Some people saying that saving your marriage based solely on principle is a good thing. I see it as a marriage doomed to fail again. it comes across as you just wanting to be right and "winning" "winning" to you is "not being the reason the marriage fails"
Guess what. It takes two people to break down a marriage and two people to put it back together. So guess what? If your marriage doesn't make it, she is not soley to blame. She will not be the "reason".
So get that out of your head. Save this marriage because she is the love of your life and you don't want to be without her.
Absolutely! It takes two people on both ends to make a marriage bad or good. We are both to blame for the problems we had and have. What I am saying is that I will not be the one to push the divorce through. I am leaving that up to her. I have put a lot of effort into working things out and I have made my stance on it very clear to her. At this point I can't do much more without her involvement in going forward. I am here and I am only positive in our interactions now, but I am not asking for anything anymore. I can only be given the same none committal answer of nothing so many times where I just stop asking or even mentioning it at all. I just except it for what ever it is and I don't even know what that is....it's limbo I guess and that is where we are. It is what it is and I am just going to go about my business because I am clear as to what I want.
She is the love of my life and I have made the clear to her too, but nothing seems to mean anything to her, so that's that. I am not ignoring her, but I am not pursuing the marriage at all and I am not pursuing the divorce either. It's still a strange thing to be completely disconnected from her with absolutely no interactions at all other than text messages, which I don't believe have anything to do with a real relationship between the two of us. The real relationship is fading in my eyes.
She has told me time and time again that she can't be in front of me or see me because she knows she will just give in to me......what ever that means I don't know. It sounds ridiculous to me. I have told her I don't want her because she gives in or anything from her that isn't completely genuine. The more she stays away from me the less I know or even feel connected to her. Who knows maybe that is her whole plan, but I still won't be the one to end the marriage when I truly believe our problems are nothing compared to most and can be so easily fixed.
I am seeing things clearer and clearer all the time for how my wife was and how I was. I can see a cycle that happened between the two of us and how each one of us caused it and kept it going. I was a certain way towards me wife because she was always so moody and not very pleasant to be around. I am sure the way I acted towards it didn't help it at all and made it worse. It was such an easy thing to fix once you know what not to do and how to communicate between the two of us.
She acts like she wants a different life with out me in it and seems to be living as if she is single. Then she turns around and tells me she is always looking at our pictures and our wedding video. Talks about things we have done together and her wedding ring. She is constantly liking pictures of me on Facebook or Instagram that are posted mostly by other people, but I see it because I am tagged in it. So I can't figure it out and I am not trying to figure it out. All I can do is just shrug my shoulders at it and go about my life. I am doing just fine and if things don't work out then I guess that's just the way it was supposed to be and I will move on.
is there anything about you, that you want to change?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
is there anything about you, that you want to change?
In the context of being a better husband for my wife, yes. I know better now how to give her the kind of love she needs as my wife. Largely a miscommunication thing and just doing things differently with her then I have before. When I know certain actions that I do affect her in a certain way and in turn she acts towards that a certain way it become an endless cycle. Such an easy thing to avoid by just knowing what I am doing that causes her to act in ways I don't appreciate and vice versa. This in it's self isn't changing me as a person and I will still be the person I am now, but I will know the things that I need to do to make her feel loved. I didn't have a problem doing these things before, but I wasn't seeing it clearly enough is all, so in large I won't be a different person, but I will be treating my wife in the way she needs to be treated. I am happy with who I am and in the direction I am heading.
My wife also needs to do things in the same manner, but that remains up to her. I am believe she is still lost and trying to find herself. When she does finally find herself it will remain to be seen as to what her next steps are. As far as that is concerned it remains to be seen if I am willing to be with that person and how long I will wait for her. I am already moving on to a certain extent, but I am still letting her come to her own conclusions. In all honestly my wife has always had problems with making decisions and is always lead to them one way or the other and I don't want to play that part. I don't think it is right for her family and friends to play that part either. She really needs to make this decision on her own and the one thing I know will happen if she doesn't is regret.
is there anything about you, that you want to change?
