. Despite the fact that I already had doubts and suspicions. It took me getting to the point where I had enough circumstantial evidence on my own and had to confront her about it. That's the only way I could have possibly learned about it and actually believed it.


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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My advice to you, Orange is to quit keeping tabs on her. Who cares what she's up to? You gotta quit letting her take up headspace. Looking to see if there were any weddings going on in a certain area seems fruitless to me. Like Steve said, it doesn't matter what you find out, she's just gonna deny and lie anyway. It will be in your favor to not care one bit where she goes or if she's cheating on OM1. Not your monkeys, not your circus. I know it can be hard and the desire to know can be overwhelming, but once you stop worrying about it, you'll feel a lot better,,


Me: 38
W:31
Kids: S16(mine from previous R), D10, S9, S4
M: 10 years
T:12 years
BD:Jan 3, 2018
W moved out: Apr 13,2018
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D final: Sep 2019

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Originally Posted by mtb1981
My advice to you, Orange is to quit keeping tabs on her. Who cares what she's up to? You gotta quit letting her take up headspace. Looking to see if there were any weddings going on in a certain area seems fruitless to me. Like Steve said, it doesn't matter what you find out, she's just gonna deny and lie anyway. It will be in your favor to not care one bit where she goes or if she's cheating on OM1. Not your monkeys, not your circus. I know it can be hard and the desire to know can be overwhelming, but once you stop worrying about it, you'll feel a lot better,,


This. Plus as my counselor taught me: the truth has a way of always coming out. It doesn't need my help.


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I didn't go searching for this new information. It's not my fault if S4 gets in the car and tells me about the Saturday he spent with some new guy


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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I did just also get an update on the court case. As I had not received a notice for a new Hearing in the mail I called the court to check up on what the status was. we have our next Hearing in Late July and evidently the judge has requested a guardian ad litem. I'm very glad they have done this. I wasn't going to request one myself as I'm trying to keep things as minimally contentious as possible but I will admit I'm quite relieved that there's going to be one involved


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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Originally Posted by OrangeK
I didn't go searching for this new information. It's not my fault if S4 gets in the car and tells me about the Saturday he spent with some new guy

I totally understand that, but you made the choice to do the detective work looking for weddings in the area he lives. Your son is going to tell you things, that's inevitable. But it's your decision on what you do after that. Trust me. I've been there. Going out of your way to find out if she's lying is addictive. I did the same thing. Last year when W would say she couldn't watch the kids because she had to work, I would drive past her work to see if her car was there, go by OM's house to see if her car was there, creep her FB profile to see if she posted about being somewhere else. The only thing it did was drive me crazy. This was after I was "detached". Because in my mind, I didn't care what she was doing. It didn't bother me. Until I woke up one day and realized if it I didn't care and it didn't bother me, I wouldn't be wasting my time looking into it. I decided she wasn't worth the headspace she was taking up and I really quit caring. And quitting wasn't easy. The urge to verify her whereabouts was still strong, but the became less and less the longer I went without looking into. It's a lot like quitting smoking and needs to be done cold turkey. No peeking. Like I said in my last post in my sitch. Whatever... You're better than that, Orange. Don't waste time out of your life worrying about if she's doing what she says she's doing...


Me: 38
W:31
Kids: S16(mine from previous R), D10, S9, S4
M: 10 years
T:12 years
BD:Jan 3, 2018
W moved out: Apr 13,2018
Filed for D: Jun 2018
D final: Sep 2019

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Originally Posted by mtb1981
Originally Posted by OrangeK
I didn't go searching for this new information. It's not my fault if S4 gets in the car and tells me about the Saturday he spent with some new guy

I totally understand that, but you made the choice to do the detective work looking for weddings in the area he lives. Your son is going to tell you things, that's inevitable. But it's your decision on what you do after that. Trust me. I've been there. Going out of your way to find out if she's lying is addictive. I did the same thing. Last year when W would say she couldn't watch the kids because she had to work, I would drive past her work to see if her car was there, go by OM's house to see if her car was there, creep her FB profile to see if she posted about being somewhere else. The only thing it did was drive me crazy. This was after I was "detached". Because in my mind, I didn't care what she was doing. It didn't bother me. Until I woke up one day and realized if it I didn't care and it didn't bother me, I wouldn't be wasting my time looking into it. I decided she wasn't worth the headspace she was taking up and I really quit caring. And quitting wasn't easy. The urge to verify her whereabouts was still strong, but the became less and less the longer I went without looking into. It's a lot like quitting smoking and needs to be done cold turkey. No peeking. Like I said in my last post in my sitch. Whatever... You're better than that, Orange. Don't waste time out of your life worrying about if she's doing what she says she's doing...


