Confused on What to Do 3

[Eagle11]

Link to my previous thread.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2703199#Post2703199

Thanks everyone for the help and advice so far. I am trying to GAL. I am taking my S6 to a golf tournament this weekend. I have taken him in the past and he really enjoys it so I got us tickets to go. Also, I might be able to do the hike I had to put off last weekend this Sunday. I am also planning on getting up early to go to the gym tomorrow. I used to go 3 or 4 times a week, but for about the last month I have made it about once a week. The goal is to go Friday and possibly Sunday (might depend on the hike). Then starting on Monday I want to get back to going at least 3 times a week. I have the cub scouts with my S6 on Monday night as well.

I'm also going to take some more responsibility. My S6 parent teacher conferences are next week and usually my W would go and I would stay home with the kids. I am going to go this time. I figure since I am the one with my S the most I should be the one talking to his teacher about his development. He has been having some anxiety problems and I want to talk to his teacher about how he is doing.

[job]

Eagle,
You sound so strong today. I'm glad you are taking your S6 to the golf tournament. That will be so much fun for the both of you. Your GAL activities sound great!

I also like the fact that you are going to participate in the parent/teacher conferences. Definitely speak to his teacher about his anxiety issues. She needs to know this in order to better help him in the classroom.

[CT1118]

Eagle11 - Did that NMMNG book arrive yet? I was cyber stalking Eric's advice to you the entire time, so I found a free podcast of the book on the net.

I am 2+hours into it, which puts me around chapter 3. I will go back and read it, but, to quote my 21 year old niece, "OMFG"! Get the book to your house, put it into a blender, and then pour it into your brain.

I never thought I was a nice guy, and it was advice to you, but I spend a lot of time driving, so I thought why not listen to the podcast. Seems I did not know what a nice guy was or how they are made. Can't say all of is spot on for me, but enough to where I see that some of the things addressed I seem to have already begun to remove by instinct, but now I see with some focus there are other things. Many other things. Get reading, tell us what you think.

[Eagle11]

CT1118,

Booked arrived yesterday and I've got thru the first couple of chapters. I'm hoping to get thru a lot of it this weekend. From what I read so far I definitely have some nice guy traits. Will be interesting to read when I get into the advice or how to break these traits

[AndrewP]

I've read some interesting reviews about that book on GoodReads but not the book itself. Some of the reviewers don't seem to think much of the book based at least in part on their opinions on the author.

As they say - your mileage may vary.

[CT1118]

You ok Eagle?

[Eagle11]

You ok Eagle?

I'm doing good. Although there was a major slip up last Saturday. Wife and I kissed. She was drunk and I was maybe a little. We both apologized. The last 2 days were normal and it wasn't brought up. Everything has been cool with us for a while now but that kiss came out of nowhere.

The rest of the weekend was good. I took my S6 to the golf tournament and we had a great time on Saturday. On Sunday I got to the gym in the morning and took my son to driving range to practice golf. I think he was inspired by watching the pros on Saturday because he hasnt got his clubs out the closet in probably 2 months. Later Sunday got the sprinklers out for both kids and they played in them and them went and got dinner Sunday night.

Today I got up at 5:30 to go to gym and this evening my son and I went to his cub scout meeting. We had a lot of fun at the meeting and he is looking forward to a camping trip next month.

W is going out of town for the next 2 days so I am single dad again until Thursday afternoon but I don't mind it. I actually seem more relaxed and I seem to sleep better when W is out of town.

I've got through maybe half of No More Mr. Nice Guy and at first I didn't really think the book related to me that much but as I've gotten into some more recent chapters I see myself. I should be able to finish it in the next 2 days and can give a better report on the book.

[ericmsant2]

Eagle

I was away on vacation and did not have time to post, at least not what I am about to post now.

I asked you about how you planned to change the lack of confidence and your response was:

I honestly don't know the correct answer. I have to figure it out. I know I have been reading and learning from others on here. I have got books that were recommended to me. I am seeing a therapist. I have to figure out a plan and I have to do it soon. I have to become more decisive.

