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LoisB #2627471 11/29/15 11:02 PM
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Have a date with Football boy for tomorrow night after my DA mtg. I will be downtown anyway.


"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man

“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
LoisB #2627496 11/30/15 01:13 AM
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Quote:
-Like Ol Yeller wanting to cuddle on your bed after he eats Grandma
You still crack me up, Heather. smile

I agree, the holidays are an odd time for many. Year after year you can see people that still haven't come to terms with their past doing weird things like he is. But that aside, you do need to do for you. Clean your side of the street. Mow your own lawn. Doesn't leave any room for an ex.

It's ok to care, but it's not going to be ok to allow him to creep around and invade into your life. I think you did the right thing to block the number and FB. You may have some reason in the future to communicate about the kids. But you don't have any reason here and now. You may have noticed that you're stronger than before. But you have more to go, and I think you noticed that too. What you may be missing is that you deserve to do more for you and about you. You deserve to be free from that and other items in your life. You need to make that happen.

Fun thing about dating. It's not about a relationship per se. It's about trying out new things with new people. It's a learning experience and one you can really start to enjoy if you give it a chance. There are ups and downs, excitement and disappointments, but that's just part of what makes it fun. Give things color. And you'll learn a LOT about yourself. What you like, what you don't like and what you aren't sure about.

Enjoy the ride and make it last. It can be a lot of fun, Heather.


AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
AJM #2627533 11/30/15 03:29 AM
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Thanks AJ :-)

Louisa and I did this cool thing this weekend. The Biltmore had a discount on their season passes... $99 for one year. Christmas present to us both. Kids under 16 get in free with a pass holder. So, for the next 363 days, we can even walk our dog on the Biltmore grounds. For the past two days we've hung out at the Biltmore (inside and out).

Caught myself thinking about Matt. Wondering if he was going to reach out again... Blah, blah, blah. That's when I knew I had to block him. The whole FB thing really bugged the girls too.

It was the right thing for today. Trying to clear my head for the week ahead.

Last edited by LoisB; 11/30/15 03:30 AM.

"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man

“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
LoisB #2627640 11/30/15 06:08 PM
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Feels a bit weird to wake up today, knowing Matt can't reach out. I can't reach out. Not an option. Also, weird knowing he can't see my life on FB. It's MY life.

Mom laid into me today. That was fun. Made it obvious she sees me as a failure. I had asked her last week for some help in paying some bills. She said Yes and it took some pressure off for Christmas. The Biltmore pass was one of two things Louisa wanted. I thought it was a done deal. She said she would mail me some help on Saturday. This morning, I get a call.

Haven't asked for help since we left Ohio. Not something I wanted to do, but felt I had to. With Christmas coming. She made it clear that I'm a deadbeat in her eyes. Got lectures about spending and finding a financial counselor.

When I told her I was in a program for recovery from debting and so forth... I got the heavy sigh and how silly I was for going that route.

She was fairly brutal. I tried to defend myself. I felt pretty low though and reacted more than I wanted to. There was truth in what she said and that's where I got stuck. Told her she didn't need to send the help. I would figure it out. "How? How will you figure it out?"

She made it clear that she sees little to no value in Debtor's Anonymous. Strange, seeing as how she devoted her 30+ career to helping alcoholics.

I know she is scared for me. I know there was truth in what she said. Truth nuggets. I know all that. I know she is tired of having to help me...

What's hard, for me, is how this is a problem we share. If anyone showed signs of having a spending problem... My mom is sorta the poster child. Her apartment has become something of a hoarding cave with her latest compulsion, second-hand furniture.

I told her how I blocked Matt. I guess I was hoping to get some acknowledgement for showing some strength in one area of my life.

I wanted to hear her say, "I'm proud of you for at least getting honest with how you are with money. I'm proud of you for trying. I'm proud of you for NOT finding an abusive man to support you, like I did."

When I made the mistake of saying, "Mom, what if you had to reach out to your alcoholic parents for help and your mom gave you advice on getting sober... how would you feel?"

Answer: "I would NEVER ask my parents for help. Ever."

Last edited by LoisB; 11/30/15 06:13 PM.

"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man

“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
LoisB #2627650 11/30/15 06:50 PM
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Heather,
I'm glad that you and your daughter enjoyed spending time at the Biltmore. It's a beautiful place and has a calming effect on some who visit there. I think it's an excellent present for your daughter. She will enjoy many days there in the future, especially when the weather is warm and pleasant and so will you.

I know several people who have attended Debtor's Anonymous and it worked for them. So, please do not allow your mother to deter you from going. It works very similar to some of the other meet up groups. How will you ever be able to curb your problem if you don't have support and feel safe in speaking up? I say go if it's working for you.

