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First off I'd like to say that I wish (probably like most of us LBHs) I knew more about psychology of WAW, WW, and MLC way earlier before the possible point of no return.

My wife seems to fit most of the "symptoms" to a tee. She was telling me for a few years how she was unhappy. I think I was hitting my MLC years (early to mid 40) while she was still in her mid 30s. Looking back, I definitely stopped being the man that she fell in love with and I can see how slowly but surely she was losing respect then physical attraction then love for me. I became a couch potato not wanting to go anywhere, gaining 50-60 lbs in a few years, not taking care of my health or my appearance. Additionally losing interest in sex and intimacy and I'm pretty sure that was the last straw for her. Our arguments became more and more frequent, and we were often irritated with each other. Somehow I was stupid enough to think that she was obligated to love me anyway and that she wasn't going anywhere.

Little did I know that she was carrying on a EA/PA with a friend of ours for some time (2 years?). As I know now, other "friends" noticed something a while ago but I was completely oblivious to all the red flags and signs of the affair. Then last Dec she told me we needed to separate and she rented an apartment not too far from our house. The main reason is the textbook "I need to think about life and our relationship". She said she rented it starting Dec but I highly suspect now that she had actually rented a few months before that. There was never a talk of her staying in the house and me moving out as it is my separate property in a community property state (purchased before marriage) and her name is not in any of the docs. I'm not sure but it's possible she felt slighted by that and possibly never felt like it was HER house too in all 12 years of M.

She didn't move out right away though and stayed thru the holidays. Right after the New Year's I learned from mutual "friends" the real reason: OM from our circle. He was married with 2 kids; apparently his wife found about the A a while ago, didn't tell me (G-d only knows why), and tried to break them up on her own a few times. When it didn't happen, she kicked him out of the housed and filed for D which was finalized earlier this year. After I found out about the A, I did all the wrong things: talking constantly about our relationship, trying to convince to change her mind and stay, etc. While she seemed to be receptive to having conversations and discussing things with me, she was adamant (in a typical WW fashion as I know now) blaming me for our deteriorating MR and her A. She said she had told me of her unhappiness many times but I didn't want to listen or do anything about it. She moved out about 4 weeks later.

For the first couple of months it was impossible for me not to talk to her and I called to check on her almost daily. It was all small talk as I was trying to come to grips to the new reality. Gave her a huge expensive bouquet of flowers on her birthday in 3/17. After the first couple of months, as I started reading about separations, affairs, and divorces, I started to detach as much as possible and stopped all the calls or texts. D11 was mostly with WW on schooldays (even though I saw her a couple of hours a day after school). On the weekends D was with me and obviously WW was with OM. I assume OM was there during the days too while D was at school. Financially he's a total loser and barely works. During summer break D also spent most of the time with WW during the week. She sent D for sleepovers at friends' houses on Friday nights to spend time with OM and then spent entire weekends with him as I had D on Sat and Sun.

Currently I don't call or text WW at all. She calls me to arrange D's transfer. During transfers initially we had almost NC, now sometimes we have a small chit-chat re D11.

It's been 7 months of limbo and hell. I detached as much as possible, exercise and try to GAL. And yet I constantly think about the sitch, how it all broke down, how I lost my family, and how it affects our D11. I sleep much better than I did in the beginning but I fall asleep and wake up thinking the same thoughts. I felt better 2-3 months ago because I thought their A would fizzle within about 6 months. As that timeframe passed, I started feeling down again with the thoughts re the stitch preoccupying my brain most of the time even when I'm supposed to have fun. GAL is double-edge sword as well: as I'm doing things, I think of how it'd be so much better to do with WW or at least to later tell her about the activities.

Interestingly, there's absolutely no talk from her about the big D. She still (again 7 months) hiding the OM from D11 meaning he's only there when she isn't and vice versa. In a way I'm grateful about it as I absolutely dread D's finding out about him. WW is obviously in charge of her R with OM since he goes along with basically being a booty call. When he's not there, he stays at his parents' house (35 yo guy lol). WW and I never talk about OM or their A. Her family knows about him; they all know him well and are totally against their R. He's not welcome at my M/FIL, S/BIL or cousins-in-law. If WW goes there, she goes by herself or with D. Again, looks like classic "us v. the world" sitch for her and OM.

I've read many threads here and know what I need to do: detach, GAL, LC only concerning D, etc. It's so hard though to get WW out of mind. When I see her during D transfers, it's so hard to believe that she's no longer my W (emotionally or physically), and she's involved with that idiot OM. No one from her family or our friends sees their R going anywhere and yet at least on the surface (and possibly for real) she seems to still be so infatuated w OM and constantly tries to find ways to send D somewhere to call in the OM. As probably most LBHs, I badly want their A to end and see if we can move towards R talks. I do realize that R may not ever be possible and she may be "done" as she tells our mutual friends but at least I want this to be an option which it is not while she's involved with OM.

I guess my Q is how to stay sane and not constantly think about the sitch during this limbo. Also, I'd like to hear people's opinions if I'm reading (hoping) too much into WW not making any moves to end our official M and keeping her R with OM on the back burner.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
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Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.


Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


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Painful,

I know it's hard, but you haven't fully detach. GAL, make yourself a person only a fool would leave. Don't GAL for your wife, do it for yourself.

This part will be hard and I know. Stop worrying about what she is doing with OM. Live your life to the fullest. Start doing 180s. The more you become a less of an option to her and she see you enjoying life, authentically, the more curious she becomes. You need to start to put doubt in her mind about OM, not with words, but with your actions. If you start to move on and mean it she will notice. In your heart you know what you want. Keep your intentions to yourself.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
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Hi Painful, I wish I could tell you how to wipe those thoughts out of your head. Who do you have to vent your stress and thoughts? Have you considered talking to a counselor who might be able to advise you?

Do you have your daughter every weekend? That seems a bit unfair, IMHO. Maybe that's better for D11, IDK, but it sure seems convenient for the lovers. Have you considered rescheduling where you can have a free weekend sometimes?

Btw, don't be too sure D11 hasn't figured out, or suspects, what's going on. Kids these days are pretty sharp about those type of things.

