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BTW - He destroyed all my memories in the figurative sense. I retaliated by destroying all the photos associated with those memories. He knows what he did. I know what I did. We both feel guilt and shame.

We can all be led astray by our emotions. Don't beat yourself up when you fall down. Just get back up and keep going.


W40 (me), H40
M14, Together 16
D12, D9

BD Oct 17
Moved out Mar 18

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Thank you FS. You've given me so much to think about.

I wanted him to leave before he did. I was utterly miserable. So miserable I didn't really see the ways in which I was making myself unhappy, and helping to trigger some of his behaviour. Not that I was responsible for his verbal and emotional abuse - only that I was no saint, and neither of us were really functioning as adults or able to be happy. I think I was incredibly emotionally dependent and needy and I still am in some respects. I need to work on that before I consider a R with him or anyone else. There's things I'd expect and need him to work on before trying again, and the first of these would be for him to communicate what is going on with him without blaming me. I see tiny signs of that - now and again. When I see it I don't think 'oh, he's changing' but 'oh, there's the man I chose all those years ago,' so it isn't like I am asking for him to be someone entirely different. We got into such a bad dynamic. Nobody's needs getting met, each blaming the other and acting progressively more like a child. I don't think we had any choice but to separate. It was awful. I was so sad - but now I am not. I am sure I will be again. But the last few days, and today, I've started to feel calmer and happy.

In terms of those two questions you mention - am I in? is he in? - where we are today is that H seems to be saying, pretty consistently, 'I am all in, but not right now - give me six weeks' and I am saying 'I am not sure if I am all in or not. Let me see what you have to put on the table.' I guess time needs to pass and I need to be clearer. Both of us have conditions on our answers - him because of his work, mine because I need to see him commit before I can. I think we're both going to have to move - he's going to have to make time to work on things and put the MR first for a while - without neglecting his own needs as an individual - and I am going to have to take a risk and accept that it is a risk and there's nothing he can do to take that risk away. I'm not there yet - I'm really not. I want to trust him or at least be willing to take that leap - but today I am not willing.

I look back and I see how dysfunctional - in places - our relationship always was. But you know, we were young when we met. I think most of the dysfunction came from a place of immaturity rather than malice or out and out toxicity. Nobody has done anything truly unforgivable in my eyes, and I don't feel angry at him today. I am concentrating on growing up a bit, because I want to - though it's also a process of disillusionment about who I am, who he is, and what marriage is and might be. Maybe we will come through this to a more mature marriage. Maybe not. But I am never, ever going back so whatever lies ahead feels better than the past and that feels good today.

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Just journalling. A sad day today. I don't know why, not really. I had a nice morning with the kids: Eldest and Youngest getting along and I am really seeing the benefit of the new boundaries and parenting methods that we put in place together after the session with the family therapist. I'm feeling a bit bored - away from work and doing all the childcare has never suited me - but it's just these two weeks and then things will be a bit more normal. It's also hard to really settle to anything like a book or a film with both kids under my feet and the new puppy - but I knew it would be like this and most of the time it is fun.

No contact from H today. I know he's at work. I also know he has breaks and would be able to contact me by text if he wanted to. I also know I tend to, with my neediness, read a lot into his lack of contact - and he's told me already he's stressed, anxious and exhausted and needs to focus entirely on his work. I feel sad. Forgotten about. And usually in these moments I'd be reaching out to him and wanting reassurance. And he'd either give it, which would tide me over for a few days until the doubt started to creep in again, then I'd be back asking for more, like an addict, or resenting him for not offering care and attention and validation freely, because he wanted to. It was so so so dysfunctional. And I am still in that space, but just trying to sit with it and not go to him or read anything into him not coming to me over and above what he's already said. I am trying to accept that he's been very clear about what his position is, and I am very clear in myself that I don't fully believe him, and don't know what my own position is, and nothing he can say or do right now will make a difference to that. It will take time and growth as an individual on my part.

I think part of the reason I feel sad is that I took the kids out this morning and we went to a place we've not been in several years, but which H and I spent a lot of time at when they were babies. I remember us pushing prams around that place. Of course the rose-tinted spectacles will be at play, and a bit of self pity and tiredness too - but it just felt so sad that a couple - a little family - has totally exploded and there's not a single thing I can do about it. I shed a few tears on the way back, but other than that I've been okay and stuck to my GAL and DB plan. Not contacting him for reassurance is a 180. I am trying to drop the rope and detach as well as I can.

