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HaWho Offline OP
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New thread.

Here is the link to the old:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2590521&page=11

And my last post:

Sotto and Job-thank you. You are right. You nailed it. More detaching. I did it Friday and Saturday but couldn't today.

Meanwhile one other issue I have is with MIL. She has some inkling that something is off. She was sniffing that something was wrong w/H as he fell off the planet with his FOI. She kept asking me and I kept saying everything is fine. But in May she confirmed something was off w/H by calling him and asking something and then calling me minutes later and receiving a different answer.

She confronts me saying she knows H is off and asks what is going on with him. I give a little info-that he is in a funk and working through it.

Her answer is horrifying. She tells me he was born angry and that I should pack my bags and leave him. I spent months reeling from that. She is the root of 99% of this. She has learned nothing. She owns none of it and her comment was an insult.

Had she said nothing or "I am so sorry you are going through this" I would have given her a pass. But I know the kinds of things she did and H was not born this way.

She dropped out of my solar system (another blow as she always checked in with me) and texted me once a month, maybe. Always: how are the kids? Me: Fine! How are you?

Never a question about H. This gave me more compassion for H.

Last week she texts that she has not talked to me in a while and asks me to call her sometime. And here is where the struggle is. She will ask how H is. And I want to tell her politely that H is working through childhood issues. I want to do this to cue her that H was not born angry. He was an emotional and physical target in his own own home while still in diapers.

I know this will not solve a thing. But by saying nothing I feel like I am agreeing that H was just born this way. To what end though? To punish an old woman for something she did 45 years ago? But then I feel I am not defending my H. I feel like I paint this guy as just struggling along for no reason and that's not fair or honest either.


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 5,301
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Hi HaWho, you sound a little like 'go between' with H and MIL. I think this is for them both (and not anyone else) to resolve. Being in the middle and trying to navigate these tricky waters sounds a bit 'fixerish' to me.

If your MIL asks you how he's doing...could you say - He's doing fine - I'm sure he'd love to tell you himself. I'll let him know you asked. And if she pushes, tell her she'll need to ask him Qs like that herself.

Equally, if your H wants to speak to her about his difficult childhood, I'm sure he will. Their R is theirs to own IMHO. You only own your own R with each of them both.

JMHO HaWho (think you're doing great by the way.....I enjoy reading your thread :))


T 13 M 7
Me 48 H 46
SS 15
BD 7.14 PA
D final 5.16 (H filed)

We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
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Thanks Job, Sotto and AJ-for the advice and as always the support. You guys are awesome!

Still working through what to do about MIL if, when I talk to her she asks about H. Balancing making sure I do not try to fix it (thanks Sotto), but have H's back (thanks AJ) and also feel good about myself here. It feels pretty lousy to hear her say he was born angry. I don't believe it as his wife nor as a mother myself. Staying silent makes me feel like I am giving her a secret nod of agreement.

In other news, I spent the last few days trying to figure out what sent me spinning like a top. Friday and Saturday H was cycling and I was able to detach. Sunday I was not. Still evaluating why. I know Job is right. I see it.

Right now, I don't know how to stop the feeling when it starts. So I started to think, maybe for now I don't focus on stopping the feeling but just work on not showing it so fully to H and in my overall demeanor? Then maybe once I am not wearing my emotions on my sleeve I can start to work on stopping it all as it is starting? Not sure here.

Later that day we texted. I think we were both feeling each other out. H told me he was a good guy for getting a lot of work done as though justifying leaving me ASAP to return home. I validated and told him he was a good guy even when he wasn't working. He sent back smiley faces. That evening I pulled it together and resumed showing a PMA, patience and all that. Still felt some spinning but was able to keep it closer to my vest. Evening ended well all things considered. Interesting that after drifting we drew closer together. That is a 180 for us. Was he testing my changes?

This is kind of ironic. The day after crazy spinning, as I am coming home from work, H texts me that he bought me a gift! This is definitely one of his key ways of showing affection. This will be the first gift he has bought me without a "reason" (not a holiday or a birthday) in many years! Oh, please don't let it be light bulbs or a Swiffer. Please, please, please . . .

I come in and you are not going to believe the irony of this one. It is a beautiful night light . . . A LIGHTHOUSE night light!!! He is going away this weekend with his good friend (woo hoo!) and he told me that when I get frustrated being all by myself to look at the lighthouse and think of him. He had that old glimmer in his eyes-not the dead depressed eyes. I kissed him on the cheek, validated and told him I will be lighting his way home for him.


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,597
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H has left for his weekend away with old pre-MLC friend!

Lots of differences in actions compared to April trip he took with MLC "friend." NC at all then. He called kids phone or texted kids only and not always as promised. Who was this man?!? When my sons were talking to him on speaker phone, at the end of their conversation, one son asked if H wanted to talk to me. H's answer: nah, I am all set.

And that about sums up what life what like then.

