WW/WAW Looking for advice from the pros (Sandi)

[Prowl]

Thanks to everyone. I'm so thankful to have all of your advice and support. I know my EA was wrong and I am sure my W doesn't feel I have fully atoned for my mistake. Do I continue to bring it up and apologize for it or let it rest?

Today has been extremely difficult. I saw her for the first time in months yesterday during a kid swap. It's weird seeing her. She's lost so much weight and her cold, uncaring attitude towards me is something I am still getting use to.

As for the house I really don't know what to do. She hasn't made a mortgage payment in 6 months and she really doesn't have any bills. When I put her child support in her account this week it didn't even take her out of the negative. How does she expect us to pay the mortgage, the catch up payments and my apartment? To give everyone a little back history, my wife is kinda a princess. She was mad when she had to start working 5 years ago and to this day reminds me that "she would never have to work and I would always take care of everything." My overtime went away and she was able to find a part time job working from home. Our biggest fights and resentment comes from this. In the fall of 2013 she didn't work for 3 months and I didn't find out until we started bouncing checks. This last fall she didn't work for a month and a half. When I found out I was extremely angry and that was part of the big fight that led to BD. I remember asking her what we would do if I took months off at a time...

So her wanting to remain in our beautiful home while I pay for everything is kinda par for our marriage. During mediation she wanted to remain in the house until the kids were grown and then sell and split the equity. In a way she is getting this for 3-5 years or until I get the mortgage payments caught up. I don't like living in an apartment. I want to be in my house. I suffer from anxiety and depression and being alone is difficult for me. Especially when I feel I'm being played.

I know I sound selfish and I'm trying not to. I've felt used my entire marriage. I always worked 2-3 jobs and would come home and have to do my own laundry, dishes, etc... My wife is very social and doesn't like doing much around the house. My kids tell me how they are doing everything around the house and the older kids are making dinners most nights while she's "out".

I know this sounds like a complain session and maybe it is. I'm really frustrated this morning and it's all I can do to not call her and cry and beg for her to reconsider.

[sandi2]

Lately, there have been a few days I did not have as much time to devote to the board, and other days I have my old trusty IPad that keeps me connected. It actually helps me by redirecting my focus (for a little while, anyway) where I may not feel quite as useless & helpless as I do when I have sick loved ones. You all know how tough it is when you want to "do" something, but some things are out of your control. There are so many things we face down through life we will not be able to control. I try to apply what I have encouraged others to do, and that is to give of ourselves wherever we can help others.....and in return it helps us deal with our own problems. This community has continued to support and bless me. I just wanted to say, again, thanks for your prayers, concern, and well wishes. It is comforting to me, and I appreciate it greatly.
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Prowl, I just saw your post today, and I am trying to catch up on your thread. I hope it doesn't close before I send my post, but if it does, please start another thread. I don't want you to think I was ignoring you. I am extremely flattered that you would reach out for my help. I do take it seriously, b/c whenever we give advice.....there should be a level of responsibility behind it. At least, that's how I personally feel.

I have not read any previous posts before the one on Thriver's thread, but I have been reading the current thread and see you getting mixed opinions. It must leave you feeling very confused. I usually try not to jump into the middle and add my own VP, too. Since you have sought me out through the title of the thread, I hate not to respond at all.

I will reply in a separate post from this one, okay?

[Georgia Bulldogs]

You need living arrangements that can accommodate visitation with all those kids and a place with a pool that the kids will WANT to visit, then as the more responsible more loving parent you just do your job, pay your modest support and be the best parent you can be until such time that you can petition the court for primary custody of your children. Based upon their ages, they will have a lot of say in which parent they choose to live with and your wife just doesn't really care about them at all right now as she destroys their security, their family AND their father.

Get on some men's rights websites. You've got to be really prepared and document everything for a number of months, even years to eventually "beat" her at this game but your youngest is 8 so really you only have 10 years at most left.

Your wife is a entitled terrorist you can't negotiate with or ever trust so there is no bargain or deal to ever be had with her. This is one situation where I think cutting her off financially, letting the house go, improving YOUR situation to the best of your ability and protecting yourself (and your kids) is priority number one. If your wife hits rock bottom in the process and "repents" so be it. Get out of God's way. If she wants to "save the house" ....let her get a job. She can work now while you have visitation.

Do you have 50/50 visitation?

[Prowl]

Thank you Sandi!! Today's been tough and I'm so happy you took some time from your life and taking care of your family to respond to me. It means so much to me!

