Count on ups and downs (IV)

[WillDo]

Last Thread:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2733327#Post2733327

[WillDo]

Summary:

I have been working on saving my marriage for the last 3 years. While I see the situation as my W's midlife crisis, I acknowledge my misbehaviours and having reading on how to change things around. Recently, had a down and W now wants separation. I agreed to move out and spend some time on our other flat. Haven't started yet. Will be away in US for 6 weeks with whole family.

She has threatened of filing divorce and in her terms going nasty. I have a history of depression which has caused a certain part of the marriage dissatisfaction. W has IMHO has blocked me out during the upbringing of our twins and felt I had abandoned the family during my temporary assignment in another country. Deep down I sense the MIL had an impact on her regarding these actions. During my assignment, she developed an affair with OM. Now I see her on online dating sites.

[WillDo]

Couldn't sleep again although I excused myself to go to bed early since I have been sleepless for sometime. W on top of the cold soar she said she had her peiod early. That does explain her mood against me back few days. That monthly cycle of mood swings is so real. I had one point had it in my calender to track mood.

I have to scream loud. I don't want separation. Denial, No accpetance but mine is law of attartion Ask and it is given.

I have decided to do more changes in my life to give focus on myself. I had listed some radical changes I had done on my previous thread. As in the 180 list, no going back. Some more.

Less interaction with my phone. I am using it now. Hard to type. Now back to reading from my kndle. Finally downloaded No More Mr Nice Guy fully. You read yourself but haven't come to the stage what to do about it.

Thank you for listening.

[WillDo]

So No More Mr Nice Guy. Sandi has been an advocate of this book. Nice Guy is a term my W, my friends and my colleague have said about me. A teacher of my had once told me to my face that I would be a great diplomat. Saying No More really felt that that would not help me. I incorporated plenty of change from DR, another book and influence on this forum. While I had results, I see now how I am in a cheeseless tunnel. Doing the same things over and over again.

[roist]

I will be interested in your thoughts when you have finished that book.

I am glad you see and want to get out of that cheeseless tunnel.

You have mentioned the law of attraction a few times. Are you doing anything on that? The mindset is only the first step.

Best wishes

[WillDo]

My impression has been really good for the book. I found myself and the solutions are good. Methods that would not be foreign for people like us searching our souls.

Law of attraction. Had even been to a Hicks seminar. Though had been too involved n DB had forgotten about the concepts I do bring them back:
You are who you arr and that is ok. It is the feeling first then manifestation

On a note today our interaction was great. The trip is keeping the excitment. We talked again about moving out (she started the conversation). I talked about my feelings. She is not aligned with me. So kept DBing with her. It was awkward. She properly feels in control of this marriage now. I will read my old posts.

[WillDo]

The mood has again been good. As a family, we went to the flat and gave it a good clean and had lunch there. Looked at options for renting out for 2 months. For one tenant I hoped she had said even a year. I was mistaken.

The theme of the book is love yourself first. Have your priorities met first. One other point that is making sense is toxic shame that you feel when you know things are wrong and how you conceal that wrong behaviour. You say different things to people. You aren't really nice.

My very first therapy tackled all these and I always think this how I build my current relationship. I dipped back into the blackhole of depression again. While feeling everything was OK, as Michele nicely puts W must have been doing an escape plan. Nice guys are caretakers. W did caretaking. Maybe that was too nice for her and felt self had gone.

My head wants to switch to begging mode. The interaction is good. Darn. I at one point looked unhappy. She asked me what is bothering. I said I felt very thirsty. Toxic shame. Now that is the dilemma of the teachings for me. Validating, boundries, detachment, last resort technique and Mr Nice Guy.

[WillDo]

It has been an interesting day.

I had agreed to move out to start separation. This has been
after I gave in as W started saying that she would file for D otherwise. Why not move out now?
As a family, we will be in US for 6 weeks. W will be attending a course there. The plan had been to move out to the flat that we normally rent out. Yesterday, when cleaning the flat, W started saying depending on who moves to the flat... Well the day before she had me on the hook to move. This morning MIL called and asked about the house. She said it would be good if you had it with an agent. Almost 5 minutes after she hang up, W suggested using an agent. I'm not off the hook but not to the flat.

And tonight we had a chat. She said I was making her feel bad about the move. I said I know I am feeling bad. Then she started talking about events where she felt sad because of me.I listened and apologised. What more can I say? I don't want another conflict.

I suppose I will be at a nearby hotel or rent a room.

I also don't want to read into anything.

In terms of GAL, continue to avoid phone but do reading. my readings highlight the importance of loving yourself almost 3 different proses. That is my focus. And Law of Attraction. In the morning I felt it was really working.