I can vouch for this. Same thing with me an snooping on my W. Each time I did it set me back. I love the smoking analogy......the urge is very similar.


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Orange don’t snoop or follow. Trust me I know. I did it for a little while and all it did was make me crazy. When I stopped following her and snooping I felt such a sense of relief. Our minds always go to the worse case scenario so now I just always assume she is out shopping. So the minute your mind starts to think the worse, change it and think of something simple she might be doing. It’s hard at first but the more you do it the better you will get and the better you will feel.


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Amusingly i used the addiction metaphor yesterday whrn talking to my SIL. so i agree


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I still feel somewhat misunderstood here which isn't necessarily A Bad Thing. it's probably just born from the fact that most of my updates are done on my phone via voice to text during the day as opposed to sitting down on my computer in the evening and actually typing out well thought-out responses. It's amazing how your own mind can play tricks on you. When I was dating Mary I thought that I was 100% probably done with the whole situation with the exception of court. I then learned that I shouldn't have been in a relationship in the first place, I know what you all say about mind reading and I'm obviously not 100% innocent of doing that. That being said I do still get the feeling that none of my post to your should be about her at all, which is kind of the point of coming here in the first place to give me a non bias place to vent my thoughts and feelings, about my divorce. I guess I think I would benefit more from conversations about why and logic as opposed to everybody just jumping on the you shouldn't have done that bandwagon. Hindsight being what it is I shouldn't have married or even dated to begin with. If we all had a hindsight ahead of time none of us would ever make mistakes. Touching on the conversation I had with my sister-in-law, like I said, I liken it to being a recovering addict. Recovered addicts must face Temptation everyday, for me the Temptation is interfering with ex-wife life as well as going off on tangents trying to figure out what she's doing. 95% of the time my thoughts and focus is on logical avoidance of these things however I cannot control my subconscious thought processes and have no say in whether or not something reminds me of her or our situation or other such things. I do my best to put those thoughts away when they do pop subconsciously into my mind but obviously I'm not perfect. I'm doing my best to struggle with the Temptations of my addiction. My addiction to her. My addiction to the illusion that was our relationship. Honestly I'm really glad that she is moving on and doing things yet again the same way she always has, it has just provided concrete proof that I have been in the right this whole time above the way that she is no way that she treats people. it's all quite a shame. you can really trace it all the way back to her parents in the way they raised her. part of me still wishes that she was the person she pretends to be and the person she thinks she is. the most astonishing thing to me is her ability to lie to herself. But again that's not my issue, I would love to hear what you all do to compartmentalize these thoughts and keep them out of your head because that seems to be my issue. Even if I'm not actively looking into her life or what she's doing, she still pops into my head on a daily basis and I would really like that to go away. Most often it's not because I miss her or because I'm mad at her or anything like that. Most commonly it's just something that casually reminds me. I have a lot to look forward to this summer and I'm looking forward to being too busy to think about this sort of thing


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I get what you're saying about the thoughts popping into your head, and I wish I had a foolproof method to prevent it. It's almost a Catch 22. Thinking about stopping a thought only makes you think more about it. I just have to actively identify it's happening and just think about something else. It's hard. Kinda reminds me of the scene in Ghostbusters at the end when they're trying to think of nothing, and Ray thinks of the Stay-Puft marshmallow man. In the same way, if you spend too much time telling yourself to not think about her, guess what you'll be thinking about. Probably her. Next time a thought involving her comes up. Just stop whatever you're doing and tell yourself, "Not today", and try to focus on what you're doing at that moment. It gets better with time. Maybe think about what you want to do later that night/weekend, what you're gonna make for dinner, seeing how many state capitals you can remember, etc. Whatever it is doesn't really matter. Just don't fuel the thoughts you don't want by thinking about them too long...


