Hi all, i know that lots of posts are saying that the books are not available online as eBooks but there must be someone that knows where i can obtain a copy, I live on a small island with a small community and don't want our private business to get out and destroy our children. If someone could point me in the right direction that would be greatly appreciated.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I agree with Island here. While the delivery of the book itself can be concealed, it isn't as easy to read it or keep it around the house without being discovered. I would welcome a Kindle edition. I haven't read DR yet for this reason.
Me46 W46 M25yrs T29yrs 4 children ILYBNILWY 1/30/17 PA confronted 3/6/17 Separated same house
Our imports have to be submitted to a freight forwarder who needs invoices for customs clearance so they would see the title on the invoice...we are good friends with the freight forwarder!!! A True dilemma!!! The forum, your rules post and the cheat sheets are a good start but i would really like to read the books.
You can read the first chapter in the links above. Other than that I do not know of any e-versions of the book. MWD and Virginia are aware of the need for it however it has not yet happened. I am not sure that it will happen anytime soon.
Maybe Cristy knows more about this when she stops by.
Well maybe I will have to wait for our summer trip to "the mainland" so that i can pick a copy up. In the meantime I may seek some advice on the forums. I have read quite a number of threads and I am struggling to define the line between NC and "being a spouse only a fool would leave". I feel that although its important not to be available to W it can seem cold and not very attractive to be dismissive in all that she has to say etc. Sadly in my situation I have only just discovered the DB site and have already broken every one of Sandi's rules countless times. I actually got to the point of stepping back and accepting the PA (still ongoing although W said wasn't a number of times) before visiting the DB site. That feeling in itself made my mental state much better. Once I actually just said "I know she is" rather than anxiously wondering, waiting up for her, yelling when she did return late etc my mind felt at peace. it was quite incredible. So now after discovering the site I am trying to live by the rules (I read them everyday) starting to work on GAL although quite difficult just now as had an accident that prevents me from getting around easily (couple months max). Also quite difficult as W still living at home, separate rooms now. How do I adopt the NC without being an a$$, eg. would make coffee every morning and take to her, now I still make coffee but it just isn't in my nature to stop doing it for her. Do I have to, according to the general consensus of advice on here? Any pointers to threads similar to my sitch or advice would be appreciated.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
Well maybe I will have to wait for our summer trip to "the mainland" so that i can pick a copy up. In the meantime I may seek some advice on the forums. I have read quite a number of threads and I am struggling to define the line between NC and "being a spouse only a fool would leave". I feel that although its important not to be available to W it can seem cold and not very attractive to be dismissive in all that she has to say etc. Sadly in my situation I have only just discovered the DB site and have already broken every one of Sandi's rules countless times. I actually got to the point of stepping back and accepting the PA (still ongoing although W said wasn't a number of times) before visiting the DB site. That feeling in itself made my mental state much better. Once I actually just said "I know she is" rather than anxiously wondering, waiting up for her, yelling when she did return late etc my mind felt at peace. it was quite incredible. So now after discovering the site I am trying to live by the rules (I read them everyday) starting to work on GAL although quite difficult just now as had an accident that prevents me from getting around easily (couple months max). Also quite difficult as W still living at home, separate rooms now. How do I adopt the NC without being an a$$, eg. would make coffee every morning and take to her, now I still make coffee but it just isn't in my nature to stop doing it for her. Do I have to, according to the general consensus of advice on here? Any pointers to threads similar to my sitch or advice would be appreciated.
Hello IslandH,
I'm so sorry for the situation you are in.
Little compares to the devastation people feel when they discover their spouse has been unfaithful. Couples often struggle to get past intense emotional pain, mistrust, resentment and never ending arguments about the betrayal. Healing from infidelity is achievable for both of you with the right support and tools.
You are at a very fragile point in this relationship and it would be extremely helpful to know what your next move should be. Feel free to give me a call at 303-444-7004 to discuss how we can best help you determine what to do next.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator The Divorce Busting Center 303-444-7004
A Divorce Busting Coach can help you save your marriage, even when your spouse wants out.
