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#2742931 05/11/17 10:34 AM
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Hi,

This is my very first post and was hoping to get some general advice. I'm a 31 year old man with a 29 year old wife. I admittedly have not been a good husband. Not bad, but not good. My wife's biggest complaints were that I was not affectionate, did not show her attention, poor communication etc. We have been together for seven years, married year and a half. Several years ago, I fell into somewhat of a depression, just not very happy with myself and the world, I just lost interest in everything including my wife. I've now grown out of it. In October 2016, I came home and my wife was gone. All her belongings, gone. I was crushed. Later that night, I received an email that she really loves me and wanted to give me a wake up call and that we need to date again. I tried my hardest to fix her concerns in the mean time. She began acting very weird and distant. We seen each other maybe once a week at that time. I stumbled across a facebook which had another man and her as his profile pic. Later discovered she moved out with him and she has been in a relationship with him, possible even before she moved out. My world seemed to end on that day. She blames me for her affair now and says that its my fault. She does not know if she loves him but does not know if she wants to be with me. We still talk everyday and she says her boyfriend is now getting angry with her. She lies to him when she comes to see me which starts fights between them but she says he treats her 100 times better than I ever had. She then tells me she cant be seen in public with me because the boyfriend may see her with me. Unfortunately, I still love her to death. She has so many qualities that are hard to duplicate. I feel like this is all my fault sometimes.

Any objective advice on how to go about this that's non divorce related? I do believe in exhausting my options to reconcile but I also lost my dignity in the process and don't want to lose myself along with the marriage.

She left October 2016, I discovered affair March 2017


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
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Originally Posted By: dale165

Any objective advice on how to go about this that's non divorce related? I do believe in exhausting my options to reconcile but I also lost my dignity in the process and don't want to lose myself along with the marriage.


Hello dale165,

I went ahead and moved your post to newcomers so that more people will see it and be supportive.

I'm so sorry for the situation you are in. You have come to the right place when it comes to keeping your dignity, your identity and your marriage moving in a more positive direction.

Little compares to the devastation people feel when they discover their spouse has been unfaithful. Healing from infidelity is achievable for both of you with the right support and tools.

Knowing what to do and what not to do at this point is crucial. Feel free to give me a call at 303-444-7004 to discuss how we can best help you determine what to do next.

Cristy

Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004


A Divorce Busting Coach can help you save your marriage, even when your spouse wants out.

Email virginia@divorcebusting.com or 303-444-7004 for more information or to get started right away.
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Originally Posted By: dale165
She lies to him when she comes to see me which starts fights between them but she says he treats her 100 times better than I ever had. She then tells me she cant be seen in public with me because the boyfriend may see her with me. Unfortunately, I still love her to death.


dale165,

So, your wife's boyfriend would get upset if he saw her in public with her husband. How do you feel about the boyfriend?

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Originally Posted By: dale165
I also lost my dignity in the process


Id start here. How will you go about getting your dignity back?

Im damn sure it isnt by going out with someone that has a boyfriend. Stop letting her have her cake; if she wants to be with OM right now, then let her and stop 'hanging out' with her. Why do you want to be in a marriage that has 3 people?

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Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.


Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Me-70, D37,S36
Cadet #2743307 05/15/17 06:42 AM
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dale165 Offline OP
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Thanks guys, I didn't see my post for a few days. I thought maybe it was a bad post but its here now.

Thank you for the comments and especially all the resources. Im in a extremely vulnerable position right now but I am pro marriage. She finally confessed the whole thing last night. This guy has always liked her and she knew this, since 2013. I knew this but just based on his appearance and his lifestyle, I didn't think anything of it. When we would have marriage problems, she would share our details with him. I did not know this, so that was a huge problem. She was seeing him a few months before she moved out and he helped her moved out. She lived alone until January, that's when he moved in. We still talk everyday which is crazy so I ended that last night. I told her she has a month to move back in. I know divorce wont help my pain at the moment so I just plan to repursue my faith and finally heal.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
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Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.


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#2743542 05/16/17 05:44 PM
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dale165 Offline OP
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Hi,

I've made a post recently about my story. I think the end is near but hoping to see if anyone had some success with the last resort techniques, I'm debating if I've had enough now to even try.

Short story is that wife left me for another man in october 2016. She said I didn't give her what she needed but still wanted to work things out. Come to find out several months later, she moved in with another man and has been seeing him 2 months prior to her leaving. She still says she loves me and can't choose, pretty obvious she chose him. She is the only real relationship I've ever had, about 7 years. I've had just a bunch of one nighters and week long girlfriends in the past but when I found her it was amazing, to this day it never even crossed my mind to betray her. With that being said I realize I also may be codependent because I believe I may never find this again. I've realized that love is awesome and those casual flings just brought my self esteem down.

Am I just being deliousanal? I think I am.

Last edited by Cadet; 05/16/17 05:52 PM. Reason: Combine posts

M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
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Don't blame yourself or let her blame you for the A. That was all her choosing. She could have done a number of other things to fix the M before that. So no matter how bad a H you may have been the A is not on you.

Are you supporting her in any way? If so stop that. Financially, emotionally, etc. If she is with an OM then you don't need to be a part of that. She chose him to take your place. Let him have it all.

A's typically don't last long. 4-6 months before the shiny newness wears off and all the warts start showing her that the OM isn't that special after all.

Work on improving yourself. Physically, mentally, emotionally. GAL is for you to be the guy only a fool would leave.

Always remember ACTIONS are strong WORDS are weak. Be a man of action. Don't tell her what you are going to do. Just do it. Especially don't tell her you are going to do something just to get a reaction. Super weak. You gave her a month. Have you decided what will happen in a month if she doesn't come back? It needs to be an action, not words. "if you don't come back in a month I'm going to ..." Weak. Just leave it at "If you don't move back in a month I will have decisions to make" Leave it vague and just act when the time comes.

If you aren't OK with her living with OM what have you done to express that? Just words or did you take an action. Like just stop doing something (texting, calls, money, help, etc).


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When they can't choose, you choose for them. Don't be a doormat. Nobody respects a doormat and nobody can love someone they don't respect. Continue this weak approach to this and she's gone for good. You know who isn't being weak about this? The OM and that's why she's still living with him.



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Hi Dale, welcome to our community. I'm so sorry you are facing this ordeal. The more you post and tell us about the relationship, the more replies you will receive.

Quote:
I'm debating if I've had enough now to even try.


If your W has moved in with another man, I recommend you use the last resort technique. Don't be afraid of it.

Do you spend time with guy friends? I recommend you try things that will build healthy self-esteem. It is important to feel confident about yourself, your core beliefs, and what you will not tolerate.

You may need to do some serious self evaluation and decide what needs improving in your life as an individual. Seriously seek out the sources that will give you strength, encouragement, peace, and support. Get out of the house and find things to do that you really enjoy. Maybe even get out of your comfort zone a bit and try something new.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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Thank you for your wisdom. I appreciate you being straight forward and considerate at the same time. I was on another site's message board before this one and the responses were absurd. Answers ranged from calling me curse words to divorce her. That's it, nothing constructive. I will participate in the final resort technique before I call it quits, if that doesn't work, I can walk away saying I did every last thing in my power.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
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If you haven't already, be sure to read Divorce Remedy by MWD.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
sandi2 #2743654 05/17/17 02:21 PM
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Went to books a million at lunch with no success so ordered dr and db online!


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
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Great!


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
sandi2 #2743793 05/18/17 03:29 PM
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Hi Dale,

Sorry you are here brother.
Definitely deploy the LRT and go dark. Detach, 180 and GAL. Dig deep and find your inner "man" and don't allow to walk all over you. I highly recommend you read all of Sandi's Reflections; really good stuff here:
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2653323&page=1


Me: 48 y/o
W: 47 y/o
Together: > 20 yrs
BD: Dec '15, then S
2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D
April '16: started piecing
#2744054 05/21/17 07:39 AM
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I recently posted my story and was given some great tips. Physically, I'm back. Mentally, not so much. Getting back in the swing of things. My biggest problem, besides the affair itself, is that I cant get the images of my wife sleeping with that guy and searching for new info. I was in her amazon account and they have ordered some bedroom things. This has consumed my mind.

