WAW and the Big D

[Bdog37]

Starting new thread for journaling

Old thread http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2729372#Post2729372

So, I was asked why I don't harbor any anger towards my WW and my response was that I didn't want to live with the anger cause why should I. Yes, from what I have read, the WAS's on here have done unspeakable things to people they once loved. I decided early on that I did not want to let my WW ruin my life anymore so I worked hard on forgiveness and let go of my anger. We can't control what they do. The only thing we can control is how we react to the things they do to us.

With that being said I think I hit an all time anger spout today. I am at the point where I have learned from a mutual friend that my WW is trying to maliciously ruin me financially. I have had my L look into our finances while we were M and the news I got from him has come at a shock. My W handled all the financial obligations, from which I have learned my lesson, and what she has done/doing still makes me sick to my stomach. This all started right after the OM's ex found out about their A and threatened to destroy my W's life. After multiple threats my W came to the conclusion that once I found out we would be getting a D anyway so she has been planning these malicious acts since then. Bank accounts were closed and multiple credit cards in my name were opened. The debt on these credit cards are substantial and she was very good at hiding the monthly statements from me. I have also learned, just today, that she literally has used one credit card to not only book a weekend out of town with the OM, but has also bought multiple lingerie items for this weekend getaway on a credit card in my name.

There may be some good news in all this. I first spoke that my W's apple account was logged into my IPad and I was able to read her text messages. I stopped "snooping" long ago, but after the lawyer informed me of my unfortunate debt that I was unaware of, I went snooping. The things I have read that she is saying to friends and family not only hurt, but has made me rediscover my anger for her. How in the world could someone grow so cold and malicious towards someone they loved and spent 16 years of their life with????? Luckily I do have these texts messages because hopefully the court will see that she has done these things on purpose to hurt me. In my town there are 2 judges that will hear our case. Through text messages I also found out that one of them just so happens to be a family friend of theirs and referred my W's current L to her. Once I informed my L about this he said we def will not be having him review our case because of a conflict of interest. So imagine if I didn't have these text messages and decided NOT to snoop. I would have gone into court, possible with a judge that is a family friend of my W's family, knowing all of this but maybe having little grounds to stand on to fight it. All marital debt in my state is split evenly so why should would have racked up all this credit card debt is beyond me? Maybe she figures that I will have to buy her out of our properties, pay her child support, give her half of my 401 and most of this debt will be wiped out, but leave me with little investments for my future?? I have no ideal, but I do know that 2 accounts were set up for our daughter's future and they are now GONE. She closed them and took the money. How.......how can someone be so cold??????? She actually stole money from her own daughters!! She was telling her friends (via text) that she is hoping our home appraises for x amount because she will be going after the equity. She literally said that she "needs" this amount to buy a home of her own. UGH! I am beyond frustrated today needed to come here to vent, so sorry. I do hope that justice will prevail and the judge will see that her actions, since last year, has only been to benefit herself in setting up a new life and forces her to pay back the money she stool and doesn't hold me accountable for this enormous debt. I have a good L and he already told me that we will definitely fight all this, but it will all boil down to whatever the judge rules on. I know Karma is a b**** so I seriously can't wait until it comes and bites her in the a** for ruining my children's and my lives.

[Dawgs]

Brotherman,

So sorry to read that. Cheaters are one thing and down right despicable, but this is just plain sucktastic, my friend. I hate it for you. Heck, I'm angry for you.

The only thing we can control is how we react to the things they do to us.

One of the best statements ever had read on this board.

I know Karma is a b**** so I seriously can't wait until it comes and bites her in the a** for ruining my children's and my lives.

It will, my friend. It will.

[Gordie]

I have also learned, just today, that she literally has used one credit card to not only book a weekend out of town with the OM, but has also bought multiple lingerie items for this weekend getaway on a credit card in my name.

As Jeep would say...sucktastic...so sorry for you, bro...allow yourself to feel the anger, vent away...only after allowing yourself to feel it will you be able to get it go...

[Bdog37]

This is just incredible. I am part to blame by trusting her (why would I not trust her) with our finances. I just can't believe all this.... I couldn't believe that someone who loved you could actually cheat on you, but now I can't believe she could stoop so low to do things like this. D brings out the worst in people!! This all reminds me of how people react when there is a death in the family and they dig their hands in to get whatever possessions/money they can without caring about the feelings of others. I have actually witnessed that scenario in multiple family's so since D can be considered a death, then I shouldn't be surprised on what she is doing.

Then there are the lies she is spreading to her family and friends. I could understand if any little bit of it was true, but the things she is saying make me seriously want to call these people up and let them know how bad she is lying. She is telling a lot of these people that I am a bad father I am and how she is going after full custody.... (that part makes me literally tear up because my children are my life). How can anybody do this???? I was not a bad husband or father!! I did not verbally or physically abuse her, I have always held a job and supported our family, I have always...always supported her ambitions by helping her with schooling etc, I have always show my love the best I could, listened while she vented about work and other stressful related issues, and I probably could go on. I literally took care of our first born by myself. Everyone who knows me personally couldn't believe how I allowed my W to go out every weekend while I stayed at home with my baby girl. So how the hell can she tell me that the worst thing I did in our M was to neglect family time with her and the kids? Yes, I became selfish in my own ways and quit going to every single event, party, carnival, etc, but how does that merit doing such horrible and unspeakable things to the person you chose to marry!!!!

I really want to wake up from this nightmare someday because sometimes it is too hard to bare. I am pretty sure that I will never get over this and even though I am angry I am also terrible hurt. Hurt that she has become a monster...the woman I loved, married, had children with, pictured to spend the rest of my life with....sigh.

I think my day of venting is done and I'm going to spend the rest of my afternoon canceling these credit cards. Hopefully some good news will come to me tomorrow.

[Bdog37]

How long before moving forward?

So since I have been out GAL I have met some wonderful people. One of these happens to be a very beautiful woman who, after talking with on several occasions, is kind, sweet, caring, interesting, wonderful mother, etc, and clearly shows an interest in me. We have been talking, as just friends, for over a month now and she has recently expressed that she wants to move forward in our relationship. She expressed these feelings last weekend when I had her over my house for dinner. However, as wonderful as she is, I told her that I am not ready for a relationship and it bothers me that I feel this way. I told her that I am not trying to lead her on in anyway and that I was sorry I feel this way.

How is it so easy for our WAS's to go out, meet someone, start dating, and have feelings for someone else so quickly when we have been a part of their lives for so long? When is it time for the LBH spouse to start dating again?

This may fall under the category of "letting go", but I just find myself not wanting to open up and start trusting again. Here, I find someone who I would be grateful to be with and yet I am afraid because of what my W has done to me. How is this fair for the LBS? We are the ones left all damaged while the WAS gets to freely express, without concern, their feelings for someone else so quickly. My D won't be finalized for some time now and yet my W has been dating the OM since December. Why is it that I am the one afraid of starting a new relationship and how is it that she so easily has? Maybe because she is not afraid of someone betraying her since it was her that had the A?

I spoke with a few family members in regards to this and they said that most "rebound" relationships do not work and my W will soon discover that. Said that I should just take it slow with this OW and maybe some day I will be able to open up with her. I am not confident that this will happen anytime soon and it may never happen. I am confident that I am a much better man/father since all this happened, but I just don't want to find myself in this same predicament years down the road. If I feel this way now then when does this end?? How will I ever move forward if these feelings remain?

I know part of it is because I still miss my W, even though if you have read anything up above that sounds crazy, but there may always be a part of me that does. I miss the woman she used to be. I miss our life together and all the happy memories that we shared. I miss the life that we were planning to have together. Hell, I even really miss many of her family members that I have become so close to over all these years.

