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#2612622 10/05/15 09:13 PM
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Sorry for the length of this post... just being thorough and hope some of you can find the time to read it and help.

My wife and I have known each other for 19 years, together for 8 (dated for 3, married for 5). We have two children, ages 2 and 4. Our marriage, like many, started experiencing difficulties with the arrival of our first child. When he was born, she immediately became child-centric and refused to allow anyone to help us take care our son. In fact, there many things she didn’t even want me to even do because she "didn’t want to miss a moment of his life". We were fortunate that our employers were extremely flexible so I was able to stay and work from home half the day and she was able to work from home the second half. It was great because we didn’t have to find childcare, but it took a toll on our marriage as we were extremely tired and stressed all the time. We stopped going on dates and we slowly stopped spending time alone together. I asked her to spend time with me, even just watching TV or reading a book together, but she was always too tired. She told me she wasn’t depressed, just tired. New to parenthood, I figured this was expected. I raised concerns about needing time to take care of ourselves and making our relationship a priority, but those concerns were rejected and were quickly followed by claims that she felt she was a single parent and I was’t helping out enough with the childcare. This argument became the one that we would routinely have and never resolve.

Fast forward a few years and with the birth of our second child, a daughter. It was clear that I could not work from home and be productive anymore. She was crushed, but we adjusted our schedules and we hired a nanny to help us. The cost of a nanny and other outside factors began to create some financial strain, but we were getting by. Still, we were growing distant and we would have the same argument. I was lonely and concerned about the growing distance between us and she felt I wasn’t helping out enough and she had to take care of three children. I know I’m far from the perfect father but I play with the kids every day, I’m often the disciplinarian, I change diapers, give them milk/food, give baths multiple times throughout the week, read to them each night, and help put them to bed each night. What more could I be doing? Her answer is always that I seem to do it begrudgingly out of obligation rather than wanting to do it!

Its worth noting that work was extremely stressful for me during this time and combined with the lack of intimacy and critically low feeling of connectedness/priority from my marriage, I fell into a deep depression. I would often escape into my cell phone and at times probably didn't engage my family enough. This only created more difficulties for us. Eventually, I sought help, was put on an anti-depressant, and began to slowly recover. I still wasn’t where I needed to be, but I felt that I was making slow progress. During the depression, however, I managed to put on a decent amount of weight and snoring became a problem. Eventually, since neither of us was sleeping well, I moved into the guest room so we could both get some sleep. That was probably 6-8 months ago.

In July, we celebrated our 5th anniversary. My wife had arranged for us to go out to dinner and it was great. We spoke of our future and our kids’ future. It was probably the third or fourth date we had without the kids since our son was born and I loved the brief amount of time I had the love of my life back. Unfortunately, things quickly returned to normal. At the end of July I attempted to flirt and suggest we taking things further but got rejected. We then had a fight I will forever regret. I explained to her that I felt lonely and continually rejected and had concerns about our marriage. She retaliated with the usual issues over childcare and feeling like a single parent. She told me I needed to man up, take care of myself, love myself, and be a better father. I accused her of no longer being in love with me. That was the breaking point, but I didn’t realize it at the time.

Things died down and the next two weeks seemed to be somewhat normal. We would text each other throughout the day just to say I love you and I thought everything was fine. Not great, but getting by. I figured this was typical of parents with kids our age. In fact, started a new job in August that significantly reduced my stress level and I had decided to followup on the things she mentioned in our fight. I was manning up. I started a new job that had much less stress. I was eating better and lifting weights to get back in shape. I made a commitment to myself that I would lose weight, stop snoring, return to my bed, and be more engaged with my family. If she was that mad at me, then I was going to prove my love to her by addressing every one of her issues as best I could. Then one day, I noticed she was upset so I asked her what was wrong and tried to console her by placing my hand on her shoulder. She recoiled and broke down. That was when she told me that she was no longer in love with me and had felt that way for a long time. She asked for time and space away from me and my heart broke.

I didn’t know what to do and made a lot of mistakes. I didn’t seek help at the time and it didn’t occur to me that I should do some research online to help us get through it. I made a lot of the common mistakes that probably pushed her further away. I told her I loved her, recalled fond memories, sent her romantic songs, told her about my dreams of the future, etc. In hindsight, I pursued her too much and pushed her even farther away instead of giving her the space she needed.