I have always been athletic but haven't played sports since college baseball in 2010. With that being said, I'm a huge fan of mixed martial arts and have signed up for kick boxing. So I am trying to get totally out of my element and do things that I've never done. Going back to original paragraph, I'm a CPA so I'm in front of a computer almost 100% of my work day. The images consume me and all it seems I do is just try to get new info on social media. I'm like a drug addict. Any tips on removing myself from that? Its become a huge problem.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
dale165 #2744057 05/21/17 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted By: dale165
I recently posted my story and was given some great tips. Physically, I'm back. Mentally, not so much. Getting back in the swing of things. My biggest problem, besides the affair itself, is that I cant get the images of my wife sleeping with that guy and searching for new info. I was in her amazon account and they have ordered some bedroom things. This has consumed my mind.

I have always been athletic but haven't played sports since college baseball in 2010. With that being said, I'm a huge fan of mixed martial arts and have signed up for kick boxing. So I am trying to get totally out of my element and do things that I've never done. Going back to original paragraph, I'm a CPA so I'm in front of a computer almost 100% of my work day. The images consume me and all it seems I do is just try to get new info on social media. I'm like a drug addict. Any tips on removing myself from that? Its become a huge problem.


Tell yourself you are the "director of the movie" in your head and yell "CUT!"

For me, meditation and turning it over to God, trusting that I will be fine, helps as do replacing those images with a mantra of "good riddance to lunacy" IF that applies.

(My h is so over the top on FB about finding the love of his life, after a 35 year marriage, that objectively it's pretty weird to do. And cruel, and clueless, etc)

As h is now, no thanks.

Maybe yourself that not all is GREAT over there. Not all is SPECTACULAR!! The OP cannot "win" at every angle but it takes awhile for their own problems to arise. For every new "exciting" discovery she may make, there are reminders of good things YOU offer and the comfort of the familiar. Songs, places, inside jokes...

Meanwhile you work on yourself in your own sandbox and let her work on hers.

Try turning it over the God or the universe or whatever higher power you have.

I used to think it, say it and hear myself say it. That helped it sink in and calm me down.

Stop the spinning. And there are free apps you can get for meditations that REALLY help more than I expected. One is called "Insight Timer". Just a thought.

Hang in there as it does get better. But for now it's like PTSD. I'd see a therapist if you are not already .


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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Thanks 25. Not trying to be graphic but we never used those "bedroom items" so its like, what the hell is going on over there.

You are totally right, I am currently seeing my pastor and therapist. Also you are right in the sense that who knows what their relationship is like, especially since the newness is fading. At end of day, there is zero chance that I can tell them what to do. They will do whatever they want, regardless of my thoughts so I should just leave it be. Easier said than done but its the truth.

Last edited by Cadet; 05/22/17 03:37 AM. Reason: Combine posts

M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
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just checking in to see how you are doing. Have you completed the books?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
sandi2 #2744155 05/22/17 06:38 AM
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Thanks for checking Sandi. Checked amazon and they are scheduled to be delivered today. I ordered 5/17. In the mean time I have been doing the last resort technique. She still tries to contact me to see how my day is going and I just give her a pleasant but short answer. I ask no questions. I will see her this Saturday which I'm a bit nervous but GAL and a few others things have helped me thus far. As I mentioned before, my main problems so far are images in my head and looking at their pics on social media.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
Wife 29 years old
sandi2 #2744166 05/22/17 07:37 AM
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Thanks for checking Sandi. Checked amazon and they are scheduled to be delivered today. I ordered 5/17. In the mean time I have been doing the last resort technique. She still tries to contact me to see how my day is going and I just give her a pleasant but short answer. I ask no questions. I will see her this Saturday which I'm a bit nervous but GAL and a few others things have helped me thus far. As I mentioned before, my main problems so far are images in my head and looking at their pics on social media.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
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Originally Posted By: dale165
As I mentioned before, my main problems so far are images in my head and looking at their pics on social media.


These are things you can control:

1) I used a rubber band on my wrist anytime my brain started to play those movies. Or imagine a giant STOP sign every time they come up. Itll teach your brain to stop playing them.

2) Time to get out the unfollow or unfriend button. You are in control of you. Exert it. Stop clicking the links looking for the pics!

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I agree, you have to stop looking at those sources that feed the images in your head. You are punishing yourself and you have enough to deal with, as it is.

Other than wanting your W to return, have you set any goals for yourself? I don't want to sound as if I am not taking your M problem seriously. I only want to help. The number one successful thing I've seen LBS's recommend is GAL. And, get a life that involves other people, not just a one person activity. Go where the people are, and make new friends. This may be the only chance you have to do whatever you want, without having to consider someone at home who is not interested in the same things.

Be your own best friend. Protect yourself. Don't watch her and the affair partner. You know she's with him, and that's all you need to know. Looking at FB or any other social network, seeing her messages, pictures, etc., only hurt you.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
sandi2 #2744480 05/24/17 10:07 AM
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Well one major problem is that I moved to her town so I'm in her familiar place. I have about 5 solid friends there and a few others I hang out with. So she left me in an unfamiliar place with two large dogs to take care of. I'm from a town about 45 minutes away and that's where my family and bulk of friends live. So moving will be a thought.

My plan is not very specific, but I have signed up for things I always wanted to do, back in gym, seeing my friends, etc. My wife was very controlling so that threw me out of loop with many friends. Another big problem is that I'm a CPA and she did this in early March, I'm still behind with some clients. So priorities will have to take a little precedence over GAL at the moment even though I am stepping out my comfort zone.

Got a call from a cruise line today asking for my wife. I logged in the website and sure enough they going on a 7 day cruise in a few months but she keeps complaining about money. She never asks me for anything though.

Thoughts on the following....Affair partner does videography and bartending. He does some video work for a local church. Is it out of line to email that church about it? Also, I think I know the answer, but is it out of line for logging into her cruise line account? I've rarely been the jealous type but I don't know the full story on a lot of things.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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Let the church know. OM won't seem so desirable with a lack of funds. Plus there has to be some consequence for his actions.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
S14
BD/PA/EA: 12/2016
#2744599 05/25/17 06:31 AM
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Posted about my terrible story awhile back. Went through a long sad/depressed stage. Now I'm in a angry stage. Wife's partner has a small videography business and lists his clients on his website, one being a church. I still have a small amount hope left for recon. I been GAL for a little bit now and it really feels great. Still in back of my mind, I feel like this guy cant get get my wife and go through his life like he did the right thing. Is it ok to email his clients and let them know about who he is or is it best to take the high road? I'm sure doing this now will drive he and wife closer but any thoughts?


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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I would absolutely not reach out to OM's clients. You might be setting yourself up for legal trouble and it makes you look like the "crazy ex".

When they go low, you go high. Always take the high road.

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Originally Posted By: Tread
Let the church know. OM won't seem so desirable with a lack of funds. Plus there has to be some consequence for his actions.

I completely disagree. It isnt your business and it will only drive the two of them together.

Let W and OM live their lives while you focus on yours. A day will come when they get what is coming, but you interfering wont get you any closer to your goals.

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Please stick to one thread until your thread reaches 100 posts.
It is easier to keep track of your story and the advice you have been given that way.

I have merged this with your original thread


Me-70, D37,S36
Cadet #2744610 05/25/17 07:05 AM
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dale165 Offline OP
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Sorry about that Cadet, I never fully talked about this since she left in October. So many questions and it feels good to hear other people speak about it. I'm getting ahead of myself.

Most people I told said divorce her butt so its hard talking to outside people with no experience in this.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
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Originally Posted By: dale165
Most people I told said divorce her butt

Have you read Divorce Remedy?

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I have not got a single crazy response here. Most are sound and logical. I tried a different board before I discovered this one and the answers were terrible.

