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Jim,

You owe your W nothing. So keep your movements a secret for now. If your worried about thinking your W not taking this serious, then being served with divorce papers will snap her back into reality. Then she'll truly realize how bad she messed up.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
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hoosjim Offline OP
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If your worried about thinking your W not taking this serious, then being served with divorce papers will snap her back into reality. Then she'll truly realize how bad she messed up.


Tread, right now I don't have any definitive plans to serve divorce papers on her. I just want to know what my options are and what I should/shouldn't be doing (like NOT moving out) in order to preserve my rights. That is why I was wondering out loud if it might be good for her to "find out" that I am talking to a lawyer.

Right now, my immediate next step, barring some "come to Jesus moment" from her, which doesn't appear to likely-- she was still talking in fairly rebellious, self-justifying terms yesterday-- will be to get her to move out of MBR and then out of house. I have already told her several times I "dont want her around" or "dont want to be near her" or "dont want her sleeping in MBR with me". Last night I reclaimed the MBR for myself but, since it was cleaned off, she insisted on sleeping in there, too. I told her I wanted her out, but she stayed, cried a bit, and kept trying to explain herself in same terms as before: "Im handling this the best I can... I was getting closer and closer to cold turkey and now I have... You hurt me so badly and I suffered so much for all those years and it has only been these six months for you... I needed to do this MY way, not by your rules (As in my boundary of absolutely no contact), etc. etc." I "listened" a bit, but told her a several times I did not want to and was not going to talk about our relationship any more. I finally just ignored her and went to sleep. Guess I'll have to be more of jerk tonight. I could always put a lock on the MBR door, but not sure that's strictly legal.

I have to say that, in general, I feel like I am in a better place than I have been to this point in many respects. I am better, stronger, more physically fit, with more of a "life", and I am pretty much fully aware what a wayward cheater my W has become. Eyes open. I also feel like, should she "Come around", that I have a much, much better chance of having her want to reconcile than I would have had I just dropped the hammer on her in January when I found out about the A. I know the theory goes that "the ealier the better" and "they have to experience loss" but, back in January, losing me would not have been much of a loss. Heck, it wouldnt have been ANY loss. Back then, we weren't even what you would call "friends" and I personally had NO life. Now, other than my MR, I have a GREAT life and, despite the painfulness and potentially counterproductive nature of our positive interactions, my wife now knows and has seen firsthand that I am someone only a fool would let get away. And that simply wasn't the case back in january... quite the opposite. I know the WW mindset keeps her from acting on this now, BUT... if/when she is hit with the "I could lose something" hammer to her head, it is going to be a MUCH bigger hammer now than it was in January. The only question is WON her respect for me has become so buried that there will be no resurrecting it.


H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18

"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7

"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
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And, MLC, I am sorry, but I really find your posts kind of relentlessly negative and demoralizing. Sandi beats me up and hits me with the occasional 2x4, but it is just somehow... different. I am sure you are trying to help, which of course I appreciate, but... doesn't seem all that helpful, and potentially harmful.


Maybe it is timing and how the poster feels when they write, and how the receiver feels when reading it. Actually, you are the first person I have ever known to hint anything less than glowing appreciation for 25yrsmlc posts. Honestly, I can't help but find a little humor here, and I hope she will, too. For years, everyone has seen her posts as being so uplifting and talk about how encouraged she made them feel............but Sandi's were negative, too tough, etc. smile . I understand that it's not humorous to you, but I hope you won't mind. 25yrsmlc and I go back a few years, so she'll get what I mean.

Actually, I think we see personalities in the posts we read here on the board. I wish I had the gift of uplifting and encouragement, but in the meantime...... I try to give insight where I think I can help.....and mainly, wayward wives. If 25yrsmlc sounds a little tougher these days, I'd say it could possibly be due to her personal situation. Ten years ago, her H walked away to pursue a life in Alaska.....but there was no OW. They reconciled, and 25yrsmlc was a shinning example, and frankly, raised the bar for most LBS's (especially in GAL).

