I get a text from W - this event is for tomorrow? I thought it was for Memorial Day (scouting thing for s9 and d6). I will have s9 ready. Guess this scraps the plans I had.
Do I need to respond to this? Should I respond with - Sorry about that." How about "Thank you for having S9 ready to go". or "I am sorry there was miscommunication and I appreciate you have s9 ready to go. Are you and D6 still planning on joining us at the event?"
Earlier, she had accepted my offer to join us and she was going to bring D6 as well. Now I am confused if she is not going to the event or not. And I can tell she is pissed off at me that I "spoiled" her plans (mindreading I know).
Does she want me to ask what the plans were? I am thinking no, she did not invite me and I guess it is none of my business. Why would she say "Guess this scraps the plans I had" if she didn't want me to ask what they were. Is this Bait?
I think I'd just say "sorry there was a miscommunication. Thank you for having s9 ready to go." It sounds like she's still going to attend so I wouldn't ask about it.
I would just acknowledge as its about your S "No problem - thanks"
Heavy,
Both Toots and Matt have good suggestions! I'd go with either. Personally, I think the shorter the better.
Chin up my friend!
Bob
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
It was my Moms birthday the other day. When I talked to her, she reported that she got he birthday card from my s9. It was mailed from my WW apartment.
Is it wrong for me to be upset with this?
I take the responsibility of sending my Mom a birthday card from me and from the kids. I think this is a boundry issue for her to send my family members cards "from the kids". I have not thought of sending my MIL a birthday cards from the kids from me. I view that as my W's responsibility.
I really don't want my WW to send my family members drawings, cards, or anything from our kids, I now do that for my family as we are separated. My W can send her own Mom (and her family members) cards on special occassions like birthday's from the kids.
What is the advice from the Board? Am I being petty? Should I just ignore it? I get the feeling the Board will say I am being petty and mean spirited but this really bothered me.
I think saying something would not get me any closer to my goal and makes me look like the smaller person. I guess it's just another chit sandwich I have to choke down.
My W lied, cheated, stole money from our family for her A and now sends birthday cards to my Mother? She never has sent my mother a birthday card. Now all of a sudden she does? I don't get it.
My suggested text would be:
W
Thank you for the thoughtful birthday card to my Mom from the S9. In the future, please let's agree to send any birthday or holiday cards from the kids to our individual family members.
Now I get an email from W who says "I can't go tomorrow but I will have the kids ready for you to pick up".
I must learn to detach more ... I swear, why is this process so hard for me to grasp? I have a great idea why she can't make it but that would be mindreading and pointless right class?
Looking at the situation positively, at least I get to see my kids on a day that is technically hers.
I will reply light and breezy to her text with a "Thanks". I won't inquire about anything else because it's none of my business.
I welcome the day I am through this and on the other side. That day can't come soon enough!!
I'm right there with you.
Of course it's easy to veer off and call it quits and shortcut to the other side. But we wouldn't be here if that were really what we want. It's the love that we have for our S's and our desire for our M that makes it so damn hard each and every day.
But I can see it in you. And in me. We are all growing and evolving into better people than we were when we got here. And it's that change that motivates me to keep going and let's me know I'm on the right path.
Took the kids to the Memorial Day Flag placement for their scouting badges. There were thousands of people there. It was a good experience for them and good for me to get out of the house and to share the experience and meaning of Memorial Day with them. It was emotional as we put the flags on the graves. There were so many graves.
Afterwards, I dropped them back off at W apartment.
I was polite and cordial and texted her two photos of the kids decorating the graves with flags. She replied "What a great experience this is for them".
At pick up and drop off it was OK seeing her. No makeup on, I said "Hi and thanks for letting me take the kids to this on your day, I really appreciate it."
We talked a little about her stove issues, apparently she killed it when she tried to self clean it. I laughed and said "yes, kiss of death" when you self clean an oven right? She said she has been without a stove for two weeks so today was the repair day and she was waiting for him. She laughed a little and then we talked about S9 hearing aides. I made a joke about getting a bullhorn next time and she laughed and said "Yeah, I told him I was going to superglue them to his ears."
I am taking Wonka's advice and putting some humor into our interactions and will monitor the results. It seemed to work pretty well today.
Been doing the no contact no pursuit dance now for months. She has responded the same - no contact and does not respond to my non pursuit.
I guess the holidays are the hardest for me - so many triggers - so much lost.
Even after all of the crap we have been through - I miss her so much. I focus on working around the house , focus on making new friends and improving the friendships that I do have. It feels like a phantom limb is there - it's not of course but my mind feels the pain. Does that make sense?
I try to keep focused on today or maybe tomorrow.because that is all I can really handle without freaking out. One foot in front of the other.
I try not to let my mind wander to what she is doing as I know that is not healthy for me. Still.... I wonder. Does anyone else feel this?
I had dinner with a friend last night and I realized how much better I have it and I am grateful on many levels. I struggle to move forward and to rebuild my life. I wonder how much is possible?
Moving forward is the only way through this. I used to be so happy and now it seems that my life is one big problem. How did that happen? And so fast too.
Carry on dear friends and thank you for all of your collective wisdom and for listening.
Heavy - No matter what, as soon as she dropped the bomb on you, your life was going to need to be rebuilt. As far as I can tell, there are only two ways to do it:
1) to run away and start over 2) to fight for yourself. To learn and grow from the challenges and emerge as a stronger, more confident, more self-aware, and frankly BETTER person.
I'm so proud to be a part of a community of people choosing option 2. It's hard and it hurts, and I sure do wish that my feelings could move linearly forward, but all in all it's worth it
It seems we have a lot in common. I am so grateful to this board and for everyone who is trying to help everyone else. Such a privilege to participate.
It seems we have a lot in common. I am so grateful to this board and for everyone who is trying to help everyone else. Such a privilege to participate.
How goes your situation?!
Not a ton of activity at the moment. W is working with a lawyer for financial S with plans to file after that. I'm doing my LRT and she's not pursuing much...yet. But I'm being patient and hopeful. There's a lot of time left. I'm doing my best to use it wisely.