So thank yall for that.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
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Kaizen, I got it Monday and Id say halfway through. I been working late catching up on the lost work. I found out in tax season, that's my money making season. Luckily my clients understood, didn't tell them the actual story but explained to some that I have an issue I'm trying to resolve.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
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Originally Posted By: Kaizen
Originally Posted By: Tread
Let the church know. OM won't seem so desirable with a lack of funds. Plus there has to be some consequence for his actions.

I completely disagree. It isnt your business and it will only drive the two of them together.

Let W and OM live their lives while you focus on yours. A day will come when they get what is coming, but you interfering wont get you any closer to your goals.


I have to agree with Kaizen here. In my situation the AP is in a very public position and I was advised by my A to do no such thing as to expose it. I was very tempted to do so early on. And if you think about it, what difference would it make if you do? Doing something like that is not going to cause your W to want to come back into the MR.

The "when they go low you go high" is excellent advice.


Me46 W46 M25yrs T29yrs
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Thanks guys, just keep thinking why the heck they get to have fun and ride off in sunset while ruining a person. Seeing the OM get payback would only be instant gratification but do zero for my mental health and life.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
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Any man that would get involved with a married woman with kids is no kind of a man. That is what I tell myself over and over.


Me46 W46 M25yrs T29yrs
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No kids on my end but I agree either way!


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
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So saturday my wife calls me and we spoke on the phone for about an hour. She explains that she too has been researching and thinking about recon. She says that over our 7 years together that she can't think of one great or magic moment. She says she believes in fairy tales and that OM is just proud to be with her and I never was. There is nothing she can go back on and say hey this can work, she explained. In summary, she says that she has no more energy for this relationship and that she's done.

Is this starting to sound hopeless? Should I continue DB? Her saying there was nothing great in 7 years probably hurt worse just as bad as affair. Side note, she said all this after she found out my some more of my friends know, I was keeping this relatively secret. But after 9 months, it's hard to not keep it all in.

Following day we went to beach along with her family. Had a blast, didn't bring relationship up once. We held hands, kissed, laughed, played etc. This was planned a month in advance and I wanted to see some of her family. My family lives hours away so I basically connected with hers more than mine. Her dad says I'm too good for her. Just rough having to let them go as well.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
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Hi Dale, I'm sorry for your current situation. And what your W said must have been hard to hear. It is common for WAS to say things like this and we call it 're-writing history.' It can help an unfaithful spouse feel more justified in their choices. And she may also want you to feel there is no hope. Or she may feel there is no hope just now. But things can and do change. They may or may not in your situation, but IMHO hope of reconciliation only fades if or when you decide to move on.

As for whether you should continue DBing. It is important to know that DBing has two facets - firstly it is a way of 'saving yourself' in extremely testing circumstances. Secondly, it is a strategy for trying to save your marriage. It is important not just to focus on the latter, because this will lead you to post things like - I have done X Y and Z and some time has passed, but she hasn't....

The thing is you have tons of control in this situation - non of that (unfortunately!!) control extends to what she does and decides. And if she chooses to believe her current infatuation with grotty OM is a fairytale and true happiness resides - well that's up to her and my guess is she may come down to earth with a bump at some point going forwards.

Something really important for you to think about are your own personal boundaries, and why you would choose to carry on kissing and holding hands 'as though' you are a couple when (in effect and sorry if this stings) she has told you the R is over and she is someone else's girlfriend.

Actually, I'm quite sure my XH would have continued some kind of R with me, whilst he continued his liaison with OW. The last time he saw me (2.5 years ago) he said he felt swept away with love for me and wanted to hold my hand. But, some time after that meeting, I found that he had secret plans to visit OW that weekend. In any case, I had told him there would be no prospect of any R with me whilst he chose to continue seeing a third party.

In one phone call, he started to moan to me that OW wasn't being nice to him. I stopped him right there and told him - I'm your wife and I really don't want hear your complaints about your girlfriend. It did stop him in his tracks and he never did that again. And actually we never did reconcile. But, you know what? From a self-respect POV I never regretted doing any of those things and looking after myself in that horrible situation. For my relationship with me is more important than any R with anyone else.

So, focus on the primary point of DBing - save yourself. Make some plans and leave her twisting in the wind with just OM for company and no reassurance that you may be her reliable back up plan. I promise you, that may get her attention far quicker than you waiting in the wings and willing to take her back no matter what. And if it doesn't get her attention - well, that's not really a problem, because you will have been making positive forward progress rebuilding your life after her infidelity in any case.

Good luck with everything smile


T 13 M 7
Me 48 H 46
SS 15
BD 7.14 PA
D final 5.16 (H filed)

We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
Sotto #2744966 05/29/17 06:32 AM
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Dale,

You should definitely go with Sotto advice. It sounds as if she's trying to save face with her family. So I can only assume that they don't have a clue on what she's been up to. If she can't do any of those things in private with you, then pull away from her in public. As far you taking her back. This where I'm confused in regards tot he DR book. It speaks as if your supposed to just ignore the actions of the WS and give it time. Then your WS is supposed to come around. I been dealing with my sitch for 5 months now. And began the DB practices in March. Changes have been noticed. Not sure where we'll be at by 9 months. But I'm going to be patient for now.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
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Thanks sotto and tread. If you read my previous posts, you can see I'm somewhat babbling and duplicating questions. I've had too many stitches and broken bones to remember but I've never felt emotional pain until now. This is a whole new meaning of pain for me. She is the only woman I've ever loved and had a real relationship. She changed my life from being a selfish party animal to a descent man. But, after talking to her calmly for the first time since she left, I have emotionally abandoned her alot though the relationship. Never cheated, physically or verbally abused her, I just became kind of a empty shell. For a long period of time I didn't want to go anywhere or see any friends. So I know I pushed her away and took her for granted. I wasn't an angel in this process. That being said, I was immature coming into this relationship because I didn't know what I was doing. [censored] it takes a nuclear bomb to figure this out. I may have made her out to be the bad guy but she was a great wife until all this nonsense. She tried lifting me up when I was down but I ignored most of it. Thabk yall for listening, always been tough on outside, inside I'm just a kitten sometimes. Hard to admit that.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
Affair began August 2016

Me 31 years old
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I see something was censored in previous post, sorry moderator. I wouldn't use that kind of language on here so I'm not sure what word it censored.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
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Hi Dale165 - just wanted to say you aren't going through this alone. My wife has completely rewritten history to a version she feels justifies her A. At first this hurt me terribly. It is only through IC and deep reflection that I've come to realize the things she says and accuses me of simply are not true. A lot of the pain comes from just hearing these things from someone you have put your deepest trust in.

As for the kissing etc, my W is the exact opposite. She tries to sit as far away from me whenever possible, avoids me, locks bathroom door in MBR. I guess this is all for the better. I'm not sure I could handle it if she were to be wanting to be affectionate and carrying on with OM.

Stay strong friend and keep detaching and doing things for yourself and your own healing.


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Dale,

Don't feel so bad. I too have been guilty of neglect. Every MR probably goes through that as couples get comfortable and complacent. But sure most spouse would run off into the arms of other people. So don't put all the blame on yourself. Far too often in these cases the S being cheated on has no clue how the other WS feels. Some actual communication with myself and not other people certainly would helped in my own MR. But I won't dwell on that. Acknowledging your faults is the first step to improving yourself.


MR: 15 T:17
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Resolut and Tread,

Anything you guys did in particular to help? I know GAL and such, but just one thing that really helped? I see we have pretty similar stories. I was GALing pretty good for several weeks and she noticed big time but my inconsistencies have brought this down to little or no pulse. When I see and talk to her, the cycle starts all over.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

Wife left October 2016
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Me 31 years old
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Hi Dale,

In my case I've just come clean and admitted to my wife that I'm normal. I'm a human being and that I've made mistakes. Through my own IC I have tried to examine the M from her POV and also from things she has said to me directly are my shortcomings. I have written those down into a very, very short list of apologies. Its very simple. I plan on giving it to her sometime but I don't know when. I am NOT admitting my actions are responsible for her A or her behavior. I have no part in that. I am simply being humble and seeing my own shortcomings. This is part of my own healing as well. I've also told her that I have hope and I would like the opportunity to make our future together better but there's no way for that to ever happen while she's still in the A.


