First though, H says it's hard for him to see me because he feels so much guilt. I say, then lets limit our contact - I don't want you to feel guilty. And why the guilt anyway? It's been 6 months already. Then he says,, that's not all that long. Also says, he wants to see me occasionally and stay in contact.
G: why don’t you want him to feel guilty? I wish my stbx felt guilty.
GP: So back and forth, with me saying I don't know what the guilt feels like since I have none.
G: well, you didn’t stray.
GP: Also tell him I'm doing okay and he doesn't need to worry about that at all. So stop the guilt, okay?
G: you can’t control him so not sure why you are telling him to stop the guilt. Does his guilt make you uncomfortable?
GP: H teared up while we had this conversation. He seems to genuinely feel rotten about what he's done. Not the first time he's teared up when talking about what he's done. I told him his guilt is likely more from how he left our marriage (ie. OW involved), and not that he wanted out of the marriage.
G: why are you telling him why he feels guilty? Isn’t that his job?
GP: Not sure this is the best way to handle these conversation either. I'm responding in a way that kind of rubs his face in what he's done and is doing. But in a nice way so he doesn't realize I'm doing it.
G: He doesn’t realize it?
GP: So, onto the budget for the next quarter. I am fair to a fault and even to my own detriment. H knows that and offered to give me more money that the budget would say he should. He feels responsible and I am glad he will even it out so I have more money to live on. He says he needs to do this and its the right thing to do. I will let him do this until we settle our finances once and for all - then we are on our own. He seemed sad at the finality of that too.
Anyway, my blindside to him was regarding the property division. I don't think he realized at all that this was not going to be an even split - in fact it is all in my favor. Our prenup gives me a LOT more (because I had more when we married), and I think he forgot that or never fully understood it in the first place. It boils down to me winding up with my own fully paid for condo, and leaves him only enough for a minimum downpayment on whatever he buys which won't be enough for a house, but maybe a condo.
Once this info sunk in, he couldn't have looked more crestfallen. I actually felt bad for him when he realized what he would get and that it wasn't anywhere near what he thought it would be.
I think what H wanted all along was to keep everything the same, marital home and all, because I believe he one day knew he would get his sanity back and want to come home.
G: good for you; you are not a backup plan!
GP: But I am now telling him that in order for me to live a decent life without him, the house would have to be sold so I could have money to live my life - travel, golf, dining out - all that I would want to do going forward. Right now I have to watch every damn penny and it's no way to live.
He looked so damn sad I was almost heartbroken for him but then realized,... he did this without any help from me. It's just some of the karma coming his way.
Eventually he just said he didn't want to talk about it anymore right now. He looked so shell-shocked.
Overall he was the perfect gentleman, paying the bill and being good company. He looked great and I told him so. He returned the compliment and I know I looked great too.
G: good for you!
GP: We touched briefly on our R, basically that we were great friends and a good team, but that the wild passion he needed wasn't there. I told him that I will never be okay with how he ended the M, but that I am okay that he did. I could never satisfy his depraved sexual needs that he recently revealed to me and since his MLC began.
G: can you say more about this? Feel free not to respond but am curious because my stbx has told me the same.
GP: Funny thing though,,, I wasn't even aware he had such depraved needs during our entire 20 years together. I have to wonder was it there all along and he stuffed it, or did it arise when the MLC hit?
G: same
GP: So we spent 90 minutes at the pub and I enjoyed seeing him and according to him he enjoyed seeing me too albeit with a lot of guilt. He took me home and then came in to get something in the house. Before he left he moved in and gave me a big long hug.
G: he hasn’t fully let you go or he wouldn’t have the guilt and the desire to hug you...
GP: I think he misses me almost as much as I miss him. Makes me sad because I really don't know if we will be able to save our M. I hope so but it's way too early to tell. I need another 5 years or so to get a feel for that.
Ok,, now I need some feedback on how I handled this night out for the first time since he moved out. Am I leading him too much away from the M reconciliation idea? I am handling his guilt comments okay? And whatever else you can advise me about for the next time, which won't be for awhile now.
G: leave him be and stay busy with your own life...your own awesome life!
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Here's some more information regarding the sexual aspect. My H met his OW by chance. They spent that first night and the next 2 nights together (he was out of town). She appears to be a 60 yr old sex maniac. Willing to do anything anytime which appealed to H. So those first 3 nights together were all nighters with no limits on what they did. So H basically experienced his sexual fantasizes in real life with this OW and a sexual addiction was borne. I mean, most people have sexual fantasies but they don't always live them out. Just having the fantasies alone can make sex more exciting. Once his MLC hit, it blew the lid off his sexuality and the lure of the seductress he met was just too much to resist.
I have read that sexuality increases enormously during MLC. The LBS cannot meet those needs because by then the MLCer has already turned away from the LBS in both heart and mind. He's no longer interested in the spouse. The catalyst to BD in my own M came with H meeting a beautiful woman (according to him) who dressed seductively (high heels with blue jeans, tight sweater, come hither looks, and overt sexual moves). He fell for her hook line and sinker and no warnings of the danger (ie. he could lose everything) could stop him.
