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Newcomer Friends

I am opening this topic of discussion for the good of all on this board. Man, has this forum been crazy lately!

I see alot of confusion about what is right and what is wrong. I presume that all on this board are primarily interested in restoring their marriages. Unfortunately, I see alot of posts on this board that are sending a different message loud and clear.

The biggest issue seems to be finding the truth about affairs.It seems that many of us are hung up on this issue. We must know the truth and we need it now. Unfortunately, efforts to finding the truth tend to exacerbate strain on an already damaged relationship. I speak from the position of experience. My spying, prying, questioning and paying to have tele #'s traced brought me and my wife great pain. It almost ended my already strained marriage.

I chose to give up my search for me. I could not handle the pain it caused and I realized that it was counterproductive to my primary mission which was restore my marriage. If trust is to be restored, someone needs to make the first move. Let it be us.

I still am not sure about my W's adventures and wether or not she had a PA. However, I no longer dwell on this issue. I figure she will tell me if and when she is ready. How can I say this? How can I let it drop? Simple, I chose to forgive, if in fact it ever actually happened.


I have also seen a number of discussions about removal of wedding rings. I know this is a sensitive topic for some. This is my view.

The wedding band has deep emotional meaning. It is the visible sign post of our committment to another human being. It is displayed for all to see, so that they know of your committment. So if you are married, why would you consider taking it off? What kind of message does this send to your spouse during a time of great confusion and distress. The signal that it sends to me is that I have given up and I am no longer committed. If this is true, great. However, don't think the action of removing the ring will help restore your marriage. To continue wearing the wedding band during one of the most terrible times in our life is a sign of strength in our committment and vows. It shows that we are the "port in the storm".

Again, Our actions speak louder than words. Much louder. Our actions have credibility when our words often go unheard. I urge others to comment and add to this thread. I think it can be a learning experience for all of us.

Kent


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Kent:

Ring on about the OM, OW item.

I'm probably the only person in my group of people that know of my situation that doesn't think W is having a PA, or at least a EA.

I made the choice when the shit hit the fan that I would not spy, follow, etc. regarding this part of my life. If she is, and if she tells me about at a later time (or I find out by accident) I'm already in the place I need to be to forgive her.

It's hard. Having thoughts once in awhile that W may be in the arms of another man. But I block it out!!!!!!!

I know that some folks here my think I'm just fooling myself with this. But, it's my way of handling it. It's working for me and I'm sure I've made the right choice. It may not be the choice everyone makes. There's already enough work here for me to do. Making my marriage work is hard.

Thanks, Kent for bringing this up.

Scott


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Scott

Your not blocking out the possibility of an A, your blocking obsessing about it and allowing it to destroy you and your M. There is a big difference.


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KENT I AM NEW TO THIS FORUM AND HOPE IT WILL PROVIDE THE ANSWERS I AM LOOKING FOR. YOUR ADVICE ABOUT NOT SPYING MAKES SENSE. I DESPERATELY WANT TO TRUST MY W BUT FIND IT EXTREMELY HARD TO DO SO. I KNOW FROM EXPERIENCE THAT THE PAIN OF KNOWING FAR EXCEEDS THE PAIN OF NOT KNOWING. I STILL FIND IT HARD TO LET IT GO EVEN THOUGH I KNOW IT CAUSES ME TERRIBLE MENTAL ANGUISH. THERE IS A REMARKABLE PARALLEL BETWEEN MOST OF THE STORIES ON HERE. I THOUGHT I WAS WALKING ALONE ON THIS ONE, THAT NO ONE ELSE WAS WALKING IN MY SHOES. I AM HAPPY TO SEE THAT MAYBE THERE IS A SOLUTION TO MY MARITAL PROBLEMS OR AT LEAST THERE IS SOME SUPPORT OUT THERE. I DIDNT HAVE A CLUE AS TO WHERE TO GET HELP. IM GLAD I CAME TO THIS FORUM

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Kent,

Thanks for the information. I agree with most of everything you said, but have something to add for people to ponder.