Do you financially support your W in any way?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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How nice of you to keep her dirty little secret for her. Limbo [censored]. It's soul crushing and it'll literally kill you. This affair prospered because his ex wife and you both kept their secret. Why? Who knows. Affairs almost always die when drug into the light of day/truth so I never understand why people keep the dirty secrets of cheaters. Oh well, all I'll say is limbo will continue as long as you allow it to continue. You get a say in this too and being a doormat will cause your WW to lose whatever shred of respect she has left for you. Nobody ever gets their WS back by being a doormat. Good luck.



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Painful,


Sorry to hear what your going through. My W officially moved out a few weeks ago. Funny thing we seem to be fighting more now that she is gone than the whole seven months I found out abiut the A. Right I'm just pissed with her trifiling ways and deceit on her part.

And yet there was a moment last night when I missed the woman who she was. I now this isn't DB advice. But my father advised me that I wouldn't be completely detached until I started engaging more with other women who showed interest in me. That is when you truly realize that there are far better women in this world than W.

And I have to agree with everything TxHubby mentioned. I kept W dirt on the low for so long hoping that W would come back and not have to be ashamed for what she did. But all this did was show weakness in my part and inspires to keep things going on. And probably motivated to engage in cheating with as few other men as well. Now when people ask how W and I are doing, I don't hesitate to tell them the truth about what she has been up to. So don't feel obligated to hide her A, because she is talking bad about you in order to justify her nonsense.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
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Painful,

The limbo is the worst. Only you can decide when you've had enough.
For starters, I would recommend that you do your best to show the world (and your W) that you are moving on without her. That means blowing up your GAL activities. You say you have your D most weekends. While its great that you have that and can work on being an awesome Dad, maybe you can take some time for you. Go on an awesome trip by yourself or with your D. If you go by yourself, that means D has to stay with W and screws up her plans with OM. Perhaps doing both is a good move.

Its true that most A's do go down in flames. With OM being such a complete loser, I have no doubt that will eventually happen here. Its just a question of how long you can wait. And then if it does end and your W comes back, you have to endure the mind F^ckery of knowing that your W chose this complete loser over you for however long it took. You would need to see some serious remorse to get over that one.

If dropping the rope and starting to move on with your life without your W doesn't work and you are tired of living in limbo land, the next thing would be to file for D. But if you do that, it has to be because your are truly ready to end your R and move on without your W. In the end, that's what it took for me and TxHubby. Filing is the nail in the coffin for limbo land. Many people are willing to hang out here for as long as it takes. But it is a horrible place to be. Only you know what is best for you.


Me: 48 y/o
W: 47 y/o
Together: > 20 yrs
BD: Dec '15, then S
2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D
April '16: started piecing
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TxHubby,

Wth? Did you even read my post in detail??? I know you're one of the vets so I don't mean to be rude.

I never hid the A from anyone. Unfortunately I was asleep at the wheel and was the last one to find out about it. What I said in my original post that his W (now XW) had known about for some time and didn't tell me. Who the h*** knows why. I, ON THE OTHER HAND, HAD NO IDEA until 1/17 after W already had an apartment rented and informed me she wanted to separate. My guess is his XW's reasoning was that if I found out early on then my W and I would separate and my W would go after her husband with a vengeance. I assume she was hoping to end their A by threatening to leave and it backfired on her.

Both W's family and OM's family know about it. Both sides are adamantly against it and I know tried to end it by talking, screaming and yelling at them (separately) on many occasions and yet it only seemed to strengthen their resolve and "soulmate" feelings. Again, looks like "us v. the world" at its finest.

In what way do you see me being a doormat? All the neediness and sappiness I only express on this board. WW NEVER sees any of it during our brief interactions. A realistic advice would a lot more helpful instead.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
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Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.


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Originally Posted By: Painful
All the neediness and sappiness I only express on this board. WW NEVER sees any of it during our brief interactions. A realistic advice would a lot more helpful instead.


Take it easy on Tx. He means well.
This board is a great place to come and vent, journal and express all the things you can do with your WW. BUT, if that neediness, etc exists in you on any level, it must be dealt with. So long as it is there, you are emotionally a doormat even if you W doesn't see it. Work hard to detach yourself from the neediness. Once you've done that, you have really begun to move on from your W which is imperative. She HAS to see that she has lost the better man.

Dont be too hard on OM's W for not telling you. I also did not expose the A to OM's W. My reasoning was that I thought he would just go away and my W and I would begin to work on our issues. ALONE. I also wanted to spare OM's W from the devastation I was going through. Was that the right decision? I don't know. Not doing so allowed the A to continue when I thought we were working on our R. But it certainly could have continued even if I did tell his W. She could have kicked him out and he could have moved in with my W. There is just no way of knowing.


Me: 48 y/o
W: 47 y/o
Together: > 20 yrs
BD: Dec '15, then S
2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D
April '16: started piecing
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Originally Posted By: Painful
TxHubby,

Wth? Did you even read my post in detail??? I know you're one of the vets so I don't mean to be rude.

I never hid the A from anyone. Unfortunately I was asleep at the wheel and was the last one to find out about it. What I said in my original post that his W (now XW) had known about for some time and didn't tell me. Who the h*** knows why. I, ON THE OTHER HAND, HAD NO IDEA until 1/17 after W already had an apartment rented and informed me she wanted to separate. My guess is his XW's reasoning was that if I found out early on then my W and I would separate and my W would go after her husband with a vengeance. I assume she was hoping to end their A by threatening to leave and it backfired on her.

Both W's family and OM's family know about it. Both sides are adamantly against it and I know tried to end it by talking, screaming and yelling at them (separately) on many occasions and yet it only seemed to strengthen their resolve and "soulmate" feelings. Again, looks like "us v. the world" at its finest.

In what way do you see me being a doormat? All the neediness and sappiness I only express on this board. WW NEVER sees any of it during our brief interactions. A realistic advice would a lot more helpful instead.


