New here- please give me advice on how to proceed

[MrBond]

Hang in there. I will say that your H and his family sound like an @$$. He's got to put on his big boy panties and learn how to deal with family responsibilities like a MAN and not a whiny little boy.

[gonegrl]

Thank you Mr Bond! His parents have always been an issue for us. They do not believe in boundaries, and my mother in law loves to talk about people and say really nasty things, and then completely deny that she ever said it. For years my H has been standing up for me (not well, but he has been trying) and it has caused him to feel "in the middle" and alienated from his parents. So now he has just sided completely with them. I overhear bits and pieces of their conversations, about me "14 years ago, she said blah blah blah", and a few weeks ago my mother in law called me and said she is going to mail me a copy of a video tape she found of my H with a prom date (not his prom even, just some girl he took to her prom) and she wants me to watch it and report back to her on my level of jealousy? Really, a 30 year old video? When I have been with her son for 25 years, and am the mother of his children? Its like some weird emotional test. And if I told my H that she said that, IF he said anything to her about it she would most likely deny it. This is the type of thing that has been going on for 25 years, my H is sick of it (I don't blame him) and tbh so am I , but unless he takes a firmer stand or cuts contact this is how they treat me. And he has decided now that they have been right all along. His gf was alienated from her parents too, and they decided together to "reconnect" with their respective parents and this is what happened.

[MrBond]

Wow. His family is nuts. I would politely tell her that you appreciate her concern, and that you don't have a jealousy issue, you are just not interested in sharing your H with someone while you're M'd. Then cut all ties with them.

[gonegrl]

I told her I don't have a jealousy issue, she insists I do because I don't like when H goes to strip clubs or when he gets massages from "questionable" massage parlors. I am ok with him going to a sports massage place, or a spa, just not the hole in the wall places that offer special "services". I have had a few instances of jealousy- my H is not very affectionate with me and there have been a few times over the years where he paid attention to another woman, at a party or something, and I became jealous. Not a daily or even regular thing, I am talking about maybe 5 examples over the course of 25 years, I can probably come up with more examples of time H got jealous but its really not an issue. But now apparently it is HUGE issue. I figured out because H doesn't want to accept that he hurt me by having an affair, so he just tells everyone I am insanely jealous and even said to me "what difference does it matter that this time was real, your reaction is the same as when I talk to any woman." Which is totally untrue. Again, like I said, there have been a few minor incidents over the years, I am not proud of that, but I am a human being and on occasion have felt jealous.

[gonegrl]

I realize now that my H really does sound like an a@@ but I swear that prior to 6 months ago or so he was a totally different person. Always stood up for me, I don't know who this guy is. I miss him so much.

[sandi2]

It has only been 4 months which seems like an eternity to me, but I am getting discouraged reading other people's stories.

Don't be discouraged reading other posts. Most are people that are in the same boat as you find yourself, and like you, they feel lost and desperate. Also, the majority of people stop posting before we know the ending of their story. And for sure, those who reconcile move ahead and leave the board. There are a handfull of "vets" who have stayed with board, as a way of paying it forward b/c of what DB did for them. It can be frustrating whever a poster just leaves unexpectly, but that's just how people are.

Does anybody think there is a chance that now that he is being "nicer" that he is actually coming out of this?

Photoka, I am not the most tactful person on the board. But I am as honest as I can be to those I send a post. This question you have asked about there may be a chance that he is actually coming out of this now that he is being nicer, really tugs at my heart strings. I want to throw my arms around and tell you these are very positive signs and how progress comes in baby steps. But I will let someone else do that part. I think you, like most, desperately want some sign that tells you there has been progress. It has been my experience in reading thousands of posts, that a sudden turn-around in the spouse is not authentic. It usually comes in tiny baby steps, back steps, and a few more baby steps. Saddle up, b/c your journey has just begun.

I hope that you will somehow be able to find balance in the advice you get. I also hope you won't see me as the bearer of negativism. I feel positive about your M, but I shoot from the hip, so to speak. Sometimes it comes across sounding a bit blunt or even harsh, but that is not (usually) my intent.

Most newcomers have a lot to learn, and the first thing many ask is about 180's or the 37 rules seeming to be the opposite of what they feel they should be doing. DBing is counterintuitive, so of course it may feel a little strange in some advice you may receive. This is especially true if the advice is saying to pull back (for example) and the newcomer asks, "But what if this was a complaint my Spouse had about our MR"? As Cadet has said, DBing is about doing what works for your M. Although, it has been my experience to see many LBS who are responding from their own fear. It does require a certain amount of trust to follow principals and techniques that your emotions are questioning about getting positive results and your fear is telling you to not take a chance.

For example, many newcomers don't understand the concept of what I call DB detaching. I included the "DB" part b/c most people just hear "detach" and think it means to physically detach, act cold or mad. But DBing detaching is none of those things. It's all about attitude.

You can't digest everything at once, so don't hold back on asking questions.

Now back to your H. There are a lot of unanswered questions floating in my head, so I can only imagine what it's like for you! I am going to just cut to the chase here and tell you that I think you and your H should not attend marriage counseling at this time. I do, however, believe he needs therapy for other issues in his life. He is completely under the powerful influence of his parents. In spite his behavior calming and his niceness he has shown, his parents seem to have their own method that keeps him pretty much in line.......with their interference. (However, "you" don't need to voice this to him.)

