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Originally Posted By: Gordie

Re fixing appliances and doing stuff for my W. I think it is going to be very hard for me to stop, even after D. Please hit me with a 2x4, as needed.

Reasons to continue helping: she needs help, money is tight, it helps the kids, it is an act of service/act of love from me to her, better for her to ask me

Reasons to stop helping; she needs to miss me, she needs to feel the consequences of her actions (divorce), she wants to be independent, better for her to ask OM


Where are you going to draw the line?

- when you are divorced?
- when she is dating someone else?
- when you are dating someone else?
- when she is married to someone else?

For me, it was easiest and cleanest to draw the line once we were financially separated.

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Thanks. Can you tell I'm a newbie? Yes, I need to draw a line and I haven't. I guess start wIth the easiest:

1. If either of us is married, I definitely would not be doing this.

2. If either of us is in a dating R, I don't want to be doing this--I guess this is the point where my R becomes more/just about the kids. If POM's feelings are reciprocal and he dumps his GF for my STBXW, then we could be here quickly.

3. If we are D but neither of us is in a R, then I could see myself being okay with this. If POM's feelings are not reciprocal and/or he is unwilling to leave his GF, then we could be in this state for an extended period of time.


Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids
2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong
2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2
2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
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I have a bad history with abandonment. I was abandoned when I was a toddler. I was adopted and my parents did their best to love me but they had a lot of their own addiction and codependency issues, so much that they emotionally abandoned me to deal with their issues when I was a teenager (we lived together under one roof but lived separate lives). In my twenties, my birth mother made an unexpected reappearance in my life which triggered a lot of unresolved issues. I went to therapy and came out the other side a healthier person and was able to rebuild my R with the parents who raised me. And now? The person Inlive most in this world--my W is abandoning me. Rationally, I know this is not my fault, but must confess that in my dark moments, I feel like there is something really wrong with me...that the people I love keep deciding that they would be happier without me. I write this with a lump in my throat and tears in my eyes.


Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids
2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong
2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2
2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
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Originally Posted By: Gordie
I have a bad history with abandonment. I was abandoned when I was a toddler. I was adopted and my parents did their best to love me but they had a lot of their own addiction and codependency issues, so much that they emotionally abandoned me to deal with their issues when I was a teenager (we lived together under one roof but lived separate lives). In my twenties, my birth mother made an unexpected reappearance in my life which triggered a lot of unresolved issues. I went to therapy and came out the other side a healthier person and was able to rebuild my R with the parents who raised me. And now? The person Inlive most in this world--my W is abandoning me. Rationally, I know this is not my fault, but must confess that in my dark moments, I feel like there is something really wrong with me...that the people I love keep deciding that they would be happier without me. I write this with a lump in my throat and tears in my eyes.


This is pretty huge.

You have the ability to target this and begin the hard mirror work. Maybe get back into IC if you already have not done so ... but I just wanted to point out for all of us there is something like this we need to address in ourselves. Its really good you have pointed this out in yourself and you can address how your W leaving has triggered some deep seeded issues within yourself.

I too had a bit of this ... was actually pointed out to me by a couple veterans on the site who had similar traits/issues and really helped me along in my personal growth.

Gordie ... following along here, I did not really have a live in MLCr ... well I did but at that time I was lead to believe she was BiPolar as you may be able to relate with those epic mood swings they have. Anyways, I think you are actually handling alot of things very well ... one concept I have adopted I want to share with you, its called "Frame". Think of yourself as a Frame, holding whatever picture it is that represents who you are/want to be. No matter what happens you do not allow anyone to get you out of your frame (its those invisible boundaries you set on yourself ... no one gets you worked up, is able to rattle you nor get a reaction out of you) I think with her living in the same house you need to really do this. For me its helped tremendously with the push and pull my MLCr has attempted over the course of her crisis. I have become mush more at peace with the very things you all are discussing here, those things that make the back of your neck hairs stand on end and you want to just scream.

Anyways .. kudos for starting to change and deal with things differently, admitting when you are wrong and apologizing is a good trait regardless, but yeah you will have to set that line at some point so she can experience that her fantasy is not what reality looks/feels like.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Cali: This is pretty huge.

Gordie: Yes, I know which is why I thought it was time to include it in this story.

Cali: You have the ability to target this and begin the hard mirror work. Maybe get back into IC if you already have not done so ...

Gordie: Yes, it's one of the reasons I re-started IC.

Cali: I too had a bit of this ...

Gordie: A bit of this? What do you mean?

Cali: Anyways, I think you are actually handling alot of things very well ...

