That's me in the spotlight

[Altair]

Hi all, my third thread
(I'll try to post links here)

Previous Thread:

That's me in the corner

Basically I'm in NC-land. GALing one day at a time. Focusing on trying to be positive, and get through the holidays in one piece, maybe even have a bit of fun. I'm a bit calmer now, my roller coaster has turned into a more benign, kiddie one at present. I think I've gained a lot of strength; I'll be able to handle what life throws my way. Today was exciting for me. Believe it or not, those of you who have put up with my divinely banal writing on this site, I can be very funny in person. (On this site; however, A.P. puts me to shame with stick jokes)
It's why H said he fell for me in the first place. It really is my saving grace.
Today, I think really since I started this job, I was just killing it in a meeting. Totally cracking up everyone. I felt alive (finally) and the meeting leader was like, (Altair) she's got this, listen to her, she knows this.
I felt so great and it was wonderful to see the room of laughing folk.
I used to be more sarcastic years ago but my humor now is warm and encouraging, inclusive (I hope). Anyway today I felt like myself. I have no idea if H will reappear, or what happens next in this M. One of the last conversations we had was along the lines of, 'There's a chance for us to work this out, I love being with you, for one, you're one of the funniest people I've ever met' (bear with me, again, I've been Eyeore cubed on this site)
Anyway, back to our regularly scheduled DB programming. Uh, I'm alone, in my apartment, eating jelly beans in bed...

[AndrewP]

Altair! Being a huge fan of A.A. Milne (and the Ernest Shepard illustrations) Eyeore is my spirit animal although WOL is a close second (bonus points if you catch the LOL)

People like us can command a room and I'm glad that you found that again in yourself.

Just wrapping you up in a big hug right now.

[Altair]

Eeyore (oops on typo!)
Yes A.P. got the LOL on the WOL.

[Altair]

AP I guess someone could put a sign over my apartment and it would say 'BLS' and I wouldn't know any better (or TRAIL-A or RAT ALI or AT LAIR)

humor?

[Coly23]

Ha, you two make me smile!

Altair, I'm so glad that old Altair is starting to shine through. I too am a little bit if a joker, always the life and soul of the party even if it isn't mine. However since BD that Coly has been supressed but now she is slowly coming through...

Your H obviously recognises and remembers what attracted him to you and maybe (mind reading) he is staying away because he was afraid he was bringing you down.

I love Piglet....

[Altair]

Hi all,
Journaling.
Met with IC today. One thing I brought up was the one down several to go conundrum.
One down: thanksgiving. To go: H bday. Christmas. New Years. Anniversary.
Thats a lot for me, so i need lots of strength to get through. powering through...

[AndrewP]

Altair - You can do this. You are a strong person already and we are all here for you to lean on. If we lean on each other we can hold up the world.

(((((Altair)))))

[Altair]

Hi A.P., thanks for the support. Already December 3, I've been so busy time is really flying by-- a good thing to keep busy. I can't believe how many social events I've been invited to! I've been in my new place a little over a year, and I feel like I've made a nice group of friends and co-workers. A party last night, a party tonight (and two invites I had to turn down) and at least two more holiday party invites coming up. This isn't my style at all but I know it is good for me to get out of my comfort zone. Last night was fun-- I was with a group of Europeans and some Americans. Our host had a ton of games I'd never seen. We played some really fun/silly word game which was extra fun due to all the non native speakers in the mix. Drank some german holiday drink-- can't recall the name-- will have to look it up. Saw a wreath today at the market, still can't pull the trigger!

[Coly23]

Wow Altair, that's great that you're social calendar is filling up already! I know what you mean about getting out of your comfort zone but if we can do this now imagine how much stronger we will be this time next year!

Go out and buy that wreath! Don't even think about it or over analyse it. I personally don't have a choice in the matter. D would litterally have a fit if I didn't decorate but to be honest with you even if I didn't have D I would be compelled to put a few bits up here and there.

You can do this Altar!

[Coly23]

By the way was the German drink gluhwein? It's a bit like mulled wine...

[job]

I'm glad your social calendar is filling up. It's the season to socialize a bit more than usual. However, if you don't feel up to going to some of the activities, then don't. You'll know when you have the need to have some quiet time.

As for the wreath...go for it! Don't wait too long or it will be gone.

[Altair]

Coly! I apologize, I did not see your response. I believe that is what it was! how fun.

Journaling.
Well still NC from H. My IC kind of furrows her brow and asks about now what am I thinking about for my future. I get it, most people who knew I had an H in my life now have stopped asking. It seems we've all written him off to be gone. It's hard, but through this site, I see how to move forward and work on myself. ( I cry as I write this)
Yikes the lump in my throat.
looking back. I've had so much time to read emails, texts, talk to people, the final portrayal of our life together at BD simply cannot be true. It might be H reality from now on but no, it was a special, loving time. I have read up so much on depression and I see that as an insidious factor; I can look back and see where it crawled in, and manifested itself in many ways.
One of the last times we saw each other he mentioned depression, how it drummed through his head, he felt no pleasure doing anything, a voice in his head he could not quell told him he amounted to nothing.
So, I carry on, alone, rebuild. Part of me still thinks its all an excuse, a ruse to get out of the relationship, but that part wanes. Now, I see a depressed person who runs away from his problems.
I am blessed though! The Universe or what deity have you has placed me in a new work group, I have been showered with holiday party invitations. I am going tomorrow to a housewarming. Sunday I have a friend date at a gallery. I cleaned my house as A.P. wisely prescribed, including all of the laundry. I think I have enough work/events to get me through this holiday season. I love the holidays. I love cooking, etc. One thing I think about is the people on this site who were married for 20 years give or take and are suffering. It is true, my suffering cannot possibly compare. H and I were friends for two years before I said yes to a date. I now wonder if I should have. Maybe kept a friend and not been in this boat. I don't know. I will put on my party dress and hit the town tomorrow. I will survive.

[Rouky]

Hi Altair,
Just read your post and wanted to add my view on your comments about your friendship with your H before you dated him. I met H and felt in love with him straight away, so I git involved with him before we had a friendship and I'm like you here. So I'd say there is no right nor wrong, we can't undo the past but only look forward even if it's hard. '

I'm starting to believe that our life is a train that has people boarding it at different stages on its journey. Your H is on his own train journey, let him be. No matter how hard it is try to embrace yours and live your life how you have always wanted to.

[Altair]

Thanks Rouky.
I'll try to "live my life how I've always wanted to".
This is hard. I know to let him be.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, good to see your post my friend.

I also think about the friendship side and wonder if I should have just kept it that way rather than taking it to the next level. I knew my H for seven seven years before we started a relationship and we always got on so well. But as Rouky said we can't undo the past and we have to move forward with whatever the future holds. Your H isn't ready to come to you as yet and you are doing well leaving him on his journey (much better than I have with my H but I'll post about that later!).

I love that you are embracing all the holiday invitations and I am very jealous! Have a few more glasses of mulled wine for me!

[Altair]

Hi Coly!!
the mulled wine parties are hard to do, for sure. I have not been the only single at the parties, but I am in my opinion too old for the singles there. But, fun nonetheless.
I don't regret things looking back, I guess. Deep sigh. But that's so interesting you and your H were friends, Coly, for so long. How are things on your end??

[Coly23]

No, I don't regret what has happened but I do mourn our friendship as much as our marriage.

I won't hijack your thread so I'll post over on mine in a bit . I haven't been posting much lately because I'm not sure how to articulate what has been going on. It's hard to get a firm hold on the thoughts in my own head let alone trying to explain in words!

I'll get the tea and biscuits ready and hopefully AP and others will join later....

[AndrewP]

Coly - I'm on my way ....

Altair - You are in a difficult place but a place from where you can find strength. I think you have found your core. This update may read at first a bit sad and I have tears in my own eyes reading it but I like the sound of the "you" that wrote it.

