PP 2.0 - PigPen & The WAW (7)

[PigPen]

Thanks for checking in on my V, As, and E.

I'm not really sure what to say as far as my DB journey goes. After getting served I completely fell apart, but then have picked myself up and put myself back together again. Rather quickly to be honest.

Today was the bi monthly dog swap and I'm not sure I DB'ed it very well. I DB'ed it the way that I wanted to though, and that was to make it as quick as possible. I know these are the only opportunities that I have to see my W, but honestly, I don't want to see her. Every time we swap Woofie, I walk away feeling like (censored) for a few days.

We always get along so well, laugh and joke with each other, and borderline flirt with each other. Then I can't work for three days. Then I can't sleep for two nights. Then I lose all of my creativity and drive. Then it all comes back.

Today I didn't want to go through all of that. If I could have I would have had her drop him with a friend and I would have picked him up there and avoided her all together. It hurts me too much to see her, hear how she's doing all of the things I had hoped we'd do together but she was never interested in then. It upsets me greatly and this week I just didn't have it in me to pretend that I did.

I'm battling a bit of a cold, but also have, to be honest, moved on a bit. Maybe this really is part of detaching and DB'ing, but I've shifted in my mind from someone that is still fighting to save his M to someone that has accepted his M is completely over and is creating an amazing new life without his W. To the point of thinking that seeing her is now a detriment to executing that great life plan. It's all confusing truthfully.

So today on Woofie swap, I gave her the grandmother hug, put the Dalai Lama of dogs in my car, answered that I was "good" and my weekend was "going fine" and then gave her a hug goodbye. On the hug goodbye she wouldn't let me go and started rubbing my back a bit but I pulled away and said I had to run. I just don't want my back rubbed folks, not today. Not by her. The good feeling from getting it hurts too much as soon as it stops.

I've been GAL'ing like crazy, maybe a bit too much that I've worn myself out, but the last month has flown by. So much so that I've started blocking off time for myself and telling people that I have plans when I don't. I've been seeing speakers, going to dinners and BBQ's, sporting events, and even gave a 45 minute talk the other night that went considerably better than I could have dreamed.

9 months in I'm also finding myself growing tired of turning down offers from women for dinners or to spend time together. I'm not ready to date or commit to anything close to a relationship, but I've gone out a few times with women who know my situation and have had a good time. It's still a battle to not feel like I'm doing something wrong or somehow cheating on my W simply by being at dinner, nor to be upset that I'm talking to anyone but her. It's also helpful to realize on some level that women still find me interesting and that sobriety hasn't turned me into a social pariah. Quite the opposite actually, everyone seems intrigued by all of the life changes I've made this year.

That's where I'm at. It's a mixed bag still of a bit of acceptance, a bit of numbness, a fair amount of confusion, and still a lot of upset. My PMA is still high on most days, but I also feel like I'm walking around in a dream a lot. It's not a nightmare anymore but it still doesn't feel like real life.

Hope everyone is doing well.

PP

[asitis]

Sorry you struggled after being served, but glad you were so resilient. On the dog swaps, what do you think you could do now that you know that you have this couple day hangover?

One thought that comes to mind is not to think of these as your only opportunities to interact and DB w/ your W. You not pursuing her is DBing. You giving her time & space is DBing. You putting so much on those short interactions, is not DBing. Besides, you don't know you won't get more chances down the road. So not making so much of those times may help change both your perspective and the costs.

Another is that you seem let down that you appear to be so good in those interactions that you want more and are hurt that she doesn't. There are a couple things to keep in mind. One is that she is also working hard to make it less painful for you but that doesn't mean she doesn't have her her own fears, pains, and issues that make her very wary of getting back involved with you beyond that (sorry for the double negative). The other is that while being polite is good, play acting in hope that she will see the light and give you want you want isn't going to likely work. So, don't be phony about it. If you aren't feeling like you are being honest to yourself, don't hold yourself to keep acting a way because you think it will make a difference. Again, I'm not saying being rude, but if you are feeling like you are pushing yourself to be something you aren't feeling it will likely bite you in the end, and it would explain some of the post-swap let down.