Email virginia@divorcebusting.com or 303-444-7004 for more information or to get started right away.
Why would you bring coffee to your W when she is having a PA? It makes you look weak.
What are your boundaries? Are you willing to be in an open marriage?
Did you leave the master bedroom?
These are the boundaries I'm struggling to define. I am absolutely not willing to be in an open marriage. My dilemma is trying to keep the whole ordeal s secret from our kids and our loved ones. Our family and our family business would suffer incredibly. Another example, we still eat dinner together, she cooks...how is this dynamic supposed to work, I still thank her for the meal as that's what values we teach our children. I obviously don't want to look weak but I truly do not know how to do this whilst co-habiting and protecting the kids. I did not leave the master, this is another thing that is going to come to light soon. "Why is mommy sleeping in the spare room".
Hello Island! I'm sorry for the situation that has been visited upon you. I think maybe I can help with the difference between "no contact" and "being the spouse only a fool would leave".
"Being the spouse only a fool would leave" is not what it may seem. Bringing coffee to someone, for instance, is a very nice gesture. But if that person is in a PA, it reeks of servitude and pursuing. You don't reward bad behavior...nor do you punish (that sends people running, too). You set your boundaries without even a word...and ignore the behavior. The OP does not matter to you. They are not a part of your life (if they are someone you know...they are no longer worth acknowledging. They cease to exhist as a person). But as long as she is in the PA, do not sleep with her. Don't let her in your MB. Your W, also, is no longer your focus.
I'm sorry you can't get the books. Is there any way you can have someone you know from the mainland bring them to you if you have the package sent (unopened) to them? Tell them its a gift?
By "being the S only a fool would leave", you need to focus on you and self improvement. Who was the guy she fell in love with? Are you still that guy? We all lose sight of who we were once we try to please our spouse and as we get bogged down with other responsibilities. What were you like before? Were you confident? Carefree? A risk taker? Had your own friends and hobbies? Try to be that again, if that was who you really were. Were you more attentive and complimentary? Did you build her up and support her interests and efforts when you first met and stopped over the years? You might want to look at that and be more encouraging, supportive, and validating WHEN SHE INITIATES CONTACT WITH YOU (dont run after her while she has an OP). What were her complaints about you in the marriage? Are they somewhat valid? Sometimes, when we look deep, we realize that we have become someone else entirely...it can be painful. Those will be your 180s...things you try to completely change, or go back to that you once were authentically. Who do you want to be? Find your authentic you.
Now...the idea of NC is, I believe, to stop pursuing.
It is usually when your S has completely shown you they have "left the marriage"; if not physically, then emotionally. You stop INITIATING any contact. You do not run after them begging, you do not try to curry favor by giving them gifts, cooking their favorite foods, trying to have talks with them, or "reaching out" to them in any way. You just merrily live your own life, pursue your own interests, have your own fun. You "get a life" as a single person re-discovering who you are as a person, not as a compromising half of a couple. You focus on you, not on them. It is your time to better yourself for you, not to impress them.
This does not mean you ignore them, however. If THEY reach out to YOU, you can listen to what they have to say. You can practice listening, validating (empathizing, understanding, accepting their right to their feelings), but do not try to react by expressing your feelings or trying to turn them to your way of thinking. You let them walk their journey. You SHOW them you are content walking yours.
You SHOULD NOT be an a$$ or dismissive or cold. You should be pleasant and carry yourself as if you are content and busy living your own awesome life...and make it awesome! This is to give you both space to figure things out,; not to punish. Learn new things, try new hobbies. The world (on your island) is yours to do with as you want. If she wishes you good morning, look her in the eye, smile and say, "good morning to you!" Then make yourself a cup of coffee and go on with what you want to do that day. ALLOW her to make her own. If yo usually do things for her to be nice, ALLOW her to do them for herself. If she does nice things for her, ALLOW her to do them...then be authentically thankful and gratious. If she initiates a "talk", just listen. Don't defend, tell your side, or give sad puppy eyes. Just listen, say "I understand how you feel" or "I understand that you feel that way". No "buts". But really listen...you might learn. If she brings up the good she has done, validate that. If she screams, yells, cries...don't react. Let her know, calmly that you will leave the room and she can continue her convo later when she is able to speak more calmly. Then leave (boundary setting). Its hard, but gets better with practice.
