D and MLC

[HaWho]

Ciluzen - sorry you had a rough trip down memory lane. We all know that feeling.

Yes, none of us are without fault when it comes to our marriages. But once depression is in the mix, perception is completely skewed. You can't really "work" with someone who is depressed. And if it's MLC to boot, the LBS spouse (most likely) has the bullseye on his/her forehead.

And I am sorry, but there is an element of the ridiculous when it comes to many of the gripes the MLCer voices about the spouse. I am not saying I did not make mistakes. I did. But many of the things I heard were so stupid that IF those were the causes of the breakdown of my marriage? Well, then it was about as mature a relationship as you'd find between middle schoolers. So, it should collapse.

In his irritability phase my h would get mad if I made him sunny side up eggs and the yolks didn't hold! Another time he got upset because I was printing too many things off our home printer. To hear him tell it, you'd think I was in the home office trying to print the whole internet!

My point? I am guessing from your sitch that you had garden variety marital problems. And with a non-depressed person you'd have a willing and able partner. But with a depressed partner? NO amount of reasoning, begging, pleading can help someone until he/she is ready. The skewed perception is just too real to them.

Don't to be this hard on yourself.

[bttrfly]

honey, {{{{{{ hugs }}}}}}

yeah, i get it. and yes, it does take two. but remember that hindsight is 20/20. truth is, at least in my case, i've come to believe that his MLC was inevitable, because he didn't deal with his horrific childhood and so any relationship was doomed. not saying i'm without blame. so i get what you're saying here C but the truth is that he's on a journey that he has to take alone in order to heal and all you can do is pray and send unconditional love his way. You, too, are on a journey. YOu're doing so well! Please take a deep breath and give yourself a bit of a break here. xoxoxoxo

[ciluzen]

Thank you, every one of you. I am really grateful for the support of you all on these boards; people going through the same thing who understand the idea of standing.

I am getting better every day and people IRL are so happy I'm "over him" and happy, back to being someone they don't have to worry about anymore. But, I can't really tell them that I still have down days when I miss him or suddenly remember something that sets me on a different emotional path. Most people I know now and consider close friends never knew him, or only spoke to him a few times. They only know him from the pain he caused during our separation. They never saw the pain I saw on his face before and during this ordeal, and they dismiss it as nothing when I try to tell them.

If I speak of him in any way, mention a fond memory or funny thing he once said, they immediately tense up and the shield goes up. Like I'm the crazy person who suddenly turns to address an imaginary friend when they thought I was sane again. Even my daughters get very emotionally closed if I mention something involving him. They will even catch themselves mentioning something he said or did, then they shut themselves down, as they realize they are bringing him up to me. Our family dynamic is so blown.

No one IRL understands that I was with him for 27 years of my 49 year old life. Sure, he has been the source of my most painful memories in the past few years, but most of my happiest most cherished memories involved him, too. I can't erase that. And, I don't want to.

So, thank you to all of of you who are here that understand how hard this journey can be, even as it gets better. Letting go is not just a one time decision, and having that tiny seed of hope that someday they will come out of MLC or depression will probably always be there for me; for his sake as much as for me. I loved him before and I love him still; I just love him enough to try so hard to leave him alone. And I'm learning to love me enough to try to make my life my own.

[Esame]

Ciluzen I'm sending you loads of (((((((hugs))))))) and kisses. And strength!

I'm so sorry you are going through this painful and hard journey, I wish I knew what to say to help. I think no matter how well you are coping, or how fast you move on, there will always be days that you need to grieve. How could you just erase 27 years? It is impossible. How can you forget about the dreams you had for growing old together? It is simply unrealistic to expect that you could do anything different than what you are doing. You are a kind and caring person, and you have helped me a lot with my situation, thank you for that. I really hope that the support you get here will be enough to get you through these dark times.

[JellyB]

Hi Cil,

I want to share a personal conversation I had with the new man in my life. He is a good honest person, who a had lengthy marriage which ended in divorce due to an affair on his ex's behalf. She came up in conversation this week between my lovely man and I. And the conversation turned to when they have positive interactions he is always hit with the "wow, how did we get here"- he struggles with the familiarity and good feelings, it makes no sense to him. Interactions with her trigger all of the emotions for him, from deep love to a deep sense of betrayal. And I get it. He finds it hard to understand that I get his deep sense of love for her, even though the marriage is over and he loves me. He feels like he is betraying me and our love, by still feeling in a small part in himself a love for her. But as I explained to him, he never fell out of love with his friend, wife and mother of his children. He still has love for that person, the person with whom he shared a life time. He loves the friend, wife and mother of his children, like a man who grieves for a partner who died suddenly. People in our community do not ask grieving widows and widowers to forget a lifetime of love and life and move forward. I have no expectations that my lovely man would not still love his wife in some way now and into the future. You likely think I'm strange and odd to feel this way, but I think it is realistic way to view the value of a relationship that saw two people grow and mature over a lifetime. My lovely man's wife may not have respected what that means, but I do, I do for him, because he needs me to understand and respect that. You can love your H and stand for your marriage as long as you need to, and if at some point your life introduces you to another man, another love, please know, you don't have to give up one for the other. You just need to hold them with equal respect.

I'm not sure if this was helpful. I still read your thread Cil. You are an amazing woman and you ARE your best version of yourself right now, keep going.