[peacetoday]

Hi

I dont know your full situation but you may want to consult a L- this doesn't mean you will file or even tell your wife
its just to learn the facts and the law in your situation
many L here do free consults and they give a ton of great information
I saw a L early on so but he time my xh Filed..I had a very good L in place
I knew my rights ..I got to keep my house //I could protect my kids from his craziness
I saved our business

jGo -just to see your options, especially if you do move out

I would hate to see you at a nearby hotel to renting a room
especially if you own another flat
its better to know what your options are just in case in comes to D
the MLCer will try to take everything they can with no concern for the LBS or the kids
protect your assets and your self

the MLCer will do what they will regardless if we are nice or not

[WillDo]

Thanks. Your previous update had made me notice to incorporate Law of Attraction more in my life again.

This will be better. The kids will not change their spot. No need to explain to neighbours at other flat plus too many memories there. Yesterday, at a point she asked what I would do. I said rent a room. She ssid I wouldn't share things. I had already been working hard all day. The conversation brought me down. I was so tired that while doing diy broke a mirror. Didnt want anythin else.

I turn to being positive bit dieing inside.

I will see about my options.

[peacetoday]

Sorry for your pain
I know how hard it is

all I can say is as much as I didn't want to separate or have XH leave the house for good
It definitely was easier living without his negative hurtful energy around

so If the situation and living together seems too difficult-living separately may be better
but I wouldn't leave if it were me till I knew my rights financially

will she be keeping the kids

[WillDo]

She wants to have the kids. Hence asking me to move out to be less desruptive to them. You are pointing out that moving out is not simply going somewhere else to live. Will need to detail it all out to see the financial implications. Thanks!

[roist]

What do you want? A R with W is not an option right now. Ginen that what do YOU WANT? Take time to figure this out.

How often will you see your kids?
Her having full custudy can mean a bigger monthly cheque from you.
Financial questions about mortgage(s) need to be finalised. Are you going to pay rent and continue paying half the mortgage? Do you pay only half now?

Catering for what W wants should not even be a consideration for you now. It is time to MAN up and make a stand for what you want. Your future could depend on it

Best wishes

[WillDo]

I don't know what to say. Not much has changed. I started getting therapy after I came back. Under pressure to move out.

[WillDo]

I want to feel good. I have read over again and will do again. I will change. That is why I chose therapy again despite the cost and the ongoing disrespect of my wife. She sees it as waste of money and tginks I should spend it at getting a better place. I can't respond still but hoping that I will get the mindset. Still finding acting as if useful. Makes me less tense.

[Sotto]

Hi WillDo, I'm glad that you decided to choose therapy again as getting to a better place yourself is the primary aim here - whatever your spouse may be doing.

I notice your timeline is similar to mine - though we S at BD and XH pressed ahead with D which finalised last year. It wasn't what I wanted, but in a way is easier than a long term in-house situation like yours. You may find it helpful to read Gordie's thread as he is also living with his spouse.

So, if we go back to DB basics - GALing, which leads to detachment, working on you, 180s - can you tell us a little bit more about how things are going here??

Have you seen any movement WRT your relationship over this time? Is your W still focused on separation? You mentioned her disrespect and I wondered how you respond when you feel she is disrespectful?

Tell us a little more and hopefully we can help...this site has certainly played a bit part in helping me get to a better place. I recently read that the path to happiness is to focus on these three things - self love, love for others (having good connections with friends and family, animals - which may or may not include a romantic relationship) and doing things you love.

I would add to this - practicing gratitude - and I also found Shawn Achor's TED talk really helpful for 5 things you can do if you want to feel better - meditate, exercise, gratitude, journal about a positive thing yesterday and an act of kindness. I think what you focus on grows, so if we focus on our errant spouse and the 'difficult' situation - our whole life feels difficult - but if we focus on the abundance in our lives separate to our spouse, that grows too....not easy by any means, but possible...

Take care and I hope the weekend brings some little moments of joy for you. :-)

[WillDo]

I recall your thread back when you started. Hope you are feeling good about where you are.

This forum has certainly opened my eyes. I know that I got frustrated from time to time and couldn't act as possibly advised. I got more convinced that I fitted into the Nice Guy Syndrome and wasn't really good looking after myself. Actually I still am not. Still early days for the sessions.

W wants me out by the end of this month. I feel like it would be better for me to stay still. But I had an episode of reading into m W and it didn't end good. Disrespect. I still can't confront. Don't want to create a fire. One of the interesting things of therapy was I had talked about what was going on with someone. Not on a forum. A real person listening. Did do it before but now it sounded wow what has been happening. I am very angry!