I think part of the problem w/your mother is that you ask for help, but never pay her back (am I assuming wrong here and you paid her back for the trip to NC as well as her help when you moved a year ago). If you had paid her back in the past, she might not have had a problem helping you out once again. Maybe she thinks you should be up on your feet by now and more independent. It's hard to say what is going through your mother's mind, but it's evident she's tired of you asking her for help.

You might want to start a fund and each time you get change in your pocket, put it in a jar. Eventually the jar will fill and you'll have some extra cash to spend on fun things. It's just a suggestion, but I've done this for years and the change adds up.

Now that the holiday season is in full swing, have you considered getting a "seasonal" position at one of the local stores? It would give you some hours and also some extra $$$ for Christmas and/or your bills.

Heather, you don't need your mother's validation. I wouldn't discuss Matt w/her any longer. It's none of her business now that the divorce is over and done with. Be proud of what you have accomplished on your own in the last few years. If your girls are proud of you, that should be enough. You know that nothing you say or do will never be enough to give you the kudos that you richly deserve. You have to find a way to accept that she's not going to change this late in the game and there's no need to set yourself up for disappointment. Keep your conversations civil, but short w/her. When she gets on a rant about you and what you are doing, end the discussion politely and hang up. If she doesn't get the message, then she'll soon leave that conversations w/you will continue to be short and sweet. Please stop allowing yourself to be your mother's whipping girl....you are worthy of far more recognition than a verbal and mental beating from this woman.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
job #2627656 11/30/15 07:25 PM
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Job, thank you. You said what I needed to hear from my mom. :-)

I need to come up with a plan to pay both my parents back with the help of a sponsor and folks in D.A. I will keep going. Have a meeting tonight.

Yep. I have some issues with money... But, I'm working on it and I'm being honest. I hate being honest. HATE It. Hate having this particular problem. I'd rather have any other problem. But, at least it's treatable and I have resources here I don't have elsewhere. There are actual face-to-face meetings.

I can do some really outta-character/terrible stuff when it comes to money. Why? I don't really know. I just do. I can have $3 in the bank with rent, car payment, food... yadda, yadda and I will find a reason to use the $3 on gum.

That's where I got stuck with Matt and his addiction. I see how I behave when I'm crazy on a money binge or avoiding my responsibilities. However, I have begun the process of getting honest and I've been willing to get help. Also, I haven't abandoned my kids for my addiction. Not that I'm any better... but, hopefully, I'm a little healthier.

I think what really strikes me... now that I look back. She was waiting for this opportunity. She seemed to sorta relish being in this position--at least a little. I mean, I know my mom loves me... but, there was this sorta fat cat kinda demeanor.

She doesn't want me to be as strong as I am. She doesn't want me to succeed. That's just the bottom line. I'm not sure she really recognizes it. But, I feel it.

She has gone back to the insanely crazy Stepdad.

Louisa saw how upset I was after the call. "Mom, whatever she said... Know that she is unhappy. She feels like everyone has left her and she is back with weird (stepdad). She took it out on you. She doesn't like that you are getting your stuff together and she isn't."

How did this kid get so smart?


"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man

“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
LoisB #2627667 11/30/15 07:51 PM
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Sometime I think I do a passive-aggressive thing with the paying her back... and my dad... because they have given me so little in terms of other support. I know that doesn't make it right. I'm just looking at how I operate.

I think I'm angry... not about how I was treated in childhood... but, how exhausting and unkind? and selfish both my parents have been in my adulthood. Money, that they will give. Any other imposition on their lives... not so much. And, the gossip about my life and how I raise the girls. My parents give money, but they take from my self-esteem and erode my confidence if I spend too much time with them. I've been a source of gossip for years now.

They don't want their lives upset by my problems or the problems of my kids. It's like... we want a relationship... but, not really.

Still, I took the money. I owe the money. And, I need to accept that, even when I pay it off... they will still gossip and be harsh and even cruel about me behind my back.

My mom actually told D21 two months ago, "Don't be like your mom."

How weird. In their eyes, I'm the freak. The deadbeat. The selfish one because I don't interact with them. I avoid them because I don't like who THEY think I am. I'm not that person.

Okay. Sorta freaking out... That's exactly how I feel with Matt. He sees me as this person... This person that other people don't see...

Last edited by LoisB; 11/30/15 07:53 PM.

"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man

“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
LoisB #2627695 11/30/15 08:55 PM
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She poo-poos DA because she knows she needs it and won't admit it, most likely.

I have a friend who just started going, she's not in debt but she has issues with under-earning much like you, and is trying to grow out of always expecting someone to come along and bail her out. She's finding it quite helpful.

