Hi everyone, I bid you good day and thank you for the knowledge I have gained from lurking and humbly ask for your guidance. I am reading 'The Divorce remedy' (currently at the chapter about depression ) but I simply cannot afford to phone a coach and I have no idea if this will change any time soon. I apologize for a passage which is likely to be similar in length to 'War and Peace' but here goes...
H 50 Brit. W 46 s e Asian. M 24 years next week R almost 25 years D 20, S 17, D 12,
History, I lost a long standing job about a decade ago. My w was very upset but supported me when I proposed training for a new career. The project was extremely difficult and required full attention over many years.
But the loss of my job destroyed my confidence and self esteem and I found it difficult to organize and to cope. I let my own insecurities and personal issues, poor organization, family and mundane issues get in the way. It was the loss of confidence and self esteem that pushed me in this career direction because I had no belief in myself and couldn't apply for jobs.
About 2 years ago, my w started saying I should get a job and in hindsight I believe now she was unhappy, stressed and depressed. She was working to keep the family above water while I contributed nothing to the finances and all the pressure was on her.
This meant our having no money to spare and being unable to visit her family until, with her mother seriously ill we managed to visit them about a year and a half ago. Things weren't good between us but I didn't understand to what extent.
My w and family visited again in August returning in September last year. During that time my wife's motherhood she loved most dearly died.
Shortly after their return we went out to have a heart to heart during which my wife said I must get a job. She was very insistent but I also insisted that I could not but I would finish my plans and all would be good.
I meant this in all sincerely as it was always my goal to take good care of my wife and family whom, I love deeply, of course. I thought my wife understood but the finances suddenly became worse and I needed to find work fast. My wife was clearly distressed and couldn't cope. She wanted me to find employment with regular pay but I simply couldn't do this and I became self employed with a poor variable income.
It took me a couple of months to do this and during that time my wife became distant and started sleeping on the couch. I replaced her on the couch as she needs more sleep than me and she has made the bedroom her fortress over the last few months.
In December I got my wife a new bigger Mobile phone at her request, (the contracts are in my name) and shortly afterward, around December 2016 I found the older one on the couch were I was sleeping. I looked through it and found messages between her and another man to whom she was reaching out. Their E A was new as they were getting to know each other but almost immediately he was trying to become intimate though my wife was more stand offish wanting to get to know him.
During a disagreement I disclosed my knowledge of this which she denied until I proved it. My w became very angry accusing me of invading her privacy but I didn't let that wash and divert the issue from the salient point. My w said she didn't love me anymore and wanted a divorce and now she had told me she would f-ck someone else if she wanted to.
I don't remember what my immediate reactions were but I tried in the aftermath to reason, plead and demonstrate our love which all fell on deaf ears and a cold heart. I remember at a later date my wife telling me with contempt that I panicked when she said she wanted a divorce. I realise now that I really shot myself in the foot by divulging what I knew and reacting in the way I did.
In January we went out to talk. I wanted, tried to go through things and explain the past with a view to persuading her to step back( By then she had seen negotiators and apparently had a free meeting with a solicitor) but all she would talk about was arranging finances and preparing for divorce and my moving out.
I said that I would not leave and that it was in our children's and our interest two-step backward from this and live separately in the house so as not to upset our youngest. My wife said she needed a week to think about it. She is still thinking apparently and recently said that I need to contribute better to the finances in the next couple of months.
About 3 or 4 weeks ago I located my wife's old phone again and found pictures sent to her of a different man possible in his 60s though he may just look older and my w together in public sight seeing and naked photos of him on his own at a different time, possibly selfys and selfys of my wife taken by her in our bathroom in underwear. She saw him a total of 3 or 4 times in Jan and Feb up to about a week ago but a few days ago I overheard her talking with her friend during which she said that he had said that he didn't want to continue their relationship as he didn't want to stand in the way of her relationship with her husband. My wife told her friend that she doesn't have a relationship with her husband. that she had been crying and felt so stupid. My wife talked about me saying she didn't think she wanted to live with me forever and that's why she was so upset.
Yesterday I overheard my wife saying she missed him and that was the problem. I don't know if she was on the phone or talking to herself as nothing else was said.
My wife continues to be surly with me and normally leaves whatever room she is in when I enter. She is very cold and hostile swearing at me and calling me names at times when I have needed to point out a minor matter. The last time I said shut up a few times and she did after which I said don't talk to me if you can't say anything nice.
I believe I have failed to take care of my wife and family and not been the man my wife needed and she has finally had enough. Maybe I can rebuild the relationship by changing, fixing the house, being more supportive, earning money, taking charge of my life, gal. I am doing these things for her , for my children and for me. Two of my kids have started m /arts with me. Something I loved in the past and we are having great fun Together. I feel better for doing these things though I need to to earn more as I am not providing enough to save the family from financial ruin. I have thought of a new simple way to earn money which requires some training and am looking into it. It is quick to learn and something I will enjoy unlike the previous project. I realised my short Cummings before reading the divorce remedy as I had over the last 6 months been evaluating my life and the effect it was having on my family ( I haven't mentioned the effect on our children ) and I was preparing to make changes.
I believe I need to to continue improving in these areas for my wife to take notice but her affair worries me. It is one thing to have an E A but another to make it physical and I don't know that I can cope with the betrayal if that becomes the case. I know that the O M has dropped my w but she is very vulnerable and unhappy. She misses the feelings he gave her and I believe she is or will try to renew the relationship. Maybe the O M is genuine or he is playing her to push her into having sex. Fortunately He lives at least 2 hours away and maybe he feels it's too far.
So I'm not sure what to do now. Should I stay silent but that's hard to do without seeming nasty.
Should I Message or write to her apologising for the past ?
I like the idea of this and also saying that dispite the problems that I have been committed to her but that any relationship found on tinder is unlikely to last as people are not looking for the commitment she desires. That they will make excuses for leaving, some genuine some to force the reaction from Her they want.
That would make me feel better about the situation. Actually I sent her a text referring to the O M as the marriage wrecker and questioning his morals knowing her husband was trying to save the marriage with 3 chidren amongst other things. Is it a coincidence that he dropped her or did she show him.
I guess what to do now really depends on all the reasons for my wife's actions or do they include a mid life crisis, and her state of mind now.
I really appreciate your reading this to the end and any advice you may have. Thank you and best wishes,
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
There is so much to learn on this site and through the books. The best advice I can give is GAL. It is the one thing that saved my sanity through my situation. Good luck!