One day she told me that she decided she thought a new hobby would help. She was going to learn how to golf from a coworker and friend of ours. I was happy that she wanted to learn how to golf and told her so, but also said I was hoping that it was something we could learn together. She balked at that, saying that she still needed space, it would help her reduce a lot of the stress in her life, and it would be difficult for our friend to coach two people at the same time. I raised concerns that I felt our relationship was vulnerable and that she needed to be careful. I told her we also needed time to focus on strengthening our marriage just as much as she needed to do things for herself… even if it was just 30 minutes of talking each night. I knew the man she was learning golf with as he was a close family friend who was recently going through a divorce, but I considered him someone I could trust. He was like an uncle to our children. I’m sure you know where this is going.

Golf soon became the thing she was most excited about, and she would spend Saturday mornings and maybe one night a week at the driving range learning how to golf. During this time, I continued to raise concerns that I didn’t feel we were working on our marriage and that we needed to do something to work towards improving our relationship. She was undergoing a lot of stress from our strained marriage and some changes at work so I knew she was close to reaching a complete mental breakdown. Around labor day weekend, we decided that I would take the kids to my parents house and allow her to stay home and relax. I even cleaned the bathtub and lined it with candles before I left. When I called her over the weekend, she seemed so extremely happy, but it was clear she only wanted to speak with the kids and not me.

The next weekend, something didn’t seem right. I don’t remember exactly what tipped me off, but it was probably the way she was behaving. She was keeping her phone on her at all times, hiding its screen and using it more often than usual. She had previously had what I would consider a borderline emotional affair two years earlier so I had some concerns. I eventually managed to get access to her text messages and that was when the life I knew was over. I found an almost naked selfie that the OM sent her and numerous suggestive comments. They had been talking about how much they loved each other, how much they wanted to hold and kiss each other. This occurred over the weekend I took the kids and left her alone. I was heartbroken and furious. I called her downstairs and showed her what I found. I confronted her, yelled at her. She claimed they didn’t kiss or have sex, but I don’t know what to believe anymore. She claimed she didn’t mean for it to happen and that it was only an emotional affair. I still don’t know what to believe. I sent a text message to the other man asking him to explain the picture I found and told him to stay away from my wife a children. His response was only that he was drunk, he was sorry, and we would stop talking to my wife. I told my wife I didn’t want her talking to him outside of her professional obligations and that we would need to figure out what to do longterm because I was not comfortable with her talking to him or working near him. I told her I still loved her and wanted to make our marriage work but that I was devastated and needed time to think and calm down. I drank a lot that night and simply remember sobbing before I passed out in the guest room.

The week after D-Day, another coworker, OM’s brother, convinced my wife to seek marriage counseling (I could never get her to go). We’ve been to two sessions now but I’m not sure there is an improvement and I’m not sure the counselor is taking a proactive solution/action-oriented approach. My wife doesn’t seem remorseful or willing to work on our marriage. She definitely doesn’t want to end the affair. She is in love with the OM and since his family is very much an extension of our own it makes it even harder for us to cut all ties. The OM’s parents are like another set of grandparents to our children and we would always go to holiday parties at the OM's brother’s house. She continues to see him at work and I have no doubt they are spending time alone together when the opportunity presents itself. In fact, we recently had a fight because I discovered that she was still speaking with him and bought him a birthday gift. She then told me that they recently drove together, alone, to a work function. I lost it and lashed out at her, telling her that I didn’t think she was trying to reconcile. I made a lot of mistakes that night and probably destroyed any chance at reconciling. I hope I’m wrong. This isn’t easy and I’m learning the hard way after countless mistakes.

My wife seems to blame me for the state of our marriage. She told me that she feels nothing but anger and resentment towards me because she felt such a deep sense of loneliness during the last four years and felt that she was carrying the burdens of our entire family on her shoulders. She has said that she is sorry I wasn’t able to make her happy or provide her what she needed and she decided long before the OM that the choice she felt she had to make was whether she wanted to be with me or to be alone. She feels like trust is our biggest issue and feels hurt that I violated her privacy and violated her trust by searching through her text messages and call logs during both EAs. She has now changed all her passwords/passcodes and separated our cell phone plan so I can no longer see who she calls or text messages.