I can empathize with your emotional, mental, and physical stress. I had a young teenager with a disease that she fought tooth & nail (rebellion) and every year brought more stress on our family.........and mainly me. My H made no attempt to learn about about her disease, and he had never been the disciplinarian with our kids. So it was left to me to "deal" with her disease and her rebellious behavior, while he sat back as the silent "good guy". It did not end after her teen years, and continued through her twenties. Feeling I was alone in carrying for her and the level of stress almost killed me, and for sure...changed the atmosphere of our home and added to my resentment toward my H.

I also had a mother-in-law who interfered and influenced my H in every part of our daily lives. She criticized me to him about almost everything, and painted me (to the other relatives) as a terrible wife & mother. For years I tried to please her b/c I wanted her approval and acceptance. But each year took its toll on my marriage, b/c my H put his mother first. However, she never talked down to me, (it was just behind my back), and never demanded an explanation, etc., the way your in-laws have talked to you. I just wanted you to know I understand a little bit of your situation.

Your H could be experiencing MLC, but IDK. Yes, I believe your M has a chance but I don't believe the issues will be resolved quickly. In fact, I believe the MC sessions are causing things to be worse, at this time. I realize we only have your side of the story, but based on that, I think your H's problems are coming from another source. Until the root of those problems can be resolved, your M may continue to get the backlash.

Here is what I suggest at this time. Continue going out once a weekl for dinner, as long as you can see this giving positive results from him. Other board members may faint when they read me giving this advice, b/c normally I wouldn't. Every situation is just a little bit different and the person who comes here looking for help has to tweak the "rules" (which are not really rules, just tips) for their particular stitch.

You asked if you planning the dinner date was pursuing. Usually, yes, but in your case and based on what you said about his positive behavior during the dinner.....just set the date, time, and reservations (if needed). As long as he is talking and showing a side of his former self, this could be used to your advantage. I strongly urge you to stay far away from discussing the relationship, his parents, or any other stressful problems at home/kids, etc. Use this time to show him the New & Improved.....Ms. Independence.....spunky.....care-free.....poised.....classy lady. Act as if you are having dinner with someone who is not your H. (Don't take that the wrong way). Let this be a time that does not involve family, finacial, or marriage problems. Let him see you being pleasant during this time particular time. If his behavior toward you begins to dive during dinner, then don't set any dates for a couple of weeks. If you are confused about anything I've said, please ask me. And I hope this doesn't confuse other readers. In your stitch at this moment, I do not see this as cake eating or pursuing, but rather, experimenting and monitoring results. When you read the DR book, you will understand better.

My advice is that you suggest to him that the MC appointments are postponed for a while, and suggest that you really want to try indiviual therapy, and then later resume the MC. Do you think he would attend therapy, alone? Would you be able to afford the two of you going to IC? Sometimes, depending where you go, their offices use a sliding scale to determine the payments.

To me, it seems both of you need guidance and support for the things that are causing hurt and stress from family, personal, marriage issues, etc. I think it would help you receive healthy advice in how to deal with the various sources of stress in your life. Plus, you could discuss the M problems without your H being present and it leading to more pain. Hopefully, each of you could see the same therapist, indivually. Then the therapist could delve into other roots with your H. When each of you are in a better place indivually, then you might consider meeting together for marriage counseling.

I need to close this long post. It takes time to communicate information.

[Cadet]

Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka
that I totally agree with.

Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.

It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.

We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.

Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.

[gonegrl]

I ordered the books last night. We have MC tonight, but then I am going away with my children on a two week vacation. He will be with us for the first weekend (with his parents) and then he heads back to work and I continue on to see my family and friends. He is going to IC as well, our MC suggested that from the beginning. So after tonight we have a 2 week break from MC. I think I will use the vacation time to read the books, read this board, and absorb everything I can. I will not call him or check in with him but he can call me or text me and I will be pleasant when he does. Does this sound like a good plan?

He can't get on my laptop, I changed the passwords recently. Thank you.

Oh, also, he said he doesn't want a divorce, but it all depends on if I can change. He admitted in counseling last week that he sees changes in me, and that it is good. But still not taking any responsibility for his own behavior. He honestly seems to have forgotten what he has done.

[gonegrl]

Sandi, I am reading and rereading your 37 rules, thank you!

[gonegrl]

Sorry to post so much, but what I am wondering is, and maybe this is in the book, but my husband is just totally 100% different so what happened?
I understand stress, questioning life, being influenced by his parents, etc, but how can someone change so radically?
It is not like he is an angrier or more depressed version of his old self, it is like a completely different person, with different memories and different priorities.
He is drinking and smoking and playing music all day, talking about me behind my back, its really like he is a rebellious teenager.

Although as "crazy" as my actual teenager gets, she is grounded in reality, he is making stuff up, or rather extremely exaggerating things to the point where it might as well be made up.
My kids are upset that "dad is smoking" (because they teach them in school that cigarettes are a drug, really scare them) and he thinks its funny, and winks at them.
For the last 2 years or so he was depressed, so maybe that was a red flag that something was going on?

And again, maybe this is in the book, but I would think that if someone went through this and then eventually regained their senses, won't he feel really guilty about what he did and then that would send him right back into a depression?
I know I would feel like crap if I acted out like this to my husband and children.
Or is he never going to make that realization? I did order the books.