If I could--coulda shoulda woulda--go back in time, I would have handled things so differently. At the moment of bomb drop, I would 100% have DB'd his arse! ... I actually replay that moment in my mind with this perfect poker-face and matter of fact response ....
Maybe next time--HA!
Blu
Oh GOD - I thought I was the only one that has played out that scenario about 1000 different times!!!
Obsess much, Storm? lol
Add me to that list, lol! I've replayed that and a few moments that followed in perfect DB form. I hope I don't end up rewriting my memory by doing that...
M-51 H-54 2D-27 and 25 M-26 yrs Bombshell and IHS 7-29-15 He moved out 10-3-15 D filed 1-27-16 D final 10-27-16
Maybe we should start a thread where we simply share the BD scenario and then replace it with the ideal one? You know, just for chits & giggles. ....
I would have stood there totally expressionless, listened to his BS lies about OW, etc, watched him fumble all over himself, and then I just would have kept my cool, nodded and said, "okay H, I understand what you are saying. I am sorry to hear that. (insert long pause)... I am going to the store now, need anything?" (Exits room, exits house, goes into car and then loses it). LOL.
Blu
“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
Funny..I'd have done nothing at all for about 3 days (my first BD was an email.) Then, after seeing him fall apart a week later with a breakdown...no A then...I would have been more matter of fact on him getting help or leaving. If only I'd known about DB then!
Me: 53 H:38 T:20 M:14 BD ILYB etc 10/15, H diagnosed severe depression S 1/16 PA 4/16 H filed 1/17
Right!?! How different would things have played out if we were equipped with DB skills before BD? My official BD was when H basically got caught having an EA with OW, however really I had lost him for longer than I had known. The EA had gone on for about 8 months before BD. I had even gotten the ILYBINILWY speech months before I learned about her. In fact, if I think hard, HE had been asking to go to MC for some months before that and I didn't agree to it. He had been trying to end the EA and cut off contact with her. There were several signs of hope, but I didn't see any of them. I was so hysterical
I also had been doing all the wrong things up until BD (in addition to after it) because I was so focused on him and the R, and not on myself. Sigh. Well I never want to relive that but I can assure you that today, if he dropped even the smallest bomb on me, I am well prepared! Not saying it would be easy, and I am sure it would be painful, but I would follow the rules and save myself.
Now that so much time has passed, it is easier to see things clearly in my sitch. I can see how when I did things that were contrary to DB (yelling, crying, pleading, bargaining, pursuing, etc) he would pull back and hide. With his NGS he would bury himself in guilt and become paralyzed. Then OW was on the sidelines pursuing, flattering, and reinforcing how much happier he would be if he left me. On the flip side, there were several times (short lived until I got better at it) that I did DB well and I was getting results. I just wasn't independent and strong enough to be able to see it (measure the results). In the middle of our separation, he left OW and attempted to R, but it was too difficult to even consider.
I was the one that kicked him out. I was the one that talked to Ls. I was the one that told him that I hated him and to never come back ... Sadly, I think if I had been in the mindset that I am today at the time of BD, then I don't actually think he would have ever left and had the full on A. I think he would have stayed and wanted to work on the M. That is not easy to admit, but it's time that I do.
Blu
“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
I was the one that kicked him out. I was the one that talked to Ls. I was the one that told him that I hated him and to never come back ... Sadly, I think if I had been in the mindset that I am today at the time of BD, then I don't actually think he would have ever left and had the full on A. I think he would have stayed and wanted to work on the M. That is not easy to admit, but it's time that I do.
Blu, I'm not sure you should necessarily beat yourself up for this. There's no way to know what would've happened if you'd been less harsh and he stayed. He might have still gone to the full A eventually, and y'all might not have made it to piecing at all. Don't get me wrong, it's a good thing to look back and learn from mistakes, but I don't think this should count as a major regret for you.
