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Sandi2,

I agree, I feel like her she was honest in her letter, she let me know why she doesn't want to quit the academy and was truthful in saying that she doesn't know if she can count on me. For the record, none of that has been said by her before the letter.

I appreciate that she wrote it, I appreciate that she finally shared her feelings/thoughts for me, that was a big part of my frustration, is she has been reserved in sharing with me. I am comfortable with what she said, I own my mistakes and have vowed for myself that I will live this life, I will not allow myself to sit in front of the TV drinking as life goes by. I am a better coconut than I was, and am still working on being the best coconut possible.

MC went well last night, we dove a little into the pain from her infertility, which needs to be resolved because it is a source of a lot of pain for her, and to a lesser extent me too.

And one last thing that will go a long ways towards helping me, I had mentioned joining the Fire department when W and I were having troubles before I knew about the A, and she shot that down telling me that it was her thing and I needed to find something else to do.

Well, she said that at the time she was against it because of the A, but now she thinks it would be great if I joined also, and started the next class in February of next year. That says a lot to me, and I think that will go a long ways towards me feeling better about the department, even if I end up not joining.

So for now, I'm in a good spot, but anyone following this thread that me saying that doesn't usually mean much, and the next emotional disaster is just around the corner, but I'm hoping that's not the case and I can move forward on an even keel.


M - 9 1/2 years
5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA
10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
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C-nut, whenever you find yourself itching to react or say something to W, I would like to challenge you to give yourself 24 hours before doing or saying ANYTHING. In that time, go back and read some of the awesome advice you give other DBers. Hardest to take our own advise, but often it is the most valuable!

Someome said this is a marathon, not a sprint, and you my friend are still early on in the race. TIME. Things will change in time. Patience.

-Blu


“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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Originally Posted By: BluWave
In that time, go back and read some of the awesome advice you give other DBers. Hardest to take our own advise, but often it is the most valuable!

-Blu


Blu nailed it! I agree 100%. Your advice to me has been great, and although I haven't always followed it I know it has helped me greatly. I'm starting to lose not just the love for my WW, but respect as well. It's sad. She's so careless and odd now and I don't like it.

Your W opened up to you. THAT IS HUGE!! That is something a loving W does. You're in a great spot man. Take your time!!


Me: 35 W: 32
S: 4
T: 6 M: 4
Physical Separation official: 5/21
Currently: DR/DBing, Focusing on me and son

Cheating on a good person is like throwing away a diamond and picking up a rock.
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"Someome said this is a marathon, not a sprint, and you my friend are still early on in the race. TIME. Things will change in time. Patience."

Thanks Blu!

This was said to me over and over in my first situation and let everyone know this all the time!

Cnut, your W wants to be with you? Do you want to be with her?


M 37 W 30
S 7
Together 10 years
Married 9 years
BD: 12/12/12(W filed same day)
I moved to apartment 1/11/13
W and S moved to MIL 1/11/13
Peicing: 6/3/13
Reconciled: 7/2013
BD2: 4/20/16
still working on it
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I find it very interesting that you posted to Jo on the 27th, and stated how much it would mean to you if your W wrote a letter. The next day you received it. smile How you communicate to her is so important. With built up emotions coming at you without warning, the other person sees you operating out of those bad emotions, and they made not hear what you are saying. In other words, they may not be getting the message you want to give.

So, I go back to what I said yesterday. Don't assume your W knows what you feel, what you want, or what "work" you want to see from her. Instead of allowing those bad feeling to fester, approach her calmly and open up to her. Timing is extremely important. IMHO, having a R talk late at night is the worst time, b/c everyone is exhausted and negative emotions tend to take over.



If your W has discovered the board, it could be a good thing......since she is trying to save the MR. Years ago, we had a high school coach on the board. His WAW discovered his posts and it actually served him well. She joined and they were a dynamic pair. If you are uncomfortable with the idea of your W reading what you write, you can try changing your name. Otherwise, I'd say to continue posting and saying what you want.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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I agree with Sandi. Some WAS find the board and get super pissed and its a disaster. Others find the board and use this as a tool.

If she did find it, she used it as a tool to look in your mind and give you want you want to make your feel comfortable in the MR. That's a good thing.

Like Cbtdad asked, she clearly wants you an the M. What do you want?

Also, have you made changes to address the insecurities and issues with the MR that she had?

