Flotsam, part II

[OwnIt]

Fight, I can assure you that as time goes by this will be easier and your concern for him will come to an end.

He is beginning, for the first time, to experience the consequences of his actions. You did not do this to him. Continue on your own path.

[FightOn]

OwnIt - "He is beginning, for the first time, to experience the consequences of his actions."

That is what I was thinking.

So last night he ambushed me again. After I put S to bed I went into the garage to retrieve some things from my car and he was standing at the kitchen counter with a notepad and some papers in front of him. He said he wanted to know if now would be a good time to discuss the divorce.

Is it me, or is he just not listening to me?

Is it me, or is this a control thing with him?

Maybe I wasn't clear enough the first time? Perhaps he didn't hear me when I said we should pick a day and time to discuss this? Maybe I need to say it again?

Or is he pushing my boundary?

I replied as calmly as I could that no, it wasn't a good time and either later in the week or next week would be better for me. He asked why I didn't want to discuss it then and there.
My response to him was that I have a big project due at work on Wednesday and that is where my focus was at the moment.

So I got punished this morning for not wanting to do things his way. He made a jab at me because I left a fish oil pill on the counter and S reached for it. He said I should know better. I didn't respond. Then, I put a t-shirt with a bulldozer on it on S and H kept trying to correct me telling me it was a digger. Really? I didn't respond.

As I type this I realize, well, at least he isn't indifferent to me (because that is the opposite of love). He is obviously very angry at me. At least that is the way I see it. Very passive aggressive.

So as I heal and work through my issues, I keep in mind that this behavior is all about him and not me. This childish/teenagerish behavior is just where he is emotionally at this point in time. I didn't cause this behavior. He, like me, can choose how to respond. He does have choices.

He can treat me with dignity and respect, he can be kind, he can move out, he can treat me the way he is treating me. There are so many choices available to him.

For me, I can respond in kind. I can be mean, vindictive, spiteful, etc. Or I can kill him with kindness. Or I can ignore it and continue on my way.

I am doing my best to ignore it and continue on my way.

I know I am still not as detached from him as I would like because this does bother me. Although not as much as it once did. Six months ago I would be really angry, now I am . . . frustrated.

On the positive side, I am trying to reframe this in my mind so that I look at it as an opportunity to learn to detach from other people's behaviors. To really learn that what other people say or do is not about me; it is about them.

[OwnIt]

Fight, I struggle too with the whole indifference vs. anger. Mine feels a tremendous amount of anger at me. Great vats of steaming, bubbling, toxic rage. Is that good? Does that mean he still cares? If so, I wish he didn't. I think indifference would feel so nice.

Narcissists crave CONTROL over all else. Mine controls me by not letting me talk. We will talk, as we did, this weekend. Then he tells me he is done talking and won't respond to me until the next day. Then I don't respond to him, yada yada yada yada. How do I get out of that game? How do you?

Do you really think talking to him is going to resolve anything on the custody or spousal support issue? I think not. I think it will just keep that simmering vat boiling over. I would tell him straight up that the lawyers will handle this. In the end it will be cheaper and save your sanity. My friend finally convinced me to stop talking to him about anything other than the kids and tell him anything else has to go through lawyers. I finally feel better. I set my ring tone to silent, my text tone to silent, and no vibration from him. I won't panic one more time when I hear one of those tones.

You have your plan. Keep things calm. Get out of the house. When you get down the road a little, work through lawyers to put a close on this.

Once you aren't in the same house and don't have to listen to him contradict you on a T-shirt image or imply that you are a horrible parent because god forbid your child could have ingested one fish oil capsule, your life will change to such an extent and you will be able to breathe in a way you haven't in your marriage.

You are getting closer my friend. Your freedom awaits. Lest you question your actions (and remember he put all this in motion) I will say that the further I've gotten from this, I see that my children are treating me in some ways as he always has. I'm shutting that down cold. You don't want your son to grow up like him. That simple.

[FightOn]

I am back again today. Lol!

OwnIt - thank you for standing beside me while I go through this. Your insight helps prop me up when I need it most.

Sometimes I too think indifference would be nice. But there is a part of me that is holding onto hope that he will come out of this and we can work on salvaging the relationship. Unrealistic? Yes. Naïve. Probably. But I am still hanging onto it.

My H is a cop. Cops need control. It's how they survive on the street. It is a game. How do you get out? You just stop.

As they say . . . detach (as if I am one to talk). Don't let it bother you. Let them make their choices, you make yours.

You are right about resolving the child custody issue and spousal support. (I just asked for spousal as a throw away issue - I will never get it. We make the same.) We probably won't resolve it on our own.