Ugh, why is this so hard for me to open up to this woman? She could very well be the one that helps me pick up the pieces and gives me the love that I deserve. Yet, here I am questioning it.

Again, how long before moving forward?

[KevinIn]

How long before moving forward?

...

How is it so easy for our WAS's to go out, meet someone, start dating, and have feelings for someone else so quickly when we have been a part of their lives for so long? When is it time for the LBH spouse to start dating again?

I'm going through a different issue - I really want someone to turn to. It's not healthy and i'm resisting the temptation, but i really want to find someone now.

[Dawgs]

I'm going through a different issue - I really want someone to turn to. It's not healthy and i'm resisting the temptation, but i really want to find someone now.

While this is a great, great thing...you must remember that there are different levels to this you need to think about.

If you can separate what you are going through from your current mindset, you'll find that going out is very, very beneficial to one's soul and ego. I speak from experience. Harley Quinn withstanding, I've gone out with quite a few - ranging from simple coffee dates to really going out, and then some.

The thing is, you must be careful of rebound attachment...which can be a not so good thing. You don't want your heart broken again.

But, go out. Have fun. Go on a date. Have some sexy time. Whatever. It's good for you. Just don't talk about your situation.

[Bdog37]

Journaling/venting

Ugh, not sure why I let my ex get to me. I was dropping my D off at school and while leaving out the door she was blowing me kisses while smiling. Her actions made it tough to leave and it brightened up my morning. Seconds later I get a text from the ex basically explaining that she is sick and tired of waiting for this D to be over. She explained that she wanted to know if I was going to put the house on the market or buy her out. She told me that she needed to "move on" and wanted to buy a place for her and the girls. She wants me to sell the house that my dying father willed to me so she can move on... Needless to say that her comments upset me so I basically just told her that I will see her in court. She clearly didn't like such a short response and went into a tirade about how she found someone who makes her so happy and that she isn't ashamed she moved on so months ago. Said that the marriage has been dead for awhile and that the only thing holding it together was a meaningless piece of paper.

I just responded with that I was glad he makes you so happy. However, I wanted to truly scream at her from the top of my lungs. Here, I was having such a great morning and now reading her comments just ruined my entire day. I want to know how in the h*** was our M "dead" for awhile now when the memories I have in the past 6 months were wonderful. We took an adult vacation to New Orleans with another couple, hosted 3 parties at our house, went and saw our beloved Chicago Cubs in a playoff game then all hugged as a family in our living room the night they won the WS. I mean, we were all literally hugging as a family on Nov. 3rd and then the very next day my life was turned upside down.

How in the world can someone say so many harsh things to someone they once loved?!?! How is it even possible for them to do so without any remorse whatsoever??

I'm so sick and tired of crying and caring for a W who thinks I am the devil who caused her so much pain. I seriously wish I could erase the last 16 years of my life. I seriously wish I never had met her, married her, had children with her, planned my future with her, loved her, etc. There are so many wonderful W out there and this one has destroyed my outlook on them.

Such a bad day now thanks to her.....ugh!!!

[Chris73]

SAL27. I feel for you man. Lately I'm of the disposition that my W is not thinking clearly. I can't ignore what she says, I have to validate her feelings and ensure that she's not attempting to cross any of my boundaries. But I can't let her words get to me.

Just yesterday morning my W called me "hon" and then later that same day said that she wants to move forward with the separation/divorce process. Does this sound like a woman who knows what she wants?

I feel like women in these situations will do and say anything to justify their decision to exit the marriage and offload some of the responsibility on the LBH so that they don't have to bear 100% of the guilt for destroying the family.

My plan is to keep working on being a better me. To become the man that she'd be crazy to walk away from. But if she still decides to walk, I'll still be a better person...

[Bdog37]

Thanks Chris73,

I remember reading your sitch and thinking about how much both of ours had in common. I also leaned on my wife to take care of the household duties and make most of the "executive" decisions in regards to the family. I too would help out when asked, but it just wasn't enough.

I feel like women in these situations will do and say anything to justify their decision to exit the marriage and offload some of the responsibility on the LBH so that they don't have to bear 100% of the guilt for destroying the family.

I agree with this and think it is the main reason for her lashing out at me all the time. However, I still try to remain friendly. Not sure why, but I want to be the bigger person when all this is said and done. It just upsets me so much coming from her. Anyone else in this world can call me every name in the book and it wouldn't bother me one bit. Hearing some of the things she has said to me just strikes so hard in my heart. I'm afraid that eventually I am going to resent the woman I once loved because of her actions and become cold towards OW as well....ugh. Just hate how I allow her to ruin my day. She isn't worth it and shouldn't have this much power over me.

[Dawgs]

It just upsets me so much coming from her. Anyone else in this world can call me every name in the book and it wouldn't bother me one bit. Hearing some of the things she has said to me just strikes so hard in my heart. I'm afraid that eventually I am going to resent the woman I once loved because of her actions and become cold towards OW as well.

You should have heard the names mine called me during mediation. Good times.

[Bdog37]

You should have heard the names mine called me during mediation. Good times.

Did you bother calling her any names back?

[Dawgs]

You should have heard the names mine called me during mediation. Good times.

Did you bother calling her any names back?

Not at all. I learned a long time ago how to deal with that. And the mediator saw it - and through it - all.

[Bdog37]

I just think its childish to sit there and call each other names. Still don't hide the fact that it hurts hearing her say all this...ugh!

[Bdog37]

Journaling/venting

It has been a week since I last vented on here and oh my how much can happen in a week. My STBEW has made it very difficult for me to keep my cool. I am trying to take the high road, for the kids sake, but last night was my breaking point. I am done playing the victim and being blamed for her A. Apart from very serious physical and emotional abuse, I can never see a good reason for a S to cheat. It is the single most worst thing you can do to someone you loved and last night I let her know that.

Her insults barely fazed me last night. Crazy how in a week I have gone from being hurt by what she says to now totally not having a single f*** to give. She is trying to blame me for her actions and its just wrong. Once again, she brought up my neglectfulness towards her and the kids during our M. I responded with that is still not deserving to be cheated on by the one you love. I'm no longer going to be responsible for her actions.

I am so done with her its not even funny. There are women out there that will treat me the way I deserve to be treated and never do what she has done. My only regret is that I didn't have the b**** to D her when I found out about the A. This woman has turned into such a monster that I no longer feel any love for her whatsoever. The unfortunate part in all this is that I will have to deal with her for the rest of my life because of the children. No matter how much I hate who she has become, I still know they need her and I will never take that away from them. The really sad part is that her actions/words have indicated to me that she desires her freedom more than being even being a mother. The kids do not deserve that, but luckily they will always have me.

I also have a meeting with my L today and I know I hired the right guy. He is going to really squeeze her in court in regards to all the credit card issues. I have confidence that the judge is going to see I'm in the right and I won't have to pay for what she is seeking. If there is any justice in the world then I won't have to, but you never know. I have been very civil with this W, but after what she said last night I believe this is going to turn ugly. Oh well, it is what it is. There is still one issue that I am hoping to receive good news from him later today.....wish me luck!

[Dawgs]

Her insults barely fazed me last night. Crazy how in a week I have gone from being hurt by what she says to now totally not having a single f*** to give. She is trying to blame me for her actions and its just wrong. Once again, she brought up my neglectfulness towards her and the kids during our M. I responded with that is still not deserving to be cheated on by the one you love. I'm no longer going to be responsible for her actions.

Isn't it refreshing when you don't have a single f*** to give? Puts things in a whole new perspective, eh? They make up "neglectful" stuff to justify...

I have been very civil with this W, but after what she said last night I believe this is going to turn ugly.

I thought civil was the way to go, too. Until she came out swinging for the fences...but, my lawyer saw through that, too. Tore her a new one. I'm still smiling inside over that.

