Serve the servants: Wayward Wife & LRT (7)

[MrBond]

Your W filed for D this week. Don't ask her out. You'd just be rewarding bad behavior.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

Your W filed for D this week. Don't ask her out. You'd just be rewarding bad behavior.

His wife is not a dog that poop'ed on the rug. She's not his pet that he is trying train. This isn't obedience school and it's not like she's going to file for divorce AGAIN (as in, "hmmm, if I file for divorce all the sudden Defacto is being nice to me...I should file for divorce more often).

She's a weak lost soul that Defacto can either try to save or not. IF she's savable and not completely unredeemable, then going out there and pulling her through.... then out of the fog will just speed things along versus waiting outside the fog for her to stumble upon him. If she's NOT savable or redeemable, then he'll have his answer sooner or later about whether this marriage is actually savable versus waiting on the sidelines indefinitely.

A confident attractive man goes for what HE wants without reacting to what she does. Ignore the divorce for now. If she brings it up, repeat that you don't want it, don't want to talk about it and maybe ask her to put it on hold or dismiss it (especially if she complains about your tough answer to her complaint).


Last week I suggested a temporary pull back on Friday and telling her to give you space because you were devastated by her filing as part of a strategy whereby sunday, when I thought you two were spending time together you could then pursue her. You not BEING devastated only make the strategy an easier sell. Remember, the second part of distancing is pursuing. This is supposed to be a dance and Defacto isn't dancing at all...just distancing.

In the alternative, go party with you wife and her girlfriend. Have a good time. Don't be serious. You want the girlfriend to tell your wife the next day that she's nuts to let you go. Invite yourself (as if) if you have to because your wife probably won't presuming you wouldn't want to. She could say no and then you just say, "well, I'll be at this place for a while if you and girlfriend want to come on by". They'll probably come by because your wife is still having second thoughts AND because she's dying to know what the heck has got into you and whether their might be another woman involved. She'll be compelled to track you down so don't ask desperately, just ask her as though she's a friend.

You can't recover if you don't spend time together. I'm not saying you have to recover. You can and will be happy either way. You will make it. But if you still feel like trying, don't let the opportunity pass you by.

[MrBond]

GB, I never referred to her in the context of an animal with baser instincts. Believe it or not, your opinion weighs the same amount as mine.

His W literally just had him served and expects them to be buddy buddy? Sorry it doesn't work that way.

Defacto, it's ultimately up to you. But it sounds like you're good with spending it alone with your kids. That's the best way to go. You don't need to depend on your W to have a good time and a bit of independence on Independence Day goes a long way.

Just have an incredible time with your kids.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

GB, I never referred to her in the context of an animal with baser instincts. Believe it or not, your opinion weighs the same amount as mine.

His W literally just had him served and expects them to be buddy buddy? Sorry it doesn't work that way.

Defacto, it's ultimately up to you. But it sounds like you're good with spending it alone with your kids. That's the best way to go. You don't need to depend on your W to have a good time and a bit of independence on Independence Day goes a long way.

Just have an incredible time with your kids.

I just don't understand you. "It doesn't work that way"? What are you talking about? Where is that written and what rule book are you looking at? Where did his wife say she wanted to be all "buddy buddy" with him? Was it while they were having sex a month ago??? This is just so contradictory to what MWD would recommend. She's still Defacto's wife today. She's NOT his buddy. They are married. And she's texting, calling him, face timing him and just pursuing him. In generally I think he should behave "as if" and like her strong secure husband until he's not her husband anymore (or until he's completely done). There is no punishment/reward system like you suggest in successful marriages or successful marital recovery programs that I know of. It's just seems so juvenile to be sorta like, "I'm not talking to you, you filed for divorce (reluctantly) and now you need to be punished"

In my opinion, I think that Defacto is in Step 3 sub paragraph 2 of the Last Resort Technique.

Here's what MWD says he should do (her opinion matters more than both Mr. Bond or myself):

2) Your mate becomes curious.

S/he might start showing more interest in you, your whereabouts, and what you are up to in your life. Your spouse might even suggest you spend some time together to talk or do something enjoyable. It's also possible that your spouse might start asking you a lot of questions about your sudden changes. If any of these things begin to happen, here's my advice:

Be loving in return, but not overly excited or enthusiastic.
Accept some invitations to spend time together, but not all.
Do not ask any questions about your future together.
Be vague when asked questions about the changes in you. Say that you are just thinking things through.
Continue to be upbeat.
Do not say, "I love you"
Resist getting into conversations about your marriage.
Beat your spouse to the punch when it comes time to leave or separate from each other at the end of an activity. You set the tone for going your separate ways.

The general rule of thumb here is to be responsive to your partners new interest, but not too responsive. If you go overboard, your partner will get cold feet. I've seen it happen many times before. If you are excited that the last-resort technique is working, share it with a friend, write it in your journal, go for a run around the block, but don't wear your emotions on your sleeve.

