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OneArt

How are you doing?

Did you guys talk or meet up?


Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids
2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong
2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2
2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
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The something that you are sensing could be one of three scenarios:

1. The holidays are rapidly approaching and he is feeling the need to reconnect w/family during the holiday season. Many of them do this from now until March 17th,

2. He wants something from you and he knows that the only way he will get your cooperation is to play nice, or

3. He's done something that is going to make you angry when you discover what it is.

Call me crazy, but I have been an unwilling participant in all three scenarios. Keep on your toes.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Job, you raise so many points I've been pondering and trying to decide for me what is best to handle. Gordie I have not seen him but we had a long call. Maybe you guys can help me figure out what is going on or what I should do here. I am torn.

I can see that he can't handle not knowing what is going on here. Keep in mind I have no idea what he is doing and never have.

I do think having some communication with him makes him stop all of the stalking stuff. But how is that not cake eating, even if a very small portion of cake. I don't need to know anything about him. I'm ready to close this book for good. How does letting him carry on his super fun life and check in here to keep him calm help him or anyone else? How is it overcoming his abandonment issues so he can resolve the divorce. I think all it does is salve his wounds so he can carry on in limbo indefinitely.

I'm sick of him threatening divorce, and now using crappy letters from his lawyer to get my attention when he clearly has no ability to follow through. I offered a resolution by year end which he should be clamoring for. He uncharacteristically said we could meet to do an agreement, but then backpedaled and said he was too busy and needed a call first (he had the whole week off and only claimed to be busy 2 of the days). I said it really needs to be done in person and let me know when you can do it. Crickets on that. Once we communicated, no mention of the divorce or wrapping it up. We were on the phone for something like 40 mins about the S issue. After the initial snottiness, it was like talking to my old H. No mention of the divorce at all. Not one mention of D either.

He has gone from blocking me and refusing to respond to me at all to suddenly being warm and friendly on the phone, unblocking me, and then immediately responding to a time change text about a meeting with S a week away, and using an upbeat and friendly/informal tone. I think I've repeatedly mentioned how he is normally cold, unresponsive, and if he communicates with me at all it usually something bordering Shakespearean speech.

Job I don't think he is going to get anywhere near that divorce. I haven't heard anything more from his lawyer and nor has mine. I haven't gotten the discovery his lawyer said he would send if we didn't respond (I have no problems with him taking discovery--at least it would be moving forward in some direction and the process the lawyer proposed was ridiculous and clearly only intended to make him and his crony experts a pretty penny, while limiting inquiry to a few of the matters in the case and ignoring the huge ones).

On your three scenarios Job:

1. Yes, I can see the holidays having an impact. In his family there was always a Christmas thaw for the battling factions so in addition to how cluster B's handle this time of year, there could be some major FOO stuff going on there too;

2. If the point of nice-ing me up is for the divorce, he isn't doing a good job since I've tried to push that agenda and he avoids it like the plague. Maybe he wants to buy a house so he can get out of that sty and have some more room to hide from her and her kids. If we aren't divorced, he needs my consent (which he'll never get--why would I consent to anything when he can do whatever he wants after divorce). I raise this possibility because he was accusing me of buying in property in May and I saw that as projection. Maybe he wants to get rid of his car (fixed now according to the insurance co) and I'm on title. I was the one, yet again, who asked him to see S, but only because he is really struggling right now and even the school is raising concerns, so it can't be that;

3. Yes, he often gets nice when he has done something awful. But this time the nice feels different. Usually he pays extra money or something else that isn't very personal, not unblocks me and communicates like a human. Also, there was no indication of nice during the recent stalk-fest.

Maybe he is just messing with me, and is like I've done nasty long enough, I'll try to be nicer for a bit to freak her out. I'm not that freaked out, just still annoyed by the games and the inability to move forward. I have three trials in mid December across the country so nothing is going to get done in December and then it won't matter because of the tax change.

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One more point to ponder....maybe he's finally getting his act together and waking up a bit. He maybe trying to the reconnection start up.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Or as a contrary point of view, he's just avoiding dealing with anything hard by pretending it doesn't exist.