It's funny in a sad way how a number of have bonded here. You and Coly23 have an almost opposite timeline in your relationships to me. From the very first day that W and I met we were inseparable. It took me all of 3 weeks to confess to her that I loved her and then we spent nearly 3 decades together building a life, family and friendship that I thought would endure forever.

After tea and biscuits I'll set up the tea trays over in the cabin and do an update myself.

[job]

Altair,

Just because your h has not reached out to you doesn't mean that he's not thinking about you. Some disappear for months and then pop back into our lives when we least expect them to. Right now, depression has him in a fog and he could be out there exploring the world trying to find a way to self medicate or he could be going to work and then coming home and sitting in a chair, in a dark room, staring at the TV. Some even sleep a lot. Whatever he is doing, he is trying to find himself and figure out why he feels the way that he does. Unfortunately, you can't help him because this is his journey and he is the only one that can help himself.

As for people asking about the situation, that's really better for you because then you don't have to explain what is going on. In some cases, people stop asking because they know how their questions could be affecting you and they don't want to see you in pain, so they do everything possible to avoid the subject. It's best to leave your situation right where it is at the moment, i.e., between you and your h.

I'm glad that you are working on yourself and have been placed in a new work group. Sounds like you'll be plenty busy w/Christmas activities for a while. All of these activities will help you focus on you for a change.

I want to also point out that we all come here and see similarities in our situations, but we need to be mindful that we do compare our situations, but no two are alike because the people involved are unique, the childhoods of those who walked are unique and the timelines will be different. Don't get discouraged by his disappearance. When he's ready, he will reach out in some way.

For now, keep moving forward and keep the focus on you. Altair, you are right where you are suppose to be at this time. Have faith in yourself and the man upstairs.

[Altair]

Thanks for stopping by, Job. As always, I appreciate the notes.

Well, it's about time to fix my hair and put on a sweater dress and suede boots. Wintery clothes I hardly get occasion to wear. Maybe there will be eggnog at the party tonight!

[bttrfly]

woot! have fun! xoxoxo

[Altair]

Journaling.
Party last night was fun. Zero people there know H or even of his existence, that took the edge off I think. Italians hosted and I ended up eating A LOT. Like, a piece of homemade focaccia, pizza, cous cous, two holiday cookies and some chocolate. I think that's more than I've eaten in the past six months, gotta keep on the D diet lol.
I tried to be a good guest and listener and have fun and enjoy myself and block out the film of self-loathing that coats me after I so unfortunately realize how deeply I have internalized all H told me six months ago about why he didn't want to be with me. Note to self to discuss with IC. There was a very beautiful and much younger than me woman lamenting about being single. There were a few younger gents there who came unattached-- she seemed a bit threatened by me. I would guess her desperation was palpable to the men and me, well I'm most likely some mysterious person who is...not desperate? I thought, gaah, look at you, young and beautiful and telling the room about your singledom, just NO! Don't!
I ended up talking to the hostess for a long time about how she prepared all of the dishes.
It's weird, I'm sure there was a time in my life when attention from attractive men would have made me feel better in some way in the middle of a heartbreak. But right now, naah.
The couple got a new apartment, which was very cute. Another couple were talking about their massive home renovation. I've done all of these things in my life. I didn't feel envy for anyone, I just felt disconnected (like a star in outer space?)
It. Is. Weird. To be in this entirely new life of strangers. Heck, I could change my name and ask to be called something else, no one would be the wiser.
Obviously, it was a red flag that I immersed myself totally in H's family, and to a lesser degree, his friends. Even if we were to reconcile it is important to maintain my own life, which I let slip especially since moving here.
I'm a homebody, I like throwing dinner parties, I like cooking for people, I can see how I ended up with not so many friends (but good ones FWIW). I've gone through periods where I isolated myself, buried myself in my work (my one success lol). Forcing myself out there to GAL.

[AndrewP]

Altair - Good for you! I think you are under-rating yourself. You have far more than "one success". You are becoming the best Altair that ever was for one thing. I'm looking forward to that film continuing to crack and for you to emerge and spread your wings.

I used to joke with people that the three magic words that "saved my marriage" were "Have Fun Dear". I think those are good words for us to all remember as we build our new lives. You certainly seem to be embracing that concept too.

Continue to take care of and love yourself. My ironing is done, perhaps a small glass of "chicken milk" and then dinner. It felt good to look at the line of freshly ironed shirts and pressed pants and know that I am ready for the next week.

[Altair]

Hi A.P., and thank you for mentioning the film-crack. I sure as heck need that. It's an egg! It's like a sad-encasement I've made. I took all the horrible stuff H said and decided this is why I can't be free.

Not my genre, but wow: A Perfect Circle (group) A stranger (song) is my feeling right now.

[d_Rose]

Hi Altair. Just stopping by for the first time. Read your sitch. We have similar timelines for BD. You sound like you are doing so well. I have my days.... Lots of triggers this time of year. Nice to hear your social calendar is full!

I also tend to be more of a homebody, and have been focused on kid activities for so many years. Trying discover how to GAL and where my interests may lie. Some of this work I would need to be doing regardless of MLC as my kids leave the house and I have more time for me. Moving to the next phase....

Anyway - nothing big to add. Just wanted to say hi.

[Altair]

Hi Rose,
thanks for stopping by. I think your point about GALing due to impending empty nester sitch is a good one. You have to do it anyway...so do it!
I don't feel like I am doing so well! In terms of how much time I end up ruminating over everything-- but at least I have a better understanding of why my brain cannot stop cycling.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, sounds like the party went well. I like your observations of the single, young female reaking of desperation. Maybe that's the how I come across to my H! However I am like you in that I don't have any interest in the opposite sex at the moment apart from my H. It's quite liberating to not feel you have to impress anyone and I definitely don't feel I need or want to.

Glad you had the opportunity to indulge in some good food, I especially love cous cous as well! Although my anxiety is still keeping my weight off I have also started to eat a little better and the holiday season is always an excuse to over indulge!

I get the sense Altair that something has shifted in you, a sort of quiet acceptance of your sitch? Since you've gone NC you've come along in leaps and bounds with your GAL'ng and it sounds like it helps when you are in the company of people who don't know your H. This is something I need to take on board although I still struggle with the GAL'ng because I too am so much of a homebody.

Can't wait to hear about the next party! I'm just going to live vicariously through you!!

[Altair]

Hi Coly,
Ha! Not sure my parties I attend are anything to live vicarously through, but maybe! You're going to love my latest GAL-- I've accepted a request to cat sit and.... CHICKEN SIT!
It so happens a co-worker has chickens! In this big ole city! They live really close to me- 2ish miles. I, of course, did not want to accept this duty next week while they holiday and I... sit at their house alone with a cat and chickens. But I said yes! why not? I do miss owning a home, for sure. This will be a nice change of habitat.

Yes, I believe something has shifted inside of me. I think it has been a huge plus my GAL has nothing to do with H-- actually with NC it is best that way, for sure, but extra hard for the homebody. (GAL homebody at.. other people's home? lol)

Let's see, where am I at this second in my thinking. Well, disappearing from a marriage isn't "normal". It's gotten to the point for me where, it's just... beyond. (I know, hello MLC/depression). It's so irrational at this point I find it hard to even consider H reasons for leaving at this point-- they don't make sense, don't connect to anything, etc... Blaming me for having to run away, it just doesn't add up at this point. Meaning, I gave him lots of outs. But no, he didn't want a D, just to run away from his life. We had a nice life, I'm sure of it. I'll probably try to set up a similar one on my own, slowly as I can. We know the worst of this is the limbo. But, he's gone! That isn't limbo! I have in a pen and paper journal from June a little jot that says "NC for maybe 6 mnths". I don't remember if he said that or I thought it or something-- but it is there. Meaning this could go 6 months or longer. I still don't want to think about filing. Make him do the work...