Hope you get the good news, my friend.

[Bdog37]

[quoteIsn't it refreshing when you don't have a single f*** to give? Puts things in a whole new perspective, eh? They make up "neglectful" stuff to justify...
][/quote]

So true brother, so true! Funny how she was "reaching" for bad stuff to say about me. None of it is an excuse to do what she did.

I thought civil was the way to go, too. Until she came out swinging for the fences...but, my lawyer saw through that, too. Tore her a new one. I'm still smiling inside over that.

Haha, that's awesome! I'm sure its not the way you wanted to go, but when they decide to become ugly you have to take action to defend yourself. I would have been happy with being very fair to her, but those days are over. No more Mr. Nice Guy lol.

Thanks brother and I'm confident I will get the good news I seek today. There has to be a shining light in all this.

[Dawgs]

Haha, that's awesome! I'm sure its not the way you wanted to go, but when they decide to become ugly you have to take action to defend yourself. I would have been happy with being very fair to her, but those days are over. No more Mr. Nice Guy lol.

No, its not. She came out swinging. I mean, no holds bard...and the things that came out of her mouth were unlike any I've ever heard. Same type of stuff that countless friends have told me. That's why I always say be prepared and protect yourself, just because you two may agree to be amicable during the proceedings doesn't mean it will happen. Case in point, my ex said yeah, we'll be civil and friendly and all. However, when it came time to go to court and all, she had staged pictures of the house to make it look unlivable for the kids and had stated that I was not of right, or sound, mind...never mind the fact that my lawyer had six suicidal texts she had sent me. He tore her a new one...

I don't say be mean, but do protect yourself. This isn't a game. And, don't give in to her guilt trips or whatever thinking that will bring you favor...

[OwnIt]

SAL27, I am new here and don't know your story. I do know this from first-hand experience, emotions in lawsuits equal money. While if you have been a victim of fraud you have a right to deal with that, keep in mind that emotions can escalate the result. No one wins in a lawsuit, except the lawyers. My suggestion would be to process your emotions and feel the wrong you have endured, but communicate only facts to your lawyer (I did not open this account, Judge so and so referred my W to her L, etc) and be certain of the outcome you want to achieve (do you want a quick D, a cheap D, no D, etc). Some will help you and others won't. Not all facts have equal relevance to the fact-finder determining your outcome. There is a big difference between being right about something and being happy with the result you achieve. Best of luck to you.

[Bdog37]

Hello OwnIt and sorry you are here.

Thank you for your advise. I have been very open with my L in regards to the facts. Its not that I want to "destroy" her for doing what she did to me, but I do need to protect myself. STBEW is the same as most by saying she is going to be civil, but showing otherwise. I never wanted a D in the first place, but I am not going to lie down and let her walk all over me.... All the while grabbing everything she can get her hands on while doing so.

Personally possessions mean little to me, but the property we share is a big concern. My dying father willed the house to my sister's and I, but stressed how much he wanted my W and I to have it before he passed away. My sisters agreed and signed over their portion in order for us to have a better home located in a much better neighborhood. It is actually the house that I grew up in so it also has some sentimental value to me as well. Ex told me originally that she wants nothing to do with it, but now see's the value and has turned greedy. I'm sure some of it was due to her L advising her how much she can get, but now my repeated attempts to "buy her out" has failed due to it not being enough for her. Again, I was more willing to be fair in the beginning, but I will exercise every right I have to keep the house so that my kids will have a safe and loving home to grow up in.

The law is the law and you can't change that so hopefully, if there is any justice in this world, I will be able to come to an agreeable arrangement that will benefit us both...but we all know how it usually turns out in most cases.

[Bdog37]

Journaling/venting

Wow, another crazy week in my life. Saw my L on Friday and he, once again, reassured me that many of her requests won't hold up in court. However, he also advised me that the judges in my county are not "black and white" so they could rule against me in regards to some things. The major concerns of mine are something that I will fight for and I believe I chose the right L to do just that. If he is as half as good in the courtroom as he is in our meetings then I should be ok.

With that being said, I am sadden once again in regards to the STBEW's actions towards our kids. She has proven time and time again that her desire for freedom is more important then time with them and being a mother. Not even sure how someone comes to such a decision, but this latest event over the weekend has strengthened my case to get my kids more then I already do. I would never keep them away from her, but if its her freedom that she wants so bad then I will be more than willing to give it to her. My girls are the most important thing in my life right now....not my freedom.

This woman that she has become makes me sick and I can't find any love for her anymore. She came over on Sat to get some more belongings out of the house and I couldn't stand her presence. I now find myself wishing more and more that I never have to see or deal with her for the rest of my life. I don't even look back on all the good times we shared anymore. I haven't felt sadness for loosing her in quite sometime now and I really just wish she would leave me alone and stop texting me all the time.

I'm pretty sure the only reason I have reached this point is because I see who she has become. Maybe this was the woman I married and I was blinded by love the entire time?? Maybe in those 16 years together she has changed and her views on M have also change. Regardless, I know that I didn't deserve what she did to me and I am better than that. I know that I have no desire to be with this woman, whoever she is, and that there are many out there that will value who I am more than she ever could.

[Dawgs]

With that being said, I am sadden once again in regards to the STBEW's actions towards our kids. She has proven time and time again that her desire for freedom is more important then time with them and being a mother. Not even sure how someone comes to such a decision, but this latest event over the weekend has strengthened my case to get my kids more then I already do. I would never keep them away from her, but if its her freedom that she wants so bad then I will be more than willing to give it to her. My girls are the most important thing in my life right now....not my freedom.

Isn't that the truth. I often wonder how the ex can only be content with having them two nights a month. Stupid is as stupid does. A few weeks ago instead of skyping like we try to do, she called from a restaurant...on a date...and talked maybe 10 minutes. Ugh. The anger is over the treatment of the kids. Zero f**ks given about her.

Document everything you can to have the strongest case possible. Do whatever you have to do to get it. You won't regret it.

This woman that she has become makes me sick and I can't find any love for her anymore. She came over on Sat to get some more belongings out of the house and I couldn't stand her presence. I now find myself wishing more and more that I never have to see or deal with her for the rest of my life. I don't even look back on all the good times we shared anymore. I haven't felt sadness for loosing her in quite sometime now and I really just wish she would leave me alone and stop texting me all the time.

Bingo. Me, too. Me, too.

[Bdog37]

Isn't that the truth. I often wonder how the ex can only be content with having them two nights a month. Stupid is as stupid does. A few weeks ago instead of skyping like we try to do, she called from a restaurant...on a date...and talked maybe 10 minutes. Ugh. The anger is over the treatment of the kids. Zero f**ks given about her.

Document everything you can to have the strongest case possible. Do whatever you have to do to get it. You won't regret it.

Oh man, sorry to hear that. And I thought mine was the worst out there. Try this one on....she celebrated my oldest D's bday and brought the OM the entire bday cake. Wouldn't let my girls have any....wtf!! She also dropped them off at my house after their party. I already celebrated her bday the week prior and this wasn't my scheduled weekend with them, but I was more then willing to change my schedule to have them stay at my house. She had a BBQ to go to at OM's house that was more important. Don't care what she does to me anymore. Just breaks my heart for them now. She parties like she's 21 again and barely spends time with them.

Don't worry... I have been documenting all of this. I have a calendar that I have been keeping since November. L has seen all the evidence. Just a damn shame for the kids, you know.

[25yearsmlc]

As horrible & absent as the WAS can be as a parent, detaching is so crucial, so there's a lot to be said for seeing this as a "parade" of fools.

Sit down out of the way, eat your popcorn & watch the parade go by...But do your best to protect your kids.

