Lol, funny, as I've already done that! She would be a co-worker of the woman who cuts my hair. She is fun as hell. Not serious dating material, even without the sleeves, but a total blast to hang out with. I didn't say I coukd not be friends - just not romantic.
As for conversation, it depends on the person but rarely do I do more talking. With the woman who ghosted me I seriously think it was 90:10 in that she talked 90% of the time - which was one of her red flags. I'm actually a very good listener. Although remember I said I typically gravitate to outgoing people? Well they tend to talk a lot. So if you were thinking I talk a lot about myself, guess again. I do tend to type a lot - just usually not about me. Lol. I'd say, after a first date, I generally know more about them than they do about me but it's usually pretty balanced or at least usually not 90:10. My fav V from ten hours away was totally 50:50 - another reason she's my fav.
DonH Midwest Me 56 WAW-EXW 55 Met 11/95 / Married 5/00 Bomb 6/20/05 / She Filed on 6/2/06 / Divorced on 10/9/06 4 who'd qualify as GF since D & dated about 25 women since D
There are moments in this life when you are so confident in the rightness of your actions, that not even for a second do you consider the option that you might be wrong.
[quote=doodler]Don, See I've lead a rather fulfilling and diversified life. I've accomplished nearly everything I wanted to do as a child. Since I was like 10 I wanted to be a firefighter and paramedic - I did it. I wanted to perform in bands - do it, wanted to be on the radio, did it/still do it. I have accomplished a huge amount - just not as well with my personal life.
-Executive Director of 7,500 person member org. -President of multiple orgs. -Radio DJ and chief engineer -Recording studio owner since 1983 -Musician playing likely close to 5,000 gigs in my life -Musician performing on over 100 "albums" CDs, Jingles, etc. likely over 500 total songs. -Private pilot with about 1,100 total hours flying time -Have owned several planes -Never smoked a cigarette, tried pot, coke, meth or anything else, rarely drink, yet I'm a recovering opiate addict with 7 years sobriety. No one and I mean no one, had a clue. -Firefighter - likely participated in 50 structure fires - which really is a lot as things just don't burn down much anymore. -Paramedic - treated thousands of patients over near 25 years with all sorts of cool stories. -Dozens of people would claim I saved their life - a few would be correct. -Love to ski - mostly water -Love to travel -Decent at baseball/softball - average at other sports -Like to go to baseball games, followed by Packers games, basketball least favorite.
That hopefully gives a better glimpse into my life and who I am.
So you call these accomplishments - which they are. Something to be proud of.
But they're not who you are. These are just things you did. Not who you are. You're not applying for a job.
I asked questions like 'Are you kind?' and it threw the other person completely off. But that's what I need to know. And 'What kind of R do you want? How do you react in a conflict? Can you talk about how you feel? What do you do if you're not satisfied in the R? What was your part of your M breakdown? What did you learn from that? How do you see your future? What do you want from a partner? What can you offer a partner?'
I couldn't care less about achievements. Can you pay your own bills? Do you have a reasonably stable lifestyle? That's enough.
M 16 yrs, WH62, P54 3 adult blended kids EA 11/13, BD1 6/14 PA fall 14, BD2 2/15 Piecing 2015, BD3 12/15 Separated 4/16 WH moved OW in 5/16 Divorced 6/15/17
Painter, you bring up a good point in that some of the most important things are about how reflective the other person is, how they treat others, what type of values they subscribe to. It was a good post and while it may seem like my post may debate yours, I actually am trying to accompany it and work with it.
For me, Don's accomplishments are important as well. They tell of a man that has remarkable drive, that feels it is important to live each day to the fullest, and who feels that means overcoming fear and adversity and complacency and instead striving to manifest his gifts and shine brightly.
I admire these qualities. I personally feel they have been diminished by our society. Money doesn't buy happiness. Beauty is only skin deep. We are all inherently valuable regardless of whether we hit a home run or strike out. Better to be low earning and earnest than a high earning grinch.
True, true, all true. But what the saturation of these mantras has lead to is the dismissal of the importance of the qualities that Don has represented. Beauty is skin deep, but it is higher quality to take care of yourself, stay in shape, and present yourself well than it is to let yourself go. Hitting a home run doesn't make you a better person, but the drive to succeed and overcome adversity is very important. Having a fancy title, high income, or flashy car doesn't make up for an empty soul, but hard work, attention to detail, and ambition are important qualities as well.
Life is about balance, and it seems to me that just as an excessive fixation on these qualities can be detrimental, so too can be their dismissal. These days I think this happens too often.
It hurt me to hear what Don has done minimized, because in many ways this really IS Don. This is what makes him who he is. This is what drives him. This is what steers his decisions. This is how he shows his love to the world and celebrate his life. This is his gift. It is almost like Don spent his entire life hand crafting a birthday present only to be told "I would've preferred jewelry".