Today is s hard day - I don't have the kids this week and the house is so quiet that it is killing me. I am finding it so hard to stay motivated and actually get out of bed. Trying to make it to church today at 10:30 but it's a struggle.
I feel like a prisoner of war - trapped and confined - but then that's only in my head right? I have the power right? I have the smarts right? I puff myself all up and then a trigger and slowly the air seeps from my balloon.
I will force myself to take a shower and get this show on the road.
Talked to d6 and s9 on the phone and we chatted briefly. We talked about d6 hamster. Made small talk with W about her stove issue and talked about 5 minutes .
And the church sermon was on Hope an the importance of never losing hope. Without hope, there is no tomorrow, no sunny day, nothing to look forward too was the basic gist. There are many biblical references to hope and it just a defining sermon.
I thought it nailed my and all of us here on the board's situation. By the time the sermon was over, I was in tears of course. I didn't even care who saw me!
So, it reinforced me - when I needed it badly. There is ALWAYS HOPE.
Tonight I Face Timed my children. I texted W and said "good time to talk to kids" She replied "Sure".
We talked for about 30 minutes with lots of commentary and interjections from W. She wanted to see the hamster which I showed. Again, it's like we are talking to each other but not really. Does that make sense? She even asked me a few questions from outside the screen's vision but I heard her and replied.
Is that considered communication or am I reading more into it?
It was all positive stuff, some jokes, some family history a few inside jokes and just a fun lighthearted conversation.
Baby steps? I don't know. All I know is that it was light, polite, laughter mixed in and it lasted about 30 minutes.
She asked what I was doing tomorrow and I said I had plans with friends and D6 said she wanted to come along. W said it was OK with her if OK with me and I said of course. Any time I get to spend with my kids is a good thing.
What is the group think on this one? Is this really communication.
She then calls me on the phone to talk about logistics for D6 tomorrow. Again cordial, polite and she asked if it was trouble to take D6 tomorrow. I said "No, no problem".
She then said she would drop her off at "my house" instead of our house. So that was telling. Hers is the rented apartment and this house is the marital home. Sad.
She drops D6 off at my house, polite cordial and spoke for a few minutes. I will keep d6 for the day.
I am seeing more of W. I will continue to have PMA and steer clear of any R talks. No movement on D on any fronts. Today marks 9 monnts of separation. I hae grown a lot, gotten a lot more confident and independent. I still miss W and out intact family. The monster seems to have gone back into the cave as well as the spews.
D6 and I are off to the Greek Festival for the day. We will meet up with some friends and make the day of it. D6 may or may not spend the night with me.
D6 talks that W and her BFF AP are still at it. (Sigh)
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
It's time to change things up a bit. At each interaction, you would want to have at least something new on you...scarf, shirt, skirt, shoes, earings, etc. At least one NEW item.
Then be the first to end things and say you need to be at some place. High time to pull out the mysterious card and LIVE your life.
Ignore all the Negative Nellies telling you to move on because they don't know what they're talking about and just want to see your pain end. They know zip about MLC or DBing.
Carry on....things are definitely thawing out between the pair of you and IT'S GOOD!
I will try this out . One new item for each interaction. When we exchange d6 - I will have new on - not sure what but something different. Maybe a new perfume.
I don't know - she is still entrenched in AP. That is not good as far as it makes me feel . I will rise above but 9 months!!! That's a long time. I know many on this board go longer than 9 months but come on.
At least the divorce talk has diminished. She has not brought it up and neither have I . My L says no news is good news.
I wouldn't go the perfume route. That is your ace up in your sleeve to be used at another time. Focus on changing up some clothing items, new lipstick, and others in that area.
I wouldn't go the perfume route. That is your ace up in your sleeve to be used at another time. Focus on changing up some clothing items, new lipstick, and others in that area.
Heavy,
You know Wonka is excellent at this. I hope you heed her advice!
*Hugs*
Bob
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
Awesome! Good luck! I'm with Rip on the confidence front too.
Me:35 W:30 D:4 S:1 Bomb: 01/08/15, discovered EA & PA In House Separation: 01/14/15 W moves out: 04/05/15 I tell OM's W about A: 04/15/15 W serves D papers: 06/19/15 Mediation: 09/16/15 D final: 12/01/15
Greek festival was a no go at the last minute, we went to a friend's house instead.
I get a text from W - How is D6? I said "She's fine" and sent a photo of her playing with her friend. D6 jumped on trampoline, played dress up, had a grand time. She definately thrives at play dates. I need to line more of those up. I had a good time with Mom too.
D6 now says she wants to sleep over at my place - so won't be able to show off new jacket or nails tonight it does not appear.
My D6 spent the night with me last night, and my W agreed, even though it was her week.
I called W this morning to ensure who was makng breakfast for D6 and she had her bookbag for school etc... We talkd about the D6 not doing well emotionally and she is acting out and I said maybe we should get therapy for he. She agreed we might look into it. We hung up.
A few minutes later she calls again and says she feels hurt that "I call all the shots". I listened very careully and validated her and said "OK I hear you, that must feel bad". I said "I don't want to call all the shots, what would you like to do?"
We talked for a while, I again listenened very carefully and my wife complained that "I shut her out" and "am rude to her" and "She is very hurt by my actions and each time she reaches out I shut her out. Whenever I am "nice" to her it's with an ulterior motive, I want something."
Again, I just listened and said validating statements. I could tell she was crying. I said "This past 8 months has been very hard for me and for the kids and we are trying to make the best of the situation." She said "Yes, she is trying to do the same thing." She said "I guess that all of this is happening because of the sweeping decisions I made". I again just listened and didn't argue and again made validating statements all throughout the conversation.
She is upset that I blocked her from FB and that my mother unfriended her. I told her it was too painful to see her new life play out on social media. She didn't say anything to that.
She has not apologized for her behaviors or affair but it feels like a thaw? Does the board feel this way or again is this my assumption or mind reading?
What is the next suggested outcome. Should I contact her further to follow up this conversation? Should I let it lie and carry on? Should I call her and ask to talk more? Do I wait to see if she contacts me?