When my h left for "up the road" (300 miles) & then to "check out" Alaska,
he wrote a letter to me saying how much he loved & missed "OUR" kids (pointing out that they were not just my children... ) um, okay...

Anyhow, he wrote that he missed me and our family & thought about us "every day." Like it had all "just happened" and wasn't caused by his unilateral choices, and as if it had happened to HIM, more than anyone else...

Honestly, you'd think he was drafted into combat...

[Dawgs]

"
Oh man, sorry to hear that. And I thought mine was the worst out there. Try this one on....she celebrated my oldest D's bday and brought the OM the entire bday cake. Wouldn't let my girls have any....wtf!! She also dropped them off at my house after their party. I already celebrated her bday the week prior and this wasn't my scheduled weekend with them, but I was more then willing to change my schedule to have them stay at my house. She had a BBQ to go to at OM's house that was more important. Don't care what she does to me anymore. Just breaks my heart for them now. She parties like she's 21 again and barely spends time with them. "

Good grief, that is truly sucktastic, man. Mine wasn't as bad, but get this - know the pics that the OMs wife sent me? Well, one of them was of my ex performing oral sex on him...and guess what the date on it was? Our freaking anniversary...

I'm sorry you are going through that, man. I'm here if you'd like to talk...

[Bdog37]

As horrible & absent as the WAS can be as a parent, detaching is so crucial, so there's a lot to be said for seeing this as a "parade" of fools.

Sit down out of the way, eat your popcorn & watch the parade go by...But do your best to protect your kids.

Hey 25yearsmic,

I agree, but sometimes its difficult to just sit by and watch what she is doing to our children. She desires a free life full of partying, staying out late, and no responsibilities. This is a life that I gave up when we had our first born and a life that I look back at and don't miss anymore. She does.

How do you tell your kids that their mother/father don't want to spend time with them? I chose not to bring up any questions in regards to the bday situation. Just asked my oldest if she had fun. As much as it hurts, I know my oldest is smart enough to realize who is present in her life right now. She doesn't speak about the situation, but does complain that she wants to stay with me and not her mom. As good as this feels I am still sadden by her loss more than mine. I can deal with loosing my wife, but I don't know how to comfort a child that "lost" their parent. The ex is going out of town this week and will only see her kids twice and only for a few hours. As a father I could never do this. The days I do not have my children are the hardest days for me. Sitting in a quiet house that used to be filled with laughter and joy... How can any parent value their time alone more than their time with their kids? This is just a concept to me that I don't understand.

How did you deal with your WAS in regards to the children?

[Bdog37]

Good grief, that is truly sucktastic, man. Mine wasn't as bad, but get this - know the pics that the OMs wife sent me? Well, one of them was of my ex performing oral sex on him...and guess what the date on it was? Our freaking anniversary...

Wow.... There are just no words for that. My ex was cheating on me around my bday (which happens to be on Christmas), but at least it wasn't on the actual day. Sure it would have been if she didn't have any family obligations. I asked for the details of the A and I eventually got them. For some reason I felt that I needed to know, but looking back now I probably could have gone without all that information. What about you? If you could go back would you say that you didn't need to see the pics or learn details like that?

Still, everything that she has done to me is meaningless. I'm done with her and would never want this woman back. I have zero f**** to give her anymore, but the constant absence in the kids lives is something that breaks my heart. I know you have to deal with this as well, being that your ex only see's your kids a couple times a month, so how do you handle this situation?

Right now, I don't bring anything negative up about their mom in front of them. My oldest doesn't say anything about it either until it is time to leave my house and go spend time with her mom. She throws a fit and refuses to get ready. So tough watching them go when I have them 5 out of 7 days a week....

[leahsue]

Hi Sal,
So sorry to hear how your ex is handling her mothering/lack of skills. You are so right- heartbreaking to watch their hearts break right in front of your eyes. I just wanted to offer a bit of encouragement though~ what I see in your posts are snapshots of a loving, attentive, involved stable parent that is providing a lighthouse of sorts for your kids. How BLESSED they are to have you as their parent! Don't lose sight of the huge opportunity you have been given (and I'm deliberately wording it that way, although it may not seem like a positive things right now, but I believe looking back years from now, this is what the kids will see~ you standing tall and proud for them). You hang in there!

[Dawgs]

No, I wouldn't have wanted to know all of those details. I had to see them in order to send them to my lawyer - and also have them for JAG. The OMs wife sent them in a bunch of emails/texts. And don't worry, everything is kept nice and neat and tucked away, just in case...

Now you see why my view of cheaters is what it is. Lowest form there is. What I can't get is why people want them back after such. Maybe our own selfish reasons need to be examined...

[Bdog37]

Thank you leahsue!

Part of me wants to go for full custody because of all this, but the other part of me doesn't want to take them away from her. My family thinks I need to. I should have seen the writing on the wall during our M. My ex was someone who would go out every weekend while I stayed at home with the kids. It became a joke, in some ways, with family and friends when they would ask me what I was doing on the weekend. Many thought I should have put my foot down then, but you can't force someone to be a parent. They either want to or don't. She told me that one of the biggest reasons for wanting a D was that I didn't spend enough time with her and the kids. Looking back now, I know this is bs because anyone who knows me personally would say that I was the one spending the most time with our children. I believe the real reason of her wanting a D is possibly a MLC or just the fact that she got a taste of her freedom and loves it more then the life of a mother/wife.

Either way the kids will have me there for them and I appreciate your words of encouragement.

[Bdog37]

I needed to know all the details at first. Thought that the only way we would be able to work on the M and move forward was to know she wasn't lying to me anymore. However, now since neither of us want to reconcile I think I should have spared myself from learning all the details. Didn't do me any good, but have a bunch of sleepless nights.

Now you see why my view of cheaters is what it is. Lowest form there is. What I can't get is why people want them back after such. Maybe our own selfish reasons need to be examined...

For real brother! Not sure how anyone can do that to someone they loved?? Think we want them back cause we want our old M back before the A. However, that type of betrayal is very difficult to deal with and get over. There are couples who move past it and go on to have very healthy relationships, but it takes a lot of work and I personally wouldn't want to be M to someone who can do that to their S.

[Dawgs]

If your children love and believe in her, and she wants to be part of their lives, then I'm not so sure about full custody. I could have gotten it and then some, but at the end of the day I realized it was about the kids and not my feelings toward the ex.

[Bdog37]

I could have gotten it and then some, but at the end of the day I realized it was about the kids and not my feelings toward the ex.

^^^ So true brother...so true. I guess a few days a week with their mom is better then none cause I know they truly do love her.

[Bdog37]

Journaling/venting

Good Day my friends! Yet another week (last week) were the EW gave up a few of her scheduled days with the kids to be with OM2. They went out of town together again so luckily I had my girls a few extra days!

What a great week I had with them as well and this week is going to be just as fun! Going to take them to see Beauty and the Beast tomorrow so I'm excited about that!! Over the weekend I invited their friends and some neighborhood girls over so my house was packed with kids lol. My little ones loved hosting so I will for sure be scheduling more play dates for them. All the parents thanked me as well for giving them a little time off so it was a win win sitch for everyone.

The Big D starts this Friday. I have sent pretty much all the info I could to my L so I believe he is prepared to get underway. I can honestly say that 4 months ago I would be crying while sharing this news, but today.....I couldn't be happier. I have detached so much from this woman and our M that I can't find anymore love for her. Believe me, I have searched. Since it was warm out over the weekend I did some Spring cleaning and found some old picture of us before we had kids. A lot of pictures where we were traveling, having a good time, and I didn't feel a shred of sadness. I actually threw them away and felt relieved after doing so. Like I was getting rid of her "ghost" in some ways.

