I was on the phone when I got the message and wasn't paying attention to the details:)
A relationship is on where you consider the other persons feelings, make an effort to make sure they feel secure and have a level of consistency. Perhaps she is saying she doesn't want an R because she can't offer those things right now?
Hey, that was HC's thing. He wanted to see me, date me, dessert me, whatever you want to call it. But he wsn't in a place to offer me consistency and reassurance. Hence, no R, hence, it doesn't work for me or him.
Hang in there DH.....it's hard to hold the line and make them come to you when you start to get a taste of some booty Are your edges starting to soften
Aw, you rascally Avoidant you, Don - you're catching feelings!
The reason you feel so - uncomfortable - is because once you have feelings you have something to lose. That's generally why Avoidants keep people at arms length. But as my friend once said - "Avoidants need love too!".
You may just have found the right woman who doesn't want to see you all the time and crowd you. You got what you wished for so just enjoy and stop looking into the ditch. (A friend taught me to ride a dirt bike once and he said - "Don't look into the ditch or you'll end up in the ditch. Look where you want to go.")
The reason you feel so - uncomfortable - is because once you have feelings you have something to lose. That's generally why Avoidants keep people at arms length. But as my friend once said - "Avoidants need love too!"
I don't want whatever this is to end - or at least I'm not ready for it to end yet. I still can't see years down the road and am not trying to but I've finally found someone I look forward to seeing. That's kinda rare for me. I think the last time was 2.5 years ago now! I often am interested to see them but I could take it or leave it and often feel like yeah I want to meet up more than I don't but there is not much excitement. I'm totally enjoying this. It's fun planning things to do. It's great to have someone to call and tell about my day, etc. I just have this nagging fear that all of a sudden she will change her mind, or a guy closer to her typical type - ie younger - will come along. But just as much, I also worry that I'll lose interest. It's not like I try to but it's happened before where all of a sudden... Or the "cute" things she does will become really annoying things.
I actually remember some 25 years ago sorta being in the same situation. Thing is, as soon as she said "okay let's do this for real, how about I come down with the kids and we all spend the weekend together" I was so turned off and so out. Of course let's hope I've matured some in those 25 years - including a marriage in that span. In that case I look back now thinking, what in the heck did I even see in her? But again it was 25 years ago.
But I could see doing this with Wild Girl for good while yet - so long as things don't change - but we all know they will. It won't stay like this forever, so I'm just enjoying it while it's here and hoping it lasts at least as long as I want it to. That's as honest as I can be. I just need to stop torturing myself or at least annoying myself in the meantime. There was no reason to have the doubting thoughts I had, or put myself through the negative thoughts - NONE. I need to stop that as there is no reason for it!
DonH Midwest Me 56 WAW-EXW 55 Met 11/95 / Married 5/00 Bomb 6/20/05 / She Filed on 6/2/06 / Divorced on 10/9/06 4 who'd qualify as GF since D & dated about 25 women since D
So looks like about a week and a half since I've updated so it's time. Really, a lot I think has shifted, I guess I'm just not sure about all of it, I'm really not sure of why but I know it's changing.
When I look and think back, all of this recent Wild Girl run started with me needing to find a "date" for a 7 day cruise. That really is what spurred me to be more active in the dating world again. I had three or four women to explore/choose from, plus had a semi-solid back-up FWB that I could go to if really needed. But then WG popped back on my radar after being introduced in June of 2017. The following now 3.5 months has been chronicled here so I won't recap any additional recent history.
