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#2672348 04/27/16 05:25 PM
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Hello, Have been M to H 6yr/T 12. He is 30 me 32. He let me know in Feb has been sorting feelings since Jan. He said unhappy but cares and loves me In later convo turned into no feelings at all. He mentioned lacking confidence so didn't explore before we were "us." It was painful to take in. we had a miscarriage in Dec but he said not relevent.

by accident (through linked device) saw msg to a male coworker friend, that H has a crush on their coworker. She may be aware but do know from the convo that hasn't been reciprocated. Still painful he is w/ this person and placing his attention away from our marriage. I question if this is why he feels he has lost feelings for me?

I have been patient, positive, checking emotions, working on me, no relationship talk. I got defensive at beginning but then learned to handle better. We are still in same bed, watch tv and hug good night (going through motions). I suggest fun things to do but a bust so far. He will ask me on errands but not looking into that gesture that much. Other things have slowly gone like kisses, I love you, wearing ring. He told me not to worry that everyone at work knows he is married. I said still bothers me and symbols he is avail.

He doesn't feel unhappiness and loss of feelings has room in marriage is fixable. And he is not sure he shares my thoughts on rebuilding and getting through together. In last couple wks he looked up twice info on D so that was unsettling to see. I have an exercise letter to write from a similar program that hopefully will help me get thoughts across. I feel defeated somewhat but trying to keep going. Would appreciate feedback from similar experiences. All I know we can get through and be stronger got it. hope he realizes it as well.

Jzmill #2672394 04/27/16 11:05 PM
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Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.


Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Me-70, D37,S36
Cadet #2672858 04/29/16 11:24 AM
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Thanks for the info. I understand the importance of patience and checking emotions and other techniques. What is tough for me is that I am doing all this work behind the scenes to make a shift possible and my H could make a decision in a second. Guess wish there was an easier way to get him to realize that the answer is to give us tthe opportunity to work through the tension to rebuild together, and not get caught up in how it feels in this moment (like it would last forever).

Jzmill #2672859 04/29/16 11:26 AM
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Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.


Me-70, D37,S36
Cadet #2672872 04/29/16 11:56 AM
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I'm also in the situation of having a husband who could announce a decision at any moment and doesn't think people can change.

I'm trying to focus on living a good life so I don't feel like I'm waiting for H to give me permission to live.

It's not easy.


Me: 44
H: 44
Kids: 20, 16, 16, and 10
Together/Married: 22 years
H announced he was emotionally detached and considering D: 4/4/16
H announced he is going to try to stay and reconnect: 5/1/16
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Welcome to the board, and sorry you find yourself here. Maybe he has found the miscarriage hard to deal with? Were you far along? Or see a C or anything at the time.

You'll find they all follow a script, especially where an A be it EA or PA is involved.

I know the pain, and I know it will feel unbearable right now. But most of us are in the same boat so can support each other.

Have you read the DR or DB book? If not, get them and read them asap. Read the homework cadet gives you, the more insight you have the better.

Seems impossible right now, but you need to look after you. Take it day by day and step by step. Keep posting.

We're all rooting for you


Me 26 H 25
M 4
T 5
Baby born 4/14
BD: 1/15
EA: 2/15
PA: 4/15
reconciling: 4/15
ILYBINILWY- 11/15
ILY-1/16
ILYBNILWY 4/16
ILY 6/16
ILYBINILWY 6/16
Baby due 3/17
BD 8/16
Cherry #2672974 04/29/16 09:09 PM
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Appreciate the support ladies..

The misc. was at 3 months. I know it was tough on him and I think it is more relevant then he believes. We were watching a movie where someone had one and I was a blubbering mess. He comforted me which felt good.

I have not read DB but the M prog. I did along with the podcasts were helpful. Even tho it's not an EA thus far, still painful. not being able to meet his needs right now and Not saying ILY has been tough and I miss the simple things. Resentment has been building up but doing best to check that.

Rooting for you as well.

Jzmill #2673271 05/01/16 10:22 AM
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It would have been hard for him too, I think men like to feel like the problem solvers, and would look to making sure you are ok. It most probably hit him hard too, but admitting this may make him feel he isn't strong or "manly"

The DR book is really great. You realise how much of this is script. And I find helps me focus and regain some patience.

It is hard, I too miss the simple things. Sometimes you look at them when they seem all miserable and you want to hug them or kiss them, but this essentially is what we want right now, not necessarily them. So we must learn to love them from a slight distance. Read up on the lighthouse story and start to make changes with you.

It is difficult, but take it slowly, be gentle and kind with yourself


Me 26 H 25
M 4
T 5
Baby born 4/14
BD: 1/15
EA: 2/15
PA: 4/15
reconciling: 4/15
ILYBINILWY- 11/15
ILY-1/16
ILYBNILWY 4/16
ILY 6/16
ILYBINILWY 6/16
Baby due 3/17
BD 8/16
Jzmill #2673287 05/01/16 10:58 AM
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Does he know that you know about his crush on this OW?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
sandi2 #2674007 05/03/16 02:04 PM
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I did let him know I was aware. He said I was mistaken and he would not betray me. Even tho feelings are on his end I feel betrayed and sad. His focus is outside of us.

The other day He told his parents projects that we needed to do like build a wall in backyard. Future things? Keeping the peace? Confused since has been looking up D info. And the next day told male friend that he feels like a coward has not ended things yet. But fears aftermath. His friend told him not to. Wish he had better role model/support to encourage working on.

So feel like holding onto cliff with a couple fingers. Still need to write end of program letter. Holding onto only hope I have left that can salvage.

Jzmill #2674021 05/03/16 03:01 PM
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Jz,

I am sorry that you find yourself here. As Cherry says, this is a supportive community all of us are in a similar sitch or have been in one before.

I also agree that you should read DR today. And go through all of the links that Cadet has shared. It may take reading them multiple times to get it to set in.

Unfortunately, this can be a very long and painful process. You may find that H waffles back and forth for awhile, is completely inconsistent, or tells you tomorrow that he is done, wants a D, and will never look back! Try not to hang on his every word. Don't believe what he says because he is running on emotions. He is scared and confused too--even if he appears self-assured, he is not!

My H did this for a year! Long story, but it was a complete nightmare and I fell apart. Now we have been back together for over a year and finally moving forward. I was scared, confused, and my self-esteem was in the toilet! So what did I do? Reacted, beg/pleaded, got angry, ignored, etc, etc, and it was all based on fear! So I ended up pushing H further and further away!