I think a lot of this stems from the fact of who she has become. I really don't think I could ever love her again. Its weird that I feel this way. Especially since it hasn't been that long. I can't even remember the last time I shed a tear over her or caught myself thinking about her?? I don't know, but I am much more happier then I was a few short months ago.

I joined a cooking class and found out that I actually really enjoy cooking lol. I have taking a much bigger role in my daughter's after school programs and help out when I can. My oldest also joined Girl Scouts so I have been volunteering there every Tuesday. I am going to Wisconsin this weekend to go to my first Cubs game with friends. Early next month I plan on taking my girls to Indiana for a little road trip to visit some family. I'm back into reading books!! I used to love to read and just started Game of Thrones. I also started a small remodeling project in the house cause I'm hosting a painting party in a couple weeks. And somehow my younger sister wants me to fit in guitar lessons for my niece. On top of all this I take care of the girls 5 days a week, keep up on the house cleaning duties, do the grocery shopping, and work!

Think things are going really, really good right now for me. I am standing on my own 2 feet and it has never felt better. Funny, but the EW told me months ago that I would be the one to jump into a relationship as soon as she left. Well she is right and as corny as this sounds I did jump into a relationship... a relationship with myself! I respect myself too much to go back now so onward and upward!

I only hope that others on here can someday find peace with their own sitch as well. Good luck my friends!

[doodler]

I only hope that others on here can someday find peace with their own sitch as well. Good luck my friends!

SAL27,

Totally awesome! I'm glad you're staying busy and having a lot of fun, particularly with your children.

Just be careful with that relationship with yourself. I did that for a few months and nearly went blind.

[Thornton]

^^^ Hahaha!

[Bdog37]

doodler.... I know a lot of this isn't funny, but d*** does your posts make me laugh sometimes!! Hahahaha, love it!!!!

Of course I would rather be blind then be in a relationship with anyone like my EW lmao.

[leahsue]

You guys crack me up!
SAL27, what an uplifting post! It's so good to see someone following the principles here, and watching it unfold like yours has done. Some get the spouse back, and some don't, but almost everyone grows and likes themselves more, on down the road, regardless of the marriage outcome. I'm so proud of you!

[Bdog37]

Wow,

Sometimes when things are going so good you just start to question it.

Yesterday I get pulled into the bosses office and was told I was getting a 20% raise. I've been with the same company for over 15 years now so he went on about what a valuable employee I am.

Then later that night I took my girls to go see Beauty and the Beast. Needless to say we all loved the movie and afterward we went back to the house to play "Beauty and the Beast". I was the beast of course lol. Good times!

When I picked the girls up my oldest told me that my youngest just got done crying. I asked her why and she said because she "missed her daddy"....melted my heart. I gave her a big hug and a kiss before we left.

Texted the EW about wanting more time with the as well (I currently get them 5/7 days a week and every other weekend). She listed a bunch of dates that she has "plans" for already so it looks like I'm going to be spending much more time with them. EW told me that I can have more days and weekends with the kids during the summer as well and I totally agreed. She just asked for Mother's Day and I told her that it was a given. From the sound of it though I will basically be having them weeks at a time now. Wonderful news all around and this week has been another great week so far!

Feeling blessed right now! Court with the EW begins tomorrow and "I ain't even mad". Honestly, I'm just ready to get the ball rolling. I have been talking to the OW that I met quite frequently now. We have both agreed to take things very slow with the current situation, but I can actually see myself in a relationship with her. Been on some friendly dates together so its very nice to have those butterfly feelings about someone again.

4 months ago I never pictured myself here, but I've made the most of the situation that I was dealt. I thought I would never be happy again. I thought detaching from the EW was impossible and I would go on for years lonely and missing her. I can truly say that I'm in a much better place right now and happier than I was such a short time ago.

Hang in there friends, things will get better!!

[Dawgs]

Yesterday I get pulled into the bosses office and was told I was getting a 20% raise.

Awesome!

However, I'd hold off on that until after the divorce (if you do, that is...). Just sayin...

[Bdog37]

Awesome!

However, I'd hold off on that until after the divorce (if you do, that is...). Just sayin...

Already told him that lol! He said it will still be on the table, but wants me to talk to my L as well. Laws change in my state come July 1st so I should be good, but we will see.

[doodler]

SAL,

I'd be happy to hold onto your raise money for you until after your divorce. Once you're divorced, I can split it with you. I know, right...doodle is such a good guy.

[doodler]

And I can't even spell my own freakin' name.

[Bdog37]

Hahahahaha!! For all the laughs....why the hell not! Course then the first rounds are on you when this is all said and done lol!

[Dawgs]

Hahahahaha!! For all the laughs....why the hell not! Course then the first rounds are on you when this is all said and done lol!

Count me in!

[Bdog37]

Journaling

Not much to report. D process has been extended until next month. All convo with STBEW is minimal and kept in regards to logistics for the kids. I do continue to get more time with them so that is great! Celebrated Easter with them and had a blast!

Think the hardest part out of all this now is when I don't have my girls. I am keeping extremely busy, but there are times at night (when the house is silent) that it creeps in. Once I start missing them I begin to feel anger and resentment towards the STBEW because I think she is taking them from me..... Even though I only go 2 days a week without having them it is still really difficult to deal with right now. I will get there.

I haven't been posting much because I have used most of my time on here reading. Reading a lot of sitch's from newcomers and even a lot from the vets on here. For all those who are newcomers I would suggest you check out some of the wonderful posts from the vets on here. Their insight can possibly help shed some light on your sitch.

Cadet
Job
fisherman
25yearsmic
Jack3Beans (RIP)
Sandi2
Vanilla

Are just a few out of many wonderful people on here that have shared some of the same experiences with their S's and offered some really good advice and even some laughter at times.

Some of these vets were DB'ing when I was blissfully in love and unaware of what was about to happen. Some are still here today trying to offer any wisdom or help that they can to the newcomers.

When I first came here I was SadAndLonely, but I think now its time to change my username..... Think this is only possible because of what I have learned from all the wonderful people on here and Michelle's books.

Yes, it stinks that we all find ourselves here, but I truly believe that what we take from here are great tools that can make us all better our future R's with or without our S's. I personally know that I have come a long way in just a few short months and look forward to a brighter future.

Onward and upward my friends!

[Tread]

Bdog37 been catching up on your sitch and its glad to see that your handling it so much better than you started. I'm nowhere near the point of BD where you are. But seeing your attitude gives me a sense of hope that things will get better with my own feelings.

[Bdog37]

Journaling

Wow, just wow.... Not sure why the actions of my STBEW still surprises me, but I just hate seeing how someone going through a MLC or being a WW, WAS, whatever, abandon their kids.

A couple weeks ago she texted me saying that she would like the girls on Mother's Day since it was my scheduled weekend with them. I, of course, said its not even a discussion and she could def have them that day. Makes sense, no?

So then last Thursday she texted me telling me they will be at the babysitter's so I could pick them up there and that on Mother's Day she plans on picking them up at noon and dropping them off at 4. I hesitated for a second and replied by saying she is more than welcome to have them the entire day. She told me that I had no right to tell her how to spend the day with "her kids" and that it was up to her.

I kindly went back and replied; "by no means and I'm trying to tell you how to spend your time with the girls". "I just thought that it being Mother's Day and all that you would like to spend the entire day with them"?!?! I told her that she could even pick them up Sat. night if she wanted to wake up with them. She came back and said, "ok, that's fine".

Now, at first I thought I was the one overreacting but then it started bugging me that she only wanted to spend 4 hours with her girls on the one day celebrated of being a mother. However, not my problem so I kindly responded by saying that I will have them ready by noon and she is more than welcome to drop them off at 4. I also asked her to extend me the same courtesy when it comes to Father's Day as I will want the entire day with them. She basically said no problem.

