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#2800549 07/10/18 11:17 AM
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Hey everyone, Ive been reading through posts for a week or so and Im not sure what I should be doing.

So exF and I were together 7 years. He is 39 and I am 34. We each had a child from a previous R and have one together who is now 5. Our relationship has been a roller coaster ride from the start. We would have periods of working very well together and then periods of not.
The last few months have been hell. Ive felt that nothing I do is right and he has been waiting for an excuse to leave. He has threatened to leave multiple times over the years, usually when he is mad or if I do not agree with him. He puts minimal effort into our relationship.
Actually the morning before he decided to move out we were having a R talk. I told him we need a concrete plan bc things will change for a day or two and then go back to normal. He have serious communication issues.

Ive always felt he values his time with his friends more than time with me. Our last date night was in January. Ive been telling him for months and months that I would like to take a trip for just the 2 of us.
I have tried to converse with him many times to plan it, he is always too busy to even think of it. We had finally decided on a date and once his buddies called with other plans, he wanted to change the plan. When I didnt not want to change the plan is when he said he was moving out. The next day he had moving trucks and was out within 3 days.

During the move out process I didnt say much. Actually, helped him pack as I was so sick of our situation. He cried the day before his final move out day and said he doesnt know if he was making the right decision. He told me another night before move out that he has a plan and hope it works out, that maybe this will be good for us, but then turned cold the day he left and in a hurry to leave to get to his buddies house.

Not sure if this matters but he has been very verbally and emotionally abusive, binge drinks with friends and during the binge goes MIA (every 3-6 months). He had a drinking incident in Feb and decided he wasnt going to drink anymore. In April he decided to start drinking again and it has been hell since. He says I am controlling and mean. In the past while working out of town he frequents bars and often cant converse on the phone until the next day.

There is so much more to this. Im a horrible story teller I know.
Anyways, so about a week after he left I started to think about the things I did to contribute to the relationship breakdown. He is rare to answer texts and if he does its a day or so later. We have to communicate due to the kids situation.
I did pursue for a few days after that all happened but have since stopped.
He is still wanting to have sex when he picks up and drops off child. I think I should probably say no next time?

Any advice? Im pretty sure he has had one foot out the door for a while. Ive felt many times that he has been wanting to argue so he has an excuse to leave.

Last edited by Cadet; 07/10/18 11:41 AM. Reason: restored post

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Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

Yes first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.


Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


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Quote:
Not sure if this matters but he has been very verbally and emotionally abusive, binge drinks with friends and during the binge goes MIA (every 3-6 months). He had a drinking incident in Feb and decided he wasnt going to drink anymore. In April he decided to start drinking again and it has been hell since.


Honey he's an abusive alcoholic - what more do you need to know?

Mind you, people can change - maybe if he went to AA and had a year sober and was willing to go to relationship counseling - MAYBE then it could be worth taking him back. But nothing you've told us about him so far indicates that he's anywhere close to doing that.

You need to go to Alanon, make a financial plan for your life (if he's an alcoholic you may not be able to count on his financial assistance all the time so get yourself into a financial position where you can be stable even if the money from him is irregular). And get some individual counseling to figure out why you tolerated this so far - was there alcoholism or abuse in your family?

And if he tries to come back, MAKE HIM DO THE WORK FIRST.

You're young - focus on providing a stable happy home for your children and getting healthy yourself. You didn't break him and you can't fix him, he needs to do that himself.

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Sorry you are here Melisa, he seems completely unstable and yes he definitely has issues and like you say seems to be wanting to create excuses to leave.
Originally Posted By: MMelisa

He is still wanting to have sex when he picks up and drops off child. I think I should probably say no next time?

Gosh that is an absolute NO to me, child drop off and pick up does not come with added privileges nor can he take it for granted.
To start off you may need to set some boundaries, I am basically in boundaries kindergarten myself, read up that thread it is quite helpful.

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If you do choose to have sex with him please use a condom.

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He said that he still expects sex? He literally said that? OMG.

Unless you want to feel used and worthless don't do it. This is unabashed cake eating.


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KML- I started Al-anon about a year ago. My problem is that I also see the good in him. He doesnt drink everyday but the binges he does quarterly are not fun. I had a hard time figuring out whether he was actually an alcoholic or not, because he doesnt drink every day or even every month. Sometimes I felt that maybe I was being the crazy one and imagining my life is like this because of the alcohol. I did have lots of alcoholism in my family, grandparents and uncles.

Financially I am independent. I bought my house 10 years ago. I make enough to support myself and kids.

I am looking to go to counseling, I just need to figure out how to find a good one We did go to one couples counseling session last year but then he was too busy with work to go back. I should have went by myself, but didnt.

Arsh18- It felt good to be close to him, but you confirmed my thoughts, bad idea. Thats one of the areas we actually spoke with the counselor that we actually work well in.

Ovrrnbw- No, he didnt say he expects sex. He just asked if I had wanted to. I did at the time. Ive decided Im going to just meet him somewhere or have somewhere to be next time we meet for him to get our S.

About a year ago, I told him I couldnt handle his drinking and MIA anymore. He needed to stop the ridiculousness or we would end the relationship. So he did well for about 8 months and then had an incident in Feb. He went to watch a game with friends and ended up driving when he shouldnt have. Didnt get a DUI or anything but should have. He decided then he was done drinking. Did good until April and decided he could handle drinking bc he is a man. Since April, I think he realized he needs to leave to have a free life without my complaints etc.

Essentially his buddies and alcohol is the OW. He doesnt drink like that at home. Only with his buddies, if that makes sense.

Thank you everyone for the responses. My head is feeling clearer. I have a hard time deciphering normal vs not normal.

Last edited by Cadet; 07/10/18 10:03 PM. Reason: restored post

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Most of his buddies are drinkers with families so I dont think he sees where his/our life was different. But it was.

During my thinking time, I realized even without his problems I definitely have mine too. I know I didnt create his problems for sure. I guess now I just wonder if I had changed things about myself then if it would have changed things in him, if that makes sense. Hes been telling me for years I need to go to counseling as I dont see anything wrong with myself (I didnt for the most part). I just though he needed to change and be more loving and attentive and say nice things to me, stop the immature drinking patterns and then I would be different too.

He is a good Dad. Loves having a family. And when we did things as a family or with each other, we had fun. Actually when we started dating years ago, thats the one thing he said he wanted, was a family. Things like this make me sad and think maybe I should have put in more effort. Thats why I am here.

So maybe I need to squash this whole should I try to fix this relationship thing. Idk.