I don't know what to do next exactly, but my instinct would be to let her come back again, when she's ready. Think of the picnic metaphor, when you reassure her that it's safe to come out of the castle and snoop around you, without getting roped into R conversations. Also, I don't find it to be very good news that she's upset about Facebook because her concerns are all about her again, with no empathy for why you or your mom would do this. Eventually, she'll have to realize and regret the hurt she's been doing to you and others, not just the pain she inflicted on herself. Also, remember that WAS want us to be nice to them because they want to feel better about their decision, not because they want to come back. Be cordial and all, available for the kids, but don't set yourself to "nice" her back into the M.
M39 D6 D3 (at S) S 2014-09 D 2016-09
"You can't start a fire sitting around, crying over a broken heart" - Bruce Springsteen.
I am glad to see that you and W are talking a bit more on the emotional aspect. Yes, things are slowly thawing out between you two.
No, I would not try to reach out and prolong this. Let this process occur organically...not forced or hurried along. It is a BIG positive that she opened up and acknowledged that she's made some not so great choices.
Now it's back to your own DB path...cordial, polite, and respectful. Keep going, you're on the right track and this is working!!
Only been at this a short time, as you know. But in this short time, there was a "thaw" of sorts last Monday and Tuesday. She spooned me in bed Monday night in tears and said she was a mess, and on Tuesday she crawled into my lap and asked about stopping her "addiction" to the texts and the affair. I came to find out (through emails that are accessible to me in our business, I didn't go out of my way to snoop, but it was too easy to read) that there had been some kind of doubt or uncertainty between her and the OW on Monday night, and whatever it was, it got resolved on Wednesday. Which is when the thaw turned back to coldness and determination on her part to keep going down the wayward path.
I suspect, and this might be true for your W too, that whenever they sense a lack of security with the OW, they come back looking for that security with us. It could be no more than a momentary thing until they work out whatever else is going on with the OW. Or it could be a real thaw... especially in your case, as she's had enough time with the OW to perhaps emerge from the fantasy world that is so all-consuming in the beginning.
I agree, though... keep doing what you're doing. Something seems to be working.
Me: 46 Her: 41 M: 5.5 yrs / S: 20, 18 3/26 W and I meet OW BD: 5/2/2015, she takes off ring W goes to stay with OW 6/26 NC: 9/5 Both moved out: 10/16 I take off my ring and feel... healed: 10/19
Yesterday W send a text how is D6 doing? I replied "we got our nails done, and are having fun and included a photo of D6, her play date, and my friend play date's Mother. It was a sweet photo of them playing dress up and they all had great smiles on their faces. My W replies "Great!" My new friend is married, and we are strictly platonic but is a knock out. My W knows about her and this is most likely the first time she has seen a photo of her and with my daughter. Could this have been the catalyst for the emotional outburst? I don't know.
So, I made sure I did not talk about any R issues, or talk about therapy or any of the pressure kind of stuff. I did not guilt trip her by using D6's problems with our separation. She actually said, It's like I don't get a say in this process at all. (I reisted saying like I had any say in your unilateral decision to drop a bomb on us but I refrained). I just kept saying "I hear you, and understand what you are saying and that must feel bad. I didn't intend for you to take it that way." I told her I wasn't the greatest listener and have been working on that.
She said our problems were all about communication issues and I replied "I hear you and yes, that must have felt bad for you to not be heard." I bit my tongue not to say "and having an affair made our comunication issues better?"
"I told her that I have told the kids I want Momma to be happy" and this is what she wants so we will be happy for her. I told her I want her to be happy and that happiness comes within and how I recently learned that concept. There was no response to that.
There were lots of long pauses, she acknowledged how hard this has been, "It's been no cake walk" and I said "Yes, it's been very hard for me too". After the long pauses, I just let them be. I didn't try to offer any suggestions, counseling, R talks, no pressure or anything. I just let the silence be.
You are right, she does't seem to get it that she can stop this at any time.
She did say that I was "rude by not saying hello, etc..." and I again validated to her that must have hurt her. I swear I have increased 10 times the politeness and cordial aspects of any communication we have. She still says I am rude to her so there is nothing more I can say to that that is her perception.
I so wanted to say, this 9 months has been horrible for all of us, let's put it behind us, get counseling, move forward, come back home, etc.... but I didn't. i just said this is a regrettable situation we are all in.
I don't know, for her to even call was a good thing, to hear her cry was a good thing (and I don't mean that in a bad way), but her talking about how this is hurting the kids, and her discomfort, and realization that she caused all of this by he choices is at least an acknowledgement in some measure of the pain she has caused and continues to cause.
But Wonka you are right, it's all about how this is affecting her, I am rude and it hurts her, I have blocked her from Facebook and that hurts her, When she reaches out (Mother's Day invitation to lunch. She was mad that I did not eat lunch but only drank a soda. I had an upset stomach so I didn't eat a pizza. That made her upset at me,) and that hurt her. My mother unfriending her on face book really upset her. She HATES my mother and recently made my son send her a birthday card. She has never sent my mother a birthday card. It's like she wants to carry on with her nice gestures and ignore all of the ruins she has left behind. She thinks she can send a birthday card to my Mom and expect her to be all happy and joyful.
It's all about her being Hurt by ME. Never any "I have put all of this in motion", "I am sorry for causing this devastation, etc...) It continues to be all my fault.
So yes, I won't follow up with any phone calls or messages. I will just wait and see what happens.
Keep in mind some people (myself included) have little to no interactions with their spouses. I haven't seen or talked on the phone with mine in four months.
Perspective dear.
Keep up the good work.
M:32,H 32 T:10, M5 BD/H Move Out: 9/2014 - extreme anger H Mental Illness Diagnosis: 4/15 Served D Papers: 10/15 Divorced: 11/15
My W refuses to see why I am so upset by all of this. She has taken a lover, moved out of the house, disrupted our family immeasurably, caused financial ruin to herself (almost) and yet is mad at me for showing dissapointment, indiference, upset or anger.
I have inreased my politeness and cordial interactions 100% yet she still see's me being disrespectful of her. I am at a loss over he perception.
I guess the answer is just do it anyway and let her reach her own conclusions as to why I am so upset with the situation.
