Working on a Trial Separation Agreement with MLC H

[ccgrrl]

Thanks, SBJ.
You're right, it would push him away. I think I am still really having trouble with not being able to have any expectations from him at all. I feel like, why am I going through all of this for someone who won't even give me the courtesy of an attempt at saving what has been an incredible marriage, despite the last few years?

I get it, it's not fair and that's just how it is, but I am finding that piece so hard to swallow... It's much more painful to me than the idea of him having an affair or the things he's told me (like his fantasy that I would have an accident and then be out of his life). I can handle a lot. I am a strong person. But I don't know where to get the strength to deal with someone saying: you're not good enough and even though I "love" you, I'm not going to give you a chance to improve because I'm just done!

[SBJ]

I totally agree with you as to how hard it is to understand how they could love us but not be willing to work things out...the problem is that we will never really understand the MLC mindset unless we go thru it ourselves. And even then our own minds would be so clouded we may not ever acknowledge it.

As everyone on here has asked me 100 time...what are you going to GAL? I know it is difficult to do new things with small kids, but it is important to work on you.

[ccgrrl]

SBJ-
As for as GAL goes, that’s another confusing thing for me because I think the fact that I already had a life and he didn’t was a huge part of our issue. To give a little background… After BD, H & I talked a lot and we both realized that we didn’t know who started doing this first, but at some point I felt a complete lack of interest from him other than sexual.

We live in a seasonal economy so half the year I am working fulltime and the other half part-time, but for him, he’s either unemployed or working freelance & part-time. In the summers he is the primary caregiver for the kids while I am at work f/t. What started to happen was I developed friendships with my colleagues and a mutual friend of ours who lives near my job, so when I had problems at work or existential questions about my life, I turned to those around me and not to my husband who was just always overwhelmed - I thought by his own career difficulties and parenting struggles, both of which I tried to help him with, but now I see he was also struggling with feeling unloved because he wanted to have sex more and more, to the point where I was having to fight him off me so I could get to sleep so I could wake up and go to work, etc. While I was developing healthy friendships and - because my job gives me a lot of these opportunities - I was going out to the theater, films, events, etc., H didn’t have any resources to draw on besides me.

I am still doing things with friends and working on creative projects that I have (I am a filmmaker and writer) and also trying to take care of all those things around the house and in my own psyche that I always put off - whether it’s sewing the button on my favorite pants or going back to playing piano which I gave up when I was teenager.

So I guess I feel like one of the problems was me GAL-ing in the first place and actually it is him who needs to GAL He told me he felt like he was lowest priority, so I am really struggling to wrap my head around why it would be good for me to continue doing that now.

[SBJ]

I'm definitely not in the position to give professional advice, but as a man, I understand his need to be close more and more. That is how we, as men feel a connection.

In my case, the wife and I did alot together, but she also does alot of volunteer work thru non-profit organizations and thru church ministries. Hence she developed friendships with people that I did not know. This has been going on for several years. I also do alot with men's groups and have a separate set of friends, but in our large circle everyone knows everyone.

Over the last year, she developed an insatiable desire to get fit...eating right, exercising, dressing more provocatively (noticed more by friends than me). All of those things got her in the best shape of her life and attracted me to her even more, which in some of her reasoning, was a cause of her pulling away from me. We are such odd creatures.

Several months before the BD she started an EA with a very new family friend. This was obviously denied by her, but phone records don't lie. About 3-4 months into the EA I got the dreaded ILYBINILWY conversation. Over the next few months the conversation changed to the total MLC script and then she moved out and filed in Nov. I has been a fast 6 months.

I guess when they say GAL to me, I feel it is something to get myself away from my situation for a while...exercise, hobbies, music, hiking, reading, etc. And thru all of those new things you'd meet people that have like minded thinking.

I guess in your case you say you had a life that he wasn't a part of or didn't want to be a part of? Did he ever express a desire to do other things with you away from the kids/house, or things with your work friends?

[ccgrrl]

Most of the life that I had revolved around work and he was always watching our children while I worked, so it was very difficult for us to be in each other's non-parenting lives. After I came home from work, he worked at night and I couldn't go participate in that at all (he's a musician), because I was watching the kids then.