And again, I really admire Don for demonstrating them, and his accomplishments show his character the same way that being in good shape shows that someone takes care of their body. These accomplishments don't make him important, but those accomplishments were very important in and of themselves.
Of course that isn't everything. The qualities you brought up are equally critical. That, in fact, is what separates the materialist from the rounded individual who happens to enjoy worldly success as well.
In Don's case I picture him more as this rounded person than the materialist. Oh, it's not black and white, I'm sure he's out of balance in some ways. But one does not spend long hours on a forum reflecting on their interpersonal behavior if these things aren't important to them.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that if those things don't matter to you, all that means is they don't matter to you. It doesn't mean they don't matter. They matter to Don, and they matter to me.
And again, nothing is black and white. The reason I believe these posts aren't opposing each other is I'd guess you can appreciate the qualities I've spoken of, and were simply trying to explain to Don the qualities that you value and how those things were absent in his self description as an FYI.
It's like different love languages. Don's love language is to move mountains and shape the world around him like a painter would paint a picture. It's a good reminder that there are other love languages that people might want to hear, and what's most important to him might not be all anyone else wants or needs. And Don should spend some time thinking about that, being aware that to most women these are going to be key to making them feel safe and connected. I also think that whoever is in Don's future needs to be able to recognize and value the virtues to which he has dedicated himself.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
I like that which Painter stated. I like your post too.
If you were a potential partner for Don or Zues and just an ordinary girl, woman, and potential skinny dipping partner. It's scary stuff.
You guys are world beaters and potential is an ordinary mortal who is also truly extraordinary.
Golly you out class us, I am impressed and why should a wonderful being such as you be interested in ordinary?
Perhaps I am a little skinny, I am curvy, I am a nurse, I have a couple of children, I was abused. I drive a van, I like noodles, I have stains on my thread shirt, I cry in the rain.
I am great although I don't meet your exacting standards, I am flawed and human and ordinary. Rejectable by one so wondrous with such fabulous achievements.
V
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
Oftentimes when I've played a pool player that's not at my level they tell me things like "You must think I'm terrible" or "This must be hard for you to watch" or stuff like that. I always wonder at that. I haven't said anything. I'm just playing pool the best I can, and they are too. If anything I respect the heck out of them because I can see they are playing hard and enjoying their gifts. The fact that I happen to play better is a small detail, because to me we are both on the same road, and we have this in common, a shared experience, and I respect them for going as far down this difficult road as they have. I always felt sad they couldn't feel the goodwill I had for them because they drown it out on their own feelings of insufficiency being projected over my voice.
You say 'we outclass you' and that you are 'ordinary'. I can't tell if you're hurt because you think I implied this in my post, or if you truly feel insufficient about yourself and are simply voicing your personal doubt taking ownership that it comes from you. It seems to be the former based on your later comment of my 'exacting standards'.
All I know is those aren't my words. Those are yours. And I don't feel that way at all. I said I admire Don, not that I looked down on everyone else besides Don. I can applaud the world's greatest violinist without looking critically at everyone else in the world.
As for your question about what to offer, if that world's greatest violinist went on a date I don't think he would care if his date had ever touched a violin. We don't all have to do the same things or be the same way. We just have to appreciate the uniqueness of the other.
The same way the violinist's date might feel rejected if they were criticized for not playing violin, the violinist might feel rejected for having his lifelong devotion to a musical instrument minimized.
Choosing to pursue one path doesn't have to be construed as criticism towards those that choose another. And it is possible for someone to celebrate what Don brings while allowing him to celebrate what they bring.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
Zues, of course it is great to be accomplished. But how about being accomplished in relationships? We get good at what we practice and focus on.
Interestingly, WH is very accomplished. He is highly respected at work, innovative, asked for by management for special projects, sent around the world to teach, and in general a very hard worker.
But he has cheated in the most offensive manner on a string of wives. And he told me straight out that his job was more important than our marriage.
That's why I look for the things I do in a potential partner. Honesty (and yes, I test). Kindness. Character.
M 16 yrs, WH62, P54 3 adult blended kids EA 11/13, BD1 6/14 PA fall 14, BD2 2/15 Piecing 2015, BD3 12/15 Separated 4/16 WH moved OW in 5/16 Divorced 6/15/17
of course it is great to be accomplished. But how about being accomplished in relationships? We get good at what we practice and focus on.
Work accomplishments are a great thing, and no one's beaten down the fact that don has accomplished a great deal. However, applying work "attitude" to dating/relationships/etc. doesn't fly. I'm not saying he does, but I do get the sense of impatience and, due to that, it may come off as desperate to some. I'm sure I'll be disagreed with, but just go back and read from the beginning of this thread and it'll pop. Don sounds like a great guy...he just needs to tone it down a bit.
There are moments in this life when you are so confident in the rightness of your actions, that not even for a second do you consider the option that you might be wrong.