Yes gratitude. I use the gratitude rock as told in "The Secret" I am reminding myself the law of attraction focusing on my wellbeing.

I do get panic attacks and I do see myself depressed but not like how I used to 10 years ago.ie not clinically depressed. I have my methods.

I really need to get myself back out.

Thanks so much for your message.

[WillDo]

I am reading Gordie. I really don't want to move out buf as I eminded myself reading there resistance will push her. She is controlling everything. I fill like a nanny. She told me her dates when she is working and asked me to cover. But again asked a out my room hunt. I am looking for a place close by but struggling with the idea. Especially after all I have done. That os where I see the Nice Guy Sendrom. I have been nice but again disn't get respect. For 5 weeks in US slept at 11 woke up at 4 to handle my work, the kids and her work. We were there during vacation as part of her work.

[roist]

Why do you feel that it is best for you to stay?

If you believe what you read about being a nice guy, what do you think of the action points in that book?

"Especially after all I have done". This indicates that you are doing things for the wrong reasons. You cannot nice your way back into her good books and you certainly should not expect her to do anything just because you do X Y and Z.

You still appear to be putting her needs and family needs before your own. Until you realise your own self worth and put that as a priority for you, you risk to remain stuck.

You cannot save your M........... unless you save YOU first. You are half the M equation. Fix yourself. Both of you need to be emotionally healthy to build a R. So if she was ready tomorrow,yyou won't be. Start working on you. NOW. It will take time. Secondly you will have a better chance of re-attracting her if you are a self confident, non-dependant man with appropriate boundaries.

Reread the advice you have received since being here. People are trying to help you, but you are stuck and cannot act. Your W has consistently and constantly stated she wants you out. I won't repeat the opinions on who should move, but the current situation is like she feels ignored and her decision is not accepted. That is her sole focus and she cannot move forward as long as the current situation continues.

Sorry if I am being harsh but I am doing so to help you.

Best wishes

[WillDo]

Thank you for your remark.

Choosing to find a psychologist and work with him was my decision. That is the first rule of getting out of the Nice Guy Syndrome.

Being self-confident? I have achieved that with a psychologist before. Therapy is something I believe helps. When you face depression, that is the message you get as well. Look after yourself first. I have not been able to master tgat in life. That I know of. But I am where I am and that is OK.

[WillDo]

I find it strange where my W refers to the fact that she is having a MLC.

Yesterday, we were with friends. She talked about her interest to quit work since she was having an MLC and even she might do new things without me. I noticed that I had been the one who has built up a thick skin to what she has been saying. I certainly didn't say anything and the couple who we were with didn't comment. It is the couple's second marriage and are dealing with a special needs child. Amongst the things we complain about my W said, she said we should be grateful.

Nevertheless, she was grateful towards me today and sent a message asking me not to do as I wish.

You know what I will write about positive aspects from now on rather than triggers that bring me down. At least ways to reformat the trigger.

That is the change I am doing. Looking after myself.

[WillDo]

Out for lunch and pampering myself.

Burger and Shake at TGIs. Monday with. Friday feeling.

[WillDo]

I have to stay still keeping the positive vibe.

However, today I did tell her that I didn't see me moving out as a good option and had a long conversation. Painful. I had been to therapy today so was already ready in my mind what to say and how to react. Specifically not to get lost in WORRY.

At least something off my chest.

[roist]

Best wishes mate.

I didn't follow everything you said. What did she mean by don't do as I wish.

It is good she realises she is in mlc. Admitting/acknowledging that is a great first step. Realising that she can do something about it though may take some time.

Continue on your path towards gratitude and positivity

[WillDo]

A quick note. I continue to go to therapy and apply gratitude and positivity. I come here when I am counting down. I read through a 12 month intimate chat conversation with OM. I was right and much more physical than I thought. Sexting to details you would say hardcore. Under my nose. I must have sensed pretty strong 4 years ago and reacted. Chat stops when I had confroned her. I say time has past but I do know there is still contact with OM. I don’t feel to open up too
much right now but wanted to record it for the forum whoever reads. I still believe in the marriage but remind myself I can only work on myself. Thanks for listening.

[WillDo]

I am finding it hard to cope. My therapist is on holiday. Waiting for him to return. I feel broken in all angles; wife, work, mother. brother, friends. All my relations are in turmoil. İ try to control tue worry but my mind is getting tired.

[Sotto]

I'm sorry you're having a hard time at the moment WillDo. Sometimes it is all we can do to keep breathing in and out and take things a day, hour, minute at a time. That is all you need to do just now - nothing more. You don't need to fix any relations that you feel are in turmoil - only exist and do the basics - sleep, eat, work and care for children if you have them.