Me46 W46 M25yrs T29yrs
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Sounds like a good idea. I done a small version of that and her comeback was we are just not the same people and that she has never had a "great" time with me. Many good times, but never magic as she says. That hurt pretty bad, like the relationship was a lie. She also said she could never be herself with me. She was relatively simple with me. She liked her makeup and dresses and other feminine stuff. With the OM, its has been taken to a new level. Tanning, hair extensions, shoes, clothes, personal makeup sessions and all kinds of stuff.

This is going to sound superficial but I look 100 times better than the OM and probably make 3-5 times more than him. That's all I can go on at the moment, it sounds shallow but I cant think of anything else I have. My integrity is obviously way higher but she says he is so proud of her and way more fun than me. I'm 31 now, I was a party animal and acted too crazy at times to about age 25 but with her I went from wild to boring. Never got that nice balance. I guess that was a big problem as well.

We do have a huge shared interest in fitness and that's about it. OM is pretty overweight so maybe fitness can bring us back. I'm sorry if all that sounds superficial, but I really cant think of anything else. I thought we had many great times and trips, hard pill to swallow.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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Dale,

She's in her fog. You have to detach and not go there. Its not good for you. Keep doing things for you.

I'm right along with you on a lot of this. My W and I are both 46 and her AP is 16 years older than her! In reality there is no contest here but again she's completely irrational and in a fog. I keep telling myself I can do so much better.


Me46 W46 M25yrs T29yrs
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Yeah fog is definantely a nice way to put it.

One last question before I forget:

I do want this marriage to work but its starting to get a little messy. My wife and I are standing in a mutual friend's wedding over the summer. My wife is now dropping out the wedding because she thinks she has a target on her back. I only told a few trustworthy friends about my dilemma. The engaged couple knows and the girl is really hurt because my wife wants to drop out. Somehow another friend found out and they are not so kind to my wife. They made a snippy comment online and unfriended her. Just little things like that.

Im almost done with DR book and will have to consult when home but have you betrayed guys and gals told many people? Its been 9 months for me and my friends aren't stupid so they been asking and I told a few.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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Dale,

I told very few people. But those closest to us know and aren't the least bit happy about it. My W told her best friend and his W right after the A started. They knew about it before I did and advised her to stop before she got caught. My W being stubborn clearly didn't follow their advice and got caught. This guy has been best friends with my W since they were 9 years old. Once he found out that my W had been spreading lies about me(she was telling him and his wife different stories about me). He called me up and filled me in on the details about the A that I didn't know about. And then they cut off contact with her all together. W wants to act as if that wasn't a big deal, but I could that she was seriously hurt by that. They were likely going to be her support system once she leaves me. And her behaviour cost her that.

I told a couple who are also close friends of ours. And they tried to have an intervention. They are religious and don't believe in BD. But after spending countless amounts of time trying to get through to my W, they're just disappointed in her. They haven't completely cut her off. But her lies to them as well has damaged that relationship. And they'll never be close with her again. They believe if you can do that to your H that you claim to love, then your capable of doing harm to anybody. Other than those people and myself. My W has nobody else in her life that she can be completely honest and open with. So this is why, I believe that she will try her hardest to have me as a best friend. But if the MR ends, then I refuse to be friends with someone who would kick their family to the curb to chase after another woman's H.

Other than that, I told two friends from work that I'm extremely cool with. But they have no interaction with my W. And then my parents and siblings know. Not sure how many people my W have told.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
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Thanks Tread. It's a weird subject for us. She keeps wanting to know who I told, yet her boyfriend has made their relationship public on facebook since September and posts something every week of them two. I'm from town A, live in town B, and they are in town C. These towns are about 30 minutes from each. I don't have any mutual friends with the boyfriend so I didn't know for 6 months plus I don't have a Facebook until I created a fake one to snoop. I dislike social media for this very reason. I disliked it even before I found out. Now some friends of I and W are finding out and she is getting mad at me for making her out to be a bad person. Not my fault I get random calls asking how my marriage is bc someone seen my wife and boyfriend out. Pretty ironic she gets mad at that yet boyfriend posts about their life together. I asked her why she let him post stuff and her reply is that she can't control him. Pretty sorry answer and logic but hey I guess logic was thrown out a long time ago.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Dale,

Don't feel the least bit bad. These are the consequences that come with WS actions. Reality always eventually comes crashing down on their fantasy world. All you need to do is just sit back and watch the show. WS think they can have it all. But the A will always the cause the decent friends to pull away from them.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
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BD/PA/EA: 12/2016
Tread #2745193 05/30/17 07:43 PM
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I agree with Tread. I think in many cases where you are not sure what to do then do nothing. Sit back and let things play out. Maybe your 180 is to have a blast at the wedding?

I actually envy you that you have friends that know about the A. In my case no one accept my IC and attorney know AFAIK. It's difficult for me to just sit and watch my W get away with this. I was hit with a feeling this afternoon that her world could come crashing down.


Me46 W46 M25yrs T29yrs
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Thanks, it got pretty ugly last night but maybe this will help. My best friends wife blew up on her last night. Now W is saying the world is against her, etc. I'm still not going to tell people yet but maybe this will help her. My best friends wife isn't mean but doesn't hold back either. When my wife brings up certain friends of hers, I ask her if she told them. All makes since now, she hast told anyone with a high leval of integrity. The people she told is halfway descent but they have some relationship issues and problems doing the right thing. So her biggest concern is escaping from this clean.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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It's typical for a WW to ditch old friends and make new ones, primarily b/c of her current lifestyle.

Although this may be painful for you to watch, these are consequences for decisions she has made. If you want to listen, then do it. I just don't think you should engage, as an attempt to get on her better side or buddy up with her. Don't try to rescue her. She has to deal with the mess she has caused.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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Yeah I guess consensus is to disengage and let her deal with it. Plus I don't have a choice now, she told me today she wants to end communication because it will never work. She says my family and friends hate her and that it will never be the same. Plus she said that our Sunday beach trip was one of the best trips she ever had with me and that it is only confusing her more because I waited this long to give her what she needed. I guess a little NC wont hurt. We probably went one day without talking for our 7 year relationship.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Please stop referring to her douche bag affair partner as her "boyfriend". Married women don't have boyfriends. They have scummy douche bag affair partners. Only a total lowlife scumbag of a "man" would mess around with another man's wife. That makes you 1000 times the better man. You need to realize that and project your confidence and self worth. Don't be anyone's doormat. Nobody respects a doormat.



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Thanks Tx, its weird you say that because I actually thought the same thing last night. I told myself, I don't think married people can have a bf/gf. They should just be referred to as OM or OW. I'm just starting to learn the acronyms by the way.

I'm just going to give her the space. Maybe her realization will come through soon. I have too many abilities that I'm wasting at the moment, ready to thrive again.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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After my wife's friend blast, w has went from let's not talk anymore to let's plan a weekend together to see if we can muster up that old spark. She also asked me to help with resume. I doubt she said weekend thing to manipulate me to help with resume. Admittedly, I was very excited but I did tone that down after much thought. Of course I want to go but I'm sure she will have her daily swing of emotions, especially after being directly confronted by a mutual friend. The mutual friend kicked the w out of her wedding bc the mutual friend was actually not to biased (mutual friend is my best friends fiance so they are more my friend than w) but she actually put alot of effort into understanding my wife's problems. My W just blew her off for months which made friend upset, like maybe their friendship wasn't what she thought.

Just an update, maybe the confrontation will ultimately help, maybe not but wife def needed to hear those things.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Have no expectations in the weekend get away. It's not likely she will feel sparks with her H, when she is in a firery affair with OM.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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Exactly, I did temper my excitement down because of that. Long as she lives and sees this guy , no chance. That was pretty interesting but what I'm more hopeful is that she comes to realize what she has caused. I have a feeling that since someone finally told her how it is, she may be sorry and remorseful, or it drives her further away. Since we bond over fitness, I may plan to go to one of those obstacle course events but it appears with the OM, she has become high maintenance so who knows if she will like that.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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But otherwise, thank you guys again. I know I babble and this is one of the first times I've ever expressed my feelings about anything. People not going through this would never understand. My family was never great communicators or affectionate but would have your back no matter what. Pretty much how my relationship went with my wife.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Dale,

I with you in all of this. A lot of my thinking lately is: who can I be now that couldn't be before or during this relationship and my now WW. I see possibilities now of how I need to heal and who I need to grow into because of mistakes I've made or have never seen. The road is not going to be easy and I'm going to make mistakes. I'm no longer going to just let my WW hurt me though.