Me: 38
W:31
Kids: S16(mine from previous R), D10, S9, S4
M: 10 years
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As much as I try to avoid getting you information, I am glad very much that I found out about this new development. I think if she had just stayed with om number one the entire time and had a long and productive relationship with him it would have been far more detrimental on my self-esteem. Having this as confirmation that it's her not me type of thing is extremely helpful in my healing process. I'm a very self-critical person and I have spent well over a year dealing with the what did I do wrong type of mindset. Seeing this kind of behavior continued, if not worse for om that it was for me makes me firmly realize that no, it was not me. No, I did not do as much wrong as I thought. No, I am not an unlovable broken waste product. I was made to feel guilty for having goals dreams and aspirations, now I can have those things all to myself, just me and S4 kicking life's ass as it should be


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Keeping with my theme of self analysis and honesty.

When EX is being plesant and chatty i find myself easily chatting back. Always about S4.
All these convos have an air of false niceness from both of us.
She uses "hah" "haha" and "lol" freakishly often in convo.
She never used tobdo this. Makes it feel very fake.

That being said. Here is my point of analysis.
I have very mixed feelings during these convos. Happy to be amiable but they do feel very fake. Like shes trying to lull me into false security or keep me in good graces for some reason. Its all too sugary to e genuine. I know what she sounds like when shes being nice.
Maybe i only ever knew the fabricated niceness in the past and now this deliberately sweet crap rings as very false to me.
However when we go weeks without talking it bothers me.

Why do you think this is?


I know the "dont try to figure it out" lines are coming.

This is an excersize in self learning. Why do i think this way, how to change it? Etc.


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It could be she’s trying to keep you placated because of the court case concerning her father. My advice would be to stop being chatty with her. If we’re thinking of it in terms of addiction, you need to stop feeding it. You say it bothers you if you go weeks without talking to her. To me, that sounds like attachment, when you should focus on being detached. Keep it simple and only answer questions pertaining to your son and keep the replies short and sweet. I’m honestly kind of shocked that you want to interact with her at all after what she put you through...


Me: 38
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Originally Posted by mtb1981
It could be she’s trying to keep you placated because of the court case concerning her father. My advice would be to stop being chatty with her. If we’re thinking of it in terms of addiction, you need to stop feeding it. You say it bothers you if you go weeks without talking to her. To me, that sounds like attachment, when you should focus on being detached. Keep it simple and only answer questions pertaining to your son and keep the replies short and sweet. I’m honestly kind of shocked that you want to interact with her at all after what she put you through...


mtb nailed it. OK I think part of the reason your relationship with Mary didn't work is based in what mtb is saying here: your aren't even close to being over her yet


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I've been looking inward a lot lately. I think I relapsed into a bit of snooping and having more conversations with her than I needed to because the restraining order she had against me expired and I think I maybe subconsciously I was expecting something to be different when that happened but the last week or so has reminded me why my hope that things might be different was a fruitless one. As S4 continues to have issues in school with his behavior it is they plainly obvious that she will lie about even the most trivial of things. she has lied about things she has done with us for as well as receiving documents from the school that she claimed she never got that I know was given to her in hand. S4 has more had more to say about this new guy. If anything wasn't evidence enough that she will never change it is the fact that she is yet again doing the same thing she did to me except now she's doing them to om. I went through my computer this weekend and deleted the last few remaining things of our past. For some reason I had had a hard time getting rid of our wedding photo album. Never deleted it in the past. No need for it now, it has been consigned to the recycle bin as well as blocking her on all social media for good and all. I think the season has something to do with it as well, spring always makes me think of new life and new things and I always feel loneliness most acutely in the spring. for a long time I was torn between wanting to have conversations with her sometimes out of nostalgia and other times out of looking for some angle or reason for karma to be taking its place. I don't know how things are really going on her end but I don't think they're going well but at the end of the day it doesn't matter. but my finances have been tough as well I am looking into getting a second job to help ease the burden. taking a concerted effort at quitting smoking again. I will be getting my Forge set up so that will provide some crafts and gal activity as well as exercise. I feel as though I have taken far longer to recover from this type of life event as other people seem to take but perhaps that's just because I was so deeply invested in the idea of my family and spending the rest of my life with them. It still irks me to hear about things that S4 is accomplishing that I do not get to witness or activities that he gets taken to do that I do not get to participate in. I never ever ever wanted a divorced household for my child but that is the reality of my situation and I'm going to make the best of a crappy one. I had to pretty much convinced her to spend time with her own child on Mother's Day after she took off for the weekend leaving me to watch S4 on her weekend well she was off with her new om. Goes to show where her priorities are, and at the end of the day that's not the type of wife that I want. a materialistic person who is addicted to limerence and admiration it's not going to be a healthy partner or parent in a long-term. I feel like a fool for having this affect me as long as it has but I'm a hopeless romantic who wears his heart on his sleeve so I guess it's to be expected. I know that if I spend time on myself improving myself the laws of fate and attraction will bring a woman into my life that is deserving of myself and S4. next time I hike a mountain I plan to leave the last vestiges of my pain in the cold morning air and walk back down to sea level with a clean conscience and a light heart