[Altair]

Journaling.
Christmas party down last night, so, one more to go. My boss pointed out my dress was open, the button right at the boob came undone, had to find a safety pin and do an awkward fix. Gotta love wardrobe malfunctions. A bit of a headache this a.m. from the wine at dinner. My Uber driver home was insane. Gets on the freeway in the rain (so much for polar vortex here) and proceeds to turn up electronic music and go extremely fast, swerving in and out of cars. I was terrified and I loved it.
Danger GAL tomorrow- I was asked to go to the 'try on wedding dresses' place. I was asked to go and sort of taken aback like really? me? but then i thought, well, I must mean something to her you don't just ask any old person to go with you to this sort of thing. So I said yes.This will require strength!

[AndrewP]

Altair - Sounds like a set of grand adventures. Make sure that the boob buttons are soundly attached to those wedding dresses. I had a cab driver in Chicago once who drove like your Uber driver. I congratulated him at the end and remarked "victory goes to the brave".

[hawker]

Haha Alair....weird my friends and I used an uber driver last night and it was raining as well...no electronic music, just a little ole country!! :-)

Wishing you strength for the wedding dress place!!!

[Altair]

Thank you hawker!!

My friend is not doing the traditional gown, just a nice beaded dress in ivory I think.
So it's not like I'll be stepping on trains and sitting in the corner, my champagne flute to my lips, face hidden by veil. Actually that probably sounds about right.
Champagne gives me a headache, so I really need to be careful.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, how's it going? Now chicken sitting sounds very interesting to me. Will you be allowed to use any eggs that have been laid during that time?

It will be lovely going to help your friend to try on wedding dresses I would certainly jump at the chance to do that! In fact helping D try on prom dresses made me all emotional thinking one day this could be a dress for her wedding...

What H's have done is certainly not normal. It seems to me in your sitch the NC is actually damage control as things were beginning to get very emotional for you when you were meeting so I can see this as benefiting you both. Although I know how hard it is.

Wishing you a lovely weekend (((Altair))).

[Altair]

Hi Coly, yes on eggs! wonder what I should make...
I have perhaps a dumb question, but I think I read about it on here. So I did the happy birthday text to H. A few hours later, got back an Altair, thanks,I appreciate it.

Ever since H left, he calls me by my name in texts, and in person before going dark. Why is that? texts never used to include my name, now they all do.

[Coly23]

Yes my H does that now as well, although he still uses my nickname but before BD no name at all. Very strange!!

[AndrewP]

My W is now extremely polite. Never used to say "thank you" - now everything (the very few that I get) has that.

On the other hand it is so very tough for me to call her by name and not use any of pet names or even just "dear" or "my sweet" that I used to address her by. I took such an effort after BD2 to stop using those although I did use the occasional "dear". I think for all the years prior to BD I only called her by her name an handful of times - usually in a formal environment.

Perhaps different rules apply in Fairy Land? They certainly apply on this side of the pixie dust curtain at least to me.

[Sotto]

This is interesting. I often called H by his initial and he lengthen my name into a pet name. After BD, he continued to use the pet name the whole time apart from a couple of emails where he used my normal name. He would always sign off with his initial.

For me, the name things were part of our R and once we were well on the way to D, I started using normal names again. For me, if someone betrays me in that way and runs off with OW, I'm not willing to sign on and off with endearments and pretend things are okay. I switched over to 'just business.' However, I am D'd, which is a place many won't want to be!!

:-) x

[bttrfly]

When I got more than double the initial offer from the insurance company on the damage to our house, stbxh said, "great job sweetheart" for the first time in months ...

and that was the LAST time also.

there are occasional xo's in text and email ... what's bizarre is when he refers to me in email by my formal full name, not my nickname. And he's now shortened his name rather than his full name, which he's always gone by. It's like we were full name H and nickname W when we were married but now nickname h is now divorcing full name wife.

They are just so freaking odd.

[Coly23]

Wow this is more common than I thought! When H and I first separated I had to send him an official email about the house and at the time I was so d@mn mad at him that I signed off the email with my full name so when H replied he also used my full name. We went backwards and forwards in this formal way until eventually he got fed up and reverted back to addressing me by my nickname and had never gone back to using my full name. Very strange indeed!!

[Altair]

Agreed. This, plus all the classic lines of an MLCer. I have to say, in the past during breakups, I never heard these sorts of lines. But on here, I see them constantly. Iguess that's one thing that causes the panic, because it is usually a completely new experience.

[Altair]

Journaling.
I made it through the bridal gown fitting of friend. The sight of the dresses, the women trying them on, the flurries of photos and family oohin and ahing I was okay about. The fitter told my friend, "Congratulations!" and that is when I teared up and ran to the bathroom to recover. That word, unexpectedly, killed me.
Then we went out and let's just say people are starting to give me some nudges. My friend was like, this is insane, your H is acting insanely, don't wear your ring, as far as I am concerned you are single, stop wasting your life, etc.
I listen, I validate, inside my stomach churns because I'd be saying the same thing.
Another one today. More advice, you need to do an ultimatum, I want to help, we love you Altair you need to move on, this is crazy, he's treating you like crap, what about you, abandoning you is not okay!
Again, I listen, validate, thank them for caring (stomach still churning)

I told everyone, yeah, well, I won't do anything until next year at any rate. To be clear, I don't talk about H, they are merely concerned (not sick of me moping and complaining). So H is not poking head out but concerned friends are.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, glad the dress fitting experience went okay. I know it's always the small things that are a trigger.

I had the same this weekend, caring friends wanting me to give H ultimatums and move on. I did the same as you, validated but desperately wanted the conversation to end. I don't know about you but these days I feel like I want to talk about it less and less....

How is your week looking? Do you have any extra time off for the holidays?

[Altair]

Hi Coly,
It's interesting you had the same weekend. I think there's a 'logic clock' going off in people's heads bringing us to receive ultimatum advice, related to our timelines. Which makes me assume people are doing it to the H's as well. In my case that would mean H must be feeling extreme pressure right now. All the more reason to leave him alone. This week, yeah I can be done on Thursday. Tuesday drinks with co-worker and she's bringing a guy I've not met (for me? for her? neither?) Hair appointments and then a Christmas Eve party. IC too.
She's another one, I feel like she is gently shifting me to D. I know this is in DB, is a known phenomenon, but I still find it strange. Maybe she's seen this happen 1,000 times with the same outcome? I sometimes think she knows something or sees something I don't. Well, at some point I will ask her this. Just not now. Getting through this week is still where I am at in my head.

Also I am getting the cat today for the week. Well I was supposed to have the cat now, but I took a friend over to see him and she 'borrowed him' because she's like me - loves cats, can't have one.
I have the key to her house, she leaves for the East Coast today. As cats do, she said he stays under the bed a lot. I hope when I go over there I'll be able to put him in the carrier. Any advice appreciated. He's very sweet, but he is a cat, a hider.
How about you, Coly?

[AndrewP]

Altair - Cats I can give advice on

"The girls" are a particular problem. I wear heavy gloves and expect to get peed on. The second one is worse than the first. Planning is key. Have the carrier set out with the door open so that it is somewhat familiar. I have yet to have the cat walk in but I'm a pretty optimistic guy - why else would I be here? Cat #1 is usually fairly easy. I place the carrier by where they hang out, scoop the cat up and then put them in arse first closing the door quickly so that they don't jump back out. Getting the cat out from under the bed would be your first challenge.

I too have been getting the "just D her" message a lot. People around me are even more tired of this than I am it would seem. Most cases that look like ours on the surface end fairly quickly with divorce which is why many people think that's "normal". But there's nothing normal at all about what we are going through. We each have to find our own reasons for "standing" - for me, my reasons sometimes change day by day.

[Altair]

Cat people will like this. Went to get cat, saw disaster in the living room. Cat dug up a plant and made a mess of the living room! Was coaxed out of underbed slowly, put in carrier. Then I vacuumed like crazy.

[job]

Yep, I've had that happen to me and the plant went out the door after cleaning up the mess kitty made. I'm glad you were able to coax kitty out from under the bed. Hopefully kitty won't be digging up a plant again any time soon.