Third, have someone you can talk to lined up to do something with shortly after the swaps. This could be scheduling IC for later in the day or the next day, or having a friend over for dinner. Dogs are wonderful therapy, but they are lousy conversationalists when you really need someone to talk to.

Anyway, what you are currently doing doesn't seem to be working for you, so experiment with things to figure out what can help you get through those couple days more.

[PigPen]

Thanks As, I appreciate your input.

I think it's less about expecting a reaction from her or even expecting anything from her and more about the experience itself. I fall back in love with her again when I see her. Especially now. Our communication is better, we're both doing things we wanted to do when we were together, we're both more vulnerable. The same things she wanted from me in our M I wanted from her.

So when we have an exchange that's so positive, it makes me more upset than if we were to get together and argue or have it be negative in any other way. She has re become the woman I married, not the woman who I lived with for the last 16 months who was a shell of this woman. I believe I have turned into the same, more so even, much more so than the man she married.

What's worked was what I did today, to be honest. I was the one that kept the barrier up, I needed to create the boundary for myself. She's done so by first leaving and then having me served. Now it seems like she's more comfortable opening up because the process is in motion, but I'm not. I've been open for 8.5 months but have grown weary of how it leaves me.

Maybe DB'ing means you have to stay open, but it's worn me thin. The cold coupled with two solid weeks of dreaming of my W and not sleeping well because of it have worn me down. Now I just want to get on with my life. Maybe tomorrow I'll feel differently.

I called my best friend on the drive home and told him that this was actually our easiest swap and for me our most pain free interaction. I may be overthinking all of it, but on some level it felt good to be the one leaving first, the one who set the boundary. It wasn't done to punish her or take anything from her, but just to protect myself.

Cheers,
PP

[asitis]

Nothing wrong with protecting yourself as long as it doesn't grow into bitter resentment or just a flip side of trying to manipulate her with warmth. At a certain point you just have to stop trying and let them do what they will. You can be open to working on it, you can even let them know you would be willing to do the hard work if it ever became something she considered in the future, but then you need to get on with your life.

It's like being in a double bind. If you walk away, you confirm to them that you really didn't love them after all and they were right to dump you before you dumped them. If you try to woo them, then you are smothering them. So walk away while making clear that you have always been and remain open to reconsideration and the hard work that goes with that. Neither smothering or abandoning. Just maturity, respect (for her & yourself), and the love to give them what they need to walk their own path. Dropping the rope really is the best thing you can do for everyone involved. You can't love her unless you can love yourself. Loving yourself means drawing boundaries and attending to your needs in this reality, while not abandoning your deep convictions about loving, honoring, and cherishing. In many cases, this means letting go and moving ahead.

Easier said than done.

BTW, as I know you had some interest in Buddhism before, I've like Storms Can't Hurt the Sky: A Buddhist Path Through Divorce by Gabriel Cohen. I've also found Charlotte Kasl's If the Buddha Dated good (she also has If the Buddha Married, but our sitches regardless if it is reconciling w/ our Ws or someone new are closer to the dating book - and she is both a therapist & lay teacher, so this isn't the how to score w/ hot Buddhist chicks in your Yoga class - although there's nothing wrong with that if that's what you're into & its mutual )

[PigPen]

Thank you As, I appreciate you responding again and agree with you. There was no malice today, nor slight of hand anything, I was just tired and didn't want to spend more time than was needed in a dog hand off. I think it was authentic. I would have stayed and chatted if I wanted to. The rope is dropped as far as I can tell.

I've got Storms Cant Hurt on the way from Amazon. You might have mentioned it elsewhere or I saw it somewhere else and snatched it up.

