Newbie In Need Of Guidance

[sandi2]

Should I tell her I'm going out, or just go and play her game? She rarely actually tells me she's leaving, let alone where she is going.

Yes, you can tell her you are going out, but don't tell her where or what time you'll be home. Women are curious by nature, and as a WW, she'll want details. She will want to know if you are seeing another woman! although she may not directly ask. Your job is to give very vague answers that tell her nothing. Do not reassure her that you aren't seeing anyone, or you are just meeting with old buddies, or that you'll be alone. I don't mean that you act as if you are dating, or try to make her jealous. I am saying to let her think whatever she thinks. You don't give her straight answers. I am not encouraging you to lie. Never lie to your W. I am just saying not to give details. If you want examples, you can ask me the questions you think your W may say, and I'll play your part, to show you what I mean.

H: "I am going out".
W: "Where"
H: "Haven't decided yet".
W: "Is anyone going with you"?
H: "Don't know.
W: "Well, have you asked anyone"?
H: (Just gives her the glare of death).
W: "When will you be home"?
H: "Don't know".


BTW, if there is nothing open late, is there somewhere you could go and just read a book, or post on your thread? Is there a nearby mall where you can just look around? Until you think of something you'd enjoy doing for fun, simply getting out of the house needs to be your aim in creating an air of mystery about you. Eventually, you will be really GAL, and you'll be able to see what a positive difference it makes in you. Don't engage into any activity that could bring regrets and you will be fine.

I want to clarify a couple of previous things, b/c I don't want you to misunderstand.

I do not want you to think you have to tolerate an unfaithful W. All cheaters lie. Even with concrete evidence, most cheaters deny having an A. Therefore, realize that simply confronting her about your suspicions will probably do no good. In fact, it alerts her to be more careful about covering her A. She will lie and deny, and try to make you feel as if it's all your imagination. The cheater's most used lie is, "He is only a friend". So, after you let her know you are sucpicious, then what? Then the games really go into high gear. Many men think confrontation, alone, will automatically end the A. It doesn't. The H has to set and enforce boundaries. I hope you are reading about it.

As I said previously, if you ever confront her......you will need to have a plan of action. Don't share with her, just be prepared. Words alone are not effective. Be ready to physically separate, if she does not make an immediate u-turn. She would need to see that you aren't playing and won't tolerate inappropriate behavior with another man. Don't be afraid of losing her, b/c she's already there. Oh, and another thing......She would have to end complete contact with the OM for the rest of her life. She could have no more hidden agendas, secret messages/contacts, and private friendships. Affairs of any type are very addictive.

The other thing I wanted to clarify is about her going out at night. When I said don't let her see you acting sad, I didn't mean for you to act goofy and overkill by telling her to enjoy herself or that she deserves it. Some H's even tell the WW to have a good time. I don't really agree with telling a wayward W this, b/c she is suspected of inappropriate behavior. Just try not to look fake.

Finding balance in your new actions/behavior and interactions with her will be challenging.

Remember, your goal is not to prove your love. It is to have the respect from your W that you deserve. When there is a WW in the M, you cannot gain her respect with your passive ways. You probably will always have nice guy traits, but you can learn how to keep a healthy balance....and what you have to do with your W.

Never threaten to do something that you can't enforce and carry through.

[Accuray]

rminer,

Sandi is giving you great advice. When W says you don't love her/cherish her/etc. she's just trying to shift the burden of what's happening 100% to you.

Her goal is not for you to love her and cherish her, her goal is to relieve herself of guilt. Therefore, if you argue and contradict her, she's just going to resent you for making her feel more guilty.

There is NO PATH to "nicing" yourself back into this relationship. The only way back is tough love.

To Sandi's points, people value that which they have to work for, and do not value that which is easily obtained. If you throw yourself at her, you're of no value.

she doesn’t feel loved or wanted, I don’t compliment her, it has been going on for years and years, we’ve talked about it but it never changes, she keeps it inside because she knows it will never change, we were just kids when we met and we grew apart, the house is killing her but I would never give it up and that she knew it was over when I stopped caring why she was mad.

"Sorry you feel that way -- I guess we're done then. Will you be packing up your things today, or this weekend?"

That may seem like a laughable response to you, but ironically it would have been the MOST EFFECTIVE response in the moment.

Why?