Me46 W46 M25yrs T29yrs
4 children
ILYBNILWY 1/30/17
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Right there with you. Having this along with kids must be making this process even more difficult for you plus the amount of time you have been together.

After reading the book, this walk away wife deal seems to be one of the toughest obstacles to overcome. Consistency has been my biggest problem. I make some good progress then my wife ignores me or I find out her and OM are going on trips, cruises, etc. then I revert back to the sad person. Time is a friend but could also be an enemy. Doing the wrong things over and over may just seal the deal. Also one of reasons for leaving was me being distant, so that makes it tough as well.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Dale,

You need to stop keeping tabs on her movements with OM. Its going to drive you crazy. Your competing with the fantasy, which is extremely difficult. Especially with all these vacations they are taking. Everything is rainbows and sunshine until they end up having to deal with other in reality. So just keep the focus on you and GAL even harder.


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No doubt about it. I don't have anyone on the inside to let me know since they are in another city so that's good. I think I may have said but I work in front a computer all day, it's just a few keystrokes and I'm there but I did have her change her passwords to everything. I found myself looking at every website to login and look for things. Haven't done this in weeks with exception of that cruise line call, so I'm getting there. I get easily distracted with all this.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Originally Posted By: dale165
After my wife's friend blast, w has went from let's not talk anymore to let's plan a weekend together to see if we can muster up that old spark.


Why are you agreeing to this? No way would I plan a weekend with my spouse if I knew they were in an affair with another person. In my opinion, it's likely that you will go and she will be comparing her feelings for you with those for OM, but you honestly cant compete, because she wont have those first feelings of 'butterflies' for you; that just isnt how life works. It feels like she's doing it to give her the ammo to say 'I tried'.

And Id for sure make her get some type of STD testing done before I messed around with her.

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You hit the dang nail on the head. It took me awhile to figure this out but I did. So I told her she needs to show me something before we can go. Not necessarily move back in but something along the lines of kicking this guy out of her apartment. Something to show me that this isn't some sort of "feel good" for her conscience.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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I booked the place for July 28 but I definitely made sure there was a refund policy. Who knows what will happen in two months.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Originally Posted By: dale165
So I told her she needs to show me something before we can go. Not necessarily move back in but something along the lines of kicking this guy out of her apartment. Something to show me that this isn't some sort of "feel good" for her conscience.


I think youre on the right track, but the logic in your head is a little turned around. See, your focus should be on what YOU need - not what SHE needs to do. For example, saying things to her like "Im not willing to go out with someone that is in a relationship with another person." Then it becomes about what your needs are as opposed to controlling certain aspects of what she does.

Id recommend reading the boundary thread for more (and frankly, better) insight.

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I looked at some of your posts Kaizen, what's your story? You seem to be nice but direct at the same time. Sometimes just what a person needs.


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Originally Posted By: dale165
Kaizen, what's your story?


Suspected my ex was in an EA for several months. Had BD and separated a month later. Divorced ~6 months later. Ex married OP 6 months after that. I learned a lot about myself and about what I want in a relationship during that time and have been dating my new partner for around 18 months. I have two kids in elementary school. Id say I get along with my ex relatively well; we can be in the same room civilly, but it's been essentially completely NC for a few years with the exception of co-parenting talk.

So...no, I didnt save my marriage. In fact, I wouldnt say I ever came at all close. But, I made PLENTY of mistakes, so my aim is to try to help others avoid the things I did.

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Well thanks for sticking around and it seems like your doing pretty good.

Mind if I ask how their marriage is going? Those kind of marriages tee me off.


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Kaizen, thank you for the wonderful advice you provide here. I find you such a sensible and level-headed guy. I have learned much from your approach. I hope that you are profoundly happy in your relationship and that your kids are doing well.

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Originally Posted By: dale165
Mind if I ask how their marriage is going? Those kind of marriages tee me off.


You can ask, but, frankly, I have no idea. Im not really all that interested to find out either.

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Originally Posted By: OwnIt
Kaizen, thank you for the wonderful advice you provide here. I find you such a sensible and level-headed guy. I have learned much from your approach. I hope that you are profoundly happy in your relationship and that your kids are doing well.


Well, thanks! My approach isnt really any different from what MWD or my coach talked to me about.

- Do what works
- Small, consistent change
- Figure out my goals and make sure to work towards them

And so on.

smile

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Well thanks again, your doing the public a great service. I sadly was hoping you would say the ex's relationship fell apart. Ya know, you moved on and that's all that counts. Even with what your ex did, seeing her in pain wont make you happy.

My work has been suffering big time and even the owner came told me, control what you can and leave what you cant alone. Cant force anything.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Sandi or anyone else out there:

I find my willingness to continue to wane. Crawling up to 10 months. Im seeing subtle changes in her but starting to see a lot of negatives.

1) On paper, wife and AP is way more compatible than me and her. They are from same city, hurricane Katrina relocated them. They both have a love for New Orleans. Both had a rough childhood, both love to travel, both like going out and being "seen", both love to take 1000s of photos, AP divorced his wife for reasons my wife wants a divorce, both love music. Im partly some of those things but I'm much simpler.

2) I'm worried if recon even happens, I wont be able to keep up with her newfound high maintenance.

I know ultimately its up to me but has anyone came across this? Not giving up because just tired, but just because spouse changed way too much.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Originally Posted By: dale165
Thanks Tx, its weird you say that because I actually thought the same thing last night. I told myself, I don't think married people can have a bf/gf. They should just be referred to as OM or OW. I'm just starting to learn the acronyms by the way.

I'm just going to give her the space. Maybe her realization will come through soon. I have too many abilities that I'm wasting at the moment, ready to thrive again.


I totally understand the resistance to calling an AP a gf/bf, but
fwiw, calling an OW a 'whore" would get a wife nowhere fast.

Just saying...


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

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Whore?? I thought it meant other woman??


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Originally Posted By: dale165
Sandi or anyone else out there:

I find my willingness to continue to wane. Crawling up to 10 months. Im seeing subtle changes in her but starting to see a lot of negatives.


are these^^ objective negatives in her that you never noticed before, or she's now changing, or are they negative reactions/emotions in You?


1) On paper, wife and AP is way more compatible than me and her. They are from same city, hurricane Katrina relocated them. They both have a love for New Orleans. Both had a rough childhood, both love to travel, both like going out and being "seen", both love to take 1000s of photos, AP divorced his wife for reasons my wife wants a divorce, both love music. Im partly some of those things but I'm much simpler.

don't play into this^^^. It gets you nowhere.



2) I'm worried if recon even happens, I won't be able to keep up with her newfound high maintenance.

are these really newfound or previously ignored, or what? AND don't get ahead of yourself here. Piecing is damn hard.

Cross that bridge when you get there.


I know ultimately its up to me but has anyone came across this? Not giving up because just tired, but just because spouse changed way too much.


this^^ is valid, okay? Discovering sides to our spouses we didn't know about

OR learning that they have changed

or not caring about whether they changed or we just learned more about them, can propel an LBSer forward in their new life.

I think there are 2 parts to this, at least.

1) one is figuring out whether you can handle the way you are being treated

AND Not whether she is new/different/or changing - *b/c in the end all that matters is how she treats you

(and focusing only on that, saves you a TON of time mind reading about MLC or WAW or wayward, etc)

and


2) - how YOU feel about her, after the dust settles.

Only you can decide what you can tolerate for how long, & how you feel about the woman you see.


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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Originally Posted By: dale165
Whore?? I thought it meant other woman??


OW does mean "other woman", I'm just saying that bashing the AP does nothing positive or productive.