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I just said on my thread about distancers going through a pursuit phase and pursuers going through a distancing phase in order to get to somewhere in the middle. I suppose in a way you making your husband move out is the ultimate distancing. Going back to pursuing seems unhealthy for you, just like going back to distancing would be unhealthy for me (even though it’s what I feel like doing).
Going to places with happy memories is hard, actually maybe I shouldn’t have chosen this place for a holiday because there is too much history. Next holiday I’m taking the kids somewhere new. Time to make some new memories! You are doing really well Alison, hang in there and be patient. Can we come up with some strategies for what to do when we want to contact but know we should back off? I could really do with some!!

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Rang H this evening. Asked him how his work had gone - he was evasive, asked me how I was. I said I was a bit sad, that I wish I'd heard from him more. That he keeps saying he wants to work on repairing things but doesn't have time right now, but he could at least have time to send me a text now and again and he hadn't, and it upset me. And he said he couldn't control how I felt and fixed how I felt and he was going to do what everyone else in the world did and please himself for once. And I said he was only able to do that because I was taking sole care of his kids, and perhaps he could show me a bit of compassion and respect and care, and he said he didn't dare ask me how I was because it always opened a can of worms. I said he didn't have to ask me how I was, he could just tell me he loved me, and he was thinking about me, and things were going to be okay, and he said he was never going to be told what to say by me ever again in his life and if I wanted to tell myself the reason why we were split up was because of his behaviour, I could do that, and he'd be quite happy in his room - he got really nasty and sarcastic and ranty and of course we ended up arguing. He was drunk, I think - I started crying and he started doing nasty impressions of me, which is how he reacts when he feels backed into a corner by my emotions. Turned out he'd had a terrible time at work - and was furious at me for not asking (I had) and making it all about me (I did). I just want this to be repaired or over and I can't have either and it stinks. And he says he wants to work on things, but every single time I go to him for comfort he's so nasty to me.

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I could just kick myself. I really could. He's always unbearable when he's tired and he'd obviously come home from work and had a couple of drinks and wasn't in the mood to be dealing with me. And he hates feeling like I am making emotional demands on him, and I basically phoned him and had a go at him for not texting me enough. I just had a very very very weak and sad moment tonight and I had been doing so well. I felt myself drifting away from him and it scared me, I guess. I've tried phoning him again to see if I can repair things and he's turned his phone off. I hate feeling so unnecessary and burdensome and disposable to him. I have been so strong and I've been working so hard on everything and all he sees is some needy, annoying, irritating person who he hates. When I go to him to be cherished or comforted or supported - all things he says he wants in our future - it seems to inspire such contempt in him.

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Oh no, that sounds horrible. You’re about as patient as I am, ie not at all! I know how it feels to be longing for comfort and to be given rejection. That hurts more than anything. So painful, I’m sorry that happened to you (())

Honestly, ringing him like that when you were feeling in need of reassurance was never going to go well...

I reiterate: we need strategies for when we want to pursue but shouldn’t. And for how not to have R talks when we know it’ll just be counterproductive.

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Cross post there!
Ok both of us have messed up today, been over emotional and had unnecessary R talks.
As you said earlier to me, you’re only human and this stuff is HARD. The hardest thing I have ever done, and I do t even know how far through it is. Let’s forgive ourselves for being human and for the odd mess up. And if our husbands are worth having then they will forgive us too, like we forgive them.
Sleep well x

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I think I get that. And I'm not trying to be obstructive. But I don't understand what the point is in having a relationship with someone you are not allowed to ask for emotional support or closeness from. If I don't ask for what I need, I don't get it. If I do ask for it, I get nastiness. It feels like a dead end.

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Alison, I'm sorry that this is going to sound tough and not what you want to hear. Please take a deep breath, and consider.

You do not have a relationship.

You think you do, your husband is clearly indicating you do not. You can't go to him for support because he is not your partner right now. This is all pressure pressure pressure and it will most certainly come to a head in an ugly way. It's already showing. He may say he wants a R, but his actions are very clear that is not the case.

I'm going to catch up on your sitch, but you can't go to H to solve your sadness right now. I'm sorry hun, but you are 100% on your own with this hurt. It's tough. We all know, and we've all been there/are there. But if you can work on you and ONLY you right now the hurt will become bearable. Find something that gives you strength, and pour your soul into it.

Make art. Read books. Go for walks. Hit the gym. Sing. Go to church. Whatever it is - find something that feeds you to get you through. Then as you find some strength you can start putting one foot in front of the other and see where life leads you.

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