Me: 38 W: 32 S10 D6 T: 10 (02/2004) M: 7 (12/2007) Separation 02/2015 OM confirmed 01/2015, D mentioned 12/2014 D finalized 9/2016
It is easy to be conflicted when you have so many emotions and thoughts going through your head!
You are so smart to recognize that there are many things that you can be doing to get yourself moving in a more positive direction. Focus on becoming the best James66 and Dad that only a fool would leave. These changes need to be made for you and your kids. They need to be long lasting and sincere. Prove that to yourself and anyone else through your actions, not your words.
Little compares to the devastation people feel when they discover their spouse has been unfaithful. Couples often struggle to get past intense emotional pain, mistrust, resentment and never ending arguments about the betrayal. Healing from infidelity is achievable for both of you with the right support and tools.
Knowing what to do and what not to do at this point is crucial. Feel free to give me a call at 303-444-7004 to discuss how we can best help you determine what to do next.
Cristy
Resource Coordinator The Divorce Busting Center 303-444-7004
A Divorce Busting Coach can help you save your marriage, even when your spouse wants out.
Email virginia@divorcebusting.com or 303-444-7004 for more information or to get started right away.
Hi cadet, thank you for your kind words and sage advice. I am currently gal returned to M/arts and my 2 daughters are coming with me. It's really
heart warming to share this with them.
Also making my way through Sandi2's posts which are very insightful and sleeping me greatly to understand.
I wish to know opinions about the following. The O M has last week dropped my wife saying that he doesn't want to come between us( re my first post). My w is still showing me disrespect and is clearly upset at his leaving and emmotionaly hooked.
I wonder if I should write or email her apologising for my part in the breakdown of our relationship which I believe is substantial and also warn that any relationship she starts on tinder is likely to fail (knowing it has temporarily at least)stating that men on there are normally after fun rather than the relationship she craves and may manipulate to get their way. (I am worried that this may be the case and she has just arranged for our youngest to be out the way for the first time since he dropped her).
I wonder if I should write or email her apologising for my part in the breakdown of our relationship which I believe is substantial and also warn that any relationship she starts on tinder is likely to fail (knowing it has temporarily at least)stating that men on there are normally after fun rather than the relationship she craves and may manipulate to get their way. (I am worried that this may be the case and she has just arranged for our youngest to be out the way for the first time since he dropped her).
Sending her this is probably the wrong thing to do. Best to say nothing and let her Pursue you
You seem to have accepted the need to change. I would like to hear you give yourself a little break.
It sounds to me as if you have personally had a breakdown or depression of some kind. Did you have medical help? In the UK there are resources that can help. Medical depression is recognised here and there is no issuing with having help for this.
So as a first step, let yourself off the hook for that.
You need extreme care in this.
Please whilst accepting your side of the street needs a good sweep, you are only responsible for your sandpit. Hold back on your letter or apology, it may go too far, have other consequences which we can't forsee. Plus you are in distress and your letter could back fire in any D proceedings or Custody. Important in the UK to have balance, this isn't just you when you are emotional. In due course if you are keen to write to WW there are those here who can help you draft a great letter. For now keep your powder dry.
Nothing, nothing you have done caused WW to have an EA, PA or to go wayward. She had many other choices in this. Many other choices including seeking counselling with you. This is her side of the street, her sandbox. And you are not responsible or accountable for her choices.
Start with Cadets reading material. I laminated Sandi guidelines, when in doubt stick to those. Do not leave your MBR, sleep on the couch or suggest you leave the MH. WW made her choices and you are accepting of her sleeping in the MBR. If she wants the couch that's a consequence. Tough about her sleep.
You are the one here on this board seeking change and growth. Good for you. It's a brave choice, there are wonderful posters here. Keep on posting, being in the UK sometimes we are out of step with the majority of the US who post. But responses from both your peers and those further down the road will follow. Keep posting please.
It's a long journey, sticking with your desire to be a new person with goals, desires, hobbies and a fulfilled life will have positive results.
So tell me, what help have you sought? There are self referral resources in many areas of the country too.
Are you in employment? Are you enjoying the world of work?
Are you in a position with private medical care that can help with counselling.
I think the first step is to provide you with some IRL support, it seems you have struggled for too long. A little tenderness to self.
V
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
Thank you Cadet, It's very hard to go against ones natural instinct to act but I'm holding back for now given your and Vanilla's advice.
I believe my w may be depressed and vulnerable having been left by me to run things and keep the family afloat for sooo long without my help. If she can only see the route she is taking is not for the best, that it is destroyed her family. That we can be so much better now I am largely out of my fog.
I guess you can see my predicament; either do nothing and hope my w doesn't make bad choices prior to seeing these things or try to advise her.
I am not out of the woods yet myself but I can see the pathway and I have a plan to move forward and I so desperately want to do so with my family beside me. Thank you again, James66
Thank you so much for you advice and kind words. I really appreciate the time and consideration you have given me.
I haven't sought medical help but accept that I have been low at times and may be depressed now but am very wary of my medical records mentioning anything like depression.
I work now after many years but have no benefits and it's poorly paid making it difficult to help support the family. One of my wife's issues and who can blame her. My inability to support her has I believe caused her to become depressed.
My wonderful wife has until recently always been a caring and loving person and I believe depression has changed her at least toward me. About two years ago she said she was unhappy and wanted me to go to counseling with her. I refused for personal reasons believing we were strong together but I didn't understand how unhappy she must have been. Now she refuses to go with me.
I have no intention of leaving the family home although I have been sleeping on the couch for a month or two. My w initially slept on the couch but she sleeps earlier than me and wants it quiet from about 9 pm. I suggested she sleep in the mbr so that she could get the rest she needed without the living room lights going out for the family. My w has since then made it her bedsit and spends most of her time there to avoid me. I wonder now if she deliberately became difficult so that I would do this. I think you and Sandi2 are correct about it being a mistake to leave the mbr and I intend to start sleeping there shortly. My w definitely thinks she is running things because she can threaten divorce and separation etc. However I feel I need to start taking charge of these things which I think wife expects of a man. I would appreciate Your advice on this matter.
I haven't written yet to my wife though the temptation is very strong for the reasons I mentioned previously and I thank you again for your advice.
Although my younger d slept over my wife didn't go out in the evening and I hope that the relationship with the o m is still off. However my w is still very disrespectful to me and I feel I need to deal with her behavior. Presently I don't initiate talk with her but I worry if I am coming over too surly your advice is much appreciated.
It's getting very late and I will write further when I can.