Last edited by Cadet; 07/10/18 10:05 PM. Reason: restored post

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So far you have not had one post that has not disappeared.

Maybe it would be a good idea to read the thread posted at the top of the forum


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Quote:
I started Al-anon about a year ago. My problem is that I also see the good in him. He doesnt drink everyday but the binges he does quarterly are not fun. I had a hard time figuring out whether he was actually an alcoholic or not, because he doesnt drink every day or even every month.


Ummm.....you have been in Alanon for a year and you still are not sure he has a drinking problem just because he's a binge drinker and not a daily drinker? You need to pay more attention in meetings! He's an alcoholic!

Quote:
I guess now I just wonder if I had changed things about myself then if it would have changed things in him,


Ummm....again, hasn't this come up in your meetings? That you didn't break him and you can't fix him? What exactly is it he thinks you need to change about yourself? (Not that we don't all have things we could work on in ourselves - none of us are perfect - but what about you was so terrible that it made him drink and be verbally abusive? Come on! It's on him.)

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KML- You're right on all accounts. I guess this is the insanity of being codependent.


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KML- Everyone in my meetings have daily drinkers. So to me, I think mine isn't as bad and maybe I am making it bigger than it is. Having others, like you, confirm my feelings does help. I then think I wasn't crazy. My grandparents drank everyday, all day, so to see that and have someone who drinks every few months, I guess it didn't seem as bad.


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It may sound insane but using this as a sounding board, even for only a couple days, has helped tremendously. I have been able to let go of my panicked feeling.
Over the years he has threatened to leave before and I either didn't take him seriously or convinced him to stay. This time I didn't do that. But then felt panicked afterwards when it really happened and the house was half cleared. Maybe this is his best chance to see his problems in the relationship because this far, he has seen mine but rarely his. Maybe he will realize the binge drinking and his anger is not part of a healthy relationship.
I have taken steps back. Last night he called for no reason, just to see how we were doing. I waited a few hours to call him back, which is new for me. I gave short answers and was the first to get off the phone.
I have realized that for us to be back together that he is going to have to do some serious work on himself too. My initial thoughts were get back together and work that out in the process but obviously it's been 7 years and things haven't worked well. The best chance of him looking at himself in the mirror is me getting a life and letting him live his and see if he discovers he has changes to make.


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I'm having a hard time finding posts relating to men leaving vs women. Curious why this is.


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I guess now I just wonder if I had changed things about myself then if it would have changed things in him,
MMelisa- Although this statement may very well be true. Your focus on change needs to be squarely on you. Your S has given you the gift of TIME. Use this time wisely- focus on what you can control. Simply put- do some deep self reflection, find out who you are and embrace that wonderful person. Thru out this process like an clay makers skilled hands. Mould this individual into the best version of YOU. Stay positive!


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Originally Posted by LoneWlf
I guess now I just wonder if I had changed things about myself then if it would have changed things in him,
MMelisa- Although this statement may very well be true. Your focus on change needs to be squarely on you. Your S has given you the gift of TIME. Use this time wisely- focus on what you can control. Simply put- do some deep self reflection, find out who you are and embrace that wonderful person. Thru out this process like an clay makers skilled hands. Mould this individual into the best version of YOU. Stay positive!

Wonderful advice. This is exactly what I am going to do. I joined a fitness club and started yesterday. They meet a few times a week so this will keep me busy in addition to the kids' activities.


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Mmelisa thanks for chiming in on my thread.
Just read through hope that I can be helpful in return.
I myself am a decade sober at this point and an active Al Anon member also.
Just because he isnt a daily drinker does not mean that he isnt powerless over alcohol.
And even if he gets sober he isnt emotionally sober which is even more important.
You need to pull away yourself (and for yourself) and hope that he hits some sort of bottom to want to change.
read Codependent no more if you havent already
Be strong!


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Originally Posted by Ste7e
Mmelisa thanks for chiming in on my thread.
Just read through hope that I can be helpful in return.
I myself am a decade sober at this point and an active Al Anon member also.
Just because he isnt a daily drinker does not mean that he isnt powerless over alcohol.
And even if he gets sober he isnt emotionally sober which is even more important.
You need to pull away yourself (and for yourself) and hope that he hits some sort of bottom to want to change.
read Codependent no more if you havent already
Be strong!

Thank you Ste7e! It seems the consensus is that our relationship won't work unless he gets sober. He always says the only person with the problem, is me. He doesn't have a problem with his drinking. :-)
If you don't mind me asking, what was your rock bottom?

I'm working on myself and know I have things that I need to fix. I am going to try to figure out why I stayed for so long without someone who obviously wasn't good for me.

He said he was going to get our S yesterday and I haven't heard from him. Oh well, his loss. I continued with our plans for the day as I wasn't sure he would actually get him anyways. I've kept myself busy today doing projects around the house that I've been wanting to do. I realized now that for the past several years I've been so focused on our relationship and fixing it that I forgot about the things I enjoy. I love working and doing small things. The kids are also getting used to him not being around.


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The ex called today and didn't really want much. Said he misses the kids and I. Bought the vehicle we had talked about getting before the BD. Went some chit chat. He is just going back to work and his boss was upset about our break up. I probably let the conversation go on too long. He told me everything about what's going on in his life. I just don't know what I should say. What should I say when he says he misses us? What should I say when he tells me he tried to tell me all the things I should've changed while we were together? I didn't know what to say but I did tell him that it didn't matter what I would've done from April on, he was looking for a reason to leave. I guess I shouldn't have said that either. He did ask if he could come over to ML. Which I said no, the kids will be home soon from Grandparents. I wouldn't have anyways but again, didn't know what to say. I still don't know how to respond to anything he says?! He also asked if I had a boyfriend yet?!? I didn't give him any details about my life, didn't mention my new fitness classes or plans I had coming up.

So after this conversation he calls again to which I didn't answer. I did sent him a text and say if you're wanting to drop off paperwork that's fine. He text and asked if the kids were home and then said he probably wouldn't make it today. Just so confused.

I did mow the grass and took the kids out to dinner. They had fun.


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I'm wondering if he is checking to see if I am waiting for him maybe. Normal me calls and texts and I haven't been.


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I wonder if you have read the thread on boundaries.
As I was reading through your initial post, it struck me that your behavior felt very controlling. Like a mom telling a kid what to do or when to be home. Im not saying this whole thing is your “fault” exactly. I’m saying that as you move forward, its important to make sure you are phrasing things about you. Instead of “do this or I will do that”, phrase things in a way that focuses on your needs. Thats also what worries me about the sex. It is not because “the kids will be home soon” it is because you respect yourself enough to have sex with people that want to be with you. Or whatever that reason is. Not about HIM but about what YOU want/need out of a partner.