[Altair]

Hi all and want to wish everyone a happy holidays, Christmas, you name it.
My journaling is kind of sad I don't want to sound hopeless; I'm really upset about today, but I will get through it.
So, journaling.
I had a health scare. I talked to IC and she said I should reach out to H, just to let him know, keep it simple, etc. So I did. He said he'd be there for any tests/procedures that I needed and that "I love you very much". That was a few days ago. I cried a lot after that short phone convo (it's been months since we spoke.)
So today I contacted him again, texted him, he called me right back. I read him the results, and gave him my take, and asked him his. It spiraled into him saying you haven't done enough, why didn't you press for more, I validated and said I did, they are hardly there, don't return calls, people left for holidays, and so on. I tried to steer conversation back to me clarifying nothing will happen until Jan or Feb. He got angry, was like, see, this is exactly you. This is what you do, you always do this. You just don't follow through. You've always done this with medical stuff and now you are doing it again. (and so on)
I tried to reign it in and say yes, (validate) and I've called I've gone there, I've called, gone back I've done everything to try to get the information. He goes in again about how I haven't gone there (I have, I protest lightly) and here we go again, here's how I do things wrong.
I say well, yes, more validation, more just letting him know things are okay for now, just wanted to let him know, that was the reason for talking.
He calms down, then proceeds to tell me how the same medical system has screwed him over, complains about his issues for twenty minutes, I listen, validate, am kind. Basically we had the same exact situation happen to both of us but as you can see, "there I go again" and I just listen to him and empathize.
This phone exchange has been painful beyond belief. Because I have never criticized how he has handled his medical issues. He can be on top of it, and lax, I get that and have been always kind and loving about it. Secondly, I've never seen him so critical of me until bomb drop. He was just so mean about it, in his terms "there you go again, the way you always are, doing X and not Y"filled with anger and frustration. He never used to speak to me this way. So, this is exactly where we were last summer and fall with the fault-finding. It hasn't softened or changed, I don't think. he seems as mad at me as he was six months ago.
All I can say is, I was validating and kind and listened. But JC really? Attacking me for this, so draining, so depressing. No one can really navigate a crazy health care system properly-- BUT I gather many of you will say that isn't the problem.
I contacted him because I have no family-- should I need procedures and stuff well, for now he is next of kin, etc. I guess he is still massively depressed, incredibly angry at me for G_d knows what, ugh. I am drained. I'm drained and sad and do not know this angry person. I think of Job: leave him be, she says. I feel so sad, in that this person who was always the sweetest to me is now irritated by my very existence. There's no NEED to be so angry at me. For any reason I think! He could D me tomorrow and there's no disagreement in our D or finances or anything. He doesn't even need to justify anything! Is the hate to make me file? Why so mad at someone you haven't talked to in months? When he was never angry before like this? I wonder if it is the depression or his IC bringing out all the dirt. I don't know, it looks grim, but I have been a kind listener, that is all I can do.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, first of all I am so sorry about your health scare. I pray that everything turns out okay.

Secondly, i am going to give you a very soft, fluffy 2x4 here because you don't deserve anything too harsh at the moment. I don't generally give them out but I'm feeling generous as its Christmas! Where in DR does it say that you should take and validate someone who is being insensitive, angry and attacking you personally when you have just told them some devastating personal news? There is a time and a place to validate and IMHO I'm not sure this was it. You reached out to him for support as he is still your husband however he has not provided that to you whether he is capable of it or not and it has left you empty and sad. You are not a doormat!

It may have been that he was concerned that you didn't do enough with regards to the results and pushing for more tests but from his reaction his empathy tanks seems to be empty. Same with my H. IMHO you didn't do the wrong thing by contacting him, you just expected the old H to be there on the other end of the phone. New H spent 20 minutes talking about himself again when it should have been all about you. Job is right, leave him be he still isn't ready. Let him reflect and stew on his reaction to your news especially as that was the first time you had spoken for months. I bet he won't feel so good about himself when he thinks back over the conversation.

Maybe next time drop him an e-mail with any updates and tell him you are only doing so as he is your next of kin. Then go and find or ring a friend who you can lean on and or provide you with all the emotional support you need.

(((Altair))), you didn't deserve any of that in your hour of need but your H isn't in a place where he can provide you with the emotional support that you were looking for.

I wish you a peaceful Christmas and I hope the New Year brings you health, love and happiness. Xx

[bttrfly]

first {{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}

I read a lot of projection on his part and anger because he's scared. I could be wrong. Just my initial take on it. Still - Coly is right, you don't need to be yelled at right now. When they are depressed, and MLC is all about depression, they just don't have anything to spare and can't handle very much. I'm sorry you're going through this and am very sorry he cannot give you more than that conversation.

Try not to take it personally and realize that was more about him than you. I hate to think of you alone with this. Is there a good friend you can turn to? We're always here, of course. Take care of yourself right now. Be gentle. Rest. I'm so sorry you are going through this. We are here for you xoxoxoxoxo

[Sotto]

Hi Altair, I'm sorry to hear about your recent health scare and that convo with your H, and big hugs from me Sweetie. (((((Hugs)))))

I agree with the lovely ladies above. When MLCers get pressured (ie: feeling difficult emotions, us wanting something from them) they can get nasty. That's what your H was doing I think. Rather than deal kindly and positively with the situation, he want into critical, ranting mode, which really wasn't helpful....and is all about him and what he can't deal with right now.

Here's my fluffy 2x4 for you my lovely. He just doesn't have it to give right now, and I think relying on good friends is better than relying on support from him. Because, likelihood is you will feel disappointed and upset again, as you did after this convo. Things may change in time, but you have seen how it is for now with him.

Maybe next time, you could drop him a quick email if you want to keep him in the loop. But for now, I would go very dim. Fine if you want to briefly wish him a nice Xmas, but other than that, please do leave him to it and reach out to friends if you need support.

Do you have any Xmas plans my lovely? I will drop in on the forums over the next couple of days and see how you are doing.

Take care xx

[job]

Altair,

I am so sorry that you've had a health scare. You've done all you can about it at the moment and w/the holidays here, offices are closed and nothing gets done until after the first of the year. Do as much reading as you can on the health issue so that if you have additional questions, you can write them down and ask them when you go back in to see the doctor and/or for testing.

I'm not handing out 2X4's to you. You've got a situation that you felt you needed to discuss w/your h. To me, this was necessary as you are still married. I'm sorry he reacted the way he did, but it all sounds like projection on his part. He's scared as heck about the situation and some people react this way. Illness death scare them and they tend to try to avoid it as much as possible because it reminds them of mortality.

Altair, when it comes to your health and you are concerned and a bit scared, there is nothing that says you have to validate what he is saying about you and how you are handling it. True, their empathy chip is broken, but you might have wanted to cut him off when he continued to harp at you. You don't need that anger and criticism right now. You need compassion and concern. Unfortunately, how can they help you when they can't even help themselves? My advice, if you have a close friend, lean on her/him during this time of uncertainty.

I'm not making excuses for your h, but he's scared and he doesn't know how to handle it. He's angry at the world and let's face it, they don't think that we will ever have a health issue and we'll be right were they left us.

I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers. The new year is right around the corner and I am praying that the report you receive back after the holidays will be a good one. I know that this is going to be on your mind this holiday season, but try to set it aside for just a little while to enjoy yourself.
Sending you hugs and positive energy today.

[Altair]

Merry Christmas and thank you to you Job for all of your help. I do appreciate it, especially as I have no family for support. But, I will be strong and positive and get through this!
Hugs to all.

[job]

Merry Christmas!

I know that you will stay positive and strong, but you need someone to lean on as well when things get tough. Come here, we have broad shoulders and we will help you through this.

Keeping you in my thoughts and prayers.

[AndrewP]

Altiar - I am so sorry to hear that you have having health issues. I am sending you a big bear hug - the sort just wraps you up and keeps you safe.

