Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 9 of 11 1 2 7 8 9 10 11
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
[/quote]

Yeah, there were signs. She said a few times over the past couple years (really, since having our D2) that she didn't know who she was anymore. She decided that she had spent all her time worrying about everyone else (D2, her parents, sister, students, friends, me, since revised to be just me) and it was time to worry about herself. Figure out what made her happy and do it, whether I liked it or not. Especially if I didn't like it. She freely admits that she's become (her words) selfish, cold, hard. She's proud of it, like that equates to strength.

I don't know if she'll wake up and see me in a better light. But we have to develop independence to be ready for either a healthier MR or the very real possibility of divorce. Regardless of outcome it's what we have to do.[/quote]

W has said very similar things but she's not prideful in selfishness, but in my opinion is taking selfish actions to divide the family and go out on our own independently, and to my knowledge is not in current affair but Teeter tottering on it. However she has said that she got tired of putting all of her family and friends and husband first. Now it's about her new plan and newly-revised life independence and happiness w S1. Mine is a behavior specialist and teacher and she's quitting her job this summer because she doesn't want to return to the stress, she wants to move away from everyone, work from home and become a health coach, a farmer, a new keeper, a stay at home mom. " in other words pursue what makes her happy" (more resentment that she had to work to pay the mortgage) this summer is right around the corner and I don't see anything lined up on her end yet. something tells me I'm going to have to pay for it all, once and if the house is sold. Which I doubt because it won't conform to her timeline and her hopes and dreams.

I'm sorry your wife is being so prideful and selfish and doesn't realize what real sacrifices are, and who they are for. For all the guys out there that work their butts off to provide for their families and their wives complain and never spend enough time with them or the family. Please listen to what they are saying and make adjustments and balance in your lives. Sometimes we all need money to keep a roof over our heads but there are some memories you can never get back. But don't ever let them demonize you because they're coming from a place of selfishness. In their minds they think they do it all when it's far from the truth. It's only partial truth and delusioned thinking at best.

Here's the real truth. A man's world is a man's world and a woman's World Is A Woman's World and usually perceptions are very different. If a man had to do all the things that women do they would go crazy and vice versa. Our spouses never see what we do or what we put up with. And a lot of them want to inflict what they experience on to us, just to give us a taste of what they go through. Still no reason to break up a marriage though IMO. These are universal problems in every marriage I'm sure MWD has seen on a regular basis.

Last edited by IHCLACS; 04/16/19 09:47 PM.
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
N
Niall11 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
N
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
Originally Posted by IHCLACS
W has said very similar things but she's not prideful in selfishness, but in my opinion is taking selfish actions to divide the family and go out on our own independently, and to my knowledge is not in current affair but Teeter tottering on it. However she has said that she got tired of putting all of her family and friends and husband first. Now it's about her new plan and newly-revised life independence and happiness w S1. Mine is a behavior specialist and teacher and she's quitting her job this summer because she doesn't want to return to the stress, she wants to move away from everyone, work from home and become a health coach, a farmer, a new keeper, a stay at home mom. " in other words pursue what makes her happy" (more resentment that she had to work to pay the mortgage) this summer is right around the corner and I don't see anything lined up on her end yet. something tells me I'm going to have to pay for it all, once and if the house is sold. Which I doubt because it won't conform to her timeline and her hopes and dreams.

I'm sorry your wife is being so prideful and selfish and doesn't realize what real sacrifices are, and who they are for. For all the guys out there that work their butts off to provide for their families and their wives complain and never spend enough time with them or the family. Please listen to what they are saying and make adjustments and balance in your lives. Sometimes we all need money to keep a roof over our heads but there are some memories you can never get back. But don't ever let them demonize you because they're coming from a place of selfishness. In their minds they think they do it all when it's far from the truth. It's only partial truth and delusioned thinking at best.