Because you would have stood up for yourself as a person of great value: (1) you won't allow her to offload her B.S. and guilt onto you, (2) you won't be in a marriage with someone who doesn't want to be there, (3) you establish that if she's unhappy, she should move out and good luck.

You better believe that response would make her stop and think!

You better believe that response would make her doubt her resolve.

You better believe that response would lead her to question who has the power in the relationship and if her prior assumptions about you were accurate.

That's what you want, to shake up her assumptions

Obviously you can't go back in time and replay that, but you CAN analyze that response and what would have happened. You can either believe that would have been the best response, and start to act that way going forward, or you can disagree, and let's talk about what issues you have with it.

Going forward I strongly suggest you begin acting as a person of high value, which means you don't diminish your needs or your status in the relationship. You stand up for yourself at all costs, and you refuse to accept responsibility for things she projects onto you.

I often tell people that the shortest path back together is a straight line in the opposite direction.

Acc

[TBSakaJ9]

ACC....that was fuching inspirational! Thank you!

[rminer]

Thanks, marina. It sounds like you know exactly how I feel.

I'm searching for answers on how to fix this, as you know, and any input is welcome.

Very hard to focus on me when all I want is her.

[rminer]

I hear ya. But really, there is not much to do around here. I will keep looking though.

[rminer]

The H has to set and enforce boundaries. I hope you are reading about it.

I am.

The other thing I wanted to clarify is about her going out at night. When I said don't let her see you acting sad, I didn't mean for you to act goofy and overkill by telling her to enjoy herself or that she deserves it. Some H's even tell the WW to have a good time. I don't really agree with telling a wayward W this, b/c she is suspected of inappropriate behavior. Just try not to look fake.

She never tells me she is going, and I don't act bothered. It wouldn't do any good anyway.

Finding balance in your new actions/behavior and interactions with her will be challenging.

I'm finding this to be very true. I want to shake her and ask what the heck does she think she is doing, but at the same time I don't want to make things worse. This balancing act is going to kill me.

[rminer]

Her goal is not for you to love her and cherish her, her goal is to relieve herself of guilt. Therefore, if you argue and contradict her, she's just going to resent you for making her feel more guilty.

No more "truth darts," eh?

There is NO PATH to "nicing" yourself back into this relationship. The only way back is tough love.

I understand that. We don't argue, and most everything is small talk, so there is not much chance for "tough love." How do you "tough love" when there is rarely a chance?

There was an episode yesterday that I will get to in another post.
To Sandi's points, people value that which they have to work for, and do not value that which is easily obtained. If you throw yourself at her, you're of no value.

"Sorry you feel that way -- I guess we're done then. Will you be packing up your things today, or this weekend?"

My wife would have called me out on that one, but I see where you are going with it and how it could work.

Going forward I strongly suggest you begin acting as a person of high value, which means you don't diminish your needs or your status in the relationship. You stand up for yourself at all costs, and you refuse to accept responsibility for things she projects onto you.

Point taken

I often tell people that the shortest path back together is a straight line in the opposite direction.

Oddly, that makes sense.

[rminer]

Day two of the 37 rules was pretty easy. She was taking the youngest two to the museum with a friend (not OM) and left before me. Didn't say a word, just left.

When I got home from work, I made a little small talk. "How was the museum?" "Were the roads bad?" etc. Nothing big. Just got minimal answers in return.

When I went to bed all I said was "good night" and got a grunt of a goodnight back.



Day three, yesterday, was a bit rougher.

I went in the kitchen about 11:30 am to get another cup of coffee. My W was there getting breakfast and I gave her a simple "hey," but got no reply. By the look on her face I could tell she was in a bad mood.

I left to get some things around the house done and finished up about 2pm. When I came in, she was doing dishes. I cleaned up and put on some "nice" clothes. Nothing fancy, just nicer than I usually wear (jeans/T'shirt or sweatshirt), shaved my neck and did my hair (day's off it is usually a baseball cap when I am going out).

I went downstairs to stoke the fire before I left and went back up stairs to wash my hands. By this time is was a little after 3pm. She was standing in front of the kitchen sink where my wedding ring was. I said "excuse me" and got the response "yeah."

When she said that, I simply said "is something bothering you?" "Yes" was the reply. I asked if it was something that I may have done. She said "Yes. I don't want to talk about it right now. I take it you are going somewhere." I confirmed that and said "I have a few things to do." She asked when I would be back. I gave the answer "I don't know."

