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First off I'd like to say that I wish (probably like most of us LBHs) I knew more about psychology of WAW, WW, and MLC way earlier before the possible point of no return.

My wife seems to fit most of the "symptoms" to a tee. She was telling me for a few years how she was unhappy. I think I was hitting my MLC years (early to mid 40) while she was still in her mid 30s. Looking back, I definitely stopped being the man that she fell in love with and I can see how slowly but surely she was losing respect then physical attraction then love for me. I became a couch potato not wanting to go anywhere, gaining 50-60 lbs in a few years, not taking care of my health or my appearance. Additionally losing interest in sex and intimacy and I'm pretty sure that was the last straw for her. Our arguments became more and more frequent, and we were often irritated with each other. Somehow I was stupid enough to think that she was obligated to love me anyway and that she wasn't going anywhere.

Little did I know that she was carrying on a EA/PA with a friend of ours for some time (2 years?). As I know now, other "friends" noticed something a while ago but I was completely oblivious to all the red flags and signs of the affair. Then last Dec she told me we needed to separate and she rented an apartment not too far from our house. The main reason is the textbook "I need to think about life and our relationship". She said she rented it starting Dec but I highly suspect now that she had actually rented a few months before that. There was never a talk of her staying in the house and me moving out as it is my separate property in a community property state (purchased before marriage) and her name is not in any of the docs. I'm not sure but it's possible she felt slighted by that and possibly never felt like it was HER house too in all 12 years of M.

She didn't move out right away though and stayed thru the holidays. Right after the New Year's I learned from mutual "friends" the real reason: OM from our circle. He was married with 2 kids; apparently his wife found about the A a while ago, didn't tell me (G-d only knows why), and tried to break them up on her own a few times. When it didn't happen, she kicked him out of the housed and filed for D which was finalized earlier this year. After I found out about the A, I did all the wrong things: talking constantly about our relationship, trying to convince to change her mind and stay, etc. While she seemed to be receptive to having conversations and discussing things with me, she was adamant (in a typical WW fashion as I know now) blaming me for our deteriorating MR and her A. She said she had told me of her unhappiness many times but I didn't want to listen or do anything about it. She moved out about 4 weeks later.

For the first couple of months it was impossible for me not to talk to her and I called to check on her almost daily. It was all small talk as I was trying to come to grips to the new reality. Gave her a huge expensive bouquet of flowers on her birthday in 3/17. After the first couple of months, as I started reading about separations, affairs, and divorces, I started to detach as much as possible and stopped all the calls or texts. D11 was mostly with WW on schooldays (even though I saw her a couple of hours a day after school). On the weekends D was with me and obviously WW was with OM. I assume OM was there during the days too while D was at school. Financially he's a total loser and barely works. During summer break D also spent most of the time with WW during the week. She sent D for sleepovers at friends' houses on Friday nights to spend time with OM and then spent entire weekends with him as I had D on Sat and Sun.

Currently I don't call or text WW at all. She calls me to arrange D's transfer. During transfers initially we had almost NC, now sometimes we have a small chit-chat re D11.

It's been 7 months of limbo and hell. I detached as much as possible, exercise and try to GAL. And yet I constantly think about the sitch, how it all broke down, how I lost my family, and how it affects our D11. I sleep much better than I did in the beginning but I fall asleep and wake up thinking the same thoughts. I felt better 2-3 months ago because I thought their A would fizzle within about 6 months. As that timeframe passed, I started feeling down again with the thoughts re the stitch preoccupying my brain most of the time even when I'm supposed to have fun. GAL is double-edge sword as well: as I'm doing things, I think of how it'd be so much better to do with WW or at least to later tell her about the activities.

Interestingly, there's absolutely no talk from her about the big D. She still (again 7 months) hiding the OM from D11 meaning he's only there when she isn't and vice versa. In a way I'm grateful about it as I absolutely dread D's finding out about him. WW is obviously in charge of her R with OM since he goes along with basically being a booty call. When he's not there, he stays at his parents' house (35 yo guy lol). WW and I never talk about OM or their A. Her family knows about him; they all know him well and are totally against their R. He's not welcome at my M/FIL, S/BIL or cousins-in-law. If WW goes there, she goes by herself or with D. Again, looks like classic "us v. the world" sitch for her and OM.

I've read many threads here and know what I need to do: detach, GAL, LC only concerning D, etc. It's so hard though to get WW out of mind. When I see her during D transfers, it's so hard to believe that she's no longer my W (emotionally or physically), and she's involved with that idiot OM. No one from her family or our friends sees their R going anywhere and yet at least on the surface (and possibly for real) she seems to still be so infatuated w OM and constantly tries to find ways to send D somewhere to call in the OM. As probably most LBHs, I badly want their A to end and see if we can move towards R talks. I do realize that R may not ever be possible and she may be "done" as she tells our mutual friends but at least I want this to be an option which it is not while she's involved with OM.

I guess my Q is how to stay sane and not constantly think about the sitch during this limbo. Also, I'd like to hear people's opinions if I'm reading (hoping) too much into WW not making any moves to end our official M and keeping her R with OM on the back burner.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
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Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.


Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Me-70, D37,S36
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Painful,

I know it's hard, but you haven't fully detach. GAL, make yourself a person only a fool would leave. Don't GAL for your wife, do it for yourself.

This part will be hard and I know. Stop worrying about what she is doing with OM. Live your life to the fullest. Start doing 180s. The more you become a less of an option to her and she see you enjoying life, authentically, the more curious she becomes. You need to start to put doubt in her mind about OM, not with words, but with your actions. If you start to move on and mean it she will notice. In your heart you know what you want. Keep your intentions to yourself.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
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Hi Painful, I wish I could tell you how to wipe those thoughts out of your head. Who do you have to vent your stress and thoughts? Have you considered talking to a counselor who might be able to advise you?