Last week was again weird - much like the week before. I sensed something going on two weeks ago but then it appeared like I was overthinking and mind-reading too much. Well, perhaps not. We've only been seeing each other a couple times a month - but often for a couple days at a time. In between there has been lots and lots of phone calls and texts. I went to her house for the opening Sunday of football, after she backed out on coming over Saturday to Sunday two weekends ago. Things seemed rather normal. Then this past week she clearly was distancing. Finally by Wednesday I just dropped the rope. We still had a text here and there but not the often now common hour or two phone calls at night. I knew she was getting to that time of the month and chalked it up to that, plus the girls are back in school and around more needing her attention. We already had prior plans for this Saturday including my staying over at her house due to multiple band gigs near her so I figured I'd just see her then. She showed up with her parents on Saturday and all was normal. She told them about the cruise - her daughters and friends already knew, even though she said she would not tell anyone for a while. Things seemed normal with fairly normal physical touch although we've now not had sex the last I think three times we've been together - mostly for lack of opportunity, although when there could have been opportunity, she didn't want to take it. A few more of my friends met her with other onlookers asking other band members "Is that Don's girlfriend, or who is Don with?" as it's not typical for me to have a GF type person at a gig. Since her parents picked her up and brought her, I took her back to her house. She gave up her bed and slept on the couch as her daughters were home - something I am more than totally fine with and would have encouraged if she suggested otherwise. Sunday morning seemed a little strained. I had to leave about noon to perform at the Sunday gig and was not sure if I was stopping back at her house or not. Ends up I left a few items behind - no big deal but went back for a few drinks on her deck in the eve anyhow.
Glad I did as we had our normal very good conversation and time, but it became more clear something was up or perhaps she's just going through too much at the moment. Most upsetting to me, even though it really should not be, was that for whatever crazy reason D17 who I really thought a lot of and who seemed to really like me, now doesn't want me around. Hmmmmm interesting. I have zero idea why other than she's a teenager. WG seems to think that they are both afraid I'm taking their mother away. But wow the attitude on this girl last night and Wild Girl took it all from her as if SHE is the daughter and D17 is the mother - which is not at all her personality normally. D17 was very disrespectful to her, would not even acknowledged me, very interesting to experience and totally out of nowhere as last weekend D17 talked my ear off with Wild Girl saying "Why do you talk with Don about all of this stuff but you never tell me these things?" So truly a 180 overnight - or during the week. Makes me wonder if WG was discussing me with D17? Also odd... or perhaps it's just she's a teenager getting away with it so she continues.
To add to it all, Wild Girl's ex bf, from what I can tell, perhaps the only guy she thinks she's ever loved, had a baby with his still somewhat new wife, there is a friend family connection and WG came face to face with exbf, wife and baby about 10 days ago at a birthday party. It almost seems like whatever is going on started then. Then her actual ex husband she D'd 9 years ago got married a week ago. She has zero feelings for him, but you still have to wonder if that didn't effect her in some way - just seeing his life is moving on while her's at least romantically, is not - including getting that 3rd baby her ex bf promised her. Then her BFF since kindergarten and her had a bit of a falling out. She did tell me she hasn't felt like talking to anyone lately. At least, I know I didn't do anything, other than be myself. I get some feeling that she thinks I'm only looking for sex. That's an odd dynamic for me given she's very sexual, initiated things much faster than I would have yet now might think that's all "I" am looking for? Very odd. Although I've seen others here post about thinking that guys are only after sex even after they had sex with them very quickly.
Sadly, or perhaps fortuitously, it has me taking a much more clear look at the reality of all of this - and it's what it has always been, only now I'm seeing it clearer or not looking past it. Wow, maybe I am just looking for sex? But I swear, I really don't think that way consciously. I very much enjoy just hanging out, talking on the phone, having a goto person to do things with, etc. Bottom line remains however, she can be a lot of fun to play with but I know more than ever that I don't want to do full-time, or whatever catchy phrase might apply - perhaps a fun place to visit but I would not want to live there? She's clearly stressed, and increasing her already solid level of self-medicating with alcohol, but I'm seeing her downsides much more than the up lately.