Gordie: Thanks

Cali: one concept I have adopted I want to share with you, its called "Frame" ... no one gets you worked up, is able to rattle you nor get a reaction out of you...

Gordie: that's interesting and will read up on that; yes, am working on this part of detachment and being steady and not letting her actions/attitudes dictate mine.

Cali: yeah you will have to set that line at some point so she can experience that her fantasy is not what reality looks/feels like.

Gordie: yes, that's one of the next steps for me to start figuring out...and what all of you here have taught me...is that this is really for me and my own self-preservation/respect...not to win her back. Thanks, Cali!


Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids
2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong
2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2
2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
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Originally Posted By: Gordie

Gordie: A bit of this? What do you mean?


I would not say it was abandonment as you have experienced.

In my case I was the oldest of 3, with both parents being alcoholics. Often dinner consisted of me making something, or warming up left overs after calling my parents whom were both at the bars. I never blamed my parents for anything that happened to me in my adult life mind you (did not even occur to me this was out of the ordinary until I was well into my 20's) ... but as pointed out here I did have to deal with some ugly mirror work that dealt with this issue.

I was essentially placed into a parent role as a kid which in a way robbed me of certain things .... this was essential in understanding why certain things really triggered me where for most it may be a simple shoulder shrug. Again ... its the deep dark mirror work that a few of us really need to address, in my case its easy to toss all the blame on the MLCr but I had a few deep dark demons that needed a swift dealing with myself before I could come to grips with facing my own new reality.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Can not edit this .... but just out of curiosity I punched in a phone number .... over 30 years later I still know the phone number to the old bar my parents went to.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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Cali: Often dinner consisted of me making something, or warming up left overs after calling my parents whom were both at the bars ...

Gordie: I know EXACTLY what you are talking about...

Cali: in my case its easy to toss all the blame on the MLCr but I had a few deep dark demons that needed a swift dealing with myself before I could come to grips with facing my own new reality.

Gordie: Yes, absolutely. I know I've got work on myself to do...probably more than others...probably more than I care to admit to myself...

Cali: over 30 years later I still know the phone number to the old bar my parents went to.

Gordie: I get that too...there are things we just can't forget...I have forgiven my dad and my mom for everything so we can have a somewhat normal relationship...but you never forget...

And in my current situation? I still love my W...she too is hurting badly and dealing (or not dealing) with her unresolved issues...in the process, she's hurting me (and the kids)...she has no idea how badly...I hide my hurt and my tears...I think of Jesus on the cross saying Father, forgive them, they know not what they do...


Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids
2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong
2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2
2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
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Fixing broken appliances for STBXW -- check.
STBXW gushing about me -- check.

Gordie, I'm coming to realize that many, if not most, people in their mid-life have lots of emotional baggage. We all have issues we're wrestling with, some more acute than others. It's those of us who can admit to them, those of us who can open up our lives to the help of others, those of us who seek wisdom from people who are indeed wiser -- mental health professionals, support groups, wise friends and clergy -- we are a big step ahead of those who deny the baggage they carry and who persist in their foolish ways.

So what I'm trying to say is, Gordie, you are a good guy. Your wife is majorly confused right now, but you are not the problem. 50% of all marriages end in a divorce. You have been married for 20 years. So the fact that you're facing a divorce ... you're in good company.

Don't beat yourself up, friend.


Me: 50, MLC/WW 45
Young kids
Nov 2015: BD1
Apr 2016: BD2
Jan 2017: W filed
Feb 2017: D final
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Originally Posted By: Gordie


And in my current situation? I still love my W...she too is hurting badly and dealing (or not dealing) with her unresolved issues...in the process, she's hurting me (and the kids)...she has no idea how badly...I hide my hurt and my tears...I think of Jesus on the cross saying Father, forgive them, they know not what they do...


For the longest time I will say that I still loved my W aswell. Over time and a great big ball of another round of serious hurting was when I dropped the rope, I still loved her but refused to allow her to hurt me anylonger. MLC, crisis, illness .. whatever it was became obvious to me that it was killing us both. I had to survive for my son, for myself .... and I loved her enough to allow her to go off and figure out whatever it was she needed to figure out with hopes ... key word hopes ... that one day she will emerge healthy, for her own sake and my sons. As far as me ... well we will see and cross that if it ever does happen, I am not so sure as of right now if I would ever entertain R at this point or not, I am not saying no ... but I also do not have the door open either.

I read earlier today something that really put how I felt over the past years and what I learned the hard way into perspective.

"She will continue to disappoint until you have no expectations."

This has held very true to me throughout all of this and I can say beyond a doubt when I was able to eliminate all expectations peace was not far away.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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