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The way I see the observer technique is as if you are on the sideline observing a situation. The minute you step in or open your mouth.....you have become personally involved, and you are no longer just observing as a detached individual.

By using the observer technique, you'll avoid reactions based on triggered emotions. It will help you become less & less attached to the other people and their lives. It will help you focus on being the person you are working on becoming, instead of spending time & emotional energy on someone else.

You are not emotionally detached from your WW, Orange. As long as you are consumed with her life, you won't be detached. As long as your thoughts are on how she duped you, you won't be able to detach, b/c it maintains that level of anger that refuses to give you peace. As long as you desire to see consequences for her, you won't be detached. You are emotionally driven by the sitch. The sitch rules your mind, and you have to let it go, if you are to ever have peace and move forward.

You are the only one who can allow yourself to let it go. Otherwise, your mind is kept in a prison where there is no escape from the torture of replaying the same old videos of your past with WW. You become its slave. Everything you start to do in the future, you'll wonder what she thinks about it. Even if you get into another relationship, you'll wonder if it affects her. That's what happens when you don't let go.

Can you visualize yourself letting her go? Letting the sitch go? Can you see yourself living a happy life, without constantly focused on her?

Don't be defensive, whenever a board member tries to point out something you are doing that is not healthy. Remember, we are the good guys. We are not attacking you. The LBS's who are offering help, are further down the road from you.....so please accept their wisdom and avoid the pitfalls.

Do you want to let go of this mess? Don't you want to feel free of it? How about setting some day to day goals about letting go?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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Time to 2x4 myself.

The fact of the matter is this.

I have not been NC.
I have not gone dark.
I have not been detached.
I have been half @$$ing these things and expecting, not only results, but immediate results.

All very unrealistic.

this took months/years to develop and grow to the horrid beast it has become.
It will take as much if not more time for it to deflate and go away, or change, or whatever is going to happen.

I know if whined about how "its been 9 months!!". THats just since i have KNOWN. Its been over a year of affair, almost a year and a half since she first cheated (that i am aware of)
That feels like FOREVER.
It isnt.
This will take YEARS to heal from, move on from and to get to where i need to be co parting wise.

Moving forward, I will not be talking with MIL or Any other extended family unless i absolutely have to.

I will not reach out to WW unless it is IMPERITIVE that id so.
If that is the case, it will be simply the question i need answered. that is it.

My replies to WW will consist of one of the following only.
"Yes"
"No"
"Thanks"
"You're Welcome"
"Where"
"When"

Ill keep you all posted if anything else comes up.

thanks everyone.


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Also, NC + Going Dark + GAL = Path towards Detachment. Key word here - path. Don't beat yourself up if you don't feel detached tomorrow or next week or next month. It will come in layers and it is crucially linked to self-care. So, keep detachment as the larger goal but do the smaller steps and commit to the process.


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Originally Posted By: sandi2
The way I see the observer technique is as if you are on the sideline observing a situation. The minute you step in or open your mouth.....you have become personally involved, and you are no longer just observing as a detached individual.

By using the observer technique, you'll avoid reactions based on triggered emotions. It will help you become less & less attached to the other people and their lives. It will help you focus on being the person you are working on becoming, instead of spending time & emotional energy on someone else.


I like this approach, i had not heard it mentioned until yesterday. it makes sense.

Originally Posted By: sandi2
You are not emotionally detached from your WW, Orange. As long as you are consumed with her life, you won't be detached. As long as your thoughts are on how she duped you, you won't be able to detach, b/c it maintains that level of anger that refuses to give you peace. As long as you desire to see consequences for her, you won't be detached. You are emotionally driven by the sitch. The sitch rules your mind, and you have to let it go, if you are to ever have peace and move forward.


I agree. I was typing the post that follows yours as you had posted yours. We were on the same thought process.
Great Minds. laugh

Originally Posted By: sandi2
You are the only one who can allow yourself to let it go. Otherwise, your mind is kept in a prison where there is no escape from the torture of replaying the same old videos of your past with WW. You become its slave. Everything you start to do in the future, you'll wonder what she thinks about it. Even if you get into another relationship, you'll wonder if it affects her. That's what happens when you don't let go.