Here's the real truth. A man's world is a man's world and a woman's World Is A Woman's World and usually perceptions are very different. If a man had to do all the things that women do they would go crazy and vice versa. Our spouses never see what we do or what we put up with. And a lot of them want to inflict what they experience on to us, just to give us a taste of what they go through. Still no reason to break up a marriage though IMO. These are universal problems in every marriage I'm sure MWD has seen on a regular basis.


As best I understand it, my W thinks she spent years putting everyone else's needs ahead of her own to the point where she didn't know who she was or what she wanted/needed anymore. She reached a point of saying, "Forget it. I'm gonna focus on me."

She's not entirely wrong, but I agree that she doesn't really appreciate what I've been through or contributed here. Her story is that she did everything, I did nothing, I'm useless. Even in the post-2016 period that's not really true. For the earlier years it's the total opposite. But she believes what she believes, and right now pesky facts will not change her mind.

She does seem to believe that having failed to focus on her own needs in the past justifies her in making up for it by ignoring the inconvenient fact of me and the MR except when it suits her. And being as selfish as she wants to be. I don't believe that and I think what she is doing right now, especially with a 2-year-old child's family unit at stake, is unconscionable. I was unhappy with things in my life and our MR too. But I've always wanted to stay and fix it. I don't understand the need to veer from one extreme to the other like this.

I can genuinely acknowledge where I let her down and where I need to do better, and point out areas where she could do better, without believing it's best to blow the whole thing up. And truth be told, so far, she's not really making any moves for D or even separation (except sleeping in the living room since a bad argument 2 weeks ago). She's happy to have me around to help with everything but doesn't want a real relationship with me right now. And for now I'm putting up with it because I'm not leaving my D2. My relationship with her comes first.


M 44, W 32
T 10, M 8
D 2
Oct '18: Fantasy affair with OW1 (yes, W)
Feb '19: Inseparable from new lesbian BFF
Still live together but a lot of tension
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
I hear ya. My son is 1.5 yrs old. She claims she did/does everything, she spends more time watching S1, child rearing is imbalanced, she does all the grocery shopping, cooking, clean, working, she has to do everything for everyone, and never puts herself first...I'm not saying there isn't validity to what they are saying but they're truth and perception can be quite exaggerated at times, either way it is their perception...blah blah blah... One hour im a great and wonderful father, who goes out of his way, and the next hour im demonized that she doesn't trust me for long periods, with S1.

Apparantly I'm to blame now, why she flip flopped 4 times on deciding following through on her bariatric weight loss surgery, because she doesn't trust me to care and physically pick up our S1, and keep tabs on him while she was scheduled for recovery post o.p. and all of this could be further from the truth.

Don't listen to any of it. Don't argue with it. Learn from our hard lessons. Just listen, try to empathize with it, and validate it. They are experiencing cognitive dissonance, and negative absolutes. They will re-write history, what they said, what you said, have skewed perceptions, harbor resentments, flip flop their minds, accuse and project onto us all the things they themselves are guilty of, and accuse the LBS of the same things in different capacities, all in the same hour, and then call us mentally ill.

I had to email the W to make a more conscious effort to not leave knives out on the edge of the counter so S1 doesn't cut himself of face this morning. Observed she did it 3 times this week, but doesn't trust me?...Hmm?... Doesn't clean up after herself, orders out all the time because doesn't feel like cooking. Buys minimal groceries, has no problems play games on phone, and binge watching reality tv shows "as an escape" etc, excuses excuses excuses. Not that I don't have mine? Im 180ing on them. The irony of my sich is my W is a behavior specialist that wants to quit her job in pursuit of her happiness by this summer.

A lot of them say before pre BD, that they felt numb, had a hard time being present, foggy memories of significant events. I think some minds and personalities shut down as a form of self preservation when dealing with continued stress. Most of the patterns I see here with the WAS is complaints of emotional numbness.