You need to stay interested, but cool, until you are absolutely convinced that your spouse's renewed interest in saving your marriage has taken hold. Once you feel absolutely sure that this is so, you can test the waters by becoming more obvious about your desire to stay together. You can try discussing your future together and see what happens. If your spouse is receptive, you can continue to move forward slowly and begin to tackle the issues that drove you apart in the first place. If, on the other hand, you're met with reluctance, backpedal just as quickly as you can. Resume your interested but distant stance until things move in a more positive direction. This might take a whole lot longer that you would like, weeks, even months. However, you must be patient. As long as your spouse seems to be somewhat interested rather than pulling away, it's okay for your marriage to be in a holding pattern. It will try your patience, but what else do you have to do right now that could be as important as trying to save your marriage? Be patient

Stop Your Divorce with the Last Resort Technique

[MrBond]

"She's NOT his buddy. They are married. And she's texting, calling him, face timing him and just pursuing him."

To be buddies or "friends". Just because she calls him (and in such a short time). Doesn't mean that she wants to get back together. Proof is that she filed. Someone whose "interested" wouldn't do that.

[T384]

How would you say she has a renewed interest if she just served him with papers?

I'm just curious...

Defacto - I know the variable recommendations are hard to deal with so I don't envy you at all in that sense but I think you can decide what you want to do.

If it were me, and I'm obviously not an expert, I would continue to be dark but warm and friendly when you do interact. Be the attractive confident guy she fell in love witH because you are.

[Defacto]

You need to stay interested, but cool, until you are absolutely convinced that your spouse's renewed interest in saving your marriage has taken hold. Once you feel absolutely sure that this is so, you can test the waters by becoming more obvious about your desire to stay together. You can try discussing your future together and see what happens. If your spouse is receptive, you can continue to move forward slowly and begin to tackle the issues that drove you apart in the first place. If, on the other hand, you're met with reluctance, backpedal just as quickly as you can. Resume your interested but distant stance until things move in a more positive direction. This might take a whole lot longer that you would like, weeks, even months. However, you must be patient. As long as your spouse seems to be somewhat interested rather than pulling away, it's okay for your marriage to be in a holding pattern. It will try your patience, but what else do you have to do right now that could be as important as trying to save your marriage? Be patient

Stop Your Divorce with the Last Resort Technique

GB,
I am a huge proponent of a nuanced approach to pursuit and distance. It certainly makes sense and is inline with MWD's writings above. However, my big concern is MWD's line about being "absolutely convinced that your spouse's renewed interest in saving your marriage has taken hold." Outside of a few guilt-driven TM's, I have no evidence STBX wants to save MR. The only hard evidence I have on anything is that she wants to end MR, albeit possibly reluctantly. (She filed for D on 06/03 and served me on 06/19). It seems like she is a bit distracted right now by her friend being in town.

But, I know this is no exact science. My goal is try to save my MR, my family, and myself.

[CaliGuy]

Def

I know there are different thoughts/takes on DBing ... in your case I do feel holding true to "believe nothing of what they say 50% of what they do" gives you guidance on the direction you should take .. your W is more than likely dealing with some guilt but she served you ... not that its over by any means but I think your DB approach must reflect this ACTION she has carried out and not by the guilt ridden WORDS she has spoken.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

You need to stay interested, but cool, until you are absolutely convinced that your spouse's renewed interest in saving your marriage has taken hold. Once you feel absolutely sure that this is so, you can test the waters by becoming more obvious about your desire to stay together. You can try discussing your future together and see what happens. If your spouse is receptive, you can continue to move forward slowly and begin to tackle the issues that drove you apart in the first place. If, on the other hand, you're met with reluctance, backpedal just as quickly as you can. Resume your interested but distant stance until things move in a more positive direction. This might take a whole lot longer that you would like, weeks, even months. However, you must be patient. As long as your spouse seems to be somewhat interested rather than pulling away, it's okay for your marriage to be in a holding pattern. It will try your patience, but what else do you have to do right now that could be as important as trying to save your marriage? Be patient

Stop Your Divorce with the Last Resort Technique

GB,
I am a huge proponent of a nuanced approach to pursuit and distance. It certainly makes sense and is inline with MWD's writings above. However, my big concern is MWD's line about being "absolutely convinced that your spouse's renewed interest in saving your marriage has taken hold." Outside of a few guilt-driven TM's, I have no evidence STBX wants to save MR. The only hard evidence I have on anything is that she wants to end MR, albeit possibly reluctantly. (She filed for D on 06/03 and served me on 06/19). It seems like she is a bit distracted right now by her friend being in town.

But, I know this is no exact science. My goal is try to save my MR, my family, and myself.

Well, your wife isn't exactly the first part of the last resort technique either as she never really fit the description of "your spouse has said to you in no uncertain terms that s/he wants to get a divorce and it appears as if s/he really means it". She's been wishy washy on the whole thing, waited until he last minute to tell you, was apologetic and blame her attorney for setting the deadline as if she had no choice. This isn't the standard "I hate you and could absolutely never see myself with you ever again because OM is my soulmate and twice the man you'll ever be" situation.

