I could really go one of two ways with this..........
Originally Posted by Yail
Originally Posted by Bo562
What's my play?
Tell her "I have plans," or be the bigger man / parent and take care of myself and boys whereas she needed help?
Gut says channel R2C and say I have plans.
Bo, I'm going to be harsh. I suspect many won't agree with me, so please take it with a grain of salt.
If you're looking for a "play" why are you even married. That's not a partnership. W has asked you in advance with plenty of notice in what you have presented as a respectful manner. She's not trying to upend your life with a last-minute assumption that you will bend to her wish.
So I vote you answer honestly. If you don't have plans, then I think it's fair to say, "Thanks for the advanced notice, W - I appreciate that. It looks like I'm free so I'll be sure to keep it set aside for the kids".This shows that your priority is your children and that it always will be.
I say respond to respect with respect. If you have any desire that the two of you will ever be able to turn this around or even coparent amicably you have to play fair back. Only play a fake "I'm busy" card if W is trying to bully you.
Yail, I appreciate your honesty and your input.
Perhaps my use of the word ‘play’ was ill-chosen. However, in response to the ‘why are you even married’ sentiment, I guess I could reply that, like has been mentioned on mine and several other threads, my W has effectively fired me as husband.
I have seen others mention that for GAL, just go ahead and make plans if you say ‘I have plans,’ and be vague about the details, though I’m not sure if that would apply to me here, and perhaps I’ve misunderstood.
I agree that she is asking me far in advance, and is not being last-minute, which is good.
That said, I can’t help but wonder if sometimes she wants to have it both ways with me. Around the time she asked me, she talked about being invited to an Easter Egg Hunt at a friend / coworker’s place, who has a daughter about OS’ age. She talked about it being ‘the boys’ earlier that day, and then just her later that night. I don’t think I factor into that equation at all. And, I haven’t exactly been factoring into the family time equation with her very much recently anyway. W and her mom always take the boys places, or her mom is over to help out. I sometimes feel like I don’t matter—because she’s fired me as H?
Thing is, is that if we end up D’ing, her mom will be here every step of the way to help her out. Like I mentioned in my original post about this, I chaperoned Winter Formal, and W admitted to me that she needed her mom there with her to help take care of the boys and put them to bed.
Bo on his own while W is out? NBD, Bo will take care of it. If nothing else, I can document it for any sort of custody arrangement—she evidently trusts me enough to take care of them on my own, and it would show that I could be able to do it on my own, while she needs her mom around. Hopefully this would cut the legs out of any claim by her for sole custody, which my L said is pretty much bananas anyway. However, it would be interesting to note for the record that I could take care of both boys by myself, while their breastfeeding mother (who needed her own help in the inverse situation) is out late drinking beers on St. Paddy’s Day Weekend. Pump and dump.
I complained about this in an earlier post, but Twofeet set me straight—some people just have it easier in this life, and it looks like W will be one of them, as long as her mom is able to help her out. She relies on her mom for a heck of a lot. OS has a week off for ‘ski week’? (Seriously, don’t ask—it’s a thing here.) Grandma buys the 4 of them SoCal Resident passes for Disneyland to use that week and into the summer, and Daddy’s left out.
If W thinks a life without me (as H ready and able to care for the boys whenever she wants to go out) is really that great, I would argue that she may need to get a preview of what that life would be like without me around, like a visit from Ghosts of Divorce Future. I apologize if this sounds mean or bitter, but what exactly would she expect if we D? She gets invited out and I’m already busy? Better call mom, or find something / someone else.
I believe it was SoTorn who mentioned it earlier on my thread, but it seems like W only needs or wants me around when it’s convenient for her. That’s not a partnership, either. The boys are my priority, yes—the priority scheme is the boys, me, and then....her. W won’t reclaim 2nd place in that list unless or until she recommits to MR and talk of D / S ceases for real.
Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
Gotcha, sorry Bo. Eh, why not have a fun night with the boys?
And then there’s this option. This sounds good, too. Boys’ Night Out. Throw in a movie or two for OS, get more of that time with YS that I crave and can’t get enough of. Take the boys to Chick-Fil-A around the corner, or order in a pizza. Or something like that. I don’t need my mom swinging by to bring over dinner like W did when I was out at Formal.