This time, day before his trip H texted that he will miss the 3 of us. H again worried about our safety: told us to lock doors, windows, etc. He called me-did not text-when he landed. He had excitement in his voice. This reconnection with "old" friend is SO good for him.

Hours later I received a photo of them via text. I know what that was: H showing me he really was with friend. I validate.

H called to say goodnight to all of us-like he used to do. The next morning he called but I missed it; I was not within ear shot of the phone. He called son's phone and I heard his first words: "is your mom okay? Where is she?" Seems a bit paranoid. But he has been having a lot of nightmares lately. I think he may be working though issues even in his dreams. Many of the settings of the dreams are his childhood home. The other night, in a dream, he explored every nook and cranny of his childhood home. He could remember wallpaper, what was in x drawer, etc. So very powerful is the mind.

Meanwhile I have a welcome respite. Lots of time to think. H texted that he has not seen this friend in 15 months! This caused me to go back and really try to figure out when this all started . . .

H bought a convertible about 3 yrs. ago. I joked that he was starting a MLC and car was better than a mistress. It seemed so funny then. Not so funny now, as I think he did start to purchase toys and that MLC was actually taking place then. I was so naive. It was all so slow and subtle.

Like we all know it started with a general irritability. Then he was always critical of me. Everything bothered him. I entered my D then. My sister's son was about 6 months and it was becoming too hard to pretend that something was not very, very off with him.

I lived in denial of all around me for a very long time. I ignored issues with H; he was angry a lot. I drifted into some sort of fog and I buried reality of everything going on with H, nephew and sister.

Those were horrible years. Months and month of testing nephew. Eliminating what it was, which initially was a relief! It's not x, y or z. He is constantly tested, poked and prodded. Poor little guy! But with time it becomes clearer and clearer that it is something and if they are eliminating the more common possibilities it is time to start looking for rarer possibilities. Then he is assigned a rare disorder geneticist.

I have so much guilt in those years. Why her? Why are my kids given so much and hers so little? What kind of a life is this for her, for him? What about their marriage? Lots of dreams where nephew if fine; so real that I wake up not knowing which is the dream and which is real?

I am lost in all this. Working through all the stages without even knowing it. H is knee deep in anger/replay. Fall 2014, I have worked through it all. I have closed doors, have accepted situation with nephew and when I think about him I can only go back so far. I cannot cry nonstop anymore or get angry. Not can I deny gravity of it all. And yet I come out the other side of this!

Then as I begin to get my footing, BD # 1!! And I enter a whole new world I never knew existed . . .


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,597
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I had a feeling that H was staying on an extra day without his friend.

Today he called in the am to say hello. I asked his plans and he tells me friend has left already (mid morning). H tells me his plans for the day.

When H asks what I am doing today, I lay out the plans with kids. He says "well sounds like you have everything under control." Ends conversation calling me endearing nickname.

Then I have feelings I don't like. It makes me sad that my H stayed on by himself while well adjusted friend flew home to his family. It is a reminder that my H is broken. My mind wanders to: I wonder what he will do all by himself tonight? Will he be all by himself?

Then the statement "you seem to have everything under control" really crawled up and all over my skin. I feel resentment surface. I do feel used.

I am trying hard to process emotions. Rationally I know he is in MLC and cannot really even take care of himself.

As for my sadness over H being broken I think it was made more painful, because I know this friend of his. At one point they were both "healthy" guys. I don't know if somewhere deep down I hoped that time with this friend would straighten H's path. I know that cannot be. I know he has to do this himself and only if he chooses/has the clarity to do it.

Comment about me having everything under control bothers me for 2 reasons. First, I do feel used. H needs all this time to cope with MLC and I just cover everything with kids. Again, it is the reality of standing with an MLCer.

But also, this comment bothered me because it reminded me of childhood. Very old feelings surfaced. I hate that feeling.


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
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Posts: 3,622
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Expectations. They are a b*tch, yeah? smile

Quote:

As for my sadness over H being broken I think it was made more painful, because I know this friend of his. At one point they were both "healthy" guys. I don't know if somewhere deep down I hoped that time with this friend would straighten H's path. I know that cannot be. I know he has to do this himself and only if he chooses/has the clarity to do it.

Comment about me having everything under control bothers me for 2 reasons. First, I do feel used. H needs all this time to cope with MLC and I just cover everything with kids. Again, it is the reality of standing with an MLCer.


I would have thought you'd have expectations that friend would say something magical and your H would come bouncing back to reality. It'd be strange if you didn't, HW. Seriously. 7 1/2 years on, I sometimes have those thoughts. Not rational nor realistic, but there nonetheless. To be honest, it's not a problem nor "wrong" to feel that way. But in the end, you and I both know that it won't happen like that for you smile What's far more likely is that like it came on, it'll leave slowly. What remains is to be seen, but he seems to be heading in that direction. He wouldn't ask nor care about the kids if not, nor would he care what you were doing. I know that's small consolation compared to what you want, but it is what it is at this point. Just keep perspective and know that feelings are what they are and neither "good" nor "bad" per se. You are at least, "normal" in your feelings smile

Quote:
But also, this comment bothered me because it reminded me of childhood. Very old feelings surfaced. I hate that feeling.
This caught my attention. Can you share some more about that?