I am my only and worst enemy here. this is the real puzzle i must unlock.
I am causing myself to miss her, i am causing myself to cycle and flounder.
I need to find out what is within myself that is causing that blockage in my energy of freedom and detachment.
There is some un-treated wound or issue i have not identified yet.

Originally Posted By: sandi2
Can you visualize yourself letting her go? Letting the sitch go? Can you see yourself living a happy life, without constantly focused on her?

I can, but its the path to get there is what is obscured to me.
The idea of living a happy life, completely without her is hard to envision, but i know its possible. Esp. considering how i now know that when i thought i was "Happy" with her, i wasnt. I know i gained Happiness from aspects of the relationship, but to say i was genuinely "Happy" with her would be like saying a drug addict is "Happy" to be addicted, sure, they feel good when they get their fix, and its a hard hard bond to break, but having lost a brother to addiction, i can say that no addict is happy to be an addict, and my addiction to her Love bombing and limerence is no different. It produced the same endorphin releases drug use does, and the same withdrawal chemicals.
But i do know in the back of my mind, a happy, healthy R is in my future. Someday.

Originally Posted By: sandi2
Don't be defensive, whenever a board member tries to point out something you are doing that is not healthy. Remember, we are the good guys. We are not attacking you. The LBS's who are offering help, are further down the road from you.....so please accept their wisdom and avoid the pitfalls.

Do you want to let go of this mess? Don't you want to feel free of it? How about setting some day to day goals about letting go?


I know sandi, i had to learn that one the hard way.
Communication and argumentativeness are things i am actively working on. they cause issues with other people in my life. that is on me.
Im all ears moving forward.

Yes. Yes.

I will post some update goals specific to letting go soon. Brainstorming.


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Originally Posted By: Maika
Also, NC + Going Dark + GAL = Path towards Detachment. Key word here - path. Don't beat yourself up if you don't feel detached tomorrow or next week or next month. It will come in layers and it is crucially linked to self-care. So, keep detachment as the larger goal but do the smaller steps and commit to the process.


This is i think the best laid out description of how detachment works i have ever seen. this made it drop into place very firmly. Thanks Makia. The equation makes so much sense!!!!

This should be added to detachment thread ASAP.


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I concur with Maika, OK. This is a process. It takes time. None of us detached out of the gate.

hang in there buddy. You were given a bigger crap sandwich than a lot of us, so don't be too hard on yourself. That said, I like your plan!


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I wnet to start writing MY goals for letting go of MY emotionally abusive, possibly personality disordered WW.
then i figured i would frame in as a "general use" type that anyone might make use of. Bear in mind this is still being birthed from my experiences and my sitch, but i will try to generalize it for any and all to use.

Goals on Letting go of Emotionally Abusive WW
By OrangeK

This is a list of things to either actively do, or recognize in the possibly disordered WW. Recognizing and doing these things will aid in your (my) detachment from the WW.

1.) Accept that although you likely have personality traits of your own to work on, that may cause issues in future R's, Your WW's Personality traits, and possibly personality DISORDERS are not your fault.

2.) Don't try and analyze your WW, A. You arent a psycologist, B. you will drive yourself nuts, there are more questions to be found here than answers.
Do as much research as you need to determine if your WW is habitually abusive, and to what degree, but dont try and make a keyboard diagnosis. If you make this determination, leave it at that. She is habitually emotionally abusive. Thats all you need to know.
**WHATEVER ASSUMPTIONS YOU MAY MAKE ABOUT YOUR WW'S MENTAL HEALTH DO NOT BRING IT UP TO HER OR THROW IT IN HER FACE, NO PROFIT TO BE HAD BY DOING THAT**

3.)Understand that the lion's share of the possibly Disordered WW's behaviors are defense mechanisms for protecting a very damaged, fragile sense of self worth, fears of abandonment, never being good enough, deep seeded self esteem and self loathing issues. She has likely hid many aspects of her life and emotional state from everyone, her whole life. Do not be offended you were not let into this inner sanctum of theirs. Firstly, it is a dark and scary place, secondly, revealing it to you or anyone else would show how flawed they view themselves to be. This is unacceptable to them, and they will hide it all all costs.
The takeaway here, although nothing will EXCUSE the awful behaviors of a possibly disordered WW, such as habitual lying, cheating / affairs, talking to ex's and other men behind your back, triangulating family and friends away from you, Gas lighting, and Projection, and they will offer EXCUSES for this behavior. Understand it is a defense mechanism, largely involuntary, and something they KNOW they do, but cannot change how their mental behavior unfolds over time.
They will lie and deceive and Gaslight to avoid blame for these behaviors, but they are aware they are doing them, remorse and guilt just isnt part of their mental makeup.

