. Would your W like if an ex lover of yours popped by each day just to grab a coffee or say hello?
Her beliefs from the past were "married only once" and "no affairs," those have, oddly enough, changed with this situation. When she mentioned the whole "I wish you would have an affair..." line, I responded with "My family values would not allow for that to happen."
Originally Posted By: alpha99
I would say carry on the path you're heading down. Most importantly, keep your cool. What are you doing to GAL?
Can do and will. The actions seem to get her attention pretty well, though she feels like they are controlling and vindictive. I do not want to bring up the keylogger, but it really is the only true proof I have, but I feel it could cause a lot of problems legally if it gets to that point.
To GAL, I hang out with my son and/or dog, play soccer a couple nights a week, and hang out with friends a few times a week. I do enjoy my work too, and my W does seem rather envious of that at times. I have been a little lazy with getting out on the weekends recently as W would like someone to watch S3 so she can do homework. Maybe just let her see the difficulty of balancing both? Should get back to weekend hangs out regardless.
Yesterday (3/29) was a little odd. We took a break after the conversation to give each other some space. Shortly thereafter, she woke S up from his nap. W decided she was going to act all buddy buddy with me right after our conversation, though she did mention in there that she did not want to work on our relationship. The entire time she did not believe that I knew she was still talking to him. No big deal. We did have some nice conversations and a few laughs. It was a good time hanging out with our S3. Just strange that she would act like that.
I went to my soccer game. It felt good. Came home. W and I read books and put son to bed. She was acting as if nothing happened. Good around our son. I stayed in his room a little longer because he wanted me to stay some more as it apparently helps him sleep (such a manipulator). When leaving his room, W was already in bed, possibly sleeping, at least acting like she was. She was planning to get up to go to an early AA meeting. An appropriate one. So I did not bring up the request to block communications with OM then, felt it was the wrong time. Got some quality time with the pets instead.
This morning she said "I love you" and gave me a kiss, like nothing was wrong, prior to her leaving for her meeting. When I was leaving for work, she came up to me giving me attention and expecting some affection. I followed through with it. All that I could think of, though, was that she was attempting to manipulate me into believing that she was not lying about anything.
She sent me a funny email today, I did not respond. She called me mid-day, of which I did not answer. She then immediately sent me a text asking me to call about a story about our S (nothing important or dire). I waited about an hour and called her back. It was a nice story, impressive on his part, sad topic though. Regardless, it all just seemed too staged.
She had another meeting tonight, different type. Gave me time to pick up S from MIL and take him to the park. Saw some of my friends there (with their kids). Had a good time. Got home before W did, checked the keylogger, sure enough, a couple more messages to OM. W got home, we watched a movie with our S, pleasant time. Put him to bed. I went to the kitchen and she came in after asking "what are you going to do?" I responded, "I would like to block him now." She sat there for a couple seconds, and agreed to it. WIN. I did not even have to get to the no internet.
Apparently our cell phone service does not support blocking numbers, I tried it anyway. There was a response saying "not supported", she asked what that was, I just said "confirmation ," instead I installed a text to email app (mostly hidden), of which forwards the text to an email that I have access to and does not leave a copy in the text inbox. If I need to get a phone keylogger, I will. This should work for now. Later on I may change the text forwarder to include all texts (forwarded but not deleted) just to make sure.
I then blocked his FB account. If I see him in her friends list, I will know. Still have the computer keylogger as well.
I asked if she understood why I was doing this. Her response was "because it is what you want." I went into some boundary talk, about how it was necessary for my own mental well being. How she has them too, and I respect them when they are brought up. Her expression during this time was none too pleased. Expected. In closing, I said "I greatly appreciate this." I am sure it left a sour taste in her mouth, but I really do.
I am not sure what will come of all of this. Of course, no one does. Still going to work on myself. Work on the attraction, 180s, etc. I know she feels forced and "stuck" right now. I am trying to decide what I should do at this point. Romance her, or pull back a little? Play it by ear/see how she reacts in the next couple of days? Wait to see if there is no contact? Stay positive, confident, upbeat for myself at least.
When I say "I know she feels forced and stuck," these are my assumptions. She has not expressed those to me specifically, but to OM - expected there though. I have mentioned several times to her that these are my boundaries and it would be appreciated if she followed through with them, otherwise I feel disrespected. That I am not controlling her decisions, just the things I have control of. It is a matter of her selective hearing at that point, her choice. I did give her options. This specific one was "I am not going to feel like we are, or consider us, working on our marriage until he is blocked." If she were to refuse, then I would have suggested the blocking of internet again, and claim she can get it herself, computer - get her own, use her own money, the money I make for the family does not go to non-conducive activities. I am not going to support it. A no again, and fine. I would follow through and let her work her own destiny out, again.