I would suggest that you give some thoughts to how you can manage on your own without H in the case that you need some support during any procedures that may be necessary. A single neighbour of mine is good friends with the man who owns the shop across the street and has relied on him to get him back and forth from appointments. You may not be able to think of anyone right now that you can rely on but give it some thought please. I find it amazing how helpful people can be when you reach out to them.

Take care of yourself my friend.
((((((((((Altair))))))))))

[Altair]

Thank you for the hug, A.P. I'll figure out the health stuff... It will all have to wait until next year anyway.
So ridiculous your W can't even text you back a merry christmas.

If I didn't have this forum and learn this is how the MLC/depressed person acts, I think I'd be a mess today. But this is how they are!!

Yet, I know exactly how you feel, I'm quite sure if I sent that text, I'd get the same non-response.
Anyway.
I did get a text from MIL this morning, that was nice of her. I've not really spoken to her since the summer but I suspect she is worried about H.
As for me, last minute, randomly I am going to Las Vegas with a friend. I don't gamble too much but it'll be a nice change of pace (too hectic, actually) I'm off for a few days so it's a getaway. Of course, I'd rather be on a beach somewhere but I couldn't get my act together to make that happen so-- Vegas it is.
Maybe I can find Bingo-- I prefer that to gaming because at least someone in the room wins.

[job]

I think a quick trip to Vegas is going to be fun for you. You don't have to gamble, but they do have some really nice shows that you might want to take in while you are there. Go, have fun and know that we are here if you need us.

Travel safely!

[Coly23]

Have a great time Altair, you deserve a nice break! I would love to go to Vegas one day!!

[Altair]

Hi all, made it through Xmas in one piece.
Christmas morning, MIL texted me a happy holidays. That made me feel good. Christmas eve, I asked H to call me to wrap up the medical stuff. We talked for a bit. He said he wanted 'a little more space' until the new year as he 'is still processing things'. But that we'd talk after the new year. (I have over analyzed this conversation to an extreme degree)
He said things like he's having trouble sleeping in his place but he doesn't want people to worry about him. I assume people are fussing over him and worrying about him, but it certainly isn't coming from me, as I haven't seen him or spoken to him since October. He told me a bit about what's going on with his family and some work stuff. As since BD, he never asks about me and I don't talk about myself. I did say, and I don't know if this was a mistake or if it even matters when the health stuff was happening that I was asking for help as a friend would. He has seemed to relax on the phone immensely since I used the word friend. Took off pressure? I don't know.
Anyway, we chatted for a bit about his life, then he said we'd talk in the new year.
Then I went to Vegas (where I am now)and played Paigo poker for hours and hours, lost 70 which is fine, and I've been people watching and sitting and thinking about my life, a lot.
Conclusions right now? H is a pretty depressed person. All the while when I thought he was not an angry person, it turns out he was, it was just directed inward or towards me in a ball of resentment. Now, since his therapy, I think he is more open about his frustration with me and honestly, it's too much. I'm not perfect. He gets frustrated with his mother or father for some ridiculous things they do, but he loves them and accepts them. WIth me, no, I don't get a pass. A small action on my part is unforgivable. I see this now, his intolerance and lack of respect for me. It's sad to see. But I am stronger now and don't live with him and don't see him so the tiny doses of it don't crush me anymore. I am ok.

[Altair]

Ah, one more thing. H brought up wanting more space-- I never brought up R stuff. I was like okay, no worries, just trying to clear up this medical stuff is all. It's almost humorous, he's still responding to the begging pleading Altair of May. That Altair is gone.

[job]

I'm glad you went to Vegas. You didn't lose too much money and you have time to walk around, people watch and yes reflect on your relationship.

As for him not sleeping, that's depression, but also his guilt is coming out to play when he doesn't have other things to occupy his mind. I seriously doubt that anyone else has said anything about his health or sleeping habits.

MLCers will not inquire as to how you are doing or show any interest in the area. Keep in mind, we are the enemy right now and we could be perfect in every way and they would still find something to gripe about. It's him...not you.

Yes, you took the pressure off of him by using the word "friend". He relaxed because you aren't expecting him to act like a husband, but more like a friend, nothing more. I think you will find that if you can keep this "friend" relationship going, he'll be more open to talking and possibly asking more about your situation, i.e., health.

Right now, he's going to want to be around his family because he's reliving his youth and yes, they do accept them, i.e., warts and all...but there will come a time when he'll begin to understand why he's so unhappy and depressed and hopefully begin to look within. Depression is about the past. Anxiety is about the future.

Altair, now is the time to focus on you and your health. Try not to over analyze what he says because tomorrow, it could change.

[AndrewP]

I have over analyzed this conversation to an extreme degree

Soul Sister!

played Paigo poker for hours and hours, lost 70 which is fine

And then there's this myth that us Mathematicians can do great at this. I lost at dominoes to a guy who works on a road crew holding the "slow/stop" sign but it turns out is great at seeing patterns ;-)

I don't get a pass. A small action on my part is unforgivable. I see this now, his intolerance and lack of respect for me. It's sad to see.

I beg to differ on this. I believe that it is written that "we hurt the ones we love the most". <excessive analysis redacted>

Enjoy Vegas and the nice warm weather. This was a very good update - you are growing my friend.

[Altair]

Thank you job.
If I end up doing medical stuff in January I will probably have a friend take me. I just needed him to know, in a next-of-kin kind of way. I didn't expect anything from him. I told him I appreciated his offer to take me if need be, and I'd let him know. But yes, he is still the MLCing depressed person. OK off to gamble a bit. Maybe I'll get lucky!

[Altair]

AP-- lol on dominoes! I am not good at dominoes.
I mean, yes, I can count cards and do quite well at blackjack IF there's not multiple decks. The house knows very well how to reduce odds for players- there are very few games that the house doesn't have better odds.
Also I'd have to pay attention when counting cards and these days I'm really distracted. AND you have to be really sober. Maybe today.
I never played Paigo before it is thoughtless, there is zero strategy it's you vs the dealer, that's it. I can't believe how mindless it is-- and played because my friend loves it so it was a blast. We will play craps tonight- another game with little strategy. A wee bit of dice probability can keep me going for hours of not winning or losing.
I am going to research Paigo odds and see what the real deal is. I tried to think about it last night as I was playing but I needed a pencil and paper. Will report anon.

[Altair]

AP-
one more thing (also your post was very funny might I add)
if you think 39 degrees F is "warm weather" and you might, then sure, I am "enjoying the warm weather".

It is sunny, there's that.

[Altair]

Hi all,
journaling.
I do have a request for advice. How to DB/NC/180/whathave you in a medical situation with an MLC/WH?

I got a call this am (in vegas) more tests are needed. I'm not feeling too good/positive about my health right now. But adding to that is this. So H wants to be kept in the loop, says he cares, but come on. It's not going to happen in any normal way. I texted him the latest, 5 hours later I get some sort of 'ok, thanks for letting me know' reply.

This isn't okay, for my mental health (as if any of this crisis has been okay). I guess what I am saying right now (which is weird) is that healthy, I was able to stand and tolerate his MLC depression, and i guess I cannot right now. It's too hurtful and insane. What should I do? I havent' done anything, just a few updating texts, but now I am feeling like, why does he deserve even this? My health situation is trumping his depression (I think). Or I just smile and get a text from him once in a blue moon and find other support. Or call him out on everything. Or plan my funeral (morbid joke). I know MLCers can't care about our health when they are in the thick of things. H wants to be kept in the loop-- or whatever minimal MLC loop on their terms loop-- do I go along with that? or disappear? What is best for me? That's really what I am grappling with. I'm in a bit of an anger phase- I don't care about his depression right now- I'd like to make it to 50, thank you very much.

[Sotto]

Hi Altair, I think it is positive that your H asked to be kept in the loop....however...

Try to accept that your own challenges are yours to deal with and process just now. Lean on the support of others and oblige your H with minimal updates as needed. I wouldn't rely on him for much in the way of practical support, but occasionally keep him up to date if he has asked for this.

