Same Sitch. New Approach. Motivated. Feeling Good.

[miky152]

Thanks Kaizen. I appreciate the fact that you're trying to be helpful. I remember one time that the DB phone coach I talked to told me to treat her like my sister. I would invite my sister to a movie, and do her a favor if she asked me. I wouldn't be bothered by her actions unless they affected me directly, so I would not spy on her or give her the third degree about her whereabouts. I try to apply that concept as often as I can.

So if I was asked to do things as 'friends', then I did it on my terms. Because of the boundaries that I set for myself got crossed, then I enforced what I needed for myself through my actions.

Could you give me an example of this? I'd like to understand the specifics of how you applied this way of behaving...

I guess my situation was a little different. I was physically separated from my ex before I found any of the DB information. But for me, at some point, I realized that I wasnt a babysitter and I didnt have to 'jump' any time I was told to.

So I stopped saying yes to every favor I was asked. I started doing what I wanted to. If I was free and wanted to do something fun with the kids, I did; if I had plans, then I didnt. One time my ex said "This [censored] that the kids are sick. I really cant take off work." and I validated, sure, but didnt offer to fill-in as babysitter if it was needed.

These are not great examples, I get that. My point is more that I stopped going out of my way to appease my ex. In your initial list, you said always treat your W with kindness. To me, that sounds like you are always going to be saying 'yes' to her, to do things that will make her happy. One of my greatest growth areas was learning how to say 'no'.

I get what you are saying, and that totally makes sense.

I'm all for making a stand, but in my case at least...it needs to actually be for a reason and not just the sake of my ego or to not feel like a doormat.

I'll give you an example...In a past life, I used to be in a position where we, the customer, would review a vendor's work before taking delivery. It was a highly regulated industry and there were both black and white rules and more gray "best practices" that we used for acceptance criteria. Some of my peers would reject things based on the most minor of issues - things like spelling errors, illegible entries and other minor issues like grammar from a non-english speaker. I, on the other hand, chose to take a more risk based approach...major issues were addressed, and minor issues were tracked but I usually let them slide unless they were pervasive. What I found was that while my coworkers would struggle to get anything fixed, I had little trouble because vendors knew when I sent something back it was because something was really wrong...I wasn't on some sort of power trip and was logical in my actions.

The point of all that is...saying no is important. But I think it should be reserved for when you actually don't/can't want to do something. It shouldn't be used to punish or teach your wife a lesson. That, to me, is the line between kindness and enabling.

[Chris73]

Thanks Guys. This is a great conversation. I value both of your opinions. You've given me a lot to think about...

[Chris73]

Inspiring passage read in church today:

"People who are unable to stand within the dark places of life, those who are always running towards their happy places, are the same things as candles without flames.

There is no worth in a candle without a flame, and we only add the flame when there is darkness.

Without darkness, there would be no need for warriors or angles. Warriors are not made because the whole world is happy and angles were not formed because there are no demons.

Be of worth, have a flame"

--C. JoyBell C.

Have a great Sunday everyone!

[Chris73]

Man, it's hard today. Feeling the pressure and the fatigue of all the hard work I've been putting in. Not discouraged in the least, just tired.

Last night I took my dad with me to the blues jam in town. On the way there he pressed me for information on the state of my marriage. This was prompted by the fact that my W is going on a trip to FL next week with her girlfriends. He wanted to know why I wasn't going. I told him that work wouldn't let me take the time off because of a project that we're really busy with this week. This isn't a lie, really I wouldn't have been able to go. But I left out the fact that I wasn't invited. I'm not a fan of dishonesty, but nothing good could come out of him knowing that my marriage is in trouble. The added stress isn't helpful though.

Tomorrow is my W's birthday. I left it up to her to make the decision about how much (or how little) she wanted to celebrate it. She opted to spend it at home with me and the kids and a few extended family members. I volunteered to cook and despite our less-than-ideal marriage situation I'm looking forward to it.

We've been getting along well and there's no doubt that she's paying very close attention to the "new me". Frankly, I don't know how you couldn't. The new me is so different from the old me. But it's only been 30 days since he's made his first appearance, so I have no expectations that she will outwardly react to my changes.

Need to return to my affirmations today...

[Chris73]

journaling...

Today is my W's 46th birthday. Since we've spent the past month fostering a low-conflict environment and being friendly to each other, she expressed the desire to celebrate her birthday at home with the family (including me) and I volunteered to make dinner.

I decided to go with a Mardi Gras theme (since it just happens to be today) which I think will work out well because the spirit of Mardi Gras promotes a light and happy atmosphere.