I am concerned for you and am going to encourage you to ask for medical help. Sometimes we are ashamed to ask, like it's a failing. Help is important and a big step.
Your M is falling apart, you have every right to be down. Chicken and egg, down and BD!
Join the club, there are many members, let me give you a T shirt, the slogan is a positive one, I am working to be a man only a fool would leave.
I am encouraging you to seek IC and medical help, come join us in this the water is lovely.
V
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
Hi James, how are you coming on reading the DR book?
I am a little confused about the time frames in which things began falling apart.
Quote:
I lost a long standing job about a decade ago. My w was very upset but supported me when I proposed training for a new career. The project was extremely difficult and required full attention over many years.
But the loss of my job destroyed my confidence and self esteem and I found it difficult to organize and to cope. I let my own insecurities and personal issues, poor organization, family and mundane issues get in the way. It was the loss of confidence and self esteem that pushed me in this career direction because I had no belief in myself and couldn't apply for jobs.
So "the project" was a new career? By saying it required full attention for many years, are you also saying you were not involved in family activities, or did not have time for your W and the raising of the children?
Quote:
About 2 years ago, my w started saying I should get a job and in hindsight I believe now she was unhappy, stressed and depressed. She was working to keep the family above water while I contributed nothing to the finances and all the pressure was on her.
This is where I get confused about the new career. Have you not worked since losing your job ten years ago? Your W has worked outside the home to financially support the family during this time?
Quote:
Shortly after their return we went out to have a heart to heart during which my wife said I must get a job. She was very insistent but I also insisted that I could not but I would finish my plans and all would be good.
Finish what plans? What were you doing during this ten year span?
I feel I can identify with your W to some extent. Your part of the M breakdown does not excuse her EA, it only explains why she was vulnerable to another man. It also tells me why she has a lot of resentment, and probably loss of respect for you.
With your issues of depression and loss of self-confidence, did you seek medical help or a counselor?
Quote:
I thought my wife understood but the finances suddenly became worse and I needed to find work fast. My wife was clearly distressed and couldn't cope.
Understood what? That you were depressed and lost your confidence over a job ten years ago?
Quote:
My wife was clearly distressed and couldn't cope. She wanted me to find employment with regular pay but I simply couldn't do this and I became self employed with a poor variable income.
As I've said, I am confused about what you did during those ten years. A woman expects her H to be responsible for the welfare of the family. If that means he has to take a regular job, so be it. She was looking at three children, who were under the age of ten a decade ago. She tried to support you, but at the end of day........she has children to feed and bills to pay. Then there was the issue of no money to go see her dying mother. That is huge, and obviously added to the resentment growing in her heart. Whether fair or not, her hurt and anger was directed to her H, b/c he was not financially contributing to needs of the family. She loses respect for her H, and when the respect is gone, the loss of loving feelings quickly follow.
Quote:
So I'm not sure what to do now. Should I stay silent but that's hard to do without seeming nasty.
Should I Message or write to her apologising for the past ?
In her current state, apologizing will have very little effect.........if you show no action to change the situation. What you really need to do is get a job. No more thinking and planning.........just get a job of some kind, and bring home a regular paycheck. Until she sees you working to support your family, an apology is not really what she wants, IMHO.
Quote:
I have thought of a new simple way to earn money which requires some training and am looking into it. It is quick to learn and something I will enjoy unlike the previous project.
Forget looking into the next project that takes even more time without a payroll check coming into the house. Look James, I have been in the shoes of your W. My H tried the self employed route, and would go for months at a time without income. No matter how understanding a woman may be, it just does something to her when she has a H who won't provide for his family. If he is in school, preparing for his career, she knows it has a time frame and he won't be in school the rest of their lives. However, going from one project to the next, does not offer the security a woman desperately needs.
My suggestion is to not discuss the OM and his lack of morals, etc. It will fall on bitter ears. She won't see the faults of the OM, b/c she only sees the faults in you. I recommend you either find the man you once were, or reinvent yourself. If you remain the same, you will lose your family.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Thank you so much for your thoughts and suggestions.
I up to pg 280 of the D R book.
I started training for a new niche career and I have referred to that as training or my project etc. Sorry for the confusion.
I have been involved with my family during this time and I have worked on and off and had other small sources of money but that in no way made up for our losses. I recognize that in my state of mind at the time I didn't work enough to keep the finances afloat.
I thought my wife understood my love for her and our children and what I was trying to achieve for us.
I am currently working in a 'self employed' job being paid regularly but not well and it is dependant on the amount of work I get. This is why I am looking for a fairly short course in a particular trade but I intend to work as well.
When we met I was able to take care of my then future wife in difficult circumstances and this led to love and we married within a year. She is a wonderful woman with a great personality but I think that I have broken her. Hurt her so badly that she has become depressed and this depression has caused her to lose her love and respect for me and reach out to others.
I recognize my failings and I am trying to correct them and to be able to take care of my family but whole I am working toward my goals I want to improve my relationship with my wife and not make mistakes that may push her away or further into the arms of another.
I hope this answers your questions Sandi2 and gives you a little more insight into my situation and thinking. I'm sorry I don't yet know how to attach these answers to your quotes.
I really feel for you. I too have much guilt over how I handled my career and my family's financial health. After I got here and endured months of W's spewing, accusations, etc Did I realize that it was not all of my fault. When W quit couples therapy it was because the Dr. was not buying her sob story and told her she was as much to blame.
So yes, you made mistakes - some may be harder to recover from then others - you will recover.
Get a modest financial plan in place and follow it. Don't try and take on too much. When other parts of your life are in chaos money problems magnify.
EA are brutal - I know.
The best advice I got from the DB books was to do things differently. It changes your outlook and opens up new horizons. If you normally wear jeans - switch to dress pants. If you buy your coffee from Starbucks - take a thermos, If you shop at Walmart go to Target.
I assure you small amounts of sun will pour into your dark days.
M:50 W:53 MR:20 D:21 S:17 S:11 BD-Sept 2015 Suspected PA Sept 2015-Confronted W & OM Dec 2015 Actually EA In house Sep:Jan/16-May 2016 W moved out:May 22 2016 OM-Intro Oct/17-On scene July/Aug 2017
I thought my wife understood my love for her and our children and what I was trying to achieve for us.
This statement caused me to remember a movie I had seen many years ago. The W complained that her H would not occassionally tell her he loved her. His answer was that he told once and if his feelings changed, then he would let her know.