When I do talk to her, her eyes are dead or unless she is mad at me then they are filled with fire. I pretend not to notice and carry on. This is all such a waste.
Wonka - Do you really think any progress is being made towards reconcilliation or are you just saying that to keep me strung along, always hoping and being a dope. Sometimes, I feel that way. I guess that is the cynic in me talking.
I realized today that after phone interaction with he, I "expect" something to happen. Like today we had those long pauses. Did I expect her to say something, I guess I did. Big mistake. She never said a word. I think the silence means everything.
How I wish I could just stop obsessing over every litle thing. That proves that detachment is far from occuring on my part. This will be a long long process for me it appears.
My IC said today that i am still being manipulated by her on an emotional level and I guess she is right. Until I can master the art of detachment, I will always be her whipping girl.
I know there are no "when will this be truly over answers" as everyone is on their own journey but boy is it a long journey filled with twists every step of the way.
I am trying so hard to learn lessons from this experience, one to heal, and two to help others go through this grueling process. That would be really great if i could assist others in some fashion.
Onwards friends and as always - thanks for listening
I think thats what pulled at my strings the most, those times when there was no life in her eyes, that look she used to give me .. gone, like her shell was there but her soul died. They are completely detached it seems and just feels so fast and sudden ... we are still coming to grips with BD, the life changes ... then have to face the emotional hurt that any love they seemed to have for us has been stuffed up in a vault and we have no key to unlock it.
All you really can do is DB, sidestep the spews, STFU and listen for clues ... they do leave them ... sometimes its all based on re-written fabrications, sometimes there are tidbits of truth in there.
Stay focused, learn from the clues she gives, keep positive...its all we can do.
I sense that you are being emotionally pulled into different directions by the latest development in your sitch and you seem to be looking for "what's the catch" scenario here.
Originally Posted By: HeavyD
Wonka - Do you really think any progress is being made towards reconcilliation or are you just saying that to keep me strung along, always hoping and being a dope. Sometimes, I feel that way. I guess that is the cynic in me talking.
I am wondering if you are assigning me in this role because you are so mistrustful of your W? I tell it as I see it...no smoke and mirrors chit. Things ARE indeed thawing between the two fo you. I never once said that you are on the path of reconciliation. To do so would be emotionally dishonest and I won't do that...ever.
One step at a time. There is a definite thaw. Embrace it, my friend.
Ideally, it would be WONDERFUL if you two are on the road to reconcilaition right now. I'd scream at the top of my lungs...to be sure!
Right now, it is critical that you have your head screwed on tight and keep this real. For your sake, for your family's sake.
OK - thanks for your honesty - both to Wonka and Caliguy.
It just seems that so much works goes into this, so much energy, so many prayers, no one really understands "Dump her" is all I get but it is so much more complicated than that.
I continue to inch along, and will keep my head screwed on straight and try to keep the door open, the lighthouse standing, the picnic and ant analogy, everything and more to get this going. I refused to let 19 years and two small kids slip through my fingers.
OK - thanks for your honesty - both to Wonka and Caliguy.
It just seems that so much works goes into this, so much energy, so many prayers, no one really understands "Dump her" is all I get but it is so much more complicated than that.
I continue to inch along, and will keep my head screwed on straight and try to keep the door open, the lighthouse standing, the picnic and ant analogy, everything and more to get this going. I refused to let 19 years and two small kids slip through my fingers.
Heavy ... thats the easy way .. 'Dump Her' I had a few people tell me that, but those people never understood everything that happened, all the intel I had.
Its seems so simple from the surface, long term M, WAS goes PA with OP ... LBS should drop em like a bad habit .. not that easy.
I agree .. there is a ton that goes into it, loads of prayers ... but THAT is where I found the secret. I prayed for W to wake up, Prayed for OM to fall down the stairs ... then I read something that stuck. God gives us everything, he also can take those things away, who are we to question this? I believe He has a plan .... I learned recently that I do not understand the reasons, nor can I see where its going to all end up .. but I do trust it is for the better, he has made me better out of all this, I would not be Cali 2.0 without this hard lesson, but the lessons worth the most cost the most.
Let go Heavy, have faith, when you do you will feel lighter .. you are going to be ok no matter what
What I'm learning heavy, and I have a ways to go is all the techniques,mooing dark, 180, pma, gal, etc only really have an effect on the ww AFTER they have an effect on you.
As weird as it sounds detaching, going dark and gal may bring her closer to you. It's taken me a while to wrap my head around it, but distance can bring them closer.
They will only fully feel the rope drop and its effect after you have truly let it go. Not to win them back, but because you deserve it for yourself.
I've been trying to drop the rope and would always keep one hand in it seemed. I'm sure my ww noticed because it had no effect. Now I'm truly moving on with my life with or without her. There's good days and bad, but even the bad are better than my worst while I was living with her.
I feel much better about myself and the man I want to be. You've come a long way heavy and have so much to be proud of. Keep in mind the progress you've made for you and where you want to go.
My ww may never come around, yours might not either. But as I see it, they only will after the affair is over and if we are someone worth coming towards. Screw trying to win them back. We deserve to have them fight for us. Might as well use the time to improve ourselves in the mean time.
Hang in there heavy!
M-33 W-33 S-11, S-8 M-11, T-14 BD - 12/26, Divorce Filing and admits to affair (her) 4/18 I moved out 5/23
The one problem I have with outsiders saying "dump her/him" is that if one actually follows through with that so-called advice has to live with the outcome. Those people do not have to live with that choice but YOU do.
Some advice, eh?!!?
Again, they don't know what they're talking about at all. Unless they've actually walked a mile in your shoes, then SHUT THE F@CK UP for real.
My answer to them would be this:
"I know you think you're trying to be helpful by saying "dump her" but it would be much more helpful to be supportive. If you cannot say anything nice, then don't say anything at all."
Just adding another vote of confidence for you. Whether or not the situation is improving, it's clear that you are - and that's all you can really control.
You are doing very well heavy. I'm pretty much in the same time frame, and understand the pain and thoughts. I too recently have been getting the "dump her" statement. It's all about them wanting us to feel better quicker. Just today I realized that yes it may be over, but it doesn't mean I give up. Until I feel like walking away, it's up to me. No one can take that from us. Keep up the good fight, and God bless.