And at least as it applies to wives, it makes us look bitter and vindictive to call an OW a "whore".

It's just beneath me.

I think air quotes calling an AP a "GF/BF" who is with our spouse while we are married,

is perfectly reasonable.


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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the thing in your situation Dale, is that your marriage is short, but you were with your w for 7 years.

Cheating this early on is not a good sign, obviously. Yet You seem sincerely surprised by her behaviors and your discoveries.

So what was the r like before you were married? Why did you guys wait so long before marrying? No judging!

Did you have reservations about her fidelity and or did she not want to get married?


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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Yes, it happens. I've seen LBH'S reconcile with the W and later realize they could not get pass the things she did. Instead of the H giving up b/c he could not measure up to her high maintenance, it's been more H's realizing they no longer felt the same about the W.

When a H puts so much work into getting back his W, his emotional energy can be spent quickly. That's one of the reasons we push newcomers to focus at working on themselves, GAL, etc. Working on himself should not be a method to just get her back again, b/c as soon as he feels she is back in the MR.......his "improvements" fall by the wayside. He should focus on how to improve himself as a man in the relationships in his life. This is not about him measuring up, or competing for his WW.

When I read your post, it sounds as if you are saying the OM is more qualified to fill the position of husband to your W. Although we occasionally see this thinking in a LBH, it is not the more common mindset. IMHO, it comes when the LBH feels he has been placed in a competition with the OM, and feels inferior to him. frown

If you decide to bow out of the M, then do it b/c it is best for you. Don't consede defeat b/c you feel OM would make a better H for your W.

If you are worn out and emotionally drained, why not drop the rope and not focus on your W? Make a life apart from her and do the things you enjoy. If she wants to mess up her life, then let her go. Don't give her the control to destroy you and your opportunity for whatever your future holds.

Your W is not the prize here, so don't compete for her. Don't think of yourself as a loser. Whether the M succeeds or fails.........you are the winner in Dale's life. You are the star!

((hugs))


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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I'm definitely surprised about the cheating. Her character and morals were high by most standards before.

We had a good/different relationship. We both were in school for a lot of the relationship. Soon as I finished CPA exam in 2012 I worked 80 hrs a week on a contract job for 2 years. She was in school for nurse practioner, that was a lot of schooling plus she worked at a bar at night (Where she met guy back in 2013). She was very controlling in the beginning. I would get 2 days off a month during that contract job. So we basically seen each other at night. I guess we never got to bond like we should have. Physical attraction was super high in the beginning. Back to the controlling, she would get mad even if I wanted to play golf. I soon began making up stuff and lying to friends on why I couldn't go places with them. I began withdrawing from everything soon after. We became distant emotionally, but she tried way harder than I did to bring us back. This continued to get worse before marriage but we still got married.

To answer why so long, me being complacent and all her schooling. She was in school for 6 of our 7 years.

No reservations about her fidelity. Not 100% but Id bet just about anything she was faithful for most of it. She was always home, didn't care about her phone, looks to a degree. The in july 2016, she started acting way diffent. Brought her phone even to take a bath. Would get "called out at work" all the time. Sleep out 3-4 nights a week. I should have known then.

Sorry for rambling, but to summarize. We never had a great, firework relationship as she calls it now but we always had each others backs and had a good time for the most part. We shared secrets with each other no one else know, her family took me in as their own. She became best friends with my mom. Wasn't a movie relationship but wasn't bad either.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Thanks Sandi. I don't feel inferior at all to him. Better looking, make way more money, honest, dependable, caring etc. What he has on me is fun and excitement. He's a bartender so he knows way more people than me. They like trips and fine dining every week. I always been simple but I do need to get out more, one of her complaints.

Your right about the detaching thing. Its my time now, cant do it anymore. Not saying I will divorce, but just cant focus on the M for awhile. This has prob taken 10 years off my life. You guys provide great advice hear, I'm just hard headed. When I want something right or wrong, I obsess over it.


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That is a lot of school, and a lot of time apart.

Of the 35 year marriage I'm leaving now, a LOT of the last decade was in a commuter marriage or with h far away (for h's "career/money" -adventure, never by my choice, and h is an MD so none of the time apart was needed. Especially in hindsight, certainly not paying off financially).

Bottom line is It takes a toll on all m's. And we had children and so much history.

You say she did the heavy lifting in the m. So, would that part be different from before, if you two reconciled?

Also, even though it sounds as if complacency on your end and feelings of rejection on her end would be legit issues for her,

I really like Sandi's point about how you need to stop thinking you are in a competition with this OM. You're not competing with him, even if it feels that way (and I know it can).

You & your w had something real, and you DID bond. You have history and you both achieved a lot professionally, and you shared things with each other that no one else is part of.

She's close to your mom. On the whole I think it's a positive. (It's way better than her hating your family, obviously)

To sum up, the focus now needs to be ALL ABOUT YOU (all!)

b/c waiting for your w to maybe awaken or maybe regret or maybe change back...

is all about HER.

It's time for you to be in charge of how your next chapter goes.

Make sense?


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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Originally Posted By: dale165
Thanks Sandi. I don't feel inferior at all to him. Better looking, make way more money, honest, dependable, caring etc. What he has on me is fun and excitement. He's a bartender so he knows way more people than me. They like trips and fine dining every week.

You are my son's age. As a mother, when I read ^^this, I want to pat your head and tell you to just STOP.

Being novel IS exciting...and then it's not novel anymore.


Unless you actually oppose traveling, (in which case she can travel with a female friend like many people do when their spouses are busy working) you can start taking trips. So they like "fine dining?" Oh, so you like "bad greasy" food?

I mean, who doesn't like "fine dining"?? (Or walks on the beach...) Don't believe the cliches that are being spouted out.


I'm sorry your heart is broken and I am sorry your w is a foolish woman who worked so hard in her career for so long, married to a man in the same boat, that when she finally looks around for some passion in her m, she assumes it cannot come from her h b/c you've both been in worker mode and mistakenly neglected the passion every m needs to some extent, some more than others.


I always been simple but I do need to get out more, one of her complaints.

Your right about the detaching thing. Its my time now, cant do it anymore. Not saying I will divorce, but just cant focus on the M for awhile.


indeed you cannot. It's not helping the situation or you.

This has prob taken 10 years off my life.


you can learn to have an inner peace and more balance in your life than you might have otherwise. In time you may well be ahead and guess what? YOU are in charge of this.


You guys provide great advice hear, I'm just hard headed. When I want something right or wrong, I obsess over it.


been there, done that, like 95% of us.

Don't pooh pooh meditation. See a therapist if you are not already.

DO GAL

We hammer GAL for a reason, which is that it works. Besides, I do not know another way to detach.

((( )))


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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Thanks for all your input 25! Truth is, I got in such a rut, I didn't know how to get out. All I did was go to work and just wanna come home. I was always into athletic stuff and fitness but quit during that several years. My wife is not athletic but sure enough she got into something I really liked but during that span I chose not to do it with her. She was a great wife, she tried very hard to snap me out of it. I would say after she left our home, I did an excellent job at addressing her concerns but when I found out about the affair in march I gave up.

As far as traveling and fine dining goes, I def like those things! Not so much dining, but I still was ok with it! Just never got into restaurants for some reason, once I find a place I like I'll just go there lol.

Bottom line is that we were busy alot and I neglected her feelings. Your right, she did the heavy lifting. We did share a bond albeit not fireworks and fairytale as she calls it. This OM showers her with attention and gifts. She can't get enough. So I somewhat understand where she is coming from. She still says she wishes that was me doing it to her, for what that's worth. She's hard headed like me but really nice at the same time so I'm sure she's going to have a hard time dumping him if she ever gets to that point.

And you guys are totally right, GAL it is. It's going to be tough because we bought a house in her neck of the woods which is 45 min from mine. Gonna be tough sometimes but hey it beats feeling sorry for myself.


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Id say I get along with my ex relatively well; we can be in the same room civilly, but it's been essentially completely NC for a few years with the exception of co-parenting talk.

Sorry for the hijack Dale.

Kaizen,

With your ex and you being civil and you being in a new relationship, why are you strictly NC with exception of co-parenting talk?