Me-47,XW-43 S13,S16 M:18 BD:4-23-17 W filed:7-17-17 (5 months of in-house separation hell) W moved out:1-6-18 D granted:2-15-18 Decree signed:3-29-18
Thank you for saying that. You are right: there is no way that I can predict now how the outcome could have changed or if it would have. The end result might have been the same or even worse. ... I think the reason it is important for me to acknowledge my actions is because I also need to have some accountability. My H has shouldered all of the blame (and guilt) in the breakdown of our M, however I certainly played a big part in that as well. I am still working on making some changes in myself, and so looking at how I could have done things better will hopefully lead to me making better choices in the future. I am trying to be less emotionally reactive in all of my Rs. It also helps me with forgiveness, which is still a work in progress. I want to forgive H, and I mostly do, but I am looking for and wanting more.
Blu
“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
What I did: I kicked W out upon finding out that night. The next day she texted me from her friends house and trickled truth, saying it was only a bunch of flirty messages. When I told her I had access to the texts (which I was going to hack her phone), she came clean and said, yes, it was physical once, it made her sick, so she stopped but kept up the emotional connection.
What I wish I did: A month after finding out, I did more digging and found out OM's wife, her work #, her cell phone #, and a Youtube video she did for her employer (and my W knew her). I wish that night I had that Youtube video playing on the laptop and my W would see it. I imagine she would probably say, "hey, I know her, she's a member of our fitness facility!!" (OM's wife is a member).
I'd say, "oh yeah? I know her too!! I just sent her a copy of every text between you and her husband. She's none too pleased. Oh yeah, and I also let your boss know about your shenanigans with OM - she wants to talk to you immediately. Please call her back as soon as possible. And your sister said she has a room available for you tonight - yeah, I let her know, too".
Although, in hindsight, had I done that, its very likely my W would've ended her life. The humility and embarrassment she endured with those in our small circle that knew was painful enough. Had all those women in her bible study, her running group, biking group, mommy group - had they all found out, it could've destroyed her.
However, the thing that hurt the most was her refusal to quit working with OM. Our recovery was hindered by their constant contact. This is something I deal with every therapy session, slowly coming to grips with it. My stupid IC and MC said it was ok and I need to get over them working together. Not until I saw my new IC did I start to get some balls back and really express my discomfort with it. Once he got promoted, I knew we were done. W sensed it and resigned immediately, no notice, nothing. THAT showed me she was serious about us. So that's something I can start building on.
Me: 52 Her: 48 2D 26 & 16 M: 25 years (together 30) EA/discovered by accident Valentines day 2016 Admitted SOME physical but no IC. We know that's a lie. Status - tryin to R
I had to search for my thread, and it was buried on page 11, so I guess it's time for an update. Nothing too exciting to report: summer vacation is over, kids back in school, and I have been working on some of my own GAL/180s. Partly that includes less time on the computer and more time reading books, home projects, exercising, and now eating more healthy. Spending time with friends has always been a strong suit. Making time for H? Guilty. I still need to work on that.
We have passed the half way point of the Retrouvaille program: there is a weekend program and then 12 post-sessions. We are doing a somewhat extended program, therefore 1 post-session at a time, whereas usually they are offered in 2s. I have to say, even though I am not Catholic, I very much appreciate the teachings and philosophy of the program.
Retro- strongly emphasizes that we as individuals are only responsible for ourselves, our choices, our actions, and that despite what our partner does, we can continue to do our own personal best. It is also helping me to accept that there is no natural fate of a relationship (no "happily ever after" and no "this M will never work"), but that if two people come together and make the choice and effort, the M can be recreated and yes, it can be better. It takes 2 IMO, and fortunately I have the S that is willing. For many, we can only do our own best, in hopes our S joins us.
So where am I in all of this? I don't always know TBH. I love my H and I love my family together. I still feel that I have some sort of wall up. Will that wall come down over time? That is the question that time will only tell. I still think that for me, I need to continue my DB efforts, in the sense that my focus should be on GAL/180 for me. I have been saying that for some time now, but I think emotionally I am finally at a place where I am developing very good habits for myself. When it comes to our daily Retro- HW, I am only motivated to do it some of the time.
Last fall, my dear mother lost her husband suddenly and is now in perpetual grief. She lost my step-father the same way many years ago. It is devastating and heart-breaking. I see her feeling so stuck in her life and I sincerely hope she can work through this and be okay on her own. I think it is too soon to tell. The thing is, she has never really been okay on her own and without a man; so this is also a pattern. I don't want to repeat her patterns.