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And yes MTB Waa 100% correct as usual


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Originally Posted by OrangeK
I feel as though I have taken far longer to recover from this type of life event as other people seem to take but perhaps that's just because I was so deeply invested in the idea of my family and spending the rest of my life with them.


OK, I wanted to address this first, not so much for you because that water is under the bridge. But for any newcomers that might read this. We all are deeply invested in the idea of our families and spending the rest of our lives with them. That is why we are the LBS! Otherwise we would be the WAS. I think you took longer to heal for two main reasons: you struggled with GAL (by your own admission). GAL is crucial. And all of us LBSs made excuse why we couldn't do a better job, but the bottom line is, with a proper focus on GAL we end up wallowing in our sorrow and "why me" and never really deal properly with the fact that there is life after our WAS. I remember one poignant moment in your sitch when I asked "OK, what is your GAL like?" Your answer: "It is sitting in my brothers house being bored out of my mind." That is not good.

Second, and this is probably directly related to not GAL properly, but you struggled mightily with detachment. We all do to a certain extent, but you really struggled with it. Detachment is so important, and those that GAL best usually detach the best. I think part of this for your sitch was also the TRO. But in some ways that should have helped with detachment (the age old IHS vs. physical separation paradox that so many LBSs struggle with).

Thirdly, LBSs HAVE to have IC. It is so hard to proceed forward without it. And goes to GAL as well.

In short, the better you DB the quicker and better you will recover. Again OK this is not to beat you up. You've come a long way. This is more a cautionary tale for other LBSs.


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Steve I agree with everything you have said here, I know you keep harping on the IC. I'll say it again for the tenth time, I really wish I could go to an IC. I'm barely affording groceries, have no insurance. Lastly I live in a state it gives very little away for free, including Mental Health Services. As you know I went for a short time and could no longer afford it so I have had to muddle through without it finding therapy in my own ways. I don't foresee that changing any time in the future unless I get a several dollar raise


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I put myself in debt years ago maintaining the lifestyle that xw wanted, the divorce only compounded that debt. You mention I see in pretty much every response. My reply to that has not changed. I simply cannot afford it. It's literally an expensive hundreds of dollars a month that I do not even come close to having


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OK, now, overall, you are in a much better place. You see her for who she really is now, and not through the "Girl I married" frosted lens. That is great.

Sorry about finances. You seem like a hard-working guy. But just a suggestion. A 2nd job is a temporary band-aid. Any chance of going back to school? Maybe improve your future prospects? Even 1 class a semester will get you closer. I didn't get my BS until I was 36. But boy what a boon to my career. I've made more than double in the 14-15 years since than I did in all the years (20+) prior to that.

Last edited by Steve85; 05/13/19 01:44 PM.

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Originally Posted by OrangeK
I put myself in debt years ago maintaining the lifestyle that xw wanted, the divorce only compounded that debt. You mention I see in pretty much every response. My reply to that has not changed. I simply cannot afford it. It's literally an expensive hundreds of dollars a month that I do not even come close to having


Again, that was said for others' benefit. I am aware of your situation. It was not a knock. Water under the bridge.