There is plenty of “blame” to go around. Unfortunately, you can only control what is on your side of the street. Sounds like you are making a good start!

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I will read the boundary thread. You are right that I do have controlling behaviors that I do need to address going forward. It's so difficult to think of things in the mindset of what I want out of a relationship.


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So I've continued to work on GAL. Been busy with the kids this weekend doing fun family activities. I still have my moments of happiness, sadness and anger. I wrote ex an angry text that I sent to myself, this helped me to get my anger out. He wanted to come over yesterday but I told him we weren't home but he could come see the kids Sunday evening. He asked where we were. When I didn't respond soon enough I am guessing he sent me a text to have fun. I replied later that I was biking with the kids.

So today he called and asked if he could come over this evening and hang out with the kids. He also mentioned we could go out to dinner. He later retracted that and said to not tell the kids so that he can make sure he will be here with enough time to go to dinner. He mentioned ML, which I told him I won't. He asked why and explained all the reasons we should continue. I explained to him that it doesn't make me feel good inside afterwards and that I won't be doing that anymore. He said he does want is to work things out and he knows we both live each other. He went on to tell me the things I need to work on. I validated. He asked me what I thought his flaws were. I asked him if he had become aware of any. He said no, he hasn't really thought about it. This tells me that he is still only seeing my side of the issues and not his at all. He said he bought a book gger vehicle so that we can take more family trips?!?!

Last night I started making lists of ways to detach and boundaries and started working through codependent work books. It really helps me to do this in the evenings. I have my first counseling appt this Thursday. I'm excited about that. I also don't know what I say to a counselor. Hopefully she will know?!

I am still lost on what I am supposed to say when he brings it R stuff. He did ask me several times if I had moved on or have a BF.

Any advice is appreciated.


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He asked where we were. When I didn't respond soon enough I am guessing he sent me a text to have fun. I replied later that I was biking with the kids.

It is ok to make him wait before replying to his text. You are not always available for his beckoning call.

I am still lost on what I am supposed to say when he brings it R stuff. He did ask me several times if I had moved on or have a BF.

If he brings up convo on R - Listen, look him in the eyes and validate. Come with the attitude of wanting to understand- not defending your position. If he asks about a BF or moving on. Simply state " I'm taking this time to better myself " and leave it at that. Hope this helps! Stay Well!


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Originally Posted by MMelisa
So today he called and asked if he could come over this evening and hang out with the kids. He also mentioned we could go out to dinner. He later retracted that and said to not tell the kids so that he can make sure he will be here with enough time to go to dinner.

Why is it cool for him to just come and go as he pleases?
In my opinion, there should be a clear schedule for when he is over. That will help for you and for the kids to have that clear expectation. Then, next time when he is over, how about you plan to go out somewhere so you arent spending time with him during the "kid-time"?

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Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Originally Posted by Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.


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Originally Posted by LoneWlf
[b]

If he brings up convo on R - Listen, look him in the eyes and validate. Come with the attitude of wanting to understand- not defending your position. If he asks about a BF or moving on. Simply state " I'm taking this time to better myself " and leave it at that. Hope this helps! Stay Well!


I read up on validation last night. I have a REALLY hard time with this. It's something I am going to work with my IC on.
I loved your advice on how to respond. I'm so shocked that he would even ask that and I'm sure he could tell. I need to also keep my emotions in check!


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Originally Posted by Amoafwl
Originally Posted by MMelisa
So today he called and asked if he could come over this evening and hang out with the kids. He also mentioned we could go out to dinner. He later retracted that and said to not tell the kids so that he can make sure he will be here with enough time to go to dinner.

Why is it cool for him to just come and go as he pleases?
In my opinion, there should be a clear schedule for when he is over. That will help for you and for the kids to have that clear expectation. Then, next time when he is over, how about you plan to go out somewhere so you arent spending time with him during the "kid-time"?


He actually sent me a text Friday night wanting to stop over and get paperwork he needed from the house. I told him we were not going to be home but he could stop Sunday evening.

I agree with the concrete schedule. As of now the only plan is he will have our S every other weekend. That's a great idea on making other plans if he comes.


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So Sunday the ex came over to see the kids. Pretty quickly he wanted to pull me aside to ML. I told him that wasn't happening and that I had already told him my reasons. He said he doesn't want me to be with anyone else. He also said that he really wants to work things out down the road and that if I had a sexual relationship with anyone else that would be a deal breaker... He just can't be in a relationship right now. So essentially, he doesn't want to be with me, doesn't want me to be with anyone else and just basically wait for him to decide if he wants to get back together. Is this insane?!

We had more R talk that didn't go well. I don't feel right validating when I know I'm not 100% to blame. I need to just start saying I don't want to talk about it. Erg. Another area I am working on.

So Monday he started a new job. He called me on his way home from work, I answered. I have been not answering and calling back later. This time I answered. He didn't really want anything. Later that night he sent me 2 songs to listen to.

1st one: A voice on the telephone sounds awful angry
And somehow it doesn't fit in
But the face in the picture, I keep on my dresser
Of the girl I once called my best friend
We drank from the fountain
Of good times and dreaming
But these long times have poisoned the well
And as our love is dying
There making a killing
On heartaches, and furniture sales
And the line between evil and good disappear
And now its so hard to tell, am I shaking a demon
Thats after my soul, thats sending an angel to hell

Next one: I tried so hard my dear to show that you're my every dream.
Yet you're afraid each thing I do is just some evil scheme
A memory from your lonesome past keeps us so far apart
Why can't I free your doubtful mind and melt your cold cold heart
Another love before my time made your heart sad and blue
And so my heart is paying now for things I didn't do
In anger unkind words are said that make the teardrops start
Why can't I free your doubtful mind, and melt your cold cold heart

Is he trying to reel me back in after the previous day's push??

So today he called me and when I didn't answer he sent me a text that he wanted me to call him as soon as I can. I called and he wanted to know if SS8 could be dropped off at my house and he pick you up both kids when he gets off of work. I told him that I had planned to have him pick up our S from my mother's and I have plans and he won't be picking up until 10pm. Was this the right thing to do?! I haven't heard from him since. He was frustrated with my plan and said it would be awkward for him to pick you up S from my mother's. And suggested maybe I could drop him off at his mother's.


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Originally Posted by Cadet
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Originally Posted by Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.



The book is on the way!


