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Irish, on the one hand I feel for you. On the other? I'm happy you no longer have that hanging over your or your daughter's heads.

Quote:
I read so many sitchs here and I am yet to find one that resembles mine.
I suggest you re-read a few in a few months time. I think you'll see that you are not alone - just in a much rarer part of the club. No joy in that, but perhaps some solace that you are not the first nor only to face similar. I personally know several people that have similar stories.

One difference among them is the extent that MLCr's seem to fight for time with the kids. It's odd how they walk away and then fight to make the other parent look like trash. Then again, it's not that out of character, right? Seems human to me at this point and has a lot to do with identity in my opinion.

It takes time to wrap your noggin around it. Don't fight it. It'll come to you in time.

I will say that in the majority of situations I've seen, the exes later can be friendly again. Even good friends, years later. For most of what I've seen, it seems 5-10 years. A few, never. My guess is that you'll not be on friendly terms with your ex although it would at some point be nice to have. Why? Because I don't think she can face what you represent to her.

If it helps: Why the lies? Identity. Imagine if your identity was as the protagonist in your own story? I doubt your subconscious would like that very much and you would be tempted to create a different "truth" right (I really hope Oprah falls down the stairs for her part in that idea of creating your own "truth" and all the damage that does to people. But I digress....)? MLCr's are human too, even if they seem more dragon like sometimes smile

To add to what mirage mentioned - to those who go through life based on feelings, life is a tragedy. Those who go through life based on thought, life is a comedy. I'll add to that - Those who balance the two are able to find contentment. Those that are really good at it? They can find contentment in any situation.

I wish you that contentment, Irish. And your daughters. I think when you feel that contentment, you'll truly see the gift you've been given.

Peace,
AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
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Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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Irish

Sorry to hear --I was so hurt when I received those papers
I never thought XH would actually file

I was thinking the other day how grateful my xh left without further damaging the kids
They never had to meet his creepy W
they never were subjected to her 18 Confused D
or her drug addict parents
they never had to know who their Dad turned into
It wasn't what I would have wanted but in my situation it was probably for the best
Hang in


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Irish, I'm so very sorry you have been served papers and that your Ds had to witness it. Bless them, they are so very lucky to have such an amazing dad! It shows what a remarkable dad you are to them that they wanted you to go in the store with them when they were buying bras. At least they get to grow up knowing how the men in their lives should treat them, you are doing an incredible job at showing them that. As job said, it is going to take a lot for your W to come back from this, if she ever does. Thank you so much for posting on my thread when you have all this going on. You help me no end and I'm very grateful.


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Originally Posted By: AJM

It's odd how they walk away and then fight to make the other parent look like trash. Then again, it's not that out of character, right? Seems human to me at this point and has a lot to do with identity in my opinion.


Hi AJ , great info and knowledge that you share each time you post. I thank you.

Yes she does seem to need to justify her actions that I'm trash. Then she will email the D's on how I'm a good dad. At least she doesnt trash me to them. Then again they know more of the truth then she does.


Peace - i agree. It's for the best they don't witness this new W.
We try to protect our kids and end up focusing on the pain they feel about missing the person out MLC'r once were. They will learn to accept that she is who she is now. But like AJ said , it's years away if at all. We are lucky in a way Peace. Our kids are stable and safe from witnessing this MLC. You are a strong woman, it shows in your posts and on the ones you post to others. I stand corrected AJ . Peace is a similar sitch. I guess I need to re-read some now that my own mind is clearer.

Inpain- yes they cried then got mad at W. I know it's a step that has to happen. W hasn't felt any consequences yet. Time for her is weeks to our months. She says things happened days ago when it was last September.
Me being a dad is my number 1 job. My W always told them that if they get boyfriends make sure they are like their Daddy. The girls told me this not long ago after W said the last 10 years were fake.
You are very welcome for my input, I hope I help. I really feel your pain. Wish I could take it from you for one day so you could take a break and find you.


Girls got an email . I counted the ones they got since W left in August last year. A grand total of 7 including this one. Then again there was one the D15 initiated when's she asked for her WII and tablet back. W said they were broken in the move.

