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Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: DnJ] #2794985
06/09/18 04:21 AM
06/09/18 04:21 AM
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DnJ Offline
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rylance what you are feeling and your confusion is all perfectly normal.

Your W is probably testing you. To see if you accept or not. It really will not matter if you accept her terms, she will just push other buttons and test until you react. She is looking for justification for what she is or wants to do.

If she is in MLC nothing you say or do is going to bring her back. She has to do what she has to do. She is going to do it. She needs to do it. There really is no stopping her.

rylance I feel for you. I have been there, we all have.

My W had an A, EA, PA, left me and kids, gave custody to me, left all responsibilities behind. So unlike her, as I am sure it is for your W.

You are looking for some advice on how to interact with W. Where she is mentally.

Let me recap, she is willing to give up her kids. She is considering a D after 23 years of R and 12 years of M. She is more strongly considering separating right now. She is confused about her feelings and does not know why she feels and is doing things she is doing.

Mentally she is irrational. Emotionally she is cranked up to 11.

She is suffering something so traumatic that to her leaving her kids and family seems like the only thing she can do. Her pain is most likely from something far in her past, something she needs to work through. This not about you. Do remember that.

When speaking with her by kind and loving. As I said she is going to try to get you to react. Remain calm when around her, do not argue. This will not cause her to get better, but it will sure help you. You will feel better about yourself.

From my experience, in the months of h3ll and pain after BD, you cannot reason with her. She is irrational and operating on emotions.

I will share some things I learnt. I went through a lot of suffering to realize this. I hope it is not to harsh. As in any advice, take what you want discard the rest.

I did not want to be separated, but W did. So she did it. Period. I did not get voice in that decision.

When your W wants to do something she will.

I am truely grateful that W and I are currently separated with the agreement she wanted back then. If she were separating today I do not how it would be.

I have full custody of my kids. That is and has been great. I do not mean for me. I mean for them. They are living in their house. They have stable lives. They have a stable sane parent (well that is what I tell myself smile ).

They do not have to jump from house to house weekly. They do not live with a mom who currently does not and cannot want them. They do not live with the OM. (As for OM - it is staggering how many MLCers have PA. Maybe your W will be one of the rare ones. Just be prepared. And give him no head space.)

It may be in your and your kids best interest to consider getting that agreement signed. I know, I know, not the best outlook on saving your M and R. If separating is going to happen anyhow make sure you look after yourself and you children. Treat it like a business deal gone bad.

Allowing her to go, to separate - it lets her walk her path she needs to walk. It supports her, as much as you do not want too. I really believe that supporting her gives the best chance of her getting through this and growing up, and that is the only way or hope of saving you M and R. Also, you need to save yourself and heal right now. It is all connected.

You actual question was - how best to communicate with her right now?

Work on the follow. Do not get discouraged they take time.

Be kind
Give her space and time
Distance yourself from this
Protect, care for, and love her children
Save and heal yourself
Loving let her go
Love her unconditionally
Forgive her


Communication is not just talking. She sees your actions, and your communication will ring loud and true.

The best people that your communication will speak to, is yourself and your children.

Be true to them and you will be alright.

DnJ


At BD
Me49, W46, S20, S19, S16, D15
M-26, T-29
Oct 8 2017 - Bomb Drop, Moved in w/OM, & Left Kids
Dec 9 2017 - Legal Separation
Currently
Me50, W47, S21, S19, S17, D16

I may give up, but not today.
Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: DnJ] #2795045
06/09/18 03:55 PM
06/09/18 03:55 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
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Gerda Offline
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DnJ's advice is as usual amazingly good and kind and true.

I would just add that separation/divorce is only a sign of their confusion, not the truth of your M. I think it's important to remember that you can be a light no matter what darkness your W brings into your lives. My H threatened D a few months ago at a BD2, and I faced that and was ready to keep standing even if he did it. He seems to have either forgotten about that idea or decided to stick around. Still crazy, still awful but sort of trying to jam his foot back into a closed door that he doesn't realize is actually open.

Point is, they have scales over their eyes so they see even beautiful things as ugly. There is no way your W can see or understand your love and faithfulness right now; all you can do is let her go and live your life with honor and grace while she spirals into the pit.


I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living.
Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: shepard] #2795082
06/09/18 11:55 PM
06/09/18 11:55 PM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 37
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Hornsfa Offline
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Originally Posted By: rylance
Hello everyone,

My support network is small but effective. I have several family and friends to confide in, including my in-laws, who are just as confused as i am right now. Every little bit helps though which is why i came here to talk about my experience and share my story.


I am in the same boat with your right now. Love my in-laws more than my own parents. Dad is consistent with his feelings - he prays that God provides the best outcome for all involved (including him and mom), and on God's timeline. Mom says she needs to snap out of it and go to counseling with me.

I am trying my hardest not to involve them anymore than they already are. Its hard...