However, that is only how our schedules were 7 months of the year. The other 5 months, we had time together during the day and used to do things - go for walks, ML, etc. But over time that stopped happening and each of us used the time the kids were in school and we weren't working to take care of other pursuits like career advancement or creative projects of our own, etc.

I know when we did have access to a babysitter, I often invited him to do things with me, and sometimes he would come but it was usually something he wasn't really interested in. Unfortunately, he never reciprocated by inviting me to do something he was interested in because he seemed to only be interested in staying home, watching TV, and having sex. Now he seems to be saying he hates/hated staying home and watching TV (sex was fine ;-]

[ccgrrl]

UPDATE...

So today I had my private session with the MC. (H has his next week). She really totally gets what's happening here and says she feels the anger coming from him and agrees that this may not be the most productive time for counseling together. She said she wants to talk to him privately first and then when we all come back in together we can talk about whether or not it makes sense to be in MC together at this stage.

She felt that he is really in a crisis mode and his physically moving out of our house would give us both more space for it to really sink in what he is talking about doing. And she also said it was very common and that what we're going through is just part of the stages of marriage that pretty much everyone goes through if they last this long, it's just that his MLC and general lack of coping skills are causing him to get stuck on this divorce idea as a kind of fantasy escape from reality and responsibility.

She also referred me to a local organization that offers free & low-cost financial and legal advice to women with regard to divorce and separation and she encouraged me to find an IC to help me work through my own emotions, as his behavior is beginning to make me really angry and I'm not sure I will be able to forgive and forget when the MLC is all over (if he's even around then).

I'm starting to see how all of this is impacting my children. They are confused because they see we are rarely in the same room together other than our nightly family dinner, which actually is generally pretty nice. The older one (S13) is even tossing around the term "midlife crisis" - I think he is actually googling it... smart kid.

I do feel the in-house separation is really tough. Every time he is in the house with me, I feel horrible anxiety and I can't function properly. I get all worried about what I look like, worried about whether the house is clean and comfortable enough for him, and if he approaches me to talk about anything, I'm all tied up in knots trying to figure out how to handle the conversation - whether it's him asking where the salt is or it's a talk about the separation.

I don't know if anyone on the board has done the in-house AND the physical separation and can tell me if they found any relief in their spouse leaving the house for a time? Anyone?

[Altair]

Hi cc,
there's lots here that have done both in-house and physical, I can assure you they will come...
I have a shorter version of the story, H and I were long distance, he got depressed/mlc whatever you name it and I didn't really grasp what was happening but when he moved out so we could be together for his new job i was met with a really angry at me depressed person. He picked fights, withdrew, talked about finding apartments, sat and watched videos on his computer in a stupor. I didn't recognize this person and was blown away. He moved out and has been gone for 7 months now into his own place. I don't think I could have handled living with the anger and fault-finding directed at me, it nearly crushed me without it being in my place. Although, you'll have lots of great people here doing it, the in-house sep. I didn't even have a choice, he just left, so I can't say if I would have chosen one over the other. But the few times I have seen him since he left, he's still unhappy-angry person. Either just directed at me or to the world, who knows. I don't argue back, I just get teary-eyed when I see the anger towards me because was it always there and just a build up and he hates me? Or is it just the MLC and he will wake up? Or never come back? These are some of the unknowns that swirl around here. I hope you can find the best way for you and your kids.

[peacetoday]

CC

I remember feeling the same way when XH lived at home

I would pace at night looking out windows wondering if he was coming home-I could not sleep or eat for months

Once he moved, the energy in my house changed-

yes it was hard when he visited and left, but in general I remember it being better for all of us

The kids are confused but soon adjust
they hear what we tell them
I use to say Dad is a good man and loves them very much
Sometimes people have crises and the key is to seek help if you need it

My kids have fully let their dad go
They are well adjusted
in school and seem to choose the right way
No talk of him hardly ever-sometimes we pray for him

yes they may have issues around abandonment-but hopefully they can work through it
I always reminded them when it still hurt, it was never about them, not their fault not their issue to help him..he has to do it alone

[ccgrrl]

Thanks everyone...

The uncertainty is very troubling for me as I'm someone who is more decisive in most situations. I generally work through issues in a timely way and come to decisions that will improve things for me - I'm speaking about issues at work, creative stuff, etc. Here's an example of how things go around here...