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I think I need to really learn to not react and not feel those codependent feelings I get of worrying how he feels. I was very sad after I told him that SS probably couldn't be dropped off with me for his weekend with him. I did give him a solution of SS can be dropped off at my parents too. I felt bad not being able to fix that. I know I shouldn't. This was one of the things that frustrated me about our R. I had SS whether he was home or not on our weekends with him. He would often be working so I had him and our other kids. I never felt appreciated or respected. Even now since the split he has attended family parties with the kids and I and stayed over. The kids are all close. His Mom and I have a good R. But that was always my duty. He would make plans with his buddies not even thinking about the child he gets only a few days a month. I do think maybe this S will help I'm spend more time with the kids. And I think maybe him having to feel the full effects of the separation, as in arranging his own childcare vs just always having me there may help.

I understand the DB process somewhat and am still waiting on the book to arrive, but I guess I don't understand how me fixing myself would ever possibly make him see what damage he did to the R. If I fix me does that make everything better?


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I went to my fitness class today. Still working on GAL. I did some.more me work last night. It feels silly that I have to work at it and study it, but I really do. Make some notes to myself to refer back to later. While at my fitness class, I saw one of exF's (estranged) buddies wives. She specifically asked how exF was doing. I told her we were no longer together. The next words out of her mouth shocked me and make me feel so validated at the same time. She said he should be grateful for one day that someone stays with him. It gave me a little wakeup that everything I imagined in my head was not true. I remembered the good times and they seemed to outweigh the bad in my head. I had been thinking maybe if I was nicer and less a, b, c he wouldn't have been the way he was. I felt validated that I'm not crazy and he needs to do a lot of soul searching too. I 100% know that I was not perfect. I controlled too much out of fear of past even reoccurring. I stopped him from his rock bottom in a sense. She went on to talk a little more about him and then we went on to talking about our kids and things. This is the first "outsider" that I have spoken with about things.

I think I have realized that maybe I couldn't "fix" our problems completely on my own. He always wanted me to go to counseling as he always said I am the one who needed fixed. I definitely do need some fixing as well. I have my first counseling session tomorrow. I'm excited and nervous about that.


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Still waiting on my book to arrive. I'm eagerly awaiting it's arrival.

My IC session went good. It's so nice to talk to someone that has to listen to you. I did a complete makeover in my bedroom and plan to maybe paint the downstairs in my house this weekend. I need to find more GAL activities. So far they are hanging with my kids, my fitness class and the occasional dinner with my sister or friends. In the past when I have been so go I would go to a bar on the weekends I don't have my kids. I really don't want to do that as it's not really who I am. I like to occasionally go and have a drink or two every few months or so but I don't want to get that started.


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My exF called me Wednesday night and brought up R stuff. He essentially thinks he did everything right and I did everything wrong. He said I never excepted him for who he was. I did say to him that I excepted everything about him except for his binge drinking when he would go MIA. And I don't believe that is what defined him. He said he agrees with that, that doesn't define him so I did accept him.

One thing that he said that really bothered me is hat he never had time for himself because he was always doing things to he kids and I. This could not be further from the truth. I guess this is the false reality that everyone talks about. He rewrote the past.

One minute he says down the road he hopes I will come to "his was of thinking", then he says once he gets established he hopes we can work things out. It honestly feels like by so many things that he says that he just essentially wants me to wait around for him. I do think he just wants to do what he wants and when he wants without a family or woman to worry about. I would think that would get old.


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If I am understanding correct, I am supposed to be nice and happy when he calls all while conuing to GAL etc. Is this the right approach or be tough love. His thinking is so distorted.

I do know that I would never want to go back to how things were the 2 months prior to the split.

I downloaded a few audiobooks last night. One about getting over relationships, especially ones you're addicted to. Girl, Wah your face, the 5 second rule and then one that's just a pleasure read.


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Also, would my exF be considered a walk-away or wayward or MLC. I'm having such a hard time finding situations like mine relative to a H.

It seems like there are more H on here than W.

I read up on pearlharbr and a few others that I would find. Is my situation different because there isn't OP, just friends (and alcohol) I'm guessing.


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I initially planned to have s at my mother's for exF to get after work. He was going to be working late. I really just didn't want to see him as I seem to feel better when I don't see him. He ended up getting off work early and called to check if he could pick him up at my house. He said he was glad it worked out as he didn't want to see my mother due to guilt and shame (because he left her daughter, his words).

I have been doing some house updates. He commented on some of them and commented that I've been keeping myself busy. He asked who patched the drywall in the living room. He also commented on some things o had moved and rearranged.


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I still feel like I am on a rollercoaster. I have the DR book now but am confused on how I implement these techniques, maybe I just need to get further in the book.


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So I'm half way through the book and am still confused. Should I be doing the LRT and going dark?!


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Last weekend I kind of got baited into a talk that I shouldn't have had. When he dropped off our S, I was cordial, declined ML and basically said goodbye. He called me a few minutes after he left. He said that he wanted to keep a door open to us working things out in the future and he thought I was closing that door. We did some back and forth talking, which never ends well. I think he was temp checking.

When S was born I gave him my last name. He said this has been a huge deal for him and wants his last name changed. There is nothing that has really changed from the time we had him to now that makes me want to change his last name. I'm not sure it would have changed our relationship. He isn't a very active father. Sees his children the minimum time of every-other weekend. His father was a crappy dad and I think he just doesn't know how to be a good dad. A couple weeks after BD he told S he was going to get him Tuesday of that week. He didn't call or show up. I asked him about it later and he said I should I called him, he would have gotten him. In my mind, I didn't make the plans with S, he did, so why would I call to remind him of what he said. I was doubtful he would follow through when he said it.


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I've been continuing my GAL and trying to stop thinking about our R. I had my IC session today, which was good. S and I spent most of the day just playing together. I haven't heard from XF since Sunday. I actually think I prefer this as it makes it easier to not over think everyhing he says.

I get frustrated that we did have a good life together, he was negative so much of the time it was hard to even be around.

I'm really thinking of the last name thing and trying to decide what's best for S. I don't want him to take after his Dad's family. Maybe a last name doesn't even matter. S is so sweet and kind. ExF has worked 7 days a week for years with a month off or weekends off here and there. So I've essentially raised our kids.


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Hi MMM. Glad to see you back here. I'm new to this myself, as you know, but it sounds like you are doing the right thing. It sounds like there are a lot of changes your XF needs to make in his life, in terms of his behaviors, attitude, and parenting. He needs to figure that out on his own, in my opinion, while you focus on yourself and your children.