Sorry if I'm wrong but I think I read you're keeping her secret from your child? Hasn't the child asked why you're not living together? If so, did you lie to them? That's all I was talking about. That was a mistake of his ex to keep the secret. That never works. If anything, it allows A's to fester unfettered. Rarely can they survive the light of day without one, or both, of the betrayed spouses enabling it.

At this point all you can do is the hard 180 and be the best version of yourself you can. Don't give a cheating spouse that moved out any head space. Live for yourself and the kid. Do that right and she'll notice. Especially since her AP is such a loser.



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Hey everyone,

I see many people reply with the initial message in the "frame" above. Sometimes it's the whole message and sometime it's just parts that need to be answered. How do I do it?

Also, what is the difference b/w reply and quick reply or quote and quick quote?

Thanks.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 567
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Originally Posted By: Painful
Hey everyone,

I see many people reply with the initial message in the "frame" above. Sometimes it's the whole message and sometime it's just parts that need to be answered. How do I do it?

Also, what is the difference b/w reply and quick reply or quote and quick quote?

Thanks.


You mean like this?
This is the quote feature. By default, it selects everything. If you don't want to quote the entire previous message, you just delete out what you don't want included.
Reply and Quote give you full formatting options (italics, bold, smiley face, etc).
Quick replay and Quick quote don't give you formatting options.


Me: 48 y/o
W: 47 y/o
Together: > 20 yrs
BD: Dec '15, then S
2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D
April '16: started piecing
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 36
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Originally Posted By: sandi2
Hi Painful, I wish I could tell you how to wipe those thoughts out of your head. Who do you have to vent your stress and thoughts? Have you considered talking to a counselor who might be able to advise you?


There were more people earlier like family and friends. But as time goes by, they become less and less interested in rehashing the same sitch plus I don't want to upset them even more than what they went through when the A was first uncovered. Currently I see a counselor once per week where we talk about the sitch and my frustrations but his "help" seem to only last a short time.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 36
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Do you have your daughter every weekend? That seems a bit unfair, IMHO. Maybe that's better for D11, IDK, but it sure seems convenient for the lovers. Have you considered rescheduling where you can have a free weekend sometimes?

I was thinking about it too. But the WW complains that I'm not pulling 50/50 since she has her 5days/6nights and I only have her 2days/1 night per week. Granted during school year her "days" consist of 1 hour in the morning and 3-4 hours at night while I basically have D11 from Sat morning to Sun night. I don't know if changing the days would "inconvenience" WW and OM as he would just stay there on the weeknights when D isn't there.

[/quote]Btw, don't be too sure D11 hasn't figured out, or suspects, what's going on. Kids these days are pretty sharp about those type of things. [/quote]

Possible, who knows for sure? She might've figured something out but I highly doubt she knows who it is. D11 knows OM from our "old" life and I don't think she would've been able to keep it a secret from me. Sometimes I ask her in different ways if Mom had someone over at the apartment and she never once mentioned him. I also had a talk with her about lying or hiding things from Dad, and she seems adamant that she isn't.

[/quote]Do you financially support your W in any way?[/quote]

Great question; I forgot to mention this in my initial post. From the beginning we had separate finances. She only run a part time cash business and used her money for her shopping (clothing, shoes, etc). I paid all of the household expenses from my income including CC that she used for any family charges. Before she moved out I took all the CC and currently she's completely on her own. The only thing I continue to pay for are D's extracurricular activities, summer camps, and a few misc items. I also continue to pay for the whole family's health insurance as I don't want to go thru a mess of separating insurance accounts and/or having W lapse hers and needing a doctor or ER visit. Since we're still officially M I believe Id be on the hook for any potential med. charges.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 36
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Originally Posted By: LiM
Originally Posted By: Painful
Hey everyone,

I see many people reply with the initial message in the "frame" above. Sometimes it's the whole message and sometime it's just parts that need to be answered. How do I do it?

Also, what is the difference b/w reply and quick reply or quote and quick quote?

Thanks.


You mean like this?
This is the quote feature. By default, it selects everything. If you don't want to quote the entire previous message, you just delete out what you don't want included.
Reply and Quote give you full formatting options (italics, bold, smiley face, etc).
Quick replay and Quick quote don't give you formatting options.


Thanks LiM. It partially worked to address the first question but then I tried to answer other questions and then it didn't work even though I've seen people's posts like that. I.e. part of the original msg in the frame --> answer --> another part of the original msg in a frame --> answer, etc.

Would you please lmk how to do it that way? Thank you again.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 36
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Originally Posted By: LiM


Dont be too hard on OM's W for not telling you. I also did not expose the A to OM's W. My reasoning was that I thought he would just go away and my W and I would begin to work on our issues. ALONE. I also wanted to spare OM's W from the devastation I was going through. Was that the right decision? I don't know. Not doing so allowed the A to continue when I thought we were working on our R. But it certainly could have continued even if I did tell his W. She could have kicked him out and he could have moved in with my W. There is just no way of knowing.


It's too late to be mad at her anyway. Obviously no one knows what would've happened had she told me right away but it certainly wouldn't have been worse. Best case scenario she and I would've busted the A by attacking it from both sides at the same time and before the APs got deeper and deeper into their limerence OR at worst our separation would've happened quite a bit earlier.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 36
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Originally Posted By: Painful
Originally Posted By: TxHubby


Wth? Did you even read my post in detail??? I know you're one of the vets so I don't mean to be rude.

I never hid the A from anyone. Unfortunately I was asleep at the wheel and was the last one to find out about it. What I said in my original post that his W (now XW) had known about for some time and didn't tell me. Who the h*** knows why. I, ON THE OTHER HAND, HAD NO IDEA until 1/17 after W already had an apartment rented and informed me she wanted to separate. My guess is his XW's reasoning was that if I found out early on then my W and I would separate and my W would go after her husband with a vengeance. I assume she was hoping to end their A by threatening to leave and it backfired on her.

Both W's family and OM's family know about it. Both sides are adamantly against it and I know tried to end it by talking, screaming and yelling at them (separately) on many occasions and yet it only seemed to strengthen their resolve and "soulmate" feelings. Again, looks like "us v. the world" at its finest.

In what way do you see me being a doormat? All the neediness and sappiness I only express on this board. WW NEVER sees any of it during our brief interactions. A realistic advice would a lot more helpful instead.