In the context of being a better husband for my wife, yes. I know better now how to give her the kind of love she needs as my wife. Largely a miscommunication thing and just doing things differently with her then I have before. When I know certain actions that I do affect her in a certain way and in turn she acts towards that a certain way it become an endless cycle. Such an easy thing to avoid by just knowing what I am doing that causes her to act in ways I don't appreciate and vice versa. This in it's self isn't changing me as a person and I will still be the person I am now, but I will know the things that I need to do to make her feel loved. I didn't have a problem doing these things before, but I wasn't seeing it clearly enough is all, so in large I won't be a different person, but I will be treating my wife in the way she needs to be treated. I am happy with who I am and in the direction I am heading.
My wife also needs to do things in the same manner, but that remains up to her. I am believe she is still lost and trying to find herself. When she does finally find herself it will remain to be seen as to what her next steps are. As far as that is concerned it remains to be seen if I am willing to be with that person and how long I will wait for her. I am already moving on to a certain extent, but I am still letting her come to her own conclusions. In all honestly my wife has always had problems with making decisions and is always lead to them one way or the other and I don't want to play that part. I don't think it is right for her family and friends to play that part either. She really needs to make this decision on her own and the one thing I know will happen if she doesn't is regret.
The question was whether there's anything you want to change in you.
You made your answer Mostly about her, and the conditions you'd set on her, before you might change a few (vague) behaviors.
In contract terms, these^^ are known as "conditions precedent". "if this, then that."
Cali, the question was about whether you want to change anything in yourself.
IF you choose to narrow your reply down to your role as a h, then a translation of
your answer really is -
"Only if I get a payoff from my w",
Consider that ^^. Be brave.
It's not an either or, Cali. It's not as if someone saying they want to change something about them, makes them a loser. Not at all.
OTOH, maybe your m wasn't so great and you overlooked a lot, but now you feel that if you admit that, it's like a failure.
But if you don't admit that, you'll have to own a chunk of where you are, and change and that feels like a failure to you. Seems to me that again, it's not an either or.
It's a rough position to put yourself in so maybe try NOT to see things in such a black and white way.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
is there anything about you, that you want to change?
In the context of being a better husband for my wife, yes. I know better now how to give her the kind of love she needs as my wife. Largely a miscommunication thing and just doing things differently with her then I have before. When I know certain actions that I do affect her in a certain way and in turn she acts towards that a certain way it become an endless cycle. Such an easy thing to avoid by just knowing what I am doing that causes her to act in ways I don't appreciate and vice versa. This in it's self isn't changing me as a person and I will still be the person I am now, but I will know the things that I need to do to make her feel loved. I didn't have a problem doing these things before, but I wasn't seeing it clearly enough is all, so in large I won't be a different person, but I will be treating my wife in the way she needs to be treated. I am happy with who I am and in the direction I am heading.
My wife also needs to do things in the same manner, but that remains up to her. I am believe she is still lost and trying to find herself. When she does finally find herself it will remain to be seen as to what her next steps are. As far as that is concerned it remains to be seen if I am willing to be with that person and how long I will wait for her. I am already moving on to a certain extent, but I am still letting her come to her own conclusions. In all honestly my wife has always had problems with making decisions and is always lead to them one way or the other and I don't want to play that part. I don't think it is right for her family and friends to play that part either. She really needs to make this decision on her own and the one thing I know will happen if she doesn't is regret.
The question was whether there's anything you want to change in you.
You made your answer Mostly about her, and the conditions you'd set on her, before you might change a few (vague) behaviors.
I got that and I thought I answered it. In short I don't believe that was the problem in our marriage. Everything boils down to not loving my wife in the way she needed to be loved. I don't believe the requires me to personally change so to speak, but rather changing the way I treat my wife. My wife on the other hand has stated she wasn't really herself, so if there is changing to be done then I would say it lies in her lap, since she was the one not being herself. Funny to think about, but if my wife was herself and acted in the way she normally does then would we be in the predicament. This isn't blaming anything on her at all, but I just have acted different towards the real her..... maybe, it's just a thought.
In contract terms, these^^ are known as "conditions precedent". "if this, then that."
Cali, the question was about whether you want to change anything in yourself.
IF you choose to narrow your reply down to your role as a h, then a translation of
your answer really is -
"Only if I get a payoff from my w",
Consider that ^^. Be brave.
It's not an either or, Cali. It's not as if someone saying they want to change something about them, makes them a loser. Not at all.
OTOH, maybe your m wasn't so great and you overlooked a lot, but now you feel that if you admit that, it's like a failure.
But if you don't admit that, you'll have to own a chunk of where you are, and change and that feels like a failure to you. Seems to me that again, it's not an either or.
