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Time for a new thread.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...729#Post2582729

Long Story Short:

Miscarriage Jan 2014, my good friend passes away a month later - start of very hard year in our M
BD - Jan, 2015, W moves out that day.
Ring off, name change two weeks later
W moves an hour away siting space needed before making any final decisions
W is not wayward, but was unhappy for a number of reasons:
- lack of intimacy
- I was not a leader in the family
- Addiction issues and all that goes with them
- I was reliant upon my W for my own happiness

I was an everyday marijuana user, drinker, workaholic, Mr. Nice Guy, co-dependent and very shut down emotionally. As of today I am 161 days completely sober and have used BD as fuel to completely change my life.

W indicates that D should be considered in the next few months but is in no hurry. MC session scheduled for July, 1st one since week after BD.
Currently no real contact with W other than the occasional text.

Some people have asked about my handle:

In college I would wear a t-shirt two days in a row and then turn it inside out and wear it again - money was tight and laundry wasn't my favorite activity. My roommate noticed this and started calling me PigPen.

When I came on this site I figured that was also how I felt, surrounded by a cloud of dirt. DB has been a lifesaver and my goal is to walk away from that cloud and into a life of clarity, faith, and understanding.

Thank you to everyone on this board that has helped me thus far on this extraordinarily painful yet necessary journey.



Last edited by PigPen; 06/28/15 04:49 PM.

M 39 W 36
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D finalized 6/17
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Yesterday was a tough one. After going through the emotional ups and down of the last two weeks - being told my W was ready to work on our M by her cousin - only to find out that she only wants closure, I was hit with some epic food poisoning.

I spent the entire day on the couch, in bed, or running back and forth to the bathroom. Talk about kicking a guy when he's down. I kept telling myself that part of this journey is about becoming completely self reliant and having to take care of myself even in the worst of times. Thank you Universe for yesterday's lesson.

Today I'm working on my goals - writing, listening to a NMMNG podcast, reading DR, and planning the week. One of my W's complaints was that I didn't take a leadership position in our family so I'm taking one in my own life. I own my own company, and have been the captain of a number of collegiate teams, so it's odd that I handed over the leadership role to her as soon as we got married.

That kind of change takes time, but my goal for today is to "act as if" and get myself back on track after dealing with the depression of last week.

I had a small backslide on Friday when my W responded to a text. We had someone reach out to us that didn't know we were separated and my W responded that we were no longer together. I thanked her for handling the text as I was in a workshop.

When she responded to me with "Awkward huh?" I told her she was lucky that she moved out of our town since I have had to tell people in person a number of times and she hasn't. I know it was a jab at her and a bit of "see how much harder all of this is on me." I've still got some work to do on that front.


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PP, sorry to hear about the rough couple of weeks. We all have those moods hit us at times, nothing we can do about it other than not let it consume us. Keep moving forward and focusing on ourselves. You seem to be doing great with your own changes, keep them up.


Accept what is, let go of what was, and have faith in what will be
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Originally Posted By: Fogg
PP, sorry to hear about the rough couple of weeks. We all have those moods hit us at times, nothing we can do about it other than not let it consume us. Keep moving forward and focusing on ourselves. You seem to be doing great with your own changes, keep them up.
Hello PigPen,

I know that feeling all too well, how you felt yesterday...you are not alone buddy. It must've been gut-wrenching.

I really love what Fogg wrote, that's why I quoted it. I agree totally with Fogg.

PigPen, is there anything you can do today that you enjoy doing? I know it's hard to be motivated when a person is down. But that's when you need it most. Anything simple, treat yourself to a favorite food you haven't had in a while, etc.

I am going to say a prayer for you right after I post this.

Peace!

Bob


Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS)
M:14 yrs
T:15 yrs
No children together--3 each from previous marriages
Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14
Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14
Divorce Final: 10/21/15
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Thanks guys.

Well Bob, I'm not venturing too far from a bathroom today! My stomach seems to have calmed down, but I'm erring on the side of caution after yesterday.

What I am doing is taking some action. During the last two weeks I let my apartment go to hell, and stopped working on my big picture items. I'm working on a website for fitness, health, and wellness and need to get some writing done for it. That's happening today. I'm also filling myself up with a lot of motivational material (NMMNG podcast), and doing my own free writing.

I'm still battling with the subconscious belief that if I fill my life too full that my W won't come back. It's a crazy belief but I have it for some reason. I'm going to do some writing on that and get to the bottom of it as it has to have a stem in - if I become who I am at the highest level then there's no room for a partner. Or something to that effect.

That on some level is still the core of NMMNG, so I know I haven't resolved it in myself yet.