Look up anxiety symptom #5 emotional numbness, lightheadedness, and Depersonalization, Derealization, and Disassociation and see if what your W is experiencing, or alludes to experiencing is part of that descriptor.

Last edited by IHCLACS; 04/17/19 04:50 PM.
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
Be helpful, but don't be a doormat, and don't perform husbandly duties depending on how far along your sich is. Just lean back, give them space, keep interactions at minimal, focus on you and D2. NO R TALKS. I WISH I LISTENED 7 MONTHS AGO. I can only go so long, like a week with keeping my mouth shut. I've probably gotten trapped into R talks indirectly for almost every weekend for the last 4 months. That stops now, and Im moving forward with securing post S life with S1. She can do whatever her heart makes her happy. I want to see how her fantasy plays out in the real world come this Summer/Fall. Protect your children, and let the accusations roll off your back, but also make changes where warranted.

Last edited by IHCLACS; 04/17/19 04:59 PM.
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
N
Niall11 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
N
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
Originally Posted by IHCLACS
A lot of them say before pre BD, that they felt numb, had a hard time being present, foggy memories of significant events. I think some minds and personalities shut down as a form of self preservation when dealing with continued stress. Most of the patterns I see here with the WAS is complaints of emotional numbness.

Look up anxiety symptom #5 emotional numbness, lightheadedness, and Depersonalization, Derealization, and Disassociation and see if what your W is experiencing, or alludes to experiencing is part of that descriptor.


This sounds very familiar. I will look it up. She said she felt numb and empty for a long time, didn't know who she was.

One of the harder things I've had to do recently was validate and not respond when she accused me of not "allowing" her friends to come to our house. This is the opposite of the truth. I love having people over for dinner, watching a game, whatever. She complained every time. Multiple friends of mine refuse to come back to our house because she wasn't happy about having company and was rude to them. Not once did I ever have any objection to her having friends over to our house.

She also claimed that I made her feel guilty if she went out with a friend (which until recently happened almost never because she was worn out from work and antisocial). And that she was totally cool if I went out to a meeting or met up with friends.

Again, everyone remembers that the opposite is what happened. On the rare occasions when she went out, I generally stayed at home and was happy to relax for a night. When I went out, she texted multiple times asking when I'd be home. Asked me to leave early to bring her food. Complained that the door creaked when I came in. My uncle stayed with us for a while and said that, when I went out in those days, she would stomp around the house very unhappily. So much for her being totally cool with me having separate activities.


M 44, W 32
T 10, M 8
D 2
Oct '18: Fantasy affair with OW1 (yes, W)
Feb '19: Inseparable from new lesbian BFF
Still live together but a lot of tension
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
N
Niall11 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
N
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
Originally Posted by IHCLACS
Be helpful, but don't be a doormat, and don't perform husbandly duties depending on how far along your sich is. Just lean back, give them space, keep interactions at minimal, focus on you and D2.


Yeah. They are painting the building where we live. It's a four-unit building and I have little control over the painters. She's complained about it every day this week and the painters have been pretty cool about it.

Yesterday morning she was venting about the painters again. I thought she was being ridiculous but didn't say so. She starts in with, "Of course you're not going to go say anything to them." I was thinking (did not say), "You're the one with the issue. You go say something to them. You basically fired me as your H and NOW you want me to be your man and protector?"

Originally Posted by IHCLACS
NO R TALKS. I WISH I LISTENED 7 MONTHS AGO. I can only go so long, like a week with keeping my mouth shut. I've probably gotten trapped into R talks indirectly for almost every weekend for the last 4 months.


I slip up maybe every six weeks and generally it goes badly. I'm getting better at avoiding R talks (I initiated them almost constantly last fall) but it's not my nature. I generally believe it's better to talk things out and reach a better understanding. I still consider all of this wildly unnecessary.