True NC is if you were in separate homes. You are not really there yet. It would be hard anyway, in your case, in an island comunity. I hope this helps. If any DBers feel the need to correct me, please do. I'm dealing with an XH at this point in MLC, but after almost 1 1/2 years (quick time from BD to D) the DB methods have helped me and our R in many ways. I hope this helps, Island! Good luck to you. Be the lighthouse (a great metaphor and story in the helpful links Cadet posted)!
M-51 H-54 2D-27 and 25 M-26 yrs Bombshell and IHS 7-29-15 He moved out 10-3-15 D filed 1-27-16 D final 10-27-16
Thank you Ciluzen, this was what i need right now, this brings a bit more clarity and to know that i can still conduct myself in a pleasant manner as I consider myself to be anyway is comforting. I am not the kind of person who wants to see her hurting but I too don't deserve to be hurting so as you say, I need to work on me. I know that things do become stagnant after many years and am certainly not blameless. I have accepted that I need to work on what part I played in the demise of the R so I will work on becoming the lighthouse (read this and truly want to be that beacon) then its just a case of time (and DBing) will tell. I'm so pleased I found a place where there are so many supportive people, its just a shame there really are so many of us...I'm just glad that there are answers to my MANY questions. Thank you DBers and good luck with your sitch Ciluzen
After reading LOTS of posts and advice already shared with me I have started to implement the beginning stages of DB, still cant get the books for now so I'm going to need plenty pointers along the way.
I am ten months in to the what I'm sure most of us LBS feel are the most difficult times of our lives. I have never felt emotions quite like it, depression, anger, anxiety etc. etc. and as I posted before, I have been doing it all WRONG...up until about 3 weeks ago.
Here is a brief timeline of events so far...
Early 2016 I see pics on social media of W and what I later discover to be OM. Time spent on cell phone had become almost addictive, seen a text from OM, nothing incriminating, approached W and said I was not happy about pics and texts, she assured me it was a friendship.
Fast forward July 2016, my suspicions had led me to try to find out more, I knew that I could find out her location from cell phone so checked and discovered her whereabouts were very irregular to where she said she had been, confronted her and basically said I knew it was an PA she broke down and told me yes. I demanded NC told her she wasn't to go anywhere near, she apologized said she would do whatever it took to go back to the way we were.
Spent a few months trying to get over everything and trying to move on...Just after Christmas 2016 I discovered (cell location) she had met with him again "only talked to see how each other were"...in a off track road for 45 mins...I still don't believe this to be true. Told her I didn't want to go on with R and that I was done. I felt good for a week knowing that it was over, then she asked me to try again...I told her yes but I didn't want to go through this again...
March we still hadn't really moved on or gotten anywhere...I pushed her to tell me if she thought we could make it and she again broke down and says that she doesn't the love for me any more. Said that she had felt that about me for some time (over a year). I told her that we had not talked about it and needed help...we agreed that we needed MC. I told her I still loved her and that even after everything I wanted to fight for our MR even suggested taking 30mins out every day to try and reconnect, she agreed and said she really wanted to try...that night she went out with a friend and by chance I saw a live video of her on social media with OM. I went out to find her and they were outside OM house in car and I flew into a fit of rage and aggressively (nothing physical) told him to stay away and demanded W return home.
Next day she told me she was in love with OM and didn't want to be in MR anymore. I was devastated. I begged pleaded, reasoned, told her all the reasons she should NOT be with OM (younger...10yrs, no stability, no home, family destroyed, friends and loved ones would be hurt etc.) Needless to say now I know this was the wrong way to go about it.