AJ


"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK
Put the glass down...
"Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world
Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
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Hi AJ-you are right. I do know it won't happen that way. H does seem to be creeping in the right direction and I need to stay patient.

As for H's comment that I had everything under control, my mother was severely depressed her whole adult life. She didn't want to take meds because of course, she did not believe she was depressed.

I was the youngest and the only one of my siblings who lived alone with her. We all became fixers but those years alone with her really forced me into this situation to take care of things, including her, at a crazy young age. I held a lot of other things together in that house. We all became adept fixers and givers pretty fast.

Now, here I am with a guy who is in this deep depression who can't be a partner to me right now. I am right back to being the one to have everything under control. And that comment made me feel like I have come full circle--that I am right back where I started! Even though I worked so hard to get out of that situation. And, even creepier, it made me feel like I married my own mother!


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,597
Likes: 2
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A few updates and a question I am hoping someone can answer.

H returned from weekend with pre-MLC friend. Before he returned he asked if I wanted to have lunch the following day. I said yes, but said if he decided he was too tired, then it was no problem for him to change his mind. He has been very tired lately and I really feel better when I communicate to him that he can change his mind. Maybe I am trying to take pressure off him but really protecting myself against potential rejection?

Anyway H lands and texts me the time and restaurant with a question mark. I say: sure see you there. He answers: we're not driving together? Me: oh we can drive together. (This is first time I NATURALLY had no expectations. So many times I have expected us to drive together and then in the 11th hour H drives on his own and I am injured. Now I am learning to always plan to go on my own.)

Today we are texting a bit. He says he is around the corner from home. I tell him I will be leaving soon for a walk w/dog. He says, if I wait he can join me. So I do.

Seems to be a peek out week. He reminds me of Rip Van Winkle in these moments.

As for question I have, I have been reading through lots of threads on here. It seems in so many situations, people's marriages were pretty good pre BD. I feel like my situation is different because pre-BD there was distancing that took place due to my depression. As mentioned before I did odd things and a bit of nasty monstering, too. Oi!

But I guess my question is, should I be reaching out a little more on peek out moments given my prior distancing in my own depression? As mentioned before, this was an issue in our M and H tried to reason with me when I was in my fog. If he seems to be creeping forward and has a peekout, should I still just follow his lead for the most part or should I initiate a bit? Or is this still a no-no despite prior depression/distancing issue?


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
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If things are working well right now, then don't change anything. By allowing him to make decisions, i.e., changing plans, etc., this gives him the "control" he seeks over his life.

I think you are doing well at the moment. If you reach out too much, he'll scurry right back into himself and distance himself. Continue to drop the crumbs of friendship and allow him to come to gobble them up, hence he'll come to you.

Continue to keep to keep the expectations at zero.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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I've been a little down this weekend. Just thinking about it all can get you down.

Heading into the weekend H made a joke about how he is the same weight as always but the weight is distributed differently (more in his stomach). He was in good humor about this. He used to take more jabs at himself but in MLC aging has hit him hard. Usually, I reassure him on how great he looks, which he does.

This time I didn't say a word. It is true, the distribution of his weight is changing and I don't think I am doing either one of us any favors by denying it. Plus, I am SO over conversations about aging! (He has come a long way though as months ago he talked incessantly about how attractive he was and that he "just knew" there were soon many women who wanted him. Have to love that MLC vanity.)

H used to be an on time person. Last night he went out for a walk said he'd be back at x time. 40 mins. after time he said he would be home, he is not back. I text him and say I am eating with kids as they are hungry. Minutes later he says he is on his way back. 10 minutes from then kids start to bicker and I decide to take them out. Plus, in all honesty, it does not sit well with me that I am sitting around "waiting" for him. I text him we are leaving.

He texts back a joke that I am misbehaving. I text him that kids were antsy and I was tired of waiting around for him. I also say as he did not text he was running late I did not know what time he would return. He texts that it takes time for him to get back and he was only 20 minutes late. His math is off but I don't answer. Plus, he certainly could have texted he was running late.

When we meet up later at home, I know he is mad. He tries to joke it off. I do a 180 and ask him if he wants to talk about it as he seems upset. He says he thinks I was pouting. I say maybe that's right. Kids were bored, he was on his own clock and it did not sit well with me to sit waiting for him with hungry kids who were starting to bicker.

I know, expectations at zero but that doesn't mean I have to wait around. (Need to not make it seem pouty though.)

Things were a little awkward in the AM. I feel good about it though. I was polite and calm but not a doormat. He can be late but that does not mean I have to wait around. In the past, I would not remain calm and then rather than discussing the primary issue at hand, things were deflected onto me. I know that by not over-reacting I was able to keep the spotlight where it needed to be.


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
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