I think that knowing if there is an affair is part of the healing process and also needs to be known if sex is still going on within the marriage. You can bet that if the WA is having an affair on you, the last thing they care about is giving you some STD or HIV. They are too selfish and self centered to think about anything but themselves and can not see the future.

I am not saying to beg, follow, plead or anything else that may drive them further away, but there are ways to find out without the WA knowing you are on to them. I think one has to know for their own health reasons.

Kent, I agree one can choose for forgive without knowing if an Affair took place, but one never forgets. I think in order the heal and truly put it behind you, one has to know the truth, face it, deal with it, and bury it. I will liken it to an adopted child always having that wonder of who his/her real parents are. They are perfectly happy with the adopted parents, but have no closure til they find out the truth about their real parents.

Knowing the truth can bring about a healing and freedom like no other. Also, if the marriage is to survive, the details of the affair will have to come out....It is an integral part of surviving an affair....I know....I was there 4 year ago.

Just my 2 cents worth....take it or leave it.

LH


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LH,

I choose to take your 2 cents. I agree that you need to know. The question is when. I choose to wait until after my M is stronger.

I also agree about the STD issue. If in doubt protect yourself!

Glad to see you could take a few minutes out from the WTF bunch.

Kent


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Kent,
I agree with you on the wedding rings. I am going too wear mine untill the divorce is final or when I feel I can take no more. I need too hold down a strong front for my marriage, my committment too this marriage, even if he has given up. I know he has given up on this but he wont admit it. He says that I gave up on us a long time ago. H said I knew what had too be done too save this marriage and even though i did them, its too late now. I had a "deadline" and I went past it. also, if my marriage ment that much too me, I would have done what it took "then" too make that happen. He stands strong with the fact that hes not in love with me anymore. Says he has forgiven me but doesnt love me. Im hanging in there though. Im going on with my life and doing what I need to do here, but Im still holding on to my marriage untill the fat lady sings.

Jelybns


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Wedding ring: to wear or not to wear.
Had mine off for last couple of weeks, probably big mistake. Last night saw the W. and she had taken off her wedding ring, a new development. Guess what, mine is shined up and back where it belongs. Will she put her ring back on? Don't know, not within my control. Hope she does but the subject will not come up unless she brings it up! I love her folks, this is a not-so-suttle way to show her my committment, though I may have already blown it. Don't do the same!

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Jely, Let go of his alien talk. I can see it is robbing you of happiness.

Jeffo, Small mistakes do not "blow it". We figure them out, correct them and move forward.

Kent


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I'm wearing my ring, but my W (separated 2 months) has had hers off for about a month.

Hurts to see that bare finger. Any insight into what they're thinking by not wearing it... is it to show they are available, or perhaps they take it off due to guilt... or something else?



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Kent,
What a great idea for a post! I agree whole heartly that the snooping, spying, etc. on our S only hurts us. When you find something re your S, I think our minds go off into a land beyond with thoughts of your s being so happy and you being so miserable. Why are they so happy, how could they do this. It just keeps bringing out the anger and doesn't bring the self to peace.

Re the wedding rings. For awhile, I even wore my H's ring at times. I did take my ring off about 9 months ago. I do wear a ring that h gave me on my ring finger.

Got to run. Have a great day, and
Keep the faith,
Kath



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Survivin,

Exactly what I'm talkin about. Who knows what they are thinking. Our minds tell us it can't be good. This is why I say avoid it unless you want to send the message that the R is over. Just cus W takes hers off, does'nt mean you need to take yours off.

Pix,

Where are you in Illinois.