Thanks!

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Originally Posted By: LH19
Id say I get along with my ex relatively well; we can be in the same room civilly, but it's been essentially completely NC for a few years with the exception of co-parenting talk.

Sorry for the hijack Dale.

Kaizen,

With your ex and you being civil and you being in a new relationship, why are you strictly NC with exception of co-parenting talk?

Thanks!


I am not answering for you, Kainzen, but I wanted to give some perspective from my sitch.

My ex married his AP and we both have moved on. We have a daughter, so we really only contact about coparenting stuff and we could ALL be together civilly. We do so for sporting events and the such.

But NC for us means we do not call and ask how each other is doing. We aren't friends. We are civil for peace and for our daughter.

So, I wouldn't say we are no contact, but by Kaizen's definition, we are no contact except for coparenting. Which to me means, we aren't friends. He is not someone I would ever want to be friends with.

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LH19,

Hijack away! Maybe I can get some useful info from yall talking than me talking. I'm very hard headed with little to know results thus far:) Finally got beat up enough to leave it alone for awhile.


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Originally Posted By: Ginger1
Originally Posted By: LH19

Kaizen,

With your ex and you being civil and you being in a new relationship, why are you strictly NC with exception of co-parenting talk?

Thanks!

My ex married his AP and we both have moved on. We have a daughter, so we really only contact about coparenting stuff and we could ALL be together civilly. We do so for sporting events and the such.

But NC for us means we do not call and ask how each other is doing. We aren't friends. We are civil for peace and for our daughter.

So, I wouldn't say we are no contact, but by Kaizen's definition, we are no contact except for coparenting. Which to me means, we aren't friends. He is not someone I would ever want to be friends with.

Id say I agree with this. Why would I want to be friends with someone that shows no remorse for lying to me, cheating on me, etc, etc? The kids deserve for their parents to be on speaking terms, they are too young with too many awesome life events still to come to need to worry about having their parents in separate rooms all the time. That doesnt mean I want to go on double dates or anything like that.

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To all the great people here, thank you for your replies and advice. Been 5 days of detachment. Last Friday was our 7 year anniversary, made it tough but I'm getting better. Since Im a math guy, I would put my healing at 3%. If I kept going the way I was, I may have been sent to a psych ward (joking but who knows, I was almost there). I was forgetting how to do menial tasks. Hard to even get a constructive email or post done. In my 30 years, I never suffered any kind of loss. No family, friends, or relationships since she was my first one. I was clueless and still am to a degree. My mind was constantly filled with trash such as how can I embarrass them? I need to jump on dating websites to find out who's left? Why me? I've done some embarrassing things through this. One glaring example would be I spent almost all day going on any website and seeing if my wife's login/pw combination worked. I found some crazy stuff. Stuff I wish I could erase.

My relationship immaturity has shined through this. Even though what my W has done is despicable, she is still my wife and I need to show her some respect. I decided not to give up on my M but I have decided to let go. When I say I couldn't do it anymore, I really couldn't.

She is going to Mexico for 7 days this week, couldn't have happened at a better time. She wouldn't be able to talk anyways.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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Originally Posted By: dale165


My relationship immaturity has shined through this. Even though what my W has done is despicable, she is still my wife and I need to show her some respect. I decided not to give up on my M but I have decided to let go. When I say I couldn't do it anymore, I really couldn't.



That resonates with my commitment. I took a vow. I am not insane that I believe we will guaranteed be together forever. But I said in sickness and in health. I have always been better when she needs me to be there for her (except two days ago but I need to forgive myself as it didn't ruin everything, nothing had even started really). She has acknowledged that and maybe if I am not pushing her to think about the M while she figures out if depression is a real threat here (she says it is, and it is OBVIOUS from her erratic behavior).

I did the same with checking websites. I downloaded Tinder which was new to me haha... turns out she just used OKcupid but whatever.

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Just thought I'd update on my detachment:

Its been a week now of detachment with exception of reviewing my wife's resume. I helped her out for a new job. This has been hard and somewhat easy at the same time. I ran myself in the dirt pursuing, checking texts/emails, and snooping. Its hard bc I miss my wife but somewhat easy bc I had nothing left in the tank. My life has become miserable, constant obsession over this A and AP. I looked at myself in the mirror and seen a 30 year old with baggy eyes due to no sleep, barely shaved, and just sloppy looking. Haven't smoked in 7 years and I find myself buying more and more packs of ciggs. I had enough. I called my old IC and made some appointments. I actually wrote down a list of goals and short term things I neglected over the months.

The good news is that my relationship with W hasn't gotten any worse. I fully understand that these goals and changes should be for me to feel better about myself and improve the quality of my life. The W recently said she is sorry for all this and she wishes she could be doing the exciting things she does with AP with me. I do believe her to an extent. On paper, there is no comparison between me and AP. Wife got the attention she needed so I will leave her be and let her figure it out. During my snooping and as she alluded, looks like she been footing the bill for their fun. Once adulthood comes back into play, good chance she will have her awakening. If not Ill be ok regardless.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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Affair began August 2016

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And if anyone has any advice:

As I mentioned before, wife and I are supposed to go on a weekend trip July 28. Is below a flawed way of thinking?

Just go and see what happens. I haven't been alone with my wife for probably more than 3-4 hours since October. I do plan on continuing my detached state but plan on speaking to her if she speaks to me. Our marriage fell apart because of me detaching so that's kind of hard. I was thinking maybe I should go since hopefully Ill be in a stable state of mind then. My plan was to go and see how its works out. If nothing, then Ill just have to go dark after that. I was thinking that as an internal deadline. I wont tell her that of course.

As told by Kaizen don't do it. At the moment I agree but was wondering if my counter has any legs or just wishful thinking?


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
T 7 Years

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Originally Posted By: Dale
Our marriage fell apart because of me detaching so that's kind of hard.

In my opinion, you need to go light on the no contact, for this reason. Your wife sought attention elsewhere, because she wasn't happy with the amount and quality of the attention she was getting from you. Going completely no contact is just doing more of the same. She needs to see a new improved Dale. I recommend to you MWD's Last Resort Technique video series that you can watch as soon as you buy it, especially if you prefer video rather than the book. It also goes into more detail on the LRT than the book does, I think. In the video series, she explains that sometimes no contact and not pursuing should be done lightly, in cases where lack of pursuit and attention lead to your problems. And I agree.

Originally Posted By: Dale
As told by Kaizen don't do it. At the moment I agree but was wondering if my counter has any legs or just wishful thinking?

I would say the trip is a big chance for you to show your wife a new loving, attentive, and fun Dale. It sounds like she really loves you, and this other guy is just a temporary fling of excitement and novelty. She said she would rather be doing all these fun things with you. To me, that is a hugely positive statement about her feelings for you. Show her that she can do those things with you. Just don't try to do anything you aren't yet ready to do, because it's just too much for you at this time -- that kind of thing. Do what you can do to show her that you can be the man she had needed you to be. She has probably just needed to see you trying -- showing that you actually love her and care about her.

I am no expert. So, I suggest you talk to a DB Coach. And above all else, do what seems to make things better with your wife, and avoid the things that seem to make things worse, even if this goes against what people are telling you. Do what works. And remember that you are looking for baby step improvements. You've been doing this for a while now. So you understand that this isn't a quick process. Baby step improvements tend to lead on to more baby step improvements, until you are back where you want to be. It's like rekindling a fire. But know that it is a roller coaster ride, with big ups and downs.


M: 33, W: 30 @BD
M 7, T 10
BD: Early Dec
W left: Late Dec
W got stuff: Late Jan
W sent S papers: Mid Feb
OM cnfrmd: Late Feb

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[quote=dale165]To all the great people here, thank you for your replies and advice. Been 5 days of detachment. Last Friday was our 7 year anniversary, made it tough but I'm getting better. Since Im a math guy, I would put my healing at 3%.


okay real quick, ^^ this was my first laugh of the day. I have a brother who talks in math terms but unlike you, he has no math background~ Just throws out %'s all the time.
Bro means well~
Anyhow...



