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Originally Posted By: CaliGuy
That's my mind set at the moment ... each stage takes energy and a different approach, its my personal race, one I could stop at any time .. .but I am a competitor and I still feel the prize at the end of it all will be worth the effort .. that prize is not my W nor my M ... its the man looking back in the mirror every morning, that's who I am doing this all for.


Excellent. Always enjoy reading your posts, its giving us all the motivation to keep going, that things can work out for the best. Its a long and hard road we all take, but one that is guaranteed to be worth it if we stick it out. Your nearing that finish line, stay strong, keep moving.


Accept what is, let go of what was, and have faith in what will be
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Ok peeps ... happy Monday .. Update time , I am going to do this one in 2 parts(or more .. we will see...says guy who has a ton to list/journal/release) as I can here at work because a good deal happened over the weekend.

Friday night ... W wanted me to come by before work, I laughed at myself as the old me would rush over ... but I had some things I needed to get done, she later TM wanting me to bring the dog over so she could spend time with him .. did not want him alone (code for she did not want to be alone ... yeah .. Misreading and I am awesome at it ... so neener neener) I ended up dropping the dog off and it was a quick hi-bye exchange and I went to work.

Saturday Morning, EARLY ... W picked me up , we dropped off S at a friends place as we went to our first Post Session. Throughout the week my frustration level has been on the rise, I had vented here some and things came up to the surface on the way to the session. W would talk and I was listening ... however when I had something to share she would cut me off, or be checked out of the conversation. This push pull thing was gettign to me, last weekend I felt close and connected and over the week felt like we have drifted apart, flet like she reels me in and casts me out ... and more importantly I felt that our M is not a high priority nor am I. So this had been brewing slowly ... we arrive to the session, its cold in the room so I offer to run down and grab my sweatshirt for her, I go all the way back to the car, return and hand her the sweatshirt. She takes it and does not even thank me nor acknowledge I was there as she is catching up with a woman in the program who she had befriended and met for coffee earlier in the week. Hurt little boy was on full tilt .. I did not blow up but in my head I was spinning.
We get to our first session where we were to share and I expressed how I felt, kept from being angry but expressed my building frustrations from the week, and how that last episode was just the exclamation point on the week. She got defensive and said I was 'assuming' things ... I told her there were no assumptions, my feelings were my feelings and no where when I shared them was there an assumption of her actions or feelings ... I feel how I feel and tossed out the "feelings are neither right nor wrong" as the course has been repeating. We talked a bit .. I cooled off and she reached out a bit .. grabbing hands, offered me a sandwich that she made for me, the nice gestures and caring caught me offguard and helped.
After the class, we went and had lunch .. I suggested a new place that we both were excited about going to. While there talks were really good then we went towards some 'trigger' issues. The OM, the A and who I will list as the OM2. I think I mentioned here that I had shared that OM2 (A friend she worked with previously... and as far as I can tell is still in the friend zone) has many of the same traits of OM1. She shared with me that she told OM2 about our discussion with that and he was upset that he has to pay the price for her A and how I view him (as a OM2/threat) I cleared the air by stating ... I do not see him as a threat per say .. but if I ask for her phone and she refuses that's a huge red flag .. given she had the A I did not see my lack of trust completely off base here. Nor did I think at this point was it a real good idea to try and sell me on 'friendship' with the lies and deceit that transpired over the past couple years .... trust needs to be rebuilt, I do not expect her to end a friendship but I would hope she and he would understand where I am coming from. She then said OM2 was hurt .... I looked at her and said "Tell him I would gladly trade places with him on the hurt ladder ... maybe he and I can discuss just how hurt he is over this" I was calm ... but kind of pissed there was a comparison here. Then I tossed out a truth dart .. asked her "Given the chance would OM date you?" she started a long winded answer ... I said .. "its simple .. yes or no... now maybe you can see where I am coming from" (she shared during the crisis and a breakup with OM that OM2 asked"When is it my turn?" I think it was to hurt me ... maybe dude was kidding .. but I doubt it ... so as far as I am concerned OM2 will need to be firmly set straight and W knows this is my stance. (I do not see him as a threat ... but never seen OM coming either)
We left pretty pissed at each other, I realized this was a boundary test and I did not budge, I did not come out and say it but there was a round about message of ... you can chose who to have in your life just as I can ... this may be a deal breaker, may not ... but at this time I am not in a place where it would be 'ok' for W to go to the gym with OM2. I used the safe word with her (new technique) so we would not escalate the argument, she tried to bulldoze through it and I again held my ground (Alot of boundary testing that day) about 15 minutes she grabbed my hand and asked me what level I was at .. told her an 8, she kept quite .. again asked .. and again I was still an 8 ... she apologized, told me she was sorry, sorry she hurt me so badly. We ran errands, well she did I remained in the car trying to cool off.
We talked a bit ... she seemed to understand where I was coming from, realized I would not be like this if she had not had the A, showed some remorse there. We picked up our S grabbed the dog and went for a walk. S shared with me he felt left out a bit .. abandoned ... he and I had a really good talk, I explained a few things to him, seemed to make a big difference.
W made us dinner, then we did our 'homework' and watched a movie together as a family. I fixed her computer (I am a fixer ... lol) and I went out and walked the dog ... came back, put S to bed and was about to go home .. W grabbed my hand and wanted me to stay, so again .. spent the night .. in my bed ... with my W.