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Hi Coconut, I think it's a big step her writing you the letter. I think like most of us H's here, we have regularly missed the signs our W's were giving us. I knew this was a problem in my relationship before and had suggested to my W that if she wasn't getting through to me to write me a letter, write things down, then sit me down and let me read it. I've always known I was an action oriented personality and her writing things down would have got through to me so much more. It was something she never tried so while I understand when W's complain about us not being there when needed etc, sometimes we do know our issues and suggest something different.

That's why it's hard for me to take when my W said she has tried everything when I know she never tried the one thing I asked her to try. An email while I was away from the house to read and process before going home would have been so much better for me than hitting me with something as soon as I got home.

Like others have said, take some time, read it through and then I think you will find your response that works for you both. All the best.

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CBT, I do want to be M to her if we are both working on it being a good one, her letter made leaps and bounds towards telling me she is, so the answer is yes, I do want our M.

Sandi, I think I realized what she may of found, and it's not this site. I write myself a lot, I find it easiest to send myself emails to collect my thoughts, I sent the following email to myself and then forgot my phone at home the next day (same day she gave me letter) and she was off for a few hours that morning.

My email, subject done.
____________________________________________________
I told you I wanted to talk about us two days after I noticed you being withdrawn from me. You hadn't talked to me in two years.

I immediately changed when you told me how I had hurt you, I stopped playing video games, started exercising, started trying to engage with you, spent more time with Son.
After I changed, you started an A. I found out about A, I said you need to quit academy, you said you won't. You say you will come home right after class and won't go there when he's there. You have class the next day, you stay at station over an hour after class. Truck checks are a week after I find out about an A, you know he's gonna be there, you go to truck checks, and everyone since.

You tell me you will only have a professional relationship with him, I find pictures of him on his Facebook page that you liked after I found out. I tell you I don't like you being friends with him on Facebook, you tell me it's only social media, but finally delete him days later. But don't delete him on other social media accounts till I find out a month later.

I bring up relationship talks, you get defensive, you never bring up a single relationship talk.

I schedule counseling. You tell me if their gonna upset me you'll stop going.

I try and schedule alone time with you, you schedule nights out with your academy friends.

I read as much relationship material as I can, try and understand how to recover from an A, how to express your love, etc. You read paragraphs that I text you, but still no dialogue.

if I don't snuggle with you, we don't touch, if I don't initiate intamicy we don't touch.

You have done a lot that I've asked for, but I'm tired of asking. I'm tired of feeling like I need to do everything I know to do to save our marriage, while you only do what I specifically ask for. I'm tired of you seeing your affair partner, you never telling me when you do or what has been said between you two, and I'm trying to pretend that I'm ok with it.

I tried giving you options that I would be ok with, see if he will move stations, he says he is planning on it, but you won't ask him when.

I am done trying to do everything I can to save our marriage. I'm done with trying to be ok with you being around him, because I don't you to be mad at me for having to quit... What, it was you who chose to have an affair with someone at the station, why are you going to resent me? Your choices, your consequences.

I will be moving out of the house at the end of July. If the house is in the market, I will help pay the mortgage until it's sold, if it's not, you'll need to figure out how to pay the mortgage by then. I am going to need my check to secure housing and furniture, etc. I will continue to pay 1/2 of all credit card bills minimum payments.
_________________________________________

I'm pretty sure she saw this email, it was my thoughts, and i was planning on talking to her about my wants without the last paragraph.


Ginger, at this point I don't think it would be horrible for her to read my threads, but it would be like letting her read my diary, so not something I plan on sharing.

Si, I agree, letter was a big step and changed my mind on laying out my wants as I had planned, although I will figure out what I would want the most and share them with her. I don't expect her to mind read.


M - 9 1/2 years
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10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
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Originally Posted By: Coconut
Sandi2,

I agree, I feel like her she was honest in her letter, she let me know why she doesn't want to quit the academy and was truthful in saying that she doesn't know if she can count on me. For the record, none of that has been said by her before the letter.



She never said it before because it's only partially true. It's little small fleeting feelings she's had over time blown up to become rationalizations and justifications for doing whatever the heck she wanted/wants. It's called a history re-write.

Waywards are selfish entitled monsters. She read your journal and came up with her best most manipulative and controlling arguments so she could to keep you AND the volunteer position.