H: 47 W:49
M: 17
BD: 5/20/18
OM discovered - still in contact as of 06/07/18.
W says she is moving out 9/1/18
Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: Hornsfa] #2795221
06/11/18 02:16 AM
06/11/18 02:16 AM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 25
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shepard Offline OP
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Thank you Hornsfa, Gerda, Dnj for your advice and support. I apologize for how long it took me to reply, i had a busy weekend planned with family. We had bought tickets last February or March (can't remember) to see the Impractical Jokers show in town on Saturday night. W and i went before two years ago and loved it. When we heard they would be back, we immediately bought tickets so us and our S could attend. She spoke all day about going, until the last minute she decided she was gonna just stay home with our D. She cried when we were leaving, i could see the pain and depression in her eyes again. Son and I had a good time, wish W could've been there.

There was also a carnival/fair in town over the weekend, another event we had planned on taking the kids to, like every year. We planned on going Sunday. Once again, W decided to stay home at the last minute, in bed while i took the kids myself. That was very difficult and sobering for me, to realize my family was at a family event, and we were not whole anymore.

Dnj, your advice was very helpful and i appreciate you taking the time to help guide me. Between these events, W and i did a lot of talking. I listened to her, and validated her feelings, as hard as it was to hear some of it, but still have some learning to do since i can't help to ask questions. She seemed receptive to the questions and snuggled with me during these conversations, even kissing me several times. Despite her passing on these events, her personality seemed somewhat different from the way she has been the last few months. She seemed to have remorse and sadness for what's happened to us and our family. She told me she did not deserve me and that she felt i "hated her". I disagreed and told her i love her. Not sure if telling her that is a good or bad thing, kinda feel its a bad thing.

The kids and I are moving out in less then a month, i am so scared of the changes happening and pray to God things will work out good for all involved. She will get the time and space she has asked for. She seems to have let go of the Divorce talks lately, but we'll see how long that lasts.

I worry about her intentions and motivations, about what she could be potentially planning. These are my worst fears, and its so hard to believe that someone i loved so much, who loved the people in her life so dearly, could be planning my worst fears. Like Dnj said, if that's what she wants, that's what she'll do.

Best wishes to all and thank you again for everyone's advice and support. It is very appreciated.


Me 41, W 37
S12, D4
T23 yrs, M12
BD 4-19-18 ILYBNILWY

Before you give up, think about why you held on for so long
Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: shepard] #2795411
06/11/18 04:07 PM
06/11/18 04:07 PM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 25
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shepard Offline OP
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Evening everyone,

Wife brought some interesting information to my attention today. She told me she doesn't understand why, but she knows she started distancing herself from her parents. She said she can't explain why, but started feeling this way about 5 months ago. Not wanting to talk and visit with them like she always has. Said she is pushing them out of her life!

She also said she is starting to have trouble making eye contact with people at work! I remember reading that people in a MLC will stop making eye contact, but still have not seen that when she speaks to me.

Is this regular MLC symptoms? Will these symptoms get worse or better? She says she is fighting urges everyday, but that its getting harder and that she feels she is getting worse. She sees her therapist tomorrow. If anyone can help explain why she's feeling like this, i would be very appreciative.

Thank you everyone,
Hope you all have a great evening.


Me 41, W 37
S12, D4
T23 yrs, M12
BD 4-19-18 ILYBNILWY

Before you give up, think about why you held on for so long
Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: shepard] #2795418
06/11/18 08:40 PM
06/11/18 08:40 PM
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 69
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You are in the very early days, and we all try to understand, analyze and figure out where they are, what they are doing, what will happen next and how long will it take. We read tea leaves, look for signs, and hope everything will just snap back. It is very normal.

My advice to you is fight that urge. It keeps you deeply attached and will cause a great deal of pain and damage. If you allow that besides the harm to you it will eventually start destroying the love you have for your wife, and one day you will realize there is no going back.

To your question They all follow a script, but they are also all different. Sounds like your wife is in early days and is going deep into replay. She is internally in a great deal of pain, confused, and her memories are distorted. I have spent a great deal of time the past couple of months talking to my wife and it is amazing how much they rewrite the past. She is feeling like this because of childhood trauma and the fact that parts of here never got a chance to fully heal, grow up and integrate. She has had internal pain and conflict she has hidden and pushed down and now the pressure is exploding and she is fracturing.

Biggest irony is whatever is happening she HAS to do this alone if she is to be whole. May be hardest thing you have to do, and it is a marathon not sprint. Get ready for the long haul and strengthen yourself and detach.

Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: MarvinF] #2795514
06/12/18 05:47 AM
06/12/18 05:47 AM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 25
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shepard Offline OP
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Thank you for the insight Marvin. The funny thing is, i have known W since she was 15 years old. From my early years with her, she was one of those lucky kids that grew up with a silver spoon. Both parents loved and cared for her, and are still married to this day. She has never told me of any serious issues from her childhood. Can these memories be suppressed and forgotten for the majority of adulthood?

If so, what brought it out that requires the reckoning now? Does therapy even help with a MLC? Anti-depressants help? I am trying to worry about myself and the kids, but i am having the hardest time trying to let go of her. Life is pretty horrible right now, wish this would all just be a nightmare that i could wake up from.