Sunday Next.....


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BD Sept13



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Originally Posted By: Fogg
Originally Posted By: CaliGuy
That's my mind set at the moment ... each stage takes energy and a different approach, its my personal race, one I could stop at any time .. .but I am a competitor and I still feel the prize at the end of it all will be worth the effort .. that prize is not my W nor my M ... its the man looking back in the mirror every morning, that's who I am doing this all for.


Excellent. Always enjoy reading your posts, its giving us all the motivation to keep going, that things can work out for the best. Its a long and hard road we all take, but one that is guaranteed to be worth it if we stick it out. Your nearing that finish line, stay strong, keep moving.


Thanks Fogg. I completely get the motivation factor .. we all need it from time to time. It is a seriously long and hard road ... but for me .. when I realized its my road and my rewards it makes doing the work a ton easier.


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Ok .. Sunday.

As Bad and tough as Saturday was .. Sunday felt like a hanging change up vs that nasty down and away fast ball.

I wake up Sunday .... W was awake in bed stirring a bit as she typically does, grabs me and turns me towards her, all smiles with a "Good Morning" ... I will not get to graphic but .. short shorts, tank top, and just beautiful looking. I smiled and said "wow, what a wonderful image to wake up to" I do not get her to blush often .. but she did. We spent some time in bed .. more pillow talking, something we always were good at, something I think we both missed, I know I did. I got up.... took the dog for a walk.
I went home and got ready for church ... spent some time eating, reading, relaxing ... W arrived and picked me up. I met with Father G early as I was sharing my "Faith Story" .... after meeting with him, I went to the pew and my heart was pounding, I was getting nervous where I was actually calm all weekend. I prayed ... then I swear .. it hit me .. God wanted me there, wanted me to do this ... everything left me, I felt calm.
Father G went through his Homily and then introduced me and had me come up. I stood at the podium and looked out at the church ... I laughed and the first words out of my mouth were "Wow .. there are so many of you from up here" The parish returned with a laugh and I just said .. "Well I will just get on with this."

I shared my story, my S and W right there in front, I was not nervous, in fact I was open, honest and my humor shined throughout .. but also so did my heart as I opened it up and allowed the people to see where I was during my darkest moments .. shared how God was there the entire time. I finished and to hear 5-600 people applaud from there, was amazing. And even more amazing .. took 30 minutes or so to get out of the church as many people cam up and thanked me for my story, even thanked W for opening her heart and not divorcing ( yeah I shared a bit of that .. but none of the MLC, A, OM stuff)

In the car W grabbed my hand and told me she was amazed at what I did, how I was up there ... and that she was proud of me. I actually felt good and at peace, thankful that possibly my story hit home and may have moved someone to either pursue their faith, get more involved in the church, or re evaluate their marriage as none of us are immune to a BD.

So after that we went to lunch ... then to her place, changed and went to the fair. Was a perfect day for it, spent way to much money .. but well worth it. I told her it was an official date and it would be approached as such. A lot of kissing on my part ... I noticed a good deal of hand holding on hers. Was just a nice day and I realized here and there the kissing part was pursuing and at times she was a bit cold here n there. (To be touched on later) However there was a shift .... she was very much pursuing the hand holding and just being physically close and mid day she asked me a question ... stopped me in my tracks and I asked her to repeat it she said "I said would you like me to grab you something to eat?" looking at me strangely .. I said .. I hear that part .. after that .. what did you say .. ... she smiled and said "I said Babe ... ok .. is that ok I call you that?" I smile and said .. "I thought that was what you said, and yes .. its completely 'ok'" She has not called me that in ... what .. 3 years, I recall during high crisis I used to call her 'Hon' out of habit and it would Spawn Monster like no other ... was just nice to hear that from her after all this time.