I realize that many of my codependent traits come from my childhood and how I was raised. I think my H having his A and leaving broke me of that. He pulled the rug out from under our life and forced me to look at myself deeply. So perhaps this was the biggest silver lining? I know now that I would be okay with or without this M. I had to do a lot of faking when it came to DB/GAL/180/etc, however now it feels genuine. I feel healthier and stronger. I love my alone time. I am not afraid of anything anymore. It pains me to write this, but I would not have come to this if our sitch had not have happened.
If there is something I am still working towards, it is the forgiveness piece and letting my walls down. There is nothing he can do better or more of: he is open to me, making changes, and trying his best. I am hoping that as I can master my GAL/180s that these walls will come down more naturally. There is still this part of me that does wonder if I will ever feel (not the same) but as strongly about him as I did before.
Blu
“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
It's been awhile, so I think it's time for an update. IMO I personally feel that if we are going to give advice and 2*4 others, then we owe it to the community to share our own sitch.
We are getting close to the end of the Retrouvaille program. I have said before that we are not Catholic, however we appreciate the program, the teachings, and the overall goals. It is an international program and anyone is welcome to attend; couples (and priests) share a wealth of information on the importance of marriage and the steps needed to have a long term successful marriage. A lot of the tools we are learning are invaluable--communicating feelings, being personally accountable, and accepting that everything is a choice (marriage, love, forgiveness, etc). It's quite impressive actually.
That's the good stuff and I still do highly recommend it. Here is where I am getting thrown off. I am starting to feel that the indoctrination is getting in the way of what I am trying to get out of it. Could it simply be that some of the presenting couples are more fundamental in their beliefs than others? The last session we were basically told that if we want to save our M, then we need to go to church together and pray together. Without getting into my history in religion and H's history (why he became a MNG and our M failed, as he had an over-controlling Catholic mother), buuutttttt telling us TAHT is the last thing we need to hear to save our M. We are going to try and stay open-minded and complete the program, however we now must do so much more guarded.
I live in a very diverse part of the country and have friends and co-workers of all world faiths, and I have yet to see a strong correlation between religion and M success. In fact the couples that I think have strong marriages happen to me agonist (atheist). Am I suggesting that this data should mean anything about the program? No, but I am saying that couples can have lasting and loving Ms without going to church together and praying. There are so many reasons people stay together, and while religion/faith may help for some, it is not the only reason.
There have also been some presenting couples that have talked about the abuse they have endured and that they still choose to stay and work on the M. That has caused me some mixed emotions TBH. There are a few presenting couples that come to mind that my initial thought has been "why are you still together?" The goal of the presenting couples are to go over the material in the post-sessions, but it is also to show newbies that really any M can be saved if both people decide to and do the work. That is correct and they are proving it's true. Me personally, there are just things that I could not endure and some of these people have accepted horrific abuses.
Lately, I have been again more focused on my own GAL. I cycle through times of doubt about my M and if I can forgive H. Will that last forever? A good friend of mine reminded me how far I've come and that even if I can't see it, we are making so much progress. I don't know about that. I still miss how I felt about him before the A. I want to feel that way about my partner in life. He is a good guy, he does all the things--remorse, great at validation, awesome dad and co-housekeeper, and he is all in--but my heart is not in it. He still had an A and left me for this ugly mistake. So while there are so many things I like about my H more now, the history is and will always be there. Will I learn to accept and embrace that over time? I can't say yet.
I guess the difference now is that I don't feel as much emotion around it. I enjoy my day to day life, my family, my kiddos, my friendships, and my GAL. I have been running, swimming, hiking, and really enjoying my days off more than ever.
Blu
“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
I want to feel that way about my partner in life. He is a good guy, he does all the things--remorse, great at validation, awesome dad and co-housekeeper, and he is all in--but my heart is not in it. He still had an A and left me for this ugly mistake. So while there are so many things I like about my H more now, the history is and will always be there. Will I learn to accept and embrace that over time? I can't say yet.
Hi blu....does your H know that you are struggling? Do you think you have changed as a person and that is why you are having a hard time accepting and embracing? Do you feel as though you deserve better? Or is it simply trying to resolve, process and move past your anger? I ask because obviously overcoming the A piece is probably the most difficult challenges each of us will face if we get to the point your at.