Sorry if I'm wrong but I think I read you're keeping her secret from your child? Hasn't the child asked why you're not living together? If so, did you lie to them? That's all I was talking about. That was a mistake of his ex to keep the secret. That never works. If anything, it allows A's to fester unfettered. Rarely can they survive the light of day without one, or both, of the betrayed spouses enabling it.

At this point all you can do is the hard 180 and be the best version of yourself you can. Don't give a cheating spouse that moved out any head space. Live for yourself and the kid. Do that right and she'll notice. Especially since her AP is such a loser.


Ohh - you were talking about our D11? I thought you meant that I was hiding it from others. No, we didn't tell our D about her Mom's A. We told her that Mom and Dad are having issues and cannot live together for right now. Forgive me - and I'd love to get other vets' opinions - but I highly doubt telling the truth to D11 would've changed anything or caused the WW to see how wrong she was.

Don't give a cheating spouse that moved out any head space. --> That's my main issue as I described in my first post. While I do 180 (not sure id it's hard enough or not), try to detach, limit any contact other than re D11, my head rebels against our separation and losing the family by me not being able to stop those thoughts.

Do that right and she'll notice. - Could you elaborate? What is doing it right v. doing it wrong? Thanks.


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Originally Posted By: LiM
Work hard to detach yourself from the neediness. Once you've done that, you have really begun to move on from your W which is imperative. She HAS to see that she has lost the better man.


Great advice LiM but HOW HOW HOW do you work to detach? Was there anything in particular that helped you? I know WHAT I need to do but don't seem to have a roadmap to get there.


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Right now, detaching will be the most difficult thing you have to learn to do. Its HARD and I wish I could give you simple steps to accomplish this. I can't.

The best thing you can do is work on your GAL. ANYTHING you can do to take your mind of the sitch will help. I just tried to keep myself as busy as possible. Anytime you can be in a environment interacting with other people (that don't know about your sitch), you will be in a place where you aren't actively thinking about it. Do that as much as possible.


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Quote:
Great advice LiM but HOW HOW HOW do you work to detach? Was there anything in particular that helped you? I know WHAT I need to do but don't seem to have a roadmap to get there.



Healthy Detachment...(Posted by DBer Peanut originally)

I. Detachment

Detachment is critical to the process of altering and repairing a relationship.

Attached, we take personally ALL that is said, not said, done and not done.

When our ego gets wounded, we are more inclined to do/say things that undermine our goals.

When we are Detached from the actions of another, we can meet anger or indifference with love.

Met with love, we are in a position to diffuse the situation, and transform it in a way that will be in alignment with our goals.

On the flipside, detachment allows us to play it cool when we do get a positive reaction from our spouse. It is a way to break the distance/pursuer cycle.

Detachment is not withdrawal. It is not indifference. It is not the mind saying, ‘I am not getting what I want so I must pull back.’

It is the natural acceptance that we alone are responsible for how we act. We cannot control another person, but we can control how we respond to them.

We are responsible for our own actions (no one else is).

We are responsible for our own happiness. (No one else is)


PART II Detachment (found around here)

Detachment is the:

* Ability to allow S the freedom to be him/herself.

* Holding back from the need to rescue, save or fix S from being sick, dysfunctional or irrational.

* Giving S "the space" to be him/herself.

* Disengaging from an over-enmeshed or dependent relationship with S.

* Accepting that I cannot change or control S and it was never my "duty/job" to do so.

* Establishing of emotional boundaries between me and S, so that both of us might be able to develop our own sense of autonomy and independence.

* Process by which I am free to feel my own feelings when I see S falter and fail and not to feel responsible for his/her failure, faltering or learning.

* Ability to maintain an emotional bond of love, concern and caring, without the negative results of rescuing, enabling, fixing, demanind or controlling.

* Placing of all things in life into a healthy, rational perspective. (=Balance is a piece of detachment).

* Ability to exercise emotional self-protection and prevention so as not to hang on beyond a reasonable and rational point.

* Ability to let people I love and care for accept personal responsibility for their own actions and to not bail them out when their actions lead to failure or trouble for them.

* Ability to allow S to be who he/she "really is" rather than who I "want him/her to be."

IF & WHEN THESE ^^^ FACTORS ARE ADDRESSED, -

We could have a great friendship, or a great marriage. And those are treasures.
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Thank you Sandi. I know it's belated but I didn't see your post until now; been reading other threads but apparently ignoring my own smirk.

Update : I feel I'm more detached but still think about the sitch almost daily especially when I see D11. Communication w WW is minimal at most and only re D11. It's obvious we're becoming more and more strangers with every passing day. Is this normal to become strangers so quickly after 12 years of marriage? How would the talk of potential R be even possible down the road when we're COMPLETELY estranged?

Question for you and others (probably mostly women - Blu, 25 & others) on how to properly handle a couple of things with WW:

Less Important: in the last couple of weeks she sent 2 catalog purchases to my (formerly marital) address. I'm not sure if it's because she feels they may disappear if left at apartment complex where she now lives or because she wants cc billing and shipping addresses to be the same. I gave the packages to her when I saw her at D exchanges. I see it as a tiny favor and not a big deal. I don't particularly want to have that discussion as I don't think it's worth it. Is it being too soft or doormat-ish? Do you think it needs to be addressed with her to not send it here or just leave it alone?

More important: Our annual car insurance renewal is coming up at the end of this month. I want to kick her off it and tell her to get her own. She obviously will be very "unhappy" as she's not used to paying for it for the last 12+ years. Keep in mind that I cut her off completely with everything else other than D's extracurricular activities and medical insurance. Currently she's not asking for child support, alimony or any other financial help either out of pride or stupidity or not wanting to p--s me off and lose plan B. What do you think is the best way to approach this conversation and potential fallout? Thank you.


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I would just ask her why she's having her purchases sent to your address.

About the car .....is it in your name, or both names? If so, then I suggest you protect yourself by keeping it covered by insurance.


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Originally Posted By: sandi2
About the car .....is it in your name, or both names? If so, then I suggest you protect yourself by keeping it covered by insurance.