Awww such nice comments and support guys, I really really appreciate it. It took me a little while to get the whole DB principles but I feel a whole lot better and am a much more aware person a a much better parent. I am thankful for that for sure.
I will gently remind folks with the "Dump Her" comments to kindly STFU - LOL
Heavy - not much to add, but I think you did great with the weekend's interactions. Keep being that great person that I know you are.
Friends with "great" advice: I recently told a friend, who has been supportive of me and my journey what my plans were and how my plans are being complicated by W. He told me to push her out the door and lock it behind her - throw her stuff out.
I told him - though I appreciate the fact that you want my pain to be over, I really do not need help being angry at my W - I've got that covered quite well. If you want to help me, lets talk about.....
He admitted that he had no idea what it is like, he has been married for about 3 years and has no children.
I know that we may have used them for sounding boards, and then maybe selfishly disregard their opinions, but sometimes some support is just wanted. Though I would never wish this on anyone, they just don't get it unless they experienced it.
Keep it up
Me-45 W-44 S21, S18, D15 T-27, M-21 BD Jan 2014 PA revealed March 2014 In-house separation - April 2015 I filed - Aug 2015 She moved out Oct 2015
W texted me 6 times today - all about kid related stuff. Her texts are pretty lengthy too. I have been polite but limited in my text replies with words like OK, thank you, glad to hear, LOL, please take a photo.
What was really weird was she used the phrase "progress in baby steps" when talking about D6 and her frustration with her brother. I thought DB had that phrase copyrighted (haha).
The last two texts, I have not replied to:
W - So far we have had 45 minutes of Spanish lessons
W - I officially hate the afterschool program
I just don't think these necessitate a reply. Besides, I am busy with GAL.
I actually did go look at a used motorcycle today - it was a beauty but don't think I can justify spending $3 grand on a toy for me at this present moment. I took it for a test drive around the block and I still have what it takes to drive a motorcycle!
Lol @ the TM... Time is rapidly approaching and you are about to move out so she has,is, and will spin
You did better with the motorcycle than I did, I test drove it AFTER I bought it... Lol That being said was the 2nd best thing I did with this duffle bag that was handed to me and filled with "the gift of time"
Caliguy - can you clarify time is rapidly approaching . ... Me moving on. .... Detachment time for me or are you referring to something else?
That bike was something else - a Honda that is just the right size for women. Only weighs 350 lbs - easy to handle . On the weeks I didn't have the kids I could fly to work!!!
Caliguy - can you clarify time is rapidly approaching . ... Me moving on. .... Detachment time for me or are you referring to something else?
That bike was something else - a Honda that is just the right size for women. Only weighs 350 lbs - easy to handle . On the weeks I didn't have the kids I could fly to work!!!
Caliguy - can you clarify time is rapidly approaching . ... Me moving on. .... Detachment time for me or are you referring to something else?
That bike was something else - a Honda that is just the right size for women. Only weighs 350 lbs - easy to handle . On the weeks I didn't have the kids I could fly to work!!!
By that I meant you are moving out soon, the gravity of life changing for ever may be rapidly weighing on her .... its amazing how the WAS has this fantasy all up in their heads of a happy life once they rid themselves of us horribly LBS's .... but once it actually starts happening they are quickly faces with a full plate of reality.
LOL @ the Honda ... yeah my 2 wheel therapy is a big beautiful heavy Harley ... its like that line about how money can buy happiness, because it can buy a jet ski and its impossible to not smile while riding a jet ski ... I feel the same about my Harley. Was something I always wanted but I was not 'allowed' this because the W controlled everything ... thankful that this happened and I have found 'me' and will never go back to 'that'.
Tomorrow is the Spring Concert at our kids school. If we sit together OK, if we don't that's OK too. I will make sure I say hello and wear something new and maybe new earrings. I will keep conversation light and breezy and concentrate on taking photos.
More texting back and forth about the show tomorrow - my responses are "Thank you for getting them", "I will check, I think so", and "D6 is getting to be a good reader." All are short and polite to any and all questions and answers about kids.
I pick up kids tomorrow - BBQ afterschool which I think we will attend, birthday party for D6 on Saturday, Spend the night guest for D6 on Saturday, Sunday church and lunch and bowling with a friend with a son. I hope my S9 likes him and they get along. I was hoping an older boy would be good for the S9, maybe a good role model?
I have to bake a cake for Boyscouts on Monday - that will be fun, it's for a merit badge so I will have S9 do as much of the work as possible - LOL.
I also want to get as much bike riding and trampoline jumping as possible thrown in for good measure during the week. That seems to bring a lot of joy to everyone when we do that.
Continuing to work the plan and rise above and act as if etc...etc...etc...
Went to kids Spring Concernt at school. Wife met me there. There were two options - 8:30 or 1:30. I chose the 8:30 and W said I wish you had chosen the 1:30 so I could have take (our family friend) instead. I didn't not say anything just said I can do the 8:30.
We sat by one another, I wore a new shirt, had a pedicure that showed through my shoes, my sure my makeup and hair looked good. We made small talk, talked about work stuff, talked about house projects I was doing, yard projects, how her apartment was going, made a few laughs, shared photos of the peformances and I left after my kids were finished as I had to get back to work. So I left first, I told her bye. We did not talk about anything of substance or R oriented.
I could tell she was angry with me about something by her clipped responses and short answers. I did not take the bait and ask what was wrong. I just talked to other people around us. She just seems annoyed with me and everything. Inoticed that last night when i Face Timed with the kids. She seemed annoyed at the kids and with me. I didn't ask anything about it. I told the kids on Face Time what I had lined up fun - birthday party, sleep over, trampoline, new friend, bowling, etc...
When the kids started singing "Blackbird" I started to cry softly and tears were running down my face. It was a favorite song that W and I talked about and sang many many times. My W noticed I was crying and put her hand on my back briefly. I regained my composure and clapped when the song was over. All of the kid performances were excellent.
To me, it is obvious that she is OVER me, she looks at me with such disdain and I try to look past that it but it still hurts, a lot.