In my opinion, people see DB as a way to win back their spouse. I think it is really about self-growth, learning to self-love, and breaking co-dependency. If your S is willing to work on themselves and commit to the M, then you will be better able to work on the M. If they don't come back, then you have maintained your dignity, and will have the confidence to know you deserve better.

Just my 2 cents,
Blu


“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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Blu,

Appreciate response. H seems convinced of the outcome he wants and hung up on the fact has been four months. But I will keep in mind about not believing everything he says. I am scared to write and give letter since could give him push he needs. It's his bday Sat as well so not sure if that plays a role at all?

If he were to say he was done, I know it's good to acknowledge his feelings and let him know I'm there for him. but could I say that there are other steps can take to try to work on and relieve tension? He may not share my opinion but we should do everything we can and have ending be last resort. Ugh feel more defeated then ever.

Jzmill #2675032 05/06/16 05:58 PM
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Ok feeling low tonight. H went out with work team. Sitting here at home knowing OW most likely included. Feeling real angry, maybe more emotions then have before. Know learned to have minimal dialogue about MR but looking back to last few months maybe would have been better to initiate more instead of letting be. I am known for bottling things up and keeping to myself. It's just hard when the person you know is disappearing. It has been unspoken what we are going through.

I have been thinking about our misc. lately. I want to open up and let him know making me down.

Jzmill #2675439 05/08/16 12:23 PM
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Hi,

I am so sorry. It's the worst. ... Have you had time to read the links that Cadet sent you? I would suggest rereading them several time. Before any interactions with H, go back and reread.

I don't have a lot of advice for you, this is an incredibly delicate time, but I will say a few things.

1. Take care of yourself and let that be your number one focus. This is hard, but the most important. Baby steps.
2. Try and start working on detachment and taking a giant step back from H. Try not to let him consume your mind.
3. There is no rush to do anything right now. No letters, no reaching out, and you don't need to tell him anything about where you are at and what you are feeling. He doesn't get that right now. Less is more.

We are here for you. Take it day by day. Breathe. You are in a crisis, but you will get through this.

-Blu


“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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Jzmill,

Please take special attention of Blu's advice. It really is the key to taking care of yourself in this challenging time. It will not feel natural, and most certainly it is counter intuitive, but it is the best way. Caring for yourself will make you feel stronger, help you endure the difficult emotions and thoughts.

There is much support for you here, and the folks here understand first hand your struggles.

Take care of yourself, be gentle, and you will make it through.


Me 46 Former W 46
D19 D7
BD Feb 2016
WAW moves out 4/16/16
D final 6/1/2017

It's time for me to start changin' the way I look at the world......and at myself. ~James Howlett aka Wolverine
Jzmill #2675447 05/08/16 12:44 PM
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Jzmill, I'm sorry to see you hear, but your in the right place.. we have all gone, or are going through, the same type of situations and there are some really knowledgable vets who can give you some really sound advice. You want to make sure to provide as much info on relationship as possible so they can get some insite into what issues need to addressed. For example did you spend time quality time together, how was the relationship prior, any intimacy, who initiated, arguing, has he said or acted unhappy before this... Also, has he given other reasons for unhappiness?

There are lots of Relationships that are saved using techniques found here, I just caution you not to act on anything when your in an emotional state, cool off before making decisions.

Praying for you.


M - 9 1/2 years
5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA
10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
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Thanks for feedback...
Checked links.. Cont. to do techs from similiar prog have. I go on walks and excuse myself at times to give space. We still watch shows weeknight/ends (going through motions) so being wise not to be obvious. Doing good not to react when he makes plans after work and respondong ok. Trying to take care of self. Think feel rushed since his mind seems made up (don't see how can change?) and has been a while since talked about R and tension remains.

M has been good overall, not much fighting, spent a lot of time together. Lots of laughs. Went to movies/dinner at times. Now suggest and he declines. I had R experience before us, but he did not. He has more confidence now which is why I feared these new feelings and lack of exp. I acknowledge and working on own flaws (driven by fear of losing, not deserving him, unintentional nag, speak before think, preferring to save then spend). I see have taken small things for granted. When trying, intimacy became chore and I declined more then should have.

H didnt expand much on unhappiness. I learned that what S shares its not the real reason for the sit. We had ducks in a row and now have beautiful home and ready to start family. Why would he not want to try to reconnect. So painful to even think about.

Jzmill #2675824 05/09/16 07:52 PM
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Alrighty..so was with H in car other day. Song came on basically about having feelings for someone. At home I can excuse myself/get drink etc, when emotions build but had nowhere to go. I tried hard but said "stupid song" and must have looked irritated. Then H shook head and matched my emotion..Dissapoonted in self. Prob took step backwards. will use that as reminder not to let happen again.

Jzmill #2675825 05/09/16 08:18 PM
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Jzmill,

First of all, I AM NOT A VET. But I am a man. Your H is confused. I think that being a W in this sitch is a positive thing. I say GAL like a MOFO. BE AWESOME. BE BEAUTIFUL. DO YOU. He is confused and I think still loves you but does not understand his feelings for some fluzzie in his office. F$%K Her. She is nothing to what you are. She is a fantasy in his mind, but not a reality yet. I think if he thinks he has you and can explore the OW, he will. If he feels he is losing you and knows he does not yet have anything with this OW, he will come running back to you.

What makes you happy?
What do you enjoy?


Focus on doing things for yourself, and DON'T sit around waiting for him. I know, I know, that's hard to do in this early stage. It doesn't seem to make sense. I seriously believe that the sooner you implement some serious GAL, the sooner he will re-commit to your M.

There is nothing you can say @ this point to change his mind. So do things for yourself and be mysterious. guys hate mysterious, they want to understand. That's a good thing for you, but don't drop your guard to soon. He will temp check. He will Temp Check. He will Temp check. Don't fall for it, He is in an EA even if the OW doesn't have a clue. Listen to the vet's they know their @#$%.

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Jz,

I think cubebot brings up some good points. It is so hard when your confidence has been shattered, but the more you can regain that confidence and strength, the more it will attract him back.

How have things been going lately?

-Blu


“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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Jz,

I'm sry to see that you are going through this situation. I'm not a vet, but a couple of things I'd like to mention...

You mention that you still sit with spouse and watch movies..