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Keep this frame of mind, Orange. Keep moving forward and don't look back. Everything from this point forward is about you and your son. She's gone. Don't give her any of your headspace. It's too precious to waste on someone like that. Glad you're in a better place, brother...


Me: 38
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Things have been going well for the most part.

S4 has been having behavioral problems at school but they seem to be dwindling.
Exw and i have communicated well to try and help him.
Its just tough as weve both had to leave work early several times to pick him up early.

What i hope is the final court date regarding exFiL is about a month away.

Exw is actually asking to cook dinner for s4 and me on Sunday, claiming its for s4, which is nice but it feels like a temp check. I havent agreed to it yet.

Living the single life. For a while i was desperate for another woman but after Mary and i flopped i havent been focused on it.

Still having a really hard time financially. Likely going to have to get a 2nd job.

Glad its summer. Gonna take s4 hiking/swimming tomorrow


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Quote
Exw is actually asking to cook dinner for s4 and me on Sunday, claiming its for s4, which is nice but it feels like a temp check. I havent agreed to it yet.


"Thank you, that is very thoughtful! However, I have other plans for Sunday for S4 and me. I appreciate the offer though."

Temp check? Very probably. Also manipulation. "Maybe if I am nice to him he will drop the RO against pops."

DON'T FALL FOR IT!


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Steve i honestly dont think she cares about the RO against her dad.

Either way it feels fishy


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With your W's history, I would completely steer clear of her and any invitations. Something like this would be potentially appropriate if she had apologized, shown remorse and humility, with a change in her actions and character. Right now, this is a temp check and don't fall for crumbs.

Over time, if you can develop a good co-parenting R with her for your son's sake, that's great. But she would need to put in a lot of work for that.


No one is coming to save you!

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Read my mind guys. Shes offering to cook my old fav meal. As good ole Admiral Akbar says....
"Its a trap!"

Om was at the store this morning when i stopped to get s4 hos "friday donut"

He kept his back to us and stared at his shoes. I dont think he wanted s4 to recognize him while with me.


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Good call Orange! Yeah I'm with Maika and Steve and you- it's a trap!


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Ive passed enough perception and insight checks regarding her.

Kudos if you get the reference!


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Crappy day.

S4 haa been kicked out of pre school for his outbursts. I will be sending him to my parents for summer time for now and visit him every weekend.

Just when things felt like they were improving


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My daycare funds will be going to an IC for s4


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Okay I need some advice, as I mentioned in my previous posts S4 is currently staying with my parents for the summer. I am going up to see him this weekend, my question is this. Obviously my ex-wife is no longer providing care in any way shape or form for my son from buying food and obviously not paying for daycare. It was my original intention to file a motion with the court to pause my child support until such time as she is actually paying for his care and we get him enrolled in a new daycare program. My family's advice to me was to Simply have my child support deduction shut off through my work, the concern I expressed about doing this was being found as not paying my child support by the state. My family basically said that no court in its right mind is going to rule that I should have to pay back those Monies considering my ex-wife is not caring for my son during the time that I'm not paying child support. I do not want her to profit off of this situation which is exactly what's going to happen if the court drags its feet on pausing my child support but I also don't want to get in trouble for not having paid despite the fact that I agree that they probably won't rule against me for not having paid when she doesn't have care of our son. Any advice would be appreciated


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Is she not seeing her son at all this summer? Are your parents buying everything he needs?

I would absolutely not just stop paying. That could end up costing you more in legal costs, even if you feel you are right.

Do this the legal and correct way.

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I agree with G, dont do it. She could have you arrested for violating your D decree. My dad just stopped paying support and my mom had him arrested. It could backfire on you horribly.


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Ginger, she is not paying anything for him. He is no longer attending daycare and has been staying at my parents house for well over a week and there are no plans for him to come back until there is daycare lined up for him as it stands right now my family is providing 100% of the care for S4


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Originally Posted by OrangeK
Ginger, she is not paying anything for him. He is no longer attending daycare and has been staying at my parents house for well over a week and there are no plans for him to come back until there is daycare lined up for him as it stands right now my family is providing 100% of the care for S4


Talk to a lawyer.