If he actually offers support - ie: to take you somewhere - you can have a think about whether that works for you.

Now then, do put him on to the back burner for a few days and try to relax and enjoy your trip. I know you must feel concerned about your health, and hope you will confide in others and seek support from them if you need it.

Xx

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, just letting you know that I am thinking of you. I'm sorry that you H is still not as supportive as you would expect. It's hard to think that they are not there for us anymore.

I agree with Sotto, keep him updated as he asked but lean on your friends for support.

Sending you a big ((( ))).

[job]

I also agree w/Sotto. You can keep him updated, but I would certainly lean on friends, co-workers and neighbors for support. If he offers to take you somewhere for testing, etc., then you will need to decide what you want to do in the way of accepting the offers.

I am keeping you in my thoughts and prayers.

[Altair]

Hi all,
It makes sense to keep him updated but turn down the offers for rides.

[job]

I wouldn't turn down rides unless you have a back up plan w/someone. You never know when your back up plan might have an emergency and it's good to keep things civil and open just in case you do need his assistance in the ride department. I would look upon him as a distant friend and only call him if you absolutely have to for assistance (last resort).

Please take care of yourself.

[Altair]

Agreed. I do live rather close to the medical center, also Lyft and Uber are prevalent and inexpensive. But sure, H can be my backup to my backup.
I just know I've built this fragile wall around myself and do not want to be hurt by H again if I can prevent it.
Being criticized for the way I handled the appointments so far was awful. Second phone call he wasn't as bad "but still upset about the conversation". What does that even mean? (lol, all LBS's nodding heads, yup, no sense-making here)
"we will talk after the new year I just need a bit more time to process things" Didn't (and don't) even know how to respond to that (just glad I made it through Christmas!!!)

[AndrewP]

Altair - I thought I'd pop around with the nutmeg and chicken milk and see how you were doing.

I was reading "your" Wikipedia article just now -
Altair rotates rapidly, with a velocity at the equator of approximately 286 km/s. This is a significant fraction of the star's estimated breakup speed of 400 km/s.
Are you spinning my dear? I suspect so.

Thinking about your "fragile wall" got me thinking about something I wrote here many months ago. I used to joke about "little Timmy falling down the well" whenever I would go into a spiral. Those walls are important and keeping them intact is part of our healing and growth here.

I'm wondering if you changed your communication method you might get a better result with your H. Perhaps instead of calling with updates to your medical issues, writing an email would be better. You can think it through, compose it, perhaps get it proof-read here or elsewhere and then any responses your H makes he can put through the same rigour. What I "saw" in your last exchange was two people who are in very frightening and scary places reacting and feeding off of each other's reactions.

Just a thought.

Here's another big bear hug and I hope you have had a great time in Vegas. ((((Altair))))

[Altair]

AP- because "I" spin so rapidly, my poles are flattened a bit. Figure that one out.
It is a good point about communication forms- and one I haven't resolved at all. Texts, which every one seems to do here with varying degrees of success, turned out to be a disaster. H would misinterpret, see spew and sarcasm where there was none, he also hated emails for some reason. My emails were apparently too long because of my attempts to make sure they were clear-- oh I stopped that at DB pretty much. So I am trying phone calls (well, maybe 6 total in the last seven months if that).
Maybe postal mail is the next shot.
And-perhaps- it doesn't make a difference.
He wants space so desperately that any contact has to be short and to the point. From now on I will revert back to short emails or texts though. (and of course there's the lack of replies, so that is changing my ways)

Trying to be more clear on the phone didn't help. I mean I knew this going in (and read about it here like 6000 times) that he's right where we were in May, with the May-me that he is super mad at for... hmm... causing his depression among many other horrible things I had done for the past five years. Yes, I think that was May.
I can understand lack of time in one place and not in another-- heck, the Altair that we see happened what, 16,000 years ago?

Vegas was fun, in an overstimulating way. Talked to lots of strangers at the tables, just was a basic stranger myself. Observed a LOT of couples holding hands of all ages shapes and sizes. Had a long conversation with a group about how terrified we were about Carrie Fisher's condition-- then, the next morning the tragic news.

So yeah-- new year's. No plans yet-- But I made it through the holidays in one piece so this is icing on the cake.

[d_Rose]

Hi Altair,

No wisdom to add, but am thinking about you and hoping for the best with your health issues. The not knowing is always hard by itself, let alone with the emotional upheaval that is the life of a new LBS. Big hugs to you.

Glad Vegas was at least sunny for you. I live in AZ, and we certainly were having a cold spell last week (50's and cloudy!) Glad to have it is back to 70's and sunny here. Hope wherever home is, it is sunny for you too. It so helps my mood and outlook on things.

Hope you come up with some fun or just relaxing plans for New Years.

[Altair]

Thanks rose!
I appreciate the kind thoughts. No news right now, so just plugging away at work...

[Altair]

OK, 2017 here I come...

I GALed! I GALed and not-Galed. Bailed on two invites yesterday because I felt a bit socially overwhelmed but I found out a person in my group has actually only been here like a year before me so I asked what he and his partner were doing tonight. A group of us are going to have dinner and play board games (and I will leave before 12 to avoid all the drunk drivers).

So yeah, no romantic NYE kiss, but maybe I can feel the pleasure of winning a board game. Or not. These guys are whip-smart and I'm a bit afraid.
As far as NY resolutions, not sure! Just to keep on keeping on being the best and brightest star I can. Here we go!

[job]

Go and have some fun! Be careful...there will be plenty of drunk drivers out there tonight.

I think you've got your NY resolutions already, i.e., just keep on keeping on and being the best and brightest star out there!

Happy New Year!

[Altair]

Happy new year all and job!
I plan to leave around tenish. I don't have to go far, I hope that will be a good time to drive.

[AndrewP]

Enjoy your evening Altair. I'm glad you are not alone and don't under-estimate your skills with board games. I have a roast pork loin almost ready for dinner and it will be just me and the cats tonight. I will miss not watching Dick Clark's "Rockin New Years Eve" which has been a tradition for W and I for many many years. I'd thought about going to visit old friends in Toronto reviving some traditions and making new ones but they don't know that W and I are apart and this wouldn't be the right time to spring that on them.

A dear friend and I are exchanging text messages and pictures of our cats. I told her that my resolution for tonight was not to text W - fingers crossed. An update perhaps in the morning. There are some things I'm trying to work through that I may be consulting the hive-mind about.

Drive safely and have fun.

[Altair]

AP,
post here instead of texting! this seems like an evening for us to ignore them. Speaking of- MIL just texted me a happy new year.
I've spent a bunch of the last ones with her so that's not surprising to get a text.
Maybe I'll ignore it and text her the same as part of the "mysterious package".
Journaling:
Let's see if I can put together some thoughts.
Haven't articulated this yet, but have been thinking. OK, so my H left me, and in the process blamed me for everything. Said he wasn't happy for years. I have done a lot of processing of his words/actions. In my first M breakup, I never acted this way, said any of these things. It's not OK. We can blame MLC/depression, that's fine. But if he is to contact me, this would have to be dealt with at some point. I was abandoned and have rebuilt my life. There'd have to be evidence of dealing with the depression, remorse, what have you. Re-re-invention of history. I can't just openly accept back someone with open arms who treated me like dirt, and threw me in the garbage. I don't know what I will do if he contacts me. At first, I'll just see what he has to say. If its a matter of Plan A didn't work out, and now he's back to me, plan B, no, I won't do it. I've gone on too far down the path of recovery.
If he contacts me and tells me he's with someone, I think I won't stand any longer. I will give up.
If he doesn't contact me for X more number of months, same thing, I think I will email him and ask him to file. We have no children together, so there's no family to break up. Who knows what I will do. We shall see. The holidays were perhaps a wake up call that I should move on fully into my new life. Here I come 2017.

[Altair]

correction: I'll ignore MIL text and text her tomorrow.

[AndrewP]

Altair - Are you sure we're not brother and sister?