When the worry thoughts start, do you have some strategies to manage them? Many, many people find physical exercise calming. I sometimes run a hot bath. Or post her. Or journal. Or listen to inspirational podcasts, or meditate, some yoga. I found working with my hands helpful too.

You need do nothing more than find ways to manage your anxieties and soothe your weary mind. Soon your therapist will be back and you can explore how you have been feeling together, and how you can best move forward.

I do hope you'll be feeling much better soon. Know that you are not broken, merely doing your best during challenging times.

[WillDo]

Mindfulness is my strategy. Thank your for fhese words. I needed them. You have a great heart.

Willdo

[WillDo]

I continue to maintain my positive state despite of the recent reality that I have witnessed.

I bought Michele's latest book Healing from Infidelity.
Specifically Chapter 8: When your spouse won't end the affair.

The book talks about it and my therapist has been asking about it. To open up to a friend who would support my marriage. I really don't have anybody. I can only reveal what I am going through in this forum and to my therapist. My therapist admitted not being experienced on affairs. I didn't go to him for that. I went there to find myself. So don't want to open up to anybody.

[WillDo]

[WillDo]

Witness one more thing. A pregnacy test

[WillDo]

I know she was out with OM last night. I snooped. Shouldnt have. My therapist is really on my side now. He also suggested me not to snoop. He asked how he can trust me. I told him though he shouldnt. But I found other things to focus on. Yes now wrtiting this message but at ease a bit. Read again their conversations deom 4 years back. I think the therapist wanted me to delete those and never mentiin it to my wife. Ok I wont. I would say I feel she has been unfaithful. I read my journal from 4 years back. There are notes that she openly denies an affair. Lies lies everywhere. Last night in her conversation she mentions how she would be in trouble about what she is doing. of course OM engourages the opposite.

God possibly sent the conversations at a better time. Wanted me to accept what is going on. I think I did and hence did the changes but my spirit wouldnt have been able to handle the full extend of the conversations back then.

The affair is out there again and I pray for pafience.

[Gerda]

Willdo, we are in a similar boat, in house and BD at almost the same exact time. I used to snoop. One snoop was the day I came home from a mastectomy and saw texts where he called OW "my secret other wife." He had been so scared when I was on operating table that he contacted her and she was comforting him that I would be okay!!! Then the A continued after that until recently, if it isn't still going on.

I tell you that just to point out to you that whatever is happening is going to be as repulsive and horrifying as it can get, and looking at it is not going to change anything. I would feel my whole body go into shock and be sick for days when I snooped. When I chose to give it to God and just not look anymore, I felt peace. Sometimes the panic hits me and I have struggled, but I assure you that if you start thinking of your temptation to look as the darkness winning, you can begin to do proper battle. I think because you mentioned God you may be standing through faith, and if so, remember that the devil is the one who is tempting you to look. God just wants you to trust Him. The despair you feel when you look is not from God. Every time you want to snoop, you can just say, "Not today, Satan!" or whatever you come up with and then blast some praise music or if you are not into that, force yourself to do something else that is positive and beautiful, even if it's just cleaning out a cabinet but maybe even doing something nice for a neighbor. Over time you will not want to snoop as much. Tim Keller has a great sermon on how having faith in God's judgement is the only way you can possibly forgive; if you can find it, I think it will give you some light! Do you get the Charlyne cares e-mails? Those help me a lot too, especially when I am lonely. If you are a person of faith, ask your pastor to help you find a prayer partner, maybe an elder with a restored marriage. Please know that I know just exactly how you feel! You are not alone!

[WillDo]

Verda thank you for your sweet words.

I will apply these when the urges kicks in.

Once I read the undiluted recently from some messages my sense of trust has collapsed. On top of that I see colognes at work showing untrustful behaviour including my boss. He cut 40% of my bonus. I feel betrayal on every level hence the urges came back. My journey is now to regain trust me in myself.

[WillDo]

[WillDo]

oh really post didnt work! simply we argued and she naaid she felt bad. She sees me after her money. I am wishing the best

[WillDo]

Patience and silence. All I am trying to do is Save My Marriage.

[Gerda]

[WillDo]

something is wrong. I dont see forum updates. entries are blank

[job]

Will,

You've not been around much in the last 4-5 weeks. The forum is experiencing a glitch, i.e., which creates missing postings. We are trying different things. I would suggest that you not use quotes, numbers, hashtags or any type of characters which posting. Also, if you should post something and it doesn't appear, go to the quick quote box, click on it and remove the quotes and then hit submit.

Unfortunately, the moderators can offer suggestions as this is an IT matter at the main location of the business.