The car is in her name only but it doesn't matter; ownership and insurance are 2 independent things (at least in our state). The car MUST be covered by state law and to protect assets in case of MVA. The question is how to tell her to get her own coverage for the car she's driving without a possible s--tshow.


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Originally Posted By: sandi2
I would just ask her why she's having her purchases sent to your address.


I could but I don't really want to have that conversation unless I decide that it's unacceptable for her to do that regardless of the reason. I personally don't feel it's a big deal one way or the other but I wanted to get the vets' and/or female perspective to see if it comes across as her disrespecting me, doormat-ish, pathetic, temp-checking, etc.


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ANNIVERSARY QUESTION.

Hi All - I'd imagine this question has been answered in some threads before but I haven't seen it. So the question for all the vets as well as newbies going thru theses hard times right now. WHAT DO WE DO REGARDING OUR ANNIVERSARIES? Mine is tomorrow so would greatly appreciate opinions.

In the years past (except for last year when things started to unravel) my WW and I celebrated the date by going out to fancy expensive restaurants with continuing "partying" in the BDR. On one hand I completely understand that she no longer feels emotionally or physically connected with me and our M as we knew it is dead (even though we're still legally married and there's no talk of a D). OTOH, it's still her history and certainly a pleasant one no matter the current M condition. Right now we're civil in a cold way and have a very limited contact at daughter exchanges. I'd like to acknowledge the anniversary in some way -- is it being weak and in denial of the current sitch OR does it show strength and character that shows I am willing to rise above the craziness of today? I'm positive she still remembers that day as the one of the best in her life - wouldn't it be worth it to remind her of the happy days in our M to possibly lessen her resentment and rebellion and crack the R door ever so slightly? Or will it have the opposite effect?

I really can't make up my mind and keep going back and forth with pros and cons of each side. I'm ready for either 2X4s if you need to send some or an encouragement to make some move. If anyone is in favor of acknowledging it, how would you suggest I handle it?


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How would it benefit YOU to acknowledge the anniversary? Forget her and what the date means to her and blah blah blah.

You're focusing too much on how she will react. Forget about her right now. If the anniversary was so important for her, wouldn't she have tried to work on the MR? I'm just saying. It's just a date - for reals.

I had my anniversary two months back and I didn't plan on acknowledging it. W msged me saying something like she didn't think we'd be here - separated. So I acknowledged it and moved on. I didn't initiate it.

A text or even in-person acknowledgment of this isn't going to somehow make any difference in your sitch. It's a small thing.
If you do acknowledge it, don't expect any thing to happen or change.

I'd err on the side of not acknowledging it.


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Originally Posted By: Maika
How would it benefit YOU to acknowledge the anniversary? Forget her and what the date means to her and blah blah blah.


Thank you M. True, I shouldn't worry what the date means to her. But the date is one of the best days of MY life as well. It always meant a lot to me to be sure to celebrate it, so maybe that's why I'm thinking (probably overthinking) about it and wanting to reach out to WW.

Originally Posted By: Maika
A text or even in-person acknowledgment of this isn't going to somehow make any difference in your sitch. It's a small thing. If you do acknowledge it, don't expect any thing to happen or change.


Again very true M. And I definitely wouldn't bank on anything right now. I'm just thinking it might nudge her to the future IF things start to turn around in her mind.

Originally Posted By: Maika
I'd err on the side of not acknowledging it.


Somehow I FEEL the opposite - that there isn't too much downside and yet there is a potential upside. I might be totally wrong though. That's why I wanted to have opinions shared, and I appreciate yours, M. Do you think it would come across as being needy, weak, hanging-on and other behaviors we aren't supposed to show WW?


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Pain....only you know your sitch that said my anniversary was last month and I didn't say a word and my W did not reach out to me.

My thought process was that she left, doesn't love me, doesn't want to be with me why on earth would I acknowledge it????

What would you say? When I ran the scenarios in my head I didn't think it put me in a favorable position.


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I'm going to say don't acknowledge it, at least not to her.

Since it is a special day for YOU, maybe treat yourself to some radical self-care. Do something that's fun for you, call a friend and treat friend to a nice dinner, see a movie, but above all, plan the day to be as full as possible, so your mind doesn't have a chance to go there.

My 13th was a week ago today, and neither of us acknowledged it. He must have remembered at some point in the night, b/c the next morning I had a text that said "I totally $ucked up, and I am so sorry."

Not really anything I needed to say back to that. And I've not heard from him since, except for a missed phone call Saturday night (probably to check on the house due to Hurricane Nate) but no message or text when I didn't take the call.

I think based on DB principles, it's best to not contact her. If it means anything to her, she will message, but I wouldn't have any expectations. And anything you do towards her will be seen as pursuit and probably not accepted in a positive light.

It sux, I know. Believe me, I know.


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Originally Posted By: Joseph9
My thought process was that she left, doesn't love me, doesn't want to be with me why on earth would I acknowledge it????


Thanks for the input J9. SAD BUT VERY TRUE.


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Originally Posted By: leahsue
I'm going to say don't acknowledge it, at least not to her.

Since it is a special day for YOU, maybe treat yourself to some radical self-care. Do something that's fun for you, call a friend and treat friend to a nice dinner, see a movie, but above all, plan the day to be as full as possible, so your mind doesn't have a chance to go there.

My 13th was a week ago today, and neither of us acknowledged it. He must have remembered at some point in the night, b/c the next morning I had a text that said "I totally $ucked up, and I am so sorry."

Not really anything I needed to say back to that. And I've not heard from him since, except for a missed phone call Saturday night (probably to check on the house due to Hurricane Nate) but no message or text when I didn't take the call.

I think based on DB principles, it's best to not contact her. If it means anything to her, she will message, but I wouldn't have any expectations. And anything you do towards her will be seen as pursuit and probably not accepted in a positive light.

It sux, I know. Believe me, I know.


Thanks for your story LS. Makes sense; the only thing that stops me from a total agreement is because the gender roles are reversed. All these "love" dates (VDay, anniversaries) were supposed to be initiated by me as a H. I'm thinking it's the case in most families. My W (not yet WW at that time) would expect me to message first even in the best years. And if I didn't (never happened), she'd probably be VERY upset with me but I'm pretty sure wouldn't do it first anyway.