I would think it would be better for you to go do something while your H is sitting around. Go take line dance lessons, go learn yoga, go do something, GAL.. I use meetup.com to find groups with different interests that I'd like to try, for example I'm going to meetup at a local restaurant to play board games later in the week, it gets me out socializing and having a good time, let your H be home alone and see what it's like to be home alone, and don't be afraid to get dressed nice when you go out.. maybe you'll come home with a smile on your face...

Hang in there.


M - 9 1/2 years
5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA
10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
Jzmill #2676094 05/10/16 01:28 PM
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Thanks Cubebot..
Hope you are right but he doesn't seem confused on way leaning. Doing best not to think about his feelings for coworker but tough. could feelings fade soon? Hope he can realize that our marriage is the better choice and not to give up.

Once last wk I let him know was playing tennis after work. When I got home he asked how it was and asked if was singles or doubles. So seemed to take interest but did best not to analyze. Same with saying goodnight. I can tell from face he rather not but He initiates a hug. The effort varies.

When you say "early stage" is that bc we are living together and he has delayed saying anything to me?

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Blu/Coconut- thanks didn't see post

Things still tough but breathing..

Have things in mind to stay busy at home (yard work, running, reading outside) to follow through with. Guess am afraid he will think I'm making a point/manipulating by all of a sudden doing things during our typical time together (more so on weekend). Going through motions with that and sure he would rather do more of own thing upstairs. He will occasionally go out after work and I'm trying too. Looking to do softball again in summer.

Jzmill #2676683 05/12/16 10:31 AM
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Need feedback..
H told friend he fears the aftermath of ending. H mad at himself for delaying telling me where he is at. That has been on his mind for weeks. He has been sighing around house at times. Doing best to not react even tho unsettling of what could come.

Why the delay? If he approaches me what do then?
Will try to run/plant and not sit around even tho at a low.

Jzmill #2676833 05/12/16 07:10 PM
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As far as what to tell him, I think you should say that is not what I want, but if you want X, I understand... Try and blow his mind by standing strong like you couldn't care less... In the meantime, go out for girls night out, dress nice and be fun... Make him realize what he is thinking of giving up...


M - 9 1/2 years
5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA
10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
Joined: Apr 2016
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Thanks coconut...

Others advice too on my last post above and this one appreciated...

H continues to let me know when doing something/home late. I have been doing the same. As you guys mentioned above not reading into that, esp since his mind is made up on outcome he wants (although delaying telling me). I have been excusing myself and saying "going for run" " tired going to bed," etc. He will say ok. If leave w/o saying anything he may not care but think would be weird.

I selfishly want to stay and watch tv and be with him each night but know as you said shouldn't. You guys are the vets so know you are right but I fear me being busy/skipping out early occasionally may be obvious and may be exactly what he wants (to have more time to self since doesn't care?). Feel I'm on borrowed time so that's setting in I think. Thanks.

Jzmill #2677194 05/13/16 05:39 PM
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As some have stated themselves, I am running out of steam. I'm a planner so the no control thing and H's same day/last min. plans after work is draining. He never did that before. maybe testing me to see what will do. I have not reacted tho at all to this which is a miracle. Don't want to feel defeated but close. Trying to focus on running/outside activities to distract. As stated above H delaying telling me done.

Advice appreciated of my questions from last couple posts above.

Jzmill #2677210 05/13/16 06:41 PM
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Jzmill, I understand how emotionally and mentally draining this is, I don't have very good patience which even makes it worse... If you stay with him your more likely to push, and that would make the sitch worse, so don't worry about it being obvious.

Also, I think the mod moved your thread to newcomers now, so you should start getting more responses..

Are you doing any GAL activities with other people? This is where I've been struggling but I believe has the most benefit for being happy..


M - 9 1/2 years
5/5/16 - Bomb drop - 3 week EA
10/31/16 - We sold house
01/10/18 - D Finalized
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 80
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Patience sure is tough. H sounds happy when calls to let me know on way home. Like things are fine, it hurts. I will work more on getting out to run/bike/golf and not sitting around each time with him. We spent most of our time together but when we did our own thing, I preferred to use my time to be by myself. The couple times I have been out, I will say briefly what doing (going to golf) and maybe he assumes if on a week day I'm with other people.

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Jzmill,

I am sorry you are in the situation that you are.
I want to encourage you to post frequently and to check into others threads for ideas for you as well as to lend support. This can create more traffic for your thread. Lots of good folks on this forum with challenges of their own, but much good advice and many at various points of the long journey.

Keep up the GAL, know that you have the gift of time, and focus on you.
These are my first bits of advice.


Me 46 Former W 46
D19 D7
BD Feb 2016
WAW moves out 4/16/16
D final 6/1/2017

It's time for me to start changin' the way I look at the world......and at myself. ~James Howlett aka Wolverine
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Sadhub- thanks for thoughts

I will have intention to get busy and then H has similiar idea. Like yesterday w/ yard work. Ended up taking a walk first, then came back to do yard work while he mowed. Ive got mindset that stepping back (tough for me at moment) is what he wants/will make worse. Know wrong tho. Since he is putting energy outside our MR w/ others and OW I feel need to take advantage of time together. Working on that.

During most wk nights we have dinner/watch couple shows. I excuse self early at times/say have headache and watch tv upstairs by self. Wkends we do own thing til 2 so I'm trying to be outside/delay available when he comes down (initiated by H). I want to stay comitted and handle things well but

Questions:
1) It's ok to spend some time together right?
2) Why is he delaying telling me he wants to be done? Know he fears aftermath so that's prob why. Should this give me any hope? Fear that since H shared his feelings to friend and has support that the outcome he seeks won't change.
3) H gives me somewhat of heads up when going out to eat/running etc. and when coming home..guess something? I have been doing the same is that ok?
4) I have been picking and choosing responding to his msgs. I will respond w/ "ok" and "have fun." ?
4) Will feelings for his crush fade?
5) We have talked briefly about small projects need to do like mulching etc. is that ok? One big project he mentioned but think bc he was telling parents.

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Meant to add to Q above about crush, that he been 5-6 months.

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I asked H the other day if he could wfh to help get our cat ready for vet tmrw, he said Maybe. tonight he said he had a meeting so couldn't help. I responded "that's fine you have a meeting, nothing you can do." He noticed I seemed irritated and I should have let it be. Long story short insinuated he rather be at work. He said goodnight and closed bedroom door. I would usually apologize but thinking leave it alone. Man am struggling checking emotions lately.

