MB, I find myself nodding when I read your posts. I agree it can be overwhelming to see all the lost marriages. If you read my opening post on my new thread it speaks to that a little.
It's good to validate those feelings, but for me it helps to do something small. You can't control the loss, or the feelings that come. But do something small to get started working in the areas that you can control. If working out or dieting is too much, what about walking up and down one flight of stairs? Sometimes the first steps are the hardest, and if we take a tiny baby step good things start happening.
More to the point than working out is this- keep taking DB steps. I've been trying to find an opportunity to post on your thread ever since you asked me to a few weeks ago, but I haven't seen a place I can jump in. I like to talk, so to me that tells me you aren't digging very deep right now or challenging yourself enough. DB forums can be great for support while you grieve, but Michelle's books didn't say "curl into a ball and find a bunch of people that empathize with your pain". She talked about goal setting, 180s, GAL, and finding new ways to change the dynamic in your R. What are your goals? What are your 180s? What were your contributions to the breakdown of the M? What would you have done differently? Why weren't you able to do this before? What have you learned or how have you grown to be able to do better? In what ways do you demonstrate this in your current life?
Marriages fail because people act selfishly, lazily, and with feelings of resentment. Sometimes you have to work hard even when you don't feel like it. If you can't do it now, what makes you think you'd do better in a marriage?
I teach employees that you are always interviewing, that you should dress for the job you want not the job you have, try to do more than your job duties but instead take on as much as possible for your boss, etc. Well, the same way MB, I'd like you to start acting as if you were in piecing, and what you do today is important in the outcome of your M. You might think it's different in piecing because at least you have your partner, but if you've read any of it you know piecing is harder, because you DON'T really have your partner, you are afraid they might walk at any time, you aren't getting your needs met, you have a ton of resentment and pain that you are afraid of expressing the wrong way because it will lead back to D, and you are walking on eggshells and biting your tongue a lot. It's not easy.
Bottom line, what you do today makes a difference. If you sit back for three to six months it may feel like it doesn't matter if there is NC...but when OW is gone and he checks in on you, you will either be the person he left, or a great woman that has transcended the person he left in a way he didn't believe. This is what I'd like to see from you. No, he may not check back in on you. But you want to be that person anyway, right?
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
Great post Zues. We all need to remember that. This time alone is a luxury (I gag a little as I write that) we can use to work on ourselves. Even if now our motivation is to R, it still works the same. At the same time we have to forgive ourselves when the anxiety overtakes us. It just happens and it's not really under our control. Let's all vow to exercise for an hour today. They say it helps.
11/4/15 W revealed EA/2 months later became PA with co-worker Reconciling since late April 2016 Don't give up until it's time, then move on Be patient, strong and kind but never a doormat
11/4/15 W revealed EA/2 months later became PA with co-worker Reconciling since late April 2016 Don't give up until it's time, then move on Be patient, strong and kind but never a doormat
Zeus, for the most part I do agree with what you have to say when I read your posts. You seem to have done a lot of work on yourself and for understanding how people think and what they do. You think things through and try to help others by giving them advice. A bit long winded sometimes, but then again that's not a bad thing! That's why I asked for your thoughts on my thread.
It seems somehow that you have gotten the impression that I am just sitting here a crying blubbering blob that doesn't try to do anything to better myself of change at all. That is certainly not the case! I have felt down for the last few days and I do cycle between my moods/emotions, but that's to be expected.
As for my goals.... 1) I want to save my marriage. Guess that goes without saying. . 2) Loose weight--have been walking 3-5miles several times a week. I've lost 40lbs so far. I would also like to workout other than just walking (i.e. Go to the gym where I pay membership dues but never show up to participate in any classes). 3) Spend more time with my kids before they all move out of the house and are out on their own. 4) Rebuild relationships with my family and friends that I allowed myself to neglect because I allowed myself to be controlled and isolated. 5) Work on my marriage -- attempted this by going to counseling for 4 over months and talking to counselor. Finally gave up on this because I realized that I can't fix him and I can't make him want to come back to our marriage if he doesn't want to. This realization led me to... 6) Work on myself! I finally told the counselor that I didn't want to talk about my H anymore and I wanted to focus on ME and fix my self esteem issues. I go to IC once a week. 7) Become as attractive as possible (not sure if this belongs in the goals or 180 section). I wear makeup every day, fix my hair, bought new clothes, and I have lost and continuing to loose weight. I guess those are all of my active goals. I've also wanted to get back in to church, but have made no effort to physically go there yet. I have, however, been praying on a daily basis. Most days I pray many times just in case he didn't hear me.
My GAL activities have been almost nonexistent for the last week and a half, but that hasn't always been the case. I have spent a lot more time with my parents, my siblings and friends. I go spend time with friends playing cards, going out to eat, hanging out shopping in town. I have been to a couple of bars with my mother and her friend (she's my age). I even sang Karaoke twice! I've been out dancing twice with friends. I've gone to play bingo (didn't realize how expensive that is!). I go for walks. I have been to a few arts and crafts shows. I went to a couple of Christmas festivals. But, I guess for the most part I walk a lot and spend time with friends and family. Now, that may not sound like much, but for me that is huge because I'm normally a homebody!