So where that brings me is I'm giving lots of space. In fact I won't contact her and will wait for her to come to me. I think that's likely needed in order to reach January 19 anyhow. Remember this was my fear all along - having to name someone so far out and then get through the next 5 or 6 months with them. I really don't see her backing out - I mean who would. And for all I know whatever is bothering her will pass in a week and she will be blowing up my phone and wanting to come out and visit. Who knows. Perhaps it's like the stock market and is a needed correction. Things can't always go up and up and up, you have to have fall downs, fall outs and corrections. I was getting too connected (for me anyhow) as it was, so another positive for a correction. The way it's all happened has me feeling totally fine about it all, which is also very helpful.
I am in what might be my busiest season for music. I "only" did 3 gigs over about 24 hours this weekend but man I was beat, at least my mouth was. Friday will kick off what might be my longest string in a long, long, long time - 11 gigs in 10 days. That's a lot of sax playing let me tell you! I've gotten so good at being a semi-retired lazy guy... So life is still good and I'm doing just fine. I miss that, met a really fun girl newness. It really was a fun several months with ball games, fairs, dining out and of course sleep overs! And this is not yet the end, but something really tells me that the end of January might be as we become a very occasional FWB situation.
Perhaps what stinks the most is now knowing for sure that I'll eventually have to find someone else. I really have come to not like the finding someone new dating process. There really is something to be said for finally getting comfortable with someone and not always having to do another first date, another first kiss, etc. Either way, Wild Girl is not going to be my last first kiss - just no way - but I pretty much new that, and said it here, right off the bat. So more dating it will have to be - just not for at least a few months yet. I'll hang back here for a little while and see if things work themselves out. It really is her loss much more than mine, in that I have no doubt.
So there you go. Sorry this update is not as exciting as some of the others. I know I'll still have more exciting and positive ones before whatever this is fully concludes - just might not be for another month or so. As always, I'm very open to thoughts, opinions or suggestions should anyone have them. If not, hopefully you at least enjoy reading my updates.
DonH Midwest Me 56 WAW-EXW 55 Met 11/95 / Married 5/00 Bomb 6/20/05 / She Filed on 6/2/06 / Divorced on 10/9/06 4 who'd qualify as GF since D & dated about 25 women since D
Dh.....I agree with your assessment back off and give her space, let her come to you. Trust your gut if you sense that something is off. You’re right, it is a long time until Jan.
But it looks more painful than enjoyable for your right now. You aren't even getting that great sex, her kids are being nasty, she is being distant, you aren't having your fun dates.
What's keeping you there? The cruise? The hope that something wonderful will come out of this? The though of having to start from scratch with someone else?
I don't like the finding someone new dating process. But I realize it's a better option than being in a crappy half-arsed relationship. Or being alone for the rest of my life. You got to see which thing you dislike the most, I guess.
What's keeping you there? The cruise? The hope that something wonderful will come out of this? The though of having to start from scratch with someone else?.
Great question! I'd say much of the above other than something wonderful - I don't see that. It's likely that the cruise is number 1. I've tried to explain the dynamic of this but unless you are in it I guess it's hard for you guys to understand the significance of this. First off it's a tremendous opportunity to get and do something that rarely comes along. We are getting as a band over $10,000 grand to do a gig that would normally pay about 1/4. But that's just the start. The potential is great for this to become a yearly thing. For one band this will be their 5th straight year. Our drummer got tapped to go to Hawaii on a 10 day trip and cruise. That coukd happen to me amd the full band could go again for several years if we don't rock the boat. I'm 3 layers down here. Everything is now booked including flights. If I come back to them and ask for changes I'll be seen as high maintainence. I know there will be charges. Here is a separate example, we used to perform at a place 6 or 9 weekends a year. We needed one or two extra hotel rooms for a festival they were part of. For whatever reason they got P'd off. They never hired us for that festival again and we rarely if ever play the bar/restaurant anymore. It's just how this biz works. Think of how many bands would kill for a $3,000 vacation (per band member and guest) in exchange for less than 10 hours of "work". The leaders wife is very savvy on this stuff and dealt with the promoter on the flights. I guess he was rather difficult and was already a bit upset with something we had already done that caused them a slight hiccup. She already said, you guys better not rock the boat or you'll never get asked back. Imagine if I were the guy who capsized us? Nope, I'm nit raking that chance.