If nothing else, this would prove to me that I CAN DO THIS. Admittedly, a side benefit would be that she would notice, too—but to paraphrase what LH has said previously, why should I care what she / others think? No expectations, right?
Bo, not much else for me to add. Just keep your chin up, be there for your kids (they need some stability), and just keep up working on the DB principles. Make plans to go out Friday night March 15th. Then be there for your kids on Saturday night. GAL. 180s. Detachment. You got this.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
I guess my "why are you still married" comment I was trying to ask if you want to still be married to W. I know she has fired you, but you seem to be here on the board doing the work, so it sounds like you want to put in the effort to yourself with the hopes that maybe there's a chance down the road you and W can revive the R. Coming up with excuses to be unavailable to watch the kids doesn't fit with that narrative.
GAL is important and great, but it doesn't take over for your family. I think we all have to balance the fact that we are happy, content, complete individuals on our own (GAL) with the fact that we don't have to be busy every moment of every day. You have a lot of great GAL activities so I'm sure W has noticed.
Perhaps a "sorry I have plans" white lie would be better suited to someone who is still spending their time moping and around the house all the time. That would be a change for that person. But you are genuinely making changes, so I think showing your balance is important.
This brings me to my "respond to respect with respect" comment. I see where you're coming from, not wanting W to cake-eat or take advantage. But I do think it's a balance. You need to lay the ground work to show that you're an amicable parent/partner that is reasonable. So W's polite and respectful request seemed like the perfect time to mirror that back to her and show you take your parenthood seriously.
With this being said, if she were going out to meet with an OM that would change things. If it was out in the air and public that might be a boundary crossed where you could say, "W, I love our kids more than anything and happily parent them. But seeing as you are going out with OW while asking me to care for them, I must refuse as I find that inappropriate and disrespectful to our M. You will need to find alternate arrangements when visiting with OW, as I cannot condone this".
A couple more things though this is getting long:
You demonstrating your solo parenthood for potential court is another GREAT reason to watch the kids. Document this for sure. Good point
Originally Posted by Bo562
If W thinks a life without me (as H ready and able to care for the boys whenever she wants to go out) is really that great, I would argue that she may need to get a preview of what that life would be like without me around, like a visit from Ghosts of Divorce Future. I apologize if this sounds mean or bitter, but what exactly would she expect if we D? She gets invited out and I’m already busy? Better call mom, or find something / someone else.
I believe it was SoTorn who mentioned it earlier on my thread, but it seems like W only needs or wants me around when it’s convenient for her. That’s not a partnership, either. The boys are my priority, yes—the priority scheme is the boys, me, and then....her. W won’t reclaim 2nd place in that list unless or until she recommits to MR and talk of D / S ceases for real.
There is a great line in the archives that I've read a lot: Do you want to be married, or do you want to be right? Right now your W is not in the marriage. That's known. But you have the option to be in or out - and you make a choice every single day with your actions/inactions.
It's not your job to point out to W what her life will be without you. That's on her. Your job is to show her what life will be if she stays and recommits. With respect, boundaries, your 180s, PMA....all the stuff going on here.
W asked me if I had plans for night of Sat. March 16th
She wants to go out to a St. Patrick's Day event with coworkers at Queen Mary in Long Beach. I told her I'd check.
Implied is I would feed myself and put boys to bed.
Bo, as long as the two of you are under the same roof there needs to be some communication and coordination on things like this. Your W is giving you plenty of notice, I can't think of a single valid reason for you to not accommodate her on this. Likewise if you make plans to do something with friends then give her plenty of notice as well. That's only fair.
I'm curious why you emphasized that you would need to feed yourself and put the boys to bed, it sounds like you're implying that's your W's job. I'm sure you're perfectly capable of this?
Quote
Thing is, last Sunday, when I chaperoned Winter Formal, she needed her Mom over to help her with all that.
I doubt she "needed" her mom there to feed herself and put the boys to bed. She probably just invited her over so she could spend some time with her.
Quote
Tell her "I have plans,"
Honest question here- why would you do that? What is your goal, and would this action get you closer to your goal or farther away?