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Some feedback on this and questions above would be helpful thanks.

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Thought of another Q to add above..Does my H feel that it is not wrong to have crush/EA since it is one sided? Thanks for help on Q's.

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Jzmill:

The whole EA thing is such a mine field. My W was in an EA and she thought it was a friendship, etc, etc.

Basically, there is no winning. Some men would think since it is one sided you should not be concerned. Some men would realize that a one sided EA is counter to their marriage. It's a lose lose.

Don't interfere - that will cause blow back. You may want to consider some kind of boundary.

That's all I got for now.


M:50
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MR:20
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Suspected PA Sept 2015-Confronted W & OM Dec 2015
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Jzmill,

My wife believes that infidelity is sexual intercourse, period. She's in an EA and doesn't think she's doing anything wrong even though she's divorcing me because I don't like her "friend."

Bigybiz has it right, EA is a mine field.

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Jzmill & Doodler:

Here is the best part of my "minefield" story. When I told the OM in the EA to get lost. He did. He wants my W and I to succeed. That I do not apologize for. I told my W that me telling another man that you are my wife and it's not cool for him to have a "secret relationship" with her is not honorable.

Funny, the only support I got was from the OM. Great example of winning the battle and losing the war (See today's post on my thread for more info).

Jzmill -

- do not interfere
- do not snoop
- do not question
- do not take drastic actions
- do not retaliate i.e. have your own affair, etc

It's a lose lose situation. Make sure you are on the lighter side of the loss.


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MR:20
D:21
S:17
S:11
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Suspected PA Sept 2015-Confronted W & OM Dec 2015
Actually EA
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Doodler/bigy thanks for thoughts...
I have let resentment get better of me a couple times which I learned from. Will keep your tips in mind. He knows I have inkling on his feelings for OP. I read that feelings, esp if not reciprocated, will begin to fade so hope true. Having trouble taking step back/detaching since we are home often together. but have read in order to make a shift will need to do more (mentioned above I fear thats what he wants me to do so can approach me on outcome he desires).

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Vets/others in need of some feedback on site/questions above. Thanks.

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Hi Jz,

It's been a busy week for me--working a lot and kids' games every evening--so I am sorry this is late! You asked me to answer your questions and so I will give it my best shot. Your sitch is a bit confusing to me, so I may answer your questions with more questions.

"Questions:
1) It's ok to spend some time together right?"

So here is my question to you; if your H has feelings for another woman, do you want to spend time with him? And if so, can you think about why you would? ... If you want to spend time with him because you are hanging on to what you used to have, then I do not think ultimately that will work in your favor.

It's hard to think clearly because right now you are scared and your confidence is shattered. I am willing to bet that your most confident self would not even want to spend time with someone that would lie and cheat on them. Can you try and access her?

I see that you are working on GAL--golf, softball, exercise, gardening--and that is great! Keep that up! ... I also want you to think about detachment; that is much more difficult and can take a long time. Baby steps. The first step is to respect yourself enough to say "I really don't WANT to be snugged up in bed next to a man that is thinking about OW."

"2) Why is he delaying telling me he wants to be done? Know he fears aftermath so that's prob why. Should this give me any hope? Fear that since H shared his feelings to friend and has support that the outcome he seeks won't change."

I don't think you are going to like this answer any more than my first answer. I have no clue as what this guy is doing and what this guy is thinking. I am one who thinks that mind reading never works. If you read in my thread when my H was in the fog, I tried to understand what he was doing/saying all the time. I was often wrong.

None of us have any idea what your H is doing and thinking. Let's look at two extremes: He could be riddled with self doubt, not sure what his feelings even are, and know in his heart that what he is doing is wrong, and he may not even want to let you go! OR, he may be knee deep in the fog, in love with OW, its a full blown PA, and it's been going on for a long time, and he has been planning his escape for months, maybe years, and it's just a matter of time... We have no idea.

When people are in any kind of A, they are not thinking or acting rationally. That is why the focus here is to work on detachment and believe none of what they say. Try your best not to mind read and hang on his words and actions--we have no idea what he is going to do and it can go either way. You have no control or influence over that either. ... But if you can learn to detach and get stronger without him, you will feel better, and you will ultimately be more attractive in his eyes.

It took me 10 months to really start moving forward without H. This is when he noticed, did his 180, and came back. It was also due to a mixture of things happening in his own sitch that had nothing to do with me.

"3) H gives me somewhat of heads up when going out to eat/running etc. and when coming home..guess something? I have been doing the same is that ok?"

I don't think this matters in terms of your outcome. No reason to ignore people and play games. I think it is common courtesy when you live with another person to let them know when you are coming and going.


"4) I have been picking and choosing responding to his msgs. I will respond w/ "ok" and "have fun." ?"

I think that is fine. No reason to play games, ignore him, etc. However if you treat him as though you are naturally starting to lose interest in him, that will most likely get his attention. Men like the chase. Let's not secure you as his plan B if OW doesn't work out. You deserve better than that. ... And my dear, I think it's okay to naturally lose interest! He is thinking about OW and plotting to leave you. ... Do you want to pine over him? Really?

"4) Will feelings for his crush fade?"

I have no idea. We cannot mind read. In fact he may have no idea. Often it is said here that things can get worse before better. Perhaps his feelings need to die naturally. That is why I said, let's not let him think you are the plan B. ... Also, I am sorry to say this, but I would be surprised at this point if this is only a "crush." I know you don't want to think about it, but most likely there is a lot going on between these two. Most men do not plan to leave their W for a crush. They have tasted a slice and now they want the whole pie.

"5) We have talked briefly about small projects need to do like mulching etc. is that ok? One big project he mentioned but think bc he was telling parents."

Sure, why not. You can do projects--big and small--and keep on living your life the way you chose. Does it mean he will stick around because he is planning longer term projects? Maybe. Or maybe not. I have no idea. ... But, I do want you to start asking yourself this--do you really want to keep investing so much of yourself with a man that is thinking about OW? Possibly sleeping with her?

I am coming at you with 2*4s because I want to open your eyes and prepare you for the worst. I have been through the worst and have come out on the other side. It wasn't until I started to let him go, discover my worth, and start realizing I deserved better, that I started to get his REAL attention.

You asked for answers. These are my honest answers.
-Blu


“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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Blu- appreciate the feedback and time.

I did check out your thread about the fog. I have gotten caught up in trying to understand what my H is thinking/doing as well.