If I kept going the way I was, I may have been sent to a psych ward (joking but who knows, I was almost there). I was forgetting how to do menial tasks. Hard to even get a constructive email or post done.

We get it. The smallest of choices, even choices that were not necessarily triggering anything, seem hard...but worse when they trigger emotions, even indirectly.

Ex - I went to get a desperately needed filing cabinet for the enormous paperwork 35 years of memories and insurance and medical records & finances and Divorce related.....(h has the filing cabinets and ALL the paperwork but I was not in a position to get them, so that's life).

SO I "research" which filing cabinet to get...you'd think it was deciding which heart surgeon to use...but I finally (2-3 weeks later) decide on one, and I go to the store...

and oops, my car's trunk is not big enough. So I didn't get a filing cabinet. This was a month ago. My guest room "office" has piles of papers on the floor. Still. And I've been in my own place 100 days now.

The smallest of tasks, let alone emotional ones, seem too complicated or difficult.

Welcome to a barely functioning level of depression.

Know one thing; it gets better. I don't say that merely to console you, but to speak truth.



In my 30 years, I never suffered any kind of loss. No family, friends, or relationships since she was my first one. I was clueless and still am to a degree.

at age 16 my heart was broken. (To my surprise, that still counts as a top 10 most painful experiences of my life--No, no it does not hurt me NOW - but back then, I felt it very deeply & no r with another man hurt me again, till my marriage.)

By the time I was your age I'd lost a bff in a car accident and my dad to cancer.
Others who have faced loss will tell you this - in their own ways

-the pain lasts but it is not eternal - and it's deeply painful but it is not fatal.

My mind was constantly filled with trash such as how can I embarrass them? I need to jump on dating websites to find out who's left? Why me?

Grief books mention (OFTEN, almost naggingly) that one step we have to take is gratitude, or at least perspective.

Sheryl Sandberg (CEO of Facebook who lost her h suddenly) said she resisted the "gratitude" piece b/c she felt the exact opposite. She was not "grateful" that she managed laundry that day, and she was not "grateful" that she had so many good years with her h before he left (although she would not have traded those years for anything).

In time she conceded that her h's undiagnosed heart problems could have been triggered while he was driving her & the kids somewhere, and killed them all, rather than when he was alone, working out. She did cede that distinct possibility and that there was some "less than horrible/could have been much worse" dimension to her loss.

She pointed out that just getting perspective on bigger problems or worse things did help her with the one part of grief that felt self centered, the "why me?" part.

In the grand scheme of things - living in western cultures and developed nations means our problems of a broken heart might even seem like a luxury. A broken heart sure doesn't feel like a "Luxury"

but when pressed, I admit knowing most people in the world are wondering about where their food supply will come from, if their water is potable, or whether they''ll have marauding warlords in their village again, stealing their children and killing them, sometimes makes me stfu in my head.

Turning to my own community...There are so many divorces in our nation, it makes me sad to think about how many walking wounded there are all around us.


I've done some embarrassing things through this. One glaring example would be I spent almost all day going on any website and seeing if my wife's login/pw combination worked. I found some crazy stuff. Stuff I wish I could erase.


We get it. The desire for details is a strange invitation to more pain that most of us face. Maybe at some level we irrationally hope there will be validation of us - but that's just not at all likely, given the givens.

And this^^^ is something you can change and have learned from already. No more self inflicted pain, eh?


My relationship immaturity has shined through this. Even though what my W has done is despicable, she is still my wife and I need to show her some respect. I decided not to give up on my M but I have decided to let go. When I say I couldn't do it anymore, I really couldn't.

I think you're a fast learner.

Letting her go is not the same as giving up. Hope can remain - as long as it does not become attached to expectation or stagnation.


Hang in there



M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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Originally Posted By: dale165
And if anyone has any advice:

As I mentioned before, wife and I are supposed to go on a weekend trip July 28. Is below a flawed way of thinking?

Just go and see what happens. I haven't been alone with my wife for probably more than 3-4 hours since October. I do plan on continuing my detached state but plan on speaking to her if she speaks to me.

Hey, her A was wrong. No argument. But You admitted that you had let yourself go and got into a rut, etc.

You know your best self was not shown to her and that her AP IS SHOWING HIS BEST SELF albeit on her dime...

why not be your best authentic self? (Start with the visible things like looking your best)

Who did she fall in love with before all the constant school work and job demands?

Let's get that guy back, b/c he's real and he's you at your best.


Our marriage fell apart because of me detaching so that's kind of hard. I was thinking maybe I should go since hopefully Ill be in a stable state of mind then. My plan was to go and see how its works out. If nothing, then Ill just have to go dark after that.


Um, so you are letting her do all the heavy lifting again?


She does not know if she wants to be married to you. So what's with repeating the same old behavior that helped get you here? People DO get past affairs, (Esther Perel has a great book - & TED Talk video on "Infidelity" and what they mean, etc. Very Useful before you decide anything else down the road -as in you can watch now but decide LATER ON....

Look, I'm all about dealing with the pain of the A at some point and rebuilding and the very hard work of piecing but not now.

You are not there yet.

You want a reconciliation, or at least you hope for one. That will take hard work to get there and

THEN to address the underlying issues in piecing...(Glad you are seeing an IC!!)

I worry that you might be acting as if she will magically cure herself of unmet needs you admit were not met, so it'll seem like more of the same on your end. Plus, just hoping and waiting is relatively easier than deciding to do X or Y...

I am not advising pursuit. More like an upbeat interesting GAL detachment.
Like 'Hey,whatever is going on in your life, yeah, whatever I OTOH am learning and growing and becoming the man I was meant to become cool" (If she shares a problem of hers, NOT related to the r or AP, let her see the bonds you do have, from which something can be rebuilt, perhaps_)

I'm talking about you being a guy who brings something to the table other than his needs, a guy with his $hit together - fake it till you make it (Amy Cuddy has a TED Talk video you would benefit from, btw. Positive psychology and so does Sean Achor -very worthwhile)

I'm saying you have to SHOW HER with new behavior, that the marriage would be different/better than before.

Right or wrong, the possibility to change the m must come from you. For now


I was thinking that as an internal deadline. I wont tell her that of course.

As told by Kaizen don't do it. At the moment I agree but was wondering if my counter has any legs or just wishful thinking?


not getting the reference. Sorry

Also did you say you got a DB coach? They're very helpful & very specific for the unique aspects of each situation.

While there are universals in heartbreak and grief, there are also, always, unique pieces b/c we are unique individuals married to other unique individuals with our own stories.



M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 170
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dale165 Offline OP
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Wsh, thank you. Those words are reassuring. Complete no contact prob wouldn't work bc of my sitch. I will look up those videos, no idea they had them. I'm more of an audio guy so hopefully they will have those.

25, you always come in clutch with words when I need to hear them. Maybe I'm not as crazy as I thought:)

The W leaves tomm for Mexico for a week so I'll have more time to reflect on a plan. This past week has been a little easier than anticipated but I found my emotions are starting to become muted. I seen W yest at her family's house and it was as if I couldn't care less if we reconciled. My emotions took such a beating, I guess they need to be recharged. Also, my younger brother was sentenced to 18 months jail last week leaving behind 3 small children so maybe that affected me a little as well. I did go to the NCAA baseball super regional last night and played golf today so I got out and had some fun.

W did mention yest that her only stipulation on going in July was not to bring up AP bc he's a good guy. I just agreed and said yeah no problem.


M 1.5 years, her affair was before 1 year
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Dale, sorry man, I have to agree with a couple of others, here: OM is a low-life scumbag predator who saw no problem with pursuing a married woman. Such people are below contempt. I wouldn't agree to any such thing. "Good guy?" Lol. Waywards (SMH)...


H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18

"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7

"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
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Hoosjim, I said yeah ok bc my tank is empty. Trying to use my little energy to get myself backup. That convo came up bc she said one of my friends was rude bc she unfriended my wife on fb. So I asked w, what does ap friends think? She said they say it's ok bc AP has been in love with my wife for years. I was trying to win a lame argument so I just said yeah ok lol


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