As for 180's, probably not much in this department. It's a bit hard to do 180's when you are in almost constant NC with spouse. I guess that is my first 180. I no longer go over there and visit him all the time. He wants NC, so I try hard to stay away. I don't call, text, or go over there. However, on the rare times when I am around him, I try to validate as much as possible. I do NOT engage in any argument he tries to pull me in to. Considering that he likes to argue, that's huge for me. I usually try to avoid a fight but eventually get pulled in. Now, I just listen and validate.....and validate....and validate some more. UGH! I am taking better care of myself....loosing wt, makeup, new clothes, fixing hair, etc. Oh, and most importantly, I am faithfully practicing to STFU, being soft spoken while working on bettering my listening skills. I am bad about interrupting him, but no more. I will bite my tongue if I have to, but I will not interrupt! I also have not been disagreeing or correcting anything because he takes that as me calling him a liar or thinking he's not smart. Whatever!
When I am around H he tells me how nice I look. He tries not to look at me though. Says when he does, he never wants to stop. Or, he tells me I "hypnotize" him. That makes it seem like he's likes me, but then again, he doesn't want me around. I try to respect that so I am in NC, but getting tired of just sitting here.
Well, I'm at work and it's about to get busy again so I have to cut this off. I will check in later. Perhaps you'll have something more to add here. Maybe some ideas on what else I need to do or stop doing.
M:45 H:48 M:11 No kids BD:Sept'15 EA:Confirmed 1wk later PA: Oct'15 12 '15 2 wk R Just kidding, H wants NC 12 '15 H back w/OW 4 '15 R &still working on it
MB thanks for that synopsis. I'm looking forward to the comments. Glad you're ok.
11/4/15 W revealed EA/2 months later became PA with co-worker Reconciling since late April 2016 Don't give up until it's time, then move on Be patient, strong and kind but never a doormat
Zues, as for my marriage, it had problems that had gone on for way too long. I am married to a man that is a bit of a control freak and insanely jealous. He wants control of everything and most of all ME. I am not someone that wants to be controlled which caused lots of problems. He would get mad if I went anywhere, talked to anyone, touched my phone (even just to play a game), etc. He would constantly ask me question after question and I would answer him, but he would always tell me I was lying or it "just doesn't sound right." It got to where he wouldn't just TALK to me, I always felt like I was being grilled. He had anger issues and I think he resented me for, well for everything! He always wanted me to think he was superior to me...would tell me everything I owned was crap and heverything he had was perfect. His kids were perfect and he would point out any problem (real or made up) with my kids. He treated his kids better than mine. He chose their side over me every time. Never wanted to go anywhere or do anything with me, and would always give a "reason" on how it was my fault he would say no. Everything was always MY fault. He picked fights with me constantly, then would say that it was my fault because I like to fight (I hate fighting!!!). It got to the point where I just couldn't let my kids see someone treat me that way and just accept it. So, I told him I was going to move out. He begged me to stay. Promised he would change. Yadda, yadda, yadda. I stayed. Nothing changed. About 6 months later, I told him again I was going to move out. He got mad and asked me to stay. I rented an apartment, but stayed for another month before I moved out. I really didn't want to leave him, but he just kept on complaining and griping every day because it was just hanging over his head I guess. So, I moved out. He agreed and we went to counseling for about 3 months. He would be better after an appointment, but by the next week it had "worn off" and his anxiety and anger were through the roof again. He made a few VERY SMALL changes right at the beginning that lasted about a week and a half. During that time, he asked me to come back. I acknowledged his changes and told him that I just needed him to show me that the changes were going to last more than a week, then I would come home. He took that as total rejection. He immediately stopped the changes he had made and never tried again. Every time it was brought up, he would say that "I tried, but you said it wasn't good enough for you." UGH! That's not what I said! I would explain till I was blue in the face, he never budged from that. So, 4 years later, he will still make that stupid comment that is NOT TRUE and he never tried again nor did he ask me to move back in again. Over the past 2 years I have told him 3 different times that I wanted to move back home. He basically told me that if I thought it was bad before, it would be worse now because now he doesn't trust me at all. Also said that every decision to be made would be his alone and that I would never have access to his bank account or money again. What idiot would sign up for that? I took that as a NO. I actually think he wanted me to move back in, but he just had to have it be his way on his terms so he would feel like he had control over it.
I think he's just a very insecure person that has always felt inferior to everyone. I think he always tried to make everyone else feel like they weren't worth anything so he could puff his chest up and feel superior to them. He had a rough childhood and I think he just doesn't have any idea how to get past it. I think he has a low opinion of women in general but just won't admit it. I also think that when he left his job to move to be with me, I think the stress started his MLC. Then, as other events happened, it just pushed him further into it (me moving, his kids graduating, his dad getting sick, and finally kids moving out). I honestly feel like a lot of the anger issues he was having was from his MLC.