She told me last night to "take care of our kids while she fights through this". She also said she wants me to "forget about her right now, but to wait for her one day"! Man, i was heart broken hearing her talk the other night.

Thanks again Marvin, i appreciate your insight.


Me 41, W 37
S12, D4
T23 yrs, M12
BD 4-19-18 ILYBNILWY

Before you give up, think about why you held on for so long
Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: shepard] #2795576
06/12/18 10:32 AM
06/12/18 10:32 AM
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MarvinF Offline
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People may look like they have the perfect life growing up, but that is not always the case. Sometimes people who look like they had the perfect families were still treated in a way that caused deep damage. It does not have to be something very dramatic, it could have been constant cut down, put down, not allowing her to find herself or criticism that seemed normal to her at the time, so she will not have talked about it.

MLC seems to come to full steam at certain ages or when some new stress or something dramatic happens (death, work, getting older). Think of it more as pressure that has been building and it finally hit critical point. And they hide and patch the cracks until the building falls down. Therapy may help, but I know lots of good therapist who have not been trained to understand this. If they do you may find that you wife still rejects their advice. It seems once MLC hits there is a breakdown and rebuilding that happens, and it always involves rejecting their current life. And you are a huge part of that. So let her go, for her and your sake.

What is interesting is that you wife seems to have insight into this at some level. She is telling you to take care of yourself and the kids while she fights. That is actually pretty darn accurate. She may become less clear, more angry, and may develop what is called shark eyes where she looks right through you. All this hurts incredibly unless you detach and realize she HAS to go through this alone.

I know my heart has broken many times over the last year, but the more I detached and went no contact the less it happened. And so far I have managed to still keep my love for my wife alive. If I had not I am not sure I could even stand her now. And believe me we all wake up at times or have moments where we want to just scream and say this is NOT real, and wish they would just snap out of it. But they can not, this is reality for now.

Best thing you can do is remove all pressure from her (she already has more than she can handle), give her space and demand nothing. Walk forward, use this time to heal and improve yourself and find who you are outside of being a husband. As you heal yourself and keep moving forward she is more likely to feel safe and find her way back. My wife has already told me she always knew I was there and she appreciated that I did not leave and gave her the time and space.

There are no guarantees but letting go now and taking care of yourself is both the best thing for you and your kids and for you marriage.

Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: MarvinF] #2795711
06/13/18 05:54 AM
06/13/18 05:54 AM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 25
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shepard Offline OP
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Thanks again Marvin, you have tremendous knowledge of these situations. Everything you say makes so much sense. It is all very much appreciated. Thank you to you and everyone else who has taken the time to give me advice and knowledge.

W went to her therapy session yesterday. Gotta say i am disappointed. W is making decisions that carry heavy consequences for our family, and all he does is validate her feeling for making these decisions. I had hoped he would try to work on the issue that caused her to feel this way, not just make her feel good about doing so? Perhaps i don't understand the process though.

W tells me she is still fighting the urge to divorce but seems to be giving up easier and easier. She keeps telling me to wait for her and that we may be able to rekindle our love later on in life?? Does telling her i love her make matters worse? Should i stop expressing any feelings towards her altogether? I understand listening to her talk and trying to validate what she's saying. Respond lovingly and kindly, but without showing my feelings for her?

She also keeps saying that if she does divorce me, she wants me to be there for her for help and to remain her best friend. I have told her i love her too much to just be her friend, and that i am here for her now, but if she divorces me, i told her i could no longer be there for her nor continue to hurt myself by trying to be her friend. Is this the wrong way to respond to this? Am i handling this the wrong way?

Thank you in advance for everyone's advice and insight. Have a good day everyone.


Me 41, W 37
S12, D4
T23 yrs, M12
BD 4-19-18 ILYBNILWY

Before you give up, think about why you held on for so long
Re: Is my W suffering from a MLC [Re: shepard] #2795720
06/13/18 06:15 AM
06/13/18 06:15 AM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 1,742
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Hi rylance - I don't tend to post too much to active situations any more but your's caught my eye.

The key thing here is that you are going to have a bumpy ride of it no matter how things turn out. You will learn things about yourself and your relationship with your W that will probably surprise you and may well disturb you.

I'm from about 2 years in an alternate future. Your situation doesn't quite mirror mine but as others say, there's a script and there are similarities between us all.

If you feel like some boring but perhaps enlightening reading you may want to check out some of my older threads. Once I shifted over to the MLC forum I got some fabulous advice from job and a gent who went as Jack_Three_Beans. Anything they wrote to me is pure gold and might help you.


Here's a link to a summary thread.
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2789569&page=1

And yes, I'm divorced and my ex is still off in fairy-dust pixie land.

The key advice I have for you right now is that it is crucial that you be the "sane" parent. Don't rely on your W for anything. She's not on the same planet as the rest of us. Whether she circles back is unknown. Whether you are still waiting will always be your own choice. But for now, your kids need you. Be present for them and do what you can to protect them and your finances.


On BD
H52, W50
T27, M26
S21, D23
BD-9-Mar-16
D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18
I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good.
But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
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