Lots of love

JellyBxxx


New Thread:

The high road: rocky with a great view

[melweb]

Hi Cil--long time, no talk. Just trying to catch up with you. I have missed reading your posts for sure. You "sound" really pulled together --on the outside-- but I know you are dying of hurt on the inside.

My sitch has ended up different than yours (so far) so I guess I am not in a really good place to be giving you advice, but man, did JellyB nail it!! I would just add that "everything happens for a reason." And believe me, I hate when people say that to me!! But as I look at my own sitch, we moved 1500 miles from home for a better life, finances etc and yet it all came crumbling down, only to end up back here and working on saving our M. Sometimes it has to fall apart, before it can come together.

[ciluzen]

JellyB, that post was beautiful and gave me a lot to think about. I have missed you and your humor and soul, but it looks like you've been busy. You seem to be in a very good place and I hope to be able to get to that level at some point; I really do.

Esame, hugs back to you and I will use that strength. I do tend to share much more here, as you all get it. Most of my friends IRL, though proving to be amazing friends, have a hard time understanding MLC and my inability to trash my STBX (I can hardly write that).

Mel, you're right. Everything does happen for a reason. I needed my eyes opened to what I was giving up by not being true to myself. What I was settling for. I'm finally figuring out day by day who I am and what I want. I think that is a big part of this trip; you get a second chance at being a whole person on your own instead of "the better half".

I had started a painting last year...well over a year ago, I guess. It was going to be a picture of my H as seen from behind, skiing down a hill with my girls; bright colored ski clothes on white snow with blue sky above. It was a large canvas and I had flanked the ski run with winter-bare aspen trees and beyond those on each side, evergreen forests off into the distance. H had expressed excitement about it...even told me where he wanted to hang it in his office. I changed it recently, though. Instead of my family, I started filling the painting with ravens picking through cardboard boxes and flying away with various items, memories and mementos of my life with H. In the foreground and off to the left is one large bird, mostly just his head visible, holding my wedding band and engagement ring in his beak. Its not done yet. I'm taking my time with it.

By the way, I have a weird obsession with ravens. I collect art and trinkets with their images. My studio was named "Ravenview" after the gatherings that would often occur in the fields in front of my house. But it wasn't until recently that I found out that they are a symbol of change. I like the thought of that. With further research I found that, depending on the culture, they are also messengers, prophets, and totems of confronting fears, symbols of the souls of warriors, and Carl Jung thought they represented the dark side of the psyche, the keeper of secrets. Just realized that my "divorce painting" (my young art student's name for it) has a lot more depth to it than originally planned. And...I think I found my spirit animal.

[Altair]

Wow! You should look up ravens in Van Gogh's paintings (if you haven't already)

[Pax_luv]

Hi Ciluzen,
Just checking in on you. How are you doing? I totally get it if you don't have anything new to post... Just want you to know that we're thinking of you!

I hope you've been able to enjoy the weekend and Halloween. I think it's great that youve found your spirit animal. We have a great studio in my town where you can create your spirit totem and then make a wish on it everytime you walk by it and ring it's bell. It would be great to hang your art where you can make a wish or say a prayer... Or....some other ritual that only symbolizes good things.

Wishing you well!

[ciluzen]

Wow. I just looked at my calendar and realized that my final mediation was Sept 19 and the last time I saw H (and had a beer with him) was a week later...and here we are in November!

Thanks for stopping by, Altair. Yes, I do love Van Gogh's ravens in the wheat fields. Almost anything corvid related catches my eye!

Hey Feyth! That studio sounds very interesting and fun. I'm doing ok. As I said, I just realized how long its been since I've seen H. Its funny, I had a fun and full day on Saturday; went to a big ski shopping event (needed a helmet and a few other things) and then out to lunch for Indian food with a friend. We even drove around the areas I'll be house hunting in the spring. But most of the weekend I "holed up" to study. And so my mind started turning to H and the events around the issue...total cycling of anger and sadness. Sure makes concentrating difficult when you're mind constantly drifts that way. I think I need a rubber band...

Part of it was Halloween, my favorite holiday. Soooo many memories involving H and I; not just the fun stuff with my girls. In the past years, (about 15 of them!) we got together at friends' houses who lived in a neighborhood and had a big party so that all of the "country" kids could trick or treat or take turns handing out candy. Even last year after H had moved out, one of that social group (the only one I really spoke to because I bugged her about wanting to see her daughter's soccer games) brought up that it was at her house, so I went. It was awkward and H was there. He kept looking at me and periodically coming over to check on me (not many people knew he had moved out) but it was even more awkward because I realized that I had no real connection to these people I'd known for years; they were just people I did things with. No deeper connection. That was a real eye opener. So this year, I turned off the holiday in my head after work, but periodically fantasized about staying home next year to pass out candy (when I can be in a neighborhood in a house) because I haven't lived in town in 22 years! I also kept wondering if H was with the former social group celebrating...where is that darn rubber band?!

Anyway, I'm better again. I have a full weekend and a lot to do. I do need to work on exercising more. I have a little 5k for fun this weekend and ski season is looming, but I am NOT in shape! I need a routine.

I do want to post some thoughts on H later today to get them out...and then stop. The reason? The holidays are coming and I feel I need to put some of the things that cycle in my head down to put them to rest. Maybe to get feedback, reassurance, ...something. But later. Hope everyone makes a good day happen!