Today I want you to go look in the mirror. Stare at yourself for a while. Then start to say outloud. I am confident. I am confident. DO this as often as you can. You need to start changing how YOU feel about yourself. Reading is great, the IC is great…coming to the boards is great. Honestly though….it really is about CHOOSING to believe it and live it. That means, when you start to feel not confident that you change what you are thinking and replace it with…. I am confident, I am confident.

I have to get back to doing the things I enjoy doing. I need to do things for myself. My W has always felt I was selfish (and I was at times), so I have been reluctant to do things I used to always do. Even last weekend. I wanted to go on the hike but I couldn't do it because she had to work at the last minute.

1) She is texting 2 OM – F*ck what she thinks right now.
2) Taking time for yourself and doing things for YOU is not selfish. Period.
3) Believing someone who has asked to divorce you 3 times, is seeing 2 OM and expect you to be Mr. Mom all the time is NOT healthy.
4) Stop being reluctant and create a PLAN. For example, once every other Thursday (use whatever date works for you) COMMUNICATE to your W that you have plans to do something. She can either be home to watch the kids while you take a little time for yourself OR she can find a baby sitter. Stop enableing her behavior. Take time for you.
5) Next time you want to go on a hike, tell her that you have already made plans. You are not her on call day care provider.
6) Promise me that in the next 3 weeks that you will go play GOLF. With NO kids.

I asked you what the perfect life looked like to you. You responded.

My dreams were to get a good education (I did), find a great job that I loved doing (I didn't), find a woman to marry (I found 2 so far), have kids (I have 2), Own a nice house in a nice part of the country (I just bought a house in June). I wanted to be a great father (getting better) and a great husband (not so much).

This ^^^^^ sounds like a cookie cutter response. Think outside the box dude. Make it personal. Really what does this amazing life that you want really look like? Hell mine includes traveling every other month, Hanging out with my friends, large parties where I cook a huge pig, having dinner with my friends and family, spending time with my sons just shooting the chit over a beer, ATV rides on the beach, Horse back rides on the beach, porn star sex with my partner (you know the kinds that makes your head spin around like the excorsist). Be a bit specific man! Just imagine if the world was yours what would that life really look like?

She was such a free spirit and I wasn't. In many ways we were opposites. She says she is introverted but not like me. I loved her spontaneity and the fact the she seemed to be really enjoying life. She never complained and she was always there for me. Over the years that changed in her and I think it was more me changing her than her wanting to change. I think I became too negative and that really brought her down.

Reading this ^^^^ it seems like YOU FED OFF of her energy and did not create any yourself. Honestly, you sounded kind of boring. Maybe Eagle, it is time to stop DEPENDING on OTHERS and start to create the “enjoying life, free spirit and spontanetity” YOURSELF. Fun is attractive, full of life is attractive….become this person if that is what you like. And before you start with all sort of excuses…..the only excuse you have is REALLY – YOU.

I tried to talk her out wanting the house but her mind was set. From then on I started worrying about money. It was also the first time in our M that I felt I didn't have a say in a big decision. We were going to buy that house regardless of what I had to say. I actually spoke up back then, but was shot down and then just gave in to her.

You made a mistake – now it’s time to get over it. That said, it seems that this may have been a key shift in the R. I wonder did you ever voice FIRMLY your disagreement with certain positions/decisions after this? Eagle, IMHO, healthy R’s are ones where the power (decision making, etc.) shifts between both parties of an R. Any one side having all of the power is NOT healthy. Also, you are a man. Women, IMO, still look for a man that provides leadership. A man that will stick to his convictions. That is not to say…that men should be macho arseholes. No. However, large decisions such as purchasing a house should be agreed upon by BOTH people.

I can give up on the snooping. I need to give up on the snooping. My life would be so much better if I gave up on the snooping. If I could just forget my phone account password my life would be better. Letting her go completely is a hard one. I know I have to get to that point, but I'm not there yet.

First, that first part of the above is so freaking whishy washy. Dude, it very simple – stop SNOOPING. Stop making excuses for snooping. As for letting her go, you will be unable to UNTIL you become the man you want to be. You will be unable to until you face the fears you have. The status quo is easy. Change is hard. Either way – Eagle all of this is YOUR CHOICE. Stop with the excuses already.