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she has only called to talk to him twice since he was up there


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Consulting one now


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Do it O.


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Hi Orangek, it was great to hear your update. Did I read correctly that your ex-wife has already found a new "other man" and she might be moving on from the original "other man?" If so that's crazy. I don't fully understand your son's circumstances but I truly hope you can provide him with all the love and one-on-one time he needs to better control his behavior. Sometimes I'll play with my daughter and in the middle of playing she'll start talking about a difficult situation at school or she'll talk about a problem with her teachers or other students. It only happens when she's relaxed and has my undivided attention. Perhaps by giving him some time like that you can better understand what's on his mind. I hope you and your son can heal and have much better days ahead.

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Originally Posted by OrangeK
It was my original intention to file a motion with the court to pause my child support until such time as she is actually paying for his care and we get him enrolled in a new daycare program. My family's advice to me was to Simply have my child support deduction shut off through my work, the concern I expressed about doing this was being found as not paying my child support by the state.


Hey O, it sounds like you are talking to your L about this before taking action and that's a good idea! There was a situation similar to this with a distant relative of mine who quit paying, and yes the court saw that as him being a deadbeat dad and took action against him even though his XW had completely checked out and was not caring for the child. So definitely go through the proper channels! Very sorry to hear your XW is pulling this, it's really unfair to your S but at least you and your parents are there for him.


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Update:



I ended up filing a motion to have my child support paused or cancelled due to EXW not providing care.
Waiting on court to rule on motion.

S4 has been up with my parents for 2 weeks now.
EXW has called to talk to him 3 times in 2 weeks, no video chat, no requests to come visit him or make arrangements to pick him up for a day or two.



I call him daily. Send messages and video chat as often as possible.
I drove the 4 ½ hours to spend the weekend with him, took Yesterday off work so I could have an extra day with him.



I have had it. I have been giving benefit of doubt that she will want to actually parent.

His behavior has improved 10 fold since being with my parents.


She has no bedroom for him. Hasn’t taken him to a single Dr apt or dentist or mental health apt since we split up in Oct of 2017.

Shes still getting my child support money and isn’t even paying for a single facet of S4’s care.

She has introduced him to 2 romantic partners in 1.5 years, and has family and boyfriends do more of the pickups and care for S4 than she does.

She lies to me about our childs whereabouts, behavior and her intentions on caring for him.



Enough enough. I Am going to be petitioning for temporary full guardianship or full custody.


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Update:



I ended up filing a motion to have my child support paused or cancelled due to EXW not providing care.
Waiting on court to rule on motion.

S4 has been up with my parents for 2 weeks now.
EXW has called to talk to him 3 times in 2 weeks, no video chat, no requests to come visit him or make arrangements to pick him up for a day or two.



I call him daily. Send messages and video chat as often as possible.
I drove the 4 ½ hours to spend the weekend with him, took Yesterday off work so I could have an extra day with him.



I have had it. I have been giving benefit of doubt that she will want to actually parent.

His behavior has improved 10 fold since being with my parents.


She has no bedroom for him. Hasn’t taken him to a single Dr apt or dentist or mental health apt since we split up in Oct of 2017.

Shes still getting my child support money and isn’t even paying for a single facet of S4’s care.

She has introduced him to 2 romantic partners in 1.5 years, and has family and boyfriends do more of the pickups and care for S4 than she does.

She lies to me about our childs whereabouts, behavior and her intentions on caring for him.



Enough enough. I Am going to be petitioning for temporary full guardianship or full custody.


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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2nd EX - Was Engaged - Diagnosed BPD
2 Major breakups.
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Quick update.

Still trying to get residential custody of S4.
Still paying child support even though exw hasnt seen S4 in 5.5 weeks.

Court last monday basically accomplished nothing.

Keeping busy and keeping up the good fight.

Refreshing to finally REALLY know what detachment feels like.
Havent heard from or talked to EX W in over a month. Its refreshing


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
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Good update OK. Only one small 2x4 (1x2?). If you are counting the days between communications......are you really detached?

Keep working with your L. She is now in child abandonment territory and you should be documenting EVERYTHING to make your case.


