Gordie: One day at a time

[Gordie]

New thread so time for some reflection. For my history, I started in new comers and came over to MLC a few months ago.

I am now 9 months post b d and thought I'd be d now. There are things that are better about my situation and things that are worse. I never imagined being where I am today but am learning to take one day at a time. My new mantra is to make the best of every day because it's all I've got. Thank you to everyone here who has supported me through this journey. I was in a very dark place when I got here and all of you have helped me get to where I am today.

What's better?

I am a better listener and w talks to me more.
I am a more involved dad and closer to my kids.
I take more responsibility for cooking and cleaning.
I am more attentive to w's sexual desires.
I am steadier and more detached from W's roller coaster.
I am more independent and content doing things without w.
I am more supportive of my W's work.
W no longer talks about POM.

What's worse?

W filed for d in March.
W and I sleep in separate rooms.
W keeps her distance in public.
W no longer goes to church with the family.

What's the same?

We are still married.
We are still living together.
We still have family meals.
We still go on dates.
We still have sex.

[Gordie]

Prior thread

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2732679#Post2732679

[Gordie]

Weekly update:

So it's been a week since we separated our sleeping arrangements. There was a part of me that said okay, this is another step towards d. I didn't panic, I just accepted it. I got the support I needed and committed to being steady, to just being me.

So here's the unexpected: w has been pursuing me this week. W keeps wanting to have sex with me. W has wanted to engage in long non R talks. When we took our weekend getaway in March, I got the advice to treat her as a GF not my W. If I thought positively about things, I'd say that's where we are now: acting as BF and GF, living more independently of one another than before, still under one roof but in separate bedrooms, emotionally connecting, dating and enjoying each other physically.

W said for us to ever reconcile we would need to destroy the old M and rebuild a new one. Is that what we are doing or is she just stringing me along? I try not to ask myself these questions but to just live one day at a time. Carpe diem!

[ciluzen]

Hey, Gordie! Believe it or not, you sound like you're doing quite well.

What your W said about destroying the old marriage and rebuilding the new one...are you sure she's not DBing?

Your sleeping arrangements look like another version of "I need space" (meaning "I need to be alone to think without the distraction of you and your influence" or "who am I without you?"). While it gives you both some time to yourselves and undisturbed sleep, it also helps with the illusion of starting a new R...bringing the "newness" and excitement of dating and getting to know someone you don't know very well back onto the stage. I think this is a good thing. But here's my caution and questions.

Take this slowwww. Do not rush this part. If you think you're being patient and slow...slow down even further. Continue to GAL and not always be available, but be very kind about it. Let her know that you enjoy her company (you can actually say it), but continue to do you. As if you are making time for a new girlfriend, but you still need to live your life.

So my question to you is...who is the new Gordie that she is discovering while dating? Is this the new and improved version of the Gordie she originally fell in love with? Or is this Gordie the version that she had issue with, but now with DB skills? Or are you going to let her slowly get to know authentic Gordie who knows who he is and likes who he is, despite what she thinks about him? Because the reason it is said "DBing is for you" is to help you to become the best version of yourself, not the version that will win back W; because if that is not the real Gordie, it will be hard to continue the illusion without repercussions.

I'll give you a funny example from my own recent experience with XH. As his anger toward me has diminished with the space and D, I find during each encounter that he brings up things that he is now doing on his own that he complained about me doing while he was busy building resentment and blaming me for his unhappiness. I do know my controlling behavior through meltdowns and pouting was also a factor in the resentment, but not part of this example . Anyway, he asked me to get a beer with him during a truck exchange last week and he wanted to order appetizers. I've always been a health-nut and a foody, and (much to my embarassment) was vocal about it. But I do like doughnuts, fried foods, comfort foods...etc. I was afraid of being judged so I ate them in secret, all the while judging others for their choices. Yeah, I'll take that well deserved "tsk-tsking". So one of my 180's is to do me and let others do them, as well. Authentically. So, XH remarked that the onion rings looked good, so I said yeah! Lets have them! He then started discussing how we should probably eat a healthier option and kept suggesting the hummus plate. He always made fun of it or complained in the past, though hummus with veggies was a go to lunch or snack for my family. He would fight the "healthful" food I grew or prepared. He ended up ordering the hummus plate "for us", so I added on the rings. Both were good. He used his card to pay but I gave him enough cash to pay both my half and the full tip, so no I didn't burden him with the add on. We ended up boxing up much of it (neither of us eat much). So, he got to see "authentic" me...who likes a good IPA and some onion rings. Is XH being authentic because he really does like hummus and doesn't always enjoy being the one who pays for everything? Quite possibly. But it could also be that he was just trying to eat something he didn't like because he was trying to be nice while eating with me. He's always been a "Mr. Nice Guy"...to everyone. But that can become a weight of resentment that can become an increasingly heavy burden as more people take advantage of it. So...by being authentically me, I take the burden of wondering what he thinks of me off of me. By accepting his ability to do what he wants, the burden of wondering what to do around me is off of him, whether he realizes it or not. The reason to take it slow is to let your "date" figure this part out. That neither of you need to impress the other; you are who you seem and they have the freedom to do the same.

