WAW - Marching to the D

[isittoolate]

Hi Sotto - thanks for checking on me - the talk was yesterday and a little exhausting so I didn't post.

Sat: I went to my friends flat to have a look - it was disappointing as its really is very small and unsuitable for my boys to stay over. The whole flat is too small and though it would be cheap and cost effective short term solution I feel that it's too far of a step down from my 4 bedroom detached house. It feels like student accommodation - 

The R talk was on Sunday after my GAL activity - a 58 mile cycle ride with the local club! I wasn't going to miss that!

I stated my position that W would get a letter from my L - saying that I intended to separate and would like W to halt  D proceedings in the interim to give time and space for reflection. My decision to separate would be non-binding i.e. I could change my mind depending on W's position and taking into consideration the financial implications.

Inevitably this led to deep and long R talk about all aspects of separation and D. Especially the financial split and a little about assets split and the kids.

W is off a mind to go straight to D and sell our house and downsize as she thinks that separating and waiting a year would leave her worse off financially and only benefit me.
Remortgaging (buying me out) would leave her with too much debt to cover and little savings. I think her argument is flawed and with a few cutbacks she could do it.

I  reasoned (without pressure) that if we separate the financial position would be similar after one year. A chunk of the mortgage would be paid off with the house value going up a little - which we then share. She could still sell after one year as another option.
She is  thinking that the house value goes up and then she will just have more debt to cover by remortgaging.

It's complicated and without carefully going through the maths it's difficult to workout which would be best for her.

She hasn't really thought it through or thought about how I would afford to separate. There are only 3 furnished properties in our small city for rent, and furnishing a 2bed apartment would cost £3/4000.

She does seem aggrieved that I will get half 'her savings' although for the last 11 years most of my savings have gone to the boys University funds - approx £20,000 - she has saved about £5000 for them. Yes she does earn more than I do, and saves more, and has spent more of 'her' savings on family holidays etc but I have proportionally saved just as much.

She did say that she wished that she had given me an ultimatum before going to her L. In other words if I didn't leave the house she would seek a D immediately.  But now that L's are involved I think she will go with the advice of her L.

Also at one stage she really hurt me by asking 'What is in it for you?' - I gave her a truth dart. 

'You asked me what was in it for me' ' well there is nothing in it for me....I lose my marriage, my wife, my home, my family, time with the boys, and some financial security.....there is nothing in it for me!'

This hit home and she apologised saying she didn't mean it to come out that way. She apologised repeatedly.

At various stages she tried to hug me, the first time I refused but she got upset so I relented.

She weeped a bit at times as well.

She also thanked me for being so nice all week and for being collaborative, open minded, and flexible.

She also said that last Monday she missed me - I was working away in London two nights. No expectations but she needs to miss me more!!

At the end she said she would consider all that we had talked about and I said I would continue to look for somewhere to rent.

I need to move out regardless of what she decides - and just get financial agreements as to how we pay the rent and bills for two properties. 

She wants to pay all the bills on our property if I pay all the bills on the rental. I want to add all the bills from both properties together and divide the bills proportional to our income. I did the maths and either way is very similar.

We ended the day by her cooking my meal and us watching the movie 'Beasts of No Nation' starring Idris Elba (brutal but very very good). She was tense so I gave her a shoulder rub - probably shouldn't have but I think it helped us both.

[Sotto]

Hi Isit, I'm sorry to hear that. It sounds like it was a tough day for you both (((Isit)))) I had a similar impasse with finances with my H. He wanted to sell our house. I would only do that as part of full settlement (as per L advice). He would only Settle finances as part of a D. As you say, your W will be guided by her L I guess - as will you.

One thing I would say is I wouldn't limit yourself to furnished properties only. You've probably seen what the market is like locally already and nice places tend to go like hot cakes. Best to cast your net as widely as you can.

I used a couple of furniture thrift shops to furnish my place (and a few bits from our marital home.) The thrift stuff all came on a big van a few days later, and I figure I'll donate it all back when I'm properly sorted - and it all benefits them. It's all nice stuff (truly I have high standards ) The only things I bought new were mattresses and a sofa cover. I guess I spent about £300 in all and my flat is a little palace.

Just a thought anyway - and I know the good places if you want to get stuff

I'm off to a DRW event in a minute.....soon you'll be able to pick and choose some of the stuff you do with them too.

Take care

[isittoolate]

Hi Sotto - You are such a kind and caring soul, thanks for all your advice!

Please tell me about the good places, I am open to all ideas.
It's late 3am and I'm tired after a work meal and late drinks so forgive me if I'm brief
X

[Sotto]

Sounds like a good night out - hope you're not too tired today! My top place is a big warehouse called the 'Big Shop" - 10 miles to the West of here in C. It's run by a cancer charity. I've also just been told of a recycling store next to the tip - south of here in SC - haven't been there yet, but I think a couple of us are going to help one of the DRW guys furnish his new empty rental house with a trip there. T - 8 miles to the SE, also has a couple of good furniture thrift stores.