M 44, W 32
T 10, M 8
D 2
Oct '18: Fantasy affair with OW1 (yes, W)
Feb '19: Inseparable from new lesbian BFF
Still live together but a lot of tension
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 914
Ha. You and me both. Talking things out to her a better understanding and resolve, as well as finding it wildly unnecessary.

Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
N
Niall11 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
N
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
W continues to be busy during her vacation week and I'm trying to do the same.

Tuesday she was out with D2 at the museum in the morning, then went to see a movie in the afternoon. After dinner I went out with my friends from next door and had a good time.

Wednesday W went out in the morning, I believe with her affair-encouraging BFF, but came back in time to take D2 to the pediatrician. We all went to the playground for an hour, then W went to the supermarket while I took D2 home for a nap. W texted me that her sister was having a BBQ at her new place. She just moved in with her BF about 15 mins from our house. So I took D2 over there and wife joined after finishing with groceries.

Yesterday (Thursday) W went on a day trip about 1.5 hours away. This was originally supposed to be with D2, then W was testing the waters on not bringing her. In the end she took D2 along, which made it much easier for me to finish some work projects.

She called me on the way back and asked if I was at the house. I said I wasn't but I would be soon. She wanted to go out with someone and leave D2 with me. I told her we had a calendar, that Thursday is "my" night, and that I had plans to go out. She asked where, I said, "Out with some friends." She asked which friends. I said she didn't know them, which is true. She was miffed and practically hung up on me. Apparently it's only fun when she gets to do whatever she wants and I stay home and mind the fort. And apparently she's the only one who's supposed to be going out without sharing details. Oh well. I went out and had a lot of fun.

This morning (Friday) I woke up and she'd put an air mattress in the living room. Apparently she has no plans to return to the MBR but was tired of the couch. None of this is what I want but I'm not going to say a word. W took D2 to a playground to meet her coworker and coworker's daughter, who will be in D2's preschool class. They get along really well, which is great since D2 hasn't been around a ton of other kids her age.

W's phone has been acting up so she wanted me to drop everything and go with her to the store (I'm the account holder). I told her I had to finish up some things first and she was miffed. She does not think my work counts. Asked me multiple times how much longer I'd be. I kept saying, "When I'm finished with the project. I have to send it out today.". A couple of hours later we went, with D2. They ended up replacing her phone, and we had to stop by the carrier's store to activate the new one.

After I said I'd like an iced tea and she made this whole thing about having to go to her parents' house and not having time, grumbling because there was traffic on the road with the iced tea. So apparently me taking 2.5 hours to deal with her phone problems is fine, but her taking 10 minutes so I can have an iced tea is a huge imposition. So selfish these days.

She's also become a more hostile driver, making snotty comments about other drivers. ("Come on, MOVE" or "Uh-uh b****, nobody invited you, wait your turn," when a car was inching forward out of a parking lot). Some pretty aggressive driving too, which I don't love with D2 in the car. Anyway...


M 44, W 32
T 10, M 8
D 2
Oct '18: Fantasy affair with OW1 (yes, W)
Feb '19: Inseparable from new lesbian BFF
Still live together but a lot of tension
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
N
Niall11 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
N
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
I hope everyone celebrating had a wonderful Easter!

Not so much for me. When I was a kid it was such a special day. This time it was such a non-event. I took D2 for a walk around the neighborhood in the early morning and, when we returned, W had a trail of eggs leading to a basket with a couple of coloring books and sticker packs. But that was just about it. My MIL had to work, FIL was sick, SIL busy, my family several hours away. Weather was decent so we took D2 to the playground but W just spent most of the day texting, I assume primarily "Potential OW2." I had a great time at the playground with D2 but otherwise it was kind of somber for me.

I should probably rename her since it seems from multiple angles that there is nothing physical or romantic going on with OW2, just a codependent friendship. A good friend of mine actually recognized her and knows her (she appears in my W's Facebook profile pic along with OW1), and says she's pretty controlling and domineering. They were friends for a while but my friend got tired of her nonsense.