I've seen a similarity in OM1 and OM2. Neither one of them have children or much responsibility at all. They are free to do what they want and when they want to. Hell, the one she is with now is a 42 year old guy that lives with 4 roommates and is in a band. I truly now believe this is what she desires.

The problem with, whatever the hell she is going through, is the fact that she is ruining any relationship she has with my little girls and it breaks my heart. She gave up her time with them last Friday so she could go out of town with the OM2 so basically she only had them 2 days last week. It seems like a norm now.

I had to tell my oldest that she couldn't go to her last Girl Scout meeting because; "mommy was busy". Again, it was last Friday and the STBEW said she can't because she has, "plans" and she made these plans weeks in advance. Well those plans involved going up to the city for the weekend with OM2 and she happily posted it all over FB. I had to be the one to tell my oldest that she wouldn't be able to go...broke my heart. If I were able to bring her then I would have happily done so, (long story).

How is it that they can so easily give up precious time with their own children? The 2 nights a week that I go without my girls I am miserable. Is their own selfishness that blinding that they can't even see what they are doing to their own kids??

This is such a perplexing concept to me and I surely don't understand the mind frame of someone like this. I read a lot of posts over the weekend and came across a post by a user named Wishingitwasover. She made a great post on here (back in 2004) about the "Do's and Don'ts " when dealing with someone going through a MLC that really resonated with me.

They become Teenagers again and become VERY slefish, They Become VERY angry, They can Be VERY nasty, You can NOT take this personal, they are angry at themselves but will take it out on you.. Just like a teenager they will look at YOU as the Father/Mother figure NOT as a Husband or Wife..

I'm starting to believe that my STBEW is going through a MLC. The selfishness of her actions clearly demonstrate her mind frame right now. It's a shame to see that she would give up so much, but I guess I have to look at her as someone going through this and just continue to be a "rock" for my little girls.

[Thornton]

I've experienced this with my ExW (Not the one I'm currently with). Anytime she would meet a new guy, I could keep D all I wanted.

It's basically an addiction. When "in love", the feel good chemicals are running rampant in the WW. People will minimize their children just to get another "hit" of their drug of choice (OM).

[Bdog37]

Journaling/Venting

This is going to be a messy D and not by my doing. My STBEW has become someone that I am starting to despise. Without going into too much of it, as I already have in a previous post, I had the girls on Mother's Day. Not by my choosing, but I was certainly blamed for keeping them away from her. Go figure...

I really don't care that she is telling friends and family that I'm keeping the kids away from her. I know the truth and have proof so that's just not the case. I've been printing our text messages, keeping a journal, and writing all this down on a calendar. All of which will be sent to my L.

The part that is starting to make me despise her is the fact that she has told multiply mutual friends that she plans to go for full custody. This hurts me deeply... First, she rips out half my heart by having an affair and now she wants to take the other half?!?!

How can someone be so cruel?? It just hurts so bad coming from someone I loved so much. Someone I imagined spending the rest of my life with. Someone who I would have taking a bullet for. Someone who was my best friend. It stings so badly that I am now worried I'm jaded and will never love/trust again.

I fear that this D is going to get so out of hand because she is going to force me to protect myself. Unfortunately, I think that is the moment when the best interest of the children gets put aside for the selfish reasons of the S's. I don't want that for my girls. They don't deserve that at all!! I would NEVER keep them from her so how could she want to keep them from me. Why can't she see that co-parenting is the best situation for OUR kids??

[OwnIt]

Bdog, I'm sorry for your pain. I imagine a lot of this is for show. What kind of mother would not try for as much custody as she can have. She is likely doing this to save face with others. Continue to document and know that the laws are far more modern now and know that children need time with both parents. Also, the custody one gets and the custody one exercises are two different things. Keep that in mind from what you have already experienced.

[Bdog37]

Thank you OwnIt, I truly appreciate it! Coming from a lawyer that was very encouraging and yes, it is all just to save face in front of family and friends.

If she plans to go for full custody then I just see this turning into a long drawn out and expensive court battle. I do not believe that is what is in the best interest for our children. They deserve equal time with both of us so hopefully, if there is justice in this world, then courts here will agree.

[Thornton]

I can't imagine her lawyer advising her to go for full custody when there is already a routine in place.

Judges hate to go against the routine. If you and W have a system that seems to work, more than likely, the judge will want to keep it that way.

Let her spew and talk sh!t about you as much as she wants. You are the stable one, keep showing that to your kids. They are watching.

[Bdog37]

Hey Thornton,

Well right now I have the girls everyday except for 2 nights a week. What I believe happened was the MIL asked why she wasn't getting them more or why isn't she spending more time with them. Her only excuse was to blame it on me which is infuriating to hear... Especially considering that is so not the case!!

She continues to give up her time with them to be with the OM. Last night was another prime example. It was her scheduled time with the girls and she asked me to keep them. Of course I agreed and have agreed to all her days she continually asks for me to keep them.

Unfortunately, I hope the judge sees this and denies her any right to full custody. If anything, I should be granted full custody but I never thought I would legally have to go for it. I have always just believed that shared custody is in the best interest of our kids.

However, she continues to live a teenagers life full of partying and expects me to just roll over when she finally decides she wants to be a mother again?? She has every right to do what she wants on her own time, I could care less, but after 6 months of me being the sole parent in our children's lives she wants to try and take that from me....why?

She misses out on school activities for them, Girl Scouts for my oldest, play dates and birthdays...it just keeps going on and on. The oldest just asked me why mommy wasn't there at her school field trip the other day. I am sick and tired of making excuses for her, but I still just replied that she couldn't make it because I feel that I still need to shield them from the truth. That day she posted on FB a pic of her and OM "riding around the old neighborhood"....that's what was more important.

I am just so heartbroken to hear she wants to go for full custody. It is her taking away the last thing in this world that means anything to me and this woman has already taken enough. I know the laws for father's have gotten better, but it is still up to a judge in the long run. If a judge right now ruled against me and granted her full custody... I would be destroyed. I can't even think about it without tearing up.

[Tryin2figuritout]

Bdog,

That's terrible that she's pushing for full custody. Keep record of what the current schedule is because that demonstrates your commitment to your kids. It would probably suit you well to run a tally week by week of days with you vs your wife.

It's amazing what a different world the WAS can be in during this. I hope you have a great weekend.

All the best.

[25yearsmlc]

Thank you OwnIt, I truly appreciate it! Coming from a lawyer that was very encouraging and yes, it is all just to save face in front of family and friends.

total agreement with Own.


If she plans to go for full custody then I just see this turning into a long drawn out and expensive court battle.


um, I don't think so. You have documentation of her lack of involvement (fb posts too) and when her L shows that to her, (or if he's a bill churner, then YOUR L can depose her and ask those questions in a deposition and no one wants to have that confirmed in public). Maybe she wants child support?? Irrelevant.

I don't believe she'd want there to be a public hearing to disclose all that. Also tbh, I don't think she even wants full custody. Though She may not even realize that.She knows what sounds good...

Put it this way, IF she does want full custody she is doing the exact opposite of what a lawyer would advise her to do.

If it weren't so sad, it'd be laughable.

I do not believe that is what is in the best interest for our children. They deserve equal time with both of us so hopefully, if there is justice in this world, then courts here will agree.

Why equal? Why not you getting full custody with visititation for her? OR you getting physical custody (but still joint, which saves her the embarrassment and which courts prefer anyhow) until such a time as she's "able" to have them half time?

She may well not be fully aware of her behavior (not "crazy" but not really with it).

FWIW, many years ago in h's first "Alaskan ordeal", I asked him if he was really willing to take the chance on losing his family all for a "great job opportunity" (adventure)

and he said something like "guess I am willing". I was shocked.