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Originally Posted By: PigPen
I'm still battling with the subconscious belief that if I fill my life too full that my W won't come back. It's a crazy belief but I have it for some reason. I'm going to do some writing on that and get to the bottom of it as it has to have a stem in - if I become who I am at the highest level then there's no room for a partner. Or something to that effect.
PigPen,

You're welcome! Staying close to the bathroom is something I had do to numerous times, so I understand. But glad to hear your stomach seems to have calmed down.

I love this: "What I am doing is taking some action." That's a very good start.

As for the part of your post I quoted at the top, I understand you are confused, hurting, lonely, etc. But please get that thought out of your mind as soon as you can. The fuller your life is, the more desirable you will become to your W. Does it guarantee it will lead to R? No. But I feel it's your best chance to show her you have changed. Then, who knows where things will head.

Would others care to comment?

Take care.

Bob


Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS)
M:14 yrs
T:15 yrs
No children together--3 each from previous marriages
Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14
Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14
Divorce Final: 10/21/15
Joined: May 2015
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Sorry you're struggling with the emotions & the illness.

I wanted to ask for a bit more detail on this learning from cousin that W wanted to work on the M, and then finding out she only wanted to move to closure.

I assumed you talked to W and she clarified that she wasn't coming to work on the R? How did that come about? Did you approach her w/ the news from the cousin, and if so how? What exactly did W say? What steps did she say she was planning to take and what steps has she taken either already or since then.

My W will keep reminding me she still wants a D, or about the plan to sell the house next spring, etc., but she makes no moves to do the things that would move us in that direction.

We've talked about mediation. No mediation scheduled or planned. We've talked about all the things that would need to happen for the house, and I'm the only one working on any of those projects. While that doesn't tell me anything conclusive, remember that you need to pay more attention to her actions than her words.

Also, I see you have MC scheduled. Her initiative or yours? If hers and she says that she wants closure, seriously ask why an MC? What does she think that will accomplish?

Maybe I (or both of us) are misunderstanding what she means by closure. Maybe she wants to see if there is something to save and wants to get to making that decision via MC. If that is the case, take it slow, as MC won't really work too well until she has made a choice to invest her self in trying t make the R work.

If she really just wants closure, sure go to the MC as a safe space to discuss the next steps, but I'd be hesitant to continue after that if she isn't wanting to work to see if the M can be saved. It would be better to look into a mediator (preferably one with a therapy rather than legal background if you still have some hope of the M). Save your MC for when there is work to be done to save the M. Mediator for work to be done to move the other direction.

Good luck & feel better1


Me: 50 W:43
S6, S3
M: 12 yrs. T: 17
M is bad & Not happy Bomb Mar '14
S 5 Feb '15
D Bomb 13 Apr '15 (but "no hurry")
DB Coach May '15
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Thank you for stopping by Asitis, I've followed your comments elsewhere and value your opinion. Your comments to Rzak were very influential in some journaling I just completed about my fear of filling my life up. I'll post those next.

As for your questions.

Originally Posted By: asitis


I assumed you talked to W and she clarified that she wasn't coming to work on the R? How did that come about? Did you approach her w/ the news from the cousin, and if so how? What exactly did W say? What steps did she say she was planning to take and what steps has she taken either already or since then.



I did talk to my W on the phone. To back up, I have a DB Coach and he recommended that I do the 9th step (I'm in a Buddhist version of the 12 steps) with my W. I was addicted to pot when she met me, wasn't a big drinker but by the end of our marriage was drinking 4 nights a week and every weekend. I never got drunk as I don't like hangovers, but 3 - 4 beers a night was common. Couple that with a joint or two and I was checked out every night. My W craves deep connection. Truthfully, I believe we were both terrified of it despite our mutual need for it.

So I sent my W an email asking if she would sit down with me and a C to go over that step - making amends. I had spoken to her cousin the day before just to fill him in on our situation after finding out that he didn't know.

The day after I sent the email to her I sent him a text saying I had reached out to her by email. He called me immediately and told me to call her saying he had spoken to her that morning and that she "was mourning the loss of the M, mourning the loss of you, and wanted me to man up and call her if I wanted to work on our M."

I might have read into that too much that she was interested or at least open to the idea of us working together. I called her and told her that I was still interested in working on our M and asked if she had gotten my email. She said she had and although she didn't want to dredge up the past was willing to sit down with me as it would be a good way "to get closure". When I asked if she would feel more comfortable at her IC's she said, "No, my IC is part of my new life and I don't want to associate you with her."

Specifically I never told her that I had spoken to her cousin. We were going off of my email request to sit down for the 9th step. When she left she told me to stop fighting for our M and to fight for myself. So in our call I told her that I had fought for myself, gotten myself well and didn't want to walk away from our M without at least sitting down and having a conversation with a third party in the room. She agreed.