Whether or not she actually wants to work on our M is up to her. If she is just going to tell me she wants to, go through the hoops just for herself to make her look OK with her family, but the entire time assume it is not going to work out with me, OK then. I do not want that, but if that is what happens, that is what happens. She can go, I am not holding her back, but she seems to know the implications. At least I can say I helped her save face with her family to a degree, maybe get her to realize lying to everyone is not an appropriate thing to do. She knows her family will not tolerate any of this, nor will they accept OM at all.
I am not going to force her to go to counselling, or anything she tells me she does not want to do, because I can not. I will just go on my own if she refuses, use it as IC for me then. See what the therapist says about the matter.
You're mostly on the right track here. The one thing that jumps out at me is the fact YOU blocked his FB account.
If you force the piecing, it just isn't going to work. It was expressed in the "because it is what you want." comment.
Having good solid intel and installing apps/programs discretely is one thing. You doing her part of the piecing work is completely another.
My advice is if she isn't ready, willing and able to cut ties with OM or honor your requests about OM, you my not actually be piecing yet.
Check PeterV2 and Shodan's threads if you haven't already.
Me 47 - W 35 M 9 - T 10 2 Daughters - 7 & 9 Discovery of EA- 8/4/14 S - 8/5/15 D mentioned - 9/11/14 R & Piecing - 3/17/15 Regard one another as more important than yourselves. - Philippians 2:3
That was my fear with that comment. She did outwardly agree to full transparency and the blocking. She just did not know how to do the actual blocking. Then again she could have just been letting me hear what I wanted to hear, though I have asked her to be completely honest with me.
At least she knows I am serious about the NC matter, though sometimes it feels like I am pushing the matter too often.
I will look at your suggestions here shortly.
MC is supposed to start next week. I will continue monitoring what I can, and see what she wants out of MC. Anything short of working on our M, then I will just go on my own.
Hi MrBond. I apologize for not responding to you in a timely manner (decided to read through the posts again).
Yes, I have been reading DR. Yes, I should have read the whole thing first and then read it again. Got it in my mind to act fast though, ergo - Yes, I got impatient and messed a few things up. Yes, I do feel like I am a little all over the place at times. Yes, I do break some rules here and there. Yes, the forums are excellent, but it is necessary that they go hand-in-hand with the books.
She worked around it. I kind of figured she would. She had been acting a little too nice these past couple days.
Decided to do a random transparency check today on her. Sure enough, some cute little messages. Just went to her, asked for her phone, looked, saw, and said "Ok, well, c'ya later." Went and got a couple beers to relax....I know the bar scene is not recommended, helped clear my mind though.
Came back. Mentioned my boundaries again. Said I was not going to support the A with the money I make for the family. She can find her own ways.
She had some of the standard claims about our R. "I feel like we are just platonic," "I just cannot love you like that," "I came back for S3," One thing she mentioned was "I need him." Ok then.
I did validate all of her feelings. Lots of pauses on her part. She said no, I have been worrying about my finances this entire time....of course, and S3. "Your decisions."
I moved W's pillows to the couch, making sure she saw me when she was brushing her teeth. Earlier she mentioned she will not leave as she wants to be with S3 as much as possible, so I suggested she can pay half the bills then as well if she just wants to live like brother and sister. She even mentioned that she could move in with her mom.....not likely, she will find out why and kick her out. I could, but I am not leaving this house.
She did mention that she "just unblocked him today," sure. "There was also contact all last week." "How do you know that?" she asks. "I feel that is irrelevant compared to the decision at hand." She mentioned controlling, tried to guilt trip me, "dick move," of which "I can see that. I am just trying to protect myself, my family, and my marriage." I caught myself almost apologize for some of these things. Do not apologize for boundaries.
We are supposed to go to MIL's house tomorrow. This could be interesting. I may just hang out with some friends. Call and wish her family a good day and apologize for not being able to be there. MIL will understand. If she asks, I can just tell her to ask W. MIL does not trust her at all anyway, still. Will not at all. Nor will she support her. Feels kind of bad doing this, but these are the decisions she has made. She can feel what it is like.