I have nothing to say on the last name thing other than I wouldn't make a decision about it right now. Status quo until you are less emotional about your sitch, would be my recommendation.


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Originally Posted by WillD78
Hi MMM. Glad to see you back here. I'm new to this myself, as you know, but it sounds like you are doing the right thing. It sounds like there are a lot of changes your XF needs to make in his life, in terms of his behaviors, attitude, and parenting. He needs to figure that out on his own, in my opinion, while you focus on yourself and your children.

I have nothing to say on the last name thing other than I wouldn't make a decision about it right now. Status quo until you are less emotional about your sitch, would be my recommendation.


Thank you for your feedback. I was starting to wonder if others could see my thread. :+)

His last name was a hard decision for me. But at the time it seemed like the right one, still does I think.

I haven't heard anything from him in 4 days now. This is the longest we have gone without contact. It seems to help me as I'm not trying to decipher what he is saying.


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I've been doing a lot of house projects. I completely re-orhanized the MBR. It looks great and so cozy. Last weekend I painted the entire first level and got rid of a lot of clutter.

When he came to get S he noticed where holes in the wall we're patched and wanted to know who patched those (I'm guessing he was assuming a guy). It was me, I'm pretty handy.

When he picked up S he asked what I did over the weekend, if I had a lot of guys hitting on me, what I did Friday because he said I was acting secretively about it. He did say that I don't have to tell him. Idk why he even asks then.

When he wanted to ML and I said no, he said he had thought that maybe we shouldn't bc I probably hooked up with someone over the weekend.

All of his behaviors are of, I don't want to be with you but I don't want you to be with anyone else.

In all of this my only hope is that he realizes he wants his family back and realizes the things he did to destroy that. I still am not sure if he is a WH or WAW it MLC. I don't think there is anyone else.

I have done some bad DB things in the past and am working on not doing those. I guess at the end of the day if he was so unhappy with our lives then I should be happy he is away. Truth be told, we we're both unhappy. I wanted him to change and he wanted me to change.

I'm going to continue my GAL. I'm working on detaching and haven't quite figured out what my 180's are. I've always been positive and upbeat. I would actually get yelled at for walking around the house winging bc it was annoying to him (and my children, ha ha). So my 180's would probably be to not care what he is doing maybe... Keeping the house uncluttered and clean... And not wanting to have talks...


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So ex and I decided to try to reconcile in November. Things have been relatively good with some hiccups. We aren't living together right now and actually haven't discussed that yet. He wants that to naturally happen and fall into place. My dilemma is, while we were separated I filed for child support. My plan was to keep that in effect for 6 months and if things were going well, cancel. He essentially is giving me an ultimatum that it needs cancelled now and he will give me money, just not through child support. He believes the child support calculated figure is too high and he can't afford it. I'm just not sure if this is a manipulation or not. I'm struggling with what to do. I feel like if he loved me as much as he says he does, this would be a non-issue. He thinks the same, only reversed. This week has been terrible, we have barely spoke as he needed space to think about child support. I think he is being ridiculous.

I've been maintaining my IC. When he came to me wanting to work things out, one of his selling points was that we should go to couple's counseling. I agreed and asked if he would set it up, he hasn't. This all is a lot harder than I anticipated.

I would love the opinion of others.


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Originally Posted by MMM12
.... I'm just not sure if this is a manipulation ....I would love the opinion of others.


I would bet manipulation. I have not been following your thread at all. Just from my gernal understanding of human behavior.


If he truly want to reconcile, you will know if you keep the child support in place.


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My thoughts are...

In order for reconciliation to work, the wayward has to really want it. If he wants it bad enough he will pay child support.

My ex did the same exact thing to me. I used to post as julieh and I wrote all about it. He was trying to get me to not file by stringing along reconciliation. Filing for child support was the absolute only thing i did right. It helped me financially and established me as primary custodial parent.

You can always keep money on side and reinvest if things are right between you.

Talk to a lawyer. DO NOT JUST GIVE UP CS. Once you give it up, he can quit his job and work under the books and then would have to give u nothing right?

How often does he see your child?


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Originally Posted by JujuB
My thoughts are...

In order for reconciliation to work, the wayward has to really want it. If he wants it bad enough he will pay child support.

My ex did the same exact thing to me. I used to post as julieh and I wrote all about it. He was trying to get me to not file by stringing along reconciliation. Filing for child support was the absolute only thing i did right. It helped me financially and established me as primary custodial parent.

You can always keep money on side and reinvest if things are right between you.

Talk to a lawyer. DO NOT JUST GIVE UP CS. Once you give it up, he can quit his job and work under the books and then would have to give u nothing right?

How often does he see your child?

I will try to locate your thread. We recently switched the kids weekends so that they could all be together on the same weekends (we have his, mine and ours) and essentially we would only have to get a sitter for ours to be able to spend alone time together and do family things too. He was getting him every other weekend. For the past 2 months we have spent nearly every weekend together. The child support was an issue within the first month and I wouldn't budge. He lifted his ultimatum only to now bring it back. He said this is the happiest he has ever been, etc. He just can't get over he child support thing. Yet, he says he is willing to essentially give it up.

He wants a compromise but I am not sure what kind of compromise is even possible here. He says he knows this relationship will work so he doesn't understand why I am stuck on my decision.


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Originally Posted by Ready2Change
Originally Posted by MMM12
.... I'm just not sure if this is a manipulation ....I would love the opinion of others.


I would bet manipulation. I have not been following your thread at all. Just from my gernal understanding of human behavior.


If he truly want to reconcile, you will know if you keep the child support in place.


When he initially wanted to work things out, my gut reaction was between sincerity or him just not wanting to pay child support. I still get confused on this at times...


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He probably picked that confusion approach on purpose.

Him "knowing it will work" doesn't prove to you a GD thing. Tell him you'll believe it when you see it.


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Hes threatened to leave multiple times and then he actually did leave. Only a fool would feel secure or stable in a situation like that. I would conference with a lawyer or get some sort of prenup based on his current salary so he cant play games. This is for your kids benefit. Not yours.

Trust takes a long time to earn. He lost your trust and if he respects you enough, he will know that he needs to earn it back after what he did.


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Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
He probably picked that confusion approach on purpose.

Him "knowing it will work" doesn't prove to you a GD thing. Tell him you'll believe it when you see it.


I still hear a lot more words than see actions. He does spend the weekends with us and some through the week and we have been planning monthly family trips. All of the hard times feels like our old relationship all over again.


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I think is the biggest problem. I don't think he respects me or my boundaries. I learned in IC that I basically almost had zero boundaries. I made threats but did not follow through with them. I continue to work on this.