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HI OrangeK,

It's good to hear you're hanging in there. I hope you'll get full custody. That would be a major victory for you and a lifesaver for your son. Please keep us posted!

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Just wondering how things were going, Orange. Hope all is well and you get the child support and custody things figured out...


Me: 38
W:31
Kids: S16(mine from previous R), D10, S9, S4
M: 10 years
T:12 years
BD:Jan 3, 2018
W moved out: Apr 13,2018
Filed for D: Jun 2018
D final: Sep 2019

"Surrender to the Flow"...
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Hey all,

Good to hear from you MTB.

not much had changed over my way legally speaking, I have what I dearly hope will be our last court date coming up in a few weeks.
I am hoping for a resolution to the FIL issue and a solidified custody schedule.
S4 has been much better behaviorally at school since returning from his summer with my parents, although he still has hard days and tough behavior from time to time.

I however, am in a far far better place.
Still struggling financially, but that's seemingly normal, just annoying.

Looking back, it scare me to think how sick and low this whole mess brought me. Now, two years and in, I do finally feel normal and healthy.
The "stomach Twisties" I used to get (anxiety) are long since a thing of the past.

Feel free to ask any specifics.

It's been a crazy two years. But the orangeK I am today is a better, wiser, stronger man and father because of it.
Honestly, looking back, with the exception of the pain poor S4 has had to endure, I'm actually glad it all went down how it did. I coulda been in a toxic marriage for years if not decades. All's well that ends well!


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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Originally Posted by OrangeK
Still struggling financially, but that's seemingly normal, just annoying.



So what are your plans to address this?

Little ditty: When my W and were dating, I had my associates degree she had a bachelors. I started taking a class here and there to get my Bachelors. When my daughter was born we decided my W would stay home to raise her. I got really serious about getting my degree and finally completed it at age 36. We struggled for about 3 years on my single, associates income, but once I got my bachelors, I landed a high paying job and kissed financial struggles goodbye.

So if you are annoyed by your finances, it is up to you to fix that.


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Just plugging away at work, working twords advancement and more sales. Trying small things to adjust my budget, etc. Gotta fix my credit.


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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2 Major breakups.
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Hello everyone,



It dawned on me that it has been AGES since I updated.

So here are a few things.



Living situation is much improved, right about the time of my last post, I had started seeing a lovely lady who has a 8yo daughter.

S5.5 is doing really well, and adores her and her daughter.

In a new home, which is gorgeous. I feel so at home there. Peaceful.

Court regarding ex-FIL is still ongoing (over 2 years now!!) but things are going very well in that regard also.

EX-W and I speak on occasion regarding S5.5, and beyond a few bits of poor communication, we are co-parenting amicably.



New job is going really well, finances are not so hard anymore.

S5.5 is growing amazingly well, so all in all. A good update!!



The recent pandemic has hardly been an impact and its shaping up to be a great summer.

I hope you are all doing well.



It really is incredible how long it takes to gain perspective, and to truly leave old wounds behind. Its worth the long haul. Its worth the hurt.

I feel like a totally renewed man. And its pretty great.


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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2nd EX - Was Engaged - Diagnosed BPD
2 Major breakups.
2 Rebounds
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Wow, I just skimmed through your sitch. Sorry, rushing to watch a show with the fam. I am so very happy for you. I usually hang out in the MCL forum as that's where my sitch is, but I'm glad to see people recover whether or not they end up with their spouse.

So happy you seem so grounded, happy and free. Sending blessings and light as you've given some to me. Have a great night! The best to you and your son! Oh and your new lovely lady and her D8.


W (me): 50 H: 46
M: 21 T: 25
S:17 D:15
BD 11/2019

Fate whispers to the warrior, "You can not withstand the storm" And the warrior whispers back, "I am the storm." ~Unknown
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Great to hear! Will read up on your sitch!
Asking specifics:
What have you done/read/changed specifically to become this :
Quote
But the orangeK I am today is a better, wiser, stronger man and father because of it.


I am on my way there but would appreciate any tips/suggestions post D.

Last edited by Mumin; 04/09/20 07:29 AM.