Ten years pass and her H enters his second childhood, or has another MLC.....I don't know.......but, this time there was/is another woman involved. He has caused incredible pain for his family (as I'm sure you can identify with that type of hurt) I don't know how to word this the way I want it to sound......but here goes. The display of unconcern; the neglect; the utter selfishness; and the bazaar behavior of a wayward spouse is bad enough to endure. When betrayal is added to that mix, I think (for some LBS's) it gives a tougher point of reference, when they offer advice to a fellow board member. Don't misunderstand what I mean by "tougher", b/c 25yrs has never been any slouch. As someone once told me, there is no other pain quiet like the type that comes from betrayal. Those wise LBS's who are futher down the road from your own situation, can see things in your situation that is too close and painful for you.

When she reads your response, I hope she will smile and think to herself, "Wow, this is a switch, it's usually Sandi's feedback that people don't like". grin

Seriously Jim, you are wanting to hear good things, and that's understandable, but please do not discredit the advice of any woman who has been on the board for a lengthy time, b/c she's probably here to support. Women can tell you things about your W that she (your W) would NEVER tell you.......b/c men can't figure out women. Women are too complex, and men don't have a clue! You would be wise to take to heart and learn from a woman who is telling you how women operate. Cadence sent you a post that gave insight to women. Did you take it seriously, or shake it off b/c it wasn't what your feelings needed at the time? And I am not beating you up, I'm just trying to inform.

Some of us have a sense of humor. Some of us have tender and soothing words of comfort. Some of us speak from experience, and some are just learning. Some give hope and words of encouragement, and some just shoot from the hip. Some sound like angels, and some not so angelic. Most are LBS's, and a few are WAS. Just remember the common thread that ties this community together.

Hang in there, Jim.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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Sorry to hijack the thread.

Sandi2 will you kindly share some of your wisdom on my thread.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2753382&page=1

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How are you doing, Jim?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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Rotten. Feel like dirt emotionally.

I "caved" on separate rooms. She had made areangement to stay with a friend of ours down there but then S18 was NOT staying in dorm after all for orientation. He has OCD answer anxiety disorder and was already stressing about the orientation. He already has some suspicions about W and me and I told W I "wasn't going to put that on him right now."

Back home last night, she was in mbr and asked "do you want me to leav", I said yes but was immediately called away by S17 (tourettes) and when I got back up there she was already asleep.

I have bed giving her cold shoulder but trying not to be an [censored] about it which is a fine line. She made some comment again about "wanting to work on things". I have pretty much been nonresponsive to texts and calls except where kidcare is required.

And then I keep thinking about the betrayal and disrespect it entails. Hurts


H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18

"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7

"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
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Jim, I'm sorry that your having to go through this.. your son's visit to College should be a big deal, but I know how everything going on with your WW can kind of put a shadow on everything else in life.

it will get easier, and isn't permanent, one way or another everything going on right now will be a distant memory and you WILL be happy again.

I think you made a sound decision on the separate room, you did what was best for your son and that is commendable.

The disrespect of your WW is incredulous, to ask you if you want her to leave, get a straight answer, and then completely ignore your desire is abhorrent.

I suspect that hurt you feel about the betrayel and disrespect will turn into anger soon, please be prepared to deal with that and not lash out at your WW. It will not help, and will hurt future chances at reconciliation. Talk to a counselor about dealing with anger before it starts rearing its ugly head.


M - 9 1/2 years
5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA
10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
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Actually, important correction to the above: I did NOT tell W that I " did not want to put that on S18", but rather that " I did not want him to have to deal with that right now." Important distinction, and I had considered my words carefully before telling her, because I didn't want to take any of the responsibility personally for what my son would have to be facing there.


Also,We took S17 down too at last minute and she made a show of laying down next to him on his hotel bed to help him with in summer project he was doing and then going to sleep so she wouldn't be sleeping in the same bed with me.S18 asked if I wanted him to wake her up and I said no let her sleep. She of course made a point of mentioning this later,saying "I figured you'd prefer we not be in the same bed.