4.) Terms to research - Object Constancy / Whole Object Relations, Love-Bombing, Devalue/Discard Cycle, Limerence, NPD vs. BPD.

5.) Lack of Emotions - Many PD's cause a person to not be able to experience some emotions at all, or in a very diminished fashion.
These include but i am sure are not limited to;
Remorse, Regret, Compassion, Empathy, Guilt, Love (in comparrison to Limerance, which they seem to thrive on)

6. Driving Factors - You will see the need for the following drive a lot of the personality of the possibly disordered WW. These may be subtle and hard to detect.
Need for Attention / Approval - This is VERY crucial, Both BPD and NPD thrive off of this need for attention. NOTE: IT DOES NOT NEEDT O BE ONLY POSITIVE ATTENTION, NEGATIVE ATTENTION FROM DRAMA IS JUST AS MUCH IF NOT MORE DESIRABLE TO THEM.

Superiority - they may not outwardly state their grandiose or superior mindset, but look for subtle conversational hints. 1-Upping, "Oh me too!", "that's cool, one time I...." including other subtle put downs of others, and raise ups of themselves.

Deception - They will do things that boggle the mind, like back into someone else car and claim it was that persons fault to get money.
Lie about their circumstances to gain pity / financial gain.

Pity / Empathy - They may not feel or experience empathy, but they know it feels good to receive from someone else. If the start of an R includes all the horror stories of every EX' they've ever had, and how life is constantly beating them down, and they look to you to swoop in and rescue them, be weary. I call my EX's routine the "Injured Princess"

If its too good to be true it likely is.



I will expand more on this in the future.


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I Still seem to struggle with this idea.

"What if WW drops all her crazy lying habits, and has a healthy NORMAL R with OM, and they stay together for a long time or forever. What is she changes for him?"

I know the likelihood of this happening is very very small.

However I also know the likelihood, that if this were to happen, how very badly it would effect me.

Why does this thought haunt me so much?

Why, if her behavioral patterns point in the exact opposite direction, do i have this concern that this will occur, despite all evidence showing that it will not?

How can a mitigate and eliminate this fear?

What if it does come true?


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Answers in bold.

Originally Posted By: OrangeK
I Still seem to struggle with this idea.

"What if WW drops all her crazy lying habits, and has a healthy NORMAL R with OM, and they stay together for a long time or forever. What is she changes for him?"

I know the likelihood of this happening is very very small.

However I also know the likelihood, that if this were to happen, how very badly it would effect me.

Why does this thought haunt me so much?

Because you haven't completely detached.

Why, if her behavioral patterns point in the exact opposite direction, do i have this concern that this will occur, despite all evidence showing that it will not?

Because you haven't completely detached.

How can a mitigate and eliminate this fear?

By becoming completely detached.

What if it does come true?

When you are completely detached it won't matter.


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People don't change overnight. With what your W would have to do to have a normal health R with someone else requires plenty of professional help coupled with deep self-reflection and putting in work.

The OM right now is a nice distraction and somewhere she can fall into.

The fear you have is legitimate - I don't want to minimize it. But that is years down the road if it happens, and you're going to be in a very different place then.

You overcome this fear by becoming a stronger well grounded independent man. You need to recognize that this fear is grounded in your co-dependency with her and the validation you receive as a husband through that dependency.

I think once you're in a more grounded place, do the mental exercise of this fear coming true. What's the worst that can happen to you? Understand and feel that and recognize the root of it all. You'll see that your fear was just your dependency kicking in, and it's actually not that bad.

On the other side of the coin, this would be a stellar outcome for the wellbeing of your child. Wouldn't you want a competent healthy co-parent? No matter how you feel about her changes, if they are going to result in positives for your kid, then that's what counts.


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