Do you have your daughter every weekend? That seems a bit unfair, IMHO. Maybe that's better for D11, IDK, but it sure seems convenient for the lovers. Have you considered rescheduling where you can have a free weekend sometimes?

Btw, don't be too sure D11 hasn't figured out, or suspects, what's going on. Kids these days are pretty sharp about those type of things.

Do you financially support your W in any way?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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How nice of you to keep her dirty little secret for her. Limbo [censored]. It's soul crushing and it'll literally kill you. This affair prospered because his ex wife and you both kept their secret. Why? Who knows. Affairs almost always die when drug into the light of day/truth so I never understand why people keep the dirty secrets of cheaters. Oh well, all I'll say is limbo will continue as long as you allow it to continue. You get a say in this too and being a doormat will cause your WW to lose whatever shred of respect she has left for you. Nobody ever gets their WS back by being a doormat. Good luck.



The future is as bright as you demand it be.
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Painful,


Sorry to hear what your going through. My W officially moved out a few weeks ago. Funny thing we seem to be fighting more now that she is gone than the whole seven months I found out abiut the A. Right I'm just pissed with her trifiling ways and deceit on her part.

And yet there was a moment last night when I missed the woman who she was. I now this isn't DB advice. But my father advised me that I wouldn't be completely detached until I started engaging more with other women who showed interest in me. That is when you truly realize that there are far better women in this world than W.

And I have to agree with everything TxHubby mentioned. I kept W dirt on the low for so long hoping that W would come back and not have to be ashamed for what she did. But all this did was show weakness in my part and inspires to keep things going on. And probably motivated to engage in cheating with as few other men as well. Now when people ask how W and I are doing, I don't hesitate to tell them the truth about what she has been up to. So don't feel obligated to hide her A, because she is talking bad about you in order to justify her nonsense.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
S14
BD/PA/EA: 12/2016
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Painful,

The limbo is the worst. Only you can decide when you've had enough.
For starters, I would recommend that you do your best to show the world (and your W) that you are moving on without her. That means blowing up your GAL activities. You say you have your D most weekends. While its great that you have that and can work on being an awesome Dad, maybe you can take some time for you. Go on an awesome trip by yourself or with your D. If you go by yourself, that means D has to stay with W and screws up her plans with OM. Perhaps doing both is a good move.

Its true that most A's do go down in flames. With OM being such a complete loser, I have no doubt that will eventually happen here. Its just a question of how long you can wait. And then if it does end and your W comes back, you have to endure the mind F^ckery of knowing that your W chose this complete loser over you for however long it took. You would need to see some serious remorse to get over that one.

If dropping the rope and starting to move on with your life without your W doesn't work and you are tired of living in limbo land, the next thing would be to file for D. But if you do that, it has to be because your are truly ready to end your R and move on without your W. In the end, that's what it took for me and TxHubby. Filing is the nail in the coffin for limbo land. Many people are willing to hang out here for as long as it takes. But it is a horrible place to be. Only you know what is best for you.


Me: 48 y/o
W: 47 y/o
Together: > 20 yrs
BD: Dec '15, then S
2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D
April '16: started piecing
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Painful Offline OP
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TxHubby,

Wth? Did you even read my post in detail??? I know you're one of the vets so I don't mean to be rude.

I never hid the A from anyone. Unfortunately I was asleep at the wheel and was the last one to find out about it. What I said in my original post that his W (now XW) had known about for some time and didn't tell me. Who the h*** knows why. I, ON THE OTHER HAND, HAD NO IDEA until 1/17 after W already had an apartment rented and informed me she wanted to separate. My guess is his XW's reasoning was that if I found out early on then my W and I would separate and my W would go after her husband with a vengeance. I assume she was hoping to end their A by threatening to leave and it backfired on her.

Both W's family and OM's family know about it. Both sides are adamantly against it and I know tried to end it by talking, screaming and yelling at them (separately) on many occasions and yet it only seemed to strengthen their resolve and "soulmate" feelings. Again, looks like "us v. the world" at its finest.

In what way do you see me being a doormat? All the neediness and sappiness I only express on this board. WW NEVER sees any of it during our brief interactions. A realistic advice would a lot more helpful instead.


Me47 W38 D11
M 12yrs
1st BD 3/16
2nd BD 12/16
Confirm PA 1/17 (going on for at least 1 yr, maybe longer)
Separated 2/17
D No talk
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
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Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.


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Originally Posted By: Painful
All the neediness and sappiness I only express on this board. WW NEVER sees any of it during our brief interactions. A realistic advice would a lot more helpful instead.


Take it easy on Tx. He means well.
This board is a great place to come and vent, journal and express all the things you can do with your WW. BUT, if that neediness, etc exists in you on any level, it must be dealt with. So long as it is there, you are emotionally a doormat even if you W doesn't see it. Work hard to detach yourself from the neediness. Once you've done that, you have really begun to move on from your W which is imperative. She HAS to see that she has lost the better man.

Dont be too hard on OM's W for not telling you. I also did not expose the A to OM's W. My reasoning was that I thought he would just go away and my W and I would begin to work on our issues. ALONE. I also wanted to spare OM's W from the devastation I was going through. Was that the right decision? I don't know. Not doing so allowed the A to continue when I thought we were working on our R. But it certainly could have continued even if I did tell his W. She could have kicked him out and he could have moved in with my W. There is just no way of knowing.


Me: 48 y/o
W: 47 y/o
Together: > 20 yrs
BD: Dec '15, then S
2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D
April '16: started piecing
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