When I mentioned that 2 years later, he had no recall. In fact, he went further, stating that he'd "never say something like that"...and I bet you that he'd pass a polygraph.

However, I am 100% POSITIVE he said that - b/c I can tell you where I was when I asked and when he replied, etc. It's freeze framed in my mind.

Point is, they don't necessarily know what they are saying or how it looks (your w sure doesn't) nor do they all recall it later. Nor do they seem to have a sense of what's forseeable down the road, like harmed r's.

Lacking self awareness is the hallmark of many diagnoses. MLC, narcissist, unresolved childhood issues and blah blah blah.

NOT SURE IT MATTERS why....if they lack it, they lack it. Which makes them emotionally dangerous for now.

Years ago, I practiced criminal defense and a lot of my clients were people who made bad choices, but given their backgrounds, you could see why, or they made horrible choices in the heat of the moment, etc.

BUT SOME were just unrelatable. They had chronic anger management issues they refused to address and or they did really bad things to innocent people...sometimes with planning.

I don't mean clients with bad childhoods, but people who had no explainable reason for their horrible actions.

Of those^^, most showed little or no remorse. More like "I did not do it or, well I 'had to', Or you'd do the same if you were me' Or I was under stress, Or lots of people do worse, & doesn't make me a bad person", ETC

So none of them said "well I'm an a$$hole or "I am very selfish" or "chose to be a bad person." NONE OF THEM SAID THAT...

they all rationalized heinous behavior, (with the few mentally ill exceptions, who wanted help).

I was sort of morbidly fascinated with those^^ people but eventually I came to believe I would never truly "get" them. They were so different than my experience or my circles, that I stopped trying to understand them.

I tried to explain how a jury would view them, but 3/4 of the time, they really believed the jury would understand why they had no choice, why they were "right"...and usually, there was a total inability to grasp societal views...so, fwiw, I see similarities in some of the WAS's here.

Deal with what you're facing, which is an absentee mom.

I know this hurts. But gosh, from where I sit, you are luckier than most men.

Instead of a woman trying to block or hinder your time with the girls, she's shoving it down your throat, publicly announcing her absences (not exactly "working to cure cancer, sure miss my kids")

it hurts and it's very scary but you are ahead in this. I think It'll be a gross bump in the road but I truly really believe you'll prevail.

Make sense?

((( )))

[Zues126]

Bdog, sorry you're going through this.

When I was faced with custody negotiations there were two separate challenges. One physical, one mental. The physical was the very real risks that my time with my children would be limited. The mental was the total shock that came from the realization that in our court system decisions get made routinely that can remove your children from your life.

This was a horrifying revelation. I mean, you see half of the country living in split homes and you know that not everyone came to a unanimous agreement on how to raise the children, so you know somehow not everyone is happy. But until you are in the middle of it you don't really understand what's at stake.

The single most memorable event in my entire life was when I was told by my L that I had to put together a 20 minute presentation that I was to share with social services. It was to encompass how our family formed, where we were today, my current relationship with the children, what I wanted for custody, and why I thought it would be best for the children. At this time XW wanted full custody with me getting every other weekend and additional time in the summer. After TWO YEARS of seeing my children grow up through these 'visitation' hours I knew this wasn't enough. There is a monumental difference between saying hi to your kids and hearing about their lives versus living it with them.

I was angrier than I had ever been before. It wasn't a quick rage like anger. It was a burning anger that didn't go away. I felt like I was on trial for a crime I didn't commit, that I could be sentenced to 15 years where I would be put to work to pay child support for children I could only see during appropriate visitation. I'm on the record of saying this is the most inhumane part of our modern society since the abolishment of slavery. We look back at 150 years ago and shudder that families could be torn apart and people collared and denied the right to live their lives with their children. Well, I truly believe that in 100 years from now it won't work the way it does today and that future generations will be absolutely appalled at the divorce culture we established and destruction of families it caused.

This was such a big moment in my life I want to share with you how I prepared. My execution in the meeting went EXACTLY as I lay it out here:

I went to a drugstore and got two little plastic scrap books that hold 36 photos...then I printed out duplicate copies of 36 pictures of my kids, and put them in a nice order.

During my presentation I am going to start by skimming through the years we were together very, very quickly. Then I'm going to talk about BD and the days since. What I've done as a man. IC, support group, journaling, and reconnecting with my family. Then I'm going to talk about what I've done as a dad. Working hard to support them in both households, getting a different job that allows me more flexibility to make room for increased time with them. Then I'm going to give them a glimpse of what we've done together by going through the scrap book. Science museums, trips to the zoo and festivals, hikes around lakes, board games, reading books, birthday parties, trick or treating...then I'm going to talk about what's not in the pictures, homework, violin lessons, getting them to eat new foods, and so on. How my son doesn't seem like he's got behavioral issues when he's with me, and that I know he feels safe and at home when we're together. How my daughter tells me when we're together it's like the world becomes full of magic and it's like our special universe to just be together.

Then I'm going to talk about what's missing from the pictures. Pictures of visiting my mom in IL because we don't have time to make that trip and we've never been out of state together. Pictures of them playing with neighbor children because they don't know our neighbors because they don't have time and feel they need to make every minute with their dad count. Day to day life. The quiet time where they do their own thing knowing dad is in the room next door. I'll talk about how all my children constantly tell me they miss me and wish they could have more time with me. How when they get in the car on a Tuesday visit after not seeing them for 6 days it's so hard because we've become disconnected, and missed so much life together, and by the time the bond is reestablished our three hours are up and it's time for bed and school and I will see them again on the weekend. And that I hurt being apart for so long, and while this is about the children's pain and not mine, I know that they are hurting too.

Then I'll tell them what I want. 50/50 parenting time. OK to make that happen over 1-2 steps over the next 3-12 months. I'll mention that I know there are concerns. I know there are trade offs. This is disruptive to their school week, etc. But I'll let it be known that it wasn't my choice, and it darn sure wasn't the children's, and it's not fair to them to give them anything less than a meaningful relationship with both of their parents.

Then I'm going to drop the mic and walk the heck out of that place.

When I got to the part about what's missing from those pictures it broke some hearts. It was the most powerful moment of my life.

What I learned is that the courts try very hard to make an inhumane situation humane. Most people working in these fields do so because they care for others and want what's best for families. Father's rights are firmly on the radar. The days of defaulting to the mama or taking everything she says as gospel are gone. The courts see through attempts of either parent to get parental time as a means to pay less or receive more child support. They get a really good grasp of the entire situation.

For me I was surprised at how validated I actually felt. Unlike you I had come off two years of visitation. During my M I was a working father and she was a SAHM, so I had a hill to climb. Yet my social workers were very interested in what I had been doing the last couple of years, how things had gone with me and my children, how we spent our time together, etc. And at the end of it they told XW that she needed to understand that she wasn't the real parent and me the father figure, we were both 50% parents in every sense. And that while I might not have some of the experience that she'd accrued being a SAHM, that I had the right to gain that experience through living with my children the same we she did. They granted both.

My goals with this post were to offer some empathy for how distasteful this is to go through, encourage you that you have a legitimate opportunity to obtain the resolution you want, and inspire you to put in the preparation that it takes to confer your vision to those that will be guiding these decisions. You CAN do this.

[Bdog37]

Hey 25 and Zues,

Thank you both for the encouraging words as it means a lot to me.

25; The mindset of a WAS is baffling to me so not sure I will every fully understand their thought process. I get the whole falling out of love with someone, but it seems to me that they transform into someone so unrecognizable that their actions become alien and very hard to understand.

Out of curiosity, was your H a man who was very involved in your children's lives early on? During piecing did you notice any change in his behavior towards your kids and did he try to take an even more active role as a father? Looking back now can you identify any warning signs that may have suggested otherwise?