Question though - your H did reach out - late but still - aren't we supposed to reply at the same "level" instead of just ignoring. I understand NC (or LC with kids) idea coming from LBS but wouldn't it have been better to acknowledge his text? Someone did ask in one of the threads - even if a R crosses WAS's mind and try to reach out, why would they want to go back to someone who completely ignores them?


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That would be true, I think, but if you're not familiar with my story, here's a short version of why I didn't respond. My H came to visit (we live 1000 miles apart since January) toward the end of the summer for 2 visits, each about a week. I think he felt my detachment, and got a little nervous that I had moved on, so he made the visits happen. While here, he said all the right things, claims he did not want a D, loves me, sees a future for us, blah blah. We connected physically, like we were newly weds. It was everything I could have wished for, and he asked me not to give up hope for us.

But something didn't feel right to me, especially on that 2nd visit. I knew once he left, it would not be the same, partly b/c we had been so close, that I felt he would need to pull away, as most MLCers do, but also b/c I knew that his job was going to be demanding and all-consuming for the next couple of months. I told him I thought we should both take some time, think about the visits and all that was said, and see where we are when things slow down for him at work.

So basically we have had NC since he left, except for a few business details. Even though I asked for it, it's kind of colored my thinking about the visits. And even though he did eventually reach out about the forgotten A, that was it. Just "I'm sorry, etc." So I didn't feel obligated in the least to respond. It felt like another slap. Now if he had followed through with ANYTHING, not even flowers, etc. (which would be his mode of operation) but even just a card? To me, that's what real "I'm sorry" would have looked like. Not just go right back to ignoring me.

Maybe you're right, and I should have responded, but I've bent over backwards to excuse all the crap, etc. that I've gotten from him since January, and I'm just not doing that any more. If he wants me, he's going to have to full on show me by actions, and not just a random text here and there. Also I have no idea if he's still texting OW all day long, because I gave up my snooping. It was killing me and doing me no favors.

When I think about his lack of concern overall for what I'm doing or where I'm going, and then think about a truly remorseful man who wants to R (like Blu's H), then I'm reminded that if he wants me back, I won't have to wonder AT ALL what his intentions are. He is a compartmentalizer (is that a word?) and always has been, plus we never developed conflict resolution skills in our M, so he puts things on a shelf, and just shuts down. Right now it's all about him, his life up there, his job, and possibly OW. Certainly not me. And the only way I am able to stay sane, detach and move forward with my life is to put him out of my mind. I'm trying so hard to stop giving him free rental space in my head. I'm closer than I was, but not nearly there yet.


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LS - No, I didn't know your sitch at all. It sure made it clear as to why you're not responding to anything from him. Sorry it's like that. He deserves no head rental space - "leaving you basically 3 times (initially and then twice when you thought he was R) - that's really s---ty to say the least. Keep your head high and ignore him.


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Thanks you for your input. You know, that whole conversation made me really re-think the whole thing. And tonight I had a possible "new contact" contact me, and to my surprise, I actually felt like responding. Maybe that is progress toward detachment?

I'm also thinking about taking a full time (temporary, until about May, which I love) job in the state legislature.

Can I go back into an 8-5 workplace after being retired, then being my own boss of my own business, since 2006? We Will See.

You've really made me think, and I thank you for that.

You keep being strong, and know that you have helped someone else on here to see things more clearly.... ME....!!!! LOL. I LOVE this place.


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Painful, have you read DB or DR? How about the links Cadet sent you?


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Originally Posted By: Painful
Originally Posted By: sandi2
About the car .....is it in your name, or both names? If so, then I suggest you protect yourself by keeping it covered by insurance.


The car is in her name only but it doesn't matter; ownership and insurance are 2 independent things (at least in our state). The car MUST be covered by state law and to protect assets in case of MVA. The question is how to tell her to get her own coverage for the car she's driving without a possible s--tshow.


Wait a second, you said she's not asked for CS or spousal support and you want to cut her off for car insurance. (The car is a marital asset, btw).

Uh, do the math and stop letting your pain push you. You want her to feel pressured to file, b/c her having to pay the car insurance or others bills is NOT going to wake her up to the advantages of being married to you. It's going to annoy the crap out of her.

BTW, my h canceled my car insurance and our d's coverage (without notice, of course.) And that violates the court order not to risk marital property and or dissipate assets.

Then he canceled the life insurance I was paying for (came directly out of my bank account and cost him nothing to leave in place. )


I realize the situations are not alike, but I can tell you how I view these^^ behaviors.

Petty, mean spirited, controlling, and cheap. I will never see him the same way again.



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Painful

I think I sounded too harsh in my response above.

I don't know your background stuff except your w is having an affair and has been, for awhile.

I still feel the same about the money issue until a court resolves it. There's a reason your w has not filed or sought support. (I don't know that reason but there is one).

Does she earn a lot? If not, how is she getting by without any support?

What are your GAL?


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Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc

Wait a second, you said she's not asked for CS or spousal support and you want to cut her off for car insurance. Uh, do the math and stop letting your pain push you.


This is exactly what I thought.

Wheree I am anyway, the courts order child support by the number of overnights. It doesnt matter if the kids spend 12 hours with me - if they sleep at my ex's house, then it would be a day there.

We have it set up 50/50 on overnights, and Id say if it goes one or two one way or the other, it's not a big deal and nobody says anything. But I know if they were staying with me 20 nights a month, then it wouldnt really be 50/50 anymore.

My point is that right now, youre at an 85/15 split. My guess is that you are looking at several hundreds of dollars a month - especially if you are the prime earner. Frankly, I wouldnt balk at the 1-200 a month for car insurance if you are getting off without CS/SS.......

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Pain...when my W moved out we sat down and went over our family expenses and lined out who was going to pay for what. I make more than double what my W makes so I have obviously assumed more of the financial responsibility.

She pays for her rent, living expenses, spending money and cell bill out of her monthly budget. She also pays for a portion of our children's afterschool care as well.

