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Maximus Offline OP
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Hi Guys,

A few months ago as I stated in a previous post I found out my wife was flirting and sending sexy photos to a guy at the gym. What I did confirm was an EA but can't a PA

I never told pleaded nor begged but told her to leave and every backslide ended in me threatening to sell the house or asking her to leave.

After a few rollercoaster weeks we have evened out and theoretically trying to make it a go.

Yes, since the initial Tsunami and after shocks things have quietened down, I have began to look at myself, change some bad habits and relationship wise things have improved superficially.

I read that abandoning the bedroom was a NO-NO so one night I got back into bed un-anounced to which she reacted badly the following morning. After a few talks I told her I was there to stay and the following morning she moved my things from the bathroom I was sharing with S22 to the master bathroom.

Small baby steps improvements I have noticed besides the previous one are giving me a peck on the lips when I left for a trip a week ago (never did it again, if our bodies come into contact at some point she doesn't pull away so we don't touch, she starts small talk and sometimes we share the joke, she initiates whatsapp messages and sometimes uses icons (never a heart, kiss or similar), we have been on a couple of trips and sort of messed around but not in a romantic loving way (sort of carrying out a house duty), she counts on me to help her, she spends less time with her friend (like sunday mornings when they used to always go for a walk to the market) and she has also avoided lately a new gym she started though she will start going but previously she NEVER would have missed it. During the trips she found out I was interested in moving country and had the opportunity and even thought (still thinks) about coming but not sure as she leaves current country. She also did a few selfies with me and let people take photos of us together (before she would never have done that). During a recent conversation discussing me moving and possibly coming I asked how the change and she admitted that last month she didnt want to talk to me. When we sleep together I sometimes hold her and she doesnt move away.

With all this in mind she never initiates any physical contact with me whether it be to hold my hand, come closer in bed, a hug, kiss, not to mention NO sex.

My doubt is if this is a healing process that needs time and for me continue like until now, do I become more distant or remain close with contact but not pamper. Is she playing me because she has no job (company closed 2 years ago and she claims to be struggling with being unemployed and feeling useless and doesnt want to be maintained)and is dependent on me so does minimum necessary for appearances?, I have looked after myself and done a little GAL and she has on ocassions hinted I have an OW (do i play on this to make her feel I am moving on and if she wants me she will have to make a decision? or is this bullying?

I have spoken to some female friends but they say that if they were to give a chance they would have initiated contact long ago and do not understand her distancing herself.

I really do not know what to do, I want this to work but have the feeling sometimes that this is as far as it will go... as room mates...the ILYBNILWY situation.

Any help would be appreciated.

My main posts are in the newcomers sections (don't know how to copy paste link - new here)

If there were more contact even non sex I would feel more secure about our relationship.

Thanks.


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I am sorry to say I think you are here in the piecing forum a little early.

Has she told you that she is committed to working on the marriage yet?(through words or actions)

You can't be piecing unless both of you are "all in" committed to the marriage.


Link to your newcomers thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...015#Post2594015

Last edited by Cadet; 08/18/15 12:16 PM. Reason: Link

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Hi Cadet,

Appreciate the reply smile

When EA was exposed she said she was sorry wanted to work on it and makes plans for both but we had a rollercoaster few months since all blew up. It was basically my accepting the situation thrown on to me and venting it out as I healed. Things have quietened down last month or so with quick short discussions when there are any.

What she has said is there is a history and she needs time, the EA wasnt the problem but our relationship and last month she could not bear to talk to me but now we are sleeping together with the small baby steps I mentioned.

My real problem is I do not know what to do. I think sometimes it is best to not initiate touch of any kind. If she wants a cuddle hug or more then she should make the move but then I read that you must be loving etc. Sometimes I read someone in a similar situation and you use the detach and I think about using it but then think maybe my situation is not the same and it will backfire.

I like helping and while not being over helpful try to act like a normal husband would as she is not ignoring me, she helps me as well and for example will bring me coffee if I am working (just did as I posted this) as she makes one for herself so maybe detaching or taking one step back is not correct.

She sometimes hints when we quarrel that I have someone else. I have told her there isn't anyone but sometimes when I sms someone from work I dont tell her so she doesnt have full control on who I talk with, the same way I dont control her.

In answer to your question maybe it is early but then I would like to know in what situation do you then think I am really in.


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Forgot to mention there is another post where I gave an update.


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Last night had a bust up with W over the no intimacy thing. I have been giving this a lot of thought and to be honest I think it was staring me in the face but I was completely missing it.

I see other H&W enduring a lot of crap but still ML even when they know their S is with OW/M. Some of them even get hugs and kisses while things are tense.

If things are better on one level where you talk, smile, laugh, sleep in same bed and there are hints from your S of a future together why is it so damn hard to give a hug, kiss or some other sign of affection....unless of course you don't love the person as a lover or spouse.

I always initiated contact but never got a reply and even in bed if i touched her i noticed it was uncomfortable feeling. Here also lied my confusion, on the one hand being loving and her friend made us advance to this stage where we maxed out. If I changed the action and detached it created some tension so following MWD advice I did more of what worked and less of what didn't or did I?