She hit on all the major wayward wife themes:

-You are controlling
-You neglected me
-It's your fault
-I'm sorry I failed to tell you what a POS you were years ago
-We are friends and I don't love you like I should (and she won't as long as OM remains anywhere in her life)
-Your behavior put me in this position
-I gave and gave (you and son) for years and now it's time for something for her - that just hers
-I feel like a caged animal
-I have to do this - it's almost life or death



But I did like a small part of the letter:

Quote:
That I should have sat you down and told you straight that your behavior is affecting our relationship and my feelings for you. I didn’t do that and I realize now that it needed to be done. I’m sorry that I didn’t try harder. I’m sorry that I didn’t call you out on your behavior and I’m sorry for not telling you how angry I was at you for it.


This is exactly why you can't just roll over and not make a boundary about volunteering at the FF. Her letter sounds as it was designed to sound. If you try to make her quit, she'll choose the firehouse and her son over you -- SO DON'T EVEN TRY IT. It's a threat. She's actually the one trying to cage you into accepting this arrangement that is destructive to you (and HER since you are her family).

Call her bluff and state your feelings just as she supposedly wished she'd have done years prior. Use this paragraph to defend your expressing yourself and "trying harder". She may get mad, she may leave you --- so what. It's better than dealing with the indignation and anxiety of her volunteering with the OM and your marriage just stagnating.

For example, as I recall (and she can probably relate her story a little better than I), Sandi and her husband had their first d-day and she gave up several of the online OM's she had had at that time but she secretly kept and maintained a relationship with one of them for another year. She just talked above about how coming to being truly sorry took a really long time for her and, I extrapolate that part of that was due to the fact she had not achieved "no contact" for a long time with all the OMs. It took a forum of former way wards and former betrayed's to convince her to cut off the relationship completely and THEN, lo and behold, she actually could feel remorse.

Your wife's foggy letter is to be expected. She's barely sorry and just going through the motions. She's still in wayward selfish entitled mode and part of the reason for that is because she is still seeing OM regularly at and around the firehouse. A person that hurts someone to such extreme would try to make or maybe discuss making amends, not defend their choices including the choice to remain in daily contact with OM.

Another thought. It's not like you can wait this out to decide. Every day you accept this situation the way it is is just kicking the marriage ending conflict down the road and making it harder and harder as she becomes more engrossed in that world. She'll very very likely get over you stating your boundary and sticking to your assertion that you have no intent to control her but that for you to continue in this relationship she needs to stop hurting you daily and give up the FF. She clearly wants the marriage so don't waste your time believing all the other manipulations and wayward babble.


An alternative did occur to me as I read the thread. If you take FF academy next spring than she should quit now, wait and take it with you and the two of you can do it together. In one year of not being there and leaving there immediately she'll probably be able to fall back in love with you and never want to set foot in that firehouse again and you'll be able to overcome her supposed fears and demonstrate that you can "be there for her". You then aren't asking her to give up the dream forever - just less than one year until next spring. By then, you'll know whether you are recovering or not.

Sometimes I wish the poster Mr. Bond was still around to demonstrate just how long recovery takes when the wife still works for or with the OM. He went on and one in pseudo-recovery for about 3 years while his wife worked for the Dr. OM at the hospital. It wasn't until the OM retired and actual "no contact" was achieved that their marriage finally recovered. Are you willing to wait until OM moves or gives up volunteering to not be concerned or even think about it every time that beeper/pager goes off at 2am or every time she goes over to the firehouse for training and socializing???? You'll end up rue'ing the day you realize you should have put your foot down immediately on this issue (and by foot down I don't mean in a punishing mean aggressive demeaning way - you can state boundaries very nicely and with empathy even - you can have complete understanding of how hard this will be for her to give up (until next spring?) but it's just something you can't accept and it's even more cruel that she even asks (and manipulates) you to accept it.


The internet is 90% complaining and entitlement and I hate it because I deserve better!
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GBD, what you say resonates with me, and if your some sort of pro D troll then your worse than OM, because you get my blood boiling and make me want to put forth the ultimatum...

I struggle between believing my W and wanting her to have a passion in her life that makes her feel alive, and wanting her away from OM at all costs. Your reasoning seems sound, and I see how I can use her own words against her. You trigger me into wanting to take action, but your late to my party and I don't know if I can trust your motives.

Can you give me a little insight? My best guess is your a religious counselor, but I don't know that for sure. Can you clear up your experience for me? I haven't been able to find your background or where your experience derives from.


M - 9 1/2 years
5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA
10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
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