I think though as Sarah suggested - keep on your toes and stay safe. He could probably turn on a dime.


On BD
H52, W50
T27, M26
S21, D23
BD-9-Mar-16
D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18
I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good.
But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
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Job, I do think he has gone through a withdrawal and a first awakening as HB described. I just don’t have much hope he’ll travel any more than that. There is so much dysfunction around everything he does, it is hard to think the human could actually emerge at any point.

Andrew, that one doesn’t quite work. No one was bothering him. He was facing no real deadlines, but when the subtle and sneaky prods weren’t working, he is the one who had his lawyer reach out to mine. I was calm and offered what I always do—a private, settled result that wouldn’t risk his job/career or embarrass our D who even at a young age has already become a public figure. Normally he ignores me or rages. This time was very, very different.

It is unfortunate that my S is struggling now and has resulted in additional contact, but his needs have to come first. I know H won’t help him, but he wants a dad so badly he just doesn’t see it.

It is likely just a cycle in or a touch and go, and I won’t be affected by it, but my son will. When he leaves again, it will bring forward more issues.

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I've had the most interesting 24 hour period I've had since this saga began.

This morning, I awoke to a beautiful double rainbow that was perfectly centered outside my bedroom window. I had my daughter take a picture of it for me. it is truly glorious. I was finishing up a scary movie with the kids that we had begun the night before. I suddenly had a memory of an email I had written to my H a month or two after kicking him out for what I knew would be the last time. That morning I had seen a rainbow and written him an email telling him that I had seen this rainbow and took it as a sign that it was ok to let him go. I wished him much happiness with OW1 and let him know I was ready to wrap things up (unbeknownst to me, they broke up 8 days later). I recalled it was about this time of year and searched my email. It was exactly 2 years ago to the day. While not religious, I tend to feel certain spiritual things and don't dismiss such things as mere coincidence.

Back to yesterday. Son saw H for the first time in 6 months. The health nut (all his life) has gained about 50 lbs and is now fat, completely bald, and complaining of physical injuries. He actually ate with my son (used to sit there while others ate and would only eat 1 salad a day). He ate a lot, and ate carbs. He has been regularly traveling to a foreign country that he never expressed interest in, that is a place I took the children the first Xmas after kicking him out (and that he told me was awful and dangerous). Other than a slip using the word "we" in reference to this trip, for which according to son he instantly blanched and became tongue-tied, there was no mention of OW2, her dog, her kids, etc. Her picture is on his phone though. For the most part there wasn't a lot of revelation to what S said, just more boxes ticked on the MLC list (spending, vacations, gambling?).

Later that night son comes to me. He knows that I am very strongly opposed to firearms and weapons of any kind, as was H the whole time I knew him. H said several times in his zombie state before leaving that he would never own a gun because he was afraid he would blow his brains out). Son tells me he now owns at least 3 guns and another weapon. I am devastated for many reasons. Do my best to hold it together.

Later my D mentions the correspondence she received from him the same day I got the stupid lawyer's letter and tried to talk to him. (the last time she heard from him, a couple of weeks ago, because he is blocked. It was instructing her, curtly, to read a certain book and watch a certain movie. I looked them up. The movie is about a father and daughter living off the grid in a rural area adjacent a major city with which we have a connection. I find this somewhat disturbing, as does she.

The book is about a depressed man who has been avoiding his estranged spouse who is trying to get him to sign divorce papers. He lies about receiving them and they meet and she gives him a new copy. He tells her he isn't ready and that he can't do it. She says it has been two and a half years (bells going off big time for me) and you still aren't ready, when will you be ready (I think in the end he gives them to her).

Once more, he filed (although I repeatedly called his bluff when he threatened). The same day he sent this to her, I got the lawyer's letter and immediately reached out to him. After the usual game playing he said he would meet, then chickened out saying he was busy. It was weeks ago. He has not come forward with more dates and his lawyer has not contacted mine asking why no response to the letter. Although his demeanor has become more civil and responsive.