I have been struggling to detach. Being able to excuse myself early to end our time together has been good practice. I know important to cont. and keep in mind what you said about you moving forward and H noticing. Think you are right tho that holding on in way. Im jealous that others receive more of his attention now since this started. He was not like that before.

When you say "do you have access to OW" do you mean to approach?
I did stumble across that H said to friend not reciprocated by OW, said that everyone knows me as his wife. Regardless it is an EA and feel betrayed. It bothers me that when approached subject with H, he said I was mistaken and continues on. H thinks that new feelings should never escape a M, not realizing its not sustainable. Its sad bc he lacks experience in area.

Checking emotions can be tough, esp. resentment. When H lets me know of plans late, whether in person/msg. it bothers me. I have done well not reacting to this tho. Having the knowledge of feelings makes it tough, knowing OW may be involved. I really want to say "I do not feel comfortable with you going out knowing blank may be there." But know would not help matters.

I have read quite a few saying they are running out of steam and I can relate. For some reason there is a small part of me that has hope that H can begin to have doubt and realize the opportunity to reconnect is worth it.

Blu, I hope MC is good.

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"When you say "do you have access to OW" do you mean to approach?"

I am confused by this--I don't see where I asked this.

I get the sense you are feeling hopeless and are waiting for H to make some sort of decision. Well you have a right to make some decisions too! Take your power back! Perhaps you need to take a giant step back, create space, do not go for any crumbs he throws you and keep it vague. It is okay to let him know that you are not comfortable with the way things are, that you need some space right now, and that you have a lot to think about. You do not owe him any explanations and you do not need to answer to him. You can create your own boundaries and I don't think it would hurt for him to think you are not his plan B, you are not sitting around waiting for him, and if he has feelings for OW then you naturally do not want to be around him. ... Then you go out and be fabulous, feel fabulous, and treat yourself the way you deserve to be treated!

Continue to be polite and respectful, but hold your head up high and let him see how you deserve to be treated!
-Blu


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Blu- Think I misunderstood..(2nd para in question one of your response, at end "can you try and access her").

I do feel hopeless somewhat. I continue to work on space. I'm scared to take step back. I did say once a while ago that what we are going through is uncomfortable/tough; H response was "I know it is." I have not initiated any R talk since. Fear bringing up again will push/open up dialogue rather not have. Know what you are saying tho that I have the right to decision, having more space.

H has a grad party to go to tmrw. I want to ask to go along but figured not good idea. H having plans, esp late notice, still getting to me. At least when do own thing here H is home.

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Ok so feeling the sad/anger build up that some have mentioned already. It is awful. I am doing so so not reacting to things. Have had a couple slips so that's a shame. Detaching and mindset of it overall is a struggle.

H called last night when on way home. I didn't answer and went for walk so not able to greet him. Before he left for party I did same thing so couldn't say bye. He ended up calling me (missed it actually) to see where I was and to say bye (not reading into that tho). I will pick and choose when answer, etc.

I have not asked any questions about his plans. still stings that going out when didn't before. Sure he is aware of how its effecting me overall.

Jzmill #2679747 05/22/16 02:20 PM
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Jzmil, it does sting/hurt when they start going out when they didn't used to, but that's why you need to detach & GAL... You to can go out even though you didn't used to, since you can't stop him from doing so, the best thing you can do is find yourself and be concerned about what you are doing. I understand the struggle, I'm right there with you, but do as I say, not as I do smile. You will make it through this one way or another, it's best if you come out the other side a more confident, happier you.


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C, Still at a low but know where coming from. This a.m I woke up first and stayed busy taking walk and reading on deck while H mowed. We both were tired so took nap on opposite sides of couch.

When we watched our show tonight, our cat was being pain with cords. I picked her up and told H I'd go upstairs to watch rest to calm down. He said "whatever" in an upset tone. He didn't say goodnight. Know not to analyze instances but at times cannot help it. I know the purpose of taking step back is to encourage H to move towards me but what if he takes my actions as giving up caring?

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Been more angry lately. suppose can use that to help detach. H has stopped saying goodnight and giving hug. Know should not let get to me but it does. H has no problem asking for small favors tho. Picking and choosing what help with.

I know not to leave bedroom but fell asleep on couch (left tv on) other day to give myself a break. When I look in H direction lately I want to shake him and ask him to stop and come to senses. So draining.

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Jzmill, find something to do with others, your great at doing things on your own, but find things to do with others... You might be afraid to get out and socialize, but do it afraid, you need to do it, it will make you happier, and if your happier, your H will notice (not the goal, but it will happen)..

Find something social that you like, even if you don't think you'll like it, try it... Eventually you will find something you do like, you'll find people you enjoy being around, it will work in your favor.


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Had some momentum detaching and then deflated it.

H had late game last night. I went on deck to be scarce. He looked around then found me. After his shower I headed to bed, not crossing paths. H found me, asked where was and he said goodnight.

Then..H came to bed real late. I told myself not to react. Well I asked why and H said had some work to get done. I was irritated bc knew was not necessary and concerned driving on little sleep. He said was fine and sighed loudly when in bathroom. I saud was concerned and apologized for some reason. he said not to be sorry and said bye as left. Screwed up ugh.

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It's ok JZ, you messed up, just start again... Have you started thinking about things you can do away from the house? Nothing wrong with sitting on the porch, I love doing so, but it will help you when your not wondering if your H is going to come find you... Last night I heard about a open mic night at a local British Pub, it was great.. I had never been to anything like it, but found myself enjoying the musicians and comics..

I've always struggled with initiating small talk, so I've never gone to bars alone, but I sat at the bar last night and forced myself to initiate conversation... The point is I saw something I "thought" might be fun, and I went for it... Tonight I'm going for a second meditation class, something I never thought would interest me, but I found that I really loved it last class, and it took away sooo much stress.

They don't need to be big things, just find new things to try, it will build your self confidence and may even give you a smile. Go on meetup.com right now, see what's going on in your area this week and pick something to do.


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C, Guess so...I love the porch too, looking at stars is peaceful...Didn't think my whereabouts would be concern. For me it is actually a big deal to do own thing close by in yard/porch. But will keep being away in mind too.

I have had hiking in mind and can hit balls at range. Our neighbors plan things. think will do the ladies game night next wk. Some events involve the guys too but H is more interested in social things w. work ppl. it hurts but try not to let it get to me. Will cont. walks so not always home to greet.

