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My first thread:
wife gone deep in the tunnel?

My previous thread: 24 Mths in.. I gotta whole lot of living to do now


New thread.

Well what I thought would end with my XW trying to push our buttons and her threats to make an appearance.. it ended in a no show and now a series of messages. Give me a few minutes to type this one up.


M51
XW43 (38 at bd)
BD1 MAY 30 2015
BD2 JUNE 25 2015 by text
moved out Aug 2 2015
left both Daughters 13 and 15 (now 18-20)
Her divorce Final July 26 2016
Last time she saw her kids Aug 2 2015
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Well Monday started out to be a calm day. I prepared to go on a 3 day trip out West. Daughters will stay with my parents for 2 nights and home alone for one.

Just as I have all the plans set I get a text.

You know Irish, I was thinking of our situation. If you would of just told the girls to mind their business about us, that it was adult stuff, we wouldn't be in this mess. you failed as a father. When I told you I was leaving, we should of sat the girls down and told them together, that we both agreed. Instead of me telling them I was leaving. About our meet up that never happened. I am open to it now. It will have to be after my therapist appointment on Thursday. And only if he decides I am strong enough I will contact you.

Now i read this more that once. I didn't want to reply because it is all the same blame to me as before. It only showed me she still believes what she preaches.

I could of wrote.

Sorry XW, i wasn't about to back you up for your departure and also you added that you no longer wanted to be a mom. you own that.
to keep teens out of our adult business as you so put it. they were in it before I was. they were 13 ad 15 years old.. not months old. They were very much aware of what was going on.
I'm glad you are seeing your therapist, i truly hope you figure it out.

But I didn't write that. No need to repeat. Lets wait until after Thursday if she is ready for a face to face.

I get on my plane. All is good.

once I land ( no wifi in canada air space), a multiple of texts comes in. Good thing too. My plane was stuck on the runway waiting for anther plane to move so it gave me reading material.

text 1
Irish, I really hope i will be strong enough to face you. We need to work together its the only way.

I hope so too. we will see

text 2
I'm afraid that you won't like what you see. That you will not want to help me connect with the girls.
Also, if the girls are mad and want to kill me i don't want to see you. They need to hear my story. I need to tell them.


the girls know the story. I hope she's truthful with them. Sadly, I don't think she is there yet so can't hope for that.

text 3
If I meet you are you going to tell me I'm a bad mom. That I abandoned my kids.

now it gets interesting.

I reply.

Let's wait until Thursday. Get back to me and let me know. i'm busy until then so after Thursday works well with my schedule.


Irish, I want to see you but if the girls don't want me then I don't see the need to. I am not well and my therapist will tell me if I should.
My therapist will decide. it's up to him.
I won't go against the girls wishes either. I do need you to help with this. I can't do it without you. I'm afraid to talk to you as well. If I tell you why I needed to leave and the life I am living you might close the idea of helping me. I see the therapist Thursday i will discuss this with him.I'll decide what I will do ... if I feel strong enough or not.


so I left it at that. A lot of rambling at the end so i can sense she is not in a good place. Where she takes it we will see.

lets see what happens Thursday.


M51
XW43 (38 at bd)
BD1 MAY 30 2015
BD2 JUNE 25 2015 by text
moved out Aug 2 2015
left both Daughters 13 and 15 (now 18-20)
Her divorce Final July 26 2016
Last time she saw her kids Aug 2 2015
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Irish, great job with the restraint.

It is good that she is seeing a therapist. Is this a new development?

I think the fear is normal. She knows she has done bad things, she knows she has been a bad mom. She is just projecting.

At least she realized relatively quickly that the wait until they are 30 thing was not a great idea.

Good luck to you and the girls (although I doubt she will follow through this time).

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I read a slightly deeper message than in her previous ones. She isn't fully there yet, but she seems to be getting closer.

I could be wrong, but she appears to be facing her demons and working past them. Whether she reaches the truth or a version that she thinks will serve her best is another story. I would like to be open to it being the former, but her initial contact was an attack on your part. Plus she is apparently letting her IC decide for her.

I also think that at this stage, she knows that you won't swallow her horseshiit. So maybe a clearer version of the truth will be forthcoming.EEven if it may be wrapped in a pity party.

You seem to have your head right so you could handle this without our help/advice. But here is mine anyway:
# don't let her meet the girls alone without having met her first to assess where she is at and what her approach will be
# when ye meet, set yourself the hard target to not react to her. Let her talk as much as possible. Don't judge her, correct her or put her in her place. Hold your tongue. This will let her finish what she has to say and not get sidetracked reacting to your reaction.
# at the end thank her for opening up and say you want to consider what she said and you will get back to her.
# eliminate the thinking that this will be or is the sane old white again and again. Have an open mind.
# try interpret what she really means. By this I mean that maybe she will attack you or look for pity but she could have a good intention behind a bad communication.

