I fully understand what you're saying, Sandi2. What I'm not sure about is the fact that my wife wanted a divorce and has prepared herself for one. As she put it, she expects me to want a divorce sooner or later given our circumstances.
I believe that a similar situation is layedoing out in DB...where you can state an ultimatum, but you'd better be prepared to follow through with it. I'm not sure that I am.
As far as the morals of the situation...that's exactly what is eating at me. I told my wife that my sister has the right to know. This is what scared her into offering to let my BIL know that I know what's been going on so he would end everything. She offered this to save my kid's relationships...and supposedly my sisters family. If it wasnt my wife involved with my BIL, I would lethink my sister know in a heartbeat.
M 17 years 3 kids EA start 2010 ILYBNILWY 1/2014 PA 1/2016 Bomb drop 2/2016 Renig on Bomb drop 4/2016 Living as roommates, EA continues
You are in a terrible predicament and I feel for you, I can't even imagine the struggle you are going through knowing what you know and having your sisters life so intractly intertwined.
I am going to come out and say what I think, because I think you may be looking for someone to shoot straight from the hip.
You SHOULD NOT allow your wife to vacation at your sisters house.
If you want to handle it as softly as possible, I would suggest telling your WW that she needs to cancel that trip, if she doesn't, call your bill and tell him he needs to cancel that trip, if neither of those options work, you need to call your sister and fill her in.
If you have any kind of good R with your sister, allowing your W to go there knowing what you know will ruin that, and no matter what, she will be your sister for life. Go down the line, set your boundaries, make sure your WW and your BIL know you will tell your sister if they don't cancel the trip, but DO NOT allow your wife to go on that trip without your sister knowing everything. I don't think you'll be able to forgive yourself, or your sister will ever forgive you, if it goes any other way.
I would put my sister before my W every time in your scenario.
M - 9 1/2 years 5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA 10/31/16 - We sold house 01/10/18 - D Finalized
... I would put my sister before my W every time in your scenario.
I would agree with this every day and twice on Sundays. It's a no brainer in IMO.
M 55 W 52 MR 32 T 34+ D29 BD May 8, 2016 - She moved out ILYBNILWY May 15 (Through email) No EA/PA August 23 - DB used against me in every way Divorce July 18, 2017 - Life is getting better every day
This says a lot. It is your w and bil that are hurting the relationships in the family, not you. If my brother knew that his W was having an EA with my H I would hope that he would tell me.
Quote:
so he would end everything
WHAT???? If she was really worried about any of this she would end it. You really need to stop letting her control this situation and stop rationalizing any of what she is saying.
I get you don't want a D, I know I have walked on eggshells to not upset H but this is at a whole new level. Trust me, living the way you are living is not going to make you happy. Ultimately it is your decision on how to handle the A, but the truth always comes out and eventually the family will be hurt regardless.
Tough situation. Take how to handle the EA out of the picture and you still need focus on you and GAL.
Me-44 (45) H- 50 (51) M-'96
S-18(20)D-15(17)D-12(14)
BD Feb 2014 (he works overseas) home Oct(sep rooms) (EAs possible Pa's unconfirmed) insists wants D through July 2015 no more talk of D since
Thanks everyone for the outside views and advice so far. You are all making me feel a little less like I'm crazy.
So, I've been thinking things over quite a bit as expected and a couple glimmers of hope have stood out to me. The first is that my W approached me yesterday and told me she did not have a physical affair at all. I suspect she is lying because the first time I called her out on it, she didn't deny it. This is important because if she truly did not want to reconcile, she would have no reason to try to ease my mind. The flip side of that is she's trying to make herself feel better about the affairs because she feels guilt. Either scenario is progress, I think.
For the second thing, I will give a short background...The guy she had a PA with owns an exotic pet store. My kids wanted pets and ended up getting snakes of all things from his shop. Yesterday, I told my wife that I don't like the snakes around because they are a constant reminder of him. She apologized saying that she would have gotten rid of them but the kids are too attached now. Again, she's showing a hint of both remorse and compassion toward me.
...or maybe I'm just reading into things...
M 17 years 3 kids EA start 2010 ILYBNILWY 1/2014 PA 1/2016 Bomb drop 2/2016 Renig on Bomb drop 4/2016 Living as roommates, EA continues
The sister situation is tough. My reason is I feel my sister should know, but it will leave mass destruction in its wake. I agree that I should put my sister first in this situation, but I'm not clear as to whether that means telling her or not intervening.
The situation with my wife travelling to visit relatives has a long history...One of the complaints I've had with my wife is that she always made time for everyone but me. She would travel out of town so often with the kids that I just couldn't go every time if I wanted to get anything done around the house. We literally always have bags in our dining room from her last trip...she usually empties them only to pack for the next trip. Yet, she could never have the time to relax with me or go out on a date. I called her out on this time and time again but she always had some excuse. Now, I know she was purposely excluding me from her life she was building on her own. Yesterday, she told me that she is not comfortable with me around on trips. Several months ago, we dropped the kids off at Sunday school and had half an hour before church. She proceeded to chew me out for smothering her by attending church with her and accompanying her on trips out of town. It really caught me off guard. The DB coach suggested I back off a bit, so I have.