Me: 34
Stbxw: 30
D:5 D:3
Mini bd: May/June 2019
Married: Aug 2019
BD: 6th Dec 2019
OM Confirmed: Feb 2020
March 2020: I filed for D
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Thanks for posting O!

Glad to see things are improving for you and S5.

Keep moving forward into a plenty life.

Stay strong!


WW H(me): 53
W: 48
T: 27 M: 22
S: 18
Piecing since 03/2016
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Honestly, same tips I'm sure you've seen here. GAL, get out an renew old hobbies/passions.
Don't lean into new R to make you feel better. When you're ready you'll know it.
Use it as motivation for an 80s movie style rebuild montage. "You're the best, around, nothing's gonna keep you down. "

My best advice? Don't do what I did. Lol.
If you scan my sitch, you'll see I clung to attachment and needing answers for farrrrrr too long.


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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whistle


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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ex - FIL is in very poor health, and court case is still ongoing.
exw has been very chatty and asking random "conversational" questions.
odd behaviors. just trying to stay frosty and mind my own business.

got a good friend going thru similar stuff. tried to offer advice and directed him here.

how are you all doing?


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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Ok great to hear from you. Glad to see you are hanging in there. Remember, do not get caught up in her crazy. Unfortunately you will be linked to this women due to your son for the rest of your life. Just treat her kindly, but do no overly engage with her. You will persevere!


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Hey Orange,

good to see you again. I am well. Hope you are living your life the best you can and taking car of your boy!


H 34
W 29
BD 3/12/18
Divorce Busted Spring 19

It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
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Hey, Orange. Sounds like you're doing well. I'm happy for you, man...


Me: 38
W:31
Kids: S16(mine from previous R), D10, S9, S4
M: 10 years
T:12 years
BD:Jan 3, 2018
W moved out: Apr 13,2018
Filed for D: Jun 2018
D final: Sep 2019

"Surrender to the Flow"...
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It’s great to see the good old guys here! Keep moving forward pals.

Respect!


WW H(me): 53
W: 48
T: 27 M: 22
S: 18
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Well, the relationship i ended up in was.......worse.

We got together in October of 2019, Moved in together March of 2020 (Covid sped that up), She kicked me and my son out in November of 2020, She dated another guy from Jan to July of 2021, and we reconciled and my son and i moved back in in Sept of 2021. We did good for a while, even got engaged in June of 2022. Then shortly after that she began to pull away again, and she bugged out and kicked us out again in Sept of this year.
We had a brief reconnect in January, and now shes Dating another guy again.

And the wheel rolls onward....


M: 35, EX-W: 3, S:4
All Divorce Proceedings Complete - Oct 18
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2 Major breakups.
2 Rebounds
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Originally Posted by OrangeK
Well, the relationship i ended up in was.......worse.

We got together in October of 2019, Moved in together March of 2020 (Covid sped that up), She kicked me and my son out in November of 2020, She dated another guy from Jan to July of 2021, and we reconciled and my son and i moved back in in Sept of 2021. We did good for a while, even got engaged in June of 2022. Then shortly after that she began to pull away again, and she bugged out and kicked us out again in Sept of this year.
We had a brief reconnect in January, and now shes Dating another guy again.

And the wheel rolls onward....

OK, sorry. Relationships are difficult. No question.

I guess the question I have for you is why you continue to hold on so tight? Imagine the pain that could have been saved if you had moved on from her after November 2020? I know at the time we think the person we are infatuated with is the best thing in the world and we will die if we don't save things with them. But you've been through it before, and you know there are other options out there.

Kick the dust off your feet and be thankful! If she is this flaky now imagine what she would be like after marrying her! Marriage has a way of amplifying problems not making them better.

You've guy this, OK! Go back to the basics. Get a life. 180s. Detachment. For you to move forward, not to try to save things with this woman.


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Quote
If she is this flaky now imagine what she would be like after marrying her!

SteveLW is right on the money! You may, one day, look on this as a blessing.

If you’ve been through DBing once, I wonder how deeply you did it. You should have come out the other side of your first marriage and divorce and DBing journey with a much better sense of self. I couldn’t imagine being with someone who didn’t want to be with me second time around!

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