Perhaps your W did understand, but didn't neccessessarily agree/approve the outcome for her and the family. Even if we understand and agree, I think most women want reassurance from their H, in some manner. It's not enough that my H pledged his love on our wedding day, I want to "hear" him say ILY, and fairly often. More importantly, I want to "see" his love in action. I believe this is where the book about the 5 love languages might be very beneficial for your situation.
Was the communication very plain when you explained to your W exactly what you wanted to achieve? Did you give her an estimated window of time that it would take for you to achieve it? Was it something she could support and cheer for you in your accomplishments?
Quote:
When we met I was able to take care of my then future wife in difficult circumstances and this led to love and we married within a year.
Sounds like you were her knight in shining armor. It's kind of difficult to resist that attraction. Behind the armor, was a man who had confidence. Male confidence ranks extremely high in attraction. It is one of the first traits women see in a man. It's very important in the relationship, and I think it helps to boost the respect she has for him.
Quote:
She is a wonderful woman with a great personality but I think that I have broken her. Hurt her so badly that she has become depressed and this depression has caused her to lose her love and respect for me and reach out to others.
Perhaps both of you have seen each other's worst side. She will have to take responsibility for her actions, just as you must take ownership for yours.
I want to ask you some very important questions. Do you want to change the man you have become? Are you willing to go outside your comfort box and do whatever is necessary to achieve self-confidence and grow into a better version of James? And, are you ready to start the work?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Hi cadet, thank you for your kind words and sage advice. I am currently gal returned to M/arts and my 2 daughters are coming with me. It's really
heart warming to share this with them.
Also making my way through Sandi2's posts which are very insightful and sleeping me greatly to understand.
I wish to know opinions about the following. The O M has last week dropped my wife saying that he doesn't want to come between us( re my first post). My w is still showing me disrespect and is clearly upset at his leaving and emmotionaly hooked.
I wonder if I should write or email her apologising for my part in the breakdown of our relationship which I believe is substantial and also warn that any relationship she starts on tinder is likely to fail (knowing it has temporarily at least)stating that men on there are normally after fun rather than the relationship she craves and may manipulate to get their way. say nothing about OM and do not "warn" her about anything unless it's an ultimatum you really will enforce (which I am NOT suggesting).
So, no "warnings". As for an apology, I think it would be a lot stronger if were backed up with action.
Plus, I get the feeling she has resented bearing the financial burden much longer than you realize. It has been building a long time. Not being able to see her mother is just one dimension of what she has done without. I'm not trying to bash you more, just trying to explain why an apology letter for not working, isn't going to overwhelm her.
Better to job hunt??
Sometimes just moving in a direction is better than waiting to know exactly where you want to go.
(I am worried that this may be the case and she has just arranged for our youngest to be out the way for the first time since he dropped her).
Thanks and best wishes to all.
What are you working on with you?
She's not happy in this marriage, so you can't convince her to "Be happy in THIS marriage"
partly b/c she has reason for feeling frustrated. Most women want to feel protected by their h's and to feel secure, which includes some financial security.
Second, talking someone into feeling something they have not felt in awhile, isn't likely to work.
So what about changing the dynamics in THIS marriage - so that if she recommits,
it'll be a better, different, improved marriage?
What would that look like?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I believe that ones words and actions, or lack of, can help to heal another or hurt them.
That my lack of leadership and inability over the years to ensure the family's security and so remove the burden from my wife have contributed to or caused her depression, though that doesn't entirely excuse her of any blame for her actions.
I have always tried to protect my wife without question, falling out with close family at times. Additionally, when we met I made it very clear I was prepared to walk away to stand by her and; prepared to go to war with some very rich and influential people on her behalf. I would never knowingly hurt my wife but I just didn't understand the messages she was communicating until it was too late.
Vanilla, I still love my wife despite what I have witnessed of her in another man's arms in the front seat of our car kissing, hugging and who knows what I couldn't see. But I am deeply hurt in ways I cannot begin to convey.
I absolutely love my children.
I try to work hard to improve the situation but I fail when my wife goes out for the evening or night because, well, you know. It rips at my heart.
I am trying to lead us to a better life and this includes healing myself and my wife if she will let me.
I also discovered, unbeknownst to my wife, that she will need an operation which could result in serious invasive surgery.
I think she may be very scared about this and the psychological effects very powerful. I feel for her and I am extremely worried for her health and well being.
I want to lead us to happier times and I am open to learning.
I thank you Vanilla and all for your support and I will reply as soon as possible.
Please read my next reply to Sandi2 as I have some further questions that you may also have a view on.
trying to change many things but I get this and all of your points. Sorry for the short reply I have very little time and snails can get across a keyboard faster.
I hope you are in a good place and wish you well. James.
Sandi, I am so very thankful for your and everyone's help but I fear it is to late for me. I have never in my life felt so unhappy, alone, and desperate
Sandi, I am sorry for not writing sooner. I actually fell asleep on two occasions having started and yesterday finished a considered message only to press the wrong icon and lose it.
Since then things have become much worse and I don't know what to do and I am barely coping with it all.
Sandi, I am so very thankful for your and everyone's help but I fear it is to late.
Over the last few days I have said that I wish to returned to the main bedroom baring in mind the advice and because I believe that sleeping downstairs did not help the situation. In addition I asked my wife to pay for our child's school Club and when she said she had no money I said you could afford to go out for dinner yesterday( with the children) I actually returned to the bedroom last night as the night I intended I worked through the night and didn't want to disturb her when I returned. Anyway it seems my comment about the dinner pushed my wife to now want a divorce and yesterday she told me that.
She has been speaking with my brothers x wife who has encouraged her to do it giving advise and today she will have seen a solicitor. She has said when we have debated/argued that she would stop the divorce if I moved out. Today, while writing this I discovered that my daughters gym display was on at the last minute and when I arrived for it my wife was there (having taken time of work) with the parents of my daughter's best friend. The ones who have my daughter for sleepover on nights when my wife goes out.
I told my wife that her not telling me was disgraceful and argued with her friends husband when I thanked her for telling me. My wife remained with them for the display and we left separately. Later it became clear that they are instrumental in condoning her actions probably pushing her in that direction. The husband made it clear what he had always disliked me.
In answer to your questions, I was very clear but I struggled and the date was put back numerous times.
My wife did understand but I think in hindsight, for the last 5 years did not agree with my continuing and wanted me to get a job.
I didn't discuss my progress to avoid pressure.
I think my wife has made it very clear that she feels trapped by me trying to persuade her. She says I try to manipulate her and use emotional blackmail.