Of course, I always go back to my mantra of "kindness, kindness, kindness". That keeps the "authenticity" from boiling over to narcissism or selfishness.

Keep living those days and moments one at a time, Gordie. Carpe diem, back atcha!

[HaWho]

My h also showed massive confliction at the beginning. He told me he was confused and he was so out of it. One day he had feelings for me, the next he was back to confused. He told me the marriage was done, but got angry when I took my wedding rings off. And on and on it went.

I read somewhere to try hard to show kind gestures in the beginning as they can remember that later on. They get worse further in the tunnel. And they must get worse to get better. So don't fear it when you see her worsen.

At BD #2 (much worse than #1) he told me he never loved me and said it was all a huge mistake. Yeah, right. That sure is one lonnnng mistake: practically 20 years!

Recently, he remembers some positive memories with me. He'll say "remember when we went to x?" And I just say "yep, I remember that" and mosey along. I don't react much and I don't wax nostalgic. I find I just can't go there. He seems to try to bring up more memories and I do think he is looking for a reaction.

Just make sure you aren't propping her up through all this. Like Ciluzen touched on, you want to still become who you want to be despite all her shenanigans. You cannot nice her out of this.

So how does her room look? Does she have boy band posters on the wall?!?

[OwnIt]

Ciluzen always has such wonderful observations and personal experience. I am really rooting for them.

My H is exactly like HaWho's. I heard first the last few years were awful and pretty soon it was the whole marriage and he settled when he married me. You'd think that guy would be dying to finalize the divorce. Now all of a sudden he is remembering fun times from our early marriage and bringing up inside jokes. Now he's sending me nice texts. But is in the honeymoon stage with his OW2. Go figure.

Gordie you totally have to go slowly. She is just doing the pursuer/distancer dance with you. That thing is so trained in all of them.

How are your kids holding up?

[Gordie]

Hey, Gordie! Believe it or not, you sound like you're doing quite well.

What your W said about destroying the old marriage and rebuilding the new one...are you sure she's not DBing?

Your sleeping arrangements look like another version of "I need space" (meaning "I need to be alone to think without the distraction of you and your influence" or "who am I without you?"). While it gives you both some time to yourselves and undisturbed sleep, it also helps with the illusion of starting a new R...bringing the "newness" and excitement of dating and getting to know someone you don't know very well back onto the stage. I think this is a good thing. But here's my caution and questions.

Take this slowwww. Do not rush this part. If you think you're being patient and slow...slow down even further. Continue to GAL and not always be available, but be very kind about it. Let her know that you enjoy her company (you can actually say it), but continue to do you. As if you are making time for a new girlfriend, but you still need to live your life.

So my question to you is...who is the new Gordie that she is discovering while dating? Is this the new and improved version of the Gordie she originally fell in love with? Or is this Gordie the version that she had issue with, but now with DB skills? Or are you going to let her slowly get to know authentic Gordie who knows who he is and likes who he is, despite what she thinks about him? Because the reason it is said "DBing is for you" is to help you to become the best version of yourself, not the version that will win back W; because if that is not the real Gordie, it will be hard to continue the illusion without repercussions.

I'll give you a funny example from my own recent experience with XH. As his anger toward me has diminished with the space and D, I find during each encounter that he brings up things that he is now doing on his own that he complained about me doing while he was busy building resentment and blaming me for his unhappiness. I do know my controlling behavior through meltdowns and pouting was also a factor in the resentment, but not part of this example . Anyway, he asked me to get a beer with him during a truck exchange last week and he wanted to order appetizers. I've always been a health-nut and a foody, and (much to my embarassment) was vocal about it. But I do like doughnuts, fried foods, comfort foods...etc. I was afraid of being judged so I ate them in secret, all the while judging others for their choices. Yeah, I'll take that well deserved "tsk-tsking". So one of my 180's is to do me and let others do them, as well. Authentically. So, XH remarked that the onion rings looked good, so I said yeah! Lets have them! He then started discussing how we should probably eat a healthier option and kept suggesting the hummus plate. He always made fun of it or complained in the past, though hummus with veggies was a go to lunch or snack for my family. He would fight the "healthful" food I grew or prepared. He ended up ordering the hummus plate "for us", so I added on the rings. Both were good. He used his card to pay but I gave him enough cash to pay both my half and the full tip, so no I didn't burden him with the add on. We ended up boxing up much of it (neither of us eat much). So, he got to see "authentic" me...who likes a good IPA and some onion rings. Is XH being authentic because he really does like hummus and doesn't always enjoy being the one who pays for everything? Quite possibly. But it could also be that he was just trying to eat something he didn't like because he was trying to be nice while eating with me. He's always been a "Mr. Nice Guy"...to everyone. But that can become a weight of resentment that can become an increasingly heavy burden as more people take advantage of it. So...by being authentically me, I take the burden of wondering what he thinks of me off of me. By accepting his ability to do what he wants, the burden of wondering what to do around me is off of him, whether he realizes it or not. The reason to take it slow is to let your "date" figure this part out. That neither of you need to impress the other; you are who you seem and they have the freedom to do the same.