I told her that we had a summer vacation coming up and that we would resolve matters, even initiate D after that so asked her to respect me and have no contact until we had come to some conclusion. I still believe she is communicating and even meeting with OM so I have constant anxiety when she is not home.
So until a few weeks ago things were EXTREMELY tough. I have begun to try to focus on not worrying about the A and accept that it is going on, but now trying to be the person that I want to be/used to be.
...did I say BRIEF timeline
Now all of my questions are about situations that arise whilst trying 180 etc.
W has never been a good communicator, I am the type of person that says it like it is and deals with my emotions there and then whereas my W tends to bottle it all up and when it gets too much explodes...which would explain why she didn't tell me that she was unhappy in our MR. I on the other hand had expressed on many occasion, which I believe was another contributing factor to her having a PA, maybe felt like frequent nagging. I also believe she lost herself in this time as she became neglectful of our home and "duties" within our family. I would come home from work and she would have sat all day watching tv while laundry was not done and dinner dishes were left all day etc. She would also find any opportunity to make herself busy out of the home with charity and voluntary work.
I was unhappy with that and our sex life had deteriorated somewhat which was ANOTHER topic that we would argue about. I completely understand why she would feel despondent with our MR but that was when she needed to communicate better and we should have sought help earlier. Now it feels like she has found her "pick me up" her drug, and doesn't want to go back to reality.
The communication is now where I am finding the DB technique difficult. I have become more cheerful, paid less attention to her, 180 all the time, but somehow want to know what she is feeling, we have not spoken about MR/PA at all for 3 weeks...its very early I know, is it a case of sit back and just wait or are there steps that can get her to initiate in some dialogue about the future without me bringing it up. I kind of want her to feel alone (away from the family) to let her see what she would be missing but also have reputation to keep and really would like to shield our children and family from the whole situation. I almost want her to speak to me so that I can put validation into practice but she says nothing...probably sounding off to OM...still spends WAY TOO MUCH time on cell phone.
We went to MC a couple of times before I found this site and she told counsellor that she wanted to try but again I found out she had been intimate with OM in the meantime which was when I "gave up" and we haven't been since.
I'm sorry this has been a long post but as we are trying to deal with this discreetly for the time being I have NO-ONE to talk to, MC was the only time I got to speak about things and now that has stopped so you guys are my only outlet so thank you for reading/listening.
I will pause there for a while, hopefully I can get some advice based on this.
Also any advice on what to do with anniversary coming up next week, I saw a nice post that said a card with "it's still worth remembering" written inside, that's the kind of thing I would do but not sure if its the right time. Should I just blank it completely?
Also any advice on what to do with anniversary coming up next week, I saw a nice post that said a card with "it's still worth remembering" written inside, that's the kind of thing I would do but not sure if its the right time. Should I just blank it completely?
Giving a card is pursuit, I personally would not suggest it.
You started 2 threads and now they are merged into this one. It will be a better way to follow your progress. Continue to post updates and questions. The shorter the post the more likely you are to get more responses.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator The Divorce Busting Center 303-444-7004
A Divorce Busting Coach can help you save your marriage, even when your spouse wants out.
Email virginia@divorcebusting.com or 303-444-7004 for more information or to get started right away.
You started 2 threads and now they are merged into this one. It will be a better way to follow your progress. Continue to post updates and questions. The shorter the post the more likely you are to get more responses.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator The Divorce Busting Center 303-444-7004
I woke today feeling full of anxiety, plagued by the thoughts of the woman I thought was only meant for me sharing herself with someone else. These feelings come in waves and I really struggle when they sweep over me. Its hard to even fathom why I still dearly love her and that I am willing to make it work. I think I also have a feeling of loss, the partner that has been there for me for so many years is now, not only the cause of so much pain, but is absent where before she was there for me during the hard times, its like a double whammy. Our children are my only source of distraction at the minute, work doesn't seem to have the same effect. I'm finding it hard that W is literally having NOTHING to say about the MR and I'm at a dead end with nowhere to go with the situation. LIMBO...ugh!! I've made the decision to completely blank our anniversary this week...it's going to be extremely tough, especially as I know we will have plenty of well wishers within the family.