At this point she started in with "I'm tired of having to cart these kids around everywhere all of the time." I asked if there was somewhere they had to be that I did not know about. She came back with "God, I can't do this any more. You know they have to be to dance and Karate." I simply said "Yes, and I am planning on taking them this week. What time? I don't remember." "Of course you don't. 6:30. You took them last week." I said "That is all I needed to know."

I followed it up with telling her that I am not going to argue with her, she doesn't need to get mad at me and that if she needs something, ask. I have no problem helping when I can. She replied with "like that works." I simply said "It would if you would try."

She then started in on how her van is a POS and that I should let her drive my car since it just sits all day when I am at work. At this point I just left the room. Her van has an exhaust leak and when it idles (only when it idles) you can smell exhaust with the heat on. Not much, but it is there. I have an appointment to get it fixed on Monday, but I feel like canceling it at this point.

A little background on the car situation. Since we have been married she has always had the better vehicle. I wanted it that way because she has the kids with her. I drive 30k+ miles per year and drive a car in to the ground before I replace it. Her van is getting older and has some issues, but she tends to over dramatize things. Last winter my car died. I offered to fix mine so we could replace hers in the spring, but she insisted that I get a newer car. She was worried about me driving the one I had and that I deserved it. Now she is holding it against me.

That was the end of it.

She had been upset with everyone most of the day. My youngest daughter said that she had been getting progressively worse throughout the day. (It is her time of the month. A little extra emotion mabey?)

When I returned from my errands, she seemed to be in a better mood. We left and came back about 2 hrs later. When we came in she was sitting in our bathroom on the edge of the tub with her phone plugged in texting someone. She was dressed to go out. Not fancy, but hair done, makeup and nice jeans.

She didn't tell me where she was going, but I overheard her say she was meeting a girlfriend who needed to talk. She left and came back about an hour later with some groceries, saying that her friend had to cancel because of the roads. She also said that they rescheduled for tonight, so I don't expect her to be home tonight when I get there.

It got even more interesting from there.

About 11:30 her phone started to go dead, so she went to get her charger and couldn't find it - all she could find is the extension cord she uses. She has it on an extension cord and a 10ft data cable so she can sit on the couch and text/facebook/netflix constantly. She asked me if I knew where it was, and I told her that the last place I saw it was in the bathroom when she was sitting on the tub. She said that that is where she left it with her hair straightener.

She went on a rant about how our oldest D put away her hair straightener and that it is amazing how all her chargers constantly disappear. I asked if she had asked our oldest D and she said she did and that she claims she hadn't seen it. As she was doing this she was trying to recruit me to her side. I sympathized with her and said that I know it is frustrating because my chargers disappear too. I told her I looked but did not see it. I then asked my oldest two Ds, and they both claim they did not have it and said she "probably put it somewhere and forgot like she always does."

W went on to say that "When my phone goes dead no one will be able to get a hold of me, so don't try. When my van breaks down that will be really nice."

I actually think my oldest D took it. All of the kids are getting tired of the amount of time she spends on the phone and never putting it down. It is affecting their relationships and they are getting almost as frustrated as I am, but more on that another day.

At this point I told everyone good night and went to bed. No reply from W.

Third day of no hugs/kisses/I love you. Think she has noticed yet?

[rminer]

Another update.

I think the R/A/D conversation may be coming soon, so I need to prepare.

I did a little Facebook stalking today and found that one of my W "friends" is a Divorce Attorney. I don't remember her being there before. I don't have Facebook, but I do know how to check some things.

My question is, what do I need to do to prepare? I have read about validation as well as some threads.

What do I need to say/do/act? I need to get a game plan together for this ASAP, as I feel like the talk will be coming sooner rather than later.

[Natural]

Are you saying that you don't think I should talk to her about "us" at all like we said we were going to do, or I shouldn't confront about the affair?

Actually, I was saying both. There is a lot of guidance on here about "No R talk," meaning no relationship talk after your W has asked for D or started an A.

It's counter-intuitive, but your W will find you more attractive if you ignore her. I used to ask my W "How was your day?" Her answer was always "Fine" and I had a horrible time trying to get her to say more. She never asked about my day. After I found the Last Resort Technique and this site, I stopped asking. I go about my business. I've GAL.

Then, presto, she started asking about me. I try to keep my answers short, but could probably keep them shorter. Completely detach, or make it look like you have. Be mysterious. It will make your W more interested. But don't answer her questions too completely, or the mystery will be gone.