I will continue to DB and have improved myself (I believe) in a lot of areas. I am more independent, more centered, more engaged, more engaging to others, just more ME and less reaction to her and our relationship. I hope that makes sense.
So,bittersweet moments for me. I am of course thrilled that I saw my kids and their performances. My W however is just stuck in a place of all things negative about me and my decisions.
W is not happy that I enrolled kids in scouting - she told me that both kids hate it. The kids tell me they love it. She is not happy that I enrolled them in soccer. She said S9 does not want to do it and it will take up too much time. she did say she would go to the games. Anytime I ask the kids if they want to do anything - they always answer with NO, but once they get into it - they love it.
She does not participate in any scouting activities or assistance with the classes. I asked her if she was interested in participating and she was lukewarm with her responses. I took that as a "No".
So, how to get on the same page regarding kids activities is a challenge. I am not sure if i should ask her before I enroll the kids in activities or just go ahead and do it. I guess we just have to work that out. She is free to enroll the kids in whatever activities she wants and I will do my best to ensure they can participate. She just looked at me coldly.
No win situation, but I am being positive. PMA the whole time I was around her.
Why is my W still so angry with me? The slow burn she has going on towards me seems like it would take a lot of energy.
Again, I try not to take any bait, and just look above it, beyond it, underneath it, beside it, just don't engage with her anger/irritability towards me.
I am sure the DB community would say ignore her and focus on ME and that the more I focus on me the more detached I become. This is what I am doing and I think I have made progress but I swear....
I keep thinking and I guess this old learned behavior that I am trying to unlearn is "how can I make her not angry, how can I fix the situation (s), how much of a pretzel do I have to turn myself into beofore she is nice to me again." I realize now how much I spend of my time doing those activities to keep the peace. I don't do those behaviors anymore, a big 180 for me.
Hi Heavy, who knows why she is so angry. That may be much more about her than about you - particularly if she is that way too with the kids sometimes.
Reading your posts now, I think you have come such a long way. Just a few months back, you were struggling to maintain good PMA about your sitch and now I think your approach is transformed. It's hard for most of us not to wonder sometimes about the whats and the whys, but it truly is a waste of valuable mental energy for us. And there are so many other lovely things in life to focus on.
Hope you have a lovely weekend HD xx
T 13 M 7 Me 48 H 46 SS 15 BD 7.14 PA D final 5.16 (H filed)
We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
As a former MLCer, I was angry a lot of the time. I was feeling pressured, antsy, angst, and not quite 100% comfortable in my own skin. We want that miserable chit gone. So we lash out at those closest to us: the spouse.
Why? Because the spouse is an easy target.
It is NOT you. Rinse, repeat.
You're on the right track with not raising to the bait or responding to her negativity.
Believe me, W definitely noticed your pedi. We DO pay attention to the LBS even if we act otherwise. Crazzeeee, right?! Yup.
Haha about the pedi. It's a dark color - again a 180. It's dark blue not red like usual.
Yes, her mouth is frozen in the hardness, it's hard to explain, but she is definately angry and irritated with everything, especially me. We used to joke about "angry bitchy face, but now it's no joke, it's like a permenant expression now.
She makes mean comments when talking to other folks about duct taping the kids mouths shut so she can get some peace and quiet. I think that is a terrible thing to say, but everyone else just laughs.
So, I made myself scarce, enjoyed the show and scram. I smiled and laughed and hugged friends I had not seen in a while and just enjoyed the experience (with the exception of the wart hog who I am married to). I should not even have brought up the subject of kids activities, its just another reason to argue.
Its not about you ... they are in crisis ... not you.
I recall during my W's angry phase (seems it was a year long I swear) Nothing ... and I mean nothing I could do she would be ticked off at me .. that bought about Scouts and soccer ... My W told me S's baseball was ridiculous, she refused to pay for it ... I refused to allow her MLC to punish our son so I paid for it all ... fees, gear, all of it. Was about S not me ... not her. Well ya know what ... as much as she hated it ... she was there for every game, I almost felt she should pay me admission to watch S as if she had her way he would not have been playing .... but a few sips on my STFU smoothie and I knew in my heart I was the rock, the lighthouse not only for her .. but more importantly for S.
To touch on that "She is completely over me" line. I recall that ... the eyes, like Great White Shark-JAWS eyes ... black cold and lifeless. uR helped me and made me realize ... she is going through so much that all the feelings she has for you .. they are stuffed away in a lock box, she can not allow herself to open this right now, she has all sorts of stuff she is trying to process ... so yeah .. right now YOU may feel that way ... but its them, their crisis that they are dealing with.
I had to talk to W about summer plans and some gaps in the coverage. We talked for a long time, maybe 30 minutes. Again, nothing of substance, just schedules, kids, shared a laugh, doctors, summer plans, kids getting taller, headsets, and a variety of other issues.
This is the first time I have talked to her in a long time, just talked about nothing really, but connected. I have missed thatmore than words can say. There were a lot of long pauses like I felt she wanted me to say something or that I felt she wanted to say something. Nothing was said, just several long pauses.
More than anything, it was good to just talk without anger or argue but just talk. I listened very carefully to her words too. I did a lot of validating about how hard it is to make schedules and how frustrating it is for me to make them.
She told me she lost her keys and how hard that was and we laughed about it and where they might be. We talked about old friends and what they are up to. Again, nothing in particular, but it just felt good to hear "her" again. She was still there buried inside of all of this other crap.
I got her up to speed with the Scouting issues, and plans. She did say she wanted to help in a small capacity.
More than anything, it was good to just talk without anger or argue but just talk. I listened very carefully to her words too. I did a lot of validating about how hard it is to make schedules and how frustrating it is for me to make them.
So maybe the day wasn't a total loss.
Hey HeavyD,
That sounds like a little step in the right direction! That's fantastic that you did a lot of validating.
Sorry, I’ve been extremely busy and haven’t been on the DB Forum much at all for a few days.
What’s new with you? Any GAL activities planned for the weekend?
Take care!
Bob
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
A lot of GAL the weekend . I have kids so birthday party. Sleep over. Bowling with new friend. Visit to food pantry and lots of bike riding and trampoline jumping.