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I had a long conversation with my sister tonight about ex and I. In the months we've been working on things, I haven't really noticed a significant change from before. There are times or moments he seems to really listen or is very sweet but the day to day is just so much like a roller coaster ride. Last night he was in a negative mood and everything I said, he thought the exact opposite. This isn't the sunshine and rainbows I thought it was going to be. When he came to me wanting to fix everything and I FINALLY agreed, I just thought things would be different.

Last week was terrible due to the child support issue. He said many mean things to me and reverted to past behaviors. I didn't see him at all through the week. We did talk on the phone but it was mostly about child support. This weekend was good. We went out of town his friends and it was a really good weekend.

This is where I get hung up. It's such a roller coaster ride. Tonight we were having casual conversation about things, and it turned ugly. I had asked where he was keeping the tractor and he said I don't know. He ended up saying he doesn't want to tell me and then once I was mad finally that it was at his parents. I don't understand why he wouldn't just answer. Realistically I don't care where it is we were just talking about it and I asked where he was storing it. I told him that I don't want to be in a relationship with secrets.

Luckily I have a IC session tomorrow and will discuss this with her. I wonder whether I am making things worse or if this relationship just isn't going to work.


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I wanted to add, after the tractor conversation he ended up not coming over. I got off the phone as I was irritated and needed to make dinner. This reminds me of our past relationship where he would get mad and not come home, and he doesn't even live here. I'm not allowed to be upset at him.


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If you've made threats or set boundaries and didn't enforce them you need to do a 180. People will only treat you as well as you let them. And if you show them that you don't respect yourself then they won't respect you either.

If you don't want to be in a relationship with secrets, but you show him that you will be with him, in a relationship with secrets then what do you really mean?

He's hiding an expensive piece of property and sweet talking you about the child support. Other than that, is he meeting any of your needs? I hate to say it, but I think there's a trick up his sleeve and I think you know what it is.


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I got a text his morning that he fell asleep after work and that's why he didn't come over. I'm not going to respond.

Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
If you've made threats or set boundaries and didn't enforce them you need to do a 180. People will only treat you as well as you let them. And if you show them that you don't respect yourself then they won't respect you either.

If you don't want to be in a relationship with secrets, but you show him that you will be with him, in a relationship with secrets then what do you really mean?

He's hiding an expensive piece of property and sweet talking you about the child support. Other than that, is he meeting any of your needs? I hate to say it, but I think there's a trick up his sleeve and I think you know what it is.


I'm terrible with boundaries. I don't want to be in a relationship with secrets. What do I do now? Tell him I won't be in a relationship with secrets?

He is meeting some of my needs but honestly not many. This is exactly what the conversation with my sister was about. We talk typically once a day on his way home from work. This is something I asked him years ago was to text etc Kore throughout the day. Words of affirmation and quality time are my love languages. The quality time has been better as we are doing more together but the words of affirmation aren't there. We went through love languages together a year ago, so he knows mine. I actually pointed out that my IC said we need MC and to talk about our love languages.

My IC told me last week that maybe I can't fix this/him and that he needs to do this himself.


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Yes, tell him that you won't be in a relationship with secrets. Or, better yet, show him. Because you've told him before, but you are still in a relationship with secrets.

Last Saturday I was very scared that what I was about to say was going to cause my W to leave me. Eventually, I was able to look her, and my fear, in the eye and say that "If you think it's OK for married people to go and get a BF/GF, then I can't be with you." And then you have to leave it at that.

I know you believe what you are saying here, about the secrets and what it takes to have a decent relationship. But when you go home to him, you break from your own beliefs. Why?

Have you thought about what I said in regards to the trick up his sleeve?


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Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
Yes, tell him that you won't be in a relationship with secrets. Or, better yet, show him. Because you've told him before, but you are still in a relationship with secrets.


I suck at boundaries. In this situation, I would show him by being done?

Originally Posted by ovrrnbw

Last Saturday I was very scared that what I was about to say was going to cause my W to leave me. Eventually, I was able to look her, and my fear, in the eye and say that "If you think it's OK for married people to go and get a BF/GF, then I can't be with you." And then you have to leave it at that.


Saying, "If you think it's ok to keep secrets from your significant other, then I can't be with you.", and then what? He decides whether he can have a secret-free relationship?

Originally Posted by ovrrnbw


I know you believe what you are saying here, about the secrets and what it takes to have a decent relationship. But when you go home to him, you break from your own beliefs. Why?

Have you thought about what I said in regards to the trick up his sleeve?


He always seems to twist things to the point that I think I overreact to things. This is actually why I didn't call him back last night. I didn't want anything turned around or for him to say "It wasn't really a big deal." I don't know why I break from my beliefs. I would like to consider myself a strong person, maybe I'm not.

I do seriously wonder if he has a trick up his sleeve. I do think he wants me and this relationship, but he wants it on his terms. He wants to be the king and for me to essentially follow this path of perfection that he creates in his head. He wants me to be a lost puppy and following his every command. Maybe he wants to see how far he can push, and I let him. Maybe I am wrong, but that's how I feel. I think the child support situation and others is all about control. He wants to control when and how much money he provides.


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I haven't heard from ex since yesterday morning. He always calls in the evening and we typically make plans for the night and talk about our day. I'm assuming he is mad at me for calling him out on his secret keeping. I'm not going to play his game or chase him and have my lines ready for when I do talk to him. I told my IC yesterday that if I were in the same situation I am in now, in 6 months or 3 years, I would be so angry at myself. I just want to be happy. She also mentioned men exist that don't call women names. Who knew!

This weekend, we went out of town with friends and it was fun. For some reason I kept getting hit on by random guys. Ex made sure to come over and stake his claim. When we got back to the hotel he mentioned that he should have knocked one of the guys out. Ha ha. That was one thing during our sitch that stayed consistent, he constantly asked me if I was seeing or dating anyone and that he hoped I wasn't.

It feels like everything good that has happened since we decided to reconcile was almost wasted by this. My IC seems to think the entire tractor situation was a manipulation and I took the bait.


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If you remain in the relationship with secrets, you have shown him it's OK. So the other option is to walk away. And then that's it, you don't talk to him for a while. Let him stew in the loss of you. Let him feel horrible. You're scared to do this, I'm sure.

I'm sure he also has a trick up his sleeve. Take away his power to use those tricks. You are capable.

If he is mad, that's probably good. He is stomping his feet about not getting his way. Boo hoo.

He's yelling at other people to leave you alone, but he won't treat you right? Boo hoo. When you say he's your EX, what is the relationship status?