Of course, I always go back to my mantra of "kindness, kindness, kindness". That keeps the "authenticity" from boiling over to narcissism or selfishness.

Keep living those days and moments one at a time, Gordie. Carpe diem, back atcha!

Ciluzen,

Wow...your advice is golden and spot on:

1. I definitely find myself getting impatient certain days. And my d b coach says I may have to be patient enough to wait out a d. Patience!

2. Who is this person she is dating? Honestly, I felt like I could answer yes to all three of your questions: a new and improved me, the old me with d b skills, and the authentic me. It depends on the day. You've given me a lot to think about and obviously need to be more a or c, preferably c.

So on her part she is trying out c. She keeps pushing the envelope with me showing more and surprising sides of hereself, testing to see if I will react negatively as I have done in the past. My goal has been to be a really patient and active listener without any judgment. Is this an improved me? Yes.

Thank you! More to think and write about later.

[Gordie]

My h also showed massive confliction at the beginning. He told me he was confused and he was so out of it. One day he had feelings for me, the next he was back to confused. He told me the marriage was done, but got angry when I took my wedding rings off. And on and on it went.

I read somewhere to try hard to show kind gestures in the beginning as they can remember that later on. They get worse further in the tunnel. And they must get worse to get better. So don't fear it when you see her worsen.

At BD #2 (much worse than #1) he told me he never loved me and said it was all a huge mistake. Yeah, right. That sure is one lonnnng mistake: practically 20 years!

Recently, he remembers some positive memories with me. He'll say "remember when we went to x?" And I just say "yep, I remember that" and mosey along. I don't react much and I don't wax nostalgic. I find I just can't go there. He seems to try to bring up more memories and I do think he is looking for a reaction.

Just make sure you aren't propping her up through all this. Like Ciluzen touched on, you want to still become who you want to be despite all her shenanigans. You cannot nice her out of this.

So how does her room look? Does she have boy band posters on the wall?!?

HaWho,

Thanks for checking in.

1. W is massively conflicted. It comes in waves of her trying to get closer and farther from me. It's exhausting at times, but I'm doing better.

2. W does not reflect on the past and our history. She is very focused on building the life she wants. She's not sure if that includes me.

3. Boy band posters? Ha. She sleeps on the couch and puts her stuff away every morning as if she didn't sleep there. Not a real dorm room re decorating.

4. What do you mean about notmpropping her up? In some ways I feel of course I am. I support her financially and emotionally still. At the beginning she sought all her support from outside the marriage, but has returned to relying on me. Is that bad?

5. Thank you for the reminder that I can't nice her back.

[Gordie]

Ciluzen always has such wonderful observations and personal experience. I am really rooting for them.

My H is exactly like HaWho's. I heard first the last few years were awful and pretty soon it was the whole marriage and he settled when he married me. You'd think that guy would be dying to finalize the divorce. Now all of a sudden he is remembering fun times from our early marriage and bringing up inside jokes. Now he's sending me nice texts. But is in the honeymoon stage with his OW2. Go figure.

Gordie you totally have to go slowly. She is just doing the pursuer/distancer dance with you. That thing is so trained in all of them.

How are your kids holding up?

1. W does not say those things about our m. Instead, it is she feels trapped. She can't be who she wants to be.

2. She still frequently says she loves me. My problem is she told me at b d that she also loved her p o m--both at the same time. She even asked for an open m and I said I wouldn't do that. She no longer talks about him and I don't ask about him.

3. Thank you for the reminder to go slowly. Of course, I get impatient at times but realize I am not in control of the time frame. Worst marathon ever.

4. Kids are holding up well. Teenagers are getting in more fights with mom. Little kids ask about our sleeping arrangements and why mom doesn't go to church. I try to answer without saying anything negative. Is that the right approach?

Thank you for your help.

[OwnIt]

Gordie:

Definitely the right approach. That is still their mom and no matter what she does, they will still want to love her and be loved by her. They will put all of this together in their own minds later. When that happens, you want them to see you as someone who always made them feel loved, always made them feel secure, and never made them feel bad about loving their mother or having to make a choice.