Anyway I told her last Monday I was not going to keep on being in a half marriage. For her it does seem perfect as it was the type of marriage we had until now (me giving her space and everything I have to offer money wise). The problem was when I found out about the EA. So I see again a pattern of comfort for her where she again has everything with the only price now that I sleep in the same bed. She btw has been out of a job for 2.5 years.

I therefore called her out, If I was to live in a half marriage being friendly but not being able to get what I find a deal breaker - affection - then why should she have all the benefits of a 100% committed wife if she still feels this ILYB... emotion. The moment she decides to take the step to really committ will she also have my full 100% commitment.

Obviously I can't employ the same emotionally detach symptom so I pulled her first privilege. Took away her smartphone and gave her a normal phone where she can sms and navigate and call but its not the S6 anymore. her reaction was really really disturbing. She blew a fit, threatened to break my PC which I use for work, struggled to take it from me but with no luck and ended up kicking, punching and scratching me. I did not react and let her hit me (did not hurt physically as I do martial arts and weights and have a 70lbs weight advantage over her). I have never laid a hand on her. Once she was finished she got dressed, lef and drove off in her car. That was early morning and 4 hours later arrived home to do house chores.

I don't know if I did the right thing but I really am tired and running very low on fuel. I have a chance to change country and live elsewhere but it is a big step and I do not know if I have the strength to do it.

Doing so also has a lot of complications as our son is still at home and would have to either move abroad with me or go live with his mother at his grandparents appartment (says he would not do that). Additionally I would still have to pay off a small amount.

I am really torn in 2 and have no idea what to do.

Yes I love her, no I do not want to D her but if you divide the relationship level in 2 parts with A the day to day friendly interaction with B the intimate physical interaction we would be in say A7 B0 how can I be expected to live a married life with these differences?


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So sorry you are facing these challenges. When you bring up the topic of affection as one of your needs (affection and not sex... for a lot of women, affection not related to sex is important & is what helps build their desire for sex) what does she say? Have you tried non-threatening affection (things that do not mean "hey, I want sex") such as hand holding while driving or things such as that?

It seems she wants to stay comfortable in a marriage but without the obligation of giving you what you need. His Needs, Her Needs is a good book that I think is helpful at describing the importance of meeting each others needs as well as detailing what the most common needs are for men & women. Would she be open to reading something like that?


T: 14 M: 12
D: 9 S: 6
BD: 2/18/15 (H affair)
Working on marriage: 3/12/15-6/11/15
Broken Trust (my error): 6/11/15
H ring off: 7/6/15; Comm w/ OW confirmed 7/13/15
H wants to work on fixing things: 7/21/15
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"Obviously I can't employ the same emotionally detach symptom so I pulled her first privilege."

I got to say this was shocking to read. You treated her like a child, and got the reaction of a child. This is not the way to go to get affection, I think!

I'm currently unemployed and trying to build a business, and H is using the income disparity frequently to put me down - sometimes I feel like a house maid/prostitute because of his demands. I know he feels alone in carrying the expenses (he wanted me to be a SAHM for years, but the kids have now left - however, it's no joke trying to re-enter the job market as a 50+ year old!). I never felt this way before when his attitude was different (generous). Be very careful how you treat your wife if you want to repair this relationship. Women have memory like elephants...


M 16 yrs, WH62, P54
3 adult blended kids
EA 11/13, BD1 6/14
PA fall 14, BD2 2/15
Piecing 2015, BD3 12/15
Separated 4/16
WH moved OW in 5/16
Divorced 6/15/17
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Hi Hope & Painter

Sorry for long delay in replying but didnt see your mesages.

Yeah, I know I haven't gone about this the right way. I tell everyone to be mature and stay calm and then go and do something like this. Not proud of it.

The problem is for many many years we had what I called a half marriage where we acted like a married couple but without the intimacy from her part. By intimacy I dont mean just sex but the small acts like hand holding etc. Often sex was more like a chore.

Following the day I caught her coming out of the cafe with the EA guy (didnt know it was that serious until a few days later when I saw her messages to this guy with lovey dovey texts and some photos in lingerie (none naked)) it has been a roller coaster ride.

I have had to fight against the insecurities but maybe the hardest part was that during all this time she was always saying how if we split up she would use men like kleenex, she didnt need any bla bla and then I see her messages to him bang on the same hour each day.

She goes on trips with me abroad, we go to the shops, walks, etc. I moved back into the MBR but she does not cuddle up nor look for me. If I touch her she doesnt go into cobra style retreat and we will be in contact. Sometimes during our walks she comes up close to see something and we do touch and she stays. She is attentative and asks if I want a coffee when she is making and also asks about projects I am handling at work. The thing is that she already went on a few trips while she was sending these messages so my perception at this stage is more of the same. The only difference is things are a little different now in that we do do more things together, she is not hiding her phone as before, I am sleeping in the MBR and things in general are better. However... I still have this thing in my head that it is ploy until things improve for her.