I've been crying a lot today and trying desperately not to call and beg her to let me come home and fix our family. I've been strong for four days and I don't want to ruin it now. I'm so tired... Emotionally and physically.

[Prowl]

You need living arrangements that can accommodate visitation with all those kids and a place with a pool that the kids will WANT to visit, then as the more responsible more loving parent you just do your job, pay your modest support and be the best parent you can be until such time that you can petition the court for primary custody of your children. Based upon their ages, they will have a lot of say in which parent they choose to live with and your wife just doesn't really care about them at all right now as she destroys their security, their family AND their father.

Get on some men's rights websites. You've got to be really prepared and document everything for a number of months, even years to eventually "beat" her at this game but your youngest is 8 so really you only have 10 years at most left.

Your wife is a entitled terrorist you can't negotiate with or ever trust so there is no bargain or deal to ever be had with her. This is one situation where I think cutting her off financially, letting the house go, improving YOUR situation to the best of your ability and protecting yourself (and your kids) is priority number one. If your wife hits rock bottom in the process and "repents" so be it. Get out of God's way. If she wants to "save the house" ....let her get a job. She can work now while you have visitation.

Do you have 50/50 visitation?

My schedule doesn't really allow me to have 50/50 custody. I work a 4 on 4 off 12 hour shift schedule. She's told me she's more than happy to let me have 50/50 but she will only agree to a full week. I can't leave my kids all day when I'm at work and I can't get them to school on the days I work.

She is very entitled and she knows I'll always bail her out. I don't know what to do about the house but I tried to even explain to her today that there is no way we can afford the house and rent. She'll move out and let the house go into forclosure before she'll let me come back home. That's her current stand. We have been getting around much better this week and I'm hoping to see any gains soon.

[Matt777]

You need living arrangements that can accommodate visitation with all those kids and a place with a pool that the kids will WANT to visit, then as the more responsible more loving parent you just do your job, pay your modest support and be the best parent you can be until such time that you can petition the court for primary custody of your children. Based upon their ages, they will have a lot of say in which parent they choose to live with and your wife just doesn't really care about them at all right now as she destroys their security, their family AND their father.

Get on some men's rights websites. You've got to be really prepared and document everything for a number of months, even years to eventually "beat" her at this game but your youngest is 8 so really you only have 10 years at most left.

Your wife is a entitled terrorist you can't negotiate with or ever trust so there is no bargain or deal to ever be had with her. This is one situation where I think cutting her off financially, letting the house go, improving YOUR situation to the best of your ability and protecting yourself (and your kids) is priority number one. If your wife hits rock bottom in the process and "repents" so be it. Get out of God's way. If she wants to "save the house" ....let her get a job. She can work now while you have visitation.

Do you have 50/50 visitation?

She'll move out and let the house go into forclosure before she'll let me come back home. That's her current stand. We have been getting around much better this week and I'm hoping to see any gains soon.

I'm confused by this. If you pay all the bills, how can the house go into foreclosure if you move in and she leaves?

When you say getting on much better, what does that mean? You are talking about doing things she doesn't want. Of course she's going to be sweet to you to try to get you to not do them. Don't mistake niceness or peace for progress.

[Prowl]

I'm confused by this. If you pay all the bills, how can the house go into foreclosure if you move in and she leaves?

When you say getting on much better, what does that mean? You are talking about doing things she doesn't want. Of course she's going to be sweet to you to try to get you to not do them. Don't mistake niceness or peace for progress.

Because the past few months I have been paying the mortgages in lieu of child support as agreed on with our attorneys. She ran out of money 2 months ago and can't afford to pay for her attorneys and continue with the D. then the bank contacted us and warned us the foreclosure was looming this month because of the payments she missed before...

Now if she leaves the house I will be paying child support instead of the mortgage. I can't afford the mortgage and CS. She's also said I am welcomed to move back in and she'll move out but she'll go full steam with the D. So basically if I don't stay out of the house there will be no saving anything. She's bullying me and using the situation to her advantage.

[Prowl]

When you say getting on much better, what does that mean? You are talking about doing things she doesn't want. Of course she's going to be sweet to you to try to get you to not do them. Don't mistake niceness or peace for progress.

I meant to write "getting along better"... I haven't been crying, begging, etc... We've only been talking about the kids. We haven't been fighting or bringing up past hurts. My kids even made a comment about noticing us not fighting on the phone anymore the last few days. I'm trying desperately not to beg and plead.

[Prowl]

You can't start over again, and you got a lot of selfish between you and the A, so it will take a long time. I'm not surprised W is baiting you, as she has built up quite a bit of rage. You did well not to take the bait.