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Oh dear..taking in the peaceful surroundings of our home; trees, hills, crisp air, sounds of frogs and crickets. I am a puddle. motivation to keep going.

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Stay strong JZ, you will make it through this, and the more time you can focus on you the easier it will get. It sounds like you live in a beautiful area, I would enjoy spending time there to, but the thing is you need to spend time away to..

The game sounds like a great outing, try and live in the moment when your there, enjoy it.


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JZ, just chicken in on you, hope your out enjoying yourself...


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Have been taking breather. I am tired. Detaching still struggle. Did get out other day to golf and kept busy around house. Finding a balance of checking emotions tough. Think have come off lately as cold so being mindful.

The feelings H has/EA is wearing on me. Following feedback to let it be but tough to keep in. When BD seems around corner is detaching still the focus and taking advantage of time given?

Was sad last night and needed a hug. Didnt seek one/any affection lately since figured persuing?

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Jzmill, treat your husband the same you would a friendly neighbor, polite, friendly, but at a distance. You wouldn't feel the need to provide a neighbor with your exact destination or how long you'll be gone right?

Try hard not to come across as cold, that will negate any positive actions you take. You need to show confidence and as though you are at peace with everything going on.


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C, appreciate feedback and doing best to be at peace and allow changes to show but think H stuck with mindset has and sees one resolution.

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C/Others ...Can tell BD approaching and really scared. Know to stay calm in moment and let know want to save. Opinions on how to handle please?

-Should I start a convo then instead and validate feelings/share my own?
-Suggest alternatives: seeing someone? An in house S?
-When convo does arise could I mention EA and how makes me feel. Let him know I have been talking to someone?

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JZ, just validate, DO NOT share your feelings, he doesn't care what your feelings are right now, his actions have shown that. Say Something like,

I understand that your unhappy and you want X, that is not what I want at this time, but I understand that is what you want.

I wouldn't bring up alternatives, he knows what his options are, he's done nothing but think about them for the last few weeks. Try and be strong, you want to seem like your ok with whatever he wants to do, if you breakdown it will reinforce why he wants it.

Don't mention EA, again he doesn't care what you think about it.

And finally, WHAT? You've been talking to someone? Like dating? If your talking about here, no don't mention any type of counseling or advice you've received. If you've been talking personally to someone, don't tell him but let us know.


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Ok so I should not jump the gun and approach then?

-When said "talking to someone"... I have been talking to the person who wrote the MR prog I did before stumbling on this forum/techniques. Similar to DB.
-Guess EA really effecting me and want to discuss it together. Someone had mentioned setting boundary around that?
-And know others have suggested some type of counseling after BD so thought maybe would bring up as well?

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Jzmill:

Your sit is awful and I feel for you. The EA is a no win sit. You need to stay clear from it as far as you can. No matter what happens it will blow up. My W started an EA. I suspected it was a PA, I pushed and pushed her to see if she was in a PA. She denied it. So I snooped - then asked again, Still no. Then I deceived her and manipulated her to expose it. She finally admitted it was a secret friendship - she still does not see it as EA. I contacted him and told him to not stay clear from my W (no threat - Just that it was not cool to have a secret friendship with a man's wife). He agreed and dropped her like a stone. No everything is a disaster.

Do what you can to stay clear of the EA. The people here would say the best strategy is to make yourself more attractive or see what he would be missing. It's hard to do when you are hurt. I hope my experience can help you.

BBiz

P.S. I continue to pray for you


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MR:20
D:21
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BD-Sept 2015
Suspected PA Sept 2015-Confronted W & OM Dec 2015
Actually EA
In house Sep:Jan/16-May 2016
W moved out:May 22 2016
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Originally Posted By: Jzmill
Ok so I should not jump the gun and approach then?

-When said "talking to someone"... I have been talking to the person who wrote the MR prog I did before stumbling on this forum/techniques. Similar to DB.
-Guess EA really effecting me and want to discuss it together. Someone had mentioned setting boundary around that?
-And know others have suggested some type of counseling after BD so thought maybe would bring up as well?


-Do not approach him about separation or divorce, unless it is something you want.

- don't tell him about any counseling or techniques you've had or learned, just do them, actions speak louder than words.

- you say EA, but if I remember correctly the OW didn't want anything to do with him, is that still the case? if it is, then he has more of a fantasy R in his head, but I guess there's not much a difference. Hopefully a vet can help on how to address this, it's so hard to deal with when they work together, because it's gonna be really hard to snap out of it when he sees her everyday. I'm not sure how you set boundaries for a R that is only in his head.

- counseling would be for you. As long as he's off in Lala land, he won't want to work on M and would just be blaming you for everything.


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C,

Ok thanks agree a vets help on above would be good then.

Previoysly someone said it's an EA even if one sided and correct is fantasy, ow likely knows.

Talked with Pastor and he said he is avail to help if I wanted to ask H to come along. I think may be good but agree if H has mindset does would not be open to working on?

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Think H is deep in fog. I do not want ro feel defeated but somewhat do. I am so emotionally drained.

Having the misc and this sitch all combined is more then can handle. I was actually looking into this retreat for women to help deal with stress and to help with healing and getting back to self. sounds like its about 3 months.

Not sure if considered running away/how would help us? but I need to think about me and thinking of discussing with H?

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Jzmill,

Keep yourself busy, that will help in forgetting what H is doing. I know it is hard but thinking about your WAS will do nothing to help you.

Do something different for yourself. I know I still have a long way to go for me but I keep trying, you can do this.

I feel your hurt that you want to reach out to H but you need to let him reach out to you. The more you contact him the more you will push him away and ensure you are his plan B.

Stay positive.


H-46 XW-38 T-7 M-6
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S 11/30/15, I filed 12/8/15
EA 2/1/16 D dismissed 3/24/16
PA 3/18/16 confirmed 4/22/16
XW files for D 4/1/16 - D final 11/17/16
Finally moving forward...
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JimKao, appreciate feedback.

I am trying to stay busy. Finding tough at times when home together. Trying not to let resentment build. Do not want to lose the initial fire to keep going but H is putting all energy into EA.

It is so painful and feeling how on earth would his mind change. Know BD coming and feel so down and scared.

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BBiz,
Almost did not see your thoughts above. It is difficult to keep pain of EA in but understand your viewpoint thanks. Think I figured since H has mindset does that mine as well let it out.