We drove home, stopped at the store, she dropped me off home and I was actually fine with staying home. She asked me if I wanted to come over, I said I could if she wanted me to, she replied that she did, but asked if I wanted to .. I reassured her I did, even joked that it does not $uck to sleep with a beautiful woman ... she laughed and said my pick up lines have improved.

I took my time, took a shower, did somethings I needed to do ... went over .. again walked the dog, got S ready for bed and was reading. W wanted to watch a movie I had picked up, we started and I could tell she was done .. nodding off .. I told her it was time for bed, she begged for 5 more minutes. Finally we got to bed and more pillow talk, she asked me about the Homily as it really was relate-able to her, I told her how I seen it, she seemed to agree and we fell asleep.

Woke this morning and W shared that she had slept better than she has in years. she came over ... and .. ok .. how to descibe this .. well there was a 'morning issue' plus the fact its been a long time ... she had me hold her close and my anxiety rose. Frustrated with the fact my W is right there and we are not at that level where we can share 'that'. I do not even feel I can touch her at this point .... she brought it up and we talked about it ... for the first time .. openly and honestly. Started with the kissing stuff the day before ... I shared that PT is my LL, its how I feel emotionally connected, and I NEED that. I told her not to bring up OM and the A but its there, I feel like I have to compete with that, that she shared that sacred thing with him and severed all ties to me in that area. Where as she still felt the ties .. but she understood finally that physical touch is just as important to me as Quality time and words of Affirmation are to her ... the light went off. She then shared more remorse about the A, understood how I felt and it was justified with "what she did to me" as she put it ... told me when we discuss it it brings up anger in her .. not at me but how stupid she was, how ashamed, how much damage she caused. I will not lie .. I know how rare it is for a MLCr to actually own this ... it was really nice to hear it. Then we talked about sex, she shared with me that she did used to hold it out as punishment and realized how much that must have hurt me knowing its how I feel love, she was sorry, she also told me the heath was the issue, but as she became better our issues and problems would not allow her to feel close enough to me to share that. I validated there as I understand that aspect ... I did share the hurt that she shared it with OM rather fast .... she said "you assume I shared that with him so quickly hurts" I simply stated she can not really hide that fact 3 months after OM and her were 'an item' they had sex. Again ... rather than be defensive she came closer and apologized.
She asked if I believed her when she told me she loved me. I told her I do, but its been so long, and she does not say it often, I even shared that I felt the love her and I share was very deep, hence why we were still in that bed together after all that we went through.
She then came in close as I held her tight, she asked if I still found her sexy, I squeezed her and told her she had no idea how attractive I thought she was, told her why ... how certain things over the years had added to it. We talked about sex, about how she in fact does want it, how we both see its important .. a bit of heavy petting and playful ness. No ML but ... the fact we talked about it openly .. it was no longer taboo ... HUGE

I am at peace currently with things, I feel by telling her what I needed, and seeing that she was in fact not only understanding .. but receptive and wanting to make an effort .. again .. HUGE. I left for work and she even laid a pretty big hug and kiss on me asking "is this better?" I told her it was perfect.

So I realize we will backslide .. but I do feel as bad as Saturday was, I have been firm in what I need in all this .. realizing I matter and in return W respects that finally ... even is a bit humble these days which is new and welcomed.

We have 2 weeks till the next Post session, I hope to make some progress with our 'homework'


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BD Sept13



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Cali,

Nice updates! Thumbs up.... laugh

Now, how's your faith in the M? A bit better, right?

It is wonderful that you and W can have those deep and honest conversations. That will aid a long way in cementing your strong bond as a unit. I am so so glad that you guys attended Retrouaville.

Yeah....I'm gonna pull out the "I told you so!" card here. grin

Bottom line...I think you and W are now officially in piecing, my friend.

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Originally Posted By: Wonka
Cali,

Nice updates! Thumbs up.... laugh

Now, how's your faith in the M? A bit better, right?

It is wonderful that you and W can have those deep and honest conversations. That will aid a long way in cementing your strong bond as a unit. I am so so glad that you guys attended Retrouaville.

Yeah....I'm gonna pull out the "I told you so!" card here. grin

Bottom line...I think you and W are now officially in piecing, my friend.

Thank you Wonka

Faith in the M .. yeah .. its much better. As I shared with W during ... man .. feels like we 'talked' 48 hours straight so its hard to recall it all and spill it here .. I try to share as much as I can for me to possible look back on .. but more so for others to relate to in case it might help. But yeah ... the fact I can actually share with her how I felt ... the analogy of her casting me out and reeling me in she at first did not understand .. but after realizing during the entire crisis she did that ... lightbulbs seem to be going off faster and brighter.