I was willing to do this because I knew I would be on the hook for spousal maintenance and child support due to what I make and also because if we split everything 50/50 she would not be able to make it on her own. I was trying to be realistic about it knowing as well she wanted to move out. I did not want to hold money over her head and that be a controlling factor in her reason to stay.

My thoughts was if you want out, lets sit down and discuss finances and how we can make this happen. I hope this makes sense.


Married 14, Together 17
M: 44, W: 43, D: 8, D: 6
M: 46, W: 45. D: 10. D: 8 (CUR)
Bomb Dropped: 5/28/2017
Separation Date: 6/17/2017
Divorce Filed: 2/7/2018
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25, Kaizen, J9 -

Thank you for your responses. It looks to me that all of you are thinking that my asking WW to pay for her own insurance will likely push her to file for D and it's more cost effective for me to prevent it by not bringing the subject up. I've thought of that, and that's one of the reasons I brought this up on this board. OTOH, she hasn't made any moves up to now and I highly doubt that would cause her to be more decisive. Which brings me to:

Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
There's a reason your w has not filed or sought support. (I don't know that reason but there is one).


I know we can't mind guess but does anyone have any theories on this? This q has crossed my mind MANY times as well, and while I have my own theory it's probably way too subjective and optimistic. I'd certainly appreciate any thoughts from objective 3rd parties, particularly from the ladies here as MAYBE they could understand it better.

Originally Posted By: Joseph9
I was trying to be realistic about it knowing as well she wanted to move out. I did not want to hold money over her head and that be a controlling factor in her reason to stay.
My thoughts was if you want out, lets sit down and discuss finances and how we can make this happen. I hope this makes sense.


That's great you were so cool and collected, J9. When my WW was moving out though, I had just found out that she was involved in a long-term PA with someone from our close circle of "friends" and obviously living a double life for all this time. I still don't exactly know how long it was going on but we're not talking a few months but 1-3 YEARS. Additionally, she refused to stop it and wanted to move out. So you can imagine I wasn't nearly as cool as you and my thoughts and actions were - you want out, then you're completely on your own (except expenses for D11). I didn't cancel car insurance b/c it was prepaid for a year last October so I forgot about it in at the time. When I calmed down and remembered about it a month or two later, I decided not to bring it up and be petty or vindictive as 25 described her feelings re her H. And honestly, knowing the OM, I thought that their A would fizzle out quickly in the real world of rent and bills. And yet here we are, it's still going. I doubt that it's very strong as he's still just a booty call rather than a full-time partner 9 months later but again I don't know. But I do know that I really don't want to subsidize her current lifestyle on my own accord. Obviously if she takes it further by filing for D I will have no choice but for now I do. Thus my dilemma.

Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
Does she earn a lot? If not, how is she getting by without any support?

She doesn't, and neither does the OM. That's one of the reasons I didn't think it would go on for too long in the real world as I said above. But I guess between the two of them, for now they have enough to pay for rent, food, and some weekend entertainment. The other reason was and is that they're rejected as a couple by nearly everyone, both their families and most friends. How long can you live in a vacuum? But I guess they're living it up one day at the time; anything else be damned b/c they're "soulmates".


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Nov 2016
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Originally Posted By: Painful

[quote=25yearsmlc]There's a reason your w has not filed or sought support. (I don't know that reason but there is one).


I know we can't mind guess but does anyone have any theories on this? This q has crossed my mind MANY times as well, and while I have my own theory it's probably way too subjective and optimistic. I'd certainly appreciate any thoughts from objective 3rd parties, particularly from the ladies here as MAYBE they could understand it better.






I don't mean to hijack Painfuls's thread, but this little line caught my attention as well. I am 1 year and 4 months into my separation. W has been in a full-blown PA the entire time. They don't live together. There has been no separation agreement, no request for support and no D talked about or filed. I am thankful for this, because I think it would be easier to recon if we are still married.

Anyway, if anyone can chime in on their thoughts on this, I think it could answer Painful's question and I can lurk in for some answers or ideas as well.


M-42
W-40
S-12
D-10
Together-13 years
Married-10 years
Separated-6/2016
ILYBINILWY-7/2016
EA-4/2016 (best guess)
PA-7/2016 (best guess)
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Originally Posted By: Matrix
I don't mean to hijack Painfuls's thread, but this little line caught my attention as well. I am 1 year and 4 months into my separation. W has been in a full-blown PA the entire time. They don't live together. There has been no separation agreement, no request for support and no D talked about or filed.


Wow, Matrix, looks like our sitches are identical except you're 7 months ahead of me. Maybe you can share your thoughts on my original q about no longer paying for WW's car insurance. How do you guys handle financial arrangements? Are they completely separate or are you paying for anything for your WW (or maybe vice versa)?

I definitely wish I'd cancelled it at the outset when everything was "hot" as she was moving out; wouldn't have this dilemma right now. Our current communication is very minimal but civil and neutral. This MIGHT bring it back somewhat to the negative side but then again I remind myself that the WW is carrying on with her A so who gives a s--t.

Originally Posted By: Matrix
I am thankful for this, because I think it would be easier to recon if we are still married.


For sure. And that sums up my own theory on why they aren't doing anything: they may be done emotionally and physically with MR for now but deep down in their brains they have serious doubts about their As ending in happily ever after. And as much as being Plan B is being looked down upon by many, I believe that at least for now it's better than being no plan at all.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Nov 2016
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W and I do not share anything financially. Everything we have is separate. If I were you, I would just pay the insurance again. If it is not big deal financially to you and you pay the whole year at once, I would just do it. No need to cause any big waves at this point. I would just text her when it's paid and say "The insurance came up for renewal and I paid it for the year. Just wanted to make sure that you knew"

I am not sure about the no filing part. I have many, many friends in real life that have gone through a D and none of them went through it this long. Not even close. Most were filed in under 3 months. I don't want to speculate too much on it, but it makes me think there is a reason for it. I think there must be some sort of doubts deep down. It might be doubts about their AP or doubts that they might not want to finalize it all. Lots of room to speculate. Maybe some others can chime in and give their opinions from what they have seen in their lives.