Kent


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Hi Kent,
I'm just north of Chicago living in Arlington Heights. Do you live in Illinois?
Kath

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I think my wife took her ring off because she believes the marriage is over. A couple of weeks ago I took mine off. Not because I don’t still care about the marriage. I do. I took it off because the only way we will stay married is if we can build a new relationship. The old one is dead. Before we can build a new relationship I have to quit holding on to the past. Wearing my wedding ring was holding on to the past and I think my wife saw it this way. The only way I can win my wife back is to become someone that interests her. The beauty of this is by becoming this person it will also interest other people. So I can come out ahead either way. I do want my wife back, but in my case I must let go of the past to have a chance.

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I have given the ring question some thought since I first started seeing the issue raised here several weeks ago. My wife has not worn her wedding ring for the past few years because she had gained some weight and it just didn't fit any longer. She does, however, continue to wear another ring I had given her on the same finger.

For me, I took my ring off a few years ago because I am a wood carver and was getting very raw and blistered where the ring kept rubbing against the inside of my finger. I put the ring back on several months ago when I cut back on the carving.

I have decided that I am going to keep my wedding ring on, regardless of what my wife does and not necessarily to send or reinforce any message to her, but rather to reinforce within myself my committment to my marriage vows and to God. I intend to keep it on even if the D goes through, until such time that God might lead me along another path.


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Kent,

I agree about the A and the rings.

I accidentally found my W with an OM co-worker. She knows I was upset, said my peace then and have never mentioned it again. If we do get back, then maybe that can be discussed. Now, the marriage is not strong enough to handle that. I consciously mad the decision to forgive W about the A, and she knows this. I feel better about not obsessing over it.

I too will continue to wear my ring. I will remain committed to my wife and our marriage as long as we are married. (Maybe even longer) She removed hers 10 weeks ago, when she left. She probably thinks that "no ring, not married", although she has asked where they are a couple of times. I've told her only that "I have them in a safe place."

W seems to have given up, but I'm not.

Stuart


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I agree with BLD. My rings represent a marriage I don't have anymore. I still wear my rings but not all the time, I wear them when I feel like it. I don't care what my H thinks about it (sorry Kent). My H, because of his job, never wore his and it never bothered me.
I don't want the old marriage back. I want a new one. I'm not the same person anymore. I don't even want the old H back. I want a newer, improved version of H. BLD is right, the new me will either attract my H again, or another man and either way I win.

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Pixie,
Your scaring me. I'm beginning to fear that I know you. I grew up in Arlington Heights. Where is your original thread?

BLD,
I agree with the new relationship. Did you get the chance to tell W why you took your ring off or can she misinterpret by guessing.

DavidKS,
My ring means similar to me. It is my committment to me, my W and my kids. I can't remove it.

Stu,
If I remember correctly, did'nt you find W kissing OM in car at movie theatre. Man, I think I would of freaked and FredG'd the turkey. Keep the W's rings safe. Maybe she will wear them someday. If not they will finance a hell of a beer party.

Sis,
Don't tell me you don't care what H thinks. I've been following you to long to believe it. He really pisses me off and I told you my feelings.

Kent


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Man, what a great idea for posting.

More suggestions, helpful tips etc. than I'd have got anywhere else.

Keep trying

Scott


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Hi All,

Regarding the ring issue - I took mine off the day W laid "Bomb 1" on me. I dropped it on the table in front of her and said " I'll put this back on when you tell me to".

I don't know what ever happened to my wedding band. I have not seen it since. I know W took it with her.

Kent - I have taken quite a fancy to your new term for OM thrashing

Fightin' Fred G.


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Kent,

I have to say that I removed my ring and gave it to H to hold on to telling him that it hurt to much to wear it. That the vows we made mean alot to me and if he ever found the love in his heart for me to bring me back my ring. I did wear my engagement ring for a while but now I have stopped wearing it too. There are times I think about putting it back on, but something always seems to stop me. I do love him and want him to come home, yet I know there is the Ow in the way. I am afraid that if I keep wearing the ring my H will not believe that I have set him free to pursue Ow, and that I want him to be happy. But I have made it clear that I will always love him, and that I care about him.

My wedding ring was just a symbol of my love to others, but the love I feel in my heart is what really matters to me.