I’m reading the forums, just recently got the DR book and have read a few other books, but I’m so lost and feel so helpless. Some days I find a trigger and I can’t help but tear up. Other days I’m completely detached. I know the only thing I can change is myself. I feel like it’s getting easier, but I often feel angry at the OM, angry at my wife, and angry at myself for letting this happen. I want to fight for my marriage. I want to fight for my kids and I want to fight for myself and my wife. I love them all so much, but it feels like I’m fighting a battle I can’t win.

This is what I’m doing today:


  • Marriage counseling once a week. We seem to be avoiding the EA and focusing on our marital issues prior to the EA, but it’s only been two sessions so I’m trying to keep an open mind.
  • Established a boundary that she should only be talking to the OM at work, for work related reasons ( I don’t know how to enforce this)
  • Established a boundary that my children are not to see the OM and he is not to be at our house
  • Lifting weights and eating better. (I’ve lost ~30lbs since August 1st and haven’t been in better shape since college. Only 15lbs to go until I’m at my ideal weight!)
  • Building a new wardrobe to match the new body (Difficult when money is tight, but it’s something I always held off doing because of my weight. Prior to the EA, my wife would have loved the opportunity to help me with this)
  • Being more outgoing and confident (The new body and wardrobe really help here)
  • Being more fun and energetic (Again, the new body and wardrobe)
  • Engaging my kids more and spending more time with them
  • Doing a few more things around the house than usual (I usually do a fair amount already)
  • Avoiding communication with my wife unless she initiates and trying to make that interaction as positive as possible. (Exception is that I still initiate and say good morning and goodnight)


I’ve already decided to postpone any decisions or ultimatums at least until after the holidays (if not longer) because I want to make sure I’m in a good place physically, mentally, and emotionally before I make the kind of decisions that will affect my children’s entire lives. Patience is a virtue but I also don’t want to be a doormat that’s enabling the affair to continue while we’re married. I also want to move on as soon as possible if that’s the way it has to be.

I could really use some help in figuring out how to handle the ongoing affair and how to get my spouse to lower her defenses and commit to working on our marriage. Is time all it takes?

I don’t know what kind of 180s I can be doing or if I’m at the point where the LRT is the option. I don’t want to push her away but I also don’t want to reinforce the notion that she is doing everything to take care of the house and kids.

Any suggestions on what I can do would be helpful.


M: Late 30s W:Late 30s
S: 4 D:2

Known: 19
Together:8
Married:5

ILYINILWY: 8/2015
EA: Confirmed 9/2015, Started 8/2015?
PA: No evidence, W Denies
D: Planned for Spring 2016
Cole_ #2612626 10/05/15 09:23 PM
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Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.


Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon


Me-70, D37,S36
Cole_ #2612640 10/05/15 10:19 PM
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Hi Cole,

Sorry to hear about your situation. It does suck and it will be long and painful, whatever the outcome.

Even though not many have posted, the trickle will turn into a flood of great advice. Cadet's welcome is of great reading, as well as sandi's rules. If she does post here you will get some really great advice.

For my 2 cents worth, it is great what you are doing but remember that you have to ride out the pain. We are human, have feelings and when hurt we suffer. The advantage of being here is knowing we are not alone and when we do feel alone, there is always someone posting helpful advice to help us on our way. A sort of light to guide us.

The fact you are reading and hopefully understanding the books as well means you will not make the common mistakes. If you do, then at least you are aware and can recover quicker.

I think you are doing everything textbook style but if your W is still in honeymoon stage it will go unnoticed for the time being. At the moment only you are seeing the changes but keep on. You will reap the rewards in the long run.

As for the boundaries, I think you cannot enforce boundaries around other peoples actions. Only the ones that affect you. You cannot put a boundary around her contacting OM but you can on her contacting you. As for the children, it could also be implemented but if the ties are that close you will have an uphill battle to prevent this.

Your communication seems ok and I would still say greet her but leave it at that as you still need some cordiality with kids in the middle.

Don't pay attention to what she says. You are in her eyes the reason the both of you are in this situation and arguing wont change anything. What I do generally say is to listen objectively to what she says and think if any of it has any truth in it and act accordingly.

As for the detailed breakdown of your post some other better prepared members will support you. Just keep coming, share your thoughts, read the books and ask for help. it would help if you acted on the advice otherwise you will just go round in circles.

Nice talking to you.