So the anniversary went by without a word said about it by either of us, it was a tough day, that was one of the hardest things to do. Today I am feeling so resentful at the fact it seems that my WAS seems to get her cake and eat it. We are trying to "deal" with the sitch behind closed doors with nobody needing to know right now, but I feel that she doesn't have the real life problems with OM that we have/had in our R, so as far as she is concerned its the perfect scenario. As far as I am aware she is still seeing OM, and she has no worries when it comes to kids/home because I am trying to be that perfect man that she doesn't want to leave. I feel like I am making it easy for her. As for living in the same house I have no reason to not be there when she decides she wants to have her social life. I am keeping communication to a minimum and making sure to do opposite to what I used to do in most situations (complaining about things not done like chores and grocery shopping etc) i just do what I have to do myself which in turn again makes it easier for her. I know its still earlier in my DB attempts but not sure what will change in the near future without any drastic measures.
Just be prepared for W to feel as if your changes are fake. This is exactly what I have dealt with in my own sitch. My advice is to change, but no so much so quickly that your W doesn't recognise you. It has to be gradual, so it doesn't come off fake.
Heading to Europe for 3 weeks for a "family" vacation which is going to be strange/difficult. Any advice on how to deal with this situation?
Still finding it difficult to obtain a copy of either book discreetly without her seeing, we are not on the mainland very long before we head to Europe so still trying to get it somehow. Someone NEEDS to convert this book to file for Michelle!!!!
Heading to Europe for 3 weeks for a "family" vacation which is going to be strange/difficult. Any advice on how to deal with this situation?
IslandH,
If you'll pay all of my expenses, I'll go with you on the European vacation and run interference between you and the family. In addition, I'll give you my copy of Michelle's book for free.
Ok so I finally managed to get Divorce Remedy whilst on vacation and discreetly pack it so as no-one would see it. I have read the book and tried to implement it to my best ability, I am however struggling on the GAL part due to work commitments and also I'm not seeing much difference in the W's attitude towards me, even after trying the 180's I've not seen much of a change. It's difficult to gauge as she has never really been unpleasant...apart from her obvious indiscretions, but she has always been somewhat polite. We have spoken once about the A and that was over a brief text conversation which i saw wasn't going in a favorable direction so cut that off before it went too far. Is it just going to be a case of sit silently for the A to die of its own accord? I don't see things progressing much while she is still seeing the AP. Detaching is also difficult, I have been quite upbeat around her and our kids but I feel terrible for the most part, even so much as it is affecting my ability to focus at work. I find my mind wandering constantly thinking about what she is doing and who she is with. Hopefully things will run their course soon enough...
and also I'm not seeing much difference in the W's attitude towards me, even after trying the 180's I've not seen much of a change.
You won't, not or months or even a year or more. At first she'll think you're doing 180's as a trick to get her back (which is probably true). You need to do 180's for YOU, to become the best "you" that you can be. Eventually she'll realize you really have changed, and THEN her attitude towards you might change as well.
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Is it just going to be a case of sit silently for the A to die of its own accord? I don't see things progressing much while she is still seeing the AP.
The idea isn't to outlast the A, it is to work on yourself independent of her and her A. You have no control over her and her A, all you have control over is you. This is why you get out and get a life, because right now you are codependent (it's a normal byproduct of being married) and you need to break that.
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Detaching is also difficult, I have been quite upbeat around her and our kids but I feel terrible for the most part, even so much as it is affecting my ability to focus at work.
Yes that is unfortunately a normal part of it. Again, this is where GAL'ing will help. I know you say you don't have time, but you've got to make time for it. GAL'ing is extremely difficult when you just want to curl up in the fetal position somewhere, but the more you make yourself do it the easier it gets and the less you think about your sitch.