Today's email was more of the same. Except she contradicted herself.
She says to othes that i Prevent her from seeing them. In the email she says I know daddy wants me to see you and isn't preventing you from seeing me. Then She goes on saying she made this mess. She hopes one day they will forget all this and want to see her.

Forget? Is she mad. Oh I forget , yes she is. They can't forgive by forgetting. I did that 10 years ago. Forgetting what she did. I can't forget this time. She hopefully will mature and work on the forgive part. Lots of work for her but I have faith one day she'll do it.

Warm weather here. Skiing and skating is closed for a while. So planning a road trip this weekend with the girls to visit some friends we usually only see in the summer .

Irish


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Hi
I know the answer to this riddle already but I need to ask it anyway and to get it off my chest and scream HOW, WHY then HOW again. I am banging my head against the wall on this one.

How could a mother tell people that her daughters are writing her emails of hatred and calling her names? When in fact they are not. They have replied to less than half of her 6 emails to them.

She has done too much damage and she is past the point of no return. I am really starting to believe this is the new W and this is who she is. I should be saying STBXW. The W i knew would never make up stories about her girls. Attack me OK but the D's that is not going to happen.

Worse thing is I had to ask the D's about it. They're faces dropped. Insulted that their mom is saying that about them.
My lawyer is in shock a mother would do and say this. Probably to gain nothing more than a little relieve from her own guilt.

You may be asking why i shared this information about their mom to my D's. Well the inquiry request came from the lawyers. I usually protect my D's on what their mom is doing or saying.

just venting..


Irish


M51
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Irish, I'm a silent follower. I have nothing but admiration for your strength and your parenting.

You are asking how their mother can do what she is doing. I might be able to give you some insight to this. My mother had a very long psyche history. She was mentally ill. We never had a good "normal". Mother daughter relationship, she was physically there, yet completely absent. My dad was the one there for me. He left my mom when I was 17. ( still my rock and support, he never " left" me). My mom fell apart went back to drugs, ect. It was bad. She was quite awful to me at times, blaming me for things, resenting me because my dad still loved me, expecting me, as a 19 year old to support and help her. She would tell me she hated me , not talk to me, threaten suicide ( which she eventually succeeded in).

My point is, your W has sunk so far down into a depression she has alienated anything that means anything to her. She is mentally ill. A mother who would do whAt she is doing can only be very very mentally ill.

It is not an excuse. But she just isn't in her right mind. And there really is nothing you or your daughters can do to pull her out of that hole. Lord knows I tried with my mom. My dad tried for the whole marriage. She's going to have to want to help herself.

Even after all the awful stuff, I knew my mom loved me. The best she knew how. I always reminded myself she was sick. She had a real illness which is very difficult to treat.

Hang in there. You are doing such an amazing job, and your daughters will thrive because of it, I promise you that.

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Originally Posted By: Ginger1


Even after all the awful stuff, I knew my mom loved me. The best she knew how. I always reminded myself she was sick.


Hi Ginger, thank you so much for your message and encouragement. I am so so sorry for your mom.

There is something about that phrase you wrote that you had to keep reminding yourself that she was not well. I read it while making supper. When those words entered my thoughts I thought of what D15 always does.. she reminds herself of the exact same thing . Even writing this now to you my eyes fill with water.

She even reminds me of this. I tend to forget and accept W and that is who she is now. Your words sent a chill down my spine and i cried.

I pray my D's get their mother back and they can have a healthy relationship. I know its all up to W.

now to go hug my D's

x
Irish


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Irish

It may be a touch of mental illness, mlc or addiction
or a little of each
Maybe we never really know
I also think some people follow the script of their parents
MY XH followed his dads choices even though they never had a relationship
I hope my son can break the chain
Alanon is a great program where people discuss living/coping with the effects of alcohol with the people we love
usually meetings are everywhere and phone meetings as well
It is hard for us to understand why the MLCer or addicted person would do crazy things but if a person is under the effects of drugs and alcohol, they do not live in reality..they live in denial
we continue to detach and let go
we never know or can control another persons behavior and choices


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Hi Peace
I think you are right.
Originally Posted By: peacetoday

I also think some people follow the script of their parents


I will not let my girls follow their moms path that's for sure. I always said to W she reminded me of her mother. She hated that. It was small pockets that would shine through. The cold and narcissist way about her mother that I saw in my W. It would last 10 min or an hour.. but it was there. Slowly creeping out to take over the loving , caring W that I knew.