Maybe if I am nice to him and approach him. Maybe if I make things easier on him, he might be more willing to concede on the one issue that is most important to me (custody time). Doing so would defy the advice of those on here that say it's his divorce, let him do the work.
Am I just being naïve to think making things easier for him might cause him to give me something I want?
Am I being a defeatist when I say that I don't think being nice and making things easier is going to make one bit of difference? Do I just not want to be nice and this is just an excuse for me?
Am I torturing myself? YES!!!!

I can feel the little girl in me pulling me back toward old patterns and old ways of doing. As I walked to get some lunch, I thought to myself, I should face it and give up everything. Give up trying to change myself and the dance between H and I. I thought it would really be much easier to just respond the way I always have --> which is to spout off without thinking. It really is so much easier to just default to what we know. It is so much harder to fight that default setting and do something differently.

Maybe me being silent and just not responding is a positive step in the right direction. I am learning restraint - the first step toward learning to respond, not react.

Or am I just being a chicken? Being a chicken would be just giving up. Afraid to change.

Part of me wants to approach H and set a date and time to discuss the particulars (then during the meeting just sit back and let him do the talking, then tell him I need to think about what he has said).

But another part of me thinks I should let him make the effort. This is what HE wants, then he needs to do all the work. That is the approach suggested by many on these boards. My issue with this approach is that meanwhile, he cuts me down. Mentally, I find myself having to fight the urge to verbally joust with him. Then I feel frustrated because I cannot say what is truly on my mind. I am left defenseless.

Oh my. That is it!!!! I feel defenseless. Just like I did when my mother would go on one of her tirades and beat me.

Wowzers. I am recreating that old dynamic with my mother.

So how do I change the dance steps? What can I do differently?

Let's see, I can step up and talk about setting up a meeting. Or I can let him come to me and in the meantime, change the way I see this.

(And let's face it; any meeting is bound to not go well.)

I need to keep my focus on this as a learning experience. I have things I need to learn. If I approach him, I am doing what I always do. Charge forward. Which feels good to me. I feel a measure of control. Almost like I am impacting the direction of this whole thing. But that is just a false sense of control. I don't have control over where this is going. God has control.

So what is God telling me?

I get the sense he is telling me to do the thing I don't want to do; the unfamiliar. I need to wait until H comes to me. Continue to work on me. Focus on me. What's the rush anyway?

How do I know if this is really what God is telling me? How do I know if my instincts are genuine and not a product of what I want? Where can I look to for reassurance?

[bttrfly]

I understand. Naive? Not sure it's naive. Hopeful is how I'd characterize it. And I don't think it will work.


Pragmatic, not defeatist. Realist, not defeatist. As for it being an excuse, only you can answer this honestly. This process is painful and very difficult. Go easy on yourself. xoxoxo

This is your chance to break that pattern for good by speaking directly to that little girl and letting her know you've got this and you're going to try a different way. There's another way to look at this: By saying nothing and not engaging you are actually gaining strength. It's counter-intuitive but true. AND if it's a 180 for you, it makes them NUTS. (on a day when you may not be feeling saintly, that's not a bad thing)
This is your "AHA" moment of the day. Pause and let it sink in for a moment, just a moment, and realize how much you've grown to realize this! Congratulations!


Let him do the work; this is his divorce.

[Quote=FighOn]I need to keep my focus on this as a learning experience. I have things I need to learn.

Look at my signature.


Posting this was a good first step. I think you're on to something. I think your instincts are sound. Keep the focus on you and your side of the street. Let him handle the divorce. Most of all, this gives you the time and space to really think about what it is you want most, what is most important to you. And it may be more than just custody time. As this continues, other things may become important as well. Reacting is always from a place of weakness. I'm glad you recognize this.

When you want to react, come here and post instead. xoxoxoxo Hope this helped.

[bttrfly]

sorry i didn't do the best job quoting. hope you understand what I'm trying to say here. xoxoxo

[Gordie]

Trust that quiet voice. I believe it is divine. You are doing awesome!

[OwnIt]

Fight, you have to do what feels right. I feel like today, without meaning to, I'm kind of mixing it up. A little quiet, a little compliant, a major offensive, and then a little business to keep it interesting. I'm trying on different skins to see what feels good in terms of dealing with him. That's the luxury of no longer giving a flip about DBing.

I still have this dyspeptic feeling inside that tells me I'm not happy and not settled (and how could I be when my sweet S may be hearing we aren't moving after all). I know its naive, but I feel a seed change coming. I think if I keep bugging him he will do something. I gave him 11 months of basically no contact and got nowhere. Now I'm going to be super annoying.

[FightOn]

Thank you Bttrfly, Gordie and OwnIt. I appreciate your responses.

I really appreciate the validation and the support you are expressing about following my instincts. At times during all of this I feel like such a child. It's like I don't know what is right or wrong and I definitely do not trust my instincts. And I get angry at myself for allowing H's actions to impact me and question them.