I have been so hard on myself. I'm much harder on myself than I am my W through this. I just feel if I could have realized what I had become we wouldn't be in this sitch.

1) Her Life Crisis is NOT your fault. Stop blaming yourself.

2) Her issues are NOT your fault. Stop blaming yourself.

3) You are hard on yourself, IMO, because that is what YOU are used to. It is what you have learned to deal with challenges in your life. Remember this…..YOU are ONLY a ViCTIM if YOU CHOOSE to be.

4) Honestly, based on your story…and based on what you have written about your W – you would been here NO matter what YOU did/didn’t do. The key……is what are YOU really going to do NOW – with the TIME you have been given.

I know she has had her faults, but I keep thinking of things I didn't do to make the M work.

Ummm….join the rest of society brother. Most R’s have issues and usually it is the result of both sides. So….in time, you will begin to accept things that YOU could have done better and IF you do the work – those issues will get resolved.

This all came about when I found out about the pain she has been in with her dad and stepdad. She broke down and said she felt abandoned by them. She felt that everybody leaves her. This was also before OM2 came into the picture. I told her I wasn't mad and I wouldn't abandon her. She was going to therapy at the time, I naively thought she would try to work her issues out. The OM was "just a texting friend". A couple of weeks later there is another OM and I felt like an idiot. Now I feel since I told her I wouldn't abandon her then I won't. I know that is stupid, but that's what i did.

I’m all for supporting your W. I do not agree with throwing your self worth down the drain to do it. Your claims of “I will not abandon you”, while she has 2 OM is…..honestly……you showing HER that you do not value YOURSELF. It is unattractive. I am not saying that you should yell and scream at her. I am saying that if you have nothing nice to say – say nothing. Look man, she has issues….well she has a therapist she can see, she has 2 OM that she can talk to about it. YOU cannot FIX HER.

Let me repeat….

YOU cannot FIX HER.

She was pouring her heart out to me like she never had. I honestly thought this might have been a turning point, but I of course was wrong.

Einstein’s definition of insanity – “doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result”. Said another way – DB101 – Do what works. I could have told you that you were going to be wrong. You are doing the same thing. You are p*ssy footing around her. YOU are not showing strength of self respect. Eagle – it is time to do something different (more on this in a bit).

I asked you about WHO YOU wanted to be. Your response was…I need to figure it out. Dude, what is there to figure out…really man. Be f*cking honest with yourself.

A good friend of mine (I’ll refer to him as – Mach)….once asked me the same question and boy did I struggle – just like you are. What I learned was that when I really detached and stop chitting in my pants everytime my ex was around, when I stopped worrying about if I was going to be able to feed my kids, where I was going to live, the impact on my life….when I really stop worrying about (in part because really I could only control but so much)…..When I stopped worrying and really just allow myself to be….. ME

When I removed the mental barriers
When I got real with myself
Well them….I knew deep down what I wanted. It really was all the dreams I’ve had…

I wanted to be that was honorable, that was trustworthy, that was loving, that was kinds, that gave of himself with no expectation, I wanted to be a dad that I could be proud of, I wanted to stop being afraid, I wanted to NEVER lie to myself, I wanted to pick up the mirror every day…and commit to doing my best in life. When I became real….OMG – it all fell into place man.
You can do this man!

I also believe despite what people say children aren't always so resilient and will be fine. We can do our best to help them, but when they see their family get torn apart at such a young age it will have an effect on them.

Honestly….the kids are going to feel it – regardless of the outcome. I could tell you the fairy tale story (the one where everything goes back to normal the kids never even knew what happened) but that is not reality. What you can do, is YOUR best to shield them from this as much as possible. To create an enviornement where they can express how they feel to you, where they feel very comfortable talking to you about how they feel. That is all you can do. Well….there is one thing you can do…….. You can use them as an excuse. You can use them as an excuse to avoid GALing, to keep yourself stuck. As with everything – the choice is YOURS.
Eagle, I am going to close this post with what may not be a popular viewpoint.