Yes I have made my mistakes in the past (communication, npt emote enough). Yes I took the wrong actions at times, said the wrong things, did not say enough. I did not recognize what was truly wrong. I did downplay her feelings in the past at times, occasionally did not listen. I know where I am to blame in the matter. I tried what I could, did what I thought was right, and concentrated on those too much, almost psychotically.
She does have an addictive personality. This is going to be difficult. Standing up for myself, family. Sometimes I feel like I shoot myself in the foot. Other times, it just feels relieving. Time will tell.
Unfortunately I found this source much later than I wish I had - would have helped 3-4 months earlier. GAL'ing helps substantially. She was cake eating and being crafty. I let my guard down too much.
If she wants to go, she can. Her decision. She does everything for it though....
She mentioned that I did not do enough for her when she was using. That I was not attached to her enough emotionally that I was just willing to "let her die."
Darned if you do, darned if you don't.
She criticizes you for failing her during her alcohol dependency problem (which is likely outrageous since you were no doubt completely trying to handle and take care of everything and everyone) but NOW, when she has an addiction to OM you are being "controlling" and unhelpful.
Remind her that you won't fail again to protect her. That her relationship with OM is just another form of escape and addiction. That you have no intention of being "controlling" but rather you are exercising "protection". OM is unhealthy for and destructive to her...just as alcohol is/was. You don't quit alcohol by hanging out in bars and others drinking and you don't quit OM by continuing to chat and be friendly with him.
BTW. Turning off the internet is perfectly justifiable in this situation. It's not overly controlling. She is free to walk out the door and speak to OM any way she wants but she's not gonna do it on your dime and in your home.
For years your wife's primary relationship was alcohol. Getting that under control is a huge accomplishment but very often having to face real relationships as a sober person is difficult without the crutch of alcohol. I am not a fan of co-ed AA meetings. Dangerous places of too much sharing between married persons with opposite sex persons not their spouse.
The internet is 90% complaining and entitlement and I hate it because I deserve better!
W slept on couch without any issue last night. She did come in to the bedroom when I had my laptop out and asked "What else are you doing?" I just claimed I was looking at stuff and trying to go to sleep. She thought I was up to more.
My ring came off. She kept hers on. Not expecting them to stay on.
S3 got up in the middle of the night. W rushed over to help sooth him back to sleep. He got up later, came into the bedroom and climbed in bed with me. "Where is mommy? I just want mommy." (in reality, this is the most difficult thing to listen to at this point). "She is in the family room buddy if you want to go out there." I rubbed his back a little and he fell right asleep and stayed for the remainder of the night. I got up in the morning, took a shower and got dressed.
"What are you planning to do?" I got. I answered "Hanging out with some friends this morning, I will be back later." "Where are you going?" I repeated what I said before. She asked again. I just said I was going to watch a soccer game with some friends (should have just giving her a seriously look). On walking out the door, W asks "how long are you going to keep up this game?" I did not respond. Walked out saying I will be home later.
To my surprise, the bartender was a good friend from high school. Reconnected some. Felt good. Hung out longer than anticipated, got some lunch too.
Came home. W's car was gone. I kept the internet off as I saw she was continuing to use the laptop to contact OM when she said she did not.
Just called MIL to apologize for not being able to show up. She apparently secretively went to a different room to talk to me. W talked to her, mentioned D. Said I was controlling, cannot be without OM, etc, etc. I figured she would speak to her. Had a good talk with MIL. She is devastated, wants to protect S3 from all of this. I agreed and validated. Mentioned I did not agree to a D and was fully committed to the M and what I was doing to a degree, that a little sacrifice with S3 now may end up beneficial later. She understood my stance. She told W that she would not support her/OM at all. That it will not work that way, and not to expect to see her much if at all anymore. I do not blame her. We had a good talk about boundaries. How W does not seem to grasp the concept. MIL mentioned that she just cannot have any trust in her ever again as she just keeps lying to everyone.
Another thing she mentioned last night along with the "I need him" statement, was that she is not able to trust her free will as that is what got her into the addictions in the first place. Kind of a scary statement, but it is kind of what AA teaches. Giving it up to a higher power. That may be good and all for some people, but when the higher power is an OM telling you these things, that is what I would call brainwashing. Still, her feelings are her feelings. Her decisions are her decisions.
On closing, MIL called me a different name - assuming because W was in hearing range. I apologized for not being able to be there, wished them a good time, and told them I loved them.