Along with these and other friends and family I am fighting a losing battle because she confides in them but will not talk to me about our issues, or see a professional with me.
Though I believe she has seen a therapist herself for depression over my working and or the marriage.
I always showed love for my wife and often told her I loved her. In our time together we were never apart and always held hands when out.
I do wish to change who I have become, our circumstances and be able to reverse our financial situation and take care of my Family.
I am apprehensive but willing to go outside of my comfort box and work on myself but there is much to do. I am really shell-shocked.
I am anxious and desperate but willing to try anything.
I have to say that advice from family who have talked with my wife is to see solicitors and start proceedings before I lose everything. They refer to the fact that I didn't go to mediators after my wife said she would delay and it now appears that I am unreasonable.
James, please reach out to someone near you. Your words concern me. It is not too late to get help. You are seriously depressed and need someone to talk you off the ledge where you currently stand.
It is difficult to deal with serious issues when we are in so much emotional pain. The emptiness and loneliness you feel today, is not permanent. Please, call someone......maybe a hotline.......but call and let someone know you need help right now.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Lets start here. Give up this attitude. It is NEVER too late until you decide that this relationship isnt what you want anymore. Frame your thoughts this way: the marriage is already over; getting the legal divorce decree is only your way of reporting you relationship status to the government. So stop fighting against the state of being divorced as that isnt what will change your situation. Instead focus on healing YOU.
Originally Posted By: James66
Over the last few days I have said that I wish to returned to the main bedroom baring in mind the advice and because I believe that sleeping downstairs did not help the situation.
This is not why you want to return. It isnt as a means of 'helping the situation'. You should be in the MBR because YOU are the one fighting for this marriage. If she wants out, she can go. Why are you asking for her permission?
Originally Posted By: James66
She has been speaking with my brothers x wife who has encouraged her to do it giving advise and today she will have seen a solicitor. She has said when we have debated/argued that she would stop the divorce if I moved out.
Dont fall for that. She will say whatever she thinks you want to hear in order to manipulate you to get her way. Of course she wants you out; stringing you along with a potential for R is a great way to do it. Read back in BEClem's situation - he was out for 6 months and was never able to move back in.
Originally Posted By: James66
Today, while writing this I discovered that my daughters gym display was on at the last minute and when I arrived for it my wife was there (having taken time of work) with the parents of my daughter's best friend. The ones who have my daughter for sleepover on nights when my wife goes out. I told my wife that her not telling me was disgraceful and argued with her friends husband when I thanked her for telling me. My wife remained with them for the display and we left separately.
Why is it your wife's responsibility to tell you these things? Is she your mother? You should start to take a more active and proactive role in your kid's life. Get the newsletters. See whats going on with her.
Originally Posted By: James66
I think my wife has made it very clear that she feels trapped by me trying to persuade her. She says I try to manipulate her and use emotional blackmail.
Sounds like she's telling you to stop pursuing her. Same kinds of things we're saying to you. Back waaaaaaaay off.
Originally Posted By: James66
I always showed love for my wife and often told her I loved her. In our time together we were never apart and always held hands when out.
Have you read the 5 Love Languages? I think it may be eye opening to you.
Originally Posted By: James66
I do wish to change who I have become, our circumstances and be able to reverse our financial situation and take care of my Family.
These are words. Where are the ACTIONS to back that up?
Originally Posted By: James66
I am apprehensive but willing to go outside of my comfort box and work on myself but there is much to do. I am really shell-shocked.
I am anxious and desperate but willing to try anything.
Have you ever been on an airplane? You know what they say? Put on your own mask before helping others. If youre a shell of yourself, youre of no good to anyone. So you cant have a healthy relationship until YOU are healthy. What are you going to do to heal? No 'try's. What are you going to DO? And WHEN?
Originally Posted By: James66
I have to say that advice from family who have talked with my wife is to see solicitors and start proceedings before I lose everything. They refer to the fact that I didn't go to mediators after my wife said she would delay and it now appears that I am unreasonable.
Have you read DR? Theres a large section about family and therapists giving advice. Most just want to tell you what you want to hear to feel better.
In my opinion, if you dont want a divorce, dont file for one. Simple as that.
I did not see your last post, when I sent my previous one. You had me really worried about you. My advice is to take care of yourself, first. I realize you want to take action to save your MR, however, your mental state is most important. You cannot make the best decisions when experiencing the type of pain you currently face.
Quote:
Anyway it seems my comment about the dinner pushed my wife to now want a divorce and yesterday she told me that.
FWIW, I doubt your comment pushed her to want a divorce. According to the pattern set by those many WW's before her, she was just waiting for you to say one thing she didn't like, and then use it as her green light to divorce. If not for this statement you gave her, any other statement would have come soon enough......b/c she was sitting on "ready". I dare say she is following the free advice she has collected.
Don't beat yourself up and think you've pushed her into doing anything she didn't want to do. At the same time, I suggest you refrain from making similar statements........at least, for the time being. At this point, I don't think such statements will save the M, and could result in more problems for you.
Quote:
I think my wife has made it very clear that she feels trapped by me trying to persuade her. She says I try to manipulate her and use emotional blackmail.
It is common for a W to feel she is being pressured when her H persistently tries to persuade her to change her mind. A WW would probably use similar terminology, as your W chose, to describe emotional pressure. I think it is natural for the LBS to at least try to talk sense into a spouse who wants to leave the M, however, it doesn't work well when there are issues such as MLC, waywardness, etc. Their mindset is not in "normal" mode. My point is that verbal persuasion is not generally successful in this type of situation.
Quote:
I do wish to change who I have become, our circumstances and be able to reverse our financial situation and take care of my Family.
I am apprehensive but willing to go outside of my comfort box and work on myself but there is much to do.
I am anxious and desperate but willing to try anything.
Great! That is your starting place ^^^^^^^^^^^^willingness. Your circumstances will not likely change until you change yourself. I see most LBH's panicking and trying to change the circumstances before working on themselves. You have to get it corrected in the right order. Also, you must understand that making lifelong changes in yourself takes time.....if the changes are to stick. And, the circumstances may take even longer. There are no guarantees about your W and the MR. However, if you really work to make positive changes in yourself, I don't see how your life could help but improve from where you sit today. Do you? Currently, you are feeling miserable and seeing little light at the end of this tunnel, however, there is ALWAYS hope when you have the attitude that matches the words you have stated in the quote above. Willingness is your friend! Anyone can "wish". It takes courage to be willing to change yourself.
I am encouraged by what I have read in your last post. Now, to put legs to your willingness.