It's a rough position to put yourself in so maybe try NOT to see things in such a black and white way.
I have to ask you a question because it seems to be a constant towards my answers and what I say. Why is there a need to try to read between the lines of everything I say. I am not hiding anything or trying to cover anything up. This seems to be something that people on here think I must be doing. In reality I am very open with what I am thinking and not trying to be the riddler here. Why come across to me with if I do this or that I will be brave? I can careless about being brave or not being brave. In the context of this forum I have absolutely no face to loose what so ever. I know none of you and none of you know me or my wife. Really those kind of comments make me say WTF because it's so out of left field for me and the context of this whole thing. If I was so afraid of loosing face or admitting a failure I highly doubt I would have ever came to the site let alone speak up on it.
I would ask maybe not try to see something that isn't there or reading into my post to deeply. Again I am not afraid of admitting failure or anything of the sort. The reason I am even good at the things I do is because I failed and failed a lot. Try keeping that in mind next time and I would be curious to see how your response changes towards me.
In me not saying there was anything I wanted to change about myself as a person, but rather change how I reacted and communicated with my wife is JUST THAT AND NOTHING ELSE. Why make it out to be more than that? I said very clearly that I was happy with who I am and where I am heading. My wife, who says so herself, is lost and doesn't know who she is. These are facts and not made up suggestions I am having. Our issue in the marriage was me not making my wife feel loved and not me not actually loving my wife. If I had known how to make her feel loved than do you think we would really be in this situation?
What you are saying that is black and white coming from me is simply what I see as the solution to our issue, so I don't get why it has to be more complicated than that. That being said, my wife is certainly complicated! I don't and I problem never truly will, how and why she does all the things she does. The difference between men and woman I suppose. Haha! Anyway I have discussed these things with my wife and it is pretty clear that is the actual real issue. My wife's biggest concern is me not changing the way I loved her or only doing it temporarily. That is admittedly by her the hang up she has. Other than the factor of her doing this boot camp, which by the way she seems to think she isn't going to make it and be kicked out, why she isn't coming back home. She is scared of the things I mentioned going back to the way they were.
You obviously have something to say about my character that you believe is an issue, so why not just say it straight out what your thinking? Maybe tell me exactly what it is you see is the flaw in me personally so I can deal with it. Even if I refuse to believe it, which I am sure you think I will automatically do, at least it will be on the table and I will hear it. Who knows, maybe if I hear it enough from enough people I will believe it and then make that change.
By the way I do talk to other people who will be totally honest with me what is discussed on this forum to get their thoughts and points of views on it too. I think involving some people who really know as a person is an important thing to do.
Our issue in the marriage was me not making my wife feel loved and not me not actually loving my wife. If I had known how to make her feel loved than do you think we would really be in this situation?
You say this as though this is unique to the situations on here. That it is just a switch to turn on and 'everything would be better'.
In my opinion, this is a surface analysis. I too thought that I just did a bad job of showing my ex that I loved her, but when I really looked at myself and my behaviors, I saw that there were so many underlying factors about myself that caused those kinds of actions and feelings in me.
"Making my wife feel loved" is, in my opinion, something that requires a fairly significant behavioral change. I think 25 is saying that it takes courage to really shine a light onto that idea of "making her feel loved" and figuring out exactly what that entails, why you werent doing that to begin with and what behaviors you are going to change in yourself moving forward
If you say that there is nothing you would change about yourself, to me is a signal that you are not looking hard enough. Very few people (if any) are at the level that they can safely say that they would not change anything about themselves. In fact I am pretty sure that the harder you look at yourself, the more things you find that you would like to improve. That is not to say that they were faulty, only that your eyes open to the possibility of improvements. And believe you me, improvements are limitless. And once you come to the stage that you realize that improvements are limitless, then the magic starts. You suddenly realize what your potential could be, your mind opens up, your heart opens up, you flourish, and your surroundings will notice. I know you are probably thinking WTF is this guy on about, but I promise you, 25 knows, the vets know. It is a beautiful state of being, and prior to BD largely unbeknown to me. Now I know and what I know can not be unlearned. And given the fact it cannot be unlearned, one must simply walk the path of self development and self realization, to get closer to what our creator made us to be. Frankly it is an offense not to grow. And thinking you are perfect just the way you are is simply WRONG.