That's why we have to discuss these things on the forum as Michelle isn't here to give her recommendations so we can only try to guess what that recommendation would be:

I think we can all agree that your wife does, at least, satisfy the requirements of the first stanza of LRT, Step 3, sub paragraph 2 to wit:

S/he might start showing more interest in you, your whereabouts, and what you are up to in your life. Your spouse might even suggest you spend some time together to talk or do something enjoyable. It's also possible that your spouse might start asking you a lot of questions about your sudden changes. If any of these things begin to happen, here's my advice:

Be loving in return, but not overly excited or enthusiastic.
Accept some invitations to spend time together, but not all.
Do not ask any questions about your future together.
Be vague when asked questions about the changes in you. Say that you are just thinking things through.
Continue to be upbeat.
Do not say, "I love you"
Resist getting into conversations about your marriage.
Beat your spouse to the punch when it comes time to leave or separate from each other at the end of an activity. You set the tone for going your separate ways.

I'd say you haven't been very "loving in return" recently nor are you accepting some invitations to spend time together.

I think you should also check out the Michelle's article "The Medium is in the Message" and maybe apply that by sending your wife a message to download another app that might let you two communicate better or have some fun goofy communications, like snapchat or KiK. Then you have an excuse to be a iittle goofy while getting acclimated to the new app. The beautiful thing about a something like snapchat is your short little fun video goes poof after she watches it twice. It's giving her a "dose" of fun you...that she doesn't get to save. It's an excuse to communicate with her without any other agenda other than perhaps the app will be a nice thing to send quick video's of your kid back and forth without filling up your phone storage with huge video files.

On the other hand, I think always utilizing the dead pan hug is a mistake EXCEPT as it relates to exiting an interaction with your wife. When you first see her she should get all sorts of warmth from you but like the plan above, when you end an activity you set the tone for going your separate ways by pulling out the distancing stuff.

How do you feel about Michelle's list above?

[Georgia Bulldogs]

I do my best to regularly contribute bits and pieces of marriage advice with my Divorce Busting social media communities. It's always interesting for me to read people's examples of how they adopt the Divorce Busting approach- you guys really are a creative bunch! Recently, however, there was a bit of confusion with one of the posts on the Divorce Busting Facebook Page. I write this post in order to clarify my thoughts. But in the end, if your marriage is truly teetering on the brink of divorce and you have been trying everything you can think of, sometimes no message is the most powerful message of all! But before you draw that conclusion, read this post!
The Medium is in the Message
When you are trying to get through to your partner, there are many ways to do it. You can have a face-to-face discussion, write a heartfelt letter, e-mail or text message, talk about things over the phone, or send a greeting card. Many couples (including Jim and me) admit to having some of their most productive conversations over the phone. I often encourage couples to call each other, even if they're in the same house! The point is, just because you might not be able to get through to your partner during a face-to-face conversation, doesn't mean you should give up. Simply try a different medium.

I know a woman who had been begging her husband for months to be more forthcoming about his out-of-town trips or his late nights at work so that she could make her own plans. Despite what seemed like several thousand reminders, he never did what she asked. This enraged her and they fought constantly. One day, instead of doing the same old thing, she left a calendar and a Magic Marker on the kitchen counter along with a note suggesting that her husband mark his schedule for the following week. When she came downstairs, she discovered her calendar marked with his plans for the next three months.

Another woman I know unintentionally hurt her husband's feelings. She tried apologizing, but he wasn't quite ready to accept. She gave him a day or two to pout, and still, he was holding his grudge. Again, she tried talking to him about the situation, but wasn't receptive. Then she became creative. Right before his morning shower, she got out her lipstick and wrote, "I love you and I am very sorry" on the shower wall. Then, after putting the lipstick on her lips she kissed the wall, leaving "smacks" all over the shower. And then she waited quietly for him to begin his morning routine.

Her husband shaved and stepped into their shower. He turned on the water and simultaneously started to laugh. Though words failed to break the ice, lipstick worked well.

Here's another example...Stu was very concerned about Resa's drinking. For years, he talked of his concerns about her health and about the example she was setting for their two children. Stu's mother was an alcoholic and he was extremely worried that Resa was going down the same path. Every time he discussed his fears with her, they ended up arguing and her behavior never changed. Out of desperation, he decided to write her a heartfelt letter, telling her how much he loved her and how scared he was about losing her. He left the letter on her dresser right before he went on a business trip.

When he returned, he feared that she would be extremely angry at him, but much to his surprise, she greeted him with tears in her eyes and, for the first time in their marriage, admitted that she had a drinking problem. She also said that she was willing to talk to an addictions counselor to help her quit drinking. Resa told Stu that the letter gave her a chance to think about what he was saying without feeling that she needed to defend herself or react in any way. Although the feelings Stu expressed in the letter were very similar to discussion they had had in the past, she felt profoundly affected by seeing his words in black and white.

Changing the medium of your message is one small, although important, example of the broader strategy of doing something different. Adopt this into your routine, and watch the difference it can make in your marriage. You might be surprised...

Michele Weiner Davis