I don't know what he is trying to tell me or if he is asking for help. Had he been ready to sign, I gave him all the chance in the world. I have been calm and patient to a fault. i really hope this is the usual narc holiday busting stuff, and not a sign of something more troubling. I will not be contacting him.

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I find it very interesting about the movie and book. Maybe in his own way, he's trying to "enlighten" you and your daughter about what is going on w/him. Some of them do give family members movies, books, poems and songs to listen to that describe what they are going through.

I think, in his own way, he's trying to tell you he's not ready to sign the papers. I do not believe there is anything you have to be concerned about something more troubling. I just think he's trying to delay the process because he's not ready to totally walk away.

Just my two cents.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Wow,OneArt -- what a day!

I was just thinking as I read your thread that it seems in some ways easier when the kids are older and can see clearly that the MLCer is not in right mind. My daughter especially loves to hang out with her dad. She refers to "old papa" and "new papa" or sometimes "good papa" (former H) and "bad papa." But she doesn't really understand that he's crazy, so it's very confusing for her.

Anyway -- Two rainbows, two years to the day after?

I know you are not a believer. If that happened to me, a serious believer, I would thank God for the extremely clear message that I must continue to stand in faith. I know you don't see it that way so I was wondering what it means to you. You said it was a spiritual sign; what is it a spiritual sign of?


I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living.
Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
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Oy vey, where to begin. I swear if I did not have to live this stuff, I would never believe that it could really happen. I was on the opposite coast for work and about to fly home. I get a text from Odysseus (I just can't call him my H anymore, which is interesting in light of what I am going to write below). Perhaps OD for short.

So OD asks if he can come the following day to discuss the agreement (you know, the one he has had for 2 years). I admit, I'm slightly piqued, not having seen the man for 1.5 years or so, given the drama he caused at Thanksgiving, and how we are suddenly going to get this resolved. I was blocked for 7 months or so, and I usually only get formal emails. This was a normalish text, he was responsive, and not putting up any hurdles.

I live in an upside down house. I leave the door unlocked and when he rings I tell him to come upstairs. He is five minutes early (good job there, usually likes to keep me waiting). Comes in with a bag. I think OMG, are we actually going to talk about the agreement? Are there papers in there? A computer? A notepad? Maybe even a pen? This is shocking. (When he uses the bathroom I peak--no computer, no papers, no notepad, no pen. Rx bottles, gum, his phone, etc.). Have a normal conversation for about 2 hours about the kids, what they are doing, what their upcoming plans are. Actually seems like a father participating in a conversation.

Then he says, what are we doing to get this wrapped up, it has dragged on for a long time, what do you think we should do. I sit in somewhat shock. I say, yes, I've been trying to wrap it up for 2 years, you've had the agreement, never told me what you didn't like about it. He grumbles about stuff that is not actually in the document. I say, I don't think you've read that document. It pretty much says we will keep doing the same thing we have been doing. You can take that document and the court will finalize the divorce, or we can keep paying lawyers and battle it out. He says something to the effect of wanting to be done with lawyers. I say yes and tell him that I am particularly unimpressed with his. He says he doesn't like him either and has talked to him very little (that is pretty obvious). He says we just have a few things to resolve (shaking my head in disbelief again).

I ask him if he read the letter his lawyer sent me a little over a month ago. He says no. I say you are cced on the letter. He says I didn't see it (he always claims he never said this, did that, etc.). I read him the letter. I say where is the mention of your child in that letter. He says there is no mention. I say isn't that the biggest thing we need to resolve? He says I'm not fighting it. I said you are not fighting what. He says I will take the other weekend, but it will be as my schedule permits. I say who offered you every other weekend? I asked what son was supposed to do planning his life. He says that son can drive soon and come to see him when he wants to. I say that isn't how it works.

I ask about the cars. He says we each keep our own. I ask about retirement, and point out that even though we have a postnup that governs retirement his lawyer is asking for my accounts. He says he wants us to keep our own retirement (he has none, I have lots). I say great.