You can continue to talk or you can begin to act. IMHO, it is time that you start ACTING. Let me expand.

Your W is seeing two OM, you are a stay a home dad that is worried about his future and what a D may look like. IMO, I would go see a lawyer. I would EDUCATE myself on what my rights are. If anything – it should but you to ease. Now I would not go and tell your W that you are doing this. This is for YOU.

Remember the journal I asked you to pick up? I woud like you to start journalling every day, what you do with thd kids, what time you feed them, etc. The journal should be kept somewhere that no one can find it.

I would start going out at least ONCE every two weeks. I don’t care if it is a drive….just get out. Period. No freaking excuses.

I would keep your conversations with your W to the bare minimum. No happy chatter, nada. When asked why you are quite – your canned response should be…nothing I have a lot on my mind. Keep her guessing dude.

Now…please….give some more thought to WHO you want to be and let me know who that guy is.

Peace,
Eric

[CT1118]

"My God, it's full of stars" Dr. David Bowman, 2001 A Space Odyssey.

[Eagle11]

Eric,

I hope you had a great vacation.

Today I want you to go look in the mirror. Stare at yourself for a while. Then start to say outloud. I am confident. I am confident. DO this as often as you can. You need to start changing how YOU feel about yourself. Reading is great, the IC is great…coming to the boards is great. Honestly though….it really is about CHOOSING to believe it and live it. That means, when you start to feel not confident that you change what you are thinking and replace it with…. I am confident, I am confident.

I will start doing this. I have some days that I feel confident and that I can do what I want. I have other days where I feel hopeless. I often have both feelings in the same day. Today I had the confident feeling most of the day. Then tonight my W called home to talk to the kids (she is out of town for work) and something seemed off with her. She was very short with me and rude, which is something she hasn't been lately. I made me wonder if something had went on tonight. It's stupid to think about this and I need to stop. I am letting her control my emotions. I need to stop that.

1) She is texting 2 OM – F*ck what she thinks right now.
2) Taking time for yourself and doing things for YOU is not selfish. Period.
3) Believing someone who has asked to divorce you 3 times, is seeing 2 OM and expect you to be Mr. Mom all the time is NOT healthy.
4) Stop being reluctant and create a PLAN. For example, once every other Thursday (use whatever date works for you) COMMUNICATE to your W that you have plans to do something. She can either be home to watch the kids while you take a little time for yourself OR she can find a baby sitter. Stop enableing her behavior. Take time for you.
5) Next time you want to go on a hike, tell her that you have already made plans. You are not her on call day care provider.
6) Promise me that in the next 3 weeks that you will go play GOLF. With NO kids.

1. That is the attitude I need to have all the time.
2. Thank you. I have been reading the No More Mr. Nice Guy book you recommended and this is brought up in the book. I am beginning to understand this concept.
3. You are correct. I really don't believe in her right now and I don't believe anything she says to me. I can't trust her. She is two different people. She is one person when she is at home, but as soon as she leaves she turns into someone else that can't be trusted.
4. I will do this. Even if its just to get out and drive or walk around. I need to have time for myself because I don't have any right now.
5. Done
6. Done

This ^^^^^ sounds like a cookie cutter response. Think outside the box dude. Make it personal. Really what does this amazing life that you want really look like? Hell mine includes traveling every other month, Hanging out with my friends, large parties where I cook a huge pig, having dinner with my friends and family, spending time with my sons just shooting the chit over a beer, ATV rides on the beach, Horse back rides on the beach, porn star sex with my partner (you know the kinds that makes your head spin around like the excorsist). Be a bit specific man! Just imagine if the world was yours what would that life really look like?

I see your point. I need to find out what I really want in life and it is something I am really struggling with.

Reading this ^^^^ it seems like YOU FED OFF of her energy and did not create any yourself. Honestly, you sounded kind of boring. Maybe Eagle, it is time to stop DEPENDING on OTHERS and start to create the “enjoying life, free spirit and spontanetity” YOURSELF. Fun is attractive, full of life is attractive….become this person if that is what you like. And before you start with all sort of excuses…..the only excuse you have is REALLY – YOU.