For now, your primary goals should be to get yourself protected legally, and emotionally. My advice is to seek legal guidance, in order to protect yourself, financially, etc. I would avoid public arguments, b/c it will work against you. I suggest you not listen to the team that supports/advises her. Avoid contact with those who wish to see the M end. Although you still want to save the M, these other things need to come first. The harder you try to save it, right now, the more depressed/fearful you may become, so keep your eyes on the goal of getting yourself protected and emotionally fit.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
My warning my wife about many men on tinder is not supposed to be a threat but
advice at a time when I believe she may be vulnerable. I guess it would not be welcome anyway.
I believe you are right in what most women and my wife want and need. Since my wife first talked about divorce I have got work but it has been extended hard to earn reasonable money due to getting used to a new trade and being dragged down emotionally by the situation and the intense worry, especially when my wife has gone out for the night with someone.
From my wife's point of view, and actually what I was trying to achieve the marriage would include a husband that worked hard and earned enough for financial security.
Be Debt and worry free,
A loving relationship involving our children with laughter and good conversation, working toward goals whatever they may be. Regular trips home and abroad,
Sandi, This evening my wife spoke with me briefly. She said that she had paid a solicitor a grand to start the divorce proceedings stating that she doesn't love or want to be with me.
The conversation started when I asked her quietly if she wanted me to go because she had a relationship with someone else. I said I want to know because if that was the case I would know what to do. ( meaning but I don't know if I made myself clear that I would understand we were over) my wife became a little frustrated saying no but of course I have seen her kissing a different man to the one that I think dropped her, perhaps someone she has known longer. But is it possible she hasn't taken it any further ?
She says she doesn't want men in her life and that I have put her off men for life by leaving her to struggle all these years.
She said she had been thinking about it for a long time to which I replied "I know, about 5 years. Her reaction suggests I was spot on. I won't go into everything so as not to waste your time plus my memory is vague but we talked for a short time reasonably,though she still insisted on divorce unless I left the house or something I don't recall.
She did say she would go to relate if the decision was binding. I thought relate was a therapist organization, anyway I said that they were not the type of people I wanted to use and that we should use a solution based therapist and I will locate one. My wife didn't really comment further about this so I don't know if she agrees or not but I will look into it. Please advise the best way to do this. It has been suggested that I text my wife saying that I'm sorry that she wants to divorce but and as she is cheating g on me I can't carry on in the marriage and I would like to go with her to mediation. (This will save us thousands thigh not what she has spent already) and it could but time.
Perhaps the bot about cheating is antagonizing and not a good idea but I see why it was suggested. Neither of us can really afford solicitors without putting a charge on the house which could wipe us out financially.
Perhaps her friends in the last post have bank rolled her. They are giving her advise and they clearly dislike me intensely.
Sandi, This evening my wife spoke with me briefly. She said that she had paid a solicitor a grand to start the divorce proceedings stating that she doesn't love or want to be with me. The conversation started when I asked her quietly if she wanted me to go because she has told you she wants out and she has told you why. Regardless of any OM's -she has told you over the years what she needed. It sounds as if you both have had hard times, you have been too depressed to work in a consistent manner and she's been bearing all the burden so, you saying you think she's depressed now or has OM just takes the focus off the one person you CAN control, which is you.
she had a relationship with someone else. I said I want to know because if that was the case I would know what to do. ( meaning but I don't know if I made myself clear that I would understand we were over) I thought there was an OM. If so, then what?
my wife became a little frustrated saying no but of course I have seen her kissing a different man to the one that I think dropped her, perhaps someone she has known longer. But is it possible she hasn't taken it any further ? So there's an OM at least partly physical, and certainly emotionally. How much difference does it make to you if it has gone further? I'm not arguing either way, just asking.
You know you have a w who says she wants out of the m, says she is acting on that wish, that her reasons for wanting out are not "crazy" or out of the blue, she's having some form of R with an OM...and you seem to be frozen in indecision.
Why not talk to someone there? I don't get what that risks. Can you tell us the downside?
She says she doesn't want men in her life and that I have put her off men for life by leaving her to struggle all these years.
She said she had been thinking about it for a long time to which I replied "I know, about 5 years. Her reaction suggests I was spot on. Okay so, ^^ this discussion of OM's and "her depression" isn't really helping you solve much. TO me they are irrelevant unless you are saying you knew she was not happy but you did nothing to improve things and now she wants out and Now you are "willing" to do something.
What do you think WILL help the situation? When do you want to do that?
I won't go into everything so as not to waste your time plus my memory is vague but we talked for a short time reasonably,though she still insisted on divorce unless I left the house or something I don't recall.
She did say she would go to relate if the decision was binding. I thought relate was a therapist organization, anyway I said that they were not the type of people I wanted to use and that we should use a solution based therapist and I will locate one. My wife didn't really comment further about this so I don't know if she agrees or not but I will look into it. Please advise the best way to do this. Make sure you are taking action to help with the financial part b/c it's crucial to how she feels. And for how your family is doing.
And let's face it, it's not really fair to her for you to unilaterally decide on another project or training or whatever, while she works full time and tells you it's bothering her.
I think she's been really clear. As for a therapist, you can actually ask them if they are "solution based".
Some T's want to delve into childhood issues, which has a lot of value in the long run, or for an individual. But right now, your marriage is in crisis and the best case scenario to me, is you getting a job and delaying her departure from the m.
I cannot see value in you leaving the home, btw. Not sure if the laws are different in the UK, but here, it would not help you. (I'm assuming there is no violence, or too much stress in front of the kids, however).
Are you doing anything for GAL? Not all with the kids...but spending good time with the kids is also a good thing for everyone.
It has been suggested that I text my wife saying that I'm sorry that she wants to divorce but and as she is cheating g on me I can't carry on in the marriage and I would like to go with her to mediation. (This will save us thousands thigh not what she has spent already) and it could but time. You want to save the m, or give her an ultimatum?
I mean, what is the point of saying that to her? She wants out of the m and IS willing to see other men.
So, you pointing out that you can't carry on, seems like an invitation to have her say "get out".
IF the time comes for hiring lawyers, THEN I suspect she will suggest mediation. She would be the payor, correct?
Perhaps the bot about cheating is antagonizing and not a good idea but I see why it was suggested. The part about cheating is absolutely antagonizing and deflecting from your own role, and is absolutely going to annoy her. Why are you focussed on her, when she's not here trying to save the m?
I think you are overlooking that in her mind, "cheating" is not cheating. It's a justified relationship with OM b/c of her long unmet needs.