He has repeatedly told ME that I live in fantasyland. And because of my FOO issues, I believe him. In order to survive my childhood, I placed all the blame on me. Children cannot blame their parents; they cannot see their caregivers are being the ones at fault, so they blame themselves.

So when H says these things to me; I believe him. It is difficult for me to accept that someone I was once close to and proclaims to care about me, could be wrong. Therefore, it must be me.

This is a difficult hurdle for me to jump over.

I am also finding that I still get bothered when I see him on the phone or when I hear his message alerts. I really don't like it.

Wednesday night after I put S down for bed, when I came out of his room, I noticed H had vanished. He wasn't inside the house or out in the yard; he wasn't in his personal car or his work car. Just gone.

I had noticed he was acting off while giving S a bath, but I didn't say anything. If he wanted to tell me what was bothering, then he can make the choice to reach out.

I was really worried. We live in an area with a lot of remote hiking trails. Given everything going on, I was concerned he went for a hike and was going to hurt himself. I called his cell and he didn't answer and I text and he didn't answer.

An hour later, he texted me to say he was fine and that he went for a walk. (Of course, my mind thought, "yeah right, you went to call one of your OW.")

I was in bed reading when he finally returned. He banged on the front door to get in the house (he didn't take keys with him). By the time I walked to the front door, he had moved around to the back of the house and was pounding on the back door. I couldn't see a thing and kept calling out, but he wouldn't respond. He turned on the flashlight on his phone and I saw his face so I let him in.

He has never done something like this before.

He brushed right past me and grumbled something about "of course all the doors are locked for the first time." I told him I was concerned about him and next time could he please just leave me a little note. He got angry and spewed about how I don't leave notes when I leave and nothing about our relationship has changed. I let it go. I told him I was glad he was all right and went back to bed.

I have been pondering the "nothing has changed" comment. From my perspective, much has changed. Nevertheless, I do think this is a kind of MLC script. He wants to know where I am at and what I am doing, but he will not reciprocate. And I think it is more justification for him.

Someone was definitely looking for a fight and it certainly wasn't me.

Thursday morning before he left for work he grumbled a very forced apology. I told him thank you and went about my business.

I am happy with how I handled the interaction when he returned home. Looking back, I am not so sure I should have called him or sent a text. If he were to do something to himself, there would be nothing I could do about it. And his answering a text or phone call would do nothing to change the scenario. Next time, I will just leave him alone.

From that whole exchange I can see how he is trying to project all of his negative emotions onto me. I can also see the emotional turmoil roiling around in his head. I am trying to have some compassion for him. I struggle with that.

When I woke up Thursday morning I had an old familiar pain in my stomach. That kind of doom and gloom feeling. The same feeling I had when my mother was in one of her moods and I was anticipating what would happen when I had to see her again. To calm myself, I reminded myself that I am no longer a little girl. I am not defenseless. I have a lot of choices on how to handle this situation. I don't have to take his venomous words or his mean attitude. I can ignore it. I can remind myself that all that bad behavior is all about him - it has nothing to do with me.

[job]

FightOn,

It's very normal to question your H's actions and to question them. Why? Because he's just not acting like the person you know and love. As for you living in a Fantasyland...that is projection. No, it's not all you. You can only claim 50% of the breakdown of the marriage...do not take on the 100%. If your H were more open to communicating his thoughts, comments and yes, even complaints over the years, you would have taken the extra care in trying to change the way you have been doing things.

As for the phone, yes, I can understand how that would bother you. He's like a teenager w/his secret little friends and has to go off be by himself to talk to the caller. Who knows who he was talking to, i.e., it could have been a male friend or an ow...but you will need to find a way to ignore the calls because it puts you in the alert mode and he can sense that.

As for the "nothing's changed" comment. My xh said the same thing and a lot of them say this. You can jump through hoops and do each and every thing that they point out that isn't to their liking and they will find something else wrong. It's about them and the fact that they do not know what they want and are searching for that something that will make them feel better. Change only those things that are valid and what you want to change for YOU. Make those changes for YOU and only if you are happy w/them because those changes will need to become a part of your routine. If you are only doing them to please him, he'll know that they are most likely a temporary thing.

The next time he disappears...leave him be. To him, your concern was more like checking on him as his mother would have done. I know you were concerned...but you've got to let him figure things out and if he's locked out...well...he knows how to call you on the phone and/or text you. Keep in mind, he's not the same man you know and love...you are dealing w/the mirror image, i.e., exact opposite of your "old" h.

They will do things to pick fights...the best thing is to stay calm and if you can distract him w/something else, then do so...but I think you handled yourself fairly well. Detach a bit more, keep the focus on you and your child and allow your man/child to grow up. One last thing...keep your expectations at zero and remember...he's going to do a lot of things differently than before the crisis.