Quote
or be the bigger man / parent and take care of myself and boys whereas she needed help?
How is feeding yourself and putting the boys to bed one night being "the bigger man"? Honestly your whole post is confusing me, where are you getting this idea that punishing your W by refusing to parent your kids for one night is helping your sitch?
She wants to go out to a St. Patrick's Day event with coworkers at Queen Mary in Long Beach. I told her I'd check.
Implied is I would feed myself and put boys to bed.
Thing is, last Sunday, when I chaperoned Winter Formal, she needed her Mom over to help her with all that.
What's my play?
Tell her "I have plans," or be the bigger man / parent and take care of myself and boys whereas she needed help?
You would be the bigger man by taking care of yourself? What does that mean.........like feeding yourself?
I could write a book about the above quote, but I'll cut to the chase and tell you to just be honest and do the right thing. You did not make previous plans, and you would be worse than a jerk to lie or find some kind of fake GAL just to spite her. And if you do, she'll probably not give you a two week notice anymore. So, yeah......keep your kids.
Quote
I have seen others mention that for GAL, just go ahead and make plans if you say ‘I have plans,’ and be vague about the details, though I’m not sure if that would apply to me here, and perhaps I’ve misunderstood.
Reading and applying DB advice to your current situation is kind of the same principle as the application of scripture. If you don't have discernment, you could really make the situation a lot worse.
I don't recommend that you try to book ever Sat & Sun on the calendar, as some way to prevent her from going out. You just open yourself for more contention between the two of you. It doesn't really pay off.
Quote
I can’t help but wonder if sometimes she wants to have it both ways with me. Around the time she asked me, she talked about being invited to an Easter Egg Hunt at a friend / coworker’s place, who has a daughter about OS’ age. She talked about it being ‘the boys’ earlier that day, and then just her later that night. I don’t think I factor into that equation at all. And, I haven’t exactly been factoring into the family time equation with her very much recently anyway. W and her mom always take the boys places, or her mom is over to help out. I sometimes feel like I don’t matter—because she’s fired me as H?
It doesn't sound to me like she wants it both ways. Having it both ways is when they try to live like a single woman and still have H included other times to play happy family. You sound as if you are surprised that she is phasing you out of the picture. You have asked the question what does she expect. What did you expect, Bo?
Quote
Thing is, is that if we end up D’ing, her mom will be here every step of the way to help her out.
So what? It's no skin off your back! If your W is that incompetent, I would think you would feel better knowing grandma is there to help out.
Quote
I apologize if this sounds mean or bitter, but what exactly would she expect if we D? She gets invited out and I’m already busy? Better call mom, or find something / someone else.
That's is pretty much the layout for a divorced working mother.
Quote
I believe it was SoTorn who mentioned it earlier on my thread, but it seems like W only needs or wants me around when it’s convenient for her. That’s not a partnership, either.
Well......yeah, when it's convenient for her! The only way she sees the two of you in a partnership is parenting those kids. You are the one who sounds as if you aren't facing reality. Why would she want you around other than when she needs you for something? Why do you feel you should be included in her plans with the boys?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
And then there’s this option. This sounds good, too. Boys’ Night Out. Throw in a movie or two for OS, get more of that time with YS that I crave and can’t get enough of. Take the boys to Chick-Fil-A around the corner, or order in a pizza. Or something like that. I don’t need my mom swinging by to bring over dinner like W did when I was out at Formal.
If nothing else, this would prove to me that I CAN DO THIS. Admittedly, a side benefit would be that she would notice, too—but to paraphrase what LH has said previously, why should I care what she / others think? No expectations, right?
That's what I'm talking about! You know, I'm kind of glad I don't have kids in my sitch, but it'd be pretty cool to have a couple little partners in crime to have some fun with. You should take advantage of that, because they'll be big and kicking your butt before you know it!
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Just got D papers in the mail from W. That explains why she’s been so quiet recently.
Will email my L.
Arrived in the mail earlier tonight (how does that work—I thought you had to be served in-person, but whatevs). W is in the shower right now, so as I opened envelope, YS woke up. I walked YS around to get him back to sleep.