Just keep practicing the I'm not a selfish bastard, I recognized that you suffered STFU smoothies, listening, and validating. Buy some stock in STFU smoothies, because you are likely going to be contributing to some profitable quarters.

You can't really replay the healing from infidelity process that MWD outlines in that chapter of DR, but I suspect that there are a lot of tips about the way to approach your very hurt W that you can glean from it. She is going to go through a lot of starts and stops, testing and venting, approaching and distancing. You have a different kind of rollercoaster to ride than some of us, but you seem to have your head and heart in the right place.

Good luck, & good job on getting through the selfish, aren't you going to let it go phase.

Thank you Asitis, this is great advice...

My wife has mentioned this taking a very long time to recover from. Even years... I don't know whether she is using this as an excuse to live in the home with me hoping for a R. Or if she really feels there is a chance for us and that it will just take a while. She is following the script to the "T". She can't or wont recall any good times. None at all!! It's maddening! But it doesn't surprise me anymore after reading DB & DR. She's doing exactly what it says she will be doing.

So for now I'm just going to follow my script. I've stopped playing the victim. Stopped crying and begging and just doing my best to give her "good feelings"...

[sandi2]

What are the ages of you and W, and how many years have you been together?

You are seeking help from a great deal of resources in a relative short period of time. Blend it with all the various stressors you face right now, you must be feeling like a man who is about to go under the last time. Considering your health, I hope you will take a deep breath and try to calm yourself as much as possible. I believe when a person is under tremdous pressure and trying to obtain so much "quick" information, it could result in what I call "brain overload". Has nothing to do with IQ, but the circumstances or conditions. The body, mind, and spirit can just tolerate so much at once, until something starts shutting down. You already feel on the verge of emotional collapse, so please protect yourself by going into survival mode. You can't save your children, marriage, home, etc., if you drown first. So, this post will be my suggestions of what to do before you go down for the last time.

I don't say this as a plug for the DBing forum, but you really have to stop reading various forums.....at least for the time being. The more forums....the more opinions.....the more confusion for you. Your state of being cannot handle all of it at this time. In order to survive, go with one forum/author/program.

Think of your overall stitch as if it were a great body of water. Think of the M as being a a boat that's sinking. You cannot swim if your fear of deep water causes you to fight it, right? You won't survive by going down with the boat, right? You can't save the other passenger (WW) if she drowns you in the process. If you start grab at everything that is rushing pass by (all forums and all advice), the weight will be too great and you will drown. And, you won't swim until you first let go of that boat that has the bottom blown away? No matter what nice possessions you have obtained, you can't drag them along while trying to swim. So, which will it be? If you are too exhausted or scared to swim, and the waters are taking you down, grab a life saver that will hold you up till you can get to shallow water.

So, for now.....stop trying to save everything. Stop trying to win back your WW. Let go. Get your own sharp lawyer who will fight for your rights as a father, and will see what can be done about that PO. Get an educated, certified, legal adviser (someone who knows the laws about bankruptcy, realestate, divorce settlements, child support and custody, and the laws in your state. Don't rely upon the poll from public forums or friends (especially one who is giving advice to her, too?) about your finances and what to do with that monster of a house (that will soon be vacated by those teenagers). You want them to live in a comfortable, nice house? Do you really think the first five kids will still be living at home by the time you can catch up with the payments (not to mention paying off the mortage). What about college? What good will a big nice house be to their future, if they can't find a good job? See what I mean? What is most important? To have a big, empty house the kids can visit in a few years, or to downsize into an affordable, less comfy, house? Which should take priority, paying for their education to give them a better shot at having good careers......or this particular nice house for a few short years?

What do you believe is more important to the kids, to have both parents under the same room while getting divorced......or to keep things as it is now? Which is less stressful for them, and for you? Which way can you cope the best? What does the law have to say about which way is best for you? Find out.

Take care of you health, even if you don't care about it, six other people, at lest, care. Do something to help deal with the depression. Some types have to have help, b/c it doesn't go away by itself. You need to GAL, do something fun, and be around people who like you! Your WW is not going to give you emotional support. Don't go down that tunnel.

You are not powerless, you just feel powerless b/c all of it together is too strong. I am not telling you to go file for a D, if that's not what you want. Get your priorities in order to survive the crises. Then you can deal with other issues, including what and how to deal with our WW, her OM, etc., & etc.

Get some sleep. Tomorrow is another day.

((hugs))