I hope you and your W are doing great, when ever I start to believe that my H is never coming back I think of you, and others here who have gotten another chance to make their M great, and realize that I also can have faith and hope that my H will come home too.

Take Care
Perplexed


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Kent,

Busted! I do care what he thinks. You're right. I DON'T WANT TO CARE what he thinks though. I still feel like the rings are for a marriage I don't have anymore. I won't change my mind on that one.
You have an open invitation to come to Connecticut and beat the sh*t out of him anytime you want.


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If someone was going to follow the DB rules to a T then would not it be beneficial to know the facts? So you can form a plan? Kent, you probably remember telling me not to hire a PI. I did not and will no longer obsess about what I think I'm seeing (interpreting.) Because interpretations are one thing and cold hard fact is another. For all of you who are worried about what you don't know for a fact, stop obsessing! It's so counterproductive. But, if the only way to NOT obsess is to find out the truth, would that not be better? At least you'll know what you are dealing with. But would we be strong enough to deal with the truth? Only we can answer that and hindsight is always much clearer.


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Hi all,

W quit wearing her rings a couple weeks after leaving. The first time I asked about it she said she had been doing dishes. The second time I asked she said she was cleaning the bathroom. The third time I asked she said she wanted to feel what it was like not to be married. The fourth time I asked she said she felt it was not right to wear them since she left me. Gee I should have asked a couple more times. Before I found you guys and gals I did so many things wrong. I know now that my wife isn't committed to this marriage. She is not sure that she wants to be married. So not wearing the rings is not the most important thing for me to worry about. It's all part of giving the W the gift of time and space. I must say the first time not seeing her wearing them was devastating. But I must have come a long way since then. As for me I quit wearing mine after about a year because it was ruined from my job. It wasn't a big deal for my W as far as I know. Or was it? I would be so happy to wear it now, but I don't think that would send any good message. I do take my wedding vows very serious as does the W. It must be hard for her not to wear them.

Lots of luck,

Max


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What a great post! I have been struggling with both of these issues and have heard conflicting answers. Just the other day I decided that I want to work on my marriage regardless of whether there was a PA with my H and a coworker. I don't believe it's ongoing, more like an EA that might have gotten out of hand. I took my ring off for a day or so prior to this decision, but every time I looked down I felt awful. I also was worried that a co-worker or family member would ask why it wasn't on and I am not ready to explain to the world my present situation.

Incidently, I spoke with my H a few minutes ago and did not ask question after question about the OW, speak about OR, or grovel. I told him how busy I am with school and work and the dog and going out with my friends. He told me that I sounded great and he was so happy about that. He also suggested that we have lunch next week and maybe see me this weekend. It feels much better than my begging him to tell me if he slept with the OW, all the details of their relationship if he didn't, etc. I truly feel good about us working things out..

Take the advice from Kent, it's good advice.


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Kim,

The point is not to just take my advice. I heard plenty of issues related to rings. My only point would be that when everyone is confused with what is going on in the R why throw a perceived negative towards an unsure spouse. There is no absolute right answer. A good way to put it is what fits your situation.

Another thought is THANK GOD OUR WAW'S AND WAH'S DON'T LISTEN TO ALL THE WORDS COMING OUT OF OUR MOUTHS. If they did we would all be divorced already. Dbing teaches us to temper our tongues and use words wisely. Stop the whining, pleading, crying, questioning, insinuating. While the WAS tends to miss the positive things one might say, The negative comments accumulate in their minds and are difficult to erase. If we are caught up in emotion, not knowing the best words to support our ultimate goal (reconcilliation), better to back off and say nothing.

Come on DBers, there are more issues related to ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS. Help me out here. I want this to be an open discussion with help from the pros that are sitting out there.

Kent


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OK, why don't we discuss the subject of "snooping" ?