My part in the breakdown of the marriage and what could I have done differently? I allowed my codependent behaviors to turn me into his doormat and cause him to loose respect for me. I didn't have clear boundaries and still don't My H was very insecure. I felt like every day he would test me to see if I loved and cared about him by accusing me of whatever. I would then have to deny it because if I didn't, then it had to be true. Once I denied it, he would feel better till the next day. I think better communication skills might have helped me with that. I didn't learn until WAY LATER that what I was saying and what made sense to me was not what he was hearing. I didn't realize that everytime I had a different opinion than he did, he was hearing me tell him that he was lying, I didn't believe him, I thought he was stupid, not good enough, etc. So many things that, if I had known, I could have said differently and it could have made a difference. Instead of getting mad about his controlling behavior, I could have tried harder to find a way to diffuse the situation. I think it would have made a huge difference if I just hadn't moved out! I think I could have made him feel more appreciated and needed. VALIDATION at that point would have been awesome, but I didn't have those DB skills yet. So many communication errors! Eventually, I just really needed to get my kids out of that situation though....and, I just needed some peace in my life.
I know it probably doesn't sound like I'm taking much responsibility, but I really have tried to be open, honest, loving, and all of that. I have tried to help him with his issues by being loving and supportive, going to counseling, making Dr appointments for him to get AD that he won't take, reasoning and explaining things to him until he makes me think I'm the crazy one. I let him pile all the blame on me for everything and I just tried to fix it. I'm quiet, easy going and allowed him to run all over me while I tried to get everyone to just get along. My poor IC really has his work cut out for him! Not sure how he's going to help me fix myself, but hopefully he will figure it out!
If anyone is still reading this, I'm sure you're wondering why I'm trying to save this. The thing is, he wasn't like this before. I know he's troubled and frustrated and taking it out on me. But, this isn't how he was. I am hoping that when he works through his MLC and stops blaming me and making me the bad guy, that he will be the person that I married instead of this angry resentful cheating person that he has become.
M:45 H:48 M:11 No kids BD:Sept'15 EA:Confirmed 1wk later PA: Oct'15 12 '15 2 wk R Just kidding, H wants NC 12 '15 H back w/OW 4 '15 R &still working on it
I miss you guys too! I'm heading to bed though. Have to work again tonight. Will check in later.
And, Zeus, I look forward to hearing from you too.
M:45 H:48 M:11 No kids BD:Sept'15 EA:Confirmed 1wk later PA: Oct'15 12 '15 2 wk R Just kidding, H wants NC 12 '15 H back w/OW 4 '15 R &still working on it
I used to tell her that she held me and my daughters to a different standard to herself & her son. there was also a lot of its your fault that I took to heart or tried to fix thinking that it would make thing better
its good to see your setting goals and well done on getting active. its great you can see your own faults and work thru them. we are going to come thru this regardless wiser and kinder people.
keep moving forward & focusing on the positives
brad
Me: 45 w:45
M:6yrs T:9 Separated aug 15 no contact dec 15 come back july 16 I filed for closure aug 16
Thanks Brad. I really hate that ANY of that sounds like your life because I know how miserable it can be to live that way. You're right. We WILL get through this and will be awesome when we get to the other side. I just hope the journey speeds up a little. It's just too painful to drag out this way. I hope you're having a good day today. .
M:45 H:48 M:11 No kids BD:Sept'15 EA:Confirmed 1wk later PA: Oct'15 12 '15 2 wk R Just kidding, H wants NC 12 '15 H back w/OW 4 '15 R &still working on it
. 2) Loose weight--have been walking 3-5miles several times a week. I've lost 40lbs so far. I would also like to workout other than just walking (i.e. Go to the gym where I pay membership dues but never show up to participate in any classes). 3) Spend more time with my kids before they all move out of the house and are out on their own. 4) Rebuild relationships with my family and friends that I allowed myself to neglect because I allowed myself to be controlled and isolated. 5) Work on my marriage -- attempted this by going to counseling for 4 over months and talking to counselor. Finally gave up on this because I realized that I can't fix him and I can't make him want to come back to our marriage if he doesn't want to. This realization led me to... 6) Work on myself! I finally told the counselor that I didn't want to talk about my H anymore and I wanted to focus on ME and fix my self esteem issues. I go to IC once a week. 7) Become as attractive as possible (not sure if this belongs in the goals or 180 section). I wear makeup every day, fix my hair, bought new clothes, and I have lost and continuing to loose weight. I guess those are all of my active goals. I've also wanted to get back in to church, but have made no effort to physically go there yet. I have, however, been praying on a daily basis. Most days I pray many times just in case he didn't hear me.