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
You know what struck me as how much STILL my emotions are tied up with WW. If we talk and it's a good convo, I feel much better, if we talk and it's an argument or she's angry I am upset.
You know what struck me as how much STILL my emotions are tied up with WW. If we talk and it's a good convo, I feel much better, if we talk and it's an argument or she's angry I am upset.
Mental note to self - Need to detach MORE
I totally get this. Just seeing I got a text from her, regardless of what it's about and my heart jumps a bit. Of course, right now it's usually about lawyers, but still.
I know I'm not completely detached. I don't know how I will ever get there. But I'm certainly more than I WAS.
You know what struck me as how much STILL my emotions are tied up with WW. If we talk and it's a good convo, I feel much better, if we talk and it's an argument or she's angry I am upset.
Mental note to self - Need to detach MORE
You're welcome Heavy! Yes, I think you do need to detach more. Good mental note to yourself! That was the hardest thing for me to do, but I think my WAW has noticed.
And don't worry about not asking about me. In fact, I just posted to my thread a few minutes ago. Thank you for asking.
My fingers need a little break. LOL Would you mind checking out my post in my thread?
Keep your chin up, HeavyD!!
Bob
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
This morning, it stunk, the afternoon, much better interaction.
Another thing that she mentioned - she told me how I wasn't in this all by myself, that if I get sick, I can always call her, etc... and while this sounds good, it's more in the friend zone. I said "Thank you, it's good to know that" but still, friend zone. She made sme vague comment about "now that we are more trusting with each other".
I guess I am looking a gift horse in the mouth but breadcrumbs is not what I am after.
I agree with you...that sounds to me like "friend zone." If so, as you know, you don't want to head there.
What do others think? Would you agree that Heavy's W's comment is nothing more than breadcrumbs?
Bob
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
I understand what you mean about your emotions being tied up with how interactions with the W go. I do the same thing, and realize that my level of detachment isn't where it should be either.
Hang in there and keep the focus on you!
M: 50 W: 47 No kids together M: 10 T: 11 BD #1: 12/14 R #1: 7/15 BD #2: 1/18 D Filed: 6/18/18 D Final: 01/28/19 Currently still in-house
Me:55 yrs/W:51 yrs (has MS) M:14 yrs T:15 yrs No children together--3 each from previous marriages Wife Moved Out: 10/19/14 Wife Filed for Divorce: 10/20/14 Divorce Final: 10/21/15
I realized my W is out of town with the OW today. I should have known. I had to get an article of clothing from my son. She replied she would have to get it to me Monday. Ahhh.....
On personal GAL news - birthday party, surprise movie with friends, spend the night with friend for D6 and a girl sout/boy scout event this morning at the local food pantry. A busy and full day if I do say so myself.
It's just not fair or just or any of this things. I played by the rules got burned and now I have all this mess to mop up for the 3 of us. How unbelievable life can be sometimes. I just have to wonder what the lesson is in all of this. Family turn into stranger, families are broken apart, hearts are broken and the world keeps on turning. I had no clue that life could ever get this complicated.
A friend told me today that I am getting the short end of the stick by not hurrying up this D process. I am mulling that one over. Maybe I am the loser in this by not Being more aggressive with the D. I am in limbo land while W gets the girlfriend and is not bothered in the least.
Sorry HeavyD. But Wonka is right. Don't listen to advice from those who have no clue.
I've had the whole "no fair" dialogue in my head all morning. She goes out for the dinners, the parties, the horseback riding, all these new adventures in her "new life." I get the crumbs, the leftovers, the in-between talk about bills and the business and the struggle to move forward. I'm the one who is eventually going to have to find the new place to live, get a new job, make a whole new life... while the OW gets to just have a new and exciting girlfriend come into her well established world. I'm the one whose been here for my W, struggled through the dark times, been her support and her light and her rock. This other woman is a predator who has thrown my W's life - and mine - into turmoil, and will continue to do so.
But, so it goes.
Me: 46 Her: 41 M: 5.5 yrs / S: 20, 18 3/26 W and I meet OW BD: 5/2/2015, she takes off ring W goes to stay with OW 6/26 NC: 9/5 Both moved out: 10/16 I take off my ring and feel... healed: 10/19
Hey Heavy - I hope your day is going better after those thoughts. I don't like when I turn to feeling like that, but I find myself doing that often. It is totally unfair and I feel that it may be unlikely that anyone will understand why we have stood the way we have.
A long while back (when we were still communicating), I told my W that her and OM are the only ones winning with this - leaving two families in shambles. She of course disagreed.
It is a bizarre and complicated life.
DO CARRY ON!
Me-45 W-44 S21, S18, D15 T-27, M-21 BD Jan 2014 PA revealed March 2014 In-house separation - April 2015 I filed - Aug 2015 She moved out Oct 2015
What I mean is the longer I "hold out" the longer my W gets to take advantage of me financially and emotionally. Does that make sense? Who am I holding out for again? For me right? Then doesn't that mean that I should do what is in my best interest to go ahead and agree to D. It feels like she knows that I wont move this process along because she knows I won't and is therefore taking more advatange of me. I swear I could get tied up in pretzels thinking about this nonsense.
Of course I am taking the long view and want my family back together in the long run... but I can't hold out forever. I am just flesh and blood.
I had the opportunity to hang out with some church folks this weekend, they of course knew we split but did not know why and well, it came out and they were shocked. I just said, yeah, me too.
This whole situation stinks.
On the bright side of the street, I have my lovely kiddos and today we went bowling - fun! My D6 beat all of us and even the 15 year old boy who was bowling with us. How about that!
I get your frustration I do ... thing is ... you are doing what is right, what you believe in, all your principles are still intact. If you read around here long enough you are going to discover some of the vets ... they will make you realize that its you who has the power in this. You can choose to walk away any time you want, You can choose just how much you are willing to put up with, You can choose what YOU will do. We can not control what our WAS do, who they see, what flavor milkshake they order ... but we CAN leave all this if we choose.