Before this crisis, I would have said I was against it. But my W tortured me with missing phone records, secret phone calls, beeper hits, and sneaking away mysteriously. I found myself compelled to investigate, usually at 2am after waking from a fitfull sleep.

I found $220 cell phone bills to the OM's number, compromising photos of them both, discovered she snuck off to dance with him, and some phone recordings revealed they "loved" each other w/ lots of sexual banter.

Although each discovery was profoundly devastating, sitting here now I'm glad I know (more closely) exactly what was going on. I know that the purported "friendship" was much more and I am operating from something more close to reality. She'd still maintain they were "just friends" if I didn't make the discoveries. I'd rather know that she had an A and CHOOSE to forgive, than to hide from it and have it never revealed. I bet hidden lies fester over time and poison the relationship later. Guilt would take a toll.

Just my thoughts

Survivin


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I believe that many of the most productive actions that we can take in DBing are those that do not in fact directly relate to our interaction or relationship with our spouses. DBing is really, at its core, about self growth and development isn't it? And when we are well on the road and gaining momentum in journey of self growth, our spouses should see and be positively affected by that growth, right?

So, some of the most positive actions we can take "for our spouses" are really positive actions we take for ourselves, to make ourselves happy and enrich our own lives irregardless of what occurs with our spouses.

Some of the outward or visible, and positive, actions (and they do have to be able to be visible by our spouses in order to have an effect on them) that I have enacted in the past few months and will be enacting in the coming months:
- I have become much more physically involved in my church and my daughters' school.
- I have been working out, eating right, and getting in good physical shape (and dressing better too).
- I've drastically curbed my use of bad language (actually greatly irked my wife the other day when she was freaking out and being verbally abusive to me by saying "shame on you" to her, rather than the usual retort she might expect).
- I'm going to take flying lessons this spring or early summer (how's that for "rising above" our relationship problems? Ha!)

That's a few examples. And maybe the neatest thing about focusing on positive actions in our lives is that not only do they positively affect our relationship with our spouses but they really will have a big and lasting influence on our own attitudes and ability to deal with the pain and heartache inherent in DBing.

So, our actions speak loud to ourselves too I guess, don't they?

A wise and useful post Kent.

God bless.
David


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Survivin,
I found alot of the same stuff, minus the photos and the tele recordings. I did find e-mails that crossed the line, cell phone bills with 20-30 calls per month to OM, intimate gifts. Again every situation is different. I never found the absolute proof that I needed, but in my mind, I had so much that it had to be true. Or did it? In my case the snooping almost destroyed me and my R. I decided that knowing was not going to further my goal. I have not given up or have I hid from it. If it happened, it was in the past and not the present. I hope to learn more someday and I'm willing to wait for W to talk about it.

DavidKS,
Yes, An important issue for you to bring up. Lets face it, a big part of this is just survivin through it. We can be miserable and let the situation rule us. Or we can stand up and fight for what we want. Alot of it is about happiness. One of the most important lessons I learned is that I was relying on others to make me happy. I relied on others to define who I was. Not no more. A big side benefit is that our spouse sees us as a strong, happy person and they begin to wonder what they are leavin. It happens!

Kent


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Hey Kent,
I didn't grow up in Arlington, but in Park Ridge. That would be pretty funny if we knew each other!

My original thread was We're separated what now: What happens when someone files?

Kath

[This message has been edited by Pixie6 (edited 01-19-2001).]


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Kent,

You're right about the movie theatre incident. I'm not sure why I didn't give the "FredG" treatment (No offense Fred), cause I'm sure I would have felt better. My wife even "thanked" for not beatin the livin' shit outta him. I do have have the plate # of OM's truck but have not pursued that avenue. I think it would only lead to alot more pain, and there's enough of that goin' around already.

Tuesday when the wife was "cleaning out" our house she asked me for her rings. I think she was going to sell them, as she is need of money. I told her I have them in a safe place, but not here.

I'm all for the beer party, we could buy enough to last a week. Just gotta know when and where, hopefully somewhere warm. I'm gettin' tired of all this snow.