I know that hurts to read and I'm sorry. It's just that most people who have affairs, particularly women, have already thought it out. It's not a casual or spontaneous one night stand or "just for sex". Most women who have A's don't feel much love for their h's, but feel deeply wounded and or resentful, and have been for a long long time. Pointing out the cheating at best, will fall on deaf ears. The more you challenge her choices, the more she will defend them. Keep that in mind.
Neither of us can really afford solicitors without putting a charge on the house which could wipe us out financially. Then when the time comes, IF it comes, mediation can arise as a proposal. But I'd be surprised if she isn't the one to suggest it.
Perhaps her friends in the last post have bank rolled her. They are giving her advise and they clearly dislike me intensely.
What so you think ? No control over this^^^. (Also doubtful that someone is just giving her money for this, but again, you have no control over this.)
You DO have control over you. What's going on in your sandbox?
Thank you Best wishes, James
Hang in there James. I wish you could see that you are empowered when you have work to do in your sandbox.
If this were all about her out of the blue, and if you had been a perfect h, then you really would be powerless.
But you're not powerless. That^^ is good news. I mean it!
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
My warning my wife about many men on tinder is not supposed to be a threat but advice at a time when I believe she may be vulnerable. I guess it would not be welcome anyway.
I see similar actions from worried H's who want to protect their WW from getting into situations with OM (online dating, meet ups with strangers, co-workers, or whatever). When the H approaches his W with words of "warning", it often has a tone of anger and bitterness.........and most of all, controlling. Well, if she's trying to date men, what H wouldn't be a little angry, right? This is me sharing my views, FWIW. If a man wants to warn his W of impending danger resulting from her conduct, he should approach her lovingly and speak in a tender, caring manner that shows his sincere concern for her welfare.........and leave his personal feelings and demands about what she's doing completely out of the conversation. It's about her and her safety. On the other hand, if she is cheating and/or conducting herself like a single woman that clearly crosses boundary lines for the M, then her H may approach her in a firm, confident manner to state how her conduct is disrespecting him and their M, and state the action he will take if she chooses to continue her wayward behavior. If he chooses the second option, he must backup his word and follow through with his action to separate (or whatever). The point is...... She is free to make her choices.
I can't blame any man who is upset about it, but speaking from personal experience, I think she will see you as trying to control her.........and it produces negative results, b/c she blames you for the shape of the MR. In my case, I saw my H as a weak, passive, desperate man trying to force me to conform to what he wanted me to do. The crazy thing in all of this is that I had previously been the woman who would have clicked my tongue and judged another married woman for the same behavior. But at this point, I was the wayward W, and filled to the gills with years of resentment. I had lost respect for my H, blamed him for not providing better,..........and eventually, I rebelled. When he tried to warn or give weak threats, I acted worse b/c I was rebelling against him and the lousy life I felt we had. Like your W, I felt trapped. I could not stand to be in the same room and share air with him! No, I did not hate him, I just felt like I was dying and struggling to survive....much like a fish laying on the ground gasping for oxygen. Eh.....a little dramatic wording perhaps, but I said all of that to show you that you cannot talk your W back into the M. As much as you may be tempted to say one more thing...........don't do it. Just work on yourself and let go of rope you have tied around her. In time, as she watches you (perhaps from afar), she will see you becoming the man you once were, or maybe better. She has to have time to work through her own stuff, before she will be ready to even consider putting forth any effort toward a MR.
I don't think I am projecting my stitch into everyone else I read on the board, b/c everyone is not the same, regardless of how similar the stories may sound. I have studied this for quite some time now, and the behavior patterns of a WW appear to be from the same cookie cutter. Until your W can let go of her resentment, and begin to feel respect for you.........I think she will continue to rebel. All in all, it still starts with you making changes for your health and the betterment of your family.
Even if a divorce is granted, it is not the end of you and your children. You can be happy, but I think you may need better help for the depression.. In the meantime, who knows what your W may decide later, I remember at least one story of a couple reconciling about a year after their divorce.
You can do what you need to do, James. I hope you will start by thinking differently about yourself. Maybe we eventually become what we believe about ourselves. If so, that should be our motivation to have a positive mental attitude, right?
I seriously want to see you pull yourself out of this pit of clay. Of course I hope the M will survive, but more importantly, I want you to be well.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
vanilla there are some lovely and experienced people helping me and I very much appreciate the time and effort you all are giving me.
I'm sorry though, I don't know what 25 questions you are referring to. Please let me know.
Thank you.
i think they mean the questions I asked you. My original screen name has pretty much stuck as my name, all these years later.
"25" for short.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
My warning my wife about many men on tinder is not supposed to be a threat but
advice at a time when I believe she may be vulnerable. I guess it would not be welcome anyway. True. Besides, trying to fix her or her issues now is pointless b/c she's not here trying to save the m.
I believe you are right in what most women and my wife want and need. well and she also told you. As hurtful as that^^ may feel, I hope you can see the silver lining, which is her clarity.
Since my wife first talked about divorce I have got work but it has been extended hard to earn reasonable money due to getting used to a new trade and being dragged down emotionally by the situation and the intense worry, especially when my wife has gone out for the night with someone. I don't know what this^^ means. Are you working and earning enough to help out or provide for your family? Or are you saying you are too upset to do so?
And if you are too upset to provide, can you see how circular this^^ gets?
She resents that you don't contribute enough, but you're too upset to contribute much so....
there are at least 3 reasons Not to blame her for what you do.
1 - Because it does Not help you! It keeps you from taking responsibility for your life, which 2 - makes you powerless, and finally, I'm not sure it's fair anyhow.
From my wife's point of view, and actually what I was trying to achieve the marriage would include a husband that worked hard and earned enough for financial security.
Be Debt and worry free,
A loving relationship involving our children with laughter and good conversation, working toward goals whatever they may be. Regular trips home and abroad,
Both with a zest for life.
Yes James, I agree that most people want ^^ this type of life.
James, what about the counseling? I hope you will see someone. I thought I read that you struggled with depression and anxiety, over the past years. There is no judgement in that comment, I'm just trying to recap what I thought I read here.
In these grueling painful ordeals, I find 2 "upsides" are possible. (But WE must grab and make these happen. No one else can do it for us.)
First, pain is the touchstone for spiritual growth...or bitterness and victimhood.
this^^ is our exclusively Our choice.
Second, the LBS has NO painless options.