He's made it clear in MC and in private that if money wasn't an issue, he would be filing for divorce right now, but he's open to the trial separation because it's the only thing we can financially do - and he's emphatic that it is not because he has any doubts about our marriage being over and done. All that being said, his mother has a summer house near us that is empty until the end of June, so we did talk about him moving in there. At first he didn't want to have to tell her what was up, but now has told her and she's agreed to let him stay there if we just pay utilities. This idea has been flying around for probably 6 weeks and his problem with it is that he doesn't feel he would be standing on his own two feet if he just moves from "my house" to her house.

Well, then yesterday morning he told me he looked for an apartment or two and it's too expensive so he thinks he will just move into her house, but he's not happy about it. I just said, "yeah that is a tough thing," and went about my day. Later on he was having trouble with the printer, so I was trying to help. What is it he was printing? Paperwork to file divorce, even though we agreed to put that off. I told him he probably shouldn't leave those papers around because of the kids. He told me he was only printing it for the therapist to see.

Next conversation later in the day is about how we'll need to replace the deck on our house in the spring. What? Does that mean he is going to be here in the spring?
Ugh....

I am going on a day trip today to a museum and setting up an appointment with my own IC, as well as calling that organization our MC recommended. I feel like there are two things I need to deal with: 1 - his mlc and how to proceed in our separation arrangements and 2 - my own ambivalence about the relationship. I just don't have any respect for someone who walks about of a 23 year marriage with children without first doing the work to fix our relationship. I can't get past that... maybe that will change, maybe he will realize this, or maybe I will see past in somehow, but right now I feel like an idiot hanging onto a relationship that, according to him, has been a sinking ship for a decade!

[SBJ]

CC...It seems to be different in each and every situation. Some of the MLC spouses are angry, some confused, some, like mine are certain and sure that they are doing the right thing and that there is nothing anyone can do or say to make things better/different. I was willing to stick it out with her while she was in the house, but did not get the opportunity.

I encouraged MC'ing and she finally went. The MC'ing only took two sessions until she decided and voiced that she didn't see being married to me in a year. The third session that got cut down to 6 months. I declined to go to and cancelled the next session because she wasn't willing to work on what we needed to work on...communication...instead she was using it as a way of getting out of our M and figuring out the best way to tell our children.

She moved out the first week of November and I was served D papers 3 days later...she does everything at break-neck speed. When she gets something in her head she completes it and is very successful at it...one of the traits I admire about her. I just wish that she'd get it in her head that she wanted to have a successful/passionate M with me...she would succeed. Unfortunately, I am fighting a battle of her will. I will stand and pray for her for as long as I can and I truly believe that all M's can be saved and reconciled, but it takes two people willing to work.

But the few times I have seen him since he left, he's still unhappy-angry person. Either just directed at me or to the world, who knows. I don't argue back, I just get teary-eyed when I see the anger towards me because was it always there and just a build up and he hates me? Or is it just the MLC and he will wake up? Or never come back? These are some of the unknowns that swirl around here. I hope you can find the best way for you and your kids.

Altair...don't they all react differently? In my case she acts totally elated and tells everyone that the D process is so easy and that our kids are doing so well with it. I think this is her denial that the process is destroying a family. She even told me once that families don't get destroyed...they just get restructured...what a crock of excrement.

Once he moved, the energy in my house changed-


I use to say Dad is a good man and loves them very much
Sometimes people have crises and the key is to seek help if you need it


...he has to do it alone

As peace says...the energy does change, but it doesn't change the fact that we feel a void. There is a void from that person that has been there for so long. That person that has been there to talk to, to touch, to laugh with, to love...it is crazy how we get so dependent on someone being there.

Peace, I haven't even talked to my kids about what is going on other than saying that this isn't what dad wants, but mom feels that she needs to do this. I have told them that we will find the strength we need to get thru this and thrive. The two oldest (19 & 14) seem to understand, but my youngest just knows that he has two places to call home right now. How I wish that wasn't true, but we make due with what we have at the moment.

And yes...He or she has to do this on their own.

CC...I'm sorry you are going thru this. Please know that you and all of the standers on this board are God's hands whether you know it or not.