This I think can be attributed to ...during the crisis they do this n that .. but being in the fog ... its so thick and they just really do not recall unless you remind them, so its a challenge to get them to fully understand how you feel ... and not always reminding them of the past in a "you really hurt me kind of way .. more like .. What happened happened and there has been some damage we need to fix, you can help this process faster by 'Fill in the blank'.

Retrouvaille I think will play a significant part. Honestly if this M ends up being saved, I would say its was my faith being renewed coupled with this forum to help me understand and change in areas different than what my faith was asking me to change (All these changes for the better) Then you throw in Retrouvaille which has changed the way we communicate .. but the timing was perfect .... just as she seemed to be coming out of crisis ... its given us tools and a place she feels safe in sharing with me those internal MLC thoughts and I can just listen and knowing what I have learned here ... help gently guide her without adding any pressure.


"officially in piecing" I am not moving from this area in the forum ... lol .. call me superstitious ... but yeah .. this morning I though .. ok .. THIS will be work but I do feel we are going about it the right way .... no elephants in the room as we are addressing everything.


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Cali,

good stuff happening. REally happy for you. Keep the ball rolling. Good luck buddy...

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Wow, Cali! Great job with the OM2 boundary/discussion. Wonderful show sharing your story with your church... the fact that you had to stay over meeting with people is a sure sign that they loved your presentation!

Originally Posted By: CaliGuy

We talked about sex, about how she in fact does want it, how we both see its important .. a bit of heavy petting and playful ness. No ML but ... the fact we talked about it openly .. it was no longer taboo ... HUGE

I am at peace currently with things, I feel by telling her what I needed, and seeing that she was in fact not only understanding .. but receptive and wanting to make an effort .. again .. HUGE. I left for work and she even laid a pretty big hug and kiss on me asking "is this better?" I told her it was perfect.


This is HUGE!

It's all coming together as it should Cali. You are doing a great job of not rushing it, while still being confident and assertive... you sexy devil, you! wink

Quote:
I am at peace currently with things


Quote:
W shared that she had slept better than she has in years.


^^^ Both very good signs, Cali. Of course bed time together doesn't hurt either!
whistle

I'm VERY excited for you guys. Stay on track my friend, you're doing great!


M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

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Oh, and if you haven't already, read Michele's book, Sex Starved Marriage. It is highly applicable to your (and my) M, and was written with helpful information for BOTH partners.


M: A really long time.
Crisis: 5 years.
She's still worth it.

Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose. -Viktor Frankl
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Originally Posted By: ForeverYoung
Oh, and if you haven't already, read Michele's book, Sex Starved Marriage. It is highly applicable to your (and my) M, and was written with helpful information for BOTH partners.


Thank you FY. Yes is a delicate walk of boundaries, mixed with understanding .. pressing for what I want but not pursuing to much. Its all new to me ... and takes a good deal of effort but seems to be working at the moment. And as you pointed out .. and it has not gone un-noticed, I see her changing and waking up very quickly, its like the girl I loved and married has woken up finally.

I think the biggest changes the past few weeks have been her clarity, knowing she made horrible mistakes but in a way amazed it was actually her. Also ... she isn't mad at me anymore, not even about the little things.

I will look for that book !!! Thank you!! ... I am currently reading one on how to deal after the A, depending on the cycle I can get hung up/stuck there, not sure if the book is helping or the fact W really seems to be following a certain script (like she read it or was told) on dealing with how I feel .... Its calmness, apologizing for hurting me, and a very concerted effort in trying and working on the M.

As I said ... I am not sure that I or the M is priority #1 but I do feel like a horse making his move on the turn and gaining ground, seems to have alot to do with me voicing what I Need out of all this.

As far as sharing my story about faith...I have told her that one of the changes I made that were non-negotiable for me was my involvement with church and communicated that I did not expect nor would I assume she wanted to be a part of it, but it was going to be a part of my life. Sunday, Sunday night and even today via TM, she seems to have been moved by my changes in that area asking me questions on how to strengthen her own faith and she and S both definitely view me as the spiritual leader in our family which was one of those things I admired in other men and wanted to take on.

She wants me to stay the night again tonight, even made a statement this morning on how she felt bad and its a waste that we are paying rent in 2 different places. Its not move in time yet .. but we are talking logistics and leaning that direction.


M: 48
W: 47
M16 T26-S8
BD Sept13



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