[This message has been edited by StuartN (edited 01-19-2001).]


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Hi gang
About the rings, mine has not worn hers since 9/2000 whem I moved out { said she was in daily pain with me being there- It probably was the biggest mistake I could have ever made} I have continued to wear mine but she has never said a word about it. She does continue to wear a birthstone ring on that finger? When I look at her hand it pains alot.
She told me she had been unhappy for many years{ married 25yrs.} but PA was the icing on the relationship failure.I have changed but really am unable to prove it but I still have hope/faith that miracles can happen. We all seem to want our marriages to recover and are ready to do what it takes to heal them. Love to hear from someone /those who began to feel different about spousal betrayal and began to walk the path of forgiveness and recovery. What kind of behavior improvements/changes were you looking for when you did not want to really hear or see us {"it's to late- can't ever forgive you- you knew I was unhappy- but we have to remain friendly for son"} I am perplexed at how to improve a " very long emotional distance relationship" I love her dearly but it seems this will never get better. Any insight /ideas would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks, hanging in there
Jmike

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Great thread Kent! I did a lot of heavy duty snooping, spying, etc. when I first found out about the EA but later found out I was misinterpreting some of the things and the things I did find out only hurt me and didn't in anyway help toward DBing.

My wife wears ring somtimes and sometimes not. I've kept mine on.

WPS


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I agree this is a great thread. My 2 cents worth. As far as rings... H stopped wearing his before he moved out and about the same time I know affair started. I have done about everything, worn it on my right hand, not worn at all and worn it on the left. Sort of represents my state of mind for the day, but after reading this I realize I bet I'm really messing with H's mind becuase he's seen me with all three different ways. So it's back on the left hand and it's staying there.

I snooped like crazy because my inner gut told me there was an OW and he lied over and over about it. I ended up finally telling him I knew during a counseling session and since that time we have started to become frinds again. For me, I had to have him admit the truth before I could stop building up the resentment. He's still very much with OW but there is less tension between us. Maybe I would have eventually gotten to the point where I didn't care about OW, but at that juncture it was what enabled me to stop resenting him for lying stop the snooping. Just my situation however, many spouses react very differently. And both of us acknowledging it did not end the affair or bring him home... yet .

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I think one of the best actions is the 180. Do something the S would never think you would do. I did this and I don't know the effects of it yet, (haven't seen W since) But I feel my actions started to make her think.

W drop the big bomb om me a week ago. I looked at her and let her finish what she was saying and then without changing my PMA I tolded her how I felt about the bomb and said my peace. She had to stop me and ask if I heard what she had said and if it had hit me or not. I relyed and said I did and it hurts a great deal.

This is somthing I would have never of done. I would have put up the biggest fight and may have broken down a cried. But I showed her someone new a changed H and with a strong PMA. I have not heard from her as of yet. But I feel great about it.

So I guess the actions I did that night not only made her think about things, but made me feel better as a person and with myself.

So actions speak louder than words to you as well as the other person....

So keep DB'ing and think about the actions that can change you for the better.

Kent thanks for all your help....

TH


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TH,
I read about your incident at the C where W bombed you big time. I was proud that you did not freak. When my W said she thought she wanted and S at the C session, I fell apart. That night was my final night of doom and gloom. Everything was different the next day.

Action was what pulled me out of the abyss. Action and keeping my mouth shut.

Kent


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Trying Hus brought up a great action item.

THE BIG 180

For me this was where I quit whining, crying, pleading, suspecting, resenting and installled a new PMA. It's been almost 4 months now and it sure works. Removing the pressure from W allowed her to see a little more clearly.

Anyone else out there have BIG 180's that had positive results?

Kent


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My 180 experience so far has had mixed results. I have stopped initiating all contact w/ my WAW, and she almost immediately started contacting me every other day. The mixed results are that sometimes the calls I do get are filled w/ resentment and bitter hostility. I always play it cool, not allowing myself to be sucked in to an arguement that is unwinnable. I'd say that for the most part, the old 180 does work, just unpredictable sometimes if not all the time.