So at some point, we have to decide whether our discomfort with change in ourselves, and not knowing where it could lead,
is worse than our discomfort staying stuck, and facing the ordeal we are in.
IF our changes and growth begin as being all about reconciliation with our spouses, hopefully it will change and become for US (Otherwise the "tactics" will end b/c they are not authentic change).
Yet the paradox is that by letting go of the results and solely focusing on what is in "our sandbox", i.e. OUR OWN issues and flaws that WE want to work on,
we become who we were meant to become and yes, that makes us more attractive to our spouses.
Sometimes we become the people we were meant to become and that is what they wanted, all along.
Hang in there James.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Yet the paradox is that by letting go of the results and solely focusing on what is in "our sandbox", i.e. OUR OWN issues and flaws that WE want to work on,
we become who we were meant to become and yes, that makes us more attractive to our spouses.
Sometimes we become the people we were meant to become and that is what they wanted, all along.
25 - This is beautiful stuff here. It's hard work keeping the focus on me and not think of we. It's a challenge every day that can be made easier with time especially when you are dedicated to improving yourself, GAL, etc. Thanks for this.
James - Hang in there and I wish you the best.
Me 42, Wife 39; Married 16; Together 17; Kids: D13, S10 Wife asks for Divorce: 03/19/13 Reconcile: 07/07/13 Round 2 Starts: 02/19/17 Apartment Life: 04/21/17 PA Confirmed: 05/23/17
Thank you 25, and to Sandi, vanilla and others that have given their support. I'm sorry to leave replying so long, I've tried a few times but fallen asleep or been sidetracked.life is in turmoil a bit as I'm burning the candle at both ends. 25 it seems there was more than one man, I believe the one still seeing my wife has been around longer but I don't know by how much.
When we met my wife hadn't kissed another man and the exclusivity of her intimacy, love and our bonding means the world to me. I cannot describe the hurt I feel at her actions, the betrayal that I know about let alone the possibility of fornication. In my youth I didn't feel the need to marry in order to have a life partner but needed to for immigration purposes if we were to remain together. Something my wife desperately wanted. I thought very carefully and took a chance on someone I had known only a about 6 months from a different country,religion and culture. but when I made that decision I meant it with all my heart and I envisioned us growing old together.
I don't believe I am frozen in indecision but cautious, trying to learn from those that have more knowledge and experience and trying not to make (more)mistakes that will damage the relationship.
Who are you referring to when you say talk to someone there ?
Earning more money to support the family is the most crucial thing to all this.
I am trying to act now.
I have started GAL doing something that has a martial and healing aspect and which is for life. I don't intend to stop again as long as I am breathing. (I did something similar before we met and reduced it until I stopped. Something I deeply regret).
More importantly I am working. I struggle to make reasonable money, especially recently due to unanticipated costs, tiredness, and health caused by the stress and worry my wife's actions are causing me. I cannot just detach like cutting a piece of string because the string is attached to my heart and it keeps it beating.
Today I am able to write because I can't work due to migraine and pulled back muscles; more money lost. But I am trying. But the money is poor when I can work and I really need to work constantly 6 or 7 days a week.
I plan to do a short 9 week course to get me into another profession. One which I will enjoy and can have reasonable pay. But this costs a few thousand unless I can study under someone already established which is unlikely. I intend to work at the same time but at the moment it is pie in the sky unless I can get on top of things and start making more money.
The therapist not only has to be solution based but one that won't give up at the first hurdle.
My wife has text me asking to go to mediation to deal with this in a peaceful way for the sake of our children. I replied that I am confused by her asking for this as she has previously refused my requests including going to relate. She replied saying she hadn't refused but didn't want to go on the weekend. That the solicitors had recommended mediation and she would contact the mediator to see when we can go. I believe we should first go to relate and want to text her this. Please let me your views.
25 I am largely just replying to your comments or question in order to give information and learn more and am not being defensive. I see clarity and agreement in what you and others have have written. I thank everyone again for your insight, help and support. I need to go now but will reply to Sandi and others asap. Your continued support is so very important and appreciated by me.
Hi Trying, Thanks for you support. I'm sorry your marriage has hit a second bump. Do you think something changed in the dynamics or attitude from one of you to cause round two ? I wish you love and peace. James
Go all,I'm sorry not to keep in contact for so long. I can't explain it.
I was hoping you could give some advice at short notice. I written today already but I'm rubbish with this stuff and I don't know if I sent it . Just trying different things and hoping it will send.
Things between us haven't changed except my wife saw solicitors to start proceedings last week with her "friend in tow telling her that it's hard at first but how great she will feel when it's done and she will be free.
I said that she had agreed( by text) to go to counseling first and she replied that o didn't talk with her. Of course it's impossible to communicate in a reasonable way and I have been trying to give space and earn money.
So on Friday I text her that I have 2 appointments available and she agreed to go. The appointment is for tonight in 3 for tonight in 3 hours with a relate counselor for couples counseling.
I know it's short notice but I would really appreciate advice as to what not to say or possibly things to say. For instance should I mention the other man or men ? How I only ever tried to look after her and our film, however well I succeeded.
Or just listen and sympathise with her ?
I'm concerned that after giving as much space, working and trying to look like I'm good as much as I could over the last few months that arranging counseling is giving the wrong signal.
Having said that is it possible she wants me to do this.
Having said that I recall her initially telling a friend that she wanted to go to counseling so that I would understand it's over. O f_Co, what can I do about it anyway.
I'm just hoping that a trained counselor can persuade her to think again.
Having said that I discounted divorce busting counseling because of the cost and being over the phone but would that help after all. How could I get her to talk to someone over the phone ? I'm confused.
Wish me luck for tonight and give me your thoughts please.
with her "friend in tow telling her that it's hard at first but how great she will feel when it's done and she will be free.
I take it you didn't read DR? CH 1 The divorce trap really spells out this illusion.
Originally Posted By: James66
I'm just hoping that a trained counselor can persuade her to think again.
Counseling has nothing to do with persuasion. Its more about communication. What do YOU want to get out of counseling?
Originally Posted By: James66
Having said that I discounted divorce busting counseling because of the cost and being over the phone but would that help after all. How could I get her to talk to someone over the phone ? I'm confused.
Coaching is about you, not her. It helps you to refine DB'ing technique. As well as plans and goal setting.
Me: 43 M: 10y S:15 ILYBINILWY 2/18/13 W moved out 2/18/13 Filed for D: 2/17/13 Got DB: 2/20/13 Got DR: 2/23/13 180 & LRT Began: 2/25/13 D Final Dec '13