I found that a day visiting a couple of these and a trip to IKEA were enough to sort me out...

My flat is right in the heart of the city - with THE best view L has to offer - I would never have got that, had I limited to furnished only...again all JMHO though.

Take care

[Huddy]

Yeah, don't touch furnished properties - it's a con. I managed to get everything I need (that includes TV etc.) from IKEA, Argos and the like and spend less than £1K. Look at it as a 'now' living arrangement, not forever. Who knows where you'll be in 12 months time.

I'm not sure exactly where you live (I guess, from your code, it's south of Brum), but I would think you should be able to find a decent size unfurnished for less that £700 pm. I guess, if I've got your location right, the London commuter market has an effect, but just keep reminding yourself - 'now, not forever'.

[Sotto]

Hi Isit, just checking in to see how you're doing today my friend x

[isittoolate]

Hi Sotto - not too bad. I've been away at a big work meeting in Manchester. Two big nights out with work colleagues I don't see very often as my day-to-day job is pretty much solo with customers. I got to bed at 3am and 1am so tonight is catch up.

I had mixed feelings of sadness and regret in Manchester as more or less exactly one year ago I organised a Valentine's weekend in Manchester with W. It was fab and a highlight (for me) of last year. An overnight stay in a hotel, cocktails followed by a quick valentines meal, followed by a comedy show in Manchester Arena. We also had sex - one of the last times - I remember the lingerie W put on.

Anyway enough of that... W contacted me on Monday by phone, I didn't answer but rang back two hours later as boys about to go to bed. She said 'are you avoiding answering my calls, I said 'no the bar was too noisy!

After talking to the boys, I closed down the convo with W.

Tuesday no contact
Wednesday - text tennis - more or less exclusively about the boys. Again I was saddened as she gave me dates of a holiday in Spain for her and boys in August.

We seem to be dividing up Easter, half term , and the Summer holidays . Both of us taking the boys off on holiday - just separately and the boys no nothing about it. Last year we did all these things as a family - it [censored]!

One piece of good news is that I will be visiting the U.S. In March - Wisconsin - a week of work related stuff.

[Sotto]

Hi Isit, just dropping in to send my good wishes on Valentine's Day. I hope you manage to have the best day possible in all circumstances. Yes, it's difficult to think about what we were doing in former years. For me, our last nice VD was three years ago. Last year I was on my own, and the year before that H was 'out' of the M (I realise in hindsight.)

It's a lovely morning and a good day to be out on your bike if that's what you have planned. Sorry to hear about holiday plans being made - I can appreciate that must be sad, and do let yourself grieve these recent developments.

Good news about your trip though - nice to have something to look forward to. Any news on the house hunting front? One of my DRW chums gets the keys to his new place this week. He's been staying with his folks for a while, so it's a big development for him. We've offered to help if he needs it.

Hope you manage to have a reasonable day, keep posting and take care

[sandi2]

Let me ask a question. Do you really want this woman to share your life b/c you love her so much you feel you can't live without her? Or.......are you thinking of the woman you want her to become? Or......is the real issue more about the attachment and desire you have for a loving companionship and to live in a happy committed environment? Is it not the security you find in marriage that you really want?

I read story after story that is so similar to yours, and I have to wonder (by what is reported) how on earth the LBH would want to be that particular woman who treats him so badly. Then when I go further into his story, it seems he is fighting to hold on to the environment and security of having a partner in life. Having someone already there, available, to go with him to see a movie or have dinner, someone at home so he won't be lonely. Even if she is the b'tch from hell, and truth be told....he has no happiness with her....yet he seems to choose that option over the idea of venturing out as a single man again. The whole idea of meeting a new woman and going out to a movie, or whatever, scares him. What would he talk about to this new woman? With his old wife, he didn't have to worry about finding something to talk about.

I'm not giving any advice here, I'm just sharing what I see from a distance. I don't want to be thought of as an advocate of divorce. I just see life being very short and a person's life being worth having the love and happiness they deserve, instead of settling for being in a R where they are completely rejected and disrespected day after day. What kind of life is that? Why would anyone choose those conditions over being single?

I am just asking, and I hope it doesn't sound judgmental. I have not experienced loneliness and I've been told it can lead a person to settle for second best many times. The world is full of people. People who want someone. They just need to find each other.

[Sotto]

Hi Isit, I'm just checking in to see how you are doing. Noticed you haven't been posting last few days and hope you're bearing up. Do drop us an update when you get chance and let us know how things are going.

Take care my friend