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Originally Posted by MMM12
I'm assuming he is mad at me for calling him out on his secret keeping.


About the tractor? He's giving you the silent treatment for asking where the tractor is stored? Wow you've got quite a passive/aggressive guy on your hands. I just went back and read through your whole thread and frankly I'm not understanding why you agreed to try to recon with him when he did nothing but treat you poorly and with disrespect and continues to do so. I think the only reason he mentioned recon at all was because you were pursuing child support. He's using it to control and manipulate you. Here's my advice to you and I suspect you already know it's what you need to do- tell him the recon is officially canceled. No more dates, no more chummy phone convos, no more texting. If you canceled the legal proceedings for the child support then get that ball rolling again. Get a set schedule in place for custody and follow it. That is the ONLY time you should see or talk to him. I'm not saying completely give up on him, but he's got a long, long way to go before he starts owning the damage he's done to you and is truly ready to pursue recon with a HUMBLE HEART. Anything less than that should be unacceptable to you.

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I'm not going to play his game or chase him and have my lines ready for when I do talk to him. I told my IC yesterday that if I were in the same situation I am in now, in 6 months or 3 years, I would be so angry at myself. I just want to be happy.


Exactly, and I think you'd be much happier alone right now. Again I'm not saying give up and quit standing, but you've got to let him hit rock bottom before things might improve. By the way, is he still binge drinking?

Quote
She also mentioned men exist that don't call women names. Who knew!


I see this so often here where women who have been subjected to emotional abuse for a long time don't even realize it anymore. They lose sight of what a "normal" relationship looks like.

Quote
This weekend, we went out of town with friends and it was fun. For some reason I kept getting hit on by random guys. Ex made sure to come over and stake his claim. When we got back to the hotel he mentioned that he should have knocked one of the guys out. Ha ha. That was one thing during our sitch that stayed consistent, he constantly asked me if I was seeing or dating anyone and that he hoped I wasn't.


Often when a man is saying things like this it's because he is actively engaging in an affair himself. People in affairs are outrageously paranoid of their own spouse/ girlfriend, it's really ironic.



Last edited by AnotherStander; 02/08/19 03:22 PM.

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Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
If you remain in the relationship with secrets, you have shown him it's OK. So the other option is to walk away. And then that's it, you don't talk to him for a while. Let him stew in the loss of you. Let him feel horrible. You're scared to do this, I'm sure.


It is scary to do. I KNOW I don't want to be in a relationship with secrets, lies etc. That's what our old relationship was like. I haven't called. I did answer when he called yesterday and today but was short and to the point. If we are supposed to be back in a relationship, there shouldn't be so much BS, threats etc..

Originally Posted by ovrrnbw


I'm sure he also has a trick up his sleeve. Take away his power to use those tricks. You are capable.

If he is mad, that's probably good. He is stomping his feet about not getting his way. Boo hoo.

He's yelling at other people to leave you alone, but he won't treat you right? Boo hoo. When you say he's your EX, what is the relationship status?


He definitely prefers to get his way. Do I not answer his calls? I recently told my IC that I don't know how to handle conflict, so I normally just don't handle it.

He seems to be getting frustrated more frequently than in our relationship pre BD. I probably sound pathetic at times but I am much less pathetic now than I was pre BD. I stand my ground much more now. :-)

He doesn't treat me the way I want to be treated. I feel lied to in a way. 3-4 months ago he promised sunshine and rainbows and I still am waiting for those.

Relationship status: Previous, dated 7 years, engaged, never married. Current, dating each other, spend weekends together and normally 2-4 days during the week. We are not living together. Home was already mine when we started dating.


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Tuesday night the whole tractor secret happened. Wednesday I got the "fell asleep" text that I didn't respond to and nothing else that day. Yesterday he calls me said he thought I was never going to talk to him again since I did not answer his call the day before, and asks if I am still mad. I told him that I am not mad, I wont be in a relationship with secrets. He makes the excuse that he was tired and that's why he acted that way and that some secrets in a relationship are ok.

I did not even acknowledge this as it is all so ridiculous. He next said he is going to order some food. I said I am going to take a bath and ended the call. This morning he calls and makes small talk, he asked what OUR weekend plans are (we have been spending weekends together). Tells me he will call me later, but then adds that I can call him if I get a break from work (I won't call). I am just so flabbergasted by all of this.

Things WERE going good! This is why I don't understand. Maybe his plan was to be a good man for a few months and then start the BS.


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Originally Posted by AnotherStander
Originally Posted by MMM12
I'm assuming he is mad at me for calling him out on his secret keeping.


About the tractor? He's giving you the silent treatment for asking where the tractor is stored? Wow you've got quite a passive/aggressive guy on your hands. I just went back and read through your whole thread and frankly I'm not understanding why you agreed to try to recon with him when he did nothing but treat you poorly and with disrespect and continues to do so. I think the only reason he mentioned recon at all was because you were pursuing child support. He's using it to control and manipulate you. Here's my advice to you and I suspect you already know it's what you need to do- tell him the recon is officially canceled. No more dates, no more chummy phone convos, no more texting. If you canceled the legal proceedings for the child support then get that ball rolling again. Get a set schedule in place for custody and follow it. That is the ONLY time you should see or talk to him. I'm not saying completely give up on him, but he's got a long, long way to go before he starts owning the damage he's done to you and is truly ready to pursue recon with a HUMBLE HEART. Anything less than that should be unacceptable to you.

Quote
I'm not going to play his game or chase him and have my lines ready for when I do talk to him. I told my IC yesterday that if I were in the same situation I am in now, in 6 months or 3 years, I would be so angry at myself. I just want to be happy.


Exactly, and I think you'd be much happier alone right now. Again I'm not saying give up and quit standing, but you've got to let him hit rock bottom before things might improve. By the way, is he still binge drinking?

Quote
She also mentioned men exist that don't call women names. Who knew!


I see this so often here where women who have been subjected to emotional abuse for a long time don't even realize it anymore. They lose sight of what a "normal" relationship looks like.

Quote
This weekend, we went out of town with friends and it was fun. For some reason I kept getting hit on by random guys. Ex made sure to come over and stake his claim. When we got back to the hotel he mentioned that he should have knocked one of the guys out. Ha ha. That was one thing during our sitch that stayed consistent, he constantly asked me if I was seeing or dating anyone and that he hoped I wasn't.


Often when a man is saying things like this it's because he is actively engaging in an affair himself. People in affairs are outrageously paranoid of their own spouse/ girlfriend, it's really ironic.