I sense another attempt to "talk" coming tonight. Right now, I have told her I am not interestep in talking about MR (don't trust her enough). But have been in the position of listening a couple of times. Monday, after most recent blow up, when she had supposedly called OM to "say they couldn't talk anymore so she could figure out things with hoosjim", she asked me "what else do you want from me", to which I responded "I don't want anything ftom you, I don't trust you. If YOU want ME to trust you, if there is ever to be any hope of that, I would need you to come to me and say "what do you need me to do", and mean it, and then be willing to follow through. In other words I'd need you to prove it." And that's where that kind of got left.

My question is... what should I be needing to see from her demeanor-wise to give her any kind of access? I can't see anything she would say or do that would make me want to stop the separation progression. But is that maybe too harsh and inflexible?

Incidentally, Goin line dancing tonight, if I can spend a little early quality time with kids. First night in a while it's been cool enough for jeans and boots...

Last edited by Cadet; 07/28/17 09:52 AM. Reason: Combine posts

H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18

"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7

"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
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Hello hoosjim,

Originally Posted By: hoosjim

My question is... what should I be needing to see from her demeanor-wise to give her any kind of access? I can't see anything she would say or do that would make me want to stop the separation progression. But is that maybe too harsh and inflexible?

Incidentally, Goin line dancing tonight, if I can spend a little early quality time with kids. First night in a while it's been cool enough for jeans and boots...


This is an excellent question for your DB Coach. Please give me a call when you would like to schedule a session.

Have fun line dancing tonight!

Cristy
Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004


A Divorce Busting Coach can help you save your marriage, even when your spouse wants out.

Email virginia@divorcebusting.com or 303-444-7004 for more information or to get started right away.
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Jim,

I'm guarded in posting to you, b/c you do lash out when it's not what you want to hear or it's literally skimmed over. I'm not here to tell you to get a divorce.

I'm advising you as best I can, in a way that is most likely to help you restore your m. It's not about just living in the same house, is it?

Nope, I am not saying it'll work out. I'm saying I literally believe an approach of appeasement is not likely to result in a lasting marriage. Your w had valid reasons for her marital dissatisfaction that's just not relevant now,IF you are owning it and IF she wants to be m.

Your recent interaction on the phone was solid boundary setting. I complimented it, btw.



I sense another attempt to "talk" coming tonight. Right now, I have told her I am not interestep in talking about MR (don't trust her enough). But have been in the position of listening a couple of times. Monday, after most recent blow up, when she had supposedly called OM to "say they couldn't talk anymore so she could figure out things with hoosjim",


Don't freak, but Other than her relayed version of a call, is there evidence that this conversation took place? Why wasn't it made in front of you?


she asked me "what else do you want from me", to which I responded "I don't want anything ftom you, I don't trust you. If YOU want ME to trust you, if there is ever to be any hope of that, I would need you to come to me and say "what do you need me to do", and mean it, and then be willing to follow through. In other words I'd need you to prove it." And that's where that kind of got left.

so she asks what you want from her, and you say nothing. But then you say you want her to ask you what you "need from her, and mean it and then follow through"? Follow through on what? I mean, this^^ is confusing to me.

My suggestion is to know what you want and clearly communicate it. No more retractions or modifications or partials. It's not neurosurgery if the person really wants to recommit.

The one thing clear in Blu's thread (and 10 years ago for me), was that the WAS wanted back in and at least said and did things showing that. I wish we had pieced more deeply and consistency, but that's for after the reconciliation - and you are not there yet.

The point I have been making (and I am not alone in making it, btw)

is that your wife does not yet seem committed to reconcile. Let alone to piecing...

So where does that leave you? Is there a time line for you?




My question is... what should I be needing to see from her demeanor-wise to give her any kind of access?

(access to what?) As for what you "should be needing", I think the question is what do you need?


I can't see anything she would say or do that would make me want to stop the separation progression. But is that maybe too harsh and inflexible?


Why not clearly specify some actions from her that you would need to work on the m?

Make sure they are important and clear, and make sure you are truly ready to act if she cannot or will not comply.


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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