I agree about being plan B for now and not plan zero. I know that if we ever reconed, I would not remain plan B and would again become plan A or the recon would not work.


M-42
W-40
S-12
D-10
Together-13 years
Married-10 years
Separated-6/2016
ILYBINILWY-7/2016
EA-4/2016 (best guess)
PA-7/2016 (best guess)
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Originally Posted By: Matrix
I am not sure about the no filing part. I have many, many friends in real life that have gone through a D and none of them went through it this long. Not even close. Most were filed in under 3 months. I don't want to speculate too much on it, but it makes me think there is a reason for it. I think there must be some sort of doubts deep down. It might be doubts about their AP or doubts that they might not want to finalize it all. Lots of room to speculate. Maybe some others can chime in and give their opinions from what they have seen in their lives.


We're pretty much on the same page, M. Hoping people will chime in with their opinions this time around. Definitely hoping to hear from some of the the ladies on this board.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
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Yeah, Painful. I was hoping some folks might have some insight on the above posts^^^


M-42
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S-12
D-10
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Married-10 years
Separated-6/2016
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Matrix and Painful,

I am not a lady but will chime in. W told me last September she wanted d. I handle all financial and legal things but on this I said if she wanted it then she would have to do the work. She is not comfortable with financial or legal matters. Well, w didn’t file until March and then didn’t complete the paperwork.

I’m just saying this to warn you it may have nothing to do with their doubting or second guessing. We have no idea. Suffice it to say, they are doing what is in their own self interest which may have nothing to do with you.


Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids
2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong
2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2
2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
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Hey Everyone,

Haven't posted in a while even though been following and reading as time allowed.

Anyway, wanted to vent. Exactly a year after BD and 10.5 months after moving out, my WW announced that she wants to proceed with the D. Don't know what's with her and the month of December; for the last two years she makes these life-altering decisions in mid-December. Probably something about starting a new year differently.

She proposed very-very favorable (for me) terms, asked if I'd agree and not contest and said she'd do all the papers and file. I'd be stupid to contest what she proposed, so she obviously wants it done painlessly and in the shortest time (3 months in our state).

Here's the main point of my message today: Even though the possibility was always in the back of my mind, the reality has hit me REALLY hard. Felling very down and distressed again, almost the same as at BD. I guess all throughout I had a flicker of hope that her A would end and she would think about recon but all that seems to be squashed now.

Hate hate hate the thought of losing her, 50% of the time with D11, family closeness, and even the in-laws (with whom I always had a great relationship) FOREVER. I'm pretty sure I know the answer to this q but want to ask: CAN ANYTHING AT ALL CAN BE ATTEMPTED AT THIS POINT TO SALVAGE IT?

Sandi, Arista, Blu, guys -- ANYTHING AT ALL???

Btw, I followed DR techniques pretty well, I think. Other than initial begging and trying to change her mind last year, I've been good at very limited C, no talks about R/A/AP/M, going to the gym, losing 25-30 lbs, GAL whenever possible, being civil and upbeat during kid exchanges, etc.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
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Painful,

If you read enough threads, this is not usually a straight path. You don’t know the future. That’s why they say one day at a time. My w has been on and off the d bandwagon and I don’t know what tomorrow will bring. Do D B for you. She may come back. She may not. She may only come back after D or years later. You never know. So the goal is to be the best you possible. That is attractive, even if your w is the fool who no longer wants to notice.


Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids
2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong
2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2
2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 36
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Gordie,

Thanks for the encouragement. Working towards that goal and I understand it is FOR ME. The pain and frustration comes precisely from the fact that she no longer notices, doesn't want to notice but instead plowing ahead ruining lives around.

Knowing my WW I'm afraid it is a straight path. She waited a year to tell me that she wants to take that step so I'm pretty sure the decision has been made to go ahead and finish it off. The easy terms also show that she wants it done asap. I think she was at the train station figuratively-speaking for all this time but now she's jumping on the train going in the direction away from me. I'm pretty sure she's discussed it with the OM who is promising the world even though in reality he has very little to offer. Should I ask her what her plans are with him wrapping the q with the concern about D11? At this point it seems like the "no talk about A or AP" rule is moot, isn't it?


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Aug 2012
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Originally Posted By: Painful

She proposed very-very favorable (for me) terms, asked if I'd agree and not contest and said she'd do all the papers and file. I'd be stupid to contest what she proposed, so she obviously wants it done painlessly and in the shortest time (3 months in our state).


I know it's awful to go through, but count yourself lucky in this regard. The alternative of going through a long, drawn-out court battle to split the sheets is miserable indeed.

Quote:
I had a flicker of hope that her A would end and she would think about recon but all that seems to be squashed now.


The WAS rarely comes back on the LBS's timeline. This is one of the biggest challenges of DB'ing, the timeline is almost always MUCH longer than the LBS expects and often involves S and or D in the meantime. But there IS always hope, it's there as long as YOU want to hold onto it. Recons happen even years after D.

Quote:
CAN ANYTHING AT ALL CAN BE ATTEMPTED AT THIS POINT TO SALVAGE IT?


Keep working on yourself. Get out and GAL. Put her behind you. Put your future in front of you. Leave her to sort her own mess. It only takes one to D, so if you're asking if you can stop the D, no you can't. But does that mean the two of you are over? It might, it might not. No one can say. It's been over 5 years since BD for me, my XW started showing signs of affection towards me somewhere around 9 months ago. Buying me gifts, making treats for me, etc. She just invited me over for Christmas dinner on Christmas Eve. Sometimes I wonder if she's dropping hints, but honestly I've moved on to the point that I can't picture a recon at all, it just seems like a foreign idea. Anyway my point is not to let D get you down, D is only the end if YOU want it to be.

Quote:
I've been good at very limited C, no talks about R/A/AP/M, going to the gym, losing 25-30 lbs, GAL whenever possible, being civil and upbeat during kid exchanges, etc.


Perfect! Keep it up!


Me: 60 w/ S18, D24, D27

M: 21 years; BD: 06-14-12; S: 09-10-12; D final: 03-17-14; XW:57
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