Based on this I am content but here is where I get lost. I read some of the stories and most have some issues I cannot relate to. She has not asked for a D but a part of me wonders if it is because she is not working and has no plan B or because she really does want to make this work. She has said a few times she has days where she thinks why not give it a go and then others where she thinks the opposite. I then read about detach, GAL, etc. Do I back off or continue to offer my hand and hug her (she does not back off). A part of me thinks I am being played while the other part thinks it is just tiime we need.

I read other couples are fighting or thinking about getting together and 2 days later have sex. With us, in particular me the sex is like the crock of gold I can never seem to reach.

I told her sex is one of the pillars of a relationship, especially for me and I do not want a relationship without it. I also miss those tender moments that I never get and it is always me initiating. I just get so tired of initiating all the time.

Sometimes its just so reassuring to be hugged or kissed out of the blue which tells me i am in there for her. When I see no physical contact and from what I have read, it seems it is down to women who have lost that feeling for their partner or because there is an OM. My conclusion is she is only here because of her situation, not because she wants to give our R a go. And this uncertainty has me mixed up inside with insecurities.

I would rather she call it a day and let me suffer now than continuing, if she wants to leave me. I am moving abroad hopefully next year and in a few days the 3 of us are travelling to see the country and areas where we would live. She however doesnt want to talk about it or even want it mentioned. I have to organize everything there and here because of her attitude. She says I should do what is best for me and what I want and she will decide when the time comes. What i keep telling her is that depending on what she wants to do I have to take route A or route B. Being so mysterious makes things harder and makes me think she is buying time. I know she does not want to leave but she has tried unsuccessfully for almost 3 years to find a job. We cant live forever on my salary and I see that her not working IS eating her up. As a result moving seems the best option. Our S also wants to try abroad so if she stays she knows she will be alone and will have to sleep in her parents house as I will sell the appartment. Ultimately it is her choice.

To me this also sounds like stalling to see if she finds a job another reason I think I am being played. Being friendly while things are looking this way. Should they change better for her then I will get dumped.


When she lost her job she stopped searching for work and I had to send the cvs off in the internet, she never worried about the finantial situation unless we had a bad month and then she would fly in making decisions which were irrational because she never wanted to know the whole story. it would just make her more upset.

So what do i do? I dont think there is someone else now. She leaves her phone lying around and offers it to me openly at any moment if I need to update anything. yesterday she participated in a sporting event and mentioned she would have liked for me to have been there (I could not because I had an important meeting for work) but was on my way to arrive for the ending but she finished before. we then went out all afternoon and she was happy to go where I suggested and it was really great.

However, come MOC (moment of contact) and its the flip side. Then I feel really bad for getting upset and arguing and then I feel like the grumpy husband she comes home to from the ha ha with her friends.

I try and stay upbeat about the whole thing but how can you be lovey dovey knowing where the limit is. How can i really believe her comments about not wanting men when she got involved in an EA and possibly a PA.

If you could enlighten it I would be really happy to hear.


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I'm really sorry for the pain you're in. I've been in your shoes. Except my wife had a long-term physical affair which she confirmed. Perhaps your wife did; perhaps not.

Your wife sounds a lot like mine, and your sitch sounds a lot like mine. Back in 2006/2007, I was posting all over this board on a weekly basis. It really helped to vent, to seek advice, and to listen to some hard truths offered by people farther along the road than I was.

So I'd like to do that for you if you're of a mind to hear it. I don't mean to be rude or put too fine a point on it, but you're doing it wrong.

According to your post she said that you "should do what is best for me and what I want and she will decide when the time comes."

I agree with her. That's what you should do. But you're not. By your own admission your are clingy, needy. That's not a criticism because I did the same thing. I was in incredible pain over what happened just as you seem to be.

The thing I had to learn was that my wife wasn't causing my pain. I was. And you are now causing your own pain. That pain is coming from having needs and hoping she will meet them one day, from being hurt that she won't meet them now, and probably from imagining she has or will meet another man's needs.

It [censored]. It totally [censored]. May be the worst thing I've ever felt in my life. And I'm telling you that it won't get better if you keep doing what you're doing. It won't even get better if she suddenly starts acting like you want her to. You think it will now, but if/when it happens, you might find you have a hard time trusting it, or that it still isn't enough.

The reason for that is, it won't get better until YOU decide to get better.

Whether your wife has made up her mind about her future or not, you only get your well-being back by truly detaching. It doesn't sound to me like you're detached at all.

Just like she was emotionally 'addicted' to her OM, you are addicted (emotionally) to your wife. Everything you experience is filtered through that and your own insecurity over this. Again, I've been there and know how bad it hurts.

Do yourself a favor. Get detached and do the DB stuff. It's not for her and it's not for your marriage. It's for you. If you can truly do it, you will have a much easier time and be much happier regardless of what she does because you will be stronger, more independent, and happy. And a strong, independent, happy, kind man is what any decent woman wants.

If you do those things and she decides to walk away for good, you will get through it much better for yourself and your son, and will be able to live from a position of inner strength which will help you if you decide to have a new relationship down the road. If you do those things and she decides to truly invest in your relationship again, you will be a better mate, happier all around, and confident going into the future.

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Thanks TL2


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