So I think I have to accept that W is no more. W had so many issues with her Mom. Cried so many times. Now W is her.
I've said it a few times that I would never date someone like her mother. I can't even call her MIL any more because of what she did to my girls. A grandmother she is not. Both girls will have nothing to do with W's mother.

This week every emotion was coming out of the D's. Anger and hurt to sadness and pain. We talked a lot about the past 7 months and for some reason last night it was so emotional for them. I did not cry or say anything. I let them talk. They were on the couch glued to each other. They were crying a little but not huge tears. More emotional tears of sadness and maybe acceptance.

They have such a view of this that if anyone heard them on the details they have on what W did, they would be in shock. No bad words or name calling, no blaming her either. Just the facts of what she did to them and me. The recall more than I do. They brought up the police a lot on how W tried to push me to snap at her while she was taping every conversation we had back then. Hoping I'd yell at her and she'd call the police and claim spousal abuse or whatever she had as a scheme back then to get me out of the house. I did remain calm. They also talked about how when i was out of the house in the beginning W use to get annoyed if the D's came upstairs. They slept together when I was away. This was only one week because right after all her outburst and drinking and offering D15 who was 14 at the time some pot if she wanted it the girls never left my side. They were afraid of W. When W finally left the house in August the D's would sleep in the upstairs living area with mattresses on the floor. They only started sleeping separately in their own rooms in late September.

I let them vent and even threw in a joke or 2 to lighten the mood. we finished by talking about the stories I use to make up about a boys adventures that went wrong. I did this every night when they were 6 and 8yrs old and stopped when they were about 10 and 12. D13 wants me to start again. :-) I will make one up next week and this one a special one, I'll include 2 young girls 6 and 8yrs old based on my D's.

I went to bed and I cried. They are dealing with this and I can see they will be affected by it for the rest of their lives. I have either forgotten or blocked out some of W's actions 7 months ago. They recall it all and it seems they have a lot more inside to tell. I am going to look into personal therapy for them. The last time the D's saw a therapist they said that the girls were fine. They are expressing their emotions openly. They are doing well in school, sleeping and eating. They are also not hurting themselves or taking it out in an aggressive way on others. I'm still worried for them.

Today the D's woke up happy. I told them they could each have a friend sleep over.

So tonight I hear them laughing up a storm downstairs. Watching movies and YouTube. I ordered in some food and just finished preparing a chocolate fondue for dessert. I guess the venting last night did well because they are back to their cheery selves. Being kids and enjoying life. That's is the most important thing for me right now.. is that they remain kids. They have plenty of time when they get older to worry about the dark side of life.

Tomorrow i'll take them on a safari drive through a state park. Its were the animals roam free (well in a gated section 2 hours north of the city).
Deer, moose, antelope, wolves, black bears, buffalo etc etc etc.. All local to this area or northern parts of the country. We use to go their when they were a lot younger. They are excited to go.


Irish


M51
XW43 (38 at bd)
BD1 MAY 30 2015
BD2 JUNE 25 2015 by text
moved out Aug 2 2015
left both Daughters 13 and 15 (now 18-20)
Her divorce Final July 26 2016
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Irish, you mentioned that your W had a narcissistic mother. I just recently started reading about daughters of narcissistic mothers. I think my mother has a lot of trends. And I adopted some specific behaviors from growing up with this kind of mother. When I look back now, I think I behaved like a narcissist myself sometimes. I didn’t give my son the emotional support he needed because I was too concentrated on my own feelings and on my problems. I also didn’t know what it would be like to be there for your child emotionally. I came a long way during these last few years. I realize now that I do not have narcissistic tendencies, and my certain behavior was a product of growing up with my mother.

And even then, I cannot not imagine abandoning my son and then blaming him for not wanting to communicate with me. I do hope that your W will work through her childhood issues and will be able to repair her relationship with her daughters.

I am so happy to hear that the therapist said that your Ds are fine. Not surprising, as they have a very strong support in you. Yes, they will get angry and sad some times, but it seems like they can process these feelings in a healthy way and still enjoy their lives and be the kids.

Have fun at the safari!


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