The reason I ask is because sometimes I think that I ignored all the warning signs and kept the wool over my eyes just for a sense of security....or love??

Whatever she is going through (I have no clue??) there was one big warning sign sticking out to me now that I just refused to acknowledge because she (at the time) was my loving wife.

She would literally go out most weekends with friends to go drinking and even a lot during week nights. This all kind of started shortly after our firstborn (which was stressful for both of us). Her own mother would join her sometimes and it became such a normal routine that when asked why "I" allowed it....I would simply reply to the friends and family that were asking, that she deserves to go out because of all she did around the house. Also, our daily routine, she would hibernate in the bedroom after supper for her "mom time" and only come back out when it was time to put the kids to bed. The entire time all this was going on I was the one taking care of the parenting responsibilities. Yes, she did most of the housework, but on the nights she was gone it would just be the girls and I. When both were newborns I was the one that changed 95% of their diapers, woke up most nights to feed and put them back to bed, took them to school, and gave them baths. Its not that she didn't contribute, but many in my circle believed she has always been someone that values her personal time over her time with the girls. Now, Sundays where her days with the kids. She would tell me that she has felt bad with all the time she spent out with her friends so she would say that she will take the girls to her parents and give me a day "alone".

This is the life she desires now and was the warning sign that should have hit me like a 2x4. I should have realized back then that her priorities were selfish and not focused on our children or wanting a family life. What would I have done back then....nothing. I mean, sadly I was happily in love.

Could it be possible for someone to be in a MLC for 9+ years? Or do you think she is just one of those people that you described up above that has little to no remorse for her selfish actions? Again, I understand my faults and her falling out of love for me but not caring to be a part of your children's lives is just.....alien to me!



Zues; As a father I am sorry you had to go through all of that. It seems unfair that our legal system denies good father's the opportunities to co-parent and be a part of their child's lives. Yes, things are getting better legally but there are still so many father's out there fighting a hard battle just to be with their kids and its pretty sad.

I am, so far, one of the lucky ones in the fact that my STBEW shows me little to have me believe she wants to hinder my time with our girls. Of course, this could all change with her and in the eyes of the courts. I could be fighting a long hard battle that you and so many other wonderful fathers had to endure. If I do, then it is a battle I am willing to put up and see through.

The presentation you had to do was a great ideal and I'm glad it worked out in the end! Its a shame that you actually had to "convince" people that you are a worthy father, but if it comes down to me having to do the same then I just might have to take a page out of your book. Then I'll drop the mic lol. Yes, reading your post was very inspiring for that I say thank you.



I have literally just received some saddening and awesome news in regards to my sitch. Daughter has advised me that she met "mommy's new boyfriend" and that they spent much of a day playing in the pool together. This was the saddening news. I have always known that this day would come, but I thought out of respect she would have told me the girls were going to be introduced to him prior to it actually happening...then again, I'm not shocked that she continues to show me no respect.

The good news is that she continues to give up her time with the girls. For Father's Day I requested to have them the entire day. She said I can have them the entire week... Ok, fine with me. She said she is busy on the nights that are her scheduled nights so I gladly accepted. She also literally just texted me saying that she needs a "night out" (cause she's stressed) and asked if I can take the girls. Tonight is her 2nd scheduled night of the week she is supposed to have them but....of course, I accepted. Therefore, she is going to go from tonight (9th) to the 21st without seeing her kids. Just saddening.

So 25 asked why I don't go for full custody? This is a good question and many of my friends and family would agree. This is something that I will speak with my L before our next court date which is on the 22nd. I will show him the calendar (where I mark the days I have the girls), text messages where she is asking if I can take them on her scheduled nights, FB posts from her out partying when its her scheduled nights, and show him what role I play now in their lives.

Hopefully with all this information I will get full custody. You just never know these days, but I do want what is best for the girls so I would never go for it out of spite. I just want my kids growing up happy and in a safe environment which is their home. I would also be happy to allow any amount of visitation that she requested because I truly believe the kids need her in their lives...even if its on "her" time.

[Bdog37]

Need advice plz!

So recently STBEW introduced our children to her new boyfriend. It was no shock that she didn't tell me she was doing this or asked if I wanted to meet him first. I found out from my oldest.

A little recap on him; he is 42, lives with 4 roomates, and plays in a local band. His family history worries me the most as his mother is in prison for murdering his father, brother is in prison for attempted murder, and cousin is in prison for murder. I know for a fact that he also has 2 prior convictions, but I do not know what they are. If they are for violent crimes then I am obviously concerned for my children. He does have a day job and works Mon-Thurs. He does not have a valid drivers license and does not own a vehicle. Also, I know who he associates himself with and I know for a fact that some of those people do drugs. I have no evidence to believe he does, but he is friends with known drug dealers and users.

My oldest is 9 and had informed me that she went to a party at his grandma's house where she was allowed to play Grand Theft Auto 5. If anyone knows what that is then they would most likely not allow their 9 year old to play such a video game.

After hearing this, I of course was upset, but didn't bother to contact STBEW. Instead I contacted him via text. After calming down I sent a simple text that read;

"Since you are starting to hang out with my kids more I believe it is time we should meet." "Let me know when you are available".

He replied a short answer saying he agrees, that its only fair, and he will let me know.

Now, they have only been together for about 4 months so I am pretty upset about the whole situation. I have a million questions to ask him, but I'm sure he will not be cooperative and answer them truthfully.

I am wondering if there is anyone on here that has had to have such a talk, how they went about it, where did they meet, and if they have any suggestions for me?

I would truly appreciate it!!

[Bdog37]

Any advise on reaffirming boundaries with STBEW?

A few months ago I set a boundary in regards to her contacting me while I was at work. We used to chit-chat during the day, but I told her she gave all that up when she filed so please do not ever contact me again unless if its an emergency regarding our kids.

Well, lately she is using discussions about our kids to text, email, call, and even call my office to basically harass me. We have a set schedule with the girls already in place that has been working for months now. However, she continues to contact me about the schedule while I am at work.

For example: we worked out the schedule for this week on Monday. She only had the girls 2 nights this week, but needed me to watch them last night (Thursday). Unfortunately, it has been the only night I have kept my previous GAL plans and told her I was busy. She said that was fine.

Well yesterday she decided to text me while I was in a meeting. I could not respond so she continued. Then she started calling my cell. Eventually she called the office. According to her it was all to get an answer for last night on if I could watch the girls. After the meeting was over I was finally able to get back to her. I simply put that we have already discussed this and I will be picking them up Friday evening. She came back by saying that she just "needed an answer".

She has always been a person who has to have everything planned. Like, a control freak. However, now this has been affecting my work performance and my personal life. I can't go on like this much longer. The stress of all this is just too much for me to handle at times. She constantly bugs me...

One night, last week, she was stressed out because of an argument she had with her parents. For some reason she decided to text me to "vent". This was late at night and I simply told her to never text me again unless if there is an emergency regarding the girls. I told her that she no longer has that privilege because she does not want me to be her husband anymore. I told her that I was sorry that her decisions stress her out, but next time when she is stressed like this to contact her OM and not me. She apologized and said she never will again.

However, I feel overwhelmed at times and believe that she still wants to somehow keep control on my life. How do I reaffirm the boundaries when she clearly doesn't respect them? I have already told her repeatedly and will do so once last time. How should I put it to where she understands I firmly mean it without jeopardizing our set schedule?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

[Bdog37]

This woman is seriously going to be the death of me. She texted me at work again and I kindly responded to her question then went on to say to please never contact me while at work anymore unless it is an emergency pertaining to the girls.

The very next day she does.... Of course I don't answer so I get a follow up text 2 min later.

I feel this is a control thing, but just have no clue? Or is she just seriously f*kd in the head?

Madness