I'm struggling in similar but different ways. I'm trying to decide what to write on my own thread.

Unlike me, you don't tend to write much about your H - perhaps because you have so little visibility into what is going on in his "Planet of the Fairies". You've set a pretty high threshold for him to cross to get back with you. From the little I know about him I personally think it unlikely that he would be able to leap that high. From what I've read the person who could attempt to come back will not have fully dealt with their issues either and would require a lot of care and patience before they could be considered "whole" again.

I don't have any advice for you except on one point. Don't put your future into his hands. If you decide you want to file, you do it. Don't rely on him to do any heavy lifting. Why should he? Study up on what is required, do your preparation and then present him with a fait accompli. YOU control the situation and YOUR future. If he can't bear the shine, he needs to get out of the d@mned sky.

The other piece of advice was given to me by Jack_Three_Beans and I believe eric a long time ago. Don't put a particular date on it. You'll spend all your time watching the clock and building stress as the minutes and hours of your life tick by. IF you decide you are done, you will know it in your heart and in your soul and can move on with no regrets. Until then, you are not done.

It sounds like you're getting ready for a great 2017 and will shine brightly my friend.

[Altair]

I do tend to write little of H now because anything would be some serious mind-reading. I have such a tiny bit of info to go on, that it is meaningless, really. One thing that bothers me the most is that H said he and his therapist thought he should go NC for awhile. I've read about this online, I've read on it here- most often it is the LBS who does it for their own sake, or a counselor plans it out for the couple. I've not seen my case, where, there was no end put on it, no reasons, presumed blame on my part (as if I were some impediment to his progress to health which is doubtful, as we didn't see each other/hardly spoke anyway).
Which is exactly how our "separation" went. "We are separated" to me implies a mutual decision on both parties. I never agreed to anything, no terms were made, no nothing. Not only did I not 'agree' to anything I was completely left in the dark as to when/why/how it happened. Of course he will claim otherwise and tell you why he left.
This is the opposite of cake eating. The cake sat on the counter, untouched.
So back to what you said about filing AP. Many months ago, I told H that this wasn't acceptable, and the response was give me space or file or tell me to file and i will. So if (and there's no date on this) I decide to do this, i will choose door #3. I will make him fill out the paper work. (TBC)

[Altair]

And I will ask him to file for a few reasons- paperwork is a bit of a pain, but not too much as it's essentially a done deal (another reason to file, I guess)
Another reason is money. He is an MLCer and hasn't done anything crazy with finances, but after a certain point I don't want to take that chance.

[job]

Altair,

How are you doing? I do understand how you feel about asking him to file the paperwork. I would like to just caution you on this, many times, when we ask them to file or they go off and file quickly, they do tend to drag their heels after starting the process. In some cases, they don't respond to the requests of the lawyers for certain documentation, etc., which means that for every phone call, letter, email, text etc. that the lawyers use to negotiate the case, the bill continues to go up and up. I just hope and pray that if and when you ask him to file, he will do the right thing and not drag this out for you and your wallet.

I am keeping you in my thoughts and prayers and hope that you get some good news concerning your health in the next few days.

[Altair]

Hi Job,
thank you for asking about me. My health is maybe ok, who knows. More tests are needed, I have all the referrals to specialists I need, this will take time. But apparently there is no rush, so I have lots of stuff to do in the months ahead.

Re, filling. Our assets have already been divided and decided upon. We would file the paperwork ourselves (well, one person has to do it and the other signs it then the judge then done) We can even waive papers being served and have them come in the mail. We are splitting everything basically in half, as we came into the M, in our discussion about it ages ago there was virtually no difference in our mindsets. I cannot see how this would change at present.
So, if he did file and didn't follow through or any other permutation, we'd only be out a few hundred bucks.
But, this is the kind of thing I would think you wouldn't want to drag on for years and years.

[Altair]

Journaling
Not doing so well today. I think in part my stomach is killing me and that is affecting focus and thoughts. I'm also at a conference which is never easy. I'm just...drained. I have never found joy in my work like others might do i think-- it's just a means to an end. I'm very good at it. But at the end of the day, cooking, socializing, family, parties, holidays, you name it were always my highlights. Definitely not work success. Now, pretty much all I have is work success. I lost my H, my/his family, my favorite rituals/ pretty much everything, but oh aren't I a success at work! UGH, so what. It's a paycheck. I know I will rebuild. I think I expended a lot of emotional energy to get through the holidays unscathed and now I am feeling the numbness. I'm at this conference and a lot of nice interesting people are here and it takes everything to leave my hotel room. I feel old and uninspired. I don't envy the young ones though. Argh this is turning out to be a depressing post and I'm not even anywhere snowy and gloomy. The new years blues.
Maybe someday this will be a paean to NC Dbing in some way for some future me to find his or her life. I'd like that. For now, my life is heII. It'll get better, in its own way, I know. I spend way too much time in my head.
Ciluzen I got a chance to read your whole thread. You did great, and are doing great (should you see this). I could see me headed down the same path of never trying, no counseling, just the end. that is what is happening for me as well. You were a great help to see that possibility and how I can prepare for it. I am very grateful for your story of DBing in the face of never working on the M.
love to all
your favorite star

[Pax_luv]

Hi Altair,
I'm sorry that you aren't feeling so great today. It doesn't help that you are in an environment that requires a lot of socialization and are generally just draining.

I'm just popping in to say, I feel ya sista. You know you will get better in time and you know that you are changing and learning, but it certainly is painful. I also know just how hard it is to keep up the brave face for the holidays.... And now just feel deflated. Emotional stress is no joke!

I hope you able to re-energize soon and your stomach feels better. Maybe there will be a silver lining to being at the conference.


Take care... I'll be thinking of you.

[AndrewP]

Altair - I "am" somewhere snowy and gloomy and we I think are at similar stages in so very many ways. Being around people and having to force yourself out of your nest is both difficult but also good for us. I too am feeling blue, trapped and stuck.

I also am very good at what I do professionally and derive a certain level of satisfaction out of it. One difference is that the hours and hours of driving, the long hours, holding myself back from more creative outlets were in a large part to provide for my family. Now they're all gone and it's just me and the cats. I haven't seen D24 since November 2015. Spending time with my family doing "stuff" was always the shine that made it all worthwhile.

One thing that I decided to do at the outset and I believe that W has as well is to find one piece of joy in my day. Today I had a nice breakfast that I made, the roses on my desk and bedside table are opening nicely and I gave one of the cats a nice belly rub. Right now I'm looking out of my home office window and seeing a pretty snowfall knowing that I am safe and secure in my home writing to a good friend and trying to cheer her up. What joy have you found today?

When a star passes through a dust cloud it's shine is dimmed. But it picks up stray elements and can shine all the brighter.

(((Altair)))

[Altair]

When stars are about to die they turn into supernovae and are at their extreme brightest (sorry, sorry, I'll be positive)

Eh, this is probably a natural January lull. I watched workmen move all of the Christmas decorations out of the hotel yesterday, it was kind of funny to see a parade of snowmen and giant nutcrackers exiting the lobby on dollies.
I also think this is a time for H to throw in the towel. You know, wait until the holidays are over then quit this M. I am steeling myself for it. (It's also hugely statistically a THING). My IC says I should live in the present. I've always mentally prepared myself for various outcomes- which seems contradictory to her advice. I'm mulling it over. I find that if I have thought about a possible outcome, I am better able to respond to it should it come to pass. Which, of course, she is trying to steer me away from. I'm willing to try, but I'm pretty entrenched here!
I'll have to clarify what she means tomorrow.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, sorry you are feeling rubbish at the moment. Not good when you have to force yourself to smile with strangers coupled with not feeling to well either. I do hope your health improves soon.

You say that that this time of the year may cause your H to throw in the towel but do you think that is you projecting your feelings on to him? Are you feeling like throwing in the towel but you are conflicted with your need to stand for your marriage as well? I know the feeling!