I did become boring. We both did. I might have started going thru the motions of life. I am not really sure. I know I was more fun to be around when we started out and something happened along the way. I know raising the kids took a lot of fun out of social life.

You made a mistake – now it’s time to get over it. That said, it seems that this may have been a key shift in the R. I wonder did you ever voice FIRMLY your disagreement with certain positions/decisions after this? Eagle, IMHO, healthy R’s are ones where the power (decision making, etc.) shifts between both parties of an R. Any one side having all of the power is NOT healthy. Also, you are a man. Women, IMO, still look for a man that provides leadership. A man that will stick to his convictions. That is not to say…that men should be macho arseholes. No. However, large decisions such as purchasing a house should be agreed upon by BOTH people.

I have thought about this and I feel it was either purchasing the house or her first EA that was a major turning point in our relationship. They were about 18 months apart. At some point around this time I became scared of losing her I feel. I was thinking about this today and trying to remember back to this time. I know I started resenting her a little when we bought the house. As far as I can remember it was the first big decision we made together as a married couple and she controlled the situation.

First, that first part of the above is so freaking whishy washy. Dude, it very simple – stop SNOOPING. Stop making excuses for snooping. As for letting her go, you will be unable to UNTIL you become the man you want to be. You will be unable to until you face the fears you have. The status quo is easy. Change is hard. Either way – Eagle all of this is YOUR CHOICE. Stop with the excuses already.

I have been beaten over the head with this by many on here. I need to stop. It is doing me no good and I know that.

1) Her Life Crisis is NOT your fault. Stop blaming yourself.

2) Her issues are NOT your fault. Stop blaming yourself.

3) You are hard on yourself, IMO, because that is what YOU are used to. It is what you have learned to deal with challenges in your life. Remember this…..YOU are ONLY a ViCTIM if YOU CHOOSE to be.

4) Honestly, based on your story…and based on what you have written about your W – you would been here NO matter what YOU did/didn’t do. The key……is what are YOU really going to do NOW – with the TIME you have been given.

1. I know it's not my fault. I have been having a hard time knowing I can't fix her problems though. I think I am a fixer. I am one who has attracted women with problems without realizing it. I think I read about this in the NMMNG book as well.
2. I know.
3. I understand where you are coming from. I believe what you are saying. I have always been hard on myself, that is what I do.
4. I have been thinking about this and I think you are right. I have actually thought this would come at some point. For a while now (before this sitch even started) I have almost anticipated something like this happening. I didn't know when, but I had a feeling in my gut. I kept getting a feeling we would stay together until the kids got older and then something would happen. Maybe I have be paranoid about this for a long time.

I’m all for supporting your W. I do not agree with throwing your self worth down the drain to do it. Your claims of “I will not abandon you”, while she has 2 OM is…..honestly……you showing HER that you do not value YOURSELF. It is unattractive. I am not saying that you should yell and scream at her. I am saying that if you have nothing nice to say – say nothing. Look man, she has issues….well she has a therapist she can see, she has 2 OM that she can talk to about it. YOU cannot FIX HER.

I wish I would have been on this board longer before I told her these things. I think in the back of my mind I thought maybe this would stop her EA, but all it did was let her think I didn't care. The NMMNG book is really helping to explain this to me. I wish I would have know about this book years ago. I lived my life in fear and dependent on my W.

Remember the journal I asked you to pick up? I woud like you to start journalling every day, what you do with thd kids, what time you feed them, etc. The journal should be kept somewhere that no one can find it.

I will start tomorrow.

I would start going out at least ONCE every two weeks. I don’t care if it is a drive….just get out. Period. No freaking excuses.

This I can and will do.

I would keep your conversations with your W to the bare minimum. No happy chatter, nada. When asked why you are quite – your canned response should be…nothing I have a lot on my mind. Keep her guessing dude.

Ok. I can do this. It will be hard, but I can do this. I know this is a major part of DBing and it's one of the things I have failed the most at.

Now…please….give some more thought to WHO you want to be and let me know who that guy is.

I will.

Thanks