I am not good at using the quote feature, so bear with me. I am sad to say that I think you're right with the first paragraph. I think he wants it, but maybe not enough. I did not cancel child support proceedings. I initiated that 4 months after we split up. He is legally obligated now to provide support and has been since December.

There is more to my story that might be relevant, i.e. the 6 months I went silent from the boards. I am not sure if any of that can outweigh his bad behaviors now. I am sure I am just trying to make excuses or justify why I am confused.


Emotional abuse was evident in our previous relationship and I suspect it is continuing. I am sure his not coming over Tuesday was my "punishment" for the tractor incident. Normally I would have called him back and tried to work out the problem, basically I would have forced an apology. Not anymore.

He has always been paranoid about me and other men. And although he didn't technically have an affair, he skirted the line many timed and I think if the opportunity presented itself, he would have. Maybe not now, but definitely before.


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Ovrrr- I saw your post on another thread, I think I sent you a follow request on Insta… :-P


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Quote


Exactly, and I think you'd be much happier alone right now. Again I'm not saying give up and quit standing, but you've got to let him hit rock bottom before things might improve. By the way, is he still binge drinking?



He isn't binge drinking and we're also doing more stuff together. In our previous relationship he would binge drink and go MIA. He would not invite me to go do things with him and his friends. So this all has been new.

My IC thinks he is essentially "testing the waters" like a child would do to see how much I will put up with. She thinks once he realizes I'm not going to play his game, it will stop.

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Cool. Given your R status, I'd just stop talking to him completely (unless it's child related but even then keep it brief!).

I listened to a couple of podcasts by Neil Sattin. Both were over an hour long where he had Michele Weiner-Davis on. Very cool and I'd highly recommended listening to the advice straight from the horses mouth.

There was another author on there to that is worth checking out. Has to do with ex bf recovery, . com

To me, it was very similar to Divorce Remedy in terms of the "remedy being twofold. It was very helpful and goes hand in hand with DB techniques IMO.


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Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
Cool. Given your R status, I'd just stop talking to him completely (unless it's child related but even then keep it brief!).

I listened to a couple of podcasts by Neil Sattin. Both were over an hour long where he had Michele Weiner-Davis on. Very cool and I'd highly recommended listening to the advice straight from the horses mouth.

There was another author on there to that is worth checking out. Has to do with ex bf recovery, . com

To me, it was very similar to Divorce Remedy in terms of the "remedy being twofold. It was very helpful and goes hand in hand with DB techniques IMO.


It's sooooo hard. We have had MORE fun together, do more things together and with the kids now during recon then we did in the past 5 years of our relationship. Makes me sick to my stomach to even be doing a break-up ALL over again. But I know I don't want the old again. Ugh


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PS. I'll check out the podcasts.


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Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
Cool. Given your R status, I'd just stop talking to him completely (unless it's child related but even then keep it brief!).

I listened to a couple of podcasts by Neil Sattin. Both were over an hour long where he had Michele Weiner-Davis on. Very cool and I'd highly recommended listening to the advice straight from the horses mouth.

There was another author on there to that is worth checking out. Has to do with ex bf recovery, . com

To me, it was very similar to Divorce Remedy in terms of the "remedy being twofold. It was very helpful and goes hand in hand with DB techniques IMO.


I agree, I like the MWD vids. There are some other nice gems out there pending on what you want to get into and the time you have.


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Hey guys, I am still here. I mostly just lurk on the boards. ExF and I have been working on things for nearly a year. I realized that I am not happy with him. I had hoped the changes would stick and his words that I shouldn't have listened to, were true. He is a very selfish man and that I cannot change. I've realized that my life is a couple weeks of good and then bad. He has reverted back to his old behaviors that made me very unhappy before.

I've been really seriously questioning whether we should even be trying to work on this for a few months. I started having dreams of other men being kind to me and romantic. This is something that didn't happen before.

I've done a lot of IC as I seriously thought there was something really wrong with me. I worried I was a narcissist, too controlling, bipolar etc. I blamed myself for everything. "Well, if I wouldn't have gotten upset about x, y, z then he wouldn't have called me names or came home." etc. I think she helped me realize one side cannot fix a relationship.

I did change in the months we were apart. I know I will be ok on my own, I know that there is someone out there that will love me the way I want and need to be loved. I know that I don't have to live trying to force someone to want to

He has an odd way of thinking about life. He is able to do as he pleases but I can't do the same. We have to do what he wants most of the time. My attempts to GAL are met with anger and passive aggressiveness from him. Last night I got a break-up text from him after going to hang with friends. Mind you he did the same hung earlier this week. I don't want to continue to receive break-up texts for the next 10 years of my life. It doesn't make me feel safe. I have finally came to terms that this is an unsalvageable relationship.

I don't know what I need right now. Maybe I'm just venting and needing somewhere to put my thoughts.


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I didn't speak to exF for most of the weekend. Today he called and wanted me to come spend the day with him. I declined and reminded him of the break-up text and got off the phone. He then sent me some texts still wanting me to spend time with him. My only response was that I do not want to spend the next 10 years of my life getting break-up texts when he is angry.

He called me again this evening and asked if we could talk. I agreed and we met up and talked. He said his feelings were hurt when he wanted to spend time together on Friday, that I wouldn't give him a clear answer about my plans and then I went to hang out with friends.

He essentially did the same thing earlier in the week and I did the same to him out of spite. Probably super immature of me. So we talked more about that. I told him I am not happy with how our R is going. It feels like we are going down a path right back to old R and we were both unhappy in it. He agreed and said he thinks if we were nicer to each other our problems would be solved. I agreed that we need to be nicer and think of more solutions.

He said I need to talk to him when I am upset about things and I told him he is very unapproachable and only gets angry when I bring anything up and I listed examples. He apologized and said he will work on it.

We talked more about what each of us want. I mentioned more QT, random talks in the evening and texts throughout the day would make me happier. He would like more ML and affection and for me to spend less time on my phone. The phone one semi-annoyed me as that's his thing when we go to bed but I didn't say anything.

We had plans originally with the family on Saturday. He went alone and took the kids. He said he spent the day thinking about what he said on Friday and wished I was with them. He said there were several times he thought about how much fun I would be having and how much I would have enjoyed the activity.

This is where I get stuck. We had a great conversation, both agreed to work to make things better The second he gets angry about something we are back to square one. He gets angry and I get super distant. I feel like I just keep rolling on with one foot out the door. I realize I need to put the other foot out the door and then get suckered back in. I feel like I am doing everything wrong. I want this to work but am afraid we just aren't compatible. I am all over the place.


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