H asked me if I realized I forgot to make his lunch today. I said "I did..oh well." He said "that's ok." I could not believe it. All your energy is on ow and you are about to BD and you ask me about a sandwich. Ugh.

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As C mentioned above think H unable to snap out/fade feelings for ow since together each day at office. Are there any boundaries that can help with this? Goodness seems impossible to get around.

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Any thoughts on above question?

Tonight I went over neighbors to play games. Got a "bye" after I said it and when got home H was playing games. Got nothing, not even "how was it"...seems becoming the norm which is sad and upsetting. I want to shake H and say stop this.

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Well H becoming more cold and distant last couple days. Keeping busy but down.

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JZ, I'm sorry to hear that you feel things are not getting better, but you haven't got the bomb drop that you were fearing, so that's a plus.

I would suggest not to tell your H specifically what you are doing, be more mysterious. Instead of saying that your going to neighbors to play games, just tell him your going out, if he asks for more, tell him to hang out with friends to have some fun.... If he asks for more, just say I won't be too late, c-ya...


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C, that makes sense. H knew I was planning on that already since neighbor mentioned when we were outside.

Not sure how those who know BD is coming any second handle that? I race myself with each interaction it is emotional. I do not want to give up but feel like have used last ounce I have.

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H was taking nap so I took walk and then hung outside to check out stars. When up H looked around for me and then guess called. When he came outside he said what are you doing and had upset tone that I did not answer. Cannot win Ugh.

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JZ, do you feel like you owe him minute by minute updates based on how he is treating you? Of course not, him getting frustrated is ok, because that's his issue not yours. If I read correctly, you were enjoying yourself, that is what matters.


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01/10/18 - D Finalized
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Originally Posted By: Jzmill
H was taking nap so I took walk and then hung outside to check out stars. When up H looked around for me and then guess called. When he came outside he said what are you doing and had upset tone that I did not answer. Cannot win Ugh.


Jzm,

Take my words for what you'd like... but this is a win in my eyes. Look at what Cnut said to you before... When you tell him every little detail of your life, he shows carelessness, disinterested, and unwilling to engage.

You disappear for 20 minutes and he doesn't know where you are? He's running around looking, calling, and then takes an angry/upset tone towards you... (remember, anger/upset comes from emotion/hurt). You don't get angry or upset with someone you don't give two cents about.

I'd suggest more of what Cnut said... do more, but say less. If he asks you, be mysterious. It sounds like he's a controller, and it seems, while he shows he doesn't care about you, or your actions... as soon as you do stuff without him knowing, he's all up in your biz...

I wish you well, Jzm.


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Originally Posted By: Coconut
If I read correctly, you were enjoying yourself, that is what matters.

oh yeah, and on this topic, i was advised not to do things JUST to get a reaction out of your spouse, but if it's something you truly want to do, something you feel provides value to your life (other than making your H worry about you), then do it, and do more of it!


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C-I did enjoy doing those things you are right, and no do not think need to give constant update.

betterm- thanks for thoughts I agree. Figured with his mindset he would not use his energy on me especially since has been more cold and distant recently. Will keep that in mind about doing things to get reaction. Wish you well too.

Refraining from not reacting to certain things and keeping general thoughts to the point but is tough.

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Feeling down...Know need to keep busy and not bring anything up but knowledge of EA and the process is really wearing on me.

H still cold/distant. tone when calling not pleasant. Other day when got home ignored me and went upstairs. I did not pursue and let be. H falling asleep while we watch tv. I continue watching some and other times go outside/walk.

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I'm sorry I missed this post yesterday, I hope you pulled through okay and having a better day today!

I know a lot of people on here are against the bringing up of an EA. I was in a similar situation as you are, in "knowing" that there was an EA with OM she works with (text/phone bill records showed over 1,000 texts in 10 day period, going sometimes through 3-4AM when I wasn't around... she was with 'girls', etc)...

Every single minute was filled with conflict of confronting, or not confronting, and it was weighing everything I did down. Trouble at work, trouble at home, trouble everytime I happened to see my WW. Finally I changed plans, and confronted her about the EA. However, I did it with help/resources of others on this forum in how to execute.

Like many said, confronting the EA will not help you in reconciling your MR. It will probably (definitely) result in pissing your spouse off to the point they will rage/yell/callnames/etc. and this is exactly what happened when I did it. However, from that moment on, I've had a much clearer vision of what I'm trying to accomplish. Instead of the LBS fog, I had the EA-confrontation fog, that was clouding every last thought I had.

Now, it probably drove my WW away from me more than she already was, but my goal was accomplished. I calmly said to her, (summary inc) "I know I've done some things to get us to this point, and I've created a void and distance that has forced you to make the decisions you've made in wanting to leave this R. All I wanted to say is that I know you've been talking to another man, more frequently that someone in an MR should. I'm not telling you this to cause a fight, and I'm not telling you that you can, or can't talk to whoever you want, but I want you to know I find that behavior unacceptable in any marriage that I want to be a part of." There were a lot of interruptions, and I'm surprised I made it as far as I didn't without erupting, but after she "fought back", I just said "I don't wish to discuss this any further, but the evidence is downstairs on the table, and I just wanted you to know. If you'd like to talk about it at another time, we can talk later when things have cooled off."

Sorry for the lengthly post, but that's about how my confrontation went, and although it didn't "help" the MR, it "helped ME!" From that moment, I was able to stop snooping, stop worrying about her and her actions, stop thinking about what kind of reactions I was going to get from my WW on each given action, etc. It set me free to focus purely on my DB path of bettering myself, without having her in the back of my head all the time...

Take this with a grain of salt, as it could be the one thing that "tips her over" and it very may well feel like you've ruined your chances forever... That's how I felt when it was all done, and the next day, I felt 100x better.


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betterm,
appreciate the feedback. Still down.

Some time ago I wrote letter approaching it. H said I was mistaken and would not betray me. There have been moments that I want to bring up again but have not since then.

It was mentioned an EA regardless if OP has not recipricated. I agree with that. H def. in fog and does not see the wrong in putting his energy outside the M. It may not be foundation but does not help matters. Knowing he is at work w. OP painful. And him making last minute plans to escape is as well.

The way you confronted seemed good. As you said afraid would "tip him over" to BD. It is not a good feeling tho knowing his mind is set but neither is getting consumed in worrying so much. Ugh.