Just picked up Shambala - The Sacred Path of the Warrior today too. Lots to read these days.

Big non attached hug to you my friend, the first Noble Truth certainly does appear to be true in our cases.

PP

[PigPen]

Sunday morning journaling. Hope all you DB'ers are having a peaceful weekend.

Still in NC with WAW, meeting with a L tomorrow to go over the few details that are in involved in my D. Meeting with the L after being served has made all of this very real and still upsetting but I'm detaching as best as I can. I view the D as a painful process that I have to go through before moving on to the next chapter of my life. Like a hard workout, I know the next few months have some painful parts, but the worst is over.

I've got Woofie for the next week and am enjoying him immensely. Lots of trips to the beach, hikes, and park. He's such a joy and is actually the only part of the D that we both disagree with. Well other than the reason.

Our paperwork states "Irreconcilable Differences" but that's not really true in my opinion as we actually never tried to reconcile them! It is what it is though.

My DB'ing has come down to completely accepting that I'm getting D'ed, and moving forward. GAL is still at an all time high, I'm meeting great people, enjoying myself, and putting together a year long project for next year that will take me around the country and to different parts of the world. It may be a year of running, but feels like a year of healing and adventure. At the end of it I will have something to share with people that will be of real value and that makes everything post BD worth the pain.

I question whether I'm still DB'ing, maybe at the latest stage where acceptance is all that you can do while continuing down a path of self improvement, or if this isn't DB'ing any more. When I see my WAW for dog swaps, I'm pleasant and honest, but don't actively "use" the meet up for any kind of purposeful advancement.

Cadet says that the LBH always has the final say in when the R is over, and I'm still battling with this thought daily. Many times I've thought I understood it and then many times I feel like I have no say what so ever as to the outcome of my sitch now that the D ball is rolling.

I know the control I do have is how I continue to react to everything, to chose faith over fear, sobriety and self improvement over numbing and acting out. Maybe that's the final choice we all get to make.

Happy Sunday DB'ers.

PP

[rd500]

Hi PP. you have control over you and control over how things affect you What you also control is if you stand or not If you decide you no longer want an R with W then that's it. Whatever W decides or changes her mind or whatever your control of you makes the final choice.

You might meet someone who you enjoy and like spending time with but wish to keep that R as light to see how W gets on. I remember old dog telling his new lady that if his W change her mind he would give the R a chance. He was quite clear with the new lady.

That's my takeon the wise cadets words but I'm sure he will clarify at some stage

Take care. Rd

[NDY]

Hey PP. thought I'd drop in.

When my WW dropped the final bomb, I realised at that point it was over between us. I really did. Vanilla said on my thread just let it go. And I did. I let it go and man, I feel so much better for it. I feel your pain my friend. I seeps from every word you write. But you will be ok.

The letting go thing is so difficult. It really is. It's all part of the fear. Embrace the fear. You are a MAN and a strong one at that. Use that strength to move on.

I hear you about the 'Irreconcilable Differences'. My WW walked away from her M and burnt every bridge on the way back. And it [censored]. Big time.

Man hug from across the pond.

[PigPen]

Thanks rd, and NDY. I know you've been going down the DB road for a while so I respect your opinions and insight greatly. Sincerely appreciate you giving me your thoughts.

You're both right, I do have the power to chose how I react. I have been angry all week at my WAW but today woke up and thought, "you know you can chose to look at this a different way, a way that doesn't leave you feeling like this." It kind of made me stop in my tracks. There's always a choice in how we react. Even on the awful days.

NDY - Embracing the fear is huge. I love how you phrased that. You're right. I am a man, and a very strong one. I've learned that lesson from all of this and am grateful for the opportunity to learn it now and not when I'm 70.

Thanks gentlemen, you've made my Sunday.

PP

[ATPeace]

Hi pp I have been reading your thread and you are a good man unquestionably you have come a long way

high five scuba dive fist pump

The care

Ghost