Then I ask about the house, does he want to sell it now or later. I explain what the court will do with the house if we march ahead to the trial date. He says he wants me to stay in the house until son graduates. I say its fine, I can rent an apartment. He says where. I say in the school district. He says he doesn't want us living in an apartment. I say the house needs to be sold while we are married because of the capital gain issue. I say we need to discuss the equity in the house and the amount of child support and alimony. He never does answer the child support question. He does make it clear that he doesn't want to pay me alimony. I say essentially too bad. He keeps coming back to the house. Says he doesn't want us to move. I say again, the house needs to be sold while we are still married. Then he says, well I guess we need to stay married until son graduates. This conversation makes no sense because he had told me again how much he hates the house, hates our town, thinks the real estate market is going to crash.

We got off topic into lots of the annoying stuff. I let on that I know his living situation has changed, but I don't say where. He tells me the month he moved, which I hadn't previously known. He ends up giving me a check for Xmas gifts for the kids (even though in the past he has always done a bank transfer--guess he really wanted me to see her address on his checks). He mentions her by name once. I say look, I don't know this person, she is crack with a pulse and means nothing to me.

I ask why he kicked me off the Costco card with no warning. He said it was inconvenient for OW2 to have to go with him all the time. I said you could have gotten her a card without kicking me off or you could have said hey, by the way, I kicked you off. He said we have two households, we need to divide stuff. I say great, I'm glad you are moving your auto and life insurance into your own name. Let's see: cost of my new Costco card $0 (my mom got me a card); savings to me from insurance $3,000 a year. Good deal you made for yourself OD.

Relatively early on he tells me that an adjoining state is going to legalize psychedelic drugs and suggests our daughter take them (who is this man?). Of course at this point I know he is using them, as I had suspected, based on reading about them in regards to another MLCer and figuring this is the type of thing that would appeal to him). He waves his hands around and says oh I know you'll never agree with this. I said, you've got that right.

At one point he is talking about his family, who he never wanted any part of. I tell him that my son doesn't want to see them. I point out that they have never been part of the children's lives and never reached out to any of us. He says that it is because I didn't let them in our lives. I say excuse me, you wanted no part of them. I begged you at times to reach out and you refused. He said that is because I wanted it to be on my terms, not yours.

He truly is the teflon man. Nothing sticks to him. Someone else was to blame for every single thing that happened. He didn't do this, he didn't say that. It was the bank's fault, the insurance company's fault, the post office's fault. Our daughter doesn't kiss his butt for paying her tuition. Our son can see him when he wants to. The children have not made him a priority. I say you've seen your son 3x in 2018 for about 6 hours. Was that making him a priority? I say its funny that the kids say the same thing about him.

He said that is the problem with all of you. You can't just leave the past in the past. This is the present, it is time to move on. I say that is what the people who say and do the hurtful things always say. Forget about it. I'm not going to apologize. Just get over it.

Still zero emotion. Acting like his life is so wonderful. He looks even worse than what my son described. I looked at him and only saw his father.

He says he has to leave. I say before you leave, tell me what you want to do with this lawsuit. He says I need time to think about it. I say no. You've had years. You said we need to get it wrapped up. It's your case. You sued me. Deadlines are marching forward, lawyers are expecting to be paid. What do you want to do? He says I guess I'm going to call my lawyer and tell him to make the divorce go away. Then he says we can deal with it after son graduates. More stalling. More excuses. He doesn't want the separation agreement. He doesn't plan to buy any property, doesn't want the house sold. He just wants to keep up the status quo. Then why did he file?

I think this was his entire agenda in asking for this meeting. I know what my lawyer will say. She will say good, this is the best result for you and the kids. But she is not the one who has to live it. I will never, ever be divorced from this man. Oh yes, and he wants more communication going forward (you know the guy who blocked me for 7 months, doesn't even say thank you if I send him pictures of the kids or a comment on their progress--but of course I'm lying he said, he always sends a thank you).

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