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I did the same. I didn't call my W even if she didn't call me on the selected day to talk. She end up calling me on a day when we were not setup to talk. She said sorry I didn't call you last week I was busy. I said no problem and left it at that.

One thing I did that I was happy about. In the C session she said " If I said I wanted to come home last night you would of said sure anytime, or if I said I wanted to come tonight you would taken me back in". I replyed by saying "No I would not, I do think coming home would be that easy and we would have to talk alot more a get our R back on track before you come home, You have been gone for 2 months. I don't know what you have been doing or anything" She sat there and look at me with the stragest look on her face like I was someone else.

Now granted I have not talked to the W since then. That was a week and ahalf ago. But the feeling I got from that was well worth it. She past the ball and I slammed it back at her. Now I just have to see what happens next.

Just some food for thought.. I hope everyone is doing well.

TH


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One other thing I forgot. I did alot of snopping. Since I'm the one in the house still. One night when her car was parked across the street I went and started snopping to see what I could find. I found some letters she had writen to herself about the both of us. It made me see some things that I had not seen before about myself. After that night I had stopped snopping. I felt myself slipping into a strange place and I didn't want to go there. I felt that if I keep doing this I would never get anywhere and become the person I never wanted to be. But marriages will do that to a person.

Someone once told me that in a marriage you have to remain your own person. You cannot let the marriage consume you and change into something that you are not. I failed, I let the marriage and the world change me. Now I have to change myself back for me. Maybe some day the W will see this and maybe not. Be at least I know I have done anything I know how to, to make myself feel good about who I am as a person.....

TH


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BRAVO, you hit the nail on the head with one more powerful stroke. I am still talking to my W even though she has moved out and taken our children, been gone for about three months. I told her that I realized that our R was dead and that if I had to start over I would really like to do it with her. She seemed releaved that I had admitted to the death and a little open to starting over. This was 3 weeks ago and we have still not done anything together but talk on the phone. I am not pushing or pulling her, I am simply baiting the hook and hopefuly she will nibble so I can set the hook. We loved each other at one time so the foundation has still got to be there. I just have to be her friend until she can see that there is something worth saving. After all I am a great guy and other women tell me she had got to be crazy for taking the chance on loosing me, so I will just hang in there. I have never given up on anything in my life and I don't plan on starting now.

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Quote:
Someone once told me that in a marriage you have to remain your own person. You cannot let the marriage consume you and change into something that you are not.


And therein lies the problem as they say. I have taken off my ring. I decided if my H wanted to stay, we would need new rings that were a symbol of a new marriage. He had taken his off so many times to be with OW (she stole it a one point) and then he replaced it with a look alike. I decided those rings were meaningless.

The other hard thing I struggle with is the affair. I do think I can forgive it. However, it is still on going. If I am true to myself I have to admit that infidelity goes against all I believe in. I think if my H were to stop, I could handle going on. But right now he is proclaiming his affair to be "real relationship" I almost feel like I am the OW. It messes with my head.


me 54
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S 18
Sep April 07
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As for snooping, I have tried a couple of times, but it just isn't in me. Then I realized after reading on here that I would just be causing myself more pain..

I had the om's wife come to me one day, she had been snooping, and tell me what she had found. That was the last day I had any contact with her, that was a definite lose-lose situation. And it only served to make me feel worse. Besides it seems to me that too much can misinterpreted when you are in our emotional state.

As for the ring, when w dropped the bomb I took mine off. I put it back on a little while later, but she had seen me with it off so she took her off and said that she didn't want to wear since we are S and I took mine off first.. Walked into that one didn't I...

We have been communicating and actually had some discussions about R. I have thought about putting the ring back on, but I am not sure yet. Part of me wants to, but I want to have a new relationship with her and the ring represents the old one.