M: 50
S: 25

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Posts: 630
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Cole,

Honestly,

I would love to read about your sitch but man it looks so over whelming. Most people do not want to read a book when they come on here. I would suggest providing a summary and asking any questions you have. Hopefully that will get more people engaged in your sitch. Good luck man.


Me: 30's W: 30's M: 12yrs
EA: Started 3/2015
MC Started: 4/2015
She moved out and served 6/2015
PA: Confirmed 10/5/2015
2 young kids

"If you do not stand for something you will fall for anything."
WhyUs #2612667 10/06/15 12:20 AM
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Posts: 150
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Cole_ Offline OP
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Is there any way for me to edit the post or could a moderator/admin delete the post so I can repost something a little more efficient and digestible?


M: Late 30s W:Late 30s
S: 4 D:2

Known: 19
Together:8
Married:5

ILYINILWY: 8/2015
EA: Confirmed 9/2015, Started 8/2015?
PA: No evidence, W Denies
D: Planned for Spring 2016
Cole_ #2612681 10/06/15 02:06 AM
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Originally Posted By: Cole_
Is there any way for me to edit the post or could a moderator/admin delete the post so I can repost something a little more efficient and digestible?

My suggestion is to stick with this thread and make another post with questions or concerns.

Just keep posting, I don't think you should delete or edit the previous post.


Me-70, D37,S36
Cadet #2612693 10/06/15 02:44 AM
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Hi cole,

The beginning of your story parallels mine. Me being over anxious after birth of my children (later learned 1/5 mothers suffer from this). My husbands weight gain and snoring. My perceived notion that husband neglected childcare responsibilities, then husband really did neglect me and children. Financial stresses, fatigue,some serious sleep deprivation, Husband Became workaholic.... To be honest I think this is a story that sadly affects many middle class Americans. (Very little support for moms, the inability to survive on 2 incomes..at least where I'm from, the increasing job demands and outrageous hours expected from the work force). It's sad and seems to require two like minded, seriously marriage committed people to survive.

In my case husband walked out, no infidelity on my part and I don't think on his either. This board has really been helping me to understand both the husband and wife perspectives. Just having a group of readers to vent to has helped prevent me from pursuing my husband and making some pretty hasty decisions. Especially, when you really can't hound your friends with this too much. Plus no other group of people will truly get what your going through and have a better understanding of the dynamics at play. Also most importantly, this group of people really values marriage and truly understands what's at stake and why we want to save it.

Julie


Me: 42
H: 43
Twins age 5
Physically Separated 7/2015
Joined: Nov 2009
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FTR I have now read your entire first post.

Your story is not much different than most of the stories posted here.

I will stick with my original advice that you leave it on the board and continue to post and follow the DB advice.

I think that LRT might be a good idea.
You can only work on yourself and make yourself into a person that only a fool would leave.

You can not cure your wife of her depression or make her love you.
You can only work on your portion of that.

Become a better DAD.

Go through your goals list and see which of those items you can control and which ones you can not control.

And like I said before - KEEP POSTING.


Me-70, D37,S36
Cadet #2612734 10/06/15 09:52 AM
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Cole,

Finally got through the post. I'm sorry you are going through this. I can tell you have a good head on hour shoulders. I like that you realize that you have a choice. So many times the LBS waits on the S to choose what happens next. I think it is smart that you are being patient with this.

My only suggestion is now that you know what she is capable of, what she is willing to do, don't overreact when you discover something new. Also, realize that things can get worse before getting better.

As far as waiting it out goes... my DB coach said it typically takes 9 months for the average affair to run its course.


Me: 30's W: 30's M: 12yrs
EA: Started 3/2015
MC Started: 4/2015
She moved out and served 6/2015
PA: Confirmed 10/5/2015
2 young kids

"If you do not stand for something you will fall for anything."
WhyUs #2612770 10/06/15 01:24 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 150
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Cole_ Offline OP
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Thanks for the feedback, everyone. I know if can't be difficult to slog through long posts.

The hardest thing about this is that living in the same house and having kids is that the lines are so gray sometimes. I did come to some conclusions about our situation and how we got here but that will have to wait until later because I have to run to a counseling session. Wish us luck!


M: Late 30s W:Late 30s
S: 4 D:2

Known: 19
Together:8
Married:5

ILYINILWY: 8/2015
EA: Confirmed 9/2015, Started 8/2015?
PA: No evidence, W Denies
D: Planned for Spring 2016
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