The difficulty I have now with our relationship is that I don't know if I should be doing 180s, GAL, or going dark. Going dark and GAL might snap her back to reality a bit when she realizes how much she still interacts with me and likes having me around. It almost seems like that should be the start followed by 180s once she's on boardm with rebuilding our relationship.
M 17 years 3 kids EA start 2010 ILYBNILWY 1/2014 PA 1/2016 Bomb drop 2/2016 Renig on Bomb drop 4/2016 Living as roommates, EA continues
Going dark and GAL might snap her back to reality a bit when she realizes how much she still interacts with me and likes having me around. It almost seems like that should be the start followed by 180s once she's on boardm with rebuilding our relationship.
Dude, you GAL, 180, and go dark for you. Its not going to snap her back into "reality". I struggled with this atfirst and my sich is similar to yours in that the W says shes sticking around just for our son.
Like you i did everything at first to "fix" the marriage. Now i do it to stay sane, be happy with myself, be my own man etc. If that attracts my W back to me at the end of the day then okay but thats not the goal. In others words im taking my balls back and being the man.
As for your sister situation, i dont envy you or have any wisdom to give cause im kinda new here too. I must say you are exceptionally patient with all her affairs, i'd be a seething volcano, an angel of retribution. I'd probably kick her out the house and call the sister. But hey thats me.
Me31 W31 M11yrs S6yrs 23Mar16-BD 9Apr16-W admitted EA w boss. 27Jun16-W Changed job and promised NC w OM. 14Jul16-Continued contact w OM.Start of Separation. 24May17-Divorced.
Tate, stop warning your WW about telling your sister the truth. That is you trying to control your W. It makes you appear as a wimp. What if you knew that your WW would stay in the M? Would that prevent you from telling your sister the truth about her H?
You do not giving a warning of what you are thinking of doing. This is not how a DBer works. You keep your thoughts from your WW. The only place to express them is here on the board.
The M you thought you had is over. Your WW admitted to faking it. She speaks out of both sides of her mouth, which can be seen in your own posts. The last thing on her mind, at the moment, is being with you. She is using the kids as her leverage. She is the only person she cares about the most.
Watch this and you will start to see it more clearly. The WW makes decisions based on what's in it for her. No matter how big or small, her mindset is all about herself. Her own selfishness motivates her thoughts and actions.
Right now, there is no way you can make her want to work on the MR. Nothing, unless she believes you are dumping her. And, she knows she has nothing to worry about, b/c Tate is concerned about looking like the bad guy.
The children and your need to look like the nice guy, are the two things she is counting on as her passport in continuing her lifestyle.
I realize you care for her. Usually, when a man finds out his W wants another man........his craving for her becomes more intent. Wanting something we can't have is common for humans. I don't know what you are considering to win back her heart. I suggest you focus on your character. What does your character say about Tate, the man? If your character says you are honorable, loyal, having high standards, etc...........then those characteristics need to shine. She has lost her moral code, apparently, so let your character shine out. Not as self-righteousness, but as a strong beam of light showing the pathway back into an honest relationship based on truth and love. She may bounce around like a crazy person, but you show strength by standing tall with long roots firmly planted, not wavering, and not pushed around.
While you are away on your trip, I hope you can use time to think about who you really are and what you want your children to be when they grow up. Think about your values and what you must have in your life. Think about what you will not tolerate in your personal relationships. Begin to think on your personal boundaries. Everyone has certain boundaries, whether they ever state it or not. Sometimes, we need to consider what we would if those boundaries were dishonored. Would we react? How would we react?
Finding yourself in a M where boundaries are not honored, must be devasting. In your situation, there are so many people to consider, and you may be feeling the heavy weight of a decision to make. Most people here can identify with your pain and the weight on your shoulders right now.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Sandi2, you're absolutely correct in that my wife has little to no concern about me. It is all about her, but I do believe she puts our kids and even my sisters kids above herself. She said that she sees me purposely hurting the kids if I were to tell my sister. FYI, we have only had this conversation once...
I do want to clarify that I am by no means not having a life over all this. I play sports and stay in excellent shapexample and I'm juggling a million projects and repairs on our house, a rental house, and two cars after a massive hail storm hit. The problem I see with this is that me doing my own thing (projects) is one of my wife's long standing complaints, so it may seem like more of the same to her. I've tried to drive the point that Ive always gone out of my way to keep things running by asking my wife to handle some of the projects...of which she could not even get started on by herself.
M 17 years 3 kids EA start 2010 ILYBNILWY 1/2014 PA 1/2016 Bomb drop 2/2016 Renig on Bomb drop 4/2016 Living as roommates, EA continues