I expect you may not agree with everything she says or wants. That's OK. Just remember your objective isn't about being right, it's about rebuilding a connection between your girls and their mother. Work towards that.

I too suspect she may hid behind not being ready to face you and postpone but I think this meeting will happen.

Best wishes Irish. Enjoy your few days away.


R 25 years
M 14 years
S11 & S13
Working on it alone since Oct 2014
M in trouble a lot earlier (~2 years)
Feb 2016. 1st R chat in a yr.
Next R chat Aug'17
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hmmm
you reminded me of something. at BD my exh was desperate to have son think it was mutual. i didn't agree, but didn't clarify anything for our son. I let exh do all the talking. I only said, "we both love you very much son"

son knew exactly what was going on the entire time.

Just like your girls knew. Kids are not stupid.

sorry, flashback. this isn't about me and I will re-focus now.

Roist's advice : [quote=Roist]# when ye meet, set yourself the hard target to not react to her. Let her talk as much as possible. Don't judge her, correct her or put her in her place. Hold your tongue. This will let her finish what she has to say and not get sidetracked reacting to your reaction.
# at the end thank her for opening up and say you want to consider what she said and you will get back to her.
# eliminate the thinking that this will be or is the sane old white again and again. Have an open mind.
# try interpret what she really means. By this I mean that maybe she will attack you or look for pity but she could have a good intention behind a bad communication.
/quote]
I think spot on, esp. the first two points.

Remember, the more she talks, rambles, babbles, the more information you will have to make a reasonable assessment of next steps for Ds. Much is revealed in their endless rambles.

enjoy your trip xoxo keep us posted.


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
~ Mary Oliver
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Wow, wow, wow.

The best suggestion is not to explain yourself or defend the crazy stuff she says. She is still full on in blame mode and she while she can admit she is not well, she still is not taking an ounce of accountability.

Your best bet? To let her ramble and not say a word. I can't see anything else that you can do.

If she is still in a place of blame shifting, her seeing D's may not be a good idea. I know there was nothing more painful to me than my mother blaming me for adult problems.

You will get a sense of whether or not she is ready to take accountability. Or at least if she is on the path to it. But until she is, I wouldn't be facilitating a meeting and "helping" her like she asks.

You continue to absolutely amaze me. I would have had her blocked from my phone by now and only entertained email to an account just for her to email and to check it when I see fit. You are a better person than I.

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Irish,

You've received excellent advice from all. I do agree that you need to step back, listen and just let that woman ramble on and on. The more she rambles, the more you will learn about where she went in her head. I know it takes the patience of a saint to deal w/these folks...but you've become a very patient man over the years.

Like most MLCer's she's afraid of being judged and rejected because deep down, she knows what she's done and doesn't have a clue to repair the damage.

I think your response was spot on and let's see what transpires after Thursday. My guess is she's not ready to face any of you.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Irish -

Ditto to Ginger1 and job's comments.

Put feelings aside and keep your thinking cap on. Do the poker face process it later, if anything happens - which I don't think it will.


M: 49, W: 45
T: 22 M: 15
S14, S11, S9
BD: Jan '16
W files: Oct '16
D final: June '18
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Wow Irish .... quite the flight you had there.

When was the last time you actually seen her?

Reading the exchange I picked up on what job said. She is terrified of being judged/rejected probably more so from the girls than from you but I am thinking its death by firing squad or hanging ... neither sounds fun.
The fact she is putting the weight of meeting you on her therapist should tell everyone she is not ready, but the good news is she seems to be atleast sorting through some issues, although I am guessing in her head if Irish did this or Irish did that she would not be in this sitch so yeah ... I would hold fast till the Blame Game stops and she actually starts to look inward for solutions.

On the journey goes my friend ... hand in there if anything its interesting and for her sake I hope she figures it all out vs. missing out on what sounds like an amazing chance to be a part of 2 amazing girls lives.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Hi

She seems to be judging herself as well and she can see her life has gone downhill a lot
and that you may not approve of her or allow her in the lives of the girls

I set a few boundaries when my XH left..I fired him from our business with the help of a L- because he was using and getting high..
I told him them he would have a job if he straightened up-
he chose the fast life and left
It was for the best for us and our business thrived with him gone
if he hits a bottom-- he will sober up- if not, he is no good for anyone including himself
he is now D from OW but still deep in addiction

In my opinion, it may be best to let her hit a real bottom if she is using
not to help until she is clean- she is telling you- her life is a mess, so we can only guess what she has become
unless you want your girls to be around an addict- it may be best to allow her enough space and no reach outs -no help until she is really there
and it doesn't sound like she is yet-
just a clear boundary, she will only be able to reconnect with her kids when she is clean and sober-
just my opinion-


married 14 years
H 42
bomb 2/07 IDLYA
D final 3 /09
M ow D ow
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