Until MLC though, I thought my H was normal regarding sexuality. But he tells me he always had those extreme tendencies without a need to act them out. Now, with MLC, he does need to act them out and has a willing partner for that as well. This isn't necessarily passion as I see it. It's nothing more than lust fueled by the dopamine that comes with limerance. These relationships will blow up eventually when the limerance starts to wane, as it always does.
Your other comments are good ones but let me explain a lot of my side of the conversation last night. I say things that aren't necessarily how I feel but how I want him to think I feel so he knows I have let him go, which I haven't. I want him to think hard about what he's lost or is losing. I think his guilt is possible more remorse and regret at what he is losing and has already lost. He has given up everything (nice house, wife, stable secure life, stable future, happy retirement) to play in the mud with his out of control sexual obsessions. It's going to hit him hard when he realizes fully that he traded all that away for a temporary, lust filled relationship and nothing more. This is what MLCers do though. MLC is much more than this but this part seems to dominate right now for my H.
This popped in my head earlier today....wearing heels with blue jeans isn't all that and those too tight sweaters usually just look like they were shrunk in the wash!!!!
Thanks for the answer. It’s nice I get a sane woman’s perspective. I just don’t know what to think when stbx says things like:
No one man can satisfy me
I don’t know if we’re sexually compatible
I need more passion
All of this from a woman who demonstrated a lower sex drive than me during M. But maybe her sex drive wasn’t the issue. Maybe I didn’t sexually attract her or please her. Honestly, I never know what to say and say nothing but it does bother me and hurt me. It sends me spinning.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Ditto Gordie. Mine had low drive and some other issues that were there from the beginning but blamed me. I think this is just how these people justify. Don't let this stuff get in your heads or think this is some major roadblock to anything because it isn't.
All of this is so familiar to me because my H said all three of those things to me as well. It's total MLC script - right from the handbook itself.
The Shadow Self that emerges during MLC is where all those previously buried sexual urges lived. Now that the Shadow Self is in control, the sexual urges can finally come forth. And boy, do they ever come forth. My guess is when the MLC is done, the sexuality returns to normal. Just a guess though.
Very well said. Many of them do return to their former selves, others may stay in character of the MLCer and there are a few that retain a few of their MLC traits once they exit their tunnel of MLC. Time will tell how all of them will be down the road.
Please keep in mind, that the MLCer does tend to think out loud and will say things that are just projections. If there is some truth to what they are saying, then you may want to look within to see if you can improve, but if what they are saying is from the MLC "fog", then ignore it and continue to move forward.
BTW, here's an example of what my xh said to me when I asked him if he was having an affair: "Gosh, no! I can't handle the one I got!". What did he mean? The only thing I could come up with was that I was independent and he couldn't control me....total projection on his part, in my opinion.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
So, in reading along what I'm thinking is, our MLCers are in such a confused state.
I've been doing a LOT of research on MLC lately because its part of my thesis. There are not as many empirically validated studies as you'd think, and the scientific community hasn't studied the mid-life age group as much as others, but there are some. The one thing that stands out is that they find that they PERCEIVE that they are missing some sort of sense of connection. That perception can be traced back to what was witnessed in their own parents' relationship as either working or not working...a model to follow as an ideal or avoid like the plague. They created an ideal based on their view of that and are looking at their own relationship and comparing it to their ideal at this time.
If they are going through a depressive phase or have had chronic depression that they were trying to cover up (usually the basis for MLC), this will also affect their perception of their own relationship. So then they feel that something is missing, but don't know what. Just that it has to do with "connection" in their mind. Sex is one simplistic way to connect, so if they perceive that a connection is missing, they will most likely look for connection through sex with others as it takes far less energy and thought than looking into their own true needs or perceived problems with the relationship. Emotional affairs are also a way to connect, especially if they still are able to see barriers such as marriage vows as being important. Those who do can convince themselves that an emotional affair is ok, because nothing "happens" and no vows are broken...kind of a child's view of faithfulness. They look for that thing that is missing, but aren't in a place where they can do the deep work needed.
Excitement with the "new" is a satisfying, easy connection at first, but because it is (most often) shallow, it doesn't do the trick. Then they are back to depression and confusion and another shallow search to fill the need. This also may be why we see huge changes in hobbies, dress, and...them. Trying to find what's "missing". As Job and others have said, they have to do the hard work...looking deep within...to have a chance of getting out of this. And we can't do it for them.
So really, not so much about the feel-good urges of sex (although that can be awesome and exciting), but the need to connect with another and be understood while trying to understand what's missing for them. Until they push aside distractions such as OPs and do their own inner work, they aren't going to get there.
M-51 H-54 2D-27 and 25 M-26 yrs Bombshell and IHS 7-29-15 He moved out 10-3-15 D filed 1-27-16 D final 10-27-16