The power is in your court here, you can stand for your M, or you can walk away ... its on YOUR terms not hers. When I reached that level I found peace, looking at the person in the mirror looking back I know I am doing the right thing ... almost 2 years later I still feel this way. Am I waiting for her to come back ... NO .. I am waiting to see WHO she turns out to be after all this then I can decide if I WANT to live the rest of my days sharing myself with her ... Its on MY terms .. not solely hers.
One of my friends said I was passive agressive with this whole situation which stung. I accept responsibility for some of that but jeez.
I am trying to walk this path with as much dignity as I can and with as much compassion and strength as I possibly can. I have made a lot of mistakes at first but have gotten better at this DB thing I think.
I am mainly just venting about my feelings and trying to work through them about this whole process.
I am still trying to work on ME and getting stronger with my mental processes and recognizing this is not about me, I didn't cause this, can't fix it, etc...
I loved the metaphore about the first thing a pilot must do when there is trouble and the plane is going down.... the first thing the pilot must do is STEER THE PLANE and keep it from crashing. That is the mental image I get when I really think about this catastrophy.
Last night we had to make a cub scout cake. Let me just say I am not the world's greatest baker. We made a cake in the shape of a bear head, cut holes for his nose and eyes and two cupcakes for ears and frosted the whole thing brown. Not too bad and it's for a good cause. The kids and I had a great time doing it too. Now the W wants to come and attend the scout event which is a first for the entire year.
Interactions with W have been regular, with the exception when she is with her friend. It's about kids stuff and an ocassional photo of the kids tossed in for good measure. I now can do the same. Every email I send or text comes with a Thanks and sometimes, "Have a great day". Some of her texts or emails comes with a "thanks" at the end.
She never addressed any emails or texts to my name or even my first initial. She never signs them either. I usually address mine with her first initial and end it with the short version of my name (example Elizabeth....Liz).
She never addressed any emails or texts to my name or even my first initial. She never signs them either. I usually address mine with her first initial and end it with the short version of my name (example Elizabeth....Liz).
Just observations folks....
Ha! LOL. This brings me memories of Ms. Wonka's absolute refusal to acknowledge me by name. For years, Ms. Wonka didn't address me by my name. That bothered me A LOT even if I intellectually understood the reason behind it. It just made me feel like a leaper. When Ms. Wonka finally addressed me by my name, things shifted between us.
Talk about moving slooooow like a glacier!!! That's dear ol' Ms. Wonka. rolling eyes
W was there early - called me and asked me to feed the street meter which I said "Sure no problem" and put $2.00 into the meter - plenty of time for the ceremony. W texted and said she had a seat reserved so I sat down beside her.
We made chit chat and I asked if her this was a good time to review summer camp schedules. She said Yeah, ok". I said Next year could we talk first before we schedule them an coordinate them as it would make it a lot easier if they went to one or two camps instead of the many camps they are going to this year. On her week, she made camps plans and on my week I made camp plans. It just worked out that way, this is the first time we have scheduled summer camps since our split.
She relies "You mean it would be easier for you, you don't get to call the shots anymore, I made the arrangements for my week and that's that. What's the problem?"
I said "There is no problem, it's just hard for me to keep track of were they are, I don't know the camps, have not been there, don't know the location, don't know where pick up and drop off are, etc... She said "I put all of the info onto the schedule and I don't see what the problem is, she unloaded that she didn't ask me to pay for any of it etc..."
Wow - just wow. I just sat there and listened to her and said "I can tell this is a bad time, maybe next year we can talk about it."
Mini spew? Not sure. As usual, her eyes were cold and lifeless and I was the enemy #1.
As soon as the ceremony was over, I made my exit, said see you later and left. Good Lord. So this was a negative encounter. I tried to be diplomatic and non chalant. When will I stop being the enemy?
She also emphatically does not want anything to do with GirlScouts, BoyScouts, Soccer, anything having to do with the kids. "She doesn't have the time."
Maybe she feels that since I in involved with these activities she doesn't want to interact with me on any level.
It is really hard to have them involved in these activties solo. So now what, just ignore he or continue on with the activities as normal.
We get the diploma for D6 and I asked if she would like me to copy the original (a nice copy that would look just like the original) and she just glared at me.
Schedules, diplomas, activities all remind W of the "fractured" family that she instigated and it BOTHERS her a great deal so she takes it out on you. A whole lot easier than turning the mirror inward and taking a hard look at her own choices.
Fine if she doesn't want to get involved in those activities. She's not ready. Her loss.
She seems to be really focused on "You are not calling the shots now" as I have heard this so many times.
I just drop it, don't take the bait or say I am sorry it feels that way to you, I'm just trying to reach common ground.
She felt I called the shots when we moved to Cali - I asked if she would come with me, of course she did. I took her with me on the interview.
She felt I called the shots on buying the mini van - Heck we have 2 active kids - she resented it. I told her I would drive the mini van - get whatever car you want. Every time we drove a mini van she always said how nice it was.
She is not reasonable, rational or even nice. The old version of my W is clearly gone gone gone.
I will just continue on the path I am on - do my thing and ignore her rants and raves as best I can.
Yeah - it's weird - she was super involved in the school before the BD and now she's dropped of the face of the earth. She says she does not have time. I don't get it.
Oh well. I will carry on. Last night I had to buy a sewing kit to set on badges onto uniforms. Can't keep taking them to the tailor - too expensive!
Yup ..... Wonka as usual is on it. And those eyes ... I know them so well, those lifeless shark like eyes. Its like a shell of the person you know being controlled by some alien being.
My W did the same with activities ... this is the selfish phase. W refused to pay for any of S's baseball fees, gear, would not even do the 'team snacks' that everyone takes on one week out of the season. You just have to let them be, do those thigns with your kids, we can not control what they will or will not be a part of.
This being said ... W only missed maybe 2 games (OM dates I suspect) as she would spin and spew on those nights she missed as I had to point out ... her choice, not mine.
Live your life .. be happy. Let her spin, spew, hit rock bottom and figure her own chit out ... all these things you can not do for her, you have to allow her to go on her journey because right now .. in her fogged up noggin .. you are the obstacle in between her and happiness... is it the truth... no .. one day you just hope she realizes it, that's when she will start to do the work.