As for whether they're selfish for not helping you - you're a grown woman. Lots of healthy parents would not be ok with continuing to help out a grown child at your age, especially if they haven't seen signs of responsibility. This I think you just have to accept and get yourself into a position where you no longer need their help. Then you can start to slowly pay them back, even if it's just $10 a month to start, it will demonstrate responsibility.

I know budgeting is not your forte, so get a friend to help you. DO THE MATH and figure out exactly how much you need to meet living expenses each month. Start an envelope system and put living expenses into the proper envelopes each month - this will keep you honest, when you only have $10 left in the week's food envelope you eat rice and beans.

Do the Dave Ramsey Baby Steps. I don't agree with his politics but his approach to getting out of debt is exactly what you need. I would only make one modification - as a single parent, you need a bigger emergency stash than the $1,000 he recommends.

Find extra work, sell some articles or babysit for someone on a regular basis to earn a couple hundred extra bucks a month above and beyond your basic living expenses; this will keep you from having to borrow more from your mom.

Go to MrMoneyMustache dot com and get inspired about ways to reduce your expenses.

Keep a change jar as recommended above.

You can do this - but you need to become independent of your parents and your ex. Time for YOU to rescue YOU, no one else.

kml #2627727 11/30/15 10:41 PM
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Thanks Ellie :-)

I appreciate all of your suggestions. Tell your friend to take a look at Sally P.'s book called "Spent." It's the best explanation I've ever found. It's a Hazelden book.

The book goes through the DSM criteria for addiction and compares the traits of a debtor/underearner to these criteria. It's pretty eye-opening and kinda made me sick the first time I read it. It's progressive. For me, this really, REALLY fits. My bottoms have gotten worse and worse. Getting fired is one of those bottoms for me.

Like any addiction/compulsion, the key is to acknowledge you are powerless.

I've been in D.A. on-and-off for about 15 years. What always stopped me up was the disease concept. Until a few weeks ago... Here I am... I am behind on my car payments. Living with daily fear of losing my car. This fear, however, is something I've grown accustomed to on a day-to-day basis... I'm earning considerably under what I'm capable of, given my intelligence and abilities and career background... So, with all my debt, pressures to earn, and daily overwhelm and terror of losing my car... What do I do? I found myself at Goodwill. Overspending. The only place where I could actually afford to fill a cart.

I could feel the adrenalin surging. It was a distraction and escape from the pressure. My way of coping. With each item, I could feel this pressure lift and I began to imagine that somehow these items held the magic cure for my ails. This book would lead me to a new life. This Pendleton skirt would make things better.

I knew, as I put things into the cart, that I was putting my kids in jeopardy. I was putting my life in jeopardy, but couldn't seem to stop myself. I tend to really get into trouble with my kids. I buy things for them when I need to pay bills.

All of those tools you mention are great. I have tried them all. Twice. I think it's something akin to an alcoholic who has tried to drink only beer, limited the drinking to the weekends, etc...

I know it may sound crazy, but the compulsion to avoid, to escape through spending, to find relief with something new... it's overwhelming to me. It's how I cope.

My dad buys cars.

My mom buys just about everything... jewelry, furniture, clothes...

I see this trait in my own children now. Cal, who is doing wonderful in school right now, getting great grades, was recently bailed out with her rent and school payments by my dad who sent her $5k. She became very angry when I suggested she try to figure out a solution in a different way. It's okay with me that she did what she did. I get it. I told her to pay attention and know there's a program for help if she every needs it.

Last weekend, a two weeks after getting the bailout money, she is calling me from the outlet mall where she works. She was shopping. I can hear myself saying, "I deserve this. I've been under so much pressure. I need this break."

Then, the justification builds and soon you find yourself in the same position.

What's hard is the heavy guilt/shame which our society has on those with money issues. Even gamblers and drug addicts are given a break these days. Our whole economy is sorta running on overspending and the temptation is everywhere. But, say you have the problem of compulsively being a deadbeat and BAM! you are judged and given all sorts of advice on how to clean up your act.

Debtor's Anonymous suggests sponsorship from individuals who have solvency--at least 3 months of living debt-free, plus you have regular PRGs where two other members give you guidance on creating a spending plan. Like A.A., the difference here is that you are guided by someone who has been there and done that.

I can see now that, the key for me is finding support.

Money disorders are an interesting topic and I'm thinking the field will continue to grow.

What upset my mother was the fact I was seeing someone who was a therapist who specialized in money disorders as opposed to a financial planner. I received a "scoff" which I don't think I will ever forget.


"You know, it's times like these when I realize what a superhero I am." Tony Stark/Iron Man

“Focus on what you can do, then do it with all your heart.” Lois Wilson
LoisB #2627749 12/01/15 12:28 AM
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Again, she scoffs because she doesn't want to look at her OWN issues with money.

Sounds like DA is exactly the right place for you. Focus on bringing in that second income that you really need.

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