Stuff like having one friend with whom she's obsessed at a time (my friend said, "Oh, your W is the flavor of the month?") and wanting to hang out with that person almost every night, and getting snippy if the friend can't until the inevitable falling out. "I need to be friends with people who aren't flaky, I need to know I can rely on you." Stuff like that. Apparently she's not the kind to accept any other commitments in her chosen BFF's life, like a 2-year-old daughter.

So the irony here is that W has invented an alternative history in which she needs independence from me because I'm controlling and jealous (I have had many failings in our MR but those are fiction), only to find herself involved in a friendship with some who is in fact controlling and jealous. W, for all her "I'm bold" stuff these days, can be a bit of a follower and apparently has found someone who wants to play leader. I don't see this ending well. W is capable of cutting friends off without a thought when they annoy her too much, and they work together. Fortunately not in the same department like OW1. Oh well.

Over the weekend, D2 was singing (loudly and off key) a song from a cartoon. W opined that it was "annoying as h***" and that "this is why I could never be a SAHM." Apparently, our wonderful D2 is OK in "small doses."

Who is this person?


M 44, W 32
T 10, M 8
D 2
Oct '18: Fantasy affair with OW1 (yes, W)
Feb '19: Inseparable from new lesbian BFF
Still live together but a lot of tension
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
N
Niall11 Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
N
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 93
Yesterday, what a day.

A week or two back an older couple we've known for years invited us to a jazz concert for last night. To my surprise W said it sounded fun and replied affirmatively to the gentleman the very same day.

Not to my surprise, W then started hedging and saying it depended on finding someone to watch D2. She then didn't even bother to ask her mom or sister, and shot down every suggestion offered. These people even offered their daughter, who's 25 and has plenty of experience babysitting. W kept saying our D2 isn't good with people she doesn't know. Which is true, but we've discussed multiple times trying to get her around more people to fix that.

W does not seem to understand that you don't accept an invitation to something that costs money unless you are sure you are going, and you don't let people know that you're not going three hours before the event. She has done this multiple times.

Last fall a lady in our neighborhood (who let W's parents stay in her house for over a month when our D2 was born) had a 75th birthday party. W kept refusing to commit. They kept asking if we were coming. Eventually I said yes, since there were no tickets or per-person cost involved, and prepared to make an excuse for W (something I've been doing for at least 5 years). Three days before the party W announced wanted to do a dance class that night with her original BFF and was furious that I reminded her of the commitment to the party. In the end she skipped the dance class but refused to attend the party, sulking at home instead. This is the same W who's spent the entire time I've known her complaining that people her age make plans and don't keep them.

So three straight days of her avoiding messages from this guy about the concert that she accepted an invitation to. Then yesterday morning she called me because her tire went very low on the way to work. She needed instructions on how to call AAA, etc. Then she couldn't find her iPhone. She still owes five months of payments on the original one that was broken and Apple replaced just last Friday. Ultimately she had a coworker put the donut on the car and found the phone in the trunk, where she'd put it when looking for the spare in the morning.

Then she wanted to go out with coworkers because "it's been a rough day." I said the people were coming to pick me up at 6:30 for the concert and she was somehow shocked that I was still going without her. And annoyed that she'd have to come home to watch D2.

I went to the concert (front row!) and had a great time! But I'm annoyed at her behavior and wonder why I ever thought she'd honor the commitment. It's brought back a lot of memories of her lack of social consideration. If it weren't for D2 I'd be fine right now with not seeing W for a long, long time.


M 44, W 32
T 10, M 8
D 2
Oct '18: Fantasy affair with OW1 (yes, W)
Feb '19: Inseparable from new lesbian BFF
Still live together but a lot of tension
Page 9 of 11 1 2 7 8 9 10 11

Moderated by  Cadet, DnJ, job, Michele Weiner-Davis 

Link Copied to Clipboard