I had always been pretty uptight about always wearing our rings, cuz they represented our marriage. Brief history: my Mom passed away when I was 2 and my Dad wore his wedding ring every day of his life, said it was the promise he made to her.. So wearing the ring is an important thing to me because of that...

One day when we were talking she said "when we get back together if I want a new wedding ring how will you feel about that"... I was fairly vague, mostly just blown away because she said "when we get back together"... I said that I would have to think that one through...

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2 things Frye.

Are you married to your wife in your heart and mind?
That should dictate what you do with your ring. Regardless of what ANYONE else says, including your wife.

A new ring...well if that happens, would you want a 'new' relationship with your wife, or the old one?



Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis

Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans

Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK

TRUST THE PROCESS - Cadet

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Yes I am Jack, you make an excellent point.

I have thought alot about it, and I am putting my ring back on.

If she wants a new ring for a new relationship I think I can do that, but for me I am wearing mine...

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I took my ring off when I found out for the 2nd time he'd been lying to me about OW, over a year after I first discovered his A. By then H hadn't worn his for years. He said it was problem in his line of work - he would take it off then put it back on. After awhile he'd forget (he said), then I never saw it on his finger. Sometime in there he'd started his A, but I didn't make the connection.

When I took my ring off, in my mind my M was over. After that, for 2 mos H slowly worked me to the point of considering reconciliation. Then again I found out OW was still around. I didn't put my ring back on since discovery 2, and I won't until H starts to come out of the tunnel, probably until he moves back home, if that ever happens.

The ring meant nothing to H for a long time, but it meant something to me. Me taking mine off was a signal to him that I was ready to move on without him. If we reconcile, that is when I put my ring back on. You don't wear a wedding ring before you get married, and though I'm technically married, I am not living as someone's wife. Sound petty? I hope not. It's DBing to me - acting as if I'm getting on w/ my life. What I'm NOT doing is sitting around pining for my H, wearing a symbol of my undying devotion to him, showing the world that I'm married.

I do want H to know that I'm hopeful we will reconcile, so I let my other actions speak - my touch, my smile, my eye contact when he talks to me. We still spend time together (dates, if you will), and we ML once in awhile, when the right times come along. I ask him about his day, his games, his friends and share the joy of his "wins". I talk to him about our D, her successes, her challenges. I thank him for any nice thing he does for me. When he says ILY, I say ILY2. Sometimes I say it first. Right now he is my friend, albeit a very special friend. My actions reflect that, and these are the actions that I will use to show my H where my heart is, not a ring on my finger.

FA


What does not destroy me, makes me stronger.

FA:43, H:42
D:7
M:10 yrs, T:24 yrs
EA:?, PA:1/06
S:3/07
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any of these that had an actual divorce from WAW and reconciled?


M 43 W 45
M 10.5 T 15
S 26 D 17 (previous relationships)
ILYB 12/25/15 + asks for D
Confirm affair 1/10/16
W has D ready to sign, but agrees to wait for refinancing to go through (I get a house!)
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Re the ring issue ... I think it depends on individual circumstances.

H and I went through a similar sitch about 10 years ago (hence my screen name) and worked things out (although, clearly not very well.) He took his ring off at that time and never put it back on. (I always saw that as a sign that he wasn't truly recommitted to the M and it hurt a great deal.) I continued to wear mine.

I questioned him about not wearing his ring once not too long before BD #2. He blew up at me, said it bugged him to wear it (although he wore it for many years) and he wasn't going to put it on. I never mentioned it again.

When I found out about OW and got the "I love you but" speech again 2+ years ago, I took my ring off and I haven't put it back on. Taking it off was one of the most heartbreaking things I have ever done, but in my mind it represented a R that no longer existed.

Hopefully the day will come when I will feel it appropriate to put it back on, but I can't say under what circumstances that would be. I suppose I will know it when it happens.


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H: :53
Me: 1 S, 1 D, both grown
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Bumping this up for the newbies.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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