Hopefully that makes it more clear why now that Wild Girl is all booked and ticketed I'm extremely reluctant to change it. But then, change it to whom? The other two I was considering now know I'm taking wild girl. I can't hardly go back to either of them and say, "hey do you want to be my second choice to go". The thought of starting from scratch also is there. Those of you who've been following know my struggles there.
All that said, I won't stick with wild girl for fear or reluctance to do anything else. That's not me, I've totally always been happier alone than frustrated with someone else. While I don't think something wonderful will come out, until about two or three weeks ago it had been really nice. So we are talking about 1/6 or 1/5 of the time has been more strained. So it well may return. It would be just as stupid for me to bail at the first speed bump. Had thus started at week three it would be a different story, I'd be gone, but also not this far in. But I need to give it time. There is no rush to bail. Should I meet an awesome girl thus weekend, I'll ask her out. There really is no rush as long as I detach.
I really do wonder if this doesn't relate back to sex. The most baffling part is D17. There is nothing I could have done for her reaction - I swear wild girl had to say something to her. I've got a great intuition and I'll bet I'm right about this. I'll maybe elaborate in another post but I wonder if Wild Girl was testing me with some comments, etc and I totally failed - and I even know better. I know, it's not making sence but if I tell the story it may.
Thing is, it's not like I even want to contact her and am not. I have not had one urge - especially since she asked me, as always to text her when I got home Sunday night. I've not heard from her since. So I will wait this week. I really will be surprised if I don't hear from her but if not, at some point I will just cut to it and ask what's up, something is obviously going on and put her on the spot with it. It's a little different than an OLD thing as she can't just ghost me away with not only the cruise but her family all know me, my friends know her, her friends know me. I'd be shocked if she would even try if these other things were not in place, but certainly not when they are. But I'll first give her time and space. That's number one
DonH Midwest Me 56 WAW-EXW 55 Met 11/95 / Married 5/00 Bomb 6/20/05 / She Filed on 6/2/06 / Divorced on 10/9/06 4 who'd qualify as GF since D & dated about 25 women since D
Don - just my 2 pence here for what it's worth. This is only my perception based on what I've read so I may be way off base here.
It's sad to me to read what appears to be you giving up on this person but planning to string her along for your own reasons for the next number of months.
Yes, she's damaged and no you're not a knight in shining armour there to rescue her. From what I read though, she's clinging to you and really wants to make this work despite the difference in age, the geographical challenges, challenges with her kids etc.
Perhaps I'm painting this with the brush of my own potentially budding relationship - there are always similarities if you look for them. My lady-friend is going through probably the second worst part of her divorce process right now.
Is this the "right" relationship for you long term? I have no clue. I don't know you. I don't know her. What I do read though is that she needs quite a bit of patience and a lack of pressure go get through this. If you are willing.
None of this stuff is easy. Especially the second (or subsequent) go-around.
On BD H52, W50 T27, M26 S21, D23 BD-9-Mar-16 D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18 I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good. But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
I know we cannot turn back time, but unless this R was on solid ground and an actual R and a future was seen, you probably shouldn't have invited her on the cruise. I know you really wanted to bring a date this year. Trust me, I am the single one most of the time amongst couples, even on vacations. But putting in for a ticket for one probably would have been best for you and best for the organizers.
I agree with Andrew, keeping a woman around because you don't want to rock the boat (pun intended) for the cruise people, isn't really fair to her. You can't keep an R together for this reason. Find a buddy or another friend and I am sure being back-up on an all-expensive paid cruise isn't that bad of an insult. So please, do not drag this on for the sake of the cruise. Do what is right and fair for the both of you.
Are your edges starting to soften