I will go into this evening with zero expectations from her (as with everything these days). Frankly, I've worked pretty hard on the details for the dinner. And the old me would have been motivated to do so for the reciprocation from my W. These days, since I've been forced to expect nothing in the way of reciprocation from her, I find myself motivated to do things a bit more selflessly, not just for her, but for other people in my life.

I know that deep down my W is noticing my changes and wondering:

1. Why didn't he do this before? and
2. How long will this last?

I wish I could convince her that my changes are genuine, but this can only happen through the consistency of my actions. No amount of talking can reinforce the progress I'm making. I have to constantly remind myself of this and some days it's hard. I just want to scream at her "I FINALLY GET IT!!!"

I know I have to approach this sitch inch by inch and day by day. Every once in a while I'll look up at the horizon to visualize the end goal and then I'll look back down and keep moving forward. I think it helps to have short term goals though. These are mine:

1. Continue to work on fixing me and making attempts to reconnect with my W

2. Train for the 8K in April

3. Improve my blues guitar technique and continue to go out every week and play

4. Clean out my office to make space for my guitars and a section for meditation

That should hold me for the next 2 months.

You know, I never wanted this to happen to my marriage, but think it needed to happen...

[doodler]

Chris73,

I hope you're going to prepare a big king cake for your wife. It certainly sounds like cake is on the menu.

[Vapo]

Chris,

I am afraid you are working yourself into a frenzy. You will burn out at this pace. Please take care of yourself first, do not wait around for your W. She will come to you if/when she is ready...

[PacLove]

Chris,

not sure if you came across this exert from MWD's website - but thought it very interesting as it may relate to your Sich... I definitely feel my W and I are moving towards the friend zone but with OM out of the picture I hope we can someday move beyond that:

http://divorcebusting.com/a_while_spouse_decides.htm

[Gordie]

Chris,

not sure if you came across this exert from MWD's website - but thought it very interesting as it may relate to your Sich... I definitely feel my W and I are moving towards the friend zone but with OM out of the picture I hope we can someday move beyond that:

http://divorcebusting.com/a_while_spouse_decides.htm

PacLove--that is awesome and inspiring but what many on the boards would call being a doormat or enabling cake eating. What do you think?

[Chris73]

PacLove. Thank you for finding this article. Believe me I question my actions/methods every day and it's always good to find support/evidence that I've made the right decision for my sitch.

PacLove--that is awesome and inspiring but what many on the boards would call being a doormat or enabling cake eating. What do you think?

Gordie, this is one of the things I struggle with, especially on this board. I don't subscribe to the "tough love" (for lack of a better way to describe it) approach as it relates to MY sitch and I am very vocal about it here. I suspect this may be the reason why some of the board vets like Sandi2 have not contributed to my posts over the past month. In their eyes, why should they continue to give me advice when I'm not taking it? And I don't blame them at all for moving on to other board members who could benefit from their advice. I will continue to post my observations and progress here and I certainly let you all know if my "kill her with kindness" approach backfires.

But really, what qualifies as "backfiring?" What does "failure" look like for me? If I end up divorced, co-parenting, and contributing 75% of my paycheck to my W and kids, is THAT failure? And what about all the folks on this board who tried the tough love approach only to end up with this very result. Did they fail? I would say no, across the board. Failure to me is simply not trying. Everyone here is trying. We read the books and post on this board. We employ critical introspection in an attempt to fix and improve ourselves. Emerging as a stronger and healthier person from this challenging time, whether it results in a reconciliation or a divorce, is a success as far as I'm concerned.

My personal philosophy is that goodwill creates more goodwill. Marriage problems cannot be fixed if there is no goodwill or connection between the couple. If my W is being obstinate, I can still affect the dynamic between us by trying to create a connection through small but consistent actions of love and kindness. It's not easy and you have to constantly ego-check, but these actions will soften the heart. When my W emerges from her fog, she needs to see me as a man who has not only improved himself but also continued to nurture a friendship that provides a fertile ground for reconciliation.

Being a "doormat" suggests that someone else can rob you of your self-respect and dignity. But I would argue that no one can "take" away your self-respect. For me, doing everything you can to honor your commitment to your marriage despite all obstacles is a very dignified and honorable thing to do.

By the way, just a brief update on my W's birthday. Everything went great. We all had a fun and my W couldn't stop thanking me and complimenting me on what a great job I did on the dinner. I overheard her bragging about it to two of her friends in the days that followed. Yes, she did eat cake. We all did, and ice cream too!