She hasn't said that she has taken any steps. When I returned from a leave out of the country I told her that my focus was on my sobriety and getting back to work but I was open to communication with her. She replied that "we need to at some point in the future think about who gets our dog, as well as filing and finalizing everything." That's all I've heard from her on the subject and that was prior to me speaking with her cousin.

Originally Posted By: asitis


Also, I see you have MC scheduled. Her initiative or yours? If hers and she says that she wants closure, seriously ask why an MC? What does she think that will accomplish?



The MC session I've written about is the session she agree to that is part 9th step, part just the need to talk with a third party present. I should qualify that it's not a true "MC" session, just a way for us both to speak with a profession in the room.

We both agreed that there were communication challenges when we talk - she took my focus on sobriety and work as "I could tell you had moved on" when in fact that's the farthest thing from the truth. I had returned to my hometown after being gone for two months and wasn't sure how well I was going to integrate back into my community as a sober person and without her.

My point was simply that my sobriety had to be goal #1. Low and behold it hasn't been an issue at all, nor do I expect it to be. I'm almost 40 and can make my own decisions. I realized after about 4 days that it wasn't going to be a problem.

Again, I appreciate your take on all of this. I'm looking at it in the DB manner of - there's still a reason she hasn't filed. She doesn't need my permission or blessing or closure to do so. She sure as hell didn't need any of the above to leave! But something is still holding her back and I can use this time wisely.

She told me early that she needed to see how I shake out with sobriety before she makes any final decisions. My W works at drug rehabs and believes that the odds are against me. I've changed my life but she is still very hesitant to bring me back into her life at all right now. I understand that after 5 years of seeing the same patterns and hearing that "I'm fine, it's just a tough week."


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Clearer now.

My W is mourning the loss of our M and feeling grief & suffering. I'm sure others (like your cousin) will read that as she is having second thoughts and wants M back. Unfortunately, it isn't what she means at all. It is what it is.

Your cousin was well-meaning, but don't act on anything any third party tells you, unless it is "your W told me that she wants to reconcile but is struggling with whether you'll take her back" ... or "how to bring it up given the pain she has called" ... or something else very explicitly a message from W via a middle man/woman. If she wants to work on the R, she will let you know. Until she does, don't try to work on the R. I'd even back off on the including her in your personal program to deal with your recovery. She is willing to, but you are just reminding her that she wants to move on and reminding her that you did things that didn't make her happy.

You want things to settle, no reminders of bad things. No reaching out to show her you are working on those things she flagged. Work on them, but for yourself. You don't want her thinking you are doing this to get her back, as she doesn't want back and she will feel pursued.

I'd ask the DB coach again about the moving to making amends when the W clearly has told you she doesn't want to work on the M, but that you should focus on working on you. I don't know enough about what your interactions have been lately (or exactly what DB coach said), but based on what you've said, you can't be the one to suggest working on the M. The WAW is going to make it about your problem driving her away, but from what you've said she said, it is that she is going off to work on the problem that is preventing her from wanting to work on the M.

So, she has said, you need to stop working on step 2 (the M) and work on step 1 (you). You aren't the one to decide, hey I'm done with step 1 & ready for step 2, as it really isn't about you working on step 1. It is about her working on her step 1 and deciding she is ready to work on step 2. See?

Besides, W is not going to take your word for it that you have dealt with step 1. She will need to see that you are different. And that will include (prob. more than the pot/drinking/emotional availability issue) that you have stopped pursuing saving the M. And even then, if she isn't ready, she isn't ready. It [censored] to have her calling the shots on this, but you aren't powerless. You are making moves to stop pursuit, GAL, 180s, etc. and that will give her the time, space, and changes in your R dynamics that give you the best shot.

So, slow down the MC step until you confirm with your DB coach that this is what he/she meant and report back how your W has responded.

Good luck.


Me: 50 W:43
S6, S3
M: 12 yrs. T: 17
M is bad & Not happy Bomb Mar '14
S 5 Feb '15
D Bomb 13 Apr '15 (but "no hurry")
DB Coach May '15
Wants proceed on D Aug '15
Starting 1-on-1 negotiations Sept '15
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Thanks Asitis. I very much appreciate your insight.

People on this board say that one thing won't make or break whether there's a chance at reconciliation but I have a feeling that I stepped in some [censored] in the past two weeks by calling my W and emailing her in the same 48 hour period - both of which were about creating a face to face meeting. At one point during my call I got a bit emotional which might have also been a turn off as well.

I thought I was getting information right from the horse's mouth when her cousin said, "She wants you to call her if you want to work on the M." She might have just been telling him that there was no way she was going to be the one to make the call, not that she was interested in working on things herself. Who knows. The reply I got was certainly not one that made me think that she was anything but happy where she was in her life without me.

Time to re-read DR and keep working on detaching.


M 39 W 36
T5 M3
BD - 1/15 Separated - Same Day
Served 9/15
D finalized 6/17
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