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I don't consider my W filing BD as her mind was set. I think it was just a continuation of her threats saying "how day you attack me, I am the one that's mad and leaving you" (that's not what I did). Do you have any evidence? Him being in denial is normal, that's what the "just friends" theory is based on. He doesn't even realize it's an EA. My wife argued the same thing until I mentioned "if it was the other way around, and I was texting an attractive woman I worked with several nights, until 4am, while your not around, what would you call it? Would you be mad?" and her tone shifted a little bit. (she got much angrier, yelling, furious, etc, and that's about when she stormed out)...


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I don't consider my W filing BD as her mind was set. I think it was just a continuation of her threats saying "how day you attack me, I am the one that's mad and leaving you" (that's not what I did). Do you have any evidence? Him being in denial is normal, that's what the "just friends" theory is based on. He doesn't even realize it's an EA. My wife argued the same thing until I mentioned "if it was the other way around, and I was texting an attractive woman I worked with several nights, until 4am, while your not around, what would you call it? Would you be mad?" and her tone shifted a little bit. (she got much angrier, yelling, furious, etc, and that's about when she stormed out)...


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Even tho the EA confrontation was definitely part of the reason for filing, it definitely was not THE reason. And even though she filed, doesn't make me see my situation any differently, nor does it change my plan.


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The evidence are msgs saw from H to male friend about his feelings and being involved in group events together. He would be upset I came across but was not intentional. As someone put it H in lala land.

BD in my mind would be H saying he wants D. But see what you are saying and about EA in general. H doing last minute things which he knows bothers me. He prob is expecting me to break.

I have almost broken down saying how awful this has been since I am drained but somehow refrained from that.

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Just curious. What did that letter say? Was it direct, saying "I know this and I'm not here to argue" or was it more "I feel like you may be getting to close to ow" or "I'm asking you now if there is any feelings for ow to come forward now please"?


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betterm,
I should have presented it more like question but instead stated I knew he had feelings for someone at work. I mentioned it was painful to think about him using time and energy on this. That noticed him being more social, dressing better, doing more group and work things.

I ended letter saying what the life we built meant and was worth working through together. He initiated responding. He kept the letter, it is under a book in the office. Did hope getting out would make some difference but seems in fog more then ever and hope further then ever.

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I disagree. I think asking questions will get you nowhere. It's all about being confident in what you know, stating it firmly, but not rudely, and keeping emotions in check when WAS gets defensive. You're not gonna get WAS to admit anything, especially when he doesn't see it for what it is.


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Well handled somewhat ok, somehow checked emotions. But right if H does not see the wrong in it then not going to get anywhere. It is very frustrating. What makes me mad is his married male coworker supporting it and not telling him not right. Hard to keep in when he does things with work ppl.

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Are these 'work activities' something that other spouses are invited to / involved in? Not sure if you're referring to activities that go on DURING work, or extracurricular activities they are doing outside of work?


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Good question..sometimes it is during work/related like dinner meetings towards end of day. But mostly it is right after work things like the team playing cards and grabbing subs, playing bball. Spouses not included but if were he prob would not ask me along. He used to give better heads up but now will wait til end of work day to tell me plans.

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Completely guessing here, but maybe it's because he's conflicted on whether or not he doing the right thing? Don't read into that too much, just a thought.

I know I'm guilty of doing this, but when plans would come up that I knew my W wouldn't be happy about, I used to have trouble informing her in advance as well. Since things are 'more' rocky between you all, he may be trying to just 'avoid' telling you for as long as he can, so that the repercussions of the event aren't something he'd have to deal with all day long, as opposed to right before he's out in a social environment, where it's easy to forget about them.

I know I mentioned to you before, but, do you still give him forewarning of every last thing you are doing? In your GAL activities, do you always let him know what's going on?


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Along with being cold/distant H has had this miserable/feel sorry for me look on his face and letting out sighs at times. It is tough not to react to when I feel like saying to him to take a step back and evaluate himself and put yourself in my shoes for a minute. Hard to wrap head around the "he is hurting as well" part.

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Wait, he's giving you like the "sympathetic, I'm sorry you're going through this look"? Or he's trying to show you that he's also suffering and having a hard time through this? Those are two different things, so wanted to make sure I understood the gesture before commenting.


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Sry was not clear. No neither of those. Seems more of a frustration with himself that he has delayed MR talk since his minds made up. Would not mind if it was due to him having tough time as well, but does not seem to be the case.

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I know it's hard, but don't even acknowledge it. He has no valid reason to play the PPM card on you. You have to make a decision to show him the consequences, or let him play his mind games... He's not the victim here.


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That is what I thought..no valid reason. Part of me sees slight hope in delay so holding off to see what comes of it. The other part is saying that I do not want to be stuck in the mud like this long term.

So when you say "show him consequences" does that mean through actions?..or actual conversation? If you mean words would that include my feelings/knowledge on EA?

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Originally Posted By: Jzmill

So when you say "show him consequences" does that mean through actions?..or actual conversation? If you mean words would that include my feelings/knowledge on EA?

I meant actions. Do not give in to his pity party. You need to keep feelings and emotions out of all conversations right now. I'm not saying don't confront about EA, but if you do, don't show emotions/feelings/hurt, etc. I mean consequences by making a plan and sticking to it, and that plan has to be for you and you only (well kids too), but definitely a plan that does not involve him at all. That plan, and sticking to that plan (don't change plans during emotional crisis) is essentially the same plan that shows the consequences, indirectly.


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Ok will think about plan.

I know not to leave our bedroom but on occasion ill sleep in the guest room. More so when he plays golf real early and if Im not feeling well ill mention going to. It is good to have that at times since I am not sleeping great and when feeling upset do not want to be in same room.

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Has been a tough week. Was thinking that H does let me know of plans but still tough but have not reacted. He will not be home for dinner next couple nights for work event/Gbye dinner. Will do what can to stay busy myself.

Planning to hike with group on sat am. and cont with walks/reading. This process and feeling of being stuck in mud really wearing on me. Not sure what plan to have but know need to be consistent. Still somehow have dash of hope for turn around.

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Jz, I hate to say this, but your gonna be stuck in the mud until you pull yourself out of it... When you get fed up with worrying about what he is doing and decide your gonna do what's right for you. Are you tired of sleeping in MBR with a H who has a fantasy or real EA with OW? If so, tell him that you will not share your marital bed with someone who has or is trying to bring someone else into your M. Stand up for yourself, tell you H what you will not tolerate. Try not to get angry or emotional, just tell him matter of factly.


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Ps, time to start a new thread.


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