To be honest with you I consider throwing in the towel about 100 times a day but I think it's all part and parcel of our journey. Prior to writing this I was blubbering good and proper after reading a motivational quote on Pintrest and thought that's it I can't do this anymore I'm going to text H and tell him where to stick it! But then i calmed down and saved some nice recipes instead.

I've realised that I am a very impulsive person and I've had to learn to stop myself from reacting when I think H is thinking something. You don't know what he is thinking Altair so setting yourself up for another BD is only gonna make you ill especially with your current medical worries. Your IC is right, live in the present because the future is unknown even to your H. Don't give him that power. Now I think I need to take my in advice!

Let's take a walk down to the banks of the Rubucon and meet AP and the others for a nice Limoncello. (((Altair))).

[Altair]

LOL- Limoncello! I'm there.
yeah, me and you, all over the place. I am feeling like no talking about R since June, no contact save a few messages since october, well it's kind of doomsday for me and crazy. Just end it already I think. Why would you need to "process" for over six months (when he already was deep in MLC with EA last year?
Just a time thing really. Like why? Why drag this out and not talk to me I feel like I am back in high school the girl that wouldn't talk to me for a year. It terrifies me and also make me want to DO SOMETHING about it. Why ignore me? What did I do? We never fought (I know this is indicative of other problems) Anyway. tired of being in this. hugs coly!

[Altair]

Hello everyone.
Totally forgot-- ages ago I corresponded with a work-person I'd never met, in another state. He saw me at a meeting, followed me out, thought I was leaving but I was just going to the bathroom, introduced himself.
I think he likes me or minimally finds me attractive. Sigh, another young'un, maybe 35? Although, these 50+ MLCers can act 13, so maybe age is but a number.
Anyway, I barely know him and said yes to a coffee or wine in a few minutes. I don't lead people on and am not a flirtatious person, but this tiny smidgen of male attention might be nice. No word from H, on that front. And, after our meeting (which my boss actually wants me to network with him, so in fact this has to be professional anyway) I'm going to go crash and get up at the crack of dawn. Eh, stretching my wings a bit. I don't need massive ego-stroking, but I swear, just someone being nice to me at this point gets me all teary-eyed. It's been a rough half-a-year for sure. It can only get better. Right? Right??

[Altair]

Also I'm in IT, so it seems like at least 3/4 male at this conference. Maybe more. I call it the sausage fest (not in a derogatory way, just a way). There was a sign reminding people not to harass the women, and be respectful. The new world we live in. I was kind of chuckling, now that I feel invisible anyway, just kind of thinking, you can talk with me, just don't harass me, right? I don't want to be a sexless machine in my life, a genderless robot-- oh wait I already am! It does seem many men are afraid of approaching me period-- I think that has gotten worse in the last few years. Either because I am old or policies or both, who knows. Since my life is my job, well, life is boring, that's for sure. Well, this year I didn't really present or do anything interesting so no one has any reason to randomly come up to me anyway. Anyway, I'm really lonely, but I can resign myself to it. Trying to have a good time in spite of things.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, I'm glad you said yes to a drink/coffee with that work guy. It's good to keep your hand in with a bit of flirting!

With the whole male attention thing, I'm in the same boat as you in that I don't really get any at all! When I'm out with D she literally gets double takes which is quite funny to see and also makes me proud! To be honest with you I'm not bothered really and I'm not just saying that because I don't get any attention, I really dont need that complicating my life at the moment.

I'm not really sure what to think of your H. I know you commented in a previous post that you didn't know of any other sitch where the IC suggested to the WAS to go NC with the LBS, however I just remembered that this happened to Pinn. His W said it was suggested to her so she did not give Pinn any false hope however it made her mad that Pinn had also gone NC so it was a bit of a stalemate. In the end Pinn's wife started behaving like the LBS!

I must admit I get very confused with going dark and NC. If you feel it is benefiting you then that's a good thing however if it's driving you nuts like it did for me then how is that of benefit? When I read some of the really old threads the thinking on NC and gong dark is that it isn't supposed to be forever and at some point you can start turning up the dimmer switch to bring them into the light. I think at this stage in the game you've got to do what is right for you Altair and if you feel compelled to DO SOMETHING then maybe you should...

Have you got any GAL activities lined up for this weekend?

[Altair]

Coly,
We did speak for a hot minute about my health, breaking NC. Recall, I am not doing NC! H is. He doesn't want to talk to me. My only recourse is D, according to him, in that he needs space. He won't respond to a text. H said he wanted more space "for a little more"-- where I am at. What do i do if someone asks for a little more space?
Is DO SOMETHING DO NOTHING? maybe.
Re, coffee date.
Oh god he was lovely. handsome, smart, married with 2 year old. I immediately turned off all signals (he mentioned his wife within like 5 minutes, good married man) He's great! I can be his friend and collaborate, easy peasy. (goes off into corner cries over H)

[AndrewP]

Altair - There's room over at the cafe if you like. We can cry on each other's shoulders.

It's funny that you wrote about men being afraid to approach you, I just wrote the same thing in the opposite direction on my own thread. Perhaps us "propeller heads" are too much for them ?

I'm glad that the gent you visited with was open and honest about his marriage and that he wanted to visit with you because he liked and respected you. You are a good person with a dry wit and a depth of heart and personality that will take a special person to appreciate. I encourage you to mingle more at the conference, sparkle like the star that you are, look people in the eyes and not at their ring fingers. Be you. You are indeed the best at that.

(((Altair)))

[Altair]

Back from conference. Glad I went. Turned on heat, looking at mound of laundry. I remember this one conference I went to, like a year ago, so I'd already moved here and H and I were dealing with being apart, and he called me a bunch and was irritated that I couldn't find time to talk to him. I remember apologizing and said I had to go out for drinks with this one group, I called him when I got back to the hotel but he didn't want to talk then. I remember thinking he was being kind of a baby about it- not understanding that the whole thing is massive amounts of work-- I wondered if he was jealous but I didn't pick up on any jealousy. He said I'm really missing you and I don't like that we don't live together now. I felt sad and talked about when we'd see each other again. I think that is, to the week, when his EA started (well, if you look at when they started texting it was like 3 days after that conference). After that he never seemed to care about my conferencing and travel. It was weird, over those next few months he pulled way back and of course, I started pursuing. It is so confusing. I feel sometimes he's just mad at me and not speaking to me for 3 months is just punishment. Or that was some entering of MLC/depression back then. There are a lot of 'what ifs', but I do think the depression was inevitable. Had we been together I guess it might have manifested itself differently, I don't know. I remember thinking 'ok it'll be just 9 months of being apart then we'll be together again. And then it all blew up.

[Coly23]

Hey Altair, shame about your friend being married but glad you know this fact and he made it clear to you!

About your H and the NC thing, yes I remember now that he is doing NC but I guess it is also for you because he isn't in a good place at the moment as you have experienced when you met on occasion. However, if you think about it all our WS's are asking for space and to a degree NC, your H has just asked for it in a more direct way. Does that mean you change what you are doing? I don't think so but you have to make that decision because it's your pain, your life that you have to live in limbo everyday.

Whether you decide to initiate D or continue to stand giving your H the space he has asked for we are here to support you. X

[job]

Coly's advice is spot on. If he wants space and time, then give it to him. While he's gone, continue working on you and focusing on your health.

You will know when you've had enough, i.e., it will be like a light switch that goes off. Whether you opt for filing for divorce or wish to continue leaving the door ajar and moving forward w/your life, we are here to support you.

[Altair]

Good point Coly.
Perhaps the several-month checkin was helpful for me to see his not-good state. Now, with months having gone by, the darkness of limbo intensifies. His (non)actions don't change what I am doing. If I had my way, right now, I'd like to see him occasionally, which is what I proposed way back when, and he agreed. then said no, his therapist said we should not see each other (I love how he put it on her). Ah, well. Sunday